Your video is the first one I've seen that explains the Waterfowl Dance properly. I've seen guides say, "If she's floating and her foot twitches, then..." or "You have to wait three-quarters of a second, then run, then sprint, then roll forward, then roll backward, then forward roll, then do seven flip-flops while whispering a prayer to Radagon..." - which feels more like a Tomb Raider cheat code. Thanks for your simple, pragmatic explanation!
she actually does the waterfoul as a reaction and it can be baited from a range with throwing knives. its coded in as a counter attack so its no wonder it happens most often as you strike her. divide her health into fifths and each time she crosses a threshold she will have a waterfoul loaded up to counter you. if you simply cannot manage to deal with it up close, notice these thresholds and run away when she hits them. then bait it with some range attacks like throwing knives. it sorta makes the fight trivial once you know this and use it to just avoid any waterfoul from a distance all the time.
I’ve noticed you can also bait waterfowl by running straight at her when she’s either walking towards or sideways to you. Once her health is 1/5th gone she starts her waterfowls
I've been using flame of the fell god to bait it out cause it staggers her if she doesn't end up doing waterfowl, but it's much cheaper in fp to use knives. Thanks!!!
The first blossom attack after phase 1 ends can be dodged without any chance of error by unlocking from malenia and sprinting directly under her to the other side of the arena. The attack has trouble tracking you and will always fly past you, at which point you can just run away from where she lands, super easy.
Thats how I dodged it my first time seeing the attack, as it seemed super obvious as many other souls bosses have attacks like that. For no rolling, Sanctuary Guardians flying dive, Kalameets flying dive, Demon Princes jump fireball throw, and several others with similar attacks can just be ran straight under. It was like natural instinct to run under her bloom, and idk why all the kills I see for her never just run under the attack
@@alwest4472 yup same here. it can't touch you. just run under her and past to a safe distance from the bloom explosion to not get touched by the rot at all
Thank you so much. Such a simple thing but I didn't think of it... I was going crazy. I've fought her maybe 80 times. After I read your advice... It only took 5 more tries to finally win!! I got her. I fucking got her.
16:04 man i found this moment so hilarious when he was talking about her attacks and explaining when she waterfowls and she instantly goes on to catch him off guard and do it, bro went dead silent just like the rest of us to focus on that dodge, great content man keep it up
Thank you for this. You were the only one who could explain how to deal with her Waterfowl from all ranges AND her Spirt Clone attack... I finally beat her after 200+ tries after watching this! You saved me so much time :)
This is by _far_ the best guide to this fight on RU-vid. Plenty of time is spent in combat, and there's no tricks or OP weapons. Just a solid video teaching you the dodge patterns you need. A+ job sir. 👍
great video, not just explaining particular builds that are strong against her but actually showing all her attacks and how you should respond to them, no matter what build you use. I needed an in-depth video like this because I was starting to lose my mind. thanks for making a REAL guide.
13:07 Pay attention to her "triple slash" attack. At the start of her move there's a sound queue followed by a spark of her weapon. If the weapon sparks she will triple slash with a follow up attack. There's a chance that at the start of the move (and the sound queue) her weapon will NOT spark. That means she will ONLY perform the triple slash attack without the follow up, which means its easier to punish her! Just a little tip. Didnt know that either but i watched my kill on her and find that out!!!!
This was apparently a "bug" that was patched out. now all her triple slashes spark. Like she wasn't hard enough already. But the key here is to dodge away from her after the triple slash to avoid getting hit by the quick/slow follow up. And then just punish the slow follow up. Safest strategy by far.
no offence, but why is it difficult to you? I got hit like once first time i saw this attack and then never ever again, but i died over 20 time to waterfowl and still can't dodge it properly, even after dozen of guides. Maybe it's just different things for everyone but i think spirit clones are easier to dodge because you just press one dodge every time you see a clone appear and the two times on the last one, when waterfowl is barely dodgeable with its 10 hits per second.
This video is as good as it gets. Tremendously communicated, really. I’ve been challenging myself to a low-level meeting with Malenia and you pointed out at least a dozen minor nuances that changed my thinking. You’re the man!
Dude, this video helped me SO MUCH, after what felt like forever I finally beat her solo! This is the BEST Malenia guide out there, I'll be sure to share it with whoever needs help beating this boss!
