Naked Bible Podcast 224 - The Falling Away and the Restrainer 

He is one of the finest and most meticulous exegete of our generation. We were blessed to have him for a while.

Wow!!! This was awesome and a huge eye opener for me. Well done Dr Heiser. You are missed!!!!

We all must do out part and spread the good news..

I feel blessed listening to your podcast, great work Michael, I love the way you communicate the subject with your audience.

“If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;” ‭‭Colossians‬ ‭1:23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I absolutely agree with you, Dr. Hesiser! AMEN!

This is old, but I just found it and enjoyed it. I hope you're still making videos.

Awesome teaching indeed! All praises to our very patient God and His awesome will for all His children.

Simply amazing!!! 😮❤❤❤ Praise God!!! 🥰

This was excellent, as always, for a parsing of the Biblical text. It does however, make me thankful that I attend a church with a strong history and foundation of catechesis and teaching doctrine, because the restrainer is obvious in this case- the Holy Spirit. (Spoiler alert... the capitalization in some translations give it away). I can see however, people who are used to believing that faith in itself are their own works, or that baptism is a work of obedience, or that we are saved by the decision bell would maybe find the answer to the question about the identity of the restrainer surprising. But with the right doctrine of the role of the Holy Spirit in creating and sustaining faith, it is obvious - if the Apostasy or falling away is what precedes the rise of the Antichrist, what helps people keep their faith so they do not apostasize? The Holy Spirit, of course!

If I understood Heiser correctly, he thinks 2 Thess 2:1 (the Lord appearing and our gathering to him) is the second coming because Paul had Isaiah 66 in his head when he wrote 2 Thess 1:6-9 (God setting everything straight at the second coming), and the restrainer is about how God is holding the Antichrist back until the fullness of the Gentiles comes in? But Paul also mentioned giving them tribulation and us rest in 2 Thess 1:6-9, which describes the rapture following by the great tribulation, so I think these verses span 3.5 years from the rapture/manifestation of the Antichrist thru his destruction at the second coming. Paul did the same thing in 2 Thess 2:8, where he described both the manifestation and destruction of the Antichrist in one sentence. I believe the restraining is about the fullness of the Gentiles coming in, which is the rapture, and that’s when the Jewish slumber towards the gospel will lift. In the short period of time between the rapture and manifestation of the abomination and Antichrist, a number of Jews will read the New Testament for answers, and because their eyes were opened at the rapture, they’ll understand and accept Jesus. This explains why Jesus left a warning to Israeli Jews (the vast majority of whom don’t believe) to understand and flee when they see these signs that start the great tribulation.

Good call on Andy Stanley!!! False teacher without doubt!

I know this is an old video, but youtube just got around to suggesting it. Anyways, I really do like your style of teaching and I agree that we can't do exegesis in a vacuum. Having said that, it sort of took me by surprise that you didn't even take a glance at Daniel 12:1, especially since one of the options that you gave for the restrainer was the archangel Michael. This is pretty much THE source of that teaching. Taken with Revelation 12:7, what we see is that Michael, forced to do battle with Satan in heaven, will be "taken" from his primary duty as protector of the people "whose name is written in the book". Satan will loose this war, be thrown down from heaven, and give his authority to the Beast. "Wow to you earth and sea! For the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time". This will be the time of great testing that Jesus is wanting us to stand firm. Even though the Christians of that time will face horrendous tribulation, God will cut that time short and we will be delivered. "So when you see the sign of the Son of man coming in the clouds, look up for your redemption draweth nigh" Luke 21:27-28

Not sure where we go with questions but one that I have is that you says there are are lots of questions that can’t be answered with regards to end times. So what if any are we sure things in your mind with regards to end times. Jesus’ return, tribulation, millennium, etc. What are the sure things vs tradition and guess work. Would be a good show. Thx.

Heiser us/was a great Bible scholar but I don't think his ultimate answer as to the "Restrainer" is correct. Paul refers to someone restraining the "man of lawlessness", not the birth of Zion's children. And if the restrainer is God, then how would the restrainer be taken out of the way? (That all happens according to God's plan goes without saying.)

Thank you so much. !!!

