Can we have a segment like in Top Gear where Jessie is the Stig and takes bikes around Centennial Park and they get ranked on a leaderboard? I could see a future where Dave Arthur is calling out Jessie Coyle lap times as a proof point for a bike!
I bought my dream bike frame (rim brake) in early 2021, when disc frames were still often just rim brake frames with disc brakes bolted on, and hence not great. Also, rim frames still had some resale value. Within 18 months, everything changed. My frames value just vanished as everything became about disc, so I had a choice, sell for a huge loss and go disc, or double down on my frame, and enjoy what was still my dream bike build for many years. I chose the second, and love my rim brake, mechanical Campy 12 speed Bianchi Oltre XR4. With 28mm tyres on Winspace Hyper wheels, it's awesome. I know it's not the fastest, but I don't care. It doesn't look boring like most new bikes do either.😜
Equal tire pressure across tire widths does not equal the same speed or comfort. This is a common misconception. Hoop stress is what you are looking for. 100 PSI in a 23mm tire has equivalent hoop stress to ~72 PSI in a 32mm tire.
it amazes me that nobody seems to understand this...I raced on 19s as a kid, trained on 23s, 25s, 28s and 30s at various pressures and NONE are what you would call comfortable.
Rim brake rider here. A 2015 Focus Cayo w/ DA weighing just over 7kg. I’m totally open to a disk rake road bike. In fact I’d love to make the move. It’s not the discs that put me off but the other “progressions” that have come with the new modern road bikes. Integrated cables, one piece bar and stem, ‘aero’ proprietary seat posts (easily my most hated element of modern road bikes). All faff for a non racer like myself. I’m not left with many options, besides the Aethos (27.2 round seat post and semi integrated cables).
See if you can ride someone's Ritchey Road Logic in rim brake or disc brake and you'd be surprised how it rides. I sold my titanium road disc bike and kept the Ritchey Swiss Cross as my all road bike as I kept reaching for that over anything else I have in the garage due it being so comfortable and fun to ride. I even swapped the same wheels and tyres across to test it on the same 60km loop and it felt just as comfortable as the Ti bike for much less. The Ti bike had semi integrated cables and the Ritchey external and TBH I don't even see the cables now and if and when I do have to replace anything it's quick, easier and cheaper to do than full integrated cables. My son is a bike mechanic and he said the amount of broken brake cables his replaced in full integrated systems is ridiculous and down right dangerous and said if you get something integrated get the under the stem system it's much less likely to kink and or wear the cables through but he still prefers to see semi integrated of external cables. Customers always get shocked when they're shown the damaged cables and then the bill to replace them.
I raced rim brakes for 20yrs. I still have my old Colnago race bike with DAce 11speed. I went to disc 2yrs ago - 12spd Ultega. Never once had any disc rub and don’t have to do anything re brake blocks when I remove wheels etc. All it needs is brake pads once a year which is an easy job for even basic skills. When I ride my Colnago it’s harsh and not as nice to ride. My disc bike is 400g heavier and it’s way more comfortable and faster. And it’s ALWAYS white shoes and sox.
I actually expected my disc brake bike to be faster. My very light mildly aero rim brake bike seems about the same speed as my heavier more aero disc brake bike on mostly flat terrain. I really can't measure a difference on the same route with PM and HR monitor indicating similar efforts many times. Both have Ultegra Di2, 50 mm rims. Same Pirelli 28 mm tires that measure 30 mm on disc brake wheel and 29 on rim brake bike with narrower rim). TPU tubes. It could be I'm not fast enough to get the full aero gain on the disc bike, or more likely, maybe my position is slightly more upright. What is true is the disc brake bike is a lot more comfortable and the rim brake is easier to travel with. The lighter bike accelerates better. All in all, I prefer riding the disc. I like having both.
Full black kit here (matt black helmet, matt black shoes, matt black-rimmed sun glasses). Matt black bike. If not this clothes set, than the same but in white (can’t afford the same bike in white, unfortunatelly😂). But I do not mix colors of helmet, shoes & sunnies; I keep them in the same color, that’s what I wanted to say. Keep up the great show, guys!
