Logic and the Christian Worldview Dr Jason Lisle Biblical Science Institute Denver Society of Creation Mt. Zion Lutheran Church Denver CO August 27, 2021 For more Information see: denversocietyofcreation.org biblicalscienceinstitute.com
towering intellect?!! The fool is an out and out bigot which makes him an half-wit that understands nothing of christianity, be cause bigotry and Christianity are mutually exclusive.
What a great presentation by Dr. Lisle I agree that just because something is beyond our understanding doesn't make it illogical. In the case of the Trinity or the Two Natures just because I don't understand how it works doesn't mean it is illogical to believe it. I do not know HOW gravity works but it is not illogical that I believe that gravity exists and what it does.
Well to be fair, you can jump off a tall building and the effects of gravity will be clear and measurable until you hit the ground, the trinity, the bible, god and all that is based on an interpretation of ancient writings, with zero measurable evidence aside from faith and incredulity.
Firstly to the zero measurable evidence. Sure you can describe the event of the fall using mathematics - I fell at such and such speed with such and such acceleration given the mass of my body. Or you can also describe the event using an historical approach - I fell off a building and broke my arm. Mathematical evidence and historical evidence are different. There is zero "measurable" evidence for George Washington crossing the Delaware, but there is historical evidence, and I believe he did. There is zero "measurable" evidence that Julius Caesar conquered Gaul, but there is historical evidence, and I believe he did. There is zero "measurable" evidence that Jesus of Nazareth was crucified and then rose again on the third day, but there is historical evidence, and I believe he did. Secondly my point about gravity is that there are things that are beyond our understanding but that doesn't make their existence illogical. Or to put it another way to say, "Because the HOW is beyond my understanding therefor it Is illogical or it must not exist" is the wrong approach to take with pretty much anything.
What has gravity to do with this? Gravity can be repeatedly and reliably demonstrated and quantified--the gravitational force between two objects is directly proportional to their masses and inversely proportional to the square of their distance from each other. They used this to send people to the moon. BTW, has there been a woman on the moon? Sally Ride didn't go that far. Just wondering. Is the moon the last holdout of male chauvinist piggery? It's a long way to go for some relief. Gravity is a demonstrable fact; 1+1+1=1 is nonsense. And show me anywhere in the Bible the Trinity dogma is fully and clearly articulated. I can show you many places where things making it impossible are clearly articulated. E.g., Paul: for us there is one God, the Father… Jesus to the Father: you are the only true God… Note that this excludes the nameless HS too. There are many more.
Come you lot brain dead to be a Xion you must do some vile things 1) EAT HIS FLESH AND DRINK HIS BLOOD 2)55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. 3) However, even though the whole thing is symbolic magic, what it represents is still the body and blood of Jesus. If one eats, symbolically or otherwise, this body and blood of a man, it follows logically that ritual cannibalism is practiced. A simple syllogism will illustrate this: P1: Jesus commanded his followers to eat his body and blood. P2: You symbolically eat the body and blood. C: You are practicing ritual cannibalism.
Did no-one ever warn you against using those asinine infantile symbols used only by imbecile children, lest you be taken for an imbecile child, for no *sane* adult would dream of using anything so asinine and infantile, but if you sincerely*wish* to be taken for an imbecile child, that is of course entirely a matter for you. I only need to see them used to know for a certainty that the user is a child with few wits, for no adult with wits and learning would dream of using them for fear of being taken for an imbecile child, that inference being inescapable. The *only* inference that can be drawn from the use of those asinine and infantile symbols is that the user is some kind of imbecile child, for*no* adult with wits or learning would use anything to asinine and infantile, but if you active *wish* to be taken for or supposed to be an imbecile child, that is of course entirely a matter for you. here really is *no_other* inference to draw but those that use such asinine and infantile symbols *are* imbecile children, for *no* sane adult with wits and learning would dream of using anything so asinine and infantile for fear of being taken for, or supposed to be, an imbecile child. You seem to *wish* to be supposed to be an imbecile child, but if that is your wish amen to that.
Every law that governs our universe was in place and operational long before mankind discovered them. These atheist will one day stand before the God who spoke those laws into existence and will be without excuse.
