Jill Tarter & Douglas Vakoch - Where Are All Those Aliens? 

“I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.” Douglas Adams

The vastness of space (time) isolates us from possible similar lifeforms like ours. Speed of light is a slow phenomenon on the scale of our surroundings.

These episodes on the possibility of alien life are always too short. I could easily listen for hours to a continuation of the discussion with these scientists.

Aliens are probably to intelligent to want to do any of the things we consider fantastic.

Once technology starts developing, it advances so fast that by the time a civilization is ready to explore the cosmos, it’s tech resembles nothing like what we currently expect. My suspicion is that a sufficiently advanced civilization becomes indistinguishable from the background noise of the universe.

Jill and Vak have told me nothing.

They haven't yet finished preparing the cookbook.

I like her approach to this supposed paradox! Go Bluejays!!

Pretty simple...they checked us out from afar and said, 'no thanks.'

One of the questions would be how would aliens from a distant galaxy share human consciousness ? If there are aliens from other planets, that proves that consciousness is universal and perhaps fundamental in the universe.

lol Jill didnt interview too well here. She had one point and Robert struggled to get anything else out of her. The guy came in clutch at the end tho

We can’t get away from our anthropomorphism.

Without SETI why don't we leave it up to all the critics to do the job and see how they go

These zoom ins are great..

Jill Tartar-- Nanotechnology of the Gaps

It’s due to our immense limitations in understanding and bias towards thinking we know even an infinitesimal. But what exactly to hypothesise in a universe that predicts almost anything, other than our own immediate, clouded potential.

Would be fantastic to hear an interview with Dr Steven Greer

We may be alone.

At the southern border. Oh, you mean extraterrestrials? The only ones that landed concluded that they wouldn’t be able to do anything to help us with our emotional problems and left. Who knows, they might come back. If they do, I hope they land at Farragut Square on a weekday around lunch hour long enough for the news trucks to cover them.

I enjoyed Jill’s thoughts on the value of looking for evidence of ETI in our own astronomical backyard. However, both guests are in denial about the growing mound of data from the military and from civilian aviation of objects in our atmosphere performing in ways that cannot be explained by any human technology. These objects are seen in broad daylight by highly trained pilots, are tracked on radar, visualized by infrared targeting pods, and picked up on satellite imaging systems. At a minimum, this fact should pique the curiosity of any scientist. The “distances are too great for interstellar travel” argument is bunk. The proper motion of the sun through the galaxy means that thousands of other star systems have passed within 1 or 2 light years, or less, of ours since the formation of our solar system. Our scientific community’s willful blindness on the UAP issue is stunning. I am a scientist by training and am baffled by this state of affairs.

Yes. I can say “they are not here.”

First! Also, firstly we need to ask ourselves with what tools we would be able to see so called aliens out in the abyss...??

This conversation could be out of date very soon dependent on what happens in the US Congress. 😅

Assuming there are some very advanced civilizations in the galaxy, there could be numerous reasons why we don't see them. 1. They know were here and they think we're way too primitive sociologically to contact. Humanity hasn't figured out how to live with itself. We have too many superstitious ideologies. We cannot live with each other without having war. Very few of our societies even try to create an equitable system so that everyone within that society has a decent life. We have the technology but due to selfishness we cannot solve our climate change fiasco. 2. Interstellar travel is probably really hard and expensive. Except for nearby stars, it could take lifetimes to achieve, such that interstellar travelers would never see anyone who wasn't traveling with them again. The psychological cost would be great. 3. Nobody is going to be dumb enough to broadcast their position without knowing a lot more about what is out there. They would send out vessels and probes with the primary intention of finding out what is out there before they decide to communicate. Assuming that they want to have contact with other species, they would still want to interact only with ones that were peaceful enough to coexist with them. Mankind is definitely not there yet. 4. Intelligent life is more rare than we thought. It took 4.5 billion years for earth to get there. Maybe the vast majority of planets where life evolves have some sort of cataclysmic event which life there before it can evolve far enough. Maybe 99% of the time it ends with single cellular life. Even here, had the asteroid that killed the non-avian dinosaurs been much bigger, intelligent life might have never evolved. 5. Maybe a large percentage of intelligent species cannot help but blow themselves up or destroy their ecosystem because they cannot figure out how to get along with each other. 6. Colonization is probably a lot slower and a lot harder than we think. There are probably no planets out there that we can just populate without terraforming them. Any planet that already has life is probably hostile to us, at least chemically. We would have to bring earth biology and ecosystem wherever we go. 7. Advanced societies may not be as driven to physically colonize as primitive ones. They may create paradises without poverty and population growth issues. They may do a lot of remote exploring, but are never driven to conquer the galaxy. Even when they do colonize, it may be slow and deliberate, valuing stability over growth. 8. Advanced societies may go virtual creating their own paradises that they can bounce around in.

