I think we have to differentiate between Gutenberg alone and Gutenberg with addon plugins. For me, in the second case it's not Gutenberg anymore because Generate Blocks, Kadence, Stackable, Spectra, Greenshift, Cwicly... all have their own solution that are not compatible with each other and which partly imprisons you. Almost 5 years later after the advent of Gutenberg, it is unfortunate that we still have to rely on complementary solutions to make a basic professional site.
I still don't understand the difference between page builders like Bricks or Elementor and Gutenberg and additional plugins that "extend" (almost replace) Gutenberg to page builder level. In my opinion it all boils down to the same thing in the end.
I have found that with every version of WordPress it' just seems more and more bloated with every Gutenberg update. The backups are taking longer....but as I said above I hate it. Every Gutenberg site tends to look the same....
Gutenberg is not on the same level as the builders you mentioned. While Elementor is a page builder, Bricks, on the other hand, is more like a Website Builder... It allows you to create your site from the ground up and you have complete control over every little detail. Bricks is a theme, so you don't need an extra plugin and it's extremely fast and powerful. Where Bricks will really shine is if you work with a lot of dynamic data and custom post types. You can create a really powerful web app with Bricks. I used to recommend Oxygen builder for building powerful sites, but the developers haven't got their priorities straight, so henceforth, it's Bricks or Webflow.
if u r comfortable with what u r using, no need to switch it. i heard linus crap, ya ya whatever, a lot third party software such as accounting software, there are in windows system not linus, so forget about these tech people bragging
@@fannyalbi9040exactly. I'm an Enterprise cross platform mobile apps developer coming from a web and SQL database background with cloud infrastructure... Just use what you're comfortable with. It's more important to get your product out there than perfecting the chase of finding the "Mysterious perfect" technology. Also, simple website designs are good because it works. What's more important is the textual content and if it ranks on Google for SEO. Anything else is not important to make money with your website / blog.
I am actually building my first website with kadence blocks (over 25yrs experience in creating websites), and I am quite disappointed about how much unnecessary code kadence blocks is generating.. it's even not possible to paste a simple html code via "html-edit-mode" to the list-modul.. because all the kadence comments are missing.. at the moment I don't think I will use kadence blocks a second time..
Paul - this is just mega🎀 thats just great 💖💖💖15 mins packed with tons of information: and just as useful as usual! Paul - your a hero: Keep inspiring us. plz do more of such great vids. Hats off to you!!!
Isn't this semantics… Gutenberg is or at least it wants to be a page builder (just its native and included). BTW Pinegrow is a tool that should sit in the Build your Theme and Blocks section in the future as they are currently in the Beta for a Plugin version of their established desktop software.
Agreed, Pinegrow should definitely be included, even without the WordPress plugin. I've only tried the desktop version, but I think that might still be my preference. The Tailwind & Bootstrap integrations are fantastic.
Always interesting content, Paul. FWIW I'm currently using the free version of 'Blocksy'. I have been very pleased with their customer support (given that I'm using the free version). Your recommendations are spot on!
Thank you for your insight. Very interesting and informative as always. But, I really want to now your opinion about Crocoblock. They are, in some cases, trying to move away from Elementor… But it as been some time since you don’t talk about the tools and I really want to know your current opinion on that. Thank you very much for all the great content.
We have just rebuilt our website with Blocksy theme free and Stackable free (definitely abandoning Elementor). It has been spectacular, fast, easy to understand and we ended up with the website we wanted and very fast loading. We need the Dynamic and Conditional Data etc features that come with the PRO version. Now let's go! But before that it is very difficult to decide between: GeneratePress and GenerateBlocks Kadence and KadenceBlock Blocksy and Stackable or Greenshift... I'm drunk with so many possibilities. Cwicly was impossible for me to understand and was very slow to build...
I am considering not continuing my yearly Elementor pro grandfathered 1000 site per year license. Why? Because a recent Wordpress update clashed with it and I lost functionalities of at least one client site that requires the pro plugin. Now, seeing even with the pro license it can become incompatible causing many issues, yet the free Elementor still prevailed. I am now using an Elementor Plugin detector to view my sites to see where I used pro plugin features. What I see is most I build with are the basic free features anyway. Only here and there do I have the pro plugins being used at certain parts of the sites. So my future thought is to not use Elementor pro due to having WP update issues where it self-deletes and then I have to go to FTP to delete the upload THEN re-upload the pro plugin yet pay for this added pro plugin that seems to be giving me more issues than it's worth (these days anyway). Just not sure how well these free block page builders look and or how to get use to building with them since I am acclimated to Elementor now. And of course using the free Elementor builder still seems solid so just letting pro go is a 1st option.
I’d like to see a video on Genesis. As for these builders, what offers the most features with the least amount of bloat? I’m current struggling with the resource requirements and load time of JetEngine + WooCommerce + Elementor. I’m building a directory listing website.
