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Measuring the Input Impedance of a Product, Circuit or System (070a) 

Electronics for the Inquisitive Experimenter
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There are two kinds of situations where you might want to measure the input impedance of a product, system or circuit:
1. At a Low frequency like an audio amplifier where there is no real concern about the complex aspects of impedance.
2. At Higher frequencies like a receiver pre-amp where we are very much interested in the complex impedance.
In this video I will be addressing the first of the two.
I will be measuring the input impedance of a small, inexpensive audio amplifier. I will discover how this input impedance is affected by:
The position of the volume control
The level of the input signal
The frequency of the stimulus
=======================================
Time Markers for Your Convenience
----------------------------
00:05 Introductory Comments
00:59 Why not use a DVM to measure Input Z?
01:53 Planning our Measurements
02:52 What is "Line Level?"
03:22 What is the difference between dBv and dBu?
04:20 Planning our Test Voltage
06:12 Three Important Questions ...
06:15 1. How does the Volume Control affect the Input Impedance?
06:43 2. How does the Signal Level affect the Input Impedance?
06:59 3. How does Frequency affect the Input Impedance?
07:36 Setting Up for the Test
07:39 Test Equipment Settings
09:00 Test Equipment Connections
10:00 First Test: How does the volume control affect the Input Impedance?
12:40 Second Test: How does the signal level affect the Input Impedance?
14:20 Third Test: How does Frequency affect the Input Impedance?
15:21 Bringing it all together
15:56 Parting comments and Toodle-Oots

