LiFePO4 Battery Buyers Guide! Battleborn vs. Renogy vs. DIY vs. Simpliphi and more! 

*Video Table of Contents to Save Time!* Battery Reviews- Battle born: 1:31 Renogy: 3:26 Relion: 4:35 Simpliphi: 6:01 Kilovault: 6:53 Chinese HHX: 7:46 My DIY Used Prismatic Cell Battery: 8:50 DIY New Prismatic Cell Battery: 9:53 DIY New Prismatic Cells with BMS: 10:23 *Bonus Material!* $16 BMS vs. $300 BMS: 12:20 Prismatic VS. Cylindrical Cells: 14:44 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Does off-grid solar confuse you? Check out my DIY friendly website for solar system packages and product recommendations, and so much more! www.mobile-solarpower.com Join our DIY solar community! #1 largest solar forum on the internet for beginners and professionals alike: www.diysolarforum.com Check out my best-selling, beginner-friendly 12V off-grid solar book (affiliate link): amzn.to/2Aj4dX4 If DIY is not for you, but you love solar and need an offgrid system, check out Tesla Solar. Low prices and great warranty, and they can take your entire house offgrid with their new Powerwalls: ts.la/william57509 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ My solar equipment recommendations (Constantly updated! Check here first): 12V/48V Lithium Batteries: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solar-batteries.html Solar System Component Directory: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solarcomponents.html Plug-N-Play Systems: www.mobile-solarpower.com/full-size-systems.html Complete 48V System Kits: www.mobile-solarpower.com/complete-48v-solar-kits.html DIY Friendly Air Conditioner/ Heat Pumps: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solar-friendly-air-conditioners.html Complete 48V System Blueprint: www.mobile-solarpower.com/48v-complete-system-blueprint.html ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ My Favorite Online Stores for DIY Solar and Coupon Codes: -Current Connected: SOK, Victron and High Quality Components. Best prices and warranty around: currentconnected.com/?ref=wp -Signature Solar: Cheap Server Rack Batteries and Large Solar Panels: www.signaturesolar.com/?ref=h-cvbzfahsek -Ecoflow Delta Official Site: My favorite plug-n-play solar generator: us.ecoflow.com/?aff=7 -AmpereTime: Cheapest 12V batteries around: amperetime.com/products/ampere-time-12v-100ah-lithium-lifepo4-battery?ref=h-cvbzfahsek -Rich Solar: Mega site and cheaper prices than renogy! Check them out: richsolar.com/?ref=h-cvbzfahsek -Shop Solar Kits: Huge site with every solar kit you can imagine! Check it out: shopsolarkits.com/?ref=will-p -Battery Hookup: Cheap cell deals bit.ly/2mIxSqt 10% off code: diysolar -Watts 24/7: Best deals on all-in-one solar power systems, with customer support and distribution here in the USA: watts247.com/?wpam_id=3 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Contact Information: I am NOT available for personal solar system consult! If you wish to contact me, this is my direct email: williamprowsediysolar@gmail.com Join the forum at diysolarforum.com/ if you wish to hang out with myself and others and talk about solar FTC Disclosure Statement and Disclaimers: Every video includes some form of paid promotion or sponsorship. Some links on this youtube channel may be affiliate links. We may get paid if you buy something or take an action after clicking one of these. My videos are for educational purposes only. Information is subject to change/update at any time. Electricity is DANGEROUS and can kill. Be smart and use common sense :) DIY Solar Power with Will Prowse is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, An affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com

People like you remind me to make a "content creator" tribute. Videos like this, bring the world forward. Better than ANY CLASSROOM

After a month of watching your videos, I designed my own 400W solar power system which uses 4 HQST 100W solar panels, 2 Battle Born batteries, and EPEVER 40A Charge Controller, and a Giandel 2000W inverter. I also ordered your book. Everything except the Charge Controller has arrived and I'm putting together the system. I could not be more excited!!