Why not just ride a full suspension mountain bike on 2.5s? Much softer. Alternatively, the couch in your home is even softer still. You could just ride that.
Tubeless is definitely better than Butyl but you can't say tubeless is better than latex because the rolling resistance of GP5000s with Latex tubes is lower than many tubeless setups.
@@independentthought3390 Maybe bleeding is actually easy and has to be done what… every 2 years? What has to be done with pistons? You’re full of misconceptions
I recently bought this camera after seeing the NorCal video on it and I've almost figured out the mount at this point. At first it was slipping on the slightest road bumps but after adding some carbon paste to the gopro prongs it's 95% where I need it to be. Also you don't need a long selfie stick, I use a 8cm long pole which makes the camera stick out just enough to clear my bike computer. But yeah it's still a bit hacky and will slip every now and then. But for a hobbyist rider who wants to share this footage on instagram or whatever it's super fun and not too hard to use either.
The wided tire and wheel is a good advantage of disc brake, but not an absolute one. The development of rim brake basically stopped because of disc brake. The latest génération, dura ace 9100, already could accommodate 28 mm tires, while almost no pros were using anything more than 25mm. Nothing to stop the next generation to reach 32mm+. Suddenly disc brake advantage is much less...
What about you are not ruining your rim every time you brake, and should you ride a lot in hilly or even mountainous area you buy rims every other year.....
@@ondrejgrolmus5450 simply do it as we've done it for ages. Run a set of alloy training wheels for your solo / training rides and a race pair for group rides and or races. Rim brake wheels are also cheap af.
Yup. Im running 28's on my 2013 tcr. Though I like running the brakes with more gap as I have small hands so i want the brakes to grip when my hands are half closed not barely gripping with the tips of my fingers, so I've got more leeway. Greatest benefit of discs is stopping in the wet. And honestly...I'm more worried about the grip of my tires on the road and sliding off to keep me going so fast I need discs to slow me. Plus I almost never ride in the rain.
All this talk about the wider tires, it of course was mentioned that a wider tire is more comfortable, but what they didn't mention was the energy saved not being bumped around the whole ride, that fatigue build up on a harsh 25mm tire at 100psi plus is sapping valuable energy so it could be argued wider tires at low pressure not only has better rolling resistance, but the that fatigue is mitigated resulting even more free speed, especially in a crit where stress levels are higher.. I also want mention obviously Jesse and Chris are elite racers and performance is top priority, but for the weekend warrior who may not race is still out smashing it with their buddies, and if they think they dont care about perforce their crazy, and I would even argue that their are more financially able weekend warriors that have a an ftp of 250 and can afford an SL8 or a madone or what have you that still care about going as fast as they can. I imagine its more of those kind of riders that listen to this show then the Elite 350 watt FFTP Cat 1/ grade A rider, dont under estimate The Weeknd warrior!
That’s a great point that weekend warriors CARE about performance, and I’m so glad you said that out loud. There seems to be this tone, especially on RU-vid, that riders such as yourself who don’t necessarily pin a number on are all just tootling around from cafe to cafe. I totally agree with you, every bunch of mates I see out on the weekend are trying to smash each other … and it’s great. Well said mate, and keep it up 🦾
Absolutely, me and my mates all raced at a high(ish) level in the late 80’s early 90’s. We’ve done the racing and life has moved on for us but we still are all looking for every advantage to kick each others heads in on a Saturday morning. Followed up by the cafe stop 3hrs later. Everyone is entitled to seeking out performance 👍. And agree with the wider tyres less fatigue comment, our roads are crap here in the UK!
Absolutely. I'm adding about 10 to 20 minutes extra per ride after switching to wider tires due to the lack of fatigue. It adds up so fast over the course of a few months.
I just don't need a new bike, or need disc brakes, or need wider tires. Industry should stop trying to sell me more cr@p to save a handful of watts. #savetherimbrake ❤❤ your show!
