@@mousetreehouse6833 former or not he in this act took his shirt off and once again danced as a stripper would, just because he then after that put a sword down his throat doesn't negate that he first danced as a stripper would.
I think the real controversy was that when Driscoll decided to take a stronger men’s approach and say “hey maybe a stripper doing a pole routine with a phallic item in his throat isn’t particularly godly” he was kicked off stage, to the crowd’s dismay. I think Driscoll’s assessment was slightly exaggerated and that Driscoll is a controversial figure and might’ve only made his stand to morally grandstand, but I don’t necessarily think that he’s entirely wrong. There was an inherently sexual stench to the routine and the fact that an actual stripper was hired might’ve been out of line for a Christian conference. That said, that routine wasn’t anything out of the ordinary for an acrobat to perform. Poles and swords and minimal clothes are common for that kind of a routine.
After all the excitement is over, and the entertainment is over, and everyone goes home, what has been gained? We need something to help us get through every single day, the good ones and the bad ones. And at the end of the day, it's still boils down to prayer and knowing God. A man's strength comes from his connectedness to God.
I agree with you, but I wouldn't dismiss the entrainment experience easily. It's not just entertainment as in the same one could do alone in front of tv, but also a sense of group, co-presence, the energy of the live show... Such experiences - also like theatre, concert, game - do being something. There's also a value in collectively sharing and releasing emotion, there's something 'cleansing' (or cathartic to use Aristotlian term of the power of theatre experience) But of course, I agree, God is still greater, abd the true nourishment of the soul doesn't come in the loud show but as you just said, prayer and knowing God.👍🙏🧡
Men will fix it or not, but it is a man's issue not in the domain of women. It will never be fixed by a man that had a women point it out to him, because they are followers, not leaders.
It wasn't so much the monster trucks, it was the former gay stripper taking off his shirt, swallowing a sword, and climbing a pole. Many of us don't see anything spiritually edifying in that.
Your producers failed to tell you the issue that brought this to everyone's attention. They're opener was a stripper from Las Vegas who did a pole show and sword swallowing Act. And then when it was called out by one of the speakers that speaker was banished from the conference.
@@vanmoody It was not a stripper performance per se, though he did rip off his shirt. it was a pole strength exercise. There is video out there. The problem is they hired a stripper from Las Vegas to do this display. People are now saying he was a convert. And then there was also he did sword swallowing. It was just weird.
I've been attending our Catholic Diocese Christian Men's conference for years (they stopped during Covid, but they're back.) It is NOT intended to be "entertainment". It is 8 hours once a year with Christian motivational speakers, Mass with our Bishop, and Adoration. Ours is called "Accept the Challenge". It is designed to increase one's spiritual strength and faith and to help usbecome better men for the good of our families. It's not some testosterone-fueled MMA cage match. It's done in reverence to our Lord. I always take my youngest son. (the other 2 sons moved away) It's a very meaningful, holy, spiritual experience that we both look forward to and missed for 3 years. We (and most of the other attendees, I'm sure) come away much stronger "manly-men". After all, real men are the providers, the protectors of our loved ones and we should be the role models, too.
Sounds like simp festival. "Manly men" what doe that mean? If you want Manly men, send them into the military - Into war preferably. "You might die,and you might get wounded , but by God your going to fight." George Patton.
"The only real problem is its not addressing the real crisis " ? Really... not the male stripper following the sword at a "church event"? I also agree that none of this is serious or what men need but I'm actually in disbelief that Michael didn't have more of an issue with that.
Sometimes it surprises me how poorly this show does background research. This is the conference that had the guy stripper come this year and kicked off the pastor that called them out. That's why the conference is trending right now.
Inform yourselves before commenting plz. Former stripper--converted Christian with a family did a knife swallowing act. Ps Driscoll did not find this out until later. Should not have interrupted..was called out by the Pastor of JRC for not being informed...
@@HisGlory768 former or not, he still in this act took his shirt off and danced as a stripper would on this stage. just cause he swallow a big knife doesn't defeat the fact he took his shirt off and danced on the pole first.
@@HisGlory768inform YOURself dear. The “former stripper” did a strip pole dance at a Christian event… no one cares that he is a reformed sinner, people are offended that he performed his sin on stage at a Christian event. Ironic that you tell others to be informed when you obviously avoided the real issue.
I’ve been an evangelical Christian for 50 years now. I’ve observed that men who are newer to a “commitment” to Christ and usually guys younger than 40 tend to go for this type of superficial, “entertaining” kind of events. But as they mature in their relationship with Jesus Christ, they desire to attend events that are spiritually meatier and that encourage a deeper faith! This crazy event reminds me of a verse that St Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 13:11 - “When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child and understood like a child. But when I became a MAN, I gave up childish things!” Life is going to get rough soon, we need sober and spiritually serious men, NOT childish boys.