Something I found that can bait Waterfowl, at least in Phase 1 since she so stupidly passive, is just throwing bone needles. She will re-aggro and I've managed to have her trigger it from afar. I really wonder why it nearly takes a PhD to beat a videogame boss with how much I had to look up to understand what killed me. She has to be the least intuitive boss. That and she just straight up cheats as she's the only thing in the game that can animation cancel, hyperarmor thru stuff how she pleases (and is inconsistent too) on top of the awful camera when she does the Clones. This is a boss that doesn't even reward you properly either. No catharsis. You feel nothing. I sure didn't. However, I'm glad your guide exists as it is a wonderfully well put together video. Big thank you!!
Very nice video! I have a slightly different way of avoiding her spirit attack: run away and to the left, roll, roll, pause, roll, pause, roll from the final stab. Not as tense as your way so I am not as stressed when I do it. Has worked for me on all distances (except when I mess up, of course).
Absolutely fantastic vid. I’m at Melania now, only tried 10 times so far. Using a mage build, but finding that I’m panick rolling instead of using patience and reading her moves. Your tutorial/guide is really helpful. Last night, I went to bed thinking I’ll never beat her. Now I think I will. Thank you.
Actually beat her while watching the video. The thing about being comfortable probably was the most beneficial as I only got further into the video while mid battle) It’s quite important to be relaxed especially when you are almost one shot by any move - helps to concentrate and not panic roll or get greedy. Anyways, explanation is really good so thanks a lot!
Thank you, mate! I still haven't learned to dodge waterfall properly, but your video gave me enough confidence to keep fighting her and eventually defeat her:) Thank you, great tutorial!
Thanks to this I was finally able to dodge those spirit clones and beat Malenia! loving my first playthrough of the game although the speed of the big strength weapons does feel rough against some bosses
I've never heard anyone talk about the pillar under her before, and that honestly explains so much of the trouble I've had with the attack. I always prefer learning by understanding how something works rather than being told to "just do this", and this video definitely helped with that. Thank you.
This guide is a fantastic breakdown. I had intuited most of it, but I was still trying to do a delayed roll into her after her 123, in a tight window that would dodge the fast and slow followup. I facepalmed when I saw a roll away is safe. Also understanding the circumstances of her move extension in phase two is very useful! I also had been bloodhounding WaterFowl, so thank you for showing me a way to learn to normal dodge it. Would you consider making a video like this for Maliketh? I'm starting NGP2, and until now he's the only boss I feel that I still don't understand, and have been winning with really aggressive poise breaks using my wondrous flask and Square Off.
Out of all the vods i have seen on Malenia guides, this one is the most in depth and easy to understand. Thanks to you i got her down in just 50 attempts and was extremely comfortable with her attacks by the end.
When timed correctly, the jump in the midrange waterfowl dodge causes her to get stuck in one place and some of her attacks to almost go through you, I would imagine that this is the way the devs intended it to be dodged
Great video, deserves more recognition for sure. I've been fighting her for three days now on my first playthrough, and i think i mastered the medium range waterfowl. But i was having trouble with the close range and the clone attack, i got close so many times and died because of that. Your video will definetely help.
He makes the close-up look so simple, but she always gets me legit in the middle of an attack. I can't do allat (target unlock, run around, dodge twice) in that amount of time. The far away one is quite easy, but bating her to do it is inconsistent
Saw this yesterday, beat her today for the first time no invocations, this is probably the hardest fight I’ve ever played I feel so good right now I finally got gud
really awsome tutorial. Ive been stuck now for three days lol. Im changeing my perspectiv from "i must beat her" to "i must understand her". Try to enjoy the learning process. When shes dead, now what? :)
- sees view count - checks upload date Oh... Well I missed the mark by 5 months, did I? Nice breakdown video! I learned quite a bit, will definitely aid me in making new challenges and revisiting my own guide! Thanks!
the waterfowl and the spirit thing always get me bc i get so nervous 😭😭 and the first explotion in the beginning of phase 2 but I'll study your advices, thank you
Funny how the internet works. I just got to Malenia’s arena and this video popped up on my feed, very helpful and like you said it’ll take practice but I’ll get her wish me luck
As a STR INT build with the moonlight greatsword, I find it super useful to have the carian phalanx spell. When she's mid-range it will stagger her out of attacking/dodging, and you can almost always get a guaranteed strong R2 in. Casting always triggers her aggro/waterfowl from safety far away, and then you can punish with a strong R2. If you cast and she doesn't waterfowl, you can usually get a strong R2 in after the swords launch.
To those struggling, keep trying! It took me over 600 hours before I knew how to dodge it! It's the clone attacks that mess me up now! The clone attacks can one shot you if you're all up in her grill attacking! I've died more to this then any of her attacks! You got time to run with Waterfowl but with them rot orphans, you stand no chance if you're unlucky enough to get such RNG.