How odd... that something that has been on my heart for a long time - the popular local notion of "once saved, always saved" - is addressed in the Scripture you cite here. I have grown to understand that Salvation is a process, not an earned state-of-being ... more like a verb than a noun. I've had a few discussions with professing Christians who use the term "once saved, always saved" as an unspoken 'out', trying to reconcile their notion with lesson of the Parable of the Foolish Virgins/et al. It doesn't. 2 Corinthians 2:15 "We are among those who *are being* saved and those who are perishing" says it all. Thanks.

Sooo good! Thank you Dr. Heiser, shalom.

Amen

He is so great like Enoch now, teaching the sons of God. Im tired of those who think they know but only teach that which agrees with the religious narrative they hold.

I have always heard that "the Restrainer" is the Holy Spirit. So if Mike concludes that God is the "Restrainer" then does this conclude that God as the Holy Spirit - the Restrainer; that take the lawless one out of the way?

I never heard it is God who is restraining but specifically the Holy Spirit that is restraining and is taken away. Thus, the church is "raptured" before the great tribulation. Can anyone help me understand this?

Pre wrath..Zephaniah 2:1-3 1Gather yourselves together, yea, gather together, O nation not desired; 2Before the decree bring forth, before the day pass as the chaff, before the fierce anger of the LORD come upon you, before the day of the LORD'S anger come upon you. 3Seek ye the LORD, all ye meek of the earth, which have wrought his judgment; seek righteousness, seek meekness: it may be ye shall be hid in the day of the LORD'S anger.

The longer I listened to this explanation of 2th2, the more it went in circles, filled with suppositions and inferences, but no solid hermeneutical interpretation. Why? You need the Historicist frame.

But how could God (he that restrains) be "taken out of the way" in verse 7? Who would take him out of the way? Clarification please

ITS NOT TALKING ABOUT CHURCH OF PENTACOST!! It’s speaking of the 1000 yr reign! The GOOD GRAIN AN CLEAN VESSEL?? Sanctified justified people!! Vessels !! THERE WILL NEVER BE A TEMPLE MADE OF HANDS !

What is that? A flock of ducks imploded?

So when Paul says the son of perdition is revealed and then he goes on to say what the son of perdition does in the temple. Is Paul giving a description of how the son of perdition will be revealed?

this could be completely off base (i haven’t studied this out or anything), but is it possible that the apostasia of 2 thess. is something that happens in the spirit world and not the corporeal world? therefore, with this in mind, that the events of revelation 12 are somehow related?

Not one of your best pieces. I know you want Isaiah 66 to be in Thessalonians, but that's a big assumption on your part and really doesn't make the Restrainer fit with what restrains, though it made sense to you. It's just not there. You created a massive red herring argument, and then didn't really defend it at all. The first part was great, but the Restrainer one was a rabbit hole that was better left avoided.

Its the Holy Spirit, who is the Restrainer ! Duh !

To the staff at The Naked Podcast. Where did you get the concept for the winged creature artwork? Many years ago i had an experience with a supernatural creature that closely resembles this. As soon as i saw the art work i was like “what??!” Thanks in advance.

So God is the "restrainer"? Well, how is God doing that? Could it be the church that is taken away, ie., the rapture? Jesus said that you are salt of the earth. Salt is a spoilage preventative.

Saw I guy on TV. with a bright green Jesus sweater, curb stomping a female protester. That was tough to witness.

What about a picture of divorce as the apostasy?