How refreshing, an American on RU-vid who is both eloquant and knowledgeable. Good job.

I like that you are not bias without factual data to support your preference. As always you supplied great jnsight. I'm just learning so thank you.

You are my #1 go to guy for everything solar. I have been at this for about 10 years but I have learned more from your videos in the past few months than I ever learned. You are a credit to this movement. Keep up the great work

All my projects are open source so you are welcome to build them and try and cost optimize the design :). The new low cost SBMS0 is 159CAD that is about 120USD and is a BMS + advanced energy monitor. The SBMS is the most important part of a solar system and cost is usually below 5% of the total cost of the system with battery and PV panels being the most expensive parts. Is possible to eliminate futures and do an even lower cost SBMS version but going from 5% of system cost for SBMS to 4% or even 3% will not make much of a difference and you will sure be missing those futures eliminated to reduce cost.

Thanks for this video, great job. As you mentioned, we sell our own KiloVault batteries, which we are very proud of. We also have had many happy customers with both the BattleBorn and SimpliPhi. They all have unique features that help determine which is the right option for your system. The missing data you didn't mention is the reason the SimpliPhi are more expensive. At 80% DoD, they have 10,000 cycles. The others have 5,000 cycles. So, while they are more expensive upfront, with a longer life, they will be less expensive for the life of the system.

Great stuff Will, keep up the good work, I'm sure this will be very useful to the vehicle dwelling community. We're going with Battle Born for our new rig.

Just in case you don't know Will, you are getting a strong following in the yacht cruising community. For all the same reasons as the RV community etc, but also because you deliver such great information in such a succinct and charming way!. Another great video, thanks!

LOVE LOVE LOVE how much knowledge you have on the topic, and so glad you are stoked to share it. One minor suggestion, edit your pieces so there is 12 more frames of pause between cuts. That will help laymen, like myself, retain what you're saying a little more. Keep being awesome! Mark

The fact that you recognize not making something because you assume other people will do it is a mistake; that makes you a leader with the right humble beginnings. Please step up to the calling; the world will really be a better place for it. I find all your videos so helpful and inspiring. It would be logically the next step if you started making reliable components for us to purchase so we know we can trust them for the right price point.

I'm new to this and like to keep things simple, so when you said that Battle Born made their terminals in a way that they can't be damaged...... I'm all in now. Small touches like that where a Company is actually thinking about more than JUST profit says a LOT. Great video! Thank you.

Excellent video thanks Will. I went with battle born. In my opinion the warranty alone is worth the added up front cost. Being a complete novice with solar electrical systems I figure just buy the best and hopefully eliminate as many problems as possible.

Great video Will! Tons of information for those of us wanting to build our own solar system on a budget but still wanting quality parts and components! Thanks man:)

Excellent info. I have been full time RVing with 909 amp hours of lithium iron phosphate batteries from LifeBlue. I have 3 - 303 amp hour batteries and 1300 watts of solar panels. The system has performed flawlessly for 4 1/2 years now. I have Bluetooth access to the important battery info at a glance. And in 4 1/2 years, they have not lost any capacity at all. They were 303 amp hours each when I got them, and that is what they still are today. I could not be happier with them.

This guy can talk about technical things in a way that the common man can understand. Outstanding job.

Just bought your books on amazon just now, because of this video.

This guy knows his stuff, I have learned a lot.

Your presentation was great. I don't see many, if any, presentations done as well as yours has been. Most people get off topic or sys um, ah or stutters so much during their presentations it is irritations. I also think your pronunciation of words are great and understandable which is unusual for people now days. Thank you.

Brilliant presentation! Refreshing to see a truly intelligent young man sharing valuable insights on YT. Much appreciated!

Thanks for this video. I needed to hear the choices and you are THE MAN when it comes to Solar and Battery chemistry...

Will, a new viewer here; man, you are amazing with the tech stuff and give greats explanations. What is your educational background and primary work. Like I said, I'm impressed, mi amigo! Y'all Be Safe!

