I'd love to see an updated version of this. I know Lots Road isn't a thing any more and the Tube has been plugged in to the National Grid for years. I saw lots of distinctive yellow cabinetssss when I was in London a few weeks ago, but rail gap indicators were few and far between.
Tunnel Wires are still in situ and in working order as back up if radio etc fails. The units, even the most modern ones still also carry the tunnel clip on telephone, again in case of radio communications failure
You might be asking: I thought there were 11 tube lines. Why did they mention 10? The W&C line was run by British Rail when this program was made. It converted to London Underground in 1994.
Blimey the year I joined LUL... Glad to see the old style SCD featured, people don't believe me when I tell them how big and cumbersome the old Wooden SCD used to be.
Some major "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" going on here. I'd love to see the arc the short-circuit thingies draw when they use them to pop the breakers. :-)
+Laura Halliday Yeah, they should do some demonstrations, because I could see those being very scary to use, with lots of sparks. Also, if you push it down to make a short circuit, and the short circuit makes a loud bang, as it likely will, you may flinch and pull the bar back up, thus possibly creating an arc if the current is still flowing.
@@Ham549 The 4 rails are used due to the metal tunnel wall and buried water and gas lines- to ensure the return current flows along a rail. A normal running rail cannot be insulated, and would be unsuitable. Many newer systems manage just fine, but this WAS the first system and they probably hadn't worked everything out yet!
"Shorting bars are only carried by trains", it sort of begs the question why some kind of shorting device was not built into the train? It would save Fred from setting his trousers on fire or a nasty case of arc eyes .
1: You use the shorting bar during emergencies like a train crash, fire, or derailment where the integrity of the train cannot be guaranteed. If it wasn't an emergency, you'd call up the line controller and they'd shut down the power and ground the lines, so no arc would occur. 2: You want the shorting bar to be easily visible to everybody on site so they can confirm to themselves it's been properly applied and therefore safe to approach. You don't want everybody to have to climb into the cab to check some tiny switch. The same concept is used for grounding in utility power systems. 3: Keep it simple, stupid.
@@straightpipediesel Many thanks for the reply - I had to watch the video again as it's been nearly 10 months since I commented. I agree a visual indication that a shorting bar is in place and therefore power is off is an excellent point, wouldn't be an idea to paint the shorting bar bright orange with yellow spots to make it more obvious? Maybe stick a Red Flag on it. I agree with the KIFS philosophy, that's something I strove my whole career in Engineering to instil in others.
We had to watch a load of nasty films to get our 'Area A' to work on the underground as engineers. Some of the films they showed were of real accidents and poor people who had got 'zapped' scary! Then we have to pass a test to walk across the yard in the depot stepping OVER live rails, thats a real butt clincher!!
In the old days kids used to go down to the tracks cut off a roll of chain link fencing ant throw it across the conductors. The result was the most amazing sound and light show. Furious loud growling electric with sparks flying off everywhere and plasma so bright it lit up the clouds in the sky.
Outer is +410 and inner is -220 i think! But on the central line they bond the middle rail and running rails so that 3rd rail trains can run on the track! How the fuck it works I'm still trying to find out!! I was told the inner rail holds 8000 AMPS!
Sterlingjob Thanks for the info. Actually I meant to put +420 outside, not +410. Inside is -210.I Would like to know how it works also. There is another reason for splitting. Something to do with finding faults and being able to move the train in case of. Still, it's hard to find a decent explanation for both.
Mark Fowler I can't remember the gory details!! I heard they use 4 rails in the tunnels because they don't want the metal lined tunnel to act as a return because it would cause electrolytic corrosion!
Mark Fowler London's Underground uses the '4th rail' system whereby the electrical return uses a dedicated centre rail, and not the running rails. This is supposed to reduce the chance of stray currents damaging tunnel walls, nearby utilities, etc. Although the underground network is nominally electrified at 630V DC the system actually works so that +420V DC is collected from the outer 'positive' (3rd) rail and -210V DC from the centre 'negative' (4th) rail. Where underground trains operate over electrified mainline railway tracks they collect the full line voltage from the 3rd rail and the 4th rail is electrically bonded to the running rails - which also act as return for the mainline trains. At the boundaries where the trains pass between sections of line electrified on the two systems there are gaps in the electrified 3rd and 4th rails which are of sufficient length to ensure that the trains do not (even briefly) electrically connect the systems together. The mainline railway routes which are shared with underground trains are typically electrified at between 660V and 750V, although when the voltage fluctuations described above are bourne in mind so trains using these routes have been known to receive as much as 900V DC.
No. It was just more expensive to generate power than to buy it off the National Grid. Lots Road was coming due for a heavy overhaul, so they shut it down.
@Craig F. Thompson rails prefer to use the national grid because the power plants are aging and has lower efficiency to generate power. It is much cheaper as said to buy from the national grid.
@Craig F. Thompson TfL is in huge debts and can't afford to do this. Don't forget TfL also does the roads aswell as the rail and they already struggled through this lockdown periods.