Such a fun boss to fight. If only she didn't have such complex moves that require tons of trial and error to learn how to avoid. And they are so deadly at the same time! Anyway, great video! I'm sure your explanations can save the sanity of some people out there.
I wouldn't call her a fun boss fight. She's a heavily RNG-based boss with so much that can go wrong without any fault of your own. My biggest issue is the input delay with hitting the dodge button and not registering a dodge quick enough to dodge. And her phantom range with her slam down attack. There are times where I'll think I have the spacing perfect, and then that thing nicks me every time. Also, she's just so insanely unpredictable. Most bosses, if you mess up mid-fight, you can correct and overcome. With her, if you mess up, you're pretty much screwed and have to try again. I know every single one of her moves, which ones to punish, how to space, etc. but even then, I can still go in and get absolutely demolished. There are times where I can nail her first phase like a pro without taking a single hit in under a minute, and then times where I die within the first 3 seconds of entering the arena, all because of some cheap quick swipe that no button press can be registered quick enough to dodge, and then you're just dead. Her second phase on the other hand seems to have even more phantom range and her attacks are slightly faster by at least 1-2 frames, meaning her attack timings are all jacked and your dodges all need to be timed differently. Because of all these inconsistencies, it's hard for me to ever label her as a "fun" boss. There's too much unpredictability going on here, all intentional by the devs, mind you. Maria, Orphan of Kos, Ludwig, Frieda, Gael, Nameless King. These are the epitome of boss design. Malenia is just cranked passed normal logic simply to make her the epitome of difficulty. You can do amazingly without taking any damage, and then you get caught under a nasty "surprise" waterfowl or something and boom, everything gets demolished in the blink of an eye. That's too much RNG for a boss fight in a FromSoftware game. Sorry for the long rant. Probably didn't read it all, but that's my two-and-a-half cents.
@@zowbaid89 I appreciate the input and the fight does feel like that sometimes, you're right. The first time I beat her I felt like I had gotten kinda lucky because she didn't use some of her moves. Also, her damage output is too high and the healing is also a bit too much. I haven't really felt like any of her attacks were too fast to dodge though. Maybe I haven't practiced enough? I don't really know all the patterns by heart yet. Perhaps the fight is enjoyable to me partly because of the many speedy switch-ups and sudden moves she can pull. I also enjoy the contrast between the first phase where she often lets you heal and the second phase where she is very aggressive. Sure, she has many flaws and she is not a top-tier boss to me but I think she can still be fun to fight if you can look past some of the frustration.
@@Index154 I would enjoy her so much more if a lot of her RNG factors were taken away. I totally agree with you that the few times I’ve beaten her it’s because she didn’t use some of her annoying moves, making me feel like I didn’t earn that win because I wanted to master every single one of her moves and beat them. So in that sense, I got lucky, which I don’t like feeling in any boss fight. I want to win because of skill not luck. And I’m sure you feel the same way.
This hands down was the best video on how to defeat Malenia. I’ve came so close to beating her but dodging her waterfall move was so rng for me. I just barely beat her, but I couldn’t have done it without knowing your video, thank you!
best vid that explained it well, had no clue about the invisible hitbox that you need to loop around so it made it difficult when watching other videos explain this tech, ty
I feel I see the obligatory “I’ve seen a million guides, but this is the only one that was helpful” comment on every malenia guide, but this is the only video that it actually applies to lol
Thank you so much for your tutorial. I was having so much issue dealing with her especially the waterfowl dance, your guide helped me a lot to beat her
I just recently started eldenring, my first souls like game. I have reached malenia and I learnt that she does a waterfoul when she like 45 to 50% or below, and another one at about 30 to 25% or below, it’s not 100 percent consistent but it lets u predict when she gonna do it about 70 percent of the time, all u gotta do to avoid the first flurry is run to like mid range throw a dagger until she does one then run from the first and dodge the rest
8:10 is one of the reason this boossfight is utter bullshit for me. She can cancel out her own recovery time with a diceroll, and you loose, not because of your fault, but because she cheated. Artificial difficutly in plain sight. I'm just astonished on how a company that basically made the same game for 12 year, that is so experienced, made waterfowl dance. I'm just curious to ask the developers how they tought this should be avoided for a healty gameplay, that doesn't involve searching on the internet how the trick her a.i.