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2 окт 2024

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Комментарии : 34   
@ernestb.2377
@ernestb.2377 День назад
Very helpful Ralph! I know 99.9% of this but still enjoy listening to you, and use it as a refresher 😊
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you День назад
I'm glad you found it helpful ... and refreshing ;-)
@stereophotog
@stereophotog 4 часа назад
Great video and thank you for the efforts and time spent doing this for us.
@octapc
@octapc День назад
I haven't touched RF gear in over 30 years from when I was in the RAAF. Impedance matching theory has fallen out of my head and will probably never be needed. However, this video is the first of yours that I will watch solely for the purpose of reminiscing 😂
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you День назад
Thank you very much for your service to your country! I was in the U.S. Air Force. Enjoy! 🙂
@AuraARTStudio
@AuraARTStudio День назад
Спасибо. Очень подробно и понятно объясняете. 👍
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you День назад
Thank you! 🙂
@W1RMD
@W1RMD 22 часа назад
I always learn so much on your channel. Thanks and take care!
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you 8 часов назад
You are welcome! 😁😁😁😁😁😁
@peterayearst23
@peterayearst23 День назад
Nice explanation. I'm really looking forward to your experiments with impedance measurements at the higher frequencies.
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you День назад
Thank you! Yeah, the higher frequency stuff is a LOT trickier! As an adjunct to this, there is my video on measuring non-50 Ohm stuff with a 50 Ohm VNA. 🙂 ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-dgDS4rjb-GU.html
@DucatiMTS1200
@DucatiMTS1200 День назад
Super video Ralph. Great to get my brain refreshed by a clear and concise explanation. I suffer from TMB i.e. too many birthdays hi hi! 73 de GI8WFA.👍
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you 23 часа назад
LOL!🤣 TMB!! I gotta use this! Thanks! 🙂
@derdoktor7123
@derdoktor7123 3 часа назад
Thanks for a very nice explanation, Ralph! If you have no idea what‘s coming next I would wish the process of matching a 50 ohms line to a crystal filter including the design process maybe 10 MHz 😊
@TR3A
@TR3A День назад
Fantastic content! Thank-you!
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you День назад
Thank you so much! ... and you are very welcome! 🙂
@mikesradiorepair
@mikesradiorepair День назад
Don't have enough fingers and toes to count how many times I have tried to explain measuring a component or circuit's performance and the importance of matching input and output impedance. In my case it's usually a RF related circuit or component like a crystal or ceramic filter, band pass filter or mismatched amplifier stages with hi/low input output stages. You can't just hook up a filter or filter network, etc... to the input / output of a spectrum analyzer or vector network analyzer with a 50 Ohm impedance to a circuit or component with possibly thousands of Ohms of impedance and expect the result to be correct. In most cases people get it, a few are like talking to a brick wall. Mike KC3OSD
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you День назад
If you take in my video on measuring non-50 Ohm things using a 50 Ohm VNA (ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-dgDS4rjb-GU.html) you will see that I am in agreement. If we absolutely do not know what the input impedance is, where do we begin and how do we accommodate this? An initial measurement without impedance matching gives us a ballpark. From this ballpark, how precise do we need to be? Many times this ballpark is sufficient, but not always. Then we have to turn to impedance matching business. In my next video I do NOT do impedance matching because the amplifier I will be testing the input impedance of is SUPPOSED to be in a 50 Ohm system, though it turns out ... not so much. 🙂
@ornithopterindia
@ornithopterindia 11 часов назад
👍Thank you sir.
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you 8 часов назад
You are welcome! 🙂
@carlosanvito
@carlosanvito День назад
Great video. Changes in input Z are likely due to having negative feedback directly in the first stage. Too bad the designer didn't use a high Z buffer with a fixed input resistance before the NFB stage(s). By the way, love the display monitor in the upper-left corner.
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you 23 часа назад
Thanks, man! I had to think about this a little... yeah, negative feedback with a capacitor in parallel with it to limit high end ... that would certainly do it. I agree with you on the fixed high input Z first stage; put the volume control between the first stage and the next. That is how I did it in my mixer project (Design End-to-End series). He is the reason I am here, my friend. That is my wallpaper on my desktop. 🙂
@carlosanvito
@carlosanvito 21 час назад
@@eie_for_you I'm completely with you, my friend - in my 'retirement' I'm an adjunct college prof, teaching engineering technology. While I'm not allowed to openly discuss my faith, I subtly include Christian values in the lectures and talk about the importance of integrity in the industries where they will likely work. Young people need to hear this from an old guy like me, as the rest of what they are constantly bombarded with is just the opposite.
@jim9930
@jim9930 18 часов назад
@@carlosanvito May 21, 2011 was the beginning of judgement day on the world And it shall come to pass in that day, a great tumult from the Lord shall be among them; and they shall lay hold every one on the hand of his neighbor, and his hand shall rise up against the hand of his neighbor. Zechariah 14;13 "Tumult" = confusion & disbelief ...on purpose, by design for the punishment of mankind! Division is the result. Babylon is fallen(world systems). Division is worldwide in religions, politics, economics, news, industry, sciences, sports, medicine, entertainment, and even between the sexes. ...have you followed world events lately? The Lord is known by the judgement which he executeth, the wicked is snared in the work of his own hands. Higgaion. Selah. Psalm 9;16 Whoso keepeth the commandment shall feel no evil thing, and a wise man's heart discerneth both time and judgement. Ecclesiastes 8;5 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign to ever and ever. And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. Revelation 11;15 19;15 spoiler alert: The biblical calendar has been known, published(1974), and carefully studied for half a century now... There are forty+ time-paths from the bible pointing to 2033 as the last day. Go look up: Ebible2 timelines T - minus 9 years and counting... That is what young people need to know, Carlos FEED MY SHEEP
@jim9930
@jim9930 17 часов назад
@@carlosanvito Because I have called, and ye refused; I have stretched out my hand, and no man regarded; But ye have set at nought all my counsel, and would none of my reproof: I also will laugh at your calamity, I will mock when your fear cometh. Proverbs 1; 24-26 GOD is our refuge and strength, a very present help in trouble He looketh on the earth, and it trembleth: He toucheth the hills, and they smoke. Psalm 103;32 Bow thy heavens, O lord, and come down: touch the mountains, and they shall smoke. Psalm 144;5 READ THE BOOK ! And an highway shall be there, and a way, and it shall be called the way of holiness; the unclean shall not pass over it; but is shall be for those, the wayfaring souls, though fools, shall not err therein. Isaiah 35;8
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you 8 часов назад
@@carlosanvito So very true! They've heard the message of "me first at all costs" ... "it is all about me and what I need" so much that selflessness is a rarity. 😞 Lying is OK if it is "for a good cause" (usually their own). Yes, integrity is so important. Keep up the good work! 🙂
@geirha75
@geirha75 День назад
can we somehow measure pure Z impedance of an efhw antenna up in the air. no unun connected. local conditions.
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you День назад
Check out this video: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-bPmtIVmlJok.html 🙂
@y_x2
@y_x2 День назад
Good info. You forgot to say that the equipment must be turn on!
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you День назад
I'm glad you liked the video! You made me think ... I thought for sure I said to turn on the little amplifier ... yup, at 10:29. 🙂
@egonotto4172
@egonotto4172 День назад
8:15 "The signal generator output impedance is set to 50 Ohm". I don't think so. All signal generators I know have a fixed output impedance of 50 Ohm. Only the voltage display is halved so that the voltage is displayed at a load of 50 Ohm.
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you День назад
Yes, you are right. This signal generator has a fixed 50 Ohm output impedance. However, there is a setting for the channel which we can set to the impedance that it will see on outs output which corrects the voltage as indicated on the display to accommodate the load impedance that actually exists on its output. It doesn't change the actual output voltage. It changes the voltage as *indicated* on the display. With that said, I DO personally own a signal generator whose output impedance is NOT 50 Ohms. While it is a good bet that most mainstream signal generators output impedance is 50 Ohms, it certainly in not a given. There is a whole class of them, for instance, which are 600 Ohms and 75 Ohms. So, let's be careful about our assumptions. 🙂
@egonotto4172
@egonotto4172 День назад
@@eie_for_you That's right, that's why I wrote “All signal generators I know”. But that wasn't right either, because I have an old Wien-Robinson oscillator that I hadn't thought of, whose output impedance I don't know. But I doubt that it has 50 ohms.
@eie_for_you
@eie_for_you День назад
@@egonotto4172 True that! It is a good assumption, in general, that all signal generators of modern design will have an actual output impedance of 50 Ohms unless they have some specialized purpose. The cable TV industry is all about 75 Ohm as is the CCTV because 75 Ohm coax has less loss than their 50 Ohm counterpart. Parts of the audio industry was all about 600 Ohms; that is where the whole dBu steps in (1 mW into 600 Ohms is 0 dBu). 🙂
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