Been years since I actively played this, but on the question of the 'woodpile' that was accumulating there....I would have started to consider picking it up at 9+; especially if I held the charcoal kiln; and a definite pickup at 15 wood. I didn't count out your pile in this game, but lets say it did hit 15; 1action - pick up the 15; 2 action charcoal it....you now have 15 'coal equivalent'...enough to 'fuel' 3 ships 5times over the remainder of the game...or power other energy requirements. Going to the colliery tops out at 4 coal per trip; the same two trips (colliery/cokery) net you 40 energy +4 francs...if occupancy and cost are not prohibitive. Charcoal has no cost (other than time, which both are similar) 3energy units are more fungible than 10, lessening waste. That's my 2c on the subject. (ed. to add- didn't notice that this had been covered already...)
This game has climbed and climbed in my estimation, easily revealing new elegant and sophisticated layers with each play. My journey with it went from it being a daunting efficiency puzzle, to it feeling like it's on rails a bit too much, to now finding tons of satisfaction in trying new strategies each game and shaking things up. It's probably the most solid game in my library. My wife and I really enjoy playing it.
I owned this forever and finally played it solo last year. Amazing game. Another great example that the early 2000s were a wonderful time for euros. Not flashy or thematic...but just rock solid. I'm not a solo gamer but I love most Rosenberg games solo because you are still playing the real game and not some weird puzzle like many solo games. Thanks for the review and keep singing the praises of these games. Many old Euros have been replaced but there are many Beatles albums that your viewers might not know about : and they really need to.
Love this game, thanks for showing it off! One thing I noticed you said you try to never take loans... but Le Havre is the ultimate "you gotta spend money to make money" game... I've played so many games where I have 4-5 loans or more but it allows me to get my engine to a state where I can ship a mountain of steel or coke in my final few actions and it more than makes up for the extra cost, even with the interest charges... It just takes some courage to hang in there until the end.
This. Especially since interest is only 1 coin per round regardless of the number loans you have. Getting rid of loans using the Local Court (3 or more players) can really help as well.
I’ve found that the loan strategy doesn’t work as well when playing two player as there is only one other person wanting to use your buildings. Unless I’m doing something wrong?
@@deanlowdon8381 The Local Court is not available in the 2 player game (And I haven’t played at that count) so that undercuts the loan strategy in the 2 player game.
Monique and Naveen, I enjoyed every minute of your playthrough. I've had the digital version of this game and struggled with it and now have a much better feel for it. Thank you!
Really enjoying this series guys. It's great to actually see you both play in detail, gives a really comprehensive idea of how to play and makes the game much more enticing and interesting as a result. Uwe is definitely one of my favourite designers. I can't wait until you guys get to A Feast for Odin :)
Re your question about wood around 1:34:45, I've been wondering the last 45 minutes why no one took the wood and converted into charcoal with the Charcoal Kiln. It would have save you so much hard-to-get coal by using it as energy to paid for all those goods processing and buying ships.
I really love Le Havre. I think is one of the best games ever. It's simple and it's absolutely cool and clever. It's easy to teach because of that. And the thing I love most, is that you feel that you are building something, even when you lose. Maybe I'm wrong but for me is the best Uwe R. game. Big hugs from Spain and thank you for the video.
Okay, I can already tell I'll love this game, even 1/4 of the way through the video. It's both very Uwe Rosenburg and very approachable, feeling not nearly as heavy as people rate it. Simple to teach, snappy to play. I imagine the decision space becomes huge by the end of the game, however - as do the resource demands.
I really like these types of games. Tjis one might have to go on my wish list. I think you two should add long games into you content on a regular basis. Loving these long game playthroughs.
Rather like this one. It is quite long though! Not sure I've ever played with more than 3 as a result. I'm probably still really bad at it, but I do love the way it escalates from the early game, where you're just trying to get by, to the end game where you're shipping heaps of stuff and making mad francs!
This format is really good. Nice way to get a close up with the cards or other detached, detailed pieces. Please keep it up. I'm also about to buy this game. Absolutely convinced!
I think in 2p game Marketplace is built in the town. Great video, as always. I play mostly 2p with my wife, I love your playthroughs. Really looking forward for next Uwe's games.
Really good playthrough. I wonder if you stopped doing Uwe Rosenberg series or I am not able to find Caverna or Feast for Odin. Looking forward to watch them. I understand it is indeed ambitious to do this series, he has published a lot of games.
Love the game and have played it for years! I think I learned something though. I and my friends thought the player disc had to move each time. We also thought to take something from the supply you had to move your disc there, but watching you and re-reading the rules it looks like we've been doing it wrong! Thanks!
it's crazy that I've played almost all Uwe Rosenberg large games except Le Havre! Now, after watching your playthrough, I'm determined to play Le Havre for sure. Thanks for the great video!
first few playtrough I spent soo many actions working the smoke fish, bread and meat to provide for my feeding game and later I understood that ships are key to free ur actions for more lucrative one and ship the ressources.
