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Lost Judo Hip throws in Aikido (Christian Tissier) 

Chadi
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This video discusses the lost or rare hip throws in Aikido that are part of the Judo curriculum.
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3 янв 2021

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Комментарии : 79   
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Aikido choking techniques: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-j-SLwaCLqfw.html Aikido sacrificing techniques: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-YpFZyIKgLGI.html
@johnpaul8403
@johnpaul8403 3 года назад
Hello please do vid on mukna ancient wrestling style and malakhro South Asia ancient wrestling thank you for your hard work and god bless
@professorteacher3679
@professorteacher3679 2 года назад
From Brasil: congratulations on the comparative video. It is reported that, in a meeting between Cano and Ueshiba, the former said "you have achieved perfection". Judo is an art of 90°, but Aikido is an art of 180°.
@eduardoalvarez2494
@eduardoalvarez2494 3 года назад
Great video Chadi, I agree with you in the point that reducing the currula for Aikido it's going to be a bad decision. Also the solution that you propose todo some randori is actually the way we train at my dojo at the end of class to review the techniques we saw and to challenge our selfs and check how effective can we apply de technique when uke tries to escape or resist, this way of training keep you grounded and let's you understand what you are missing
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Thank you Eduardo
@trinidadraj152
@trinidadraj152 3 года назад
In Gozo Shioda's randori footage you often see him using floating hip throws. It's very useful.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Indeed
@jtilton5
@jtilton5 3 года назад
My favorite Koshi Nage to do is from Yokomenuchi (side strike, or also applicable to roundhouse punch.) when they attach you step inside, bring their hand down, gab them around the head, turn and load them up on your hip then throw them. Quick, short, and to the point.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
It is neat
@donaldduke2233
@donaldduke2233 3 года назад
My Aikido Sensei (Karl Geis) was also a famous Judo master and trained under Tomiki Shihan. I didn't go past Nidan in the Tomiki Aikido system but there was definitely a blur of the line between Judo and Aikido in his system. I especially liked the fact that there is actual randoori in Tomiki Aikido as opposed to strictly taking turns being Uke & Tori. Being in my 80s now, it's been many many years since my body could take the stress. I miss it. My practice now consists of going through the motions as Katateka do in Kata. Thanks again for another great Chadi video.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
It really brings me a lot of happiness that good people that trained and fought for decades take time and listen to me.
@dianecenteno5275
@dianecenteno5275 3 года назад
Aikido and Judo are a great compliment to each other. Aikido can improve a Judoka' s Taisabaki. Judo adds missing pieces to Aikido. Thanks for sharing!
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
🙇🏻‍♂️
@MrSamurai137
@MrSamurai137 3 года назад
But you need to add a striking art to karate, boxing, kick boxing
@kempbrown4402
@kempbrown4402 3 года назад
Alot of forums seem to debate why aikido throws seem so ineffective against resistance, even when used by high ranking aikidoka. But the founder of aikido was an extreme advocate for peace and passivity, and I think he intentionally chose to only include techniques that are hard to force, to emphasize the soft, blending action he emphasized in his teachings
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
I do believe that we should fight before we train aikido
@mauropalmieri1568
@mauropalmieri1568 3 года назад
Koshi Nage is one of my favourite Aikido techniques - I agree 💯 with your opinion on introducing sparring into the aikido curriculum 👍 plenty of potential for it.
@Ojja78
@Ojja78 2 года назад
Fun fact: Morehei Ueshiba specifically told his students that the hip throw is categorically NOT Aikido and practitioners are not to use it.
@bushido007
@bushido007 3 года назад
Informative! Thank you. Re-affirms my view that modern aikidoka should do judo as well
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
100%
@TheRoninkai
@TheRoninkai 3 года назад
Yes, if you ever want to win a fight.
@minorityofone1510
@minorityofone1510 2 года назад
Great and informative video as usual - you manage to trawl a lot of old sources for your presentations!! I am sure most of the Aikido techniques come from the old school Jiu Jitsu styles? They work so can no doubt be brought into your training. I am going to practice the Uke Goshi at my next JJ mat session - it is not in my syllabus but it could be as a counter to someone countering an arm and shoulder lock/ throw!
