@@KevinCapolino A lot of physical therapy info and training info is apparently colloquial, and depends on the study group, so it sounds more like psychology, where you have wide latitude to say what you want as there probably is no scientifically validatable answer.
@@donaldkasper8346 I could rant for an hour about how true this is and it's way deeper than people realize. The leading edge of research very often contradicts the leading popular theories. PRI physical therapy is proving "upper/lower cross syndrome" style physical therapy completely wrong. The number of people talking about eccentrics is very encouraging and wasn't the same even 10 years ago. How much protein you actually need. How much testosterone you actually need. All these facets of physical therapy and training MUST be based on real world studies and large sample sizes. The good news is we're going in the right direction but the bad news is that it's not sexy. Dr. Mike talks about this constantly with regards to celeb/social media style workouts.
This is what I needed, I have been trying to dial in my rows. I am new to the lift and this definitely helped, thanks again for everything you do Doctor Mike.
@@divyansh6574 You can but some people want the variation, its fun and some people also want the spinal erector stimulus. Chest supported and bent over are both very good
@@RobiGold11 chest supported row is way better. Spinal erectors don't require much stimulus which most people already get from deadlifts. If you actually want to train the back muscles rather than just doing an exercise that feels difficult and gives u the sense of high effort, chest supported row is superior.
Dr.Mikes slow negative/eccentric part of the movement has changed my whole training routine. I set my ego aside to lift lighter weights with much better form. Loving the results and the brutally sore muscles the next day. Thanks Dr.Mike!
totally agree with letting your shoulder blades come down at the bottom. that's how we naturally move our shoulders when we reach down to actually pick up like an object and practical things like that. nobody keeps their scapulae stable when they bend down to pick up objects lol
yeah that was some really valuable advice right there for me. I've always found it totally unnatural holding my shoulder blades together in the full range. Never feels right. Too rigid.
The clearest cue's by far... That's such a skill in itself.. Not a wasted syllable and still room for a little dry arse sarcasm.. Hands down the best all around this fella..
The thing that really helped my bent over row was really getting my RDLs down. The hing, flat back and untightening of the hamstrings made all the difference
Totally agree with ya mate! 100 kilos 20 reps three sets of RDLs immensely help me with the heavy rows and heavy shrugs and T bar rows too not to mention standing barbell press!
The Barbell Row is arguably the best secondary exercise for the Deadlift. Using the multi-grip option (close, and snatch grip) like Dr. Mike suggests is really a good way to obliterate the lats as well as developing a better Dead. Excellent vid DM.
Yeah, this truly blew up my deadlift. And imo you should really push the weights on the barbell row, it helps a ton and deadlifts never feel unsafe or lacking anywhere
45 degree back extensions are the Best deadlift secomdary excercise Belt Squat will help your Squat, front squat can help deadlift too And the dip is the Best Bench press helper :)
It IS better if your goal is to get a bigger back. Deadlifts are not necessary at all if want that monster look. Risk to reward ratio is not good either.
So thats why i was always more of a fan of the pendlay rows. It Requires dynamic contractions of the scapulae. I unironically always lower the weight a bit more to get into a good 8 rep range, and they end up looking exactly like your "hinge" rows.
I like dumbbells for rows, more options for manipulating multiple dimensions of the move and trying different paths while allowing me to retract and pull back more. Certainly heavy barbell rows are also a good idea, but it's nice variation.
dumbbells are good when you're already progressed, but barbells are where it's at for the beginner, cause you'll get an even ROM and overall muscle memory of how it should feel.
@JAMMERHAMMER I needed to start with dumbbells to actually figure out how to get my traps to activate. Tried barbell all the time before that and had no clue what the exercise was supposed to be working lol
Smith Machine Bent over rows are a really great for stimulus/fatigue ratio. Personally I like to do lat prayers to get those pumped before going into my row. Then super setting wide overhand grip rows with narrow underhand grip rows. You’ll feel like a ninja turtle afterward, with the back pump that will have you questioning your humanity.