This is the first of your videos I have seen and I subscribed to your channel less then half-way through it (btw, thanks for not begging for likes and subscriptions like many of the hacks). I am new to the world of solar power and I need real information from people who have done their homework. In two words: Thank you.

In case of self-made I would also consider insurance matters. Many boxed batteries are tested for shock absorption.... As if the cells inside those, it's often IRF18650 1400 or 1500mah cells. I like these lifepo4 cells. I've observed that over-discharge as well as over-charge (in example to 4 or 4.5V) they typically don't get hot but instead go super high resistance and lose capacity to 1mah or so. That's a very safe failure mode. So 1 broken cell won't really impact anything else than balancing (and overall capacity). Many other lithium cells instead get a small internal short - not only in case of failure but also in case of end-of-life (which is constantly drains the batter pack making it impossible to balance), over-heat/convert charge into heat until fire or losing liquid. So many bad things just for a bit more power density and C-rating that are unlikely to happen with lifepo4.

Dude...what is your background to know all of this stuff! You are amazing! I happen to favor the Battle Born batteries for all of the points you mentioned...thanks for the video!

I don't know what you are talking about cause it's over my head, lol. Just watching as usual for support.

After watching this video I feel like I have read a whole book about batteries. Lots of love from Pakistan

Good little rant :-) I bought a Battleborn for my little teardrop trailer because it's simple as you said: drop it in, change the mppt controller settings - done. Result is double the usable capacity in the same amount of space and for less weight - all good stuff in a small camper trailer. I just depleted the battery for the first time in 2 years after camping in Oregon under smoke filled skies and trees. 4 days of use from electric fridge to TV and heater - I'm pleased with that and it charged full in a day once we got out into the sun. I'm perfectly happy with that setup. If I could fit 2 of them I probably would, but it's a nice setup that simply works without having to think about it.

Outstanding primer for those exploring the lithium option.

Brilliant ! always the BEST videos... I am learning so much from all your posts... for my boat project - Thank you Will.

Very useful, thanks so much for this information. I just watched some other guy ramble on another channel and I felt stupider than when I started watching, you actually taught me something useful and helped to inform my decision making process.

I could be wrong, but i appreciate your "unbiased" opinion when it comes to batteries and components in this solar arena. Im sad to see other RU-vidrs fall back to the old ways of shameless promotion of said products. Keep it real brother, and know you are appreciated. Knowledge is ($olar) power.

Awesome video! It's almost like you're reading our minds and answering our biggest questions!

Great info. It’s nice to hear an educated unbiased view of all of this stuff! Thank you so much!

Will, thank you so much for all the information, I've watched your videos on where you came from and where you are now, we need more young men like you. Thank you again, your book is coming, we're doing a van conversion.

LOL! Was funny to see you say you were waiting on someone to build a GOOD BMS for around $50 and then realize to get one to meet your standards, YOU should be the one! I agree, you should, I know it would be a hassle but I think there's a lot of things you should build ( or atleast design ( select all the parts and options and have a company build it and agree to your quality and standards) because If you did that and approved of whatever it was then I and everyone else would know it would be the best by far! I think you are really missing out on a great opportunity and even more the solar world is missing out! I think if you did this, it would greatly improve the quality of solar everywhere! Please give it some thought and maybe even investigate if there is a company that would partner with you and allow you complete control and manufacture a system that meets your requirements and standards! Just to see a system stamped with your approval that it's your design ( has everything you want and nothing you don't) I think if they didn't think ahead and have all the parts to build a million or have half a million already built before the launch, they would sell out and never be able to keep up with the demand! Thanks for all you have done and do ! I hope you really think about what I have suggested!

My eyes are now open, thanks again Will.

Hey Will.. just want to share my experience with the Renogy Lifepo4.. I pushed it to it's limits and got locked out after it went under 10 volts.. called Renogy Tech and was advised to use a Noco Genius that has the 13.6v Supply setting to unlock it.. I ran it in the Supply mode for 7 minutes and was able to unlocked the battery.. I repeated this 2 more times and successful unlocked 3 lithium batteries..