@Ojja78
@Ojja78 2 года назад
Fun fact: Morehei Ueshiba specifically told his students that the hip throw is categorically NOT Aikido and practitioners are not to use it.
@uberdonkey9721
@uberdonkey9721 Год назад
I think the declining syllabus is in part due to people becoming instructors without knowing all the techniques. Because mostly learning principles rather than techniques, cute techniques often used. Of course Ueshiba predominantly used ikkyo and irimi nage in demosvwhen he was older, but you can still see that when someone would resist or move against what was happening, he'd flexibly pull a technique out the hat.
@kyle9648
@kyle9648 3 года назад
Our Hip throws are for the majority the same as Judo throws but there are some differences in the way we do some of them. Uki Goshi in Kyushin Ryu uses the side of the hip and in a scooping motion you "float Uke up in the air then use your hands to help rotate them over. We also have a Hip throw called Ura Goshi which is like an O Goshi in reverse ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-fzx-4HahwTU.html which I haven't seen done anywhere else.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
This is pretty cool thank you
@kerpal321
@kerpal321 3 года назад
i did aikido for a few months and found it to be a waste of time for the most part when judo and jiu jitsu was available, the one thing i did did learn in aikido that did help me in all other martial arts training later on and especially in jiu jitsu was the series of wrist stretches that were taught to us as beginners which gave me a lot of flexibility in my wrists which made it hard for people to wristlock me
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
They are beneficial indeed
@AikidoScholar
@AikidoScholar 3 года назад
Really nice video and great investigation Chadi! Indeed, I have been investigating for years some of the lost techniques in aikido using Ueshiba's books: "Maki no Ichi" (1954), "Budo" (1938), "Aiki-jujutsu Densho" (1934), etc... were some of the books I have been using for the research. And aikido seems to be experiencing important changes in its curriculum... Techniques such as kata guruma (the ganseki otoshi variation) or a form of tomoe nage was actually taught by O Sensei himself during aikido's first years, when it was known as aikibudo or Ueshiba-Ha daito-ryu aiki-jujutsu. Also several forms of sutemi waza were implemented by Ueshiba's uchideshi such as Mochizuki or Tomiki (as you mentioned in the video). I personally think that aikido is strongly based in physical and technical principles and as long as we are following those principles, techniques can be adapted or used in different contexts or ways, aikido shouldn't have limits, as Morihei Ueshiba himself said that aikido was meant to keep evolving and adapting to modern times. Again, really nice video Chadi. You are doing a really good job in your judo research. As I said in a previous video, your channel is an inspiration for my channel and aikido investigation. Thank you!🙇🏻‍♂️🙇🏻‍♂️
@ravenlasky5286
@ravenlasky5286 3 года назад
You can always count on the Aikido guys to write an essay in the comments section. 👍
@AikidoScholar
@AikidoScholar 3 года назад
@@ravenlasky5286... is this an essay for you?
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Thank you
@TheBandrade
@TheBandrade 3 года назад
Another excellent video Chadi!!!! Thanks
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Thank you Bastian
@Titan500J
@Titan500J 3 года назад
This is really cool. Thanks for posting this!
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Thank you
@kempbrown4402
@kempbrown4402 3 года назад
Chadi, the Sumo curriculum has alot of techniques that are not found in judo, and interestingly most of the techniques have never actually been seen in sumo competition, since they rely most on the basic atemi and push out strategy. Could make for an interesting video
@uberdonkey9721
@uberdonkey9721 Год назад
Nice get some background on you Chadi 👍🏽
@danielalejandroagudelospag1694
@danielalejandroagudelospag1694 3 года назад
Always a pleasure to see your work... The concept presition that allows you to point differences with respect. Happy new year.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Thank you Daniel! To you and your family
@daniel-meir
@daniel-meir Год назад
In my Aikido school we used to do randori like in Judo but softer due to a lot of wrist and elbow techniques in Aikido. Unfortunately my Shihan stopped teaching and I can't find any Aikido people who would like to spar. So I had to switch to Judo and then to BJJ. BJJ feels safer for the back.