@@JAMMERHAMMER deep sigh. Yes you are correct the smith machine does take out the stabilizer muscles. But that doesn’t mean the free weight barbell row is the ideal exercise for everyone, or is the straight cut superior movement as you claim that it is. Someone who trains legs the day before will have a fatigued lower back. Also a thing to consider, some people have lower back problems in general. Thus the lower back would be the limiting factor for the free weight variation and would not be able to train the back properly compared to the smith machine variation. So before you go arguing over what movements are superior or inferior, think about the context in which an exercise is applied, and why. It’s not as black and white as you make it seem.
@@trevormyres5315 Correct. Also the Smith version is excellent for variation when the free weight version gets stale, that's why I treat them as two different movements that can be rotated when needed. One great example would be doing them with a Barbell when massing and in the Smith machine when cutting in a slightly higher rep range.
@@floriancazacu4504 3-4 sets of 12-20 reps. I typically do 135 for straight sets. With a 1 second squeeze at the top and a 3-4 second negative with a pause at the bottom. For the super set I use 95 lbs with the same tempo. And I’ll alternate which grip I do first every workout.
Really good info. About the ONLY informative barbell row guide I have seen on RU-vid. All the other internet people produced total crap for this move. This is excellent and shows your experience. Slow, Heavy, Controlled, Scalable. Unusual on RU-vid.
Dr Mike's approach to strength training and anatomy in general is awesome. No BS or fear-mongering, just common sense backed up by a complete understanding of biomechanics.
thank you very much for all the tips. both ~15 second videos without unnecessary info dumps and long and thorough explanations like this are very appreciated. thanks for pointing out the details and answering faqs in the video itself and not in the comments
How come EVERY TIME I work out a muscle group I see these PERFECT videos explaining what I did wrong for the workout yesterday. Please read my mind and post the right workout instruction ahead of time. Tysm
Thanks Dr. Mike, I'm still a noob, trying to get technique right and this helps greatly. Tip #2 kind of came natural, so that's encouraging to hear you talk about that. Thanks again
I appreciate your discussion of the variations hinge and lift point. I am starting a lifting program after not doing and serious lifting for the past 30 ish years but after 50 I noticed serious muscle loss. It’s been so long I worry that I’ve forgotten how to do it but your videos really help with that. Thanks for putting these out there.
Phenomenal demonstration. I really love doing barbell rows and doing them how Dr. Mike recommends them is definitely the way to go! Doing them completely or close to parallel to the ground especially with a deficit while arching the back, hinging at the hips and focusing on keeping a neutral spine improves the SFR of the lift by a long way and allows your upper back to reach more closer to failure without fatiguing the lower back too much for me. It’s a great lift for overall back development. It really thickens up the upper back (lats, rhomboids and trapezius) and spinal erectors through isometric contraction. I improved a lot on barbell rows ever since I started following Dr. Mike advice and closely following his technique on this and all other lifts as it makes me feel the muscles working and allows me to better my SFR. Big thanks to Dr. Mike and his in depth tutorials of technique. I do them in a pretty strict fashion. Focus on a slow controlled descent and big stretch at the bottom and definitely pause for a second or two there. 👍💪
@@fredrikandersson1846 stimulus to fatigue ratio. It basically means that how much stimulus an exercise produces at what fatigue cost. For example, heavy quarter squats have a poor stimulus to fatigue ratio as they’re not very stimulative for quads because of partial ROM in the shortened position and they’re quite fatiguing if they’re done with very heavy weight. Full ROM hack squats are considered to have a good SFR because of their highly stimulative nature for the quads and fairly low fatigue cost. Keeping fatigue low is generally better for hypertrophy training as that allows you to do more work which results in more growth.
Dr. Mike is as good as it gets as far as fitness info on RU-vid goes. I always recommend RP videos to anyone asking for recommendations on how to build muscle.