No offense Michael, I love you man, but you missed the point on why people are talking about this conference. There was an opening act that was similar to a male strip show, and Pastor Mark Driscoll got kicked off stage for calling it out. That is what people are talking about.
@@simplyshirene8833 the nation should just split in two and have the religious conservative side and let the other half be the progressive non-religious side. Build a giant wall between the two and don't have contact with each other.
Having a stripper on a pole at an event to "get you closer to God" is disgusting. Secondarily, what is disgusting is the "need" for ENTERTAINMENT in the church! By the way, this is the exact same problem that I have with most youth groups in churches. I remember as a teenager going to youth group and HUNGERING to learn about God, to pray with fellow believers, and to be given insight into the Bible. Instead it was game nights, hang out time, and activities with a few songs and a shallow and feel good Bible "study" tacked on. Talk to some teenagers. They actually are hungry for truth, but aren't finding it at church because the church FALSELY believes that kids just want to be entertained. When I got older, they were advertising for their women's conference (which I considered going to) but then they literally said, "don't worry, we won't be praying and reading the Bible and listening to sermons the whole time... We will have fun too!" WHAT?!?!?!? As a Christian learning about and knowing God should be the MOST fulfilling, joy filled, and fun thing you do! There's nothing wrong with some entertainment or games. But the attitude should never be "now let's forget this God stuff so we can actually have fun." If that's the attitude you have toward God, something needs to change. And I have to say it... It's the lukewarm church that thinks unbelievers want entertainment... No. People are CRAVING TRUTH. They are HUNGRY for it. And they go to church and get entertainment and some silly shallow sermon and think, "this is no different than the world" and leave and never come back. Or, they join, but for all the wrong reasons. People don't need entertainment. People need the gospel. And they don't need it watered down either. All they need is truth. Jesus is Truth.
I couldn’t agree with you more. I grew up in church (still attend) but I didn’t like youth group for quite the same reasons you just listed. It seemed the only “spiritual guidance” we received regularly was the “sex is bad” message. That’s a side note… But yes, I recall very little encouragement and guidance in the way of studying Gods word.
@@cavaleirosemlicenca3894 sorry, I'm confused by your comment. It's not an exaggeration that there was a stripper on a pole at a "Christian" men's conference. I agree we shouldn't export such behaviour, nor should we have it here.
I’m a staunch Protestant but I agree with Michael 100%!!! 💪☺️♥️ That whole thing is such an embarrassment to Protestantism 🤦♂️ along with most “evangelical” & mega churches!! 👎
I'm a man raising two men ages 13 and 15. I wake my sons up every morning after I have read for 1hr, the men in our house read the Bible and talk about what we learned. Then we do an online Hillsdale collage class together and talk about what we learned. Then we do 30 mins of exercises. My sons helped plant the garden last weekend and we are getting five pigs tomorrow. If you want men to be manly raise them to know their place. Men make war and peace, we break and heal, we threaten and protect, we are productive, educated, and caring. We stand before God and give account of ourselves and humbly ask for wisdom, strength and forgiveness. We walk by faith. Some will critique what I say, I don't care. I don't need a pole dancer with swords to tell me how to be masculine. God made it my nature to be manly.
@@johnowens5342 What is prayer? It is talking to God and being honest with Him. It is also asking Him for strength and forgiveness as you said. One aspect of prayer which Jesus says in the Lord's Prayer is a prayer for the Kingdom of God to be realized.
I can't tell anything from this clip because I don't know what the actual teaching was. I do think men need spaces and events that are just for them, so they can be encouraged and strengthened in Christ.
@edm3673 actually 0% of men can have kids. If a man is sterile and cannot father children then he can put in the years of hard work to become the type of individual that younger men and teens can look to as a mentor.
Michael, I think what you just reacted to was the advertisement for the conference. I think you’d have a more informed opinion on it if you went to the conference or watched a recording of it. Yes?
We live in Ozark, MO, this whole men’s conference is in our back yard at MSU’s arena, which is in Springfield, which is super close to us. There is a lot of controversy over this event, especially Mark Driscoll.