Just to chime in here on the SuperSix EVO chat. A super six EVO from 2015 which I own and have upgraded every bit of weighs in at 6.23Kg on 25c tires. It is lighter, it was cheaper but it is not faster. Unless going uphill over 10% gradients. I also don’t ride it over my 2023 EVO WITH 30c tires. It sits on my indoor trainer
Same. I have a 2015 Felt F1 that weighs 6.7 kg. Absolutely loved that bike, but since I picked up a disc-brake bike that's 7.8 kg, I haven't ridden the Felt in over a year outside. After a while, I took off all the parts off the Felt that didn't have to do with shifting, and sold it on ebay for some extra cash. Now that bike sits as my permanent trainer bike.
The next step is to test a high quality aero RIM BRAKE frame with 32C clearance (yes they exist) from china with an electronic rim brake groupset like the wheeltop or the upcoming magene groupset with some nice wheels on. Im still team disc brake but would like to see someone finally build a bike like that and properly compare it.
You’re right! You can easily get 30mm wide carbon rims for rim brakes!! Recent Rim brake frames (also LOOK, TIME & PINARELLO) can fit 30c tires and these frames have aero tweeks. So there is ABSOLUTELY the possibility to have a light, slightly aero, rim brake bike with wide rims & 30c tires. People talking as if rim brake bakes were all old with round tubes and narrow tire clearance are just ignorant / wrong
@@SamuelBlackMetalRider I had Bianchi Oltre xr4 rim brakes, Dura Ace, Cadex wheels, 6,7kg, was riding like you expect but i prefer my new Ritte Esprit disc, room for 34mm tires, long wheel base, a little heavier but more enjoyable and comfortable, the one area where the Oltre is superior is when you accelerate or steep hills
N+1 bikes: I have a VENGE & ENVE MELEE both SRAM RED etap and I also have a COLNAGO C50 rim brakes 11s Super Record. Love all of them for different reasons. And I’m building a superlight rim brake climbing bike sub 5,5kgs with 11s SRAM RED 22. And I will love it too.
Having owned only disc brake bikes up until recently… I enjoy my new to me rim brake bike the most. It just looks so cool & it feels great. I do miss the disc brakes on descents & I hope the market will continue to support the rim brake option in the future. Choice is good. I am a for fun rider chasing my own PRs and fitness & a break from reality haha. It would be so sick to have a new gen madone with rim brakes that would hopefully be cheaper. That being said some companies are offering modern rim brake frameset such as blackheart cycles, ritchey, standert among other brands... Sadly they are not at a cheaper price point Than their disc counterparts.
The rim brake and narrower tire vs disc and wide tire argument is the same argument mountain bikers have already hashed out. Mtb’ers have already adopted wider tires and discs. Mtb’ers since then have learned to adopt change. Just look at the geometry changes in XC bikes. XC bikes are getting more travel, slacker geometry, and wider rims and tires. I love road riding too, but c’mon until recently, road bikes haven’t changed. There weren’t options back in 2015 so, what’s the difference? Oh no, you need to learn something.
To equalize the difference of the mentioned rim vs disc frame, i know wider tyres are faster, but you are trying too much variable at once. But since the older TCR can't fit wider tyre, then : - the Tavelo should use the same tyre. There is still wheel difference but tyre should account for more speed. - even better, swap the tyre around, because tyre age matters a lot. (or buy 2 same tyre that fits on the old TCR.)
Having faffed around with the 3D edits on the Insta 360 - which somehow never look “real” and also used the little 360Go (which I do sometimes wander is on or off and the film quality is not quite right) - I stick with the Go Pros - and when feasible x2 (one on the front of one bike and the rear of another). Again a long edit - but a much more polished edit. Ref the colour of helmets and shoes and accessories. Many riders have more than one bike - so having n+1 shoes, helmets and accessories is one of the other pleasures of cycling ….accessorise for the gainzzz Loving the Jesse Coyle “Z4 Exclusive” training plan - minus Centenary Park 💪😁
I have been considering selling my superfast Wilier 7,8 kg (with pedals, i hate cycling without them) rimbrake bike with Campagnolo Record 11-25 cassette and 50-34 compact crank because I pick my discbrake gravelbike (with big cassette) every day and forget my Wilier in my basement. But now I am getting second thougts. Its a big issue that about brake maintenance. I can service my rimbrakes myself, but I am not confident about hydraulics maintenance. Discbrakes are better for my 4 days a week bike, mostly because that bike takes bigger tyres, and I am now going to upgrade my 38mm tyres (thats great for tarmac and easy gravel) to 45 mm , which makes it super on the forestroads, but then there opens more gap between the bikes and the superlight racerbike with 25 mm tyres might get chosen for rides that I am sure will go exclusively on tarmac. And I will not get so little money for my super racebike that it will not fell good to sell it, anticipating that i never ever will be buying a sub 8 kg bike again.