This is my view for what it's worth. Rev 13:18 is not referring to 'a' singular man. There is no 'a' in the Greek text. It should be translated as man/mankind/humankind. Some translations have correctly ascribed it this way, though not many. Likewise, the phrase, 'man of lawlessness' is a personification, and not a literal 'man' - singular. It is a kingdom/empire of man/mankind. It is 'man pre-eminent'. Humankind - a united kingdom of man, himself, as was the rebellion (apostasia) at Babel (Babylon), a united rebellion against God the Creator and his Messiah. Of man's rebellion (apostasia) Paul writes in 2 Thess 2:4, 'He (again using the pronoun 'he' as a personification) will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God'. Speaking metaphorically, Paul is to saying that he, man/mankind, will think himself superior to the God who created him. Man's version of what is truth opposes the Word of God. These keys are given in Revelation itself using 'type and shadow' of the OT; The beast 'out of the sea', Rev 13:1, is; the complete chronological lineage of Gentile kingdoms which were to come (Daniel) and unite the world in rebellion to God, as at Babel (Babylon). It is the complete beast because it has been assigned the number 'seven', the number in scripture which symbolizes complete/completion/whole, as with the seven churches in Rev 1 being the complete church; seven days make a complete week; Jacob worked seven years to complete his servitude to Laban for Rachel, etc. So the beast 'out of the sea'- sea of Gentiles, is the complete chronological lineage of Gentile kingdoms, as described by Daniel, which were to come and unite the world in rebellion to God, as at Babel. The little horn (referred to as the antichrist) which grows to displace three others, the displacement of three is a description of it's power since the number three in scripture symbolizes strength, surety and stability, and thereby the little horn/power/kingdom starting as an eleventh horn/kingdom, displacing three, becoming an eighth kingdom; 11 -3 = 8. The number 'eight' symbolizes 'resurrection' and telling the reader that this 'little horn' is a resurrected kingdom. It is a kingdom 'which once was (at Babel, Babylon), now is not (at John's time of writing) but will come again (alluding again to its resurrection), Rev 17:11. *It is the kingdom that is 'an eighth kingdom, which belongs to the seven'. The 'little horn' grows to unite the world in rebellion (apostasia) to God as first attempted at Babel where God said, if they be united like this, as one, nothing will be impossible for them. *It is the resurrected kingdom of Babel (Babylon), signifed by being assigned the number eight. *It is the kingdom 'which was wounded by the sword, yet lived', when God went down to Babel and 'wounded' man/mankind's effort to unite, as one, by confusing his language and DISPERSING him over the face of the earth. Mankind, the humanistic spirit of man powered by the dragon, whose wound of dispersion has been healed and is back uniting as one world kingdom under his own headship, just as he first attempted at Babel. Man/mankind has his own gospel to preach to the world, which opposes the Word of God; liberty, equality and fraternity, apart from God. His gospel blasphemes the Word of God calling it archaic, barbaric and even unrighteous. The word of man purports to save humankind apart from God and his Christ, Jesus. This is the deception 'which will be worshipped as truth by all those who are perishing, because they loved the darkness instead of the light', 2 Thess 2. Cheers

The apostasy is when you lot took up the immortal soul, hell, politics and your three headed God. The apostasy came from the successors of the Apostles.

Since I'm stubborn I still think its the angel Michael 🥰 lol but this was great too!

The time for the gentile is when the 12 tribe israel becomes the 12 sign zodiac. Every one born is under king David

Well retrainer does not specifed for a reason.

This is how I understand 2Thessalonians 2:1-13. How do we interpret this present time? Is it Night or Day? Is it Winter or Summer? About the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, when we will be gathered with him, we ask you, brothers, to be not easily alarmed or unsettled in your mind by some spirit, words, or letter that it looks like they came from us, saying, "The Day of Christ is already here!" Don't be deceived by anyone or by anything, for that Day will not come until these two events took place: First, 'the people will completely rebel against the Law' then the 'man of lawlessness and the son doomed to destruction must be exposed'. He will oppose soon and exalt himself above any so-called gods or saints. He will set up himself in the church of God proclaiming he is the Most High. Don't you remember? I used to tell these things when I was still with you there. And you know the hindrance now so that he will be exposed at the appointed time. This power of lawlessness is already at work but it is hidden and the one who covers him now will continue to do so till this hindrance is taken out of the way. That will be the time for this spirit of wickedness to be revealed whom the Lord will overpower by the word of truth and destroy by the brightness of his Day! Now, about the reign of this evil one, it will be in accordance with Satan's power and will perform all kinds of counterfeit miracles and wonders, and will use every kind of deceit on those who will perish. They will perish because they didn't receive the love of the truth so as to be saved. This is why he will let them to be ruled by this strong delusion so that they will believe the lie, so that all who delighted in wickedness will be condemned. But we must thank God for you at all times, brothers, you whom the Lord loves. For God chose you from the beginning to be saved by the Spirit's power to make you his holy people and by your faith in the truth. _2Thessalonians 2:1-13, TCM.