I think his great argument that you don't wonder if a new place has the laws of logic is going away, sadly. I cannot agree that America is currently a place where the laws of logic apply anymore.
...it is much about logic , the mind and thinking, very eloquently and very intelligent ...but i cannot help thinking about the body, and the relationship between mind and body, the way they are interwoven and the important role of ( bodily) affects and emotions...
Your better question would be to ask yourself what you are calling "*thinking*"? What *exactly do you suppose what- you-call"*thinking*" to be? You have not the faintest idea? That you are about to demonstrate If you sincerely wish to investigate " the relationship between mind and body," have a look at what they do what functions they perform. It is a good question but I suspect you merely want to dream about in rather than go into it with hreat care and detail. Quite right: What*does* the body do in terms of what function it performs, and similarly what exactly does the mind do- what *exact function or functions does it perform, and in relation to both mind and body are they your master and you their slave? That you can discover by setting whatever " "yourself" might be the task of fasting - going without food for 7 days Then -I*promise* you, you will discover *exactly* who is boss, and if you are serious about your investigation you will perform that experiment but will discover that you simply*cannot* and will thus discover who or what in whatever you are is the boss or master and thus you its slave; it is a small price to pay for knowledge. If you are sincerely interested in that investigation , you can start by discovering of how many functions whatever-you-are, is composed. look for yourself, there are clearly wanting, not_wanting, liking, disliking and how many more can you discover? What or which function does those things-performs those functions, but you must discover that for yourself by experience which oddly enough is the french word for experiment. My guess is that you are a kinderlander- American are are thus handicapped by the maleficent invention which has conditioned or programmed you to suppose that you can be *told* or *given knowledge which is no more possible than someone else could defecate or urinate*for* you nor you fill a man with bread(food) merely by looking at him. If knowledge is *not* direct immediate personal experience(as direct immediate and personal as pain) what e-x-a-c-t-l-y- *Is* know ledge- what exactly*are* you doing when you say you "*Know*" which of our(how many?)functions does whatever*"Knowing"* may be? Is not the fundamental problem of self investigation encapsulated in the analogous question: " Can a mirror reflect*itself*? What would or might you use to investigate the mind and its functions? That reminds me of the story of the Englishman in Ireland who asks how to get from town A to town B, only to be told in the immortal words: "Ah, sorr, if Oi wor you oi would not go dere from here". Perhaps self -investigation or self-knowledge *Not* such a good idea. Men(human beings/dreaming machines) are in the analogous position to that of he who embarks upon a jigsaw puzzle without having -or being*able* to have any idea of what the finished(or perfected [perfect means finished completed or accomplished]) puzzle resembles or of what the finished puzzle is a picture. The supposition of very experienced seekers along the lines of on which you*say* you wish to embark is that were you able to se the completed or perfected picture/jigsaw puzzle or the "*whole*" truth, you would find yourself n the position of the Pter that gets given something approximating *the-whole-truth* in what -is-called Acts10:10 which a species of codicil tacked on to the Jesussey- itself t for some inexplicable reason tacked onto the jewbook. spoiler alert: he did not fancy it at all, thus demonstrating that men(human beings/dreaming machines)*say* the want to discover the truth the slightest glimpse of it scares the living shit out of them because the*whole_truth( includes the *certainty* of their(for themselves) destruction forever, thus they are not allowed to see it or if you prefer a bit of thej ewbook called " proverbs: "Lest thou should ponder the paths of life, here eays are hidden *that- *ye-may-not-know-them"*, which is an elaborate way of saying do not poke yout nose where it does not belong little man." If you were allowed to se the entirety of what-*Is*-and-cannot be different, you simply would not be able to bear it because you may not emulate our friend Peter in acts 10:10and pick and choose what is provided for you from above which in the trade we call impressions- it's the *whole_ thing* including seeing your own complete nullity or nothing ness and the *certainty* of your own(for yourself) destruction forever which requires long and careful preparation, or training without which it would scare the living bejesus out of you, which is why the whole thing is only shown to very old men who abandoned all their illusions long ago, or as the African saying goes: "Old men sit in the shade because they planted the trees many years ago. Or* you could try:" You can't change the wind, so change the sail You could find out for yourself what you*say* you wish yo know but are not prepared to*pay* for it or just not prepared You like to *talk* about these things but prefer to keep it at the