I remember Dan Forsyth (didn’t know his name at the time until I saw overall event time sheet). I rode with him the last 80-90km of the Peaks Challenge Gold Coast 2015. Good guy. I can’t relate to any your disc chat but can relate to your random call out of local rider 😂
Just bought the 360 x3 GO, brilliant little cam. You missed one feature that works pretty well - voice activation! Just shout ‘record now’ and you’re off, most times! Fun also to see how your mates react 😂 One last thing, it’s possible to mount it on your helmet, or even glasses, it’s so light!
HAHA!! I never had the balls to use the Voice Comment feature. Will give it a go during my next race. I wonder, can I use custom commends. Be great to use "up up up" as the trigger to turn on.
@@ChrisMillerCycling haha. Hadn’t thought of that, would be well good. Maybe I’d use something like ‘smile blossom’ incase there’s lots of ‘up up up’ in similar accents and poor little cam gets confused! I’m going to investigate the ‘voice commands’ right now. Damn, I can’t see custom in the menu, just - Take a photo, start recording, stop recording, mark that, and shut down camera (for English options). In a race might not take long till someone shouts stop recording and a start / stop ‘war’ begins!
Most do not have the finances to compare the performance difference and they are not racing. The older bike has plenty of performance envelope for mortals. It's not just the expensive initial purchase but the running costs of consumables are higher. I know a lot of folk that can not dish out 2 Grand let alone 10. As a mechanic and fitter I can assure you that the vast majority of people do not fall into the category of elitist. Unfortunately the industry needs new tech to survive...
As a life-time cyclist and motorcyclist I never complained when we got our hands on disc brakes on motorcycles, great development. It should not be different with bicycles, but it did not go that way, with some reasons to take into account. Firstly, on a bike the brakes have to be really precise because the annoying sound of a not perfect position of the brake pads will kill your ride; on a motorcycle you don't even hear it... They had to fix that. Weight was an issue, but not anymore. Next, purchasing a new bike, that certainly will have disc brakes, depends on what you wish. I did not buy a new bike in years because I needed my money for other things and on top of it I have a nice collection of vintage bikes. If you don't race, all those arguments about aero and watts being saved are totally irrelevant. The same goes for the debate about tubes or tubeless. If you are a pro rider, you get everything done for you. The big difference is for other racers who are not pros and have to take care of their own bikes. They are the ones who buy a big chunk of first-rate road bikes and to them all of this matters. So, everybody figure out if they care to bother according to where they position themselves. Back in the day, when I was a racer, at a very moderate level, I bought the top end bikes I still own, rim brakes and all. I will buy disc brakes anytime I will decide to get myself a bike of these days and will not be whining about the quality.
A few comments - as a rim brake lover. 1. It depends where you live. I now live in hills and the discs are great, particularly on sharp, shaded descents. 2. I have a disc and rim brake bike. Both the same brand. The disc brake bike is MUCH stiffer for acceleration. In fact, it climbs better despite being 1.1kg heavier (and a lot cheaper). If I still lived in the flat lands, discs wouldn’t remotely interest me. However, in my very small sample of experience, the game changing fact is the increased stiffness.