Literally the attack would be so good if she only did it at a range if your spamming spells. It would stop people from playing passively and still be a dodgable attack. At close range the attack is just so unfair. As for what the devs were thinking with waterfoul; I literally think they made the attack as hard as possible and let the community figure out how to dodge it and force average players to use strategies to avoid it so complex they could be speed run tactics 😎 this is fr one of the worst bosses in the game because of *one* attack
@@poe1554 This was a dumb myth people were tossing around after they said there wouldn't be any sekiro dlc. Not sure why the community got so hooked on it. Just a otherwise fun enemy with a couple terribly designed attacks
Just throwing this out there as a universal tip (not exclusive to her but I don’t see it advised as much), when she does the jumping thrust attack you can use i-frames to roll with the attack (so backwards and you end up in the same spot as her after the roll). It makes it easier to punish. Another good use of this is the start of the Godfrey fight. If you get the move where he throws the ax you can roll back with it and get 2-3 attacks in at the beginning of the fight.
Good guide and very handy. Only critique is I'd like to see waterfowl dance in quicker succession. That said, your breakdown is very well described and implemented
Thank you for the feedback, i agree that the waterfowl section has slow pacing. I could have put the two examples from the start in there for the close up at the very least.
This is an excellent guide literally step for step thank you! I’m stuck in her again in ng+ and while waterfowl is still giving me trouble I kept getting hit by her last shadow clone thanks for showing the timing.
Hey, just wanted to say thanks, I basically beat Malenia thanks to you. I've been fighting her for at least 15h of game time. Nailed all her moves including her waterfall dance. The one move that kept killing me was the spirit clones. I've tried a lot of ways to dodge it. None worked except yours. Thank you
Thank you fellow tarnished for this.. after fighting her on my own without any cheese for about 60 hours now, she always gets me at thay damn phantom attack. I am so close to doing it. When i do, you'll get half the credit for teaching me how to dodge that shit proper. Much love!! ❤
@@Vy-Tan Perfectly no, i get hit a bit here and there but Waterfowl became trivial.. but that damn phantom attack was hard and kept fuckin me up. the 60 hours was a bit exacgerated, took me about 40 hours realisticly to beat her. Now I finally finishedmy first playtrough and this video helped me more than anything else. Finished my first playtrough lvl 120 zweihander str build average knight guy with 0 spells or bulshit. I am satisfied and bathing in joy :3 Peristance fellow tarnished, Persistance gets you trough everything
Just beat her with BKH bleed affliction and giant hunt AoW (also highly recommend this AoW or one with similar effect - it's almost cheesy) - your tip on dodging series of attack starting with a spark was super useful. Waterflow - was super sloppy but i survived 2 times - thats all that matter. Good luck for everyone who struggles, you will do it☝
awesome in depth-video I really wish I had seen it before trying to no-hit her all of these past evenings :D. Finally managed to do it yesterday. I had a colossal weapon (zweihander) and due to the no-hit limitation and the lag induced by heavy weapons such as these I felt obliged to use bloodhound just for dodging waterfowl. I had the same strat as you except middle range and close range are the same: (at least)quarter circle around her into bloodhound. Still hard AF though haha. As you said most of her attacks have like a ~10% chance of having a follow-up but it will never happen on her left-dodge, any jump attacks (inc waterflow) and her heavy swing after her flurry combo (she actually has 2different finisher this one has more windup time). These are the attacks that can safely be heavy jump attacked. For heavy weapon users I would advice to buffer a backstep after safe jump-attacks and react to what she does with either a follow-up R1 attack or a roll. It does a ton of poise-damage on hit and helps building distance to keep a safe range, works like a charm and looks super cool if she dodges to the left or backwards. I did not notice the fact that she does the specific two-hit jumping attack upon using estus/fp flask on the second phase it makes so much sense ! I feel like she not only does it on reaction but adds it in her moveset just like waterfowl. I don't know you but this fight is incredibly fun to try and try again, I'm amazed at how many animations and attacks she have and all the reactions/chaining possibilities they gave her. Have we ever witnessed a boss that has that many moves ? I don't usually try hard that much but it made me happy. Chivalery at its best :D
Finally defeated Malenia today. Although I used Flame of the Fell god in phase 1, in order to inflict a knockdown followed by a Taker's Flame skill. Then summoned a fully upgraded Tiche in Phase 2 to gank her. Thank you for the guide.
Btw for the close range waterfowl dodge on a PC (mouse and keyboard), you can keep Malenia locked when you see it and just run forward immediately until your character completes a 360 around her automatically and then dodge. twice forward.