@@BeforeYouPlay It's very straightforward, no changes to the gameplay really. You just try to score as high as possible and adapt your strategy to the building cards that come out.
@@BeforeYouPlay The solo is my favourite type of solo. I love Uwe’s solos. Unlike a lot of games push for solo bots, this keeps it nice and simple and don’t have to learn another card system.
The solo isn't as good as multiplayer, because the 1P card choices are a lot more limited. Not quite enough variability to push it into the upper tier of solo Uwe games, IMO. But still a very good game.
I really enjoy Le Havre. With players that are familiar with the game, I've been able to get a 4-player long game done in under 2 hours. I think this game is good at all player counts. One of the things I miss in our hobby as I play more new games is how varied the really great games are with repeated plays and at different player counts. Games you think you've figured out can play so differently at higher player counts or with players who are doing different strategies than you are used to and it's great to have that opened up and to have to adapt to it.
Love Le Havre so much. Especially my premium bit set from BGG. I will say it’s kind of counter intuitive to how one wants to play early on for the first few plays because of how loans work. In all honesty you should take a bunch of loans early because they give you the opportunity early to sure up your ability’s later…but that’s so not clear when first learning. At first you feel ohhh no I can’t take a loan that’s bad and do everything in your power to just survive rather than thrive. Great video keep up great work Before you Play.
Great video as always! Played the short game for the first time yesterday with three players. Still took around two hours and the person who taught it scored around 150 whereas I (and the other player, who had also never played it) scored in the 80s. As you mentioned, definitely can’t expect to do well your first time playing. It grew on me during the play though, and after, and very much feel this is indeed one that gets better with each playthrough. Hoping to try the long version soon but it would also likely me with 3 players again.
A classical item on the shelf, next to Agricola or Puerto Rico. Maybe not a first choice game these days but still well ranked. Personally a bit more time I spent over boars from Agricola than cattles here but.. for sure both comparable. Nice video btw.. as always 😊👍
We just played it 4 player Long game in 3 hours. We all loved it! We played at a pretty leisurely pace too. I would not hesitate to play it again at 4p as long as all were reasonably quick players.
Lots of ships lots of cows and lots energy to ship , avoid debt. You can use other players buildings, but they can not use your ships. Ships provide food, cash and points. Best buildings Hardware and Grocery. Love this game.
Friends of ours introduced this to us when we were first starting to get into serious board games. Such good memories! We bought my folks a copy of it, played with them several times before we started having kids, but oddly don't own a copy ourselves! EDIT: For what it's worth, most times we played were with 4 people (2 board game savvy couples) and it was always highly enjoyable!
If there's like 14+ wood in the stack, it is more efficient to collect wood and convert to charcoal than it is to collect 4 coal and convert to coke. That is only if you're going to use it for energy, not to sell.
Great playthrough of my second most loved game! As far as player count goes, I'd say that 2 and 3 players, long game, is the sweet spot. Though I wish I could play a 4 player game with seasoned players to see how the (need for) loans would impact the play and the economy.
@@ColonelKurtz I didn't expect to be asked what my favourite game is, but since you did, I'm going to say that the game I enjoy playing the most is Troyes, which has a great playthrough on this channel.
can't wait for you to play ora et labora.. that + fields of arle are my two fave uwe games. i actually like ora et labora the most with 4 people but you can do the long variant with 2 and it's still good. fields of arle is MADE for you two, hope that's in there, too, in this series
You look so familiar! Did you go to Westborough Middle School? I knew a girl named Monique and met her through Ron. The girl I knew from Middle School had short hair and glasses and she looks very much like you! It was so long ago, but I moved to Fremont after Middle School. They were the sweetest people!
They have another camera setup to show a table with a green cloth on it. They (Monique) place card on the green cloth to show it in close up. In editing this second view is overlaid onto the first (main) camera view, but using a 'chroma key' technique which removes the green and allows you to 'see through' to the main camera view.
Really enjoy your videos! You should reconsider on taking loans, especially early in the game. You’d spend less time worrying about feeding & more time building your economy early. There’s plenty of time to pay them off & usually one turn of the Shipping Line will cover it. I also couldn’t believe you just left all that wood sitting there! Don’t forget that you can still use it as energy. Instead of Naveen’s turn of going to the Marketplace to take 1 coal, iron & fish, he could have taken the wood offer which at that point was equal to about 5-6 coal!