Been looking at Tavelo arow and it looks like a quality frame-set. My only issue is its BB 86 bottom bracket especially if you plan to combine it with a Dub based crank like Cybrei. There are other cranks which would have worked better eg ones that come with a 24mm spindle, yet still offer similar low weigh (eg. Incolor offers such an option and so also elilee). You will then have to periodically change the bearings due to them wearing out often(perhaps every 50000 miles)
On my club ride we're almost all rim die hards on c.2015 bikes - happy to potter along at 14.5 mph av. (hilly area) The next faster ride up in the club almost all have
I agree a 400 gram difference would be felt. It's just filling up two water bottles. I felt a difference with an 800 gram difference when I "weight weenied" my bike. I'm not sure this is apples to apples in terms of comparison feel between a tcr and a tavelo which is an aero bike. A disc TCR is a better comparo. Why not get the Tavelo weight reduced also by 400grams with Elilee cranksets, Darimo cockpits, Berk Lupina saddles to see how similar weights perform? Lastly, I did feel 28s are more sluggish compared to my 25s. Already went back to 25s for my duathlon races. I run only 70psi in my 25s. I'm 63kg. Use Maxxis HighRoad Sl tires which rock.
The worst part about discs is that they completely pushed out rim breaks and there are very few options for us sunday riders that d9n't want to get a PHD in disc break fixing. W don't have team mechanics.
Honestly tubeless is more f around but honestly the amount of rocks, potholes and random shit I have hit recently due to wether n not had to deal with a flat is insane! Yes more set-up crap to do with tubeless but I’m not stopping on the road every couple of rides because of pinch flats also their faster 👀
I have 3 road bikes. The slowest by a long way is my 2014 Cannondale Supersix. Won’t take more than a 25mm tyre. It sits on my turbo so I still ride it regularly. My Argon18 Gallium is super light and has a very aggressive geometry with Ultegra mechanical gears and rim brakes, tubes. Sure it’s not quite as fast as the newest disc brake bikes but it is great for alpine climbs and so simple. Perfect for slinging in a bike box when I go on a flight. Then my super fast Spesh SL7. It was very expensive and only comes out on dry days. There is no way I’m taking it on a plane. Just too risky and too much potential faff. Horses for courses as they say!
But wheels make up the majority of the aero difference. Jeff Linder just did a video on it. If you are doing crits, the accelerations are why you need a thinner tire because the weight of the wheel getting up to speed. Also the higher pressure the more resistance the tire has on the ground when you sprint
My first disk brake bike was a dog. Cable actuated crap nugget brick. My latest hydraulic disk break is lighter and faster than my old rim and I’d never go back. But it is a lot more expensive but time/inflation makes up a good part of that.
46:30 Camera this size still looks big-ish, but tolerable. Great on that tiny little part that splits off. The brick you've shown bit earlier? G, does it do IMAX and requires 48 mm film rollers spinning?
Anecdotally, I built an aero disc electronic Chinese bike for 2.5k EUR. 36cm cockpit, carbon cranks, wide gp5000, tpu, the whole thing. I'm spending the summer riding with friends in french mountains. I smoke everyone on the flat and straight downhills. Aethos disc, supersix rim, Look rim, canyon gravel disc, friends who have genetic engines far, far stronger than mine. So, yeah, all the marginal gains from new tech all put together results in a MASSIVE difference. To the point where I feel bad overtaking people who're just way stronger than me. And if you had to chinertown forum, you can build stuff for cheap, assuming you have that nerd factor to do your own shop work and all.
New disc brake bike is faster but not because of disc brakes but in spite of them. Also, I don't believe that wider tires are much better if road is not very bad. 5 W difference from rolling resistance only is a stretch on my opinion. It certainly makes sense to go for a larger tire when desired pressure would mean risk for pinch flats, but other reasons are debatable. In theory wider wheel has two aerodynamic disadvantages: larger frontal area and worse thickens-to-chord ratio. But it can also have one advantage: gap between tire and frame will be smaller. So both could be faster but in theory narrow wheels with optimized frame still win.