As a young woman, it seems to me that what you said at 4:32 to 4:50 is particularly true. I see a lot of bros in t-shirts, tank tops, and cargo shorts. Those aren't inherently bad... but I bet it would've made a HUGE difference if one night or day of the event had a suit requirement. On one day of the event, every man and boy dresses to the nines. Not in a flashy or boasting way, but to show them the _value_ of dressing well, with _intention_ and _care._ The way you dress has great influence on how you think and what you feel, about yourself _and_ everything around you. Dressing well, in clothes that fit well and say "I respect myself and everyone I'm with", would be an _invaluable_ lesson for men nowadays. Dressing more formally, in clothes that fit, commands respect. You hold yourself to a higher standard in good clothes, and other people treat you with more respect _AND higher expectations._
It looks like a lot of the world there. Do y'all really think Jesus would accept this? How much were the tickets to attend. How much money did they pay for all the entertainment? Re-read your bible cause from Jesus example he would turn over tables!!!!
I think jesus might be mildly entertained possibly. But to say this was holy or Godly is what it truly means to take the lords name in vain. In a few years this will standard Sunday service. But remember Michael is catholic not christian.
@@Riley_Mundt atheism is a logical fallacy. Your religion is the worship of self. Faulty, limited and without center. What then, is the point of life if there exists nothing greater than yourself? Why have any kind of social order? You should be working towards amassing as many sensual pleasures as you are able before your ultimate end and nothingness. Why are you wasting your time making this comment? Tick tock, tick tock…..that’s the sound of your doom.
Ruslan covered this very thoroughly. Its very sad that the leadership would approve an act where a man stripped off his top, danced around the pole, hanging in the shape of an inverted cross. Forget about the sword swallowing. We need to get back to having the Spirit confirming The Word with signs and wonders.
It was a show,not church, pictures of cars, fireworks, just silly stuff sprinkled with Jesus. It's stuff like this that made look into catholicism/ eastern orthodoxy.
Men can learn manliness in a culture that is below poverty levels. It's more fundamental and does not require a flavor of American excess to be learned and taught--much the opposite.
The Daily Wire want men not to retire, work 70 hours a week and just go to church every Sunday until they drop dead. Can't we have a little fun, would that be OK? Not all us like to just drink, dance on our desks and play the sitar.
My Husband attended the men’s confrence for the SSPX in Feb here in Canada. I think it’s great for men to get away and learn how to be leaders in their homes, how to pray, how to discern God’s will etc. It shouldn’t be a circus, entertainment etc but a chance to grow in faith with other men and to go back home renewed and refreshed for their roles as Husbands and Fathers etc. This one from the clips seems very…showy…hopefully some men gained something from it lol.
Michael, you said "I'd go to the boxing match, anyway." I think you just proved the point of the entertainment. Men who would normally not go to a men's conference, may go if there is boxing, for example. There is also really good, sound teaching in between.
2 Timothy 4:3-4 King James Version (KJV) For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
That is actually the problem with these conferences, the lack of responsibility and accountability from the local church. The churches are supposed to be local and independent aka small and personal. Men of THE FAITH are connected through Jesus Christ our Lord, but there is no need for body of whomever conglomerating. That's GOD's job, not man.
Watching the conference clip, my gut reaction is, CRINGE. Grated on my nerves on so many levels. You are absolutely right, Mr. Knowles; I agree with everything you said. Strength comes from God and building a godly character.
This is one of the few times I disagree with Michael on both takes. First off he didn't talk about the actual controversy from the conference. Second the point of the conference wasn't to have a stoicism lecture. It was time for men to relax, learn about God, and release their pent up stress though fun. The extravagant events were also to bring people to the conference. Last it was mainly speakers, prayer and worship those clips were highlights that took up maybe 10% of the conferences. To his second point I think younger people are preferable to older people especially when talking about the extremes. I would much rather have a fiery 20 or 30 year old than a 70, 80, or 90 year old. Secondly I disagree with his point that we are less educated than the founding fathers we are far better educated on economics, philosophy, and politics. I think people especially conservatives romanticize the revolutionary period. Except for their use of our language they were incredibly dumb compared to Americans now
I am amazed by the individual and collective wisdom and high moral qualities of all of the DW hosts. When the absolute insanity gets me down, I am renewed by the knowledge that there are more people with traditional values than there are sick freaks.
My father and grandfather are and were the pinnacle of being what a man is supposed to be, a hard worker who takes responsibility for both himself and those who rely on him. They both achieved that without religion, because religion goes directly against that responsibility. The notion that "everything will be okay because god loves you" promotes laziness. If you want to foster the principles which make up the "ideal man," you won't find it in a church, you'll find it in service porch or the attic, where a husband is fixing the HVAC or the water heater. You won't find it in the sports bar or the boxing ring, because it's in the garage, where a father is helping his child build a boxcar or is refinishing a cradle for the kid who is on the way. You won't find it at the rock concert in the 16,000 seat arena, because it is in the school auditorium, where another father is watching his child's music recital. To paraphrase my father: fuck god, go do your job.