Will: Your battery expertise plus hands-on knowledge plus gift of gab points you to better things. Also, your fair treatment of mfgrs vs quality vs price is quite valuable. Best wishes.

not only was this super informative, but this guy should be a model or summin, no homo, but this guys eyes, teeth, skin tone and hair are just to cool

Thanks Will for making all of this stuff understandable to someone without your knowledge !!!

I just ordered 3 BBB for my RV. SOLAR Next!

WOW.. I rarely watch 20 min videos all the way through but too much good information, i couldn't skip forward Very nice Will Keep it up!!!

I don't know why... but your videos are my best lullaby now!.. well, in a good way.. watching you explain.. and it continues in my dreams.

Great vid. You need to build the $50.00 BMS and sell it. Sounds like a good idea.

U have a really cool channel. I was searching something like this. Keep it up!!! You defenietly earned a new subscriber :)

great work Will - my views; No wonder manufactures don't want a comparison - all they want is you to reiterate their sales blurb, so Good On You!.. Second, the reason Slimpliphi are so popular is; the did what Pringles did - spend a lot of effort on marketing - the whole sacred geometry thing.. Third. So, you say there are three primary manufactures for the inner cells so - why not buy a cheap eBay Chinese battery and use a quality BMS.. Job done!

Just switched to a Battle Born: super simple swap out and no worries. Worth the price (I paid $899).

My _guess_ is that there is a difference between prismatic/flat cells and cylindrical cells in that a cell is made up of layers of coated tape and electrolyte. As the cell cycles the layers tend to separate and degrade the cell. Cylindrical cells keep pressure on the layers so they do not degrade as quickly. Prismatic/flat cells have no way to handle layer separation so they bulge over use. I have noticed that EV car batteries that use flat cells keep the cells under pressure between end plates.

You sir are a great teacher!! Thanks!

Just a note on Warranty Period for the DIY set with Yellow cells (Winston), we provide up to 5 years warranty. At least judging by the photo of DIY set, it is our product ,)

Thanks for sharing your knowledge. Really helpful for me here on a veery remote farm in Australia. Just had to slow you down in the playback speed to 75% to digest all your info easier. Could be my age or being born in Holland. :-) Good stuff - keep it coming !

6X battle borns here and highly recommend them!!!

Dang, you pt a lot of really good info into a relatively short space! thank you so much!! I've been looking for a good solution for my small RV that allows for a relatively high consumption rate (we're old, sooo.. lol) And want a small solar setup.. suitable for Arizona where sun and wind are not in short supply.

Thanks for all you do! Excellent reviews, honest, informative, understandable, entertaining, concise. Just ordered a Battle Born from Amazon using your link. Enjoying supporting you!

Important nuance to take into account: no two warranties are created equally (so to speak), aka the different warranties mentioned are not comparable. Some cover aging and others only cover defects. For example, Battle Born has a 10 year "10 year manufacturers defect" warranty while Simpliphi *seems* to have a 10 year / 10k cycles warranty for the remaining capacity. It might provide some explanation for the large differences in price!

Great video video Will, I enjoy your channel. How about doing a review of the Lifeblue lithium battery? They offer some advantages such as built in Bluetooth monitor, and a built in heater to extend the charging temp down to -4° F.

I'm getting hooked on your videos, I think, I think, I might be getting thru the clueless wall! haha , still hard to understand, 'what is electricity', does not flow thru my brain cells easily', haha. Thank you for your videos

I'm planning to build a solar system with a redundant power capacity of at least 2-3 times my maximum daily usage, and I've been looking at different setups including mppt charge controllers and probably a d.i.y. setup for the b.m.s. with temperature monitoring (and regulating if I can set it up) so I'm glad that you've put this video out to help people see what's available.