Maybe we are giants and aliens are super microscopic

I don't believe aliens are here, but this interview still has me annoyed

i heard a rumor there is supposed to be a galaxy with better humans somewhere...

It baffles me how people have discussions like this and dismiss the UFO phenomenon. We literally have members of the DOD admitting that UFOs are a real phenomenon. Truly baffling

What if the next closest intelligent conscious being to us is not by distance, but by size. And our planets are just the molecules that make an an entirely alien organism.

Sitting right next to you!

I have the impression that they did not get to the crux of the paradox. If advanced civilizations were using nanoprobes or the like for colonization or exploration, it's possible that they might use that for discrete observation. But only in a first phase. In a second phase you would want to perform real colonisation with macroscopic probes. Claiming the planet is the ultimate goal. Why else are you doing it for? If you don't do that, you might as well do nothing. That is exactly what the Fermi Paradox is about. There was plenty and plenty of time for that to happen. At least one civilisation would want to colonize, no ?Why haven't we detected any clear signs of such macroscopic probes or their presence yet?

They are here homies 🤗

It’s too bad most of us will probably not be here any longer, therefore will not be able to experience all this wonderful technology. It would be kind of cool though.

I await peer review anywhere. The problem is, should there be an ET meeting or recovery event, the private market and its lobbying interests will obstruct from the public. This has already been certified through the 5412 Directive.

I have never heard Seti talk like this. This sounds serious.

Another Jack and Jill bedtime story .

1. Maybe they don't want to be detected by humans. 2. How do you know they intended to crash this last mile? Do you assert to know a intelligence greater than yourself, intentions?

Maybe aliens care about there planet and they are not multiplying and multiplying and multiplying and multiplying and multiplying...like the simple humans do....

I don’t think there are aliens in our universe. The big question then is why.

I remember the Astronauts commenting on how they were on the Moon's surface looking out into the vastness of Space thinking there's no way we are the only life. Like being on a Desert Island shoreline wondering if there's anyone else on this planet. Impossible.

Maybe they did come, but it was the worst holiday they ever had.

Cool beans.

Her theory isn’t falsifiable.

“I don’t think” is not a scientific argument

Of course the problem, and it's circular in nature, is us humans may not have the necessary level of consciousness, intelligence, awareness, etc, never mind the technology, to look for other intelligent life. We may not even be able to understand other lifeforms. Assuming intelligent life out there means our kind of intelligence is ignorant, though understandable. We can only see the world from our human perspective which might be limited in the scoop of life, if not nonsensical.

talk about the navy sightings and the spherical probes seen all over the place

They are in other realities. This reality is fine tuned to us.

They are here and most likely have been for a long time…the truth will out soon enough through disclosure and more…brace yourselves, oh yee skeptics😅

Dr. Jill Tater published her first paper in 1971 and obtained her Ph.D. in 1975, that means she is now 75+ yrs old. How can she still look that young?

Aliens are quantum in nature. When we attempt to observe them, they do a quantum collapse.

What are Artifacts?

They could hop on rogue planets or big asteroids to find new homes . For instance, to escape supernovas, gamma ray bursts, magnetars, etc, close to their solar system. And, for sure, I wouldn't broadcast my position when I am traveling.

Unusually good points on the Fermi paradox!. But the comment that aliens wouldn’t crash was flippant … our probes have crashed into Mars and elsewhere. Humans are still killed by wild animals and insects. Advance tech doesn’t make you infallible or invulnerable. But the basic point is we have no idea how to find aliens, only how to find people like us.