About as popular as a burger order at a vegan restaurant might have been better. :)

All I heard is "the truth is Left Behind" 27:10 so now I'm going to go watch the movies to get all the answers I need. Thanks Dr. Heiser!

I find it hard to believe Revelation never mentions The coming of one of Our most satanic foes. Those that created a religion that pits itself directly against Our God, and Christ himself, that beheads His believers to this day! Traditional interpretations of Revelation has blinded us, and for some reason pushes the worst persecution to the fuzzy future….. And traditional interpretations does something else that blinds us all, we get fixated on looking for the return of Christ, which makes no sense because no one is promised a tomorrow, so chances are most of us will get the chance to stand before our maker long before any rapture. So how should we live our lives? One more thing traditional interpretations does, it isolates those that latch on to different groups, and turns these groups against each other groups of Christ followers. Will we have an answer for such things when we meet Christ face to face? There is some that won’t even read Paul because of their interpretation pursuits, others try to throw us back under the bus of following the Law of Moses more so than following Jesus, although they pick and choose in their attempts to turn themselves into Jews. Give God more than a passing thought, Jesus is what makes us worthy, He really did deal with our sin issues. Go and make disciples…..

Except the Greek is not “ha kataxon” but “o kataxon” which is an indefinite article and masculine

The temple of God is the Christian church, not a Jewish temple or synagogue

The main questions I always have are: Is 2 Thessalonians 2:7 translated accurately? This is asked because is the restrainer (of what and/or who) a person or a person conducting an action upon oneself or upon another or event? Lastly, is there a restrainer mentioned in other parts of Scripture? Scripture is supported by Scripture. Why is this rule set aside with this discussion?

Firmament

Surprise, surprise, end times stuff by Dr. Heiser. I wanted a teaching on this exactly. Because of timimg of the man of lawless vs pre tribe or mid. Oh, boy. Is the ESV what Dr H uses. Any way to find out the most accurate English version if Hebrew OT? True to old Biblical Hebrew. Not modern Hebrew. A double side by side would be wanted also. Thanks!! (I listened then relistened reading each verse w Dr.H. I like the BLK better. Don't know why it would change a word. And either Dr.H started a little into Isaiah 66:8 ~ leaving out the first sentance~or his Bible version leaves it out. It is: "For I know their works and their thoughts." NKJ *GREAT, study! So I came at 30 yrs old to discover what the Bible said. Town at 10K, no tv, the warmest place was in bed under afgans. I started w 1 gospels and then Rev., (kind of trippy, but it is clear in most of it.), Genesis, onward. Then on to NT, and OT stories. I don't see how you can know God well if you don't read OT. Two words: Holy and Supreme. I used to go to church n bibke studies in conserv evangelical but when in a bible study, after also side studying w woman, one day she said, "I just read the NT." She was 65+. I just said, "Then you don't really know who your God is." She looked... quiet. I went on to say, "His character, attributes, expectations. And a more accurate understanding of what the Grace of Salvation brings to us. You should read the OT." Goll, the stories ! Judah, the tribes, the kings the lineage of uncompromising men. If someone wld do these stories for tv with the quality of Game of Thrones, they 2nd make much money. (I had a friend, I ate w who watched. Quite violent, risquee in lots of places. He was a hi mason, head for history/world religion) (which we watched). I came to see that I was making no impact (unfortunate). First friends, then never hiding my beliefs, went on to press further. I walked away one day after I went to his apt opened the door (unheard) and he was praying hands in the air and the warm, evil presence washed against me. He had a table w a statue and an icon painting. (I didn't k they thought icons had spirit within and cld empart. I learned a lot of Catholicism, l read sees, looked at their bible studies. They are never free.) But after 1.5 yrs I decided that was enough. He never had a visitor, disabled, but went to mass of course and his mason meetings. Which I knew nothing about at first either. Great guy. But..... He passed away. He heard my arguments from a totally sufficient Jesus perspective. Always kind, and times emphatic. A shame.