talking stage. True? - not_true? You are like those that flatter themselves that the might be able to become christians(which is of course impossible for them *as-they-are* namely dreaming machines or even *more* exactly* like the rich young man who went away sorrowing -He was simply not up to it or like all ordinary men numbers one two and three - dreaming machines, he(the rich young man)did not have the ingredients or would not afford the ticket. Th bigoted hillbilly is no " chrsistian" , he *could* not be and if it*cannot* be true it *Is*not true. Your Maya or illusion is that you suppose yourself capable of what you are simply*In*_capable. your excuse for not trying the seven day fast is that you do not wish/want* to which simply means that your functions are boss and you their slave-just.. like... your.... servant... here.. present and all other ordinary dreaming machines. You want what requires seven years of seven day fasts, and you are just no more up to that that you could become able to become able to be a christian, because you have no idea what the ingredients or conditions precedent to being able to become able to become a christian, are, and have no way of discovering what they are. You simply cannot" go and sell *all*that you have an give it to the poor because you have no idea what that means. My bet is that you are a talker- can talk the talk but or not up to the next bit of that saying; you merely *say* you want self-knowledge. Part of the business of self-knowledge is having the courage to se and eat your own*Complete nothingness* which takes years of preparation an enormous amount of trying and failing, but fortunately as you age you get close to the only true freedom which is not -giving-a-shit about the functions and their purely automatic mechanical(mens you get no say in them) reactions. The trick of it is to pute*everything* on a scale of one to ten of importance with a bit-of -a- cough on one and death on ten You like to imagine that you wish to see of what the perfected jigsaw puzzle is a picture, but HP(higher powers)- simply out of kindness do not alow you to see that. My guess (and at best itcan only be a guess) that putting the final piece in place means you get that mercy and kindness - you may die-cease to experience anything, so pay attention to proverbs. I have done my three score years and ten and settled my debt to nature but still no sign of my ticket of this planet, because - like you I am not sufficiently serious about my aim which is far too vague and dreamy and all talk.One cannot become serious and many other things, just -for-the-wishing, which is why so many(unwiase enough to imagine that they might be anle to be able to become christians, can no more became christians than you can fast-go without-eating or seven days*Or become a christian, which might be a good idea had you the slightest idea of what the conditions precedent to becoming able t be able to become christian might be, and since the tradition of christianity is extinct there is no way you could discover what they are. Doo you have any idea at all why that bigot loon supposes there to me magic in the jewbook, the book of the religion Judaism which some call bible(which only means book so all books are bibles)? Of all the millions of books i/on this planet *why* seize upon the jewbook as a having special magic? What is so special about we Jews that the bigot supposes our book to be magic?
the multiverse was hatched to solve the fine tuner problem, where many of the constants in our universe are fine tuned ver precisely, begging the question of a fine tuner. The multiverse cannot be observed, now matter how long we hung around and how good our tech could become we will never ever be able to observe another universe they are all racing away from each other to fast. as an article a new scientist said our 64:24 most successful theories lead to the 64:26 inescapable conclusion 64:27 that our universe is just a speck in a 64:29 vast sea of universes 64:31 the multiverse is not some kind of 64:33 optional thing like can you supersize or 64:35 not 64:36 says this theoretical physicist at the 64:37 university of california in berkeley 64:39 our own cosmological history he says 64:41 tells us that it's there 64:43 and we need to deal with it so remember 64:45 regardless of how weird the multiverse 64:48 may sound 64:48 secular cosmologists demand that it's 64:51 true 64:51 and you just need to deal with it no they need the multiverse to solve the fine tuning problem, just because your theory needs another bandaid to patch over another problem does not mean that the solution you came up with is true. For years they have yammered about doing testable repeatable science in a lab, ok so show me the testable repeatable science for the multiverse, oh wait you can't.
Besides, if contradictions are not allowed on Fridays but they are allowed on Saturdays, then on a Saturday, it is also a Friday were contradictions are not allowed. But if it's a Friday, it is not Saturday for sure because that's the time where contradictions are forbidden. Then being on Saturdays means being on Fridays which cancel any contradiction. Ex: Suppose that it is a Saturday and it is raining and not raining. Since it is a Saturday, it is also Friday. But it is impossible for it to be Saturday because Fridays forbid contradictions. Therefore, it is either raining or not raining but not both.