Titus 2:11-14 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
I've seen a video showing clips from the sword-swallower's performance, Mark Driscoll's rebuke, Lindell's response, and the crowd's response. I have seen non-sexualized sword-swallowing acts that were impressive demos of training and skill. So I don't have a problem with sword-swallowing acts in general. I do think the one at that conference, while NOT a strip show, was sexualized. It actually creeped me out to hear the crowd of men cheering as another man ripped his shirt off. However, judging from the crowd's response to the rebuke, pride, anger, and obsession with spectacle are were the conference's worst problem. If the responses to Driscoll's rebuke are any indication, I think the conference was filled with a spirit of ungodly anger and ungodly pride. Mark Driscoll was right to rebuke the conference. I think the crowd was a LOT more interested in prideful spectacles than in CHRIST. At best, they are spiritual infants.
So we are going to ignore the sensual and grotesque opening act? Normally, i respect his views, but this one i have to disagree with. If i turned the tv on and saw that playing, I would immediately switch it off and would have had no idea it had ANYTHING to do with the Lord. God is not mocked. Im hoping that someone just failed to mention to him what the outrage is about.
Well the biggest thing going on is that mens conference literally had a male stripper swallowing a sword on stage for one of their opening of the conference this year and Pastor Mark Driscoll called it out as he should have! And now everyone is attacking that Pastor which is mind blowing i live where that church is at its called James River Church and its been saying that they have prayed ppls fingers and toes back that weren't there 🤦🏼♀️ and i have friends who go there and they are always trying to get me and my husband to go and we have a couple times but its not a good place and turned into kind of a cult like church tbh! Sad days we live in that's for sure we need the Lord more now than ever 🙏😢
Those men claiming to be Christian as they say false teachings. That one dude says we can change & impact the world that is a false statement right there. Only, Jesus Christ has changed and impacted the world no one else could Christ only.
I went to a Christian healing meeting once and the pastor was doing his best Anthony Robbins impersonation(apologies to Anthony Robbins). It was nauseating. This reminds me of that.
So all the monster trucks, boxing, and other entertainment at the event I see within the add as a means to catch the men that really need this. You show up for the monster trucks and get a lesion on God. I could be wrong on this but that is what I hope it is and the impression I got from the add.
I went to one a few years ago .. the opening entertainment lasted about 30 min. Following that was usually an interview with a Christian pro athlete. Closing first day with a sermon. Day two is about for sermons (speakers) and the sport event as the closer.
Watch Pastor Mark Driscoll. Trinity Church Ssottsdale, Arizona. The feminist movement confused and beat men down. Men need to be reminded or taught what they were created to be.
Pastor Mark reproved the conference, he didn't necessarily reprove the former striper or the pastor of that church publicly. However that pastor of the church was hypocritical with Mark and has done everything he accused Mark about. That pastor also twisted scripture about repentance of a brother. He was demanding an apology rather than a change. I agree with Mark, in that I'm not sure what ripping your shirt off, swollowing a sword and climbing a pole has to do with being a Christian man. Seems kinda gay striperish to me.
The hugest red flag is this guy saying he careful to not criticize those the lord has annointed.. ..are you kidding me. Leaders do not get a free pass from criticism. Did we learn NOTHING from Ravi?
When you get beyond the cringe this was actually super meaningful. A group of men who all know they’re sick but have no idea what the cure is. And in fact are probably making it worse.
Michael: You totally missed the video clip of the gay male Vegas stripper pole taking off his shirt and pole dancing before the audience of men! You missed the ball on this one Michael! You got some 'slainin' to do' MIkey! Let me repeat: The controversy is over the Las Vegas male stripper who pole danced at the Men's conference!
Did I mention that they had a gay male stripper pole dancing before the audience of men? At The Stronger Men's Conference! Did I mention they had a gay male stripper-pole dancing before the men?
Everyone seems to be an expert on how to live a fun life. All those experts immediately disappear when there is a problem like an illness. Nobody in our society seems to be willing to deal with serious issues like pain and suffering. Everyone is just interested in the prosperity gospel.
“What is a “strong man” in the Bible? In the canonical gospels of Matthew, Mark, and Luke, this parable forms part of the Beelzebul controversy, where Jesus's opponents accuse him of gaining his power to exorcise demons by being in league with Satan. In a common Interpretation, the strong man represents Satan, and the attacker represents Jesus.” I rest my case, Your Honor.
To be honest tho we need to 180 masculinity so I think this over the top stuff is fine but eventually tone down once our youth starts coming back and make it more serious and less flashy