Waste of time ya said nothing left wanting

Many teach the restrainer to be the Holy Spirit, the Church, The Roman government, archangel Michael or even God but none of these teachings are correct. Paul was making sure that the young Church in Thessalonians clearly knew who the restrainer was but before we identify this restrainer, let us first determine that which the restrainer is holding back. We need to look at “certain facts” we know about the restrainer that the participle has no compliment; that is, no direct object to receive the action of the participle. The direct object is implied rather than explicitly stated. So we must supply that direct object. Nearly all of the popular solutions to the problem of the restrainer’s identity have assumed that the man of lawlessness is being held back by the restrainer. This has always been the premise of previous studies. Until now, it seems, no one has seriously questioned this assumption. But is this, in fact, the correct implied direct object of the participle? We must be willing to explore every possibility in order to be assured that we have arrived at the correct solution. So, perhaps the correct question to ask of the text is not, “What is holding back the revelation of the lawless one?,” but rather, “What is the restrainer holding back?” To answer this more foundational question, let us go back to the subject Paul is addressing. It is essential that we interpret this in view of the wider context. Paul clearly states his topic in verse 1: “Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him.” The whole of chapter 2, then, is the Pauline response to the confusion about the arrival of this historic event. The coming of our Lord is what Paul is concerned with in this passage, not the coming of the lawless one. The confusion of the Thessalonians was not about the coming of that lawless one, but over the rumor regarding the arrival of the day of Jesus. Accordingly, Paul is explaining that The Lord’s parousia has not yet occurred because, in fact, other prophesied events must be fulfilled first. So, “the coming of Jesus and our gathering to him” are being restrained. Thus, verse 6 should be understood to say, “and now you know what is holding him (Jesus) back,” or even, “now you know what is holding it (the day of The Lord) back.” The apostle corrected any misunderstanding about The Lord’s coming in verses 3 and 4 by reminding them of what he had explained at length while he was with them - that the day of The Lord’s parousia can not arrive until the prophetic events of the tribulation period are fulfilled. Then in verse 6, Paul reiterates his correction to their confusion when he begins: “And now you know what is holding...back.” So what is it that the Thessalonians now know? They were just told and now know that the day of The Lord will not come until after the apostasy occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed. Those two events were standing in the way of the parousia of The Lord and the rapture. The popular solutions to the identity of the restrainer assume that the man of lawlessness is being held back. But why would Paul be discussing what is holding back the lawless one when the more pertinent information the Thessalonians needed to be reminded of was the fact that certain prophesied events were holding back the coming of The Lord? The whole point Paul is driving home in chapter 2 is that the day of The Lord’s parousia is being hindered! The restrainer, therefore, is holding back the day of The Lord’s post tribulation coming and the rapture of the church. Since the day of The Lord is being held back, then, as we have already discussed at length, the apostasy and the revelation of the man of lawlessness are holding it back, because those two events must occur first. The restrainer, then, is the Antichrist who is revealed after the falling away occurs first. If you are not aware, most modern English versions of the Bible translate 2 Thessalonians 2:7,8a alike. For example, The NIV says that “the one who holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed....” Because of this kind of rendering, nearly all who read this text are led to believe that only when a certain individual is removed will the lawless one be revealed. But we already know that the restrainer is not holding back the revelation of the lawless one. Instead, the lawless one is that restrainer who is holding back the day of The Lord . The mistranslation of the phrase “taken out of the way” is a major reason for the confusion about the restrainer’s identity. First, the word translated, “taken,” is not an accurate rendering of the Greek word in our text. In order to do justice to this passage of Scripture, we must insist on utilizing the normal meaning of words as long as the normal meaning renders a coherent thought and makes sense within the context of what the author is writing. Unfortunately, in 2 Thessalonians 2:7, the normal meaning of the word translated “taken” was not used. Consequently, the translation not only misses the point of what Paul was saying, but it renders the exact opposite sense which he intended. Another example of a grossly perverted translation of verse 6 can be found in the NCV- “And now you know what is stopping that Man of Evil so he will appear at the right time.”, this verse is about Jesus not the Antichrist, they have completely swapped Jesus with the Antichrist. Just look at what the NKJV does with verse 7-“For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way”. Do you notice that the heretical NKJV capitalizes the “H” thus giving deity to the Antichrist! Now you know what the dark agenda is on these perverted translations and you know why some of us have such a passion for the truth of the King James Bible. Understanding how these verses have been twisted backwards and used by false teachers to mislead the elect is vital in the importance of understanding the original truth of what Paul wanted to make clear. Now, ask yourself- is it possible that you may have been taught other untruths?