Huge class and help. I'm 42 and I'm doing a home workout, designing it has been difficult but it's been two months and little by little I have been adding or substracting exercises with a mix of calisthenics and gym focussed work out. The back and calves are my difficult focus points, so this video fixes half of it and Tomorrow I start with Back day with your teachings. Thank you so much!
I've never had my traps upper traps on 🔥 and nearly cramping from bent rows, the 🔥 is now spreading up to my neck and down to my mid and lower traps. Insane. Thanks Dr. Mike
if it's just upper traps it's not a good sign you may be shurgging the weight cause it's heavy, if it's truly the whole traps (especially the middle traps) then you've done it 100% right
I want to come train with you when im in NY end of August. Im former NPC Atlantic States winner 2003. Im 47 and have rebuilt my physique recently. Lets go!!!
What is your opinion on many fit influencers calling bb bentover rows "not optimal"? Personally I think they are out of their right mind to be saying that. Besides that, big ups for the whole rp team, you guys have made my training so fucking amazing, people are staring at me like I'm some kind of lunatic training that hard, and I love that feeling. And the gains? They are astronomical, guys who blast gear accused me of blasting too, even my own mother did! No better feeling than that. Big love.
If your lower back can handle it in addition to your deadlift and squat volume bb rows are amazing. Many people don't do them because it fries their lower back and impedes their recovery for other exercises they prioritize.
They may be like me and heard people say "just do rows bro" and followed programs that only had rows for back movements when they started. My back never grew from rows. Pull ups were what I needed. Barbell rows are nice, but they are not at all the "King of Back Exercises" for many of us. That said I still work them into some mesocycles, especially now that I can't do chest supported rows which I found to be by far better for growing my back for a long time. No movement should be looked at with a one size fits all mentality.
@@kalabhairava6670 The thing is that in order to achieve a well developed back you have to do both vertical and horizontal movements for the back. In your case you neglected vertical movements ( Pull ups, pulldowns, etc) which emphasize back width while horizontal ones like rows emphasize back thickness. In other words, both planes of the back must be hit to get optimal results.
@@ernestosdl7732 I know. What I am saying is that many beginner programs from years back (Stronglifts, Starting Strength, etc) neglect the vertical pull and then when some people finally start doing them they realize that just doing rows like the bros said to do is not correct. Some mistake this for rows being suboptimal. I'm also saying that the barbell row is not inherently the best horizontal pull. For me it was the chest supported row by far for a while.
Jesus Christ - what another brilliant video. Thanks DM. What I really enjoy is the detail and the clarity of explanation peppered with expletives. Just brilliant. Fuck it’s great.
Now you are the real trainer and just by watching your videos, I realize how many people on youtube are teaching the exercise wrong. I see most of the people touching their neval and when i try to do that its impossible and I don feel the back at all but when i tried your method, even if I use just the bar I feel my whole fu*king back.
This makes soo much sense and I can actually feel my back like why do people make it so complicated😅 thank you so much for making this clear and understandable video.❤❤❤
Excellent back training demonstration, and practical tips, and sane advice that works; conducive to exercising most of the back muscles! I exercise this way on dumbbell rowing, and on the performance cable rowing.🏋♂
I’ve worked out for a little over a year and a half and hit a mean plateau. Never really did any crazy research on working out just did the basic stuff I seen other people in the gym do and found what worked for me. Since watching multiple videos on this channel I’ve focused on really stretching the muscles and using lighter weights and correct form. At first I felt like I was back tracking but after about 3 weeks of this consistently I’ve noticed a visual and strength difference. It’s incredible! Who’d of thought doing things the right way would lead to results! 😂
I hip hinge like I am sitting. Shoulder with legs, flat back...parallel with the floor, and as I pull I get into deadlift position and pull....touch a tad over my belly button..my body type lets me do this....I put my hips back so far I make believe I am sitting down. Sir your content guides me and I really pay attention since turning 50. Thanks Doc
Ny gosh Dr. Mike, everything you have shown here, is exactly what i do and the number of times people in the gym kept staring at me and saying "you are doing it wrong" and i just reply "i feel my back doing all the work, this works for me and i have no lower back pain", they shake their head and walk away....thank you for removing the doubt they gave me.