@rodger603
@rodger603 3 года назад
Another great one! Good job Chadi!👏👍👌
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Thank you Rodger
@rodger603
@rodger603 3 года назад
@@Chadi no problem bro! Why I love Shingitai Jujitsu. Theres a little of this and a little of that. If something works we add it. If it dont then we drop it!
@2024_R_I_S_I_N_G_
@2024_R_I_S_I_N_G_ 3 года назад
Thank you, Chadi😊
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
🙇🏻‍♂️
@MrSamurai137
@MrSamurai137 3 года назад
That Olympic throw is epic
@oneguy7202
@oneguy7202 3 года назад
Great video i watched koshiki kata the other days
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Thank you
@user-ri1ep7cm4p
@user-ri1ep7cm4p 9 месяцев назад
As I understand, Tissie's koshi nage is from Morihiro Saito.
@aegisdefense1130
@aegisdefense1130 3 года назад
Nicely said. I laugh when I see videos and comments that AIkido 'does not work' because of this or that reason. I understand that Aikido of 'today' is not really true AIkido. I have seen others to also ask or make a claim that AIkido 'has transformed' into a 'cult' . AIkido is what one makes it is, it is all inclusive this is the Aikido I was taught and I know. I remember in the early '80s I had a similar discussion with a nice sensei of Aikido Ben Mancini in AZ who had actually gone and lived in Japan and studied Aiikido he knew very well. We were exchanging over dinner information, I asked him the same questions... why does he not teach the things that are actually part of Aikido...Well, we live in a litigious society, and sooner or later they, the students will discover them the variations etc.... by themselves.... Very nice person. When we parted I moved to Cal but he made sure he ave me a nce present, he made sure he had all of the school students attack me randori fast from four different directions many times again and again. Not four or five ..hehehe...over forty...Everything was a blur...That was fun. Remember that Japan came out of WWII broken with two A-bombs on its back, the whole society had to be restructured, there were no martial arts allowed, Judo and then Aikido even Karate and Jujitsu they all had to become more educational an emphasis on exercise rather than self defense. The inclusion of some form of the arts in the Olympics also required restructuring...and so forth. Obviously a person given the knowledge and opportunity always choses to not destroy an attacker but, the key is to have many things in the hip pocket i.e knowledge this increases the 'good' intent meaning the ability to bring to closure successfully the event.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Thank you for this insight
@TheRoninkai
@TheRoninkai 3 года назад
You may want to look into traditional Yoshinkai Aikido. Or get to a Jujitsu school then try Aikido.
@SI-ln6tc
@SI-ln6tc 3 года назад
I seen some hip throws in aikijujitsu I'm guessing these were the origins of aikido's hip throws?
@trinidadraj152
@trinidadraj152 3 года назад
Yes, but Gozo Shioda also started with judo before aikido. Morihei Ueshiba also started with sumo. Daito Ryu has some sumo takedowns. And of course, Daito has many throws and locks and chokes.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Not all
@TheRoninkai
@TheRoninkai 3 года назад
No, Aikijutsu predates Aikido. Jujitsu is the grandfather of all.
@SI-ln6tc
@SI-ln6tc 3 года назад
@@TheRoninkai that's pretty much what I was trying to say.
@feirabbitt
@feirabbitt 3 года назад
How do you feel about the double parry that is seen in kali and some karate styles . Jesse the karate nerd did a video on it. I also know that the small circle jujitsu guys use it to.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
I'll check it out
@thomaswilliams3426
@thomaswilliams3426 3 года назад
I have a hard time understanding aikido and the practitioners. I think it’s a beautiful art but it’s lack of practicality leaves me confused as to why someone would choose it over an art that has randori or some kind of tangible skill to defend yourself with. My opinion is that without this ability, Budo means very little.