666 thumbs up wow save mike 667

An hour leading up to "God did it?" Of course God the Father is the author of life and nothing happens He doesn't allow to happen; it goes without saying. But to then ascribe every unknown to the Father is pure laziness. Jesus already defeated satan. A lesser entity (antichrist) arrives to challenge Jesus (the true Christ) and the assertion is that God the Father has to intervene? Preposterous. Correctly danced around the "Gentiles*" question when discussing the Restrainer, then ignore it and ascribe Restraining to the Father? Again, preposterous. (more...) Satan was/is punching up (at God the Father), so God sent Jesus, who crushed satan. Antichrist comes along, punching up at Jesus - obviously someone lesser than Jesus will be sent to Restrain. Yes, a Gentile*. One could argue an Angel or a Son-of-God (SoG) as Restrainer, but if the antichrist has earthly lineage, the Restrainer is likely human? And since the Restrainer isn't actually battling the antichrist, one would think medium guns (SoG's or Angels) wouldn't even be necessary? Verse seven says "Only he who restrains it will do so until he is out of the way." The Restrainer is thus, 'taken out.' Other translations literally say, "taken out." So the assertion is that God the Father is "taken out?" For a third time - preposterous. No my friends, the Restrainer is human. He is an Israelite, living among the Gentiles. Not a Jew, but rather from one of those tribes scattered among the nations. He is equally ranked or positioned as the anitchrist. If the (yet unempowered) antichrist is a dishwasher, the Restrainer is likewise an unskilled laborer. If the antichrist was president, then the Restrainer is also at that level. __________ * Gentile: There are eleven missing tribes of Israel. Since an equal number (12k) come from each tribe, we may assume the "lost" eleven tribes are each as populated as Judah (Jews); even though Judah's taken a number of decimations to their ranks since the diaspora (therefore, it's likely each of the eleven tribes is actually larger than Judah?). Today, Judah has ~40M. Therefore, Israel has at least ~480M. To call the eleven-tribes of Israel "Gentiles" is a misnomer. Yes they are "among the Gentiles," but God knows exactly which are Israelites.

I wish I had two answers. 1. How can we trust the Bible when it has been proven to have been edited and manipulated like at the Council of Nicaea? And secondly, How can an intelligent person believe in myths such as a Virgin Birth, a god becoming a man, walking on water, a talking snake, and so forth? And maybe lastly, if 1/3 of the ANGELS rebelled against their boss...that is a high turnover rate for any company. They didn’t have a good CEO or healthy corporate culture.

Yet again. Brilliant. It’s taking me a third time listening to take it in. Dr Heiser is just gifted. See you in the kingdom brother. We miss you

Last night it hit me that all these demonic pop musicians & commercials stressing "rise up" are trying to raise the beast and demons in plain sight.

I’m reading Unseen Realm. It’s not a easy read. Makes me stop n think over each sentence. I make notes in the margins- always did this in my college books. I have not read anything that stands out on prayer n healing so far , but it’s early yet I’m only on page 56. I go over stuff many times.

Wow! What a teaching this is! Knowledge is increasing as stated in Daniel 12:4.

I just recently discovered Dr. Mike. Gone too soon but everlasting impact. A dent on Christian world view! Mike is already experiencing the unseen realm first hand!!!!

Was going through the Naked Bible Podcast list, read the title and thought, how interesting can this episode be? Man, I was floored by it!

The way mike was so straight forward in this presentation was awesome. I really appreciate the unbiased approach to scripture too.

god bless you Dr Heiser. We wait for King Jesus!

Christian Zionism belief and being saved without believing in Jesus could be it. Heretical and causes falling away. I also agree that many NT writers were OT scholars. Paul was brilliant in his understanding of the OT.

Thank you Dr. for your scripture insights. I’m always blessed by your insights.