couple of things to clarify. Big Blu is sponsored by cadex so most likely he will go to jayco alula. I think this is a combo deal with trainer Olav Alexander. He is a good friend of Head of performance in bora Dan Lorang. This might be big step forward fo Jayco. My question is how Kristian is planing to fight against small-big boys Jonas and Pog. When Kristian was starting in long distance he was 78kg in the Olympics 74-75 kg. If he will be able to get to 70kg still math is not in his favor 70*7 =490w for 60min. No idea what is possible but this sounds a bit unrealistic. Excluding other factors like riding in the bunch, covering moves etc. Wining stages for sure but GC in TDF hard to imagine but if not him than who. On the disc break vs rim Break debate. Difference in current climbing bike and aero bike are around 15-20w. I never saw data if this is inline with rim break bikes bbut I don't se9e the reason why not. Taking that into account what Jessi tested his 20w difference is now around 0-5w (difference hard to detect). Actually I can perform such test as I have propel adv sl 2016 and dogma x 2024 ( if this bike qualify for you). From my perspective dogma is better bike overall bigger tires and thur axels add a lot confidence on downhills. Bike is more comfortable than Propel and has better gearing (11-34) on the rear, very nice for heavy boar and long rides in the Alps :). Advantage for rim brake bike is simplicity (maintenance) for me this is not the biggest Problem as I am doing everything alone but definitely working on new bike takes much more time. And Price is also significant difference. I Had good deal on giant and in 2015(-40% from sticker) I paid three times less than for dogma (for which I had also good price -25% from sticket). And At the end if someone ask if dogma is 2 or 3 times better simple answer no. Thats the problem for this industrie.
No one is gonna convince me that having more surface area in contact with terra firma is gonna equate to the same rolling resistance. I wonder if tractors have the same mpg as a family saloon.
Comparing two different bikes … is not about the brakes … at least use the same bike frames if you’re going to make a comparison… My gravel bike has 32 mm tyres .. for recovery rides it’s nice but I prefer 25mm and rim on road .. by far
Slower, because the TCR is a slow frame. New disc one is even slower if not a top build, because of the added weight. A Canyon Aeroad rimbrake modell from 2015-2020 (tested 206-208watts by Tour Mag), with proper wheels is faster and lighter then this China bike and much cheaper too.
Imagining Blummenfelt trying to follow the wheels Pogacar or Pidcock going down a mountain... Wondering if Jesse still hits the concept2 erg these days?
Wouldn't it be nice if there were 2 identical Giant TCRs one with disk and one with rim brakes that you could test. Solving an equation with 20+ variables is impossible.
to be fair, yeah you boys are a bit out of tune with most peoples reality, it isn't just you though, anyone who has a 10k+ bike and I wouldn't really take the opinions of those who ride around centennial as they are all elitist for the most part. From a purely performance standpoint sure the full modern 10-20k package gets you that. You know, there was an alternative, evolve the rim bike to fit the larger tires and whatever else (everything other than disc part), why couldn't everything be that way? the industry just decided to put in an enormous load of faff and BS to raise prices. Id be happy to ride a modern era bike, just cant justify the cost like most people.
To me the main issue is just the price point to performance ratio. Granted I don't race but I enjoy training and pushing myself. The top end models are better, but as Jesse said the entry to mid range disc bikes are just horrendously specced. I was recently looking in to the lastest supersix with 105 di2, 4K at over 8kg, add on to that decent wheels, power meter bars, saddle tires etc.. you're pushing over 6K€, which is the price that i payed for a new Sworks venge in 2020 with ultegra di2. In my eyes the underlying problem is the insane price creep that has just pushed up the price point for the enthusiast cyclist that enjoys a nice ride.
5:06 “it’s just faster. Hands down” lmfao dude was in denial for years. “It can’t be faster” now look at him 😂 had to make a whole spread sheet himself and this common knowledge. Welcome to the light.
Here are my bike priorities 1) Bike Fit 2) Reliability 3) Beauty 4) Aero 5) Weight. My definition for fit is position on the bike for optimum power and comfort.
Imagine switch to deep wheels optimized for 25 mm tires, another 20W saved. Nobody ride wide tires at same or even near pressure like narrow tires, so always RR will be bigger for wider tires. Ah, you cannot use 25 mm tires on disc brake bike, it would ride like a plank.
Calling Pidcock a failed road racer is just pure shade. How many make it pro? How many perform at the level that Pidcock does? Strade Bianchi, Tour stage, Amstel Gold, like that ain't failed whatsoever.