9:50 "short circuiting devices are only found on trains" isnt that kinda obvious i woudlnt imagine taxis and busses had them and why would anything but a train nneed to short circuit in the first place...
KYLE REES Short circuiting devices are also used by the power companies when working on overhead cables. They cause the breaker to trip if someone accidentally turns it back on too soon.
Trams working on the surface contact system usually carried a short-circuiting device in the form of a brass brush, in order to earth a stud accidentally remaining 'live' after the car has passed.
remember working on a job on rail way bloke got electricuted all that was left was a pair of steel toe caped boots with smoke comming out of them. be care full out there.
this is 21 century high end technology? i am not surprised why so many disruptions on the underground.... most of the installation in manually operated , a high number of signal failures are everywhere on the underground network, i pay around 20% of my wage just on transport every month and everything is same as 50 years ago.why the hell the tickets price is not the same???
If you can get them to accept your shillings and half penny tickets, and still run a profitable business, good luck. The disruptions have many causes, the majority are from jumpers and idiot customers, the minority are faults and staff caused issues. The technology used is as good as you get for a station of it's age and size. If you want to upgrade this technology on a network of this size there are many issues faced such as will changes be backwards compatible? Can it be done with minimum cost and inconvenience to customers? Will it be obsolete before the project of upgrading is complete?
Nearly all "signal failures" in the UK are caused by thieves stealing the wiring! East Europeans steal a lot of copper but the UK also has plenty of home-grown lowlife. The record is probably held by a bloke from Newport Wales. He noticed that Railtrack had been replacing worn rails near Bristol. The old rails were left at the side of the track awaiting collection but he beat Railtrack to it! About 100 tons of old rails (stolen) were weighed-in at a South Wales steelworks but they had his number. Whoops! He got some porridge at the big house!
techdavey1000 If the truth be known, there is a small EU country that wishes to be nothing to do with the UK, and they have a record for more scrap theft than the Eastern Europeans. Only a small minority though, shame as it does tarnish the name of the good people.
I did a course with someone who worked for Network Rail, they described the 'short circuiting' technique here and seemed to suggest that it is still in use. Dunno if that also applies to the Underground.
Yes, very closed, probably luxury riverside apartments now, the place was massive! All the power comes from the grid now, wonder what the quarterly bill is?😳
Addendum II : Correct title is : "The Taking of Pelham 123" (Pelham is a road in the Bronx and a terminal point). Also, George Shaw is in it ("Jaws")...
The +ve (positive) rail is at 420 volts above ground, the -ve (negative) rail 210 volts below ground. The ground return system can cause corrosion problems in underground transit systems where water or other utilities are in close proximity. Tunnel walls and liners can also be subject to electrolytic corrosion.
I think i might have watched this at White City RTC as part of the track awareness/track walk training. I started 4th Jan 1993 with induction day at Covent Garden, LT museum, I remember the first thing the trainers did when i got there was have my staff pass, Induction materials and welcome to london underground mug thrust into my hands which i had to carry around for the rest of the day. Ended up on the east end of the central line, home station Woodford. Good times!
If you're going to do STEREO do it in modern style, not like some 1950's RCA demonstration record....... and one of the wires isn't earthed properly......
well that A60/62 stock was nearly refurbished because the cabin ends are red as it supposed to be! but not blue doors because its making me dizzy!!!! 0:02
The Underground having its own powerhouse is a robust electrical system that has more advantages than disadvantages. The Underground depends on its own self, instead of municipal agencies to fulfill its needs. This film is on target.
They shut down the powerhouse over a decade ago. Wouldve been too expensive to retrofit for emissions regs, other issues. London Underground is powered by the National Grid now
@@captainkeyboard1007 yes, I think its the same company :) they're a British company responsible for all power connections and lines in the country, but we used to call power lines the national grid anyway before the company was formed
The NYC system, newer but a hundred years old at this point, just has the hot rail on the left side and I guess the ground is through the wheels and tracks to the ground. The hot rail is covered by a board or something more modern. More recent systems like BART in the San Francisco area and DC Metro (very similar) are the same, but with a rubbery plastic guard over the hot rail. I don't know why the Tube needs the fourth rail or why the hot rail is not covered, but it is even older. Even with a cover employees and people falling or intentionally being on the tracks in all these American systems occasionally get fried.
emjayay On the underground ac is converted to dc at the substation, but on nyc subway and other 3rd rail systems, the ac is converted to dc on the train, with ac, you only need one rail, but you need 2 for dc. Hope this answers your question!
@@rudyhighlan8542 3rd rail surface systems are commonplace in The UK. 750 volts DC with running rails used as the return path to complete the circuit. In underground applications This arrangement can cause electrolytic corrosion, hence the use of a fourth rail system. In the case of London Underground the +ve (positive) rail is at 420 volts above ground, the -ve (negative) rail 210 volts below ground.
