@@marks238 ah true, but Tony Blair carried on his message and won. Compromise is necessary. Arguably Blair took it a bit too far though. I mean, New Labour could just barely be called “socialism”.
One of the most powerful political speeches ever. Labour was factionalised. Now the Tories are. If you want ordinary people to vote for you, they need to understand what you are about. Blair and Thatcher understood that.
John Bull It would appear it was only the Liverpool MPs who walked out as if well known left wingers like Benn and Skinner had done so it would have been publicised.
David Batthews u can tell Skinner didn’t walk out since he’s behind Kinnock on the right. He was also my MP and he made a point of standing up against the mismanagement of Liverpool by Hatton and Co.
As relevant today as it was then. Those that fail to learn the lessons of history are forever condemmed to repeat them. The Labour Party is going through the early 1980s all over again.
I was broadly in sympathy with Hatton and Heffer at the time. Resisting the Thatcher menace had to be hard line because the alternative was surrender and be crushed........ But....... Kinnock was so dynamic, infused with genuine hatred, passionate and articulate. He made his point exactly and emphatically. It was truly difficult to disagree with the man, because he meant it. That look at the beginning as they cheer him that said” you don’t know what I’m going to say yet” is priceless. The fury, the venom is heartfelt. It was the best he ever got.
It was a stunning piece of oratory but if it was a turning point, paved the way for two election defeats and then Blair and Iraq. I would also say Brexit because if Labour had not presided over the loss of a million manufacturing jobs and taken other measures to protect workers' rights, I doubt it would have happened. Most voters were not bothered about the EU but Farage and co persuaded them it was the source of all our ills- light years from the truth. Kinnock's speech after the 1983 defeat is deeply moving as is his concession speech on the steps of Walworth Road HQ in the early hours of the morning of 10th April after the shattering defeat of 1992. It remains one of the saddest days of my life because hopes were high that a different type of society was possible after the carnage of the Thatcher years. Here were are thirty years later and the issues that 1992 could have gone some way to starting to address remain unresolved. We cannot have Scandinavian public services with US levels of taxation, for example. The outlook is bleak.
I don’t care about his pension he was dead right then and is now. Momentum play at politics they don’t want power it scares them. They are still Students playing at politics.
A great orator who was never elected as prime minister;NOT because of his politics, or because he fell over in the water in Blackpool; But because many Little Englanders would NOT vote for a party with a leader with a Welsh, Scottish or Irish accent. Prove me wrong!
@@stevenpaulgoulding Yes true , but neither Smith, Nor Brown were elected as Prime Minister. Not sure who the third one is . Blair was born in England , speaks with an English accent and has never claimed to be Scottish.
Note the Beast of Bolsover (Dennis Skinner) sitting behind Kinnock, completely unmoved and silent. If only he knew then that Labour was to change into a centre-right party within a decade, he would have walked out.
Interesting that over thirty years ago the Labour party was wrestling with the same issue - too many of its campaigners not really wanting to deal with the dirty business of fighting and winning elections.
@@ruairidhirwin1767 We'll see. You're probably right, but who knows what effect five years of this government smashing everything in sight will have on the electorate.
@@ruairidhirwin1767 Perhaps. But you have to choose from what's in front of you, and I would much prefer Starmer in No. 10 than Johnson. He is manifestly a more grown-up, serious and intelligent politician. As for the rest of the cabinet - it remains to be seen. He will need to assemble a convincing team in order to be taken seriously. I think he's made a reasonable start. There are still a few cranks and student politician activists in there, but he's cleared most of them out. What do you want to happen?
@@robicenco1 I want social democracy. I like Starmer but I think he will lose. Labour will then elect a leader on the right of the party and eventually win. We will have a period of government and then be in a similar, if not worse position in 30 years time.
Also, vast majority of the men wearing very light-coloured suits. Don't know if it was a particularly warm September in 1985, but I'd be surprised if even 5% of delegates at conferences nowadays were wearing anything other than a dark grey, dark blue or charcoal suit.
@@chriswatson3464oh yes they are and the truth is they’d rather be an ideologically pure opposition and protest movement than accept the reality of compromise and pragmatism of being in Government.
@@LeftWinger9 That's fair (apart from the bit about me being a tory!). But if you look at where the party was that he inherited, he did well. He got the politics right, he just lacked the aura. It was always said he could have won if his wife hadn't dragged him to the ground on the beach. Made him a figure a fun.
I am and will always be a Conservative but this speech and what he was trying🎉 to do is immense. The Labour party then fell in love with Corbyn that says a lot about Socialists but Mr. Kinnock...you did well lad. (but you still lost)
The incorrect audio on this video is mixed in from the right side. If you turn off right audio then it becomes easier to hear what he's saying. For example, if listening with headphones, listen through the left headphone and not the right headphone.
It amazes me why anybody buys into any Politicians speech! Even if its well meaning! Events and Circumstances usually mean that a lot of the things they want to do can’t be done anyway.
Gore and Kerry gave us Obama too Smith gave us FDR besides Jennings Dewey gave us Eisenhower Whitlam/Hayden gave us Hawke Churchill gave us Atlee Fritz gave us Clinton besides Dukakis both Teddy and Taft gave us Harding and Corbyn might bring Starmer in Number 10
Less so with FDR, but all the examples you gave are leaders who took their parties further right than their predecessors had. Blair gave us New Labour, Reagan gave us greater concentration of wealth, and Clinton gave us eight years of passing Republican congressional legislation. Nightmarish on the whole.
@@jinnymudlark1815 Your command of English syntax is laughable. Hopefully when England is separated from Europe and the rest of the UK you'll bother to learn the native language.
Don't worry Neil, when your Westminster career fails you can always head off to Europe and line your pockets with the huge salary, perks, and pension you'll get there. Your whole family can join you there and earn large incomes, perks and pension too for themselves. Years later you can even use your name within the Labour party to help your son become a Westminster MP, where he can enjoy his £75,000 a year (£1,500 a week) tax-payer funded salary.
Given that the average wage in the UK is £30,000 as of 2021, I would have thought £75,000 for an MP is entirely reasonable, don't you? Stockbrokers in the City of London, investment fund managers, hedge fund executives by contrast are on upwards of £500,000 a year, Premiership footballers between £5-10 million. The people who take home 60% of UK salaries.
@@MarkHarrison733 Yes,that might be so,but he knew that Militant-Tendency was trouble & that if he didn’t shut his mouth:he’d get kicked out of Labour too,like,Hatton did. Skinner probably valued:his job & his pension & perks more,than his principles.