Great vid as always mate... Native Gutenterd will take a very long time to catch up with, and indeed compete with, page builders, BUT... The vast range of tools surfacing that focus on enhancing Gutenterd is certainly a sign of the future
Yup! Gutenurd alone is still lacking in so many ways. But, with tools like that covered in the video, you are no longer tied to the need or reliance on a page builder and everything that comes with them. :)
While I can appreciate the intent of exploring this as an option with an open mind, I believe considering this route to a solution needs to embrace a wide degree of observations to be objective. Therefore, before making such a comparison in general between a page builder and a block builder, some important distinctions must be considered. I think you have to decide "how" you want to invest your time, your money and the future of the site you are building. Yes, some of these block level editors may feel less intimidating up front but in the long run what have you got? You STILL are going to make a significant time and financial investment that you need to compare the end result for. A page builder such as Bricks has some strong advantages that can't be ignored. One such is the cost overall. You can still purchase an LTD right now for less than $200 ($79 for one site). These block builders are re-occurring pricing models. These block builders don't seem to have the strength of a class styling system to globally change design styling like a proper page builder. If you know what I mean by the use of classes to style the content, then you are possibly above the common experience level. In the hands of the less experienced especially, you can easily end up pushing pixels about to create a cookie cutter result in many cases. Now scale the creation and management of a site to more than one person in a site project and potential issues are easily created in terms of consistency and ubiquity., not to mention future changes down the road. Building a site this way can easily involve more than basic numbers of plugins to achieve the desired outcomes in many of the cases. This can effect stability, interoperability and performance. A solution like this can be a non-starter in some cases because of the dynamics involved. There is also the consideration in some cases of the resulting performance. Maybe a "home blog" this is not as important as running a business or profit center with the site. How does the solution scale down the road? How easily can it be maintained - especially by more than one person? I think it's very important to acknowledge that comparing block builders to page builders (just coin a phrase here), is not an overall "apple to apples" comparison. There are always going to be tradeoffs and they can be very important. I would recommend careful consideration before going this route. No I don't work for the Bricks developers and I get no financial consideration for my opinions)
Most of the points raised could apply to both methods of building sites. Plus, page builders encompass many tools and using a sweeping statement about costs while pointing out Bricks current Ltd doesn’t prove a fair comparison. For example, Greenshift had an Ltd recently, but that’s not the point if the topic in this video. Regarding the class system, the likes of GenerateBlocks and Cwicly have this integrated into the core of the software. Another negative for page builders is that they generally do not have core compatibility as they override WordPress to a lesser or greater degree. All things being equal, these are all tools to achieve a result. Choosing the right ones is more important than saying one type of tool is superior to the next one. But, the whole point of this video and the topic is to spark debate. So, thank you for adding your thoughts to the conversation. 👍😁
Love you. Hate Gutenberg as a page builder. Only use it for blog posts. Elementor has its issues but it’s far more intuitive and I can actually see what I’m doing as I’m working. Also, I’ve never found it difficult to optimize Elementor speed to really high performance. Other than it’s inherent speed, Gutenberg just isn’t close to being at Elementor’s (or other visual page builder) level.
Recently I had to work in a premium version of a Wix website. I was surprised how easy it was and Just buy draging The elements, they were always in the right position at the front end. What page builder you think is close to this way that pro wix works? I am trying some options to maybe leave elementor.
Here's one ridiculous thing that keeps me from using Gutenberg or themes like Kadence: the list views and setting menus on the left and right affect the element widths on the canvas, and hence the entire layout. This happened in Elementor, and some genius made a plugin that let the element menu float over the canvas, so it wasn't cramming its way onto the real estate of my layouts. If I want to see how things really look, I'm either working on two tabs or constantly closing the menus to get an accurate view of things. I haven't found a fix for it, but Bricks doesn't smoosh up my layouts every time I have something open, so Bricks wins for me. Is there something I'm missing?
Many of my clients now prefer a website designed with Gutenberg blocks over Elementor. Because Elementor slows down your website a lot. That's why I transfer Elementor designs directly to Gutenberg.
THX, Paul - for some reaseons lots of my elementor sites use realtionships;) I dont want to go with JetEngine (I know it is working) ... Kadence Pro + Kadence Blocks Pro and ACF ist my go to at the moment and so much better and faster than elementor - but how about the relationship's - you did quite a few clips back then with elementor ... still missing in Gutenberg as far as I see ... By chance - do you have any "insights" on Cwicly thinking about that .... Have a great evening - Cheers and again THX for all the brilliant output Paul
You mean taxonomy query relations? I am interested too, and found Pauls video: THIS Is So Powerful - Cwicly Query Builder ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-yRS5V34NwvU.html
I think you should have added Astra theme. There are several reasons why they are the #1 most used theme. Add Spectra, their free block builder, and I think the combo is better than Generate Press.