Vincit Veritas Sadly Lots Road was closed a number of years ago now I was there in the last week of operation, Greenwich stayed active for emergency and I know believe there is a plan to re equipped Greenwich but not sure if it proceed en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenwich_Power_Station en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lots_Road_Power_Station
Unfortunately London Underground mostly rely on the National Grid and when this once failed, it caused the closure of 60% of the London Underground network: news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/3190143.stm
Shameful that this unique and world's oldest underground railway system does not have any window in bulkhead separating driver's cab and passenger area. This to offer some means of actually seeing the trackway ahead for interested members of the public. (Plus no cab passes are issued either so far as I understand) Why this cutting off of all end viewing access in UK (even on all mainline trains, except some trams in Croyden, Docklands Railway, and Tyre and Wear Metro near Newcastle-upon-Tyne) is well beyond me! (The bulkhead window can be placed opposite where the driver sits to avoid light reflection off of windscreen. The Paris Metro (RER) has placed one way glass in the doors leading to the cab in the bulkhead as well on the newer rolling stock as in Hamburg, Germany another one way glass so upon standing up close to it one can see the road ahead. Again I do not understand the logic behind UK's reluctance in this day and age to allow some means of front end viewing by the ridership. This should be encouraged as to promote an interest and to expand this field! (not to conceal it)! I only hope that one day as this technology becomes available such as across the Channel in Germany (Stuttgart) trains will become driverless and automated, then no total blank out of end viewing would be necessary and afford the ridership end and front end trackway viewing. The Tube is unique the world over with its four rail system, and it is such a shame the general public on the trains are not permitted to see it as if some 'trade secret' or the like! This is a real slsp-in-the-face against trainspotters in general as well as people like me who are ardent advocates for railway electrification. One last comment: the Board of Directors for the London system should go over to Japan for a short visit and see how the Japanese do it. Virtually all their tube trains have clear full access to end or trackway viewing by the public and the accident rate on the JR is amazing extremely low! So really! There is no excuse as not to begin retrofitting the tube trains in London, Liverpool, and other UK cities to allow some sort of viewing access for the general public to the trackway ahead! BTW, perhaps you haven't heard; the Cold War is long over! Thank you!
This used to be common place on older diesel and electrical multiple units such as the class 121 or 117. However it isn't used anymore for one many drivers felt awkward being looked at whilst driving so many closed the blind. I also think this is for safety purposes as well so if the train is involved in a head on collision it will not injure the passengers with broken glass.
On NYC subways there is a window so you can see ahead even on the new trains. There is a diffusion plastic on it (at least on some) so you can't really see the driver well, who is over to the side anyway. But if you stand there you can generally see ahead.
Shit this takes me back, I joined in Jan 1990 and we had to learn all this crap on the guards training course. Great fun though, it was a good job back in those days.
Warum nutzen die dort immer noch die offenen Stromschchienen? In München bei der U-Bahn sind die von oben abgedeckt und der Strom wird auch von unten über einen Schleifer abgenommen.
thebuffalodude The normal procedure, then and now, is to call the line controller and request traction current discharge. The procedures you saw in this film are for emergencies when current must be discharged without delay.
Your in house voltage is officially 230v but a lot of equipment is rated for 240 and 250v. 20 volts isn't too great a difference. 650v is actually used on the compromise voltage areas where third rail and fourth rail runs too. Not that it's directly related but it is interesting. NR third rail is 750v. Where compromise voltage is used the neutral rail is bonded to the running rails for the NR stock's return as well as LUL. It's all to do with potential difference, not 0 vs 630.
Does the mains voltage in the UK typically actually measure around 240VAC, but they call it 230V? Normally my mains in the US is 248-252V, but its usually referred to as 220, sometimes 240.
The ruddy jocks tried to copy this and ended up with 2 stations because they couldn't keep the natives off the booze long enough to finish the planned 50 stations haha!
AC at a fixed frequency is much worse than DC, unless you run the motors at a fixed RPM (wich isn't possible for a train that needs to accelerate and go at different speeds). New trains uses inverters that varies the frequency to the RPM needed at the moment, and that way get more efficient than DC motors. But an inverter always needs to get DC to be able to convert it into AC with the right frequency. If you take power from a AC source, you have to run it thru a rectifier to get it into DC before turned into AC again with the right frequency. That just adds an unecessary step and increases the losses (it's better that they get DC directly instead). The reason most railways uses AC is simply that transformers can be used. The line can have a very high voltage to minimize losses and (much thinner) wires above the track can be used instead of an extra rail (or even 2 extra rails in this case). The trains then carry their own transformers and rectyfiers to take down the voltage to a more manageble level and turn it into DC for the motors and regulators/inverters.
It's an old video- from 1989. The earliest stock to run motors on DC through an inverter (converts DC into AC) was I believe the 1995 Stock, found on the Northern Line. For stock compatibility reasons as well as space, they still use DC- it's what they've been using for a century now.