Battleborn has their 100AH 12V Deep Cycle, LiFePO4 battery price of $949 now jacked up to $1,399.99! So, the cost per watt hour jumps to $1.09. They're cashing in. /edit: actually, that seems to just be the Amazon seller(s). Website price remains the same.

Hey WIll, Thanks for the video.. great information and well presented.

Just one question: a year later we are still looking for that perfect BMS. Will, build one already, please !

There are a lot of folks living and cruising on sailboats. There is a whole lot of folks thinking about going LiFePO4 battery on their boats. There is a lot of confusion going on. Could you consider doing a video on LiFePo4 for live-aboard/cruising sailboats? Thanks bro keep up the outstanding work!

Wow, I've binge watched a lot of your videos, and soaked in an incredible amount of information. Very stimulating to the brain. I cant wait to begin building my own solar batteries for my 26' 30A rv solar.

Will, You're the man! Thank you so much for breaking all this stuff down. Your videos are so freaking helpful!!

I want to use a lilo or battery for ocean going boat. I have a led acid starter battery. I want a new battery to run the electric down trigger, radar, chart plotter, GPS, etc.

😂wow great video. That $16 white bms is the same one I got for $3.50 two days ago. Yesterday I was adding silver soldier and 12 gauge copper to the busses because the little soldier buss bars in my opinion cannot handle past 60 amp for long without burning up. I am testing it on 4 of my headway 38120’s before I risk my whole stack. I will definitely add the heat sensor. Thanks for the battery brand review and information.

Dear Appreciate for good video. Few suggestions: 1- Please use Cable ties for dressing cables, instead of making nots at cables BMS. 2-BMS and O/Current Protection (adjustable current) is easy to built. 3-Adding more un-proven protections some times reduces the reliability and make simple things complicated, I donot deny for adding protections but PROVEN PROTECTION and if required technically. THanks Regards Siraj Inst & Controls Engineer

Please Please Please do a video on a good 50-100 dollar BMS for your DIY Battery. I would like to use a cheaper BMS and use a victron battery monitor instead of that 300 dollar smart BMS system. Loved the video thank you again

17:52 so, Will, when are you building your own BMS system and selling it to the world?

Thanks for the video. The TCB Worthy lifepo4 batteries that Amazon sells have low temp and high temp cut off and the other safety things . They are saying that their batteries can be wired in series of 4 batteries and or parallel of 4 strings with a total of 16 batteries and they are about $180 each for a 100 ah capacity .

Thanks very much for this comarison, Will. I live in Germany and most of the models you can't get here. But I'm interested in buying a renogy 100AH and your work is very useful for me.

If you make a good quality bms I will buy it for $50

Thanks for the great info, I just subscribed! When you buy battery cells, what do you use to charge, discharge, test, etc? Thanks

Updated video time? It's a whole new world.

Hi Will Thanks for the great summary on these products. Very helpful. One thing you didn't discuss is certification to the appropriate UL standard. Battery systems used in stationary renewable energy applications, either off-grid or grid-tied, should be certified to UL standard 1973. Inspectors in my area know about this and will fail an electrical inspection for battery systems that are not properly certified. I believe that the Simpliphi is the only one you discussed that has this certification. Maybe that is why it is more expensive. The integral circuit breaker on the Simpliphi is a really nice feature. I don't think any of the others have that.

Why is the cost of these batteries so hi? Great video!

Hello, I think you said the Battle Born battary had internal BMS. Will my RV AGM charger charge the BB lithium Battery OK ?

Here is the info concerning SimpliPHI lithium batteries.: SimpliPhi LFP batteries require no maintenance after installation. Warranty & Lifetime: Lead acid batteries reach their end of life after 2-7 years and on average last about 500 - 1600 cycles. SimpliPhi LFPs come with a 10-year warranty and will perform well for more than 10,000 cycles.

I do have 2 Relion 12 V connected in series for a 24V system and it works perfectly ! I powers an off grid completely !! Any comments ?

LiFeBlue -- price and specs match up with battleborn, plus a few other models, and a bluetooth accessible BMS.