Great content Paul, thanks for your video. Can you help me with 2 questions? Background experience with Web page building - 10 Years playing with Weebly. I am now just researching wordpress options before I kick the ball and start building a site for my CAD drafting business. My website needs to have ecommerce options for digital downloads. Q1. Does Generate blocks paired with generate press sit inside the Gutenburg editor? Q2. If you think of other suggestions to point me in the right direction, please let me know. Cheers Glen
But the Generate blocks mainly shows the premium blocks which brings up the same issue like the main page builders. If you don't keep up the many yearly subscriptions, your client's sites lose site functionalities only the pro licenses allow. Subscriptions are getting way out of hand as you build to make nice sites but then you the web developer have to continue all these subscriptions to upkeep your client sites; well after they paid you to build it. Unless we can convince clients to pay a yearly fee to maintain their sites even if they are not on a monthly plan is a must. Or all these builders and add-ons are not worth it.
Sadly, that's part of the cost of doing business and something that needs to be factored into either your maintenance/care plans or the license and upkeep is transferred to the client and the responsibility lies with them.
Greenshift has "Query Loop Builder" and most probably next month, they will release a powerful "WooCommerce Builder". Stackable does Not have any of these two features.
I’m not that genned up on Greenshift, but it’s more focussed on being an all in one solution for building more advanced sites and layouts over Stackable. If that’s what you need, my money would be on Greenshift out of those 2 options.
I tried Elementor once. I hated I had to install something to build a template. Along came Gutenburg and Full Site Editing. I use it exclusively now. It's got the basics and that's all I need.
Where exaxtly did I suggest that? The video breaks things down into several scenarios and provides options for EACH scenario. Of which, the suggested tools were a theme (which you have with most page builders) and a block level tool. That was it? It's also worth bearing in mind, if you want to use a page builder like Elementor, you will rarely ONLY use Elementor. Want dynamic options - at least one plugin (usually several to handle conditional logic, many basic features that are not covered in Elementor). This whole idea that you can do everything with a page builder is a myth unless you are creating relatively simple sites.
Elementor for me is the best way all in one single shoot !!!, they know the other are running so, elementor, Beaver and the others actually top sellers will became lighter, and more "flex" ible step by step, problems is the price. for some
RU-vid Wordpress Content Creators: Is X builder going to replace elementor? Heres why! US: "opens up gutterdence sees the UI" Nope back to elementor Repeat rinse every 2 weeks. 🤣😂
Omfg...I tested greenshift. The plugin sucks. I have a lifetime license and I cannot use it. Is far far away from kadence. Very low customization options and support is...better no
Good video to explain all the options but I just don't find working with Gutenberg enjoyable, Elementor and more recently Bricks just make's the whole process easier, especially when having clients that want to be involved in updating their sites after the build.
That's a fair comment. This was less about should you and more about could you. If you're handing off to clients, then maybe a set of custom blocks could help the process. Working in Gutenturd alone isn't the best experience for sure. But, the speed benefits are worth it for me. However, with the likes of Bricks, you have some great options for still using PB's. It's a great time to be building websites with WordPress! ;)
Thank you for another great video. I've been getting sick of Elementor, especially when I have to regenerate CSS from time to time, it's just not worth it. I'm buying Bricks Builder, but in the long run, I feel Gutenberg will be better. I'm learning more PHP, so I'm hoping that'll allow me to do nearly everything I want to. Cwicly, Bricks, and Gutenberg is what I'll be working on from now on. Bricks claims that we can edit their pages in Gutenberg and vice-versa, don't know how that works but I'm curious to try that out.
Yes, they are solid plugins too. I pretty selective about the tools I use, so included only those in this video. Once Spectra Pro comes out with dynamic data support, I'll be investigating that in detail.
Great video as usual, an excellent overview of the current tools available - I'm a GeneratePress/Blocks user and just wanted to mention that Accordion's are on the way - they are mentioned on Github, but I have no idea on timing at this stage!
I’ve been building a community site using Elementor pro but I like the idea of switching to something less ‘weighty’, so will check out your suggestions. One thing I’d like to see is a tutorial on is how to incorporate ‘newsfeeds’ into a website either with RSS or some other tool. For example, we have two local councils which send out media releases by email or on their websites; and other organisations which frequently update ‘what’s on’ pages. Thanks.