Dude I watched this video a few days ago and came back to say I've never had my traps burn so good. This advice made a world of difference compared to whatever garbage I was doing before.
Really great stuff. I generally consider myself advanced re back training, at least when using the metric of strength on movements like the clavicle-to-bar pull-up and deadlift - but barbell rows have never really clicked. Instantly felt a difference when hinging into position before starting the movement, though. They still feel far from perfect, but just that little tip has given me hope again; I might just be able to make this exercise work for me now. Kudos.
If you’re watching this and doing bent over rows, do not let your scapula free. Unless you’re doing 50%or less of your max, you will hurt yourself. I just tweaked my neck doing this on about 80% for 12. Once you start getting fatigued during the set, your traps and neck start to pickup the slack because your shoulders aren’t packed.
My favorite thing about this guys videos is how he’ll say shit like “keeping your muscles in an iso lateral quantum reflux position“ And then in the next breath go “if you do this shit wrong, your vertebrae will fall out of your asshole”
Thanks, Mike. This is one of the few exercises I have an inordinate amount of difficulty isolating. I always, always, always feel it predominantly in my trapezius. My trap development is also exaggerated, which leaves me to believe I've been using poor technique for a long time.
Hinge, scapular protraction/retraction, chest up, vary grip, more cephalad contact point = more upper back; more caudad = more lat involvement + others, deficits
From one who has broken his back three times (one fusion at L4/5 at first break--and hey, guess what- you have spina bifida occulta-- second one was due to running and the third was a bike accident) and got spooked a bit this makes sense and I am using it. So far so good. Thank you.
Awesome tips, as usual. My issue with bent rows (actually, basically all rows) is that it feels like my biceps take over. Especially in the last few reps, I feel it a ton in my biceps, but not really in my back. My upper back especially is basically never sore, no matter what I do. Any ideas?
You could try focusing about pulling your elbows back. That helps me a lot to take the biceps out of any pulling movement. Also try a lower weight and focus on the form
Give some thought to a wider grip, as well as doing some reverse flyes beforehand to pre-exhaust the upper back or some lat prayers to pre-exhaust the lats! - Dr. Mike
All great tips in here, another one that I've only done once, but it seemed to work, was to hit biceps first and take them out of the equation. Fatigue the biceps so they physically can't takeover when doing the pulling work. Was just an experiment, likely not ideal, so take this with a grain of salt. Will try pre exhausting the back first, so how it goes.
Dude i tried this today, ow my god i can put 100lbs + to my rows, dr thanks so much for ur content, each time i hit the gym i watch your videos and it always works out, sometimes im even in the gym in the middld of a set secretly watching again due to my memory loss LOL!! Thanks guys !
Great video! You covered a lot here! - very helpful. I'm older, in my 50s, when I started lifting in my teens I connected well with the BB Row. I tried everything you mentioned in terms of plates - 25s, 35s, 45s and underhand. I also, thanks to Arnold, tried doing them standing on a bench. All great! Shoulder Width typically works best for me - average I think. Interestingly, however, it's a different story with DB rows! I'm a stickler with technique and if I use the typical neutral grip I can't seem to feel my Back. It wasn't until I observed Lee Haney use a prone grip ( barbell grip) that I experimented with and connected better - even better holding the DB at a 45 degree. So, as you stated you do have to experiment and figure it out for yourself. We aren't just a bunch of muscle heads!!...LOL. Btw, there is a RU-vid channel called: Natural Gallant Bodybuilding. His motto is: "Train the muscle, not the joint!" You probably won't like his ROM but he makes a good argument. Would be interesting to get your critique.
This video is unbelievably good thanks again to RP! Is my lower back supposed to be sore if I feel the other muscles worked or is it poor form? I feel my back is arched enough & that is the cause of the lower back pain? Thanks!