If people would pay attention everything that happened back then is happening now.

Wow! I have waited 40 years to hear who/what is the restrainer -- no answers ever sat right for some reason. All answers seemed awkward and forced. This may very well be the most coherent and sensical explanation I have ever heard. The only stretch is to assume Paul is thinking about Isaiah 66, but it is definitely the most valid argument I have ever heard. It has bothered me to YEARS! Thank you Dr. Heiser.

RIGHT on!!! The Old Testament must be checked with New Testament. Well done! Brilliant!

Regarding the Apostacy and the Revealing of the man of sin. I believe they are simultaneous and connected. Those who turn away, turn away TO the man of sin revealing who he is. This would be a 'gathering' of apostates, becoming disciples / believers in the man of sin.

I am soooo thankful for Dr. Mike and his crew. I discovered him just prior to his passing. R.I.P man of God. Thank you your wisdom moves us forward.

"Vegan order in a burger place" love it 😀 😋

This is one of the few times, you can hear the excitement in Mike's voice as he explains the return of Christ. And the correlation between the jews in prophecy and Paul's current jews he contends with.

What we have learned, really. should have learned a long time ago is, always keep the big picture in mind.

God Bless!

Wow really great stuff!

The laws of metaphysics are that you have to announce what you are planning because the human has to know what they are buying into when they reject decency for depravity. They can couch it anyway they want in their efforts but saving or damning your soul, the real you, has to be an informed decision.

I, too, lived in Bellingham for a couple of years or so, albeit Bellingham, London. Definitely not the kingdom in its fullness. ;-)

Wouldn't it make sense, in regards to the Day of the Lord, that profacy could possibly be being fulfilled literally, figuratively, and metaphorically in both realms while only needing it to occur in any sense God chooses thus establishing the doctrine of immanence? I mean how else can you possibly surprise the top fallen angel and all his minions?

I do wish he had gone into the Greek of the portion of 2 Thessalonians.

This topic is a major hangup for pre and post trib rapture debate and it was handled beautifully and carefully. Heiser is rock solid in my book. Taking this into account I still believe the prewrath rapture view is correct.

I remember reading a story in the Talmud. A hand full of rabies are discussing when the messiah will come and the argument goes back and forth. Finally one rabbi who has been relatively quiet speaks up and says they messiah must come during the time of the second temple. If he didn’t come then then He is not coming. And I wonder if the whole son of perdition being revealed in the next temple is related to what this rabbi was arguing about. If it is I think that some scholars will soon begin arguments around Herods temple and whether it is the second temple or just a renovation of Solomon’s temple. Just a thought.

I love this stuff

Lol, He just doesnt want to use that pre-1611 kjv bible translation bcuz it uses the word "Departure" insted of "Falling Away". It seems to me one of two things will happen. The Lord Jesus comes for His believers and snatches them up and they all ride up to heaven on the bible bus. Or, I could die and take a private limo on up. Also, When the rapture happens i have a feeling all the believers will fall over dead, because these carnal fleshly bodies can not enter heaven. There could be 15-20 yrs between the rapture and and the tribulation or antichrist. The Temple has to be built, and there is that Ezekiel 38 war btwn Magog Russia and Israel, and those will take a minute to develop. Jesus in Mathew is talking to the Jews, who will choose to believe a lie and go into the oven for 7 yrs.

2 Thess 2:5-8... HOW did Paul KNOW that?

Dr Heiser thanks so much! I have been studying 2 Thess. 2 recently. Briefly, it it possible that the man of lawlessness is not an individual as the word for man is anthropos and not aner (sp)? Would that not “fit better” with this being an end times process and not one or two events? In other words, “antichrist” is a spirit that instigates the apostosia. Moreover, “he” sits in the temple ( not a physical temple but the bodies of those who “fall away).

I've even heard ...satan is the one restraining because he doesnt want to give up his place in heaven..aka the mystery of lawlessness...I think I heard that from dalton thomas

A further teaching that there is no pre-trib rapture. Believers of this theology teach the church/holy spirit is the restrainer. That makes no sense to tell the church the Day of the Lord can't come until the rebellion and man of lawlessness is revealed. But then he can't come until you are gone. Such an awful teaching.