Hey Paul, thanks for the video, I love how succinctly you go over all these different approaches. As far as building custom blocks, have you looked into Tangible Blocks at all? Both Lazy Blocks and Genesis Custom Blocks require you to build your block with PHP, but Tangible Blocks uses its own templating language that has a lot of the same capabilities but a noob like me can learn it in a couple hours and be building totally custom blocks like the pros. It's certainly not no-code (it's basically like writing HTML), but it's an innovative solution that makes queries and conditional logic and stuff WAY more approachable. As a bonus, it simultaneously creates the same block in Gutenberg, Beaver Builder, and Elementor, so you can switch page builders down the road and not lose your work. I think at the moment it has big potential for agencies who want to quickly build custom blocks to hand off to their clients without needing to learn PHP/React, but I think there's also a case to be made for WP DIYers to get a lot more flexibility without needing to learn PHP. Anyway, thought that might interest you.
I haven't, but I will. :) This is pretty crazy, but I was just looking at Loops & Logic and see that you're part of the people behind it. How mad is that to see that connection in the space of a few minutes? 😜 Speaking of Loops & Logic, I'll be playing around with that next week I think. :)
@@WPTuts Haha, somehow despite it powering like 50%+ of the web, the WordPress community is still a small world! I can't claim to be "behind" the brilliant dev work going on with L&L, but I do work with the people who are building it and I've been trying to help out in the community as I learn WP development myself. Let me know if you ever want to give Tangible Blocks a try, I'd be happy to show you around. The interface at the moment is a bit 'raw' in that it gives the user super powerful tools but doesn't really guide them toward understanding just how much this can change their site-building workflow. We've got big dreams for the UI, but we're prioritizing building a rock-solid foundation for those dreams for now 😊 Thanks again for making content that's honest and approachable for beginners while still promoting ideas that work at scale. It's always a breath of fresh air to hear your nuanced opinions on the WP ecosystem!
Another example proving that gutenberg is not even half baked nearing the end of 2022 - almost clickbait to say "Leaving WordPress Page Builders for Gutenberg | Possible?" - and show without a page builder, just use gutenberg and wordpress, but add special plugins or/and special themes to do basic things like flexbox. More proof that gutneberg should never have been in core. I tried not long ago to remake a site using base gutneberg and ended needing to add generate blocks just to get some containers and padding. Sadly we are stuck with the guten-bloat - and an even more fragmented community of designers and maintainers now that we need even more plugins to do the basic things that free page builders could do with WP free years ago. Thanks for the extra proof!
Hi! I love your videos. I am stuck with something that I'd like you to do for me instead if you're open for site customization services. It's about a combination of Jetengine, Jet Smart Filter & Greenshift to create some custom post type. Would you please send me a link where we could furter discuss this?
I built two sites with Gutenberg for one of my clients. Having issues frequently and have no clue why. Maybe I lack knowledge. But still I don't like Gurenberg for the UI. Hope one day I will move to GB as it's lot more faster than Elementor
I think I could be here all day mentioning all the great tools out there. I need to find a balance between enough info to be useful but not too much to give information overload. :)
Nice work Paul! I have numerous agencies and LTDs you mentioned. I’m curious at the present time, what combination would you use for a car rental site? No mention of Bricks?
Thanks Paul, I am thinking of starting with kadence to get going and then later transfer over to Generate press with Generate blocks. I figured this would help me with my learning curve. Question - if I did this can I bring my work with me when I transfer or do I need to choose the right builder from scratch?
I want to leave Elementor Builder but I found myself lost in front of so many packs of blocks and options. This video was a very important one for me. Thank you very much.
@WPTuts it's very easy to use why wouldn't you use it? I'm still exploring all options for building sites. I like Kadence, trying to learn Bricks. Breakdance pricy but seems easy but I don't know all the different functions they do or don't have..
I like your realistic view, but I have to disagree with the first 3 minutes. Although fine tools, there's no flexibility whatsoever. However, I get this might be a matter of perspective.
That’s fine Joe, we all have opinions and videos like this are created to spark a conversation. I’m curious why you feel there’s no flexibility though? Sure, a theme will always have limitations, but the initial few minutes are all about really simple sites and not something you want infinite design control over. That’s what the subsequent sections move towards. 😉
i've changed my agency website from astra + elementor to kadence + gutenberg, and its incredible, i still dont use to create my clients website, because it take twice the time, but its a change i want to make soon. but for know one think i notice is that there still a layout limitatios, and that we see in the editor isnt exactly how it shows in the front end
I really want to like Gutemberg, and I dont mind it to do posts, but I dont really feel confortable with the UI and the workflow. But I will keep trying from time to time
It gets considerably easier once you settle on a solid set of tools to use with it and just like any page builder out there, it will have a learning curve attached to it. Once you get past that, it gets considerably easier and less frustrating.
@@WPTuts I will revisit some blocks/themes when i have the time, Im an Elementor user wanting/omw to switch to Bricks, but I would love to have a combo of theme/blocks as my secondary tool
That’s entirely up to you. I think it’s a great theme and the pro version has a lot of great features. If you need those, then yes. If not, stick with the free version. It’s a great theme. 👍