Why assume that alien intelligence is like ours? What if they operate within time in a fundamentally different way than we do? Much faster, they would zoom by before we noticed. Would any civilization capable of interstellar travel recognize us as intelligent? I have very little concern or awareness of the insects in my backyard.

Time travelers obviously

My understanding is they are already here

Did these people not see the news of the congressional hearings?

I know the answer - they all invented AGI machine superintelligence

Yes, there could be many forms of intelligence. Too bad we see none on display here.

The "inevitable progress of technology" is not at all inevitable. Moore's law only held while it was POSSIBLE to shrink transistors. We're nearly at the point where we'll hit physical limitations, not ingenuity limitations

The fermi paradox suffers from homocentric bias. Would it apply to plasma life forms? Sometimes the rational scientists sounds as whacky as the ideas that fall outside it’s box.

There would have to be a motive for colonizing a whole galaxy. I've never heard one proposed that made sense to me. For instance, I dont think humans will ever have a motive to do it.

First of all, I love this series and the job Robert Kuhn does. However, this episode shocked me by the utter stupidity of Jill Tarter's explanation of the Fermi paradox: "Aliens are here, but they are nano-scale."??? If this is the best argument SETI has to offer, better shut it down. (BTW, evolutionary biologist Stephen Jay Gould has written about why humans are the size they are and why we can't be nanoscale)

It seems rather easy to understand why we have not discovered life elsewhere. We are simply infants just beginning to have the capabilities to reach out and discover other intelligent beings. The real question we should be asking is, why have not other more intelligent and advanced life forms, that surely must exist, not discovered us. They should want to share and reach out to us like one would assume a more advanced and intelligent being would want to do. Like we behave with the other intelligent creatures on our world. Simply, why is no one reaching out to us.

We can equally say - "where is all that dark matter?" One theory is endorsed - the other, for now, is not.

Maybe we ARE the aliens.

I know that everyone wants to believe, but all the evidence says that the trajectory of life and evolution on Earth was an almost infinite series of one-off lucky chances. There's nothing wrong with keeping up the search, but there's also no point in getting our expectations up.

Hummm.. What would this discovery, if successful, give to our understanding of life? 🤔It would increase our confusion about the universe, that's about all imo

Intelligent...hmm, why would they come here?

I always wonder if the reason that Earthlings have not “discovered” communication from other “intelligent entities” strongly suggests that due to our theories of quantum mechanics and special relativity being INCOMPLETE (and providing some credence that they are significantly incomplete), that earthlings don’t understand the “rules of communication”. AND because of this, WE are not technologically competent enough to detect the signals! A kinda Star Trek variation on not establishing first contact unless “such and such threshold level of gating technology” has been attained. But in this case it is simply having the understanding of how to build the “higher dimensional brane” communication receiver, or some such “Oojamaflip Thingy”!

If we understand that the primary unit of life is the Cell Then cellular life could exist elsewhere in the universe. How far it has evolved into intelligent species in other locations in space is the question? The probability of life in other locations in space is clear. The question is when will we hit that lottery.

Ariel school Rhodesia 🤗

They're hiding at Bigfoots house.

The more they speak using "high-tech" innovation manifested by the internet, the more I realize that technology does not necessarily equate to intelligence. To paraphrase Ghandi: "Intelligent technologically saavy life in the universe? That would be novel."

The "too small to detect" argument does not really work. Atoms and molecules have the same size everywhere in the universe, and a certain number of them is required for any complex system. Independently of technology, small living entities lack the complexity required for intelligence. Large systems are required for survival over large distances, but large systems take more time to develop. That growth is eventually limited by the age of the star that provides the energy for its development. We already see that our computing power no longer grows by Moore's law and our technology is reaching limits. Civilizations end because of limited resources. Life is a rare thing. To develop, our civilization has taken a long time that is a significant fraction of our sun's lifetime. The sun won't last forever. Traveling and surviving across interstellar distances is extremely difficult for both biology and machines, if not simply imposible. Life is very likely out there, but we have to accept that life, like stars, have their limits too.

Gobbledygook.