@bobpickens1
@bobpickens1 3 года назад
Interesting.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Thank you Robert
@eduardoalvarez2494
@eduardoalvarez2494 3 года назад
I think a good subject for another video could be ukemi in judo
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Of course
@Mulberry2000
@Mulberry2000 Год назад
Uki goshi does exist in judo
@TheRoninkai
@TheRoninkai 3 года назад
The video up-loader has not studied his history. The historic order of Japanese martial arts (hand to hand): Sumo Jujitsu Aikijutsu Aikido Judo Why no Karate? Because it's not from Japan and would be rolled into Jujitsu.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Aikido came after judo
@hoituthien
@hoituthien 3 года назад
A di đà phật... 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙇🙇🙇🙇
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
🙇🏻‍♂️
@MrSamurai137
@MrSamurai137 3 года назад
Aikido is going the wrong way globally
@hiskandar
@hiskandar 3 года назад
Chadi, I disagree on the point that Aikido cannot be used in randori because of just one technique you showed here as comparison with Judo in this specific clip. In reality, even there are (judo/karate-do/xxx-do) moves that doesn't make sense for the randori/sparring/fight/whatever situation is. But we cannot say that xxx-do doesn't work for randori. The problem of Aikido student today, almost all of them don't do physical prepared for the battle. Most of them just go for the peace calmness feeling craps (excuse me for my French). Not all, but unfortunately many Aikido students come more to listen preaching rather than physical stamina speed power etc training. And Unfortunately, if Aikido sensei start teaching the physical, their dojo (as you want everyone to call it but not calling it the gym just for respect) will have less and less students. Because going to the fitness gym will cost much less than any xxx-do dojo. Basically, in an imaginary scenario that you can test it for research, if you teach Khabib all Aikido techniques you know, and challenge him to fight you with just Aikido, he will find his way to use some Aikido moves he likes that is doable for randori according to his self expression against you. And don't expect his aikido move will be the same as yours black belt experience. But he will find his way to make it work for him. There maybe a lot of atemi but much more powerful atemi than Morihei Ueshiba's. Or maybe some variation he "invented Or discovered" due to his past fight experience. And that Khabib can easily says he just uses his Aikido for randori.
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
I said that it can work, their koshi nage is Koga's sode, it jist needs a randori structure
@hiskandar
@hiskandar 3 года назад
@@Chadi got it... yeah somehow i thought you were saying "can't" with the stop T sound on min 6:17. Haha
@ronin2167
@ronin2167 Год назад
It's a shame what Aikikai has done to Aikido. It's practiced by them, not as a martial art, but as a means solely for deifying Ueshiba. Which is not what he wanted. You actually have to look long and hard to find valid usable Aikido teaching. For if Aikido wasn't meant as a means of self-defense, then why did Ueshiba create it at all? I'm sure he's rolling over in his grave....well, urn. LOL
@fennec812
@fennec812 3 года назад
The whole “art of peace” angle on Aikido seems to be largely a western thing. I don’t have much proof, but I suspect it kind of “back-flowed” into the art as it got international traction. At the very least, a lot of the translations detailing Aikido writing are pretty poor. Chapters get moved around, words tweaked, etc. to support this narrative of a “passive” and “peaceful” art. Early Aikido doesn’t appear to be any more or less violent than any of its contemporaries. Ueshiba himself at one point even researched Judo counters and Shioda is on record as having deliberately picked fights to practice. Modern Aikido just has reinvented itself into a mostly aesthetic art (for better or worse). Ironically, I suspect this has to do with the lack of sparring/randori/competition. That live training is the core of practice for a majority of people, without it you need a new marketing gimmick. I think the spin towards aesthetics is largely that, even if it didn’t happen over night.
@eduardoalvarez2494
@eduardoalvarez2494 3 года назад
As I researched from Stanley Pranin (RIP) and Ellis Amdur there is a break point on Aikido and the way it was trained, the prewar aikido and the postwar(father of the one we currently have). You can see that the first one was more martial than the later one, that's one of the reasons of the separation from several disciples to create their branch (Tohei, Shioda). And the reason we have the current Aikido that we have is that it was designed by Kisshomaru using the post war Aikido, he tried to standarize more the techniques, have a curricula, and favor the aesthetics (also we can't forget the american occupation after the war that might have influenced a lot of changes on it)
@Chadi
@Chadi 3 года назад
Agreed 100%
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