It is all relative. He seems to have huge potential and it looks like he is underperforming. That is the failed part. The same way roglic is being criticized. I would not call him a failed talent, but I do see why people are disappointed
To be clear, this is more a comparison between an aero bike and a non aero bike, the non-aero bike just happens to be a rim brake one in this case. There is a reason why the pros use the propel and not the TCR...
I think the arguments are almost the same. With the updated UCI regulations regard tube shape ratios, older UCI approved bike will never be as aero as more modern bikes, regardless of rims or disks. But because the change happened as disk brakes became the norm, rim brake bikes in general are going to be older and therefore less aero
It’s also not the point. Once we start comparing “aero rim brake bikes” you are entering the world of integration with rim brakes. That brings with it a whole myriad of proprietary solutions such as brakes mounted next to bottom brackets. Most people agree Jesse’s 2016 TCR represented a very high performing rim brake bike. Anyway, we made our point, if you still think there is a pure performance gain to running a rim brake bike in 2024, it’s on you.
I'm with Chris on the coaching thing. It's mindboggling that Jesse as a coach says that he won't sit through 45 minutes of race footage to see where a gap should have been closed. For most riders learning how to race will do way more in terms of getting results than increase their FTP by another 10 watts.
As usual good banter rim V disc. I have both and like my disc brake. It simply is better to ride but spends more time in the bike shop than my rim brake bikes. I have invested a lot in my rim brake bikes and even had two custom made. I don’t race at my age anymore so not looking for the extra watts. My Parlee z Zero is 5.9kg…but it doesn’t matter anymore! The MAIN thing is to ride them. Love this show and respect you are professional riders but most of us are not. Keep up the great content.
12 months ago I transitioned from black road shoes to white coloured road shoes. During dry conditions a quick 30 second wipe with a Wet One every 2-3 rides keeps them looking pristine. Wet weather = black shoes and black socks.
I've been riding disc brake bikes since 2015, currently have four of them, honestly it takes about a minute to change brake pads and the only bleeding I've ever done is remove the screw at the top of the reservoir once every six months and check if there is a bubble and add a few drops of hydraulic fluid, tap the levers a few times and done, about a minute a side, it takes a lot longer to replace rim brake pads and they also need periodic alignment with the rim to be sure they are contacting evenly, it's not a valid argument and I really have to question just how incompetent people are with their bike maintenance.
I know. I really don't understand when people talk about maintenance. Plus, since it's a closed system, you don't need to bleed nearly as often as you would need to change brake cables. The only counter argument is if you're traveling with a bike, discs may get knocked around and need to be re-trued.
Last year I went from a cervelo rca to a factor ostro vam. 25mm tubeless GP5ks up to 30s (measured 32s on enve rims with a 25mm internal). The tire difference is honestly the largest noticeable change between the two bikes. The difference in comfort going up to a wider tire kind of blew me away honestly. I resisted discs for a while because I've always been a bit of a weightweenie, but the factor is faster and just more comfortable. I think in a lot of cases it's similar to the initial resistance that I (and I'm sure a lot of others) had to Di2. We have this sort of romantic notion of what a bike should be based on what bikes used to look like when we started riding, and it can be hard to get over that. I convinced myself that mechanical gears were a purer expression of a bike and that needing to charge a bike was an absurd notion. That the click of the shifter was more satisfying. That I couldn't afford the weight penalty, etc. But Di2 is just better. I tried it one time on a buddy's bike and immediately knew I wanted to switch. With tires I don't think the subjective feel difference is as stark as mechanical vs Di2 and the data on tire width impacting rolling resistance and aerodynamics probably hasn't been around long enough to override the years of conventional wisdom that skinny tires pumped to absolute hell are the fastest you can be. But it's inevitable at this point I think. People will come around on them not being slower. And once you ride 32s on a rough surface, you'll never want to go back to 25s imo. At least I don't.
This is interesting. I have the 2nd gen RCA rim brake version with Enve tubeless. I have latex tubes because I can’t stand the tubeless liquid mess and maintenance. I think it’s the same for disc brakes. I don’t live in a super hilly area and hardly ever ride in the rain. I also have mechanical 9100 Dura Ace which I absolutely love. The action and braking are really the peak of rim braking. It’s a reason why I’m still stuck on rim brakes. I admit the RCA is more heritage and looks than actual speed. I was faster on probably more comfortable on my old SL3.