Her 2nd phase will seem less scary when you realise the only additions are the Spirit Clone, the Whirlpool extension after some of her attacks and finally, the fact that she can counter a single hit with a spinning kick. Her healing punish is different but much easier to deal with
just recently beat Malenia on m&k and it was extremely hard dodging the waterfowl dance. I'd get it maybe 1 every 10 tries up close. Also, if you're not confident in dodging up close, when you deal 20% to her and you know shes about to do the dance, you can use a kukri to force her initiate the dance from a far.
You don’t want to dodge backwards after attacking her, dodge behind her because she has a lot of multi hit attacks that come out very fast with her very long sword that will hit you. Some attacks can be strafed or outspaced and punished with a charged r2 instead of rolled which gives you less time to hit her. Also sometimes after she attacks you she will jump backwards, so if you dodge behind her you can get an extra hit in. The attack where she sort of floats upwards and does two sword attacks; if you strafe around her slowly you don’t have to roll and can land a charged R2. If you strafe that attack too quickly she can 180 and catch you so you might have to roll. One last thing, personally I like to dodge to my left or her right shoulder when she does the triple sword slash, then I move backwards in case she does the fast follow up, and if she does the slow follow up I try to outspace it and start charging a heavy attack. I find rolling to her right side puts me in a better position to land the charged R2 if she does the slow finisher
So I've only just started fighting her for the first time and I know the game and this video are already a couple years old but there's some things I worked out while fighting her last night. The attack in phase one where the sparks come out of her prosthetic arm and then she does a bunch of slashes. You say roll past her shoulder and roll again. You can actually roll into this attack and punish and she doesn't finish the combo. At 24:50 you say don't double heal, but I've been squeezing two heals in here and then rolling that sweep attack no worries. Not that it's done me any good because I'm still stuck fighting her lmao. Hence, being here getting some pointers but I think I've worked out all the stuff you mention just by trial and error. My problem is consistency. I just need to keep trying me thinks, I'll get it eventually. I got this far. Great video though!
Found this guide extremely helpful and the only video that really goes in-depth with the attacks. Recommended this to my friend and you gained yourself a new sub 😊 Hope to see more content from you in the future.
The scheme for evading an attack at the beginning of the second phase is quite complex. You can just immediately remove the lock, and run right behind her, just don't hit her model, it's like dodging a Waterfowl dance at close range, only you don't have to do a full circle. She will always miss in this case, and you will be safe, no need to make unnecessary movements and take risks.
Here because of the spirit attack lol thanks man. Kudos to all the people trying to learn every moveset for enemies and whom didnt look up anything related to "cheese." We are the last of a dying breed in this trash era of gaming and its community/industry lol. I also think the main issue with alot of people who resort to cheesing is that their reaching most zones heavily underleveled because all they do is rush through everything straight to the demigods for bragging rights. Rather than take their time looting, searching, and killing/practicing with minor enemies. They just want to "bEaT tHe GaMe" and go post it on the cesspool of platforms like Reddit, Discord, and Twitch, even though theres way more to it than that. Or rush straight to Mohgwyn Palace and rune farm til their massively overleveled. Hell every enemy I come across I try to practice with it over and over until I take no damage from it/use minimal flasks. Until I feel as though im ready to move on. I honestly could care less how people play their game it doesnt bug me as much as Im probably letting on. BUT I just think its so lame.
Thank you for this! Really excellent demonstrations, helped me get through the fight. The clone attack is just as bad as Waterfowl imo. It's a good fight but those two moves bring it down a bit by just how hard they are to read.
I've been practicing and actually got a way of getting hit only once with only rolls. When she unleash her flurry dodge 1 inside her range, you will hit one time and then when she do the second flurry you can dodge like in the video.
New game +3 took me around 5 hours, she’s pretty easy once you master her move set, using a shield completely counters waterfowl dance, bloodfiends arm destroys her, phase 2 is kinda rng
Really cool guide. Wish Id seen this before I got her down yesterday. Took me 5 hours straight, in addition to the 2-3 hours Id already spent on her the night before. I know people always complain about hard bosses, but this is the one time I definitely feel like its just tuned too hard. Theres a fun fight in there, but its marred by waterfowl and the self heal. Remove just one of the two and I think it would actually be fixed. I had to respec and go blood infusion on my knights greatsword to keep up with her self heal, as well as switch to quickstep to keep up with her sheer pace. And my previous build had taken me through the game with very few obstacles at all. And no, spirit ashes dont exist.