A denomination is defined as existing within a specific country. There are 33,000+ total of these "Christian denominations" in 238 total countries. These 33,000 are subdivided into "6 major ecclesiastical-cultural mega-blocs", and ordering them by denomination size we have (I am rounding up or down slightly for convenience, using the year 2000 figures) : Independents (about 22000) Protestants (about 9000) "Marginals" (about 1600) Orthodox (781) Roman Catholics (242) Anglicans (168) So the 33,000 number is from the total of these 6 mega-blocs: 22000 + 9000 + 1600 + 781 + 242 + 168 = 33,000+ All of them cannot be right, in order for there to be that many they must all have at least one doctrine they wont give up that is different from all of the rest. So which one is right, depends on who you ask because they all claim to be the true church and all the others are some degree of false. I am going with none of the above, Jesus started His church 2,000 years and anything that came after that is different from what He started is false. Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. The church that jesus started 2,000 years ago He said the gates of hell would not prevail against it. The church that Jesus started still exists today, because even the very gates of hell would not prevail against it. all of the above are man-made denominations that have come after the Church Jesus started. the church that Jesus started prexisted all of the listed denominations above. Trying to defend a church that Jesus did not start but was started by some man or woman will end up in fallacy. I prefer to be a part of the Church that Jesus started, it is simply called "the church" no other name is needed. this will be resisted because people do not want to think they joined the wrong church, when people die or many miss the catching away they will know why, because they followed man-made teachings and doctrines and because they were not obedient they did not have the Holy Ghost to guide them into all truth.
…Yet not one of those denominations believe that Jesus’ death on the cross, burial and resurrection isn’t the gospel of salvation (1 Corinthians 15:1-4). Their practices my be different, and their theologies surrounding the gospel my be different, but all Christian denominations believe that Christ’s sacrifice and His resurrection are the means of God’s salvation for man. If there is a quote “denomination” in your list that does not believe the gospel as I stated previously, then they cannot be included in your list of Christian denominations because they are not “Christian”, as the very definition of being a Christian is to believe the gospel of 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.
@@rjhinnj While faith in what Christ did is essential there is more to it than that. false doctrine is false doctrine, and must be spoken against Truth Act 5:32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him. Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. 1Co 2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. 1Co 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. 1Co 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 1Co 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 1Co 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal. 1Jn 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. Lies Pro 6:16 These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: Pro 6:17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, Pro 6:18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, Pro 6:19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. Pro 12:22 Lying lips are abomination to the LORD: but they that deal truly are his delight Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. False doctrine is lying hence the prefix of false. Liars will not inherit the Kingdom of God, doctrine matter greatly. for example the blab it and grab it heretics must be exposed because they are making merchandise of their flocks and living the millionaire lifestyle such as that wolf in sheep's clothing Kenneth Copeland, most of those heretics preach a watered down gospel, and those who fall for it are deceived and believe it because they choose to from the desires of their own lustful flesh. We have the availability of the Holy Ghost to guide us into all truth, but there is a catch and it is called obedience Acts 5:32 Many say they are Christians but they do not bring forth the fruits of being a Christian, these are they which are Christians in name only following the false doctrines and precepts of men who wrest the scriptures to their own destruction.
The chief of sinners, apostle Paul was saved by Grace alone ( no church involved) on the road to Damascus, going to kill and persecute Christians, he was an example for us, of how far Gods Grace extends, and how we are saved, this is why we need to seek God with all our being, heart mind and soul, reading the Bible continually ( KJV is good, not NKJV) and ask Jesus for understanding, You cant give Gods Grace to yourself, it is the faith of Ephesians 2:8 that is “ not of yourself” 1 Timothy 1:15 “This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.”
The God in the Bible made Eve from Adam's rib. Adam is a male, so Adam's rib has male DNA. So, God made Eve a transgender woman. If LGBT is a sin, why did God make Eve a transgender woman? (T, in LGBT, stands for Transgender).