Agree the RCA is just a sexy bike. To the point where even though I don't ride it anymore, I can't bring myself to part with it. It is an odd thing. I like my factor more than the RCA by every criteria that matters to me. It's more comfortable. It's faster. I enjoy the 'locked in' feeling of riding an aero bike. But there's something just intangible about a frame like the RCA. As much as I love the factor, I'm not emotionally attached to it the same way I am with the cervelo.
Di2 is the thing that I thought would never make a difference. And I absolutely would never ever go back... Even if you give me a free brand new top end frame of any choice I would instantaneously spend the money to put Di2 on it
Agree on Di2. I jumped in on 12 speed (after a decade on Chorus 11 speed mechanical) and boy is it amazing. Never going back to mechanical on a roadie (11 speed XT mechanical on a flat bar however is very good but as soon as Shimano releases their next Di2 wireless MTB groups I’m all in as well)
in the podcast you don't mention skin tension in your tire talk. 60 PSI in a 32m is the 100 psi of a 25m. its the same approximate tension. I've been on 30m on the road for 3 years. 55-60 psi is just slower than 48=50 psi because the rolling resistance is too much at the higher pressure. if you are in a fast group ride, areo just doesn't matter that much. I've averaged 23mph on 30m road tires and on 38m gravel tires in drop group rides. I've raced gravel on 38m tires and on 2.35 Mezcal MTB tires and a 100mm travel fox 32 fork, on the same 70 mile course that is 60% road and had the same 16.5mph average on both. It just doesn't matter. Skinny tires just don't offer any advantage in the real world. High pressures are a liabilty off of the track.
27:21 2014 SuperSix Evo Hi-Mod - new $9750 account for inflation that is $12,940 today. Bikes were always expensive, inflation is a bitch. Milk used to cost $1. Reverse it: Jesse's Tavelo is $5000 (2024) in 2014 dollars would be $3770. What could you buy in 2014 new? 2014 Cannondale CAAD 10 Black Inc $4100 Equal dollars, accounting for inflation- Is the Tavelo a better value today than the CAAD 10 in 2014? Specialized is selling the Tarmac SL7 Sport for $3800 Definitely some great things about rim brake bikes but the math ain't mathing if you think stuff was cheaper. Life just is more expensive for everything unfortunately.
True, because modern rim brakes from 105 up on alu rim are miles better than 105 disk. I have bikes with both (Caad 13 disk 105, TCR disk 105, and Caad Optimo with rim 105) and on descents i much more prefer the rim brakes.
@@Kf1rr that could be for you. As a rider that is well over 100kg but still put in over 10,000km last year, the difference was on the edge of life/death. This was Shimano Ultegra rim vs Shimano Ultegra Disc...the pucker factor on the rim was WAY higher.
I moved from rim brake TCR to a disc bike. I still have both bikes and keep telling myself they are both good bike and "I should take my TCR out sometime". But every time, I just keep taking my disc bike out and say to my old TCR: "maybe next time".
@@simonq588 just this morning I almost crashed onto a crazy motorbike rider. Riding in a busy city is full of surprises. Aside from being nimble, one needs stopping power, just in case some idiots show up in front of you suddenly.
The truest sentiment about bikes that "feel" fast will always be that people want bikes that feel like the bike they had when they were at their most fit.
When it comes to a new bike vs. a new bike. Some are the same as me, "to upgrade from my rim bike, get the same quality or better, is way too much money". "Perhaps a used rim bike, newer makes more sense?"
Guillaume Martin LOOK blade + Apparently Cofidis went 'back to black' for the team bikes after first week of the Tour to save a little weight over the new Satin white scheme. I had wondered why they switched. Yes, he has retracted most of his statement, to basically saying it was a 'bit heavy', for stage 11 where he lost 45 secs to the Pog group. He has posted on his Instagram a video of the weight of his bike and it shows 7.23kg. He was definitely 'look'-ing for a reason to excuse his performance, ready to leave to a new team!