They should say " assembled in U.S.A"

Awesome video and thank you for sharing this information. I’m just getting started with my channel and gained encouragement from the way you laid out your video. 🙏

At ~11:56, did you mean to say it ("it" meaning having to factor in the price of a high-end BMS to your build-it-yourself battery system) will be comparable in cost to a drop-in, lead-acid-battery *replacement*? That is, a replacement in the form of a lithium battery with a good BMS? You left off the "replacement," I think. Thanks for your in-depth, straightforward, non-kowtowing-to-manufacturers analyses. I so appreciate your trustworthiness and look to you as reliable resource. You are a gem.

What's your opinion on sol ark 8 kw system I'm setting up an off grid home

Have you calculated ppw on Nissan Leaf 7.6V cells? They're sold on ebay

Voltronix USA has a 3 year warranty and they ship directly from the factory. Their customer service is top notch. I called them and a person answered the phone. I had a quote in my email in 45 minutes.

I'm semi-retired, and my wife will retire soon. We plan to buy a plain box van and build our own RV out of it. My Power Plan is Four Battle Born Batteries in parallel, 600 Watts of Solar, 60 Amp MPPT Controller, and TWO 2,000 Watt Pure Sine Inverters. The reason for TWO Inverters is that I don't want to over-stress either one, and its cheaper than buying a Single 5,000 Watt Inverter.

Are those used Tesla batteries in your system still the cheapest even compared with those Chinese Li-on battery in this video ?

You really know what you’re taking about , and it shows that you like this subject ! Very educational ! BMS with solar at $50 ... oh ya !!

Thank you with your guidance and information I can see it's possible to build small to large weekend power to a full house/business / garden power something for e everyone . Being retired it's interesting fun without pitfalls of lack of knowledge.

A beautiful mind, whaaat, how do you know all this stuff. Very interesting and im learning way more than I wanted to, THANKS ! do you surf ? I see the surfing t-shirts

Off topic question, but will you be doing a review of ChargeTech's 124,000 mAh power station?

Another reason the BMS that is cheaper is components, they may not be temperature tested and may fail inside of an enclosed case. If you know anything about electronics you know diodes can overheat which cause thermal runaway and essentially the package will either fail to a short or fail to an open. You do not want a battery to short itself out. The Mosfet's basically switch a resistor to discharge and balance the batteries. If multiple mosfets were to short at the same time the result is overheating of the whole battery to the point of your battery exploding. Which is why I agree with Will, buy the best you can afford and go with a trusted company. Save yourself the headache...

I done some research but still maybe need more to do. Comparing 2 batteries here. BattleBorn and SimpliPhi. 24v Config. 6 Battleborn configure to a 24v 300ah bank.(Series and parellel) Price is $950 ea for $5700 LiFePO4 Batteries. 2 Simpliphi PHI-3.8-24-60 3.8kWh 24 Volt 302 AH (Can not series connect) Price $2690 Ea for $5380 Lithium Ferro Phosphate So far what i have researched is the Simplifi Battery chemistry (Lithium Ferro Phosphate) is safer then (LiFePO4). More cycles than Battleborn. Same warranty as Battleborn and has a Built-in accessible 80 Amp DC breaker On/Off switch However each has different selling points. But overall i am leaning more towards Simpliphi

Is he...is he using makeup? Great video by the way.

You fascinate me. You are good at teaching us older folks about this stuff. Keep it up! I fee like I know what I need or want to buy based on your information.

Hello Will. I'd like to tell you how much I appreciate your experience and knowledge from the lithium and solar perspectives. As you mentioned before the world of lithium is turning into a minefield. It's really difficult to differentiate between good product and junk. No you've been busy lately just hope in your new stardom where this all came from. Hope to see you were up and running soon I really missed your knowledge. I bought your book which was a great help. Take care and stay safe.

Great info thanks. Your channel will help me make an informed decision on batteries and solar panels and complete solar setup for my system.