Fantastic! This is why I'm taking Greek lessons.

Doesn't the bible say that their word went out to all the world? If using hyperbole, would that apply to every "all the world"?

Just ignore the fact that Paul told the Thessalonians about these things in person and that the Thessalonians knew what was restraining him in their day and that the one who was restraining the man of lawlessness in Paul's day would do so until he was taking out of the way. Also, just ignore the fact that Paul said the man of lawlessness was already at work. While you are at it, go ahead and ignore 2 Thessalonians 1 and 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17, where Paul told the Thessalonians that some of them who were alive in Paul's day would remain alive until the second coming. And don't worry about the fact that Jesus said the disciples would see the abomination of desolation. I am sure Paul and Jesus were just poor communicators.

Isn’t this the Pope or catholic system ?? This was common knowledge

I hope people noticed how he doesn't point to any outside literature (very unlike him) in his teaching like 1 Enoch where Michael is mentioned over and over. The restrainer is mentioned in Daniel chapters 10 and 12. Jesus told readers to understand (Matthew 24:15) what Daniel said. Why does he go to Revelation 12:7 without mentioning Michael? So Mike totally avoids taking out Michael as being a "possible" option. He mentions Michael but then he doesn't explain why Michael is not the restrainer. Mike does go to the fact that 2 Thes. 2:3 points to Matthew 24, right? Well, Matthew 24:15 points to Daniel, not Isaiah! (Although, I 100% agree with his connecting 1 Thes. to Isaiah 66, as I never saw this before). I think that Mike might have answered half of the question.. he might have nailed the "what" (Isaiah 66) but totally winged it with the "who" (Daniel 10; 12 Revelation 12:7) part of the question! Normally I love his teaching and have totally bought into the Deut. 32 world view.. Maybe Michael just can't stand the fact that the most powerful angel is named after him! Lol It is not "OBVIOUS" who the restrainer is.... the use of metaphor is not obvious ...it is subjective! Isaiah 66 is describing the New Heavens and New Earth from 65:17 thru 66:22. This has not happened yet..... you make it sound as it has... by the way you say it was being fulfilled in Paul's day. The promise was only confirmed in Christ not fulfilled (Romans 15:8). It is NOT the womb...THAT is obvious!

To be honest, I’m feeling a little rage at the moment. We are encouraged to be in the word of God. Scripture declares a blessing on all of those who hear/read the words of the prophecy of Revelation, but no body really understands any of it. Not only do we have many avenues of disagreement among ‘biblical scholars’ and seminary trained pastors, but now it’s being presented that we need to understand the male/female of original Hebrew words and to think like a biblical Jew to gain any understanding of what’s truly being said? Why even read the scripture if apparently I need to be proficient in Hebrew and Greek to even understand it?! I just cannot believe that God has complicated His word to the point that only the ‘scholars’ among us can understand what it written. That takes us back under Roman Catholicism. I have about had enough of all of this!!! The End

Agree 2 events, falling away first, then man of sin revealed. Won't go any further as it will upset many. The secret is not a secret, but in plain sight, for it is written. Been looking at that text for years, and have only recently seen what is written. Blessed be our Adonai and His Ben Yeshua. Shalom.

Wilson Charles Garcia Kimberly Thomas Christopher

Pagan Rome (the restrainer) became PAPAL Rome (Roman Catholicism- apostasy).

The Day of the LORD covers the last 1,000 years..Look in the prophets for the wording, "in that day or in that time."

It's clearly 2 separate events. The day of the Lord will not come until a falling away first. So, first apostasy, then after that, man of lawlessness revealed. At the same time he is revealed, the lord destroy him with the breath of his mouth. The Lord himself does it. So he has come already at the event of the man of lawlessness being revealed. So it's easy to understand, falling away first, then Man of lawlessness/coming of the Lord happens second.

the restrainer is the Holy Spirt who will leave with the church at the Rapture. Leaving the earth fully vulnerable to the un-restrained evil.

You guys never give a definition of the truth. Psalm 119: 142.

Who is the "Ouse" that Dr Heiser keeps referring to? He keeps referring to someone and his articles? commentary? It's not linked on the podcast page. Anyone know??