Maybe if Naveen took the wood at the end it would have energy he needed since he did not need all that coke. Would have saved him a few actions I think
Yeah the wood was so tempting, should have pulled the trigger once 9+ piled up!! Had about 2-3 inefficient moves that likely cost me (Naveen) 20-30 points
Thank you for the playthrough. Watching it did NOT feel long. I enjoyed seeing an entire game play out and imagine how different choices would change the game. No worries from this fan....hehe... Also question: @ 1:38:18 wouldn't Monique have gotten 7 coal for all the hammer symbols?
Are the supply "houses" (eg the "Wood Supply" or "Treasury" - I hesitate to call them buildings) just dead space on the board? Or are they simple buildings one can enter for one matching resource (and not likely used in a two player game)? If it's just board art it's so weird to have pictures of the resources on them... or is it just me?
I think those are just spaces to hold your resources, they're not actually functional buildings. We thought it was more of a hassle to put them on the board so we just put ours in bowls
thanks! and thanks for the video! I always thought le havre was just nusfjords older brother (one of my favorites) but it's totally different and I'm enjoying your vid thoroughly!
@@Chereebers if you are limited to choosing 0, 1, or 2, evens will win 5/9 times. You would need to be able to choose from an equal number of even and odd numbers. Unless you like adding up numbers, a simple '1' or '2' should suffice.
@@ColonelKurtz hahaha. how in the world is that example correct. Even if we were restricted to using 0,1,2. it's still 50% of the time evens. you have 8 possibilities, and evens occur at (0,0) (0,2) (2,0) (2,2). So there's no flaw to this. Only your basic probability concepts makes it 'wrong'.
@@snowchamp If each person is limited to throwing 0, 1, or 2, here are the outcomes: 0, 0 = even 0, 1 = odd 0, 2 = even 1, 0 = odd 1, 1 = even 1, 2 = odd 2, 0 = even 2, 1 = odd 2, 2 = even That's 5 outcomes where the sum is EVEN. 4 outcomes the sum is ODD. Not sure how you think this is incorrect.
It’s one of my favourite use games. I find 2 and 3 players are pretty balance. Some find 3 player games not balance. However I don’t find so. As everyone will have same number of turn in total. 1231231 - 1st round 2312312 - 2nd round 3123123 - 3rd round ..
I think we both agree this game plays best at the 2 or 3 player count. There's an app that is fantastic (if you are familiar with the game) where you can try different player counts against the AI.
12:35 the way naveen said "once it becomes edible" totally made me laugh 😂 and the 16:42 "if you have two cattle, you birthed another cattle" wow, what a man 😂
This is Probably Our favorite game, It plays so well solo, 2 and 3 player, I would not want to play it at any higher count unless It were with veteran players.
Just a few comments now that I’ve actually been able to watch (half of) this: I noticed you didn’t mention the loans while teaching, and you mentioned them much later. I respect that you play trying to avoid them, but I wouldn’t treat them like they’re not in the game and avoid teaching the rule. Personally, I think they’re a wonderful mechanism to let yourself focus on building things up rather than chasing food, and the fact that you can’t take them at will (only when necessary) makes the buildings with money entry fees very interesting. And I joke that the game teaches a skewed version of financial responsibility because no matter how many loans you have, you only pay 1 franc in interest every time that (randomly placed! more fun!) space is triggered. I’m not sure if this was me misunderstanding or you misspeaking, but I thought I heard you say that upgraded goods count as the normal ones as well, specifically when talking about charcoal. But that’s definitely not true. The only upgraded goods you can use as the basic materials are bricks can be used as clay, and steel can be used as iron, and those are clearly marked. Just as in real life, using charcoal instead of wood to build something will not work. I think you neglected to point out that buying and selling a building is a way to kick someone out of it, so e.g. if someone’s camping out in the free-entry building spot, you can buy it from the town to be able to use it. It’s also a nice way to get an icon to make your Marketplace stronger. Monique is definitely after my heart with the cows and the abattoir. I can’t stay away from them.
Hi Yossef! These are all excellent points and mainly due to our inexperience with the game haha. Monique totally forgot about the loans because we never take them, but as someone else pointed out, that’s probably a mistake! They probably help you do more with your economy. Also, that’s so true! Buy a building to kick someone out of it haha. I’m sure that plays an even stronger role in higher player counts but that’s a great point. Thanks!
Good review. However what game an experienced player, unless it's a pure fun /party game, would not outbase you ? I think this argument can be said to any strategic tactical, even casual strategic tactical games.
2 года назад
another great game impossible to buy in Europe.. meh
Really? The Polish version is available in dozens of online shops, I took it for granted that German and English versions should be abundant. Maybe I should buy it then just in case, even though I've just bought Agricola so I'm not planning to play Le Havre anytime soon...