Let us try it this way what exactly do you*call* logic - what do you actually *Do* when you suppose yourself to be using logic-assuming you can?Just keep it simple or you will only confuse yourself further-Don't you worry your woolly little associative apparatus with words you neither use nor understand.
How could I get a DVD of Dr. Jason Lisle’s presentation to use in my class on Deductive Logic. I teach Logic and other subjects at a Christian High School. Of course, this video is available on RU-vid.
Good works lead to salvation because they are the expression of faith. There is no contradiction between them, you need both because works are a result of faith.
To love God's Word builds one's happyness up. To apreciate his Goodness, wilturn us more like himself every hour, through the holy spirit's Power, as it's written on the Bible; « The way of the just is like's daylight, wich becomes more and more brighter until full day arrives». To pursue true wisdom, mus be one's most desirable and valuable achievement. Jesus is the source of unmatched wisdom. He is The Master, as he declares on the Bible; « You say I'm Lord and Master, and indeed you are wright, because I'm Lord and Master». On another biblical passage Jesus says; « Don't call anyone else your Father and Master, because The only One, Who is your Father and Master is God». Jesus is God, incarnated and born as a human baby, in order to reveal God's Character to all universe, and to be the second Adam, saving mankind from death's condemnation, through his sinless life. His Grace is more precious than my life. Aleluia! Maranata! Ámen!
@@ashwayn His name is Jesus Christ, Jehova, YHWY. "The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." - Romans 10:8-13
yes, there is a christian ( ie biblical world view) but of itself it is not enough. If all one has is a worldview and not a relationship with the Spirit of Christ one on one whereby you are led by Him (see Paul to the Romans) then you do well by believing that God is one, but this something the devils also believe ( See letter of James) and it will do you no good my fear is that creation science can and does become an idol; and that apologists can and do rely on their cleverness rather than the Spirit testimony. What did Jesus say would persuade men that God has sent the Son? take a close look at the High Priestly prayer in John chapter 17
Since you are a presuppositional apologist, and teach a class in Logic, how logical would it be for a person to post a blasphemous video of a false teacher blaspheming God, to expose false teachers? Would you agree with giving that kind of "evidence" to expose them?
It's his presuppositional apologetics that seems to undermine Dr. Lisle's appeal to logic. Presuppositional apologetics is circular and therefore, a fallacy which he apparently does not see.
Belief: you don't need a good reason, you need *evidence*. That's what you need. I think it is fascinating he does not (as a supposed scientist) emphasize evidence. Maybe ... because once you bring up evidence, religious arguments crumble. He's being disingenuous.
You're talking about someone who has a Phd and knows his stuff lol. Just like He said in the begining, school was intended for you to think rationaly but apparently you have not learnt how to think with rationality. You didn't refute or prove anything just a bunch of fallacies.
Well if you understood concepts correctly you would see it is self contradictory to have two or more all powerful, all knowing, all present perfect beings who make no mistakes. Look up what analytical propositions are in Philosophy. If you had you would not make the wrong claim you did in this post where I had to reply.
C'mon now, it;s wicked to mock the afflicted Fom where would you het the queer idea that there was, or might be *any*-even_one*"all-mighty being"? You could not possibly have any direct immediate experience of any such thing as an "all-mighty being" so that sort of cock can_only* be imaginary.
@@douloschristus1475 There is nothing inconsistent about atheism. Nobody besides superstitious morons needs a supernatural pseudo-explanation of the physical world.
This PhD does not understand his fallacies. So bizarre that he picks this topic as part of his discussion. Odd. Also, Mr. PhD, the purpose of an education is not to study logic (and the study of logic was never a common curriculum in grade school). The purpose of an education is to cultivate skeptical critical thinking. That's the purpose: question everything; show me the evidence.
Your reasoning is alarming. You presuppose all knowledge MUST a come from science apparently because you keep mentioning EVIDENCE. What if there is no EVIDENCE? Then what? A claim that has NO EVIDENCE according to you is impossible to be true still? A claim that has NO EVIDENCE cannot still be false? Looks like either way the truth value of a claim is independent of evidence anyway.
@Σά ββας my feelings have nothing to do with the points made. Evaluate the points made. World view doesn't change what is true. You sound like an everything is subjective type of person. This is a popular and inconsistent idea from the start. Proper reasoning goes far.