The universe is so vast maybe they just haven’t found us yet, or they are on there way.. maybe once we become intelligent we kill each other off so no one’s around long enough to explore the universe. Maybe they are here and we don’t know what to look for.

lol they are talking about publicly available technology 😂 we haven’t found them because interstellar travel doesn’t take place at the speed of light or sound but through vibrations or inter dimensional travel. Every point in space and time is connected.

Fermis paradox is not a paradox if take into consideration the facts and data then evident reality that, other intelligences are already “visiting”. These kinds of scientists and their opinions zero research is actually such a slap in the face to people who do diligence on the topic as well as experiences of otherworldly phenomena. I actually pity :)

There are senses we don't have or maybe the senses we do have aren't sensitive enough to detect them. I'm sure there's something out there, but we may not even recognize it if it came here.

Were

UFOs.....

We earthling may be the dumb aliens cast out from a super intelligent planet

Excellent podcast

Is Establishment science so blind it doesn't know an alien presence has been here for thousands of years? I guess so.

Time and s p a c e.

I find these people to be smugly dismissive of the growing mountain of evidence of Non-Human technology that has either been seen... or found on Earth. Granted, the DoD has not fully released much... but they don't address this subject at all

At first I thought this video was about an open border.

Stating that there are no artifacts is the first lie

What if a distant advanced civilization in the past managed to create super-intelligent AGI. Image that AI with an equivalent IQ of 2000……20,000……2,000,000…..? What would such an entity be capable of? Is it inconceivable that it could send out a “signal” (probably not EM) that could manipulate distant minds to…..wait for it…..develop super intelligent AI? Makes ya think.

Space and time is just too big... that Civilizations just miss each other... Contradictory to Belief; life is dependent on a Planets biome... This “Star Trek” Thinking that life/humans can life and conquer space is Garbage....!

I think Jill understands that its very possible non earthling intelligence is very likely here already but using energy in a way our sapien brain cannot percieve or even consider yet. Each time she spoke of that possibility, in nano form even, it went straight over their heads.

Turn on absolutely ANY television channel you care to. Now recognize that the information on that channel is escaping into space. Now explain too me why any intelligent life would alert us to their presence?

It could be naive to think other life forms within our receiving window will use similar technologies like ours (radio, lazer etc). Let alone flying saucers. We have invented gods to our liking too. Its how we fill in the blanks driven by wishfull thinking. We are alone here with one thin delicate atmosphere.

I like the wonderment of us being the only intelligent race in the galaxy. Maybe there is only one per galaxy; and that is great too. My guess is that since nature has instilled into each of us, a curiosity that bares no bounds, we will make the journey to other galaxies, as flesh and blood and of a great spirit, as great as those that ventured the perilous journey to America and the moon. I know there is a way, it is seemingly impossible but we will make it happen.

We don’t yet know whether life has come into being elsewhere in the universe. The odds against it are astronomical. I suspect life on earth is all there is - in which case, we need to spread outwards as quickly as possible before it is snuffed out. As soon as a self-replicating cell or even the most simple fossil is found outside our sphere of influence, I’ll believe the universe is teeming with life.

The great silence may just be a great deafness. We don't have much ability to detect ET if they're not already trying to get our attention. That should improve pretty fast though.

Somewhere, at the bottom of the ocean, there's a school of sea creatures that meet every so often to discuss the same question. None of them have been to the surface or experienced sunlight. They argue about the origin of the strange objects that litter the ocean floor and surmise there must be some strange unseen form of life that is responsible. "Ridiculous", some say. "If so, where are they?". "We've been here for millions of years, and not once have we seen any evidence of such a lifeform". But... absence of evidence does not imply evidence of absense. "Oh, if only we had more funding, we could launch a search of the ocean bottom and put the question to rest once and for all." "What if it turns out, they are not in the ocean at all?", said the squid. "That might be hard to prove. Any old business to discuss?"

Remember, the Tarters are members of the Flat Earth Society.

🚨This conversation needs to be: We know they exist and that they're here, so now what? Agreed that everyone should be angry that we've wasted trillions on activities that are behind where we should be, given that the technology already exists past where we're performing...that technology is trickled as to maximise profit rather than to benefit humankind. Let's have THAT conversation.