I have long advocated a law to require all public employees to tell the truth when speaking in their official capactity under penalty of perjury. I realize that this would land nearly every member of congress and at least 3/4 of all bureaucrats behind bars, but I'm not seeing a downside.
congress is not comprised of public employees. they are elected officials. there is a distinction, and a very important one. but i agree with you... lawmakers and government bureaucrats should be required to tell the truth to the public in all matters not related to national security or when a citizen's privacy needs protected.
@@TheRedStateBlue "should be required to tell the truth to the public in all matters not related to national security" next step: declare everything national security. on a side note: what exactly IS "national security"? looks to me like an umbrella term for: "anything i don't want others to talk about"
Cops lie on reports and in court easily 95% of the time. When in contact with the police you can just assume they are lying when they open their mouth.
Bingo... and it does not help that courts and prosecutors are very comfortable and agreeable to the lying too! They only dislike it when a cop lies so blatantly that they can't keep lies concealed.
This is very true, but not for all cops. some genuinely just make human mistakes. The problem is that Judges impart so much faith in all cops that the bad ones can get away with it with almost no repercussions. And it's hardly exposed because the prosecutors will just drop the case against you if it looks like you're going to put the cop on blast in court. I know this firsthand because I was going to do just that. I had video evidence proving the cop was lying in my case and the DA just dismissed it at the first meeting. So that cop gets to keep on lying to all the other chumps who don't record everything they do.
@@ilovecops5499 I've given up because they are taught that the people are the enemy. OH, and that the founding fathers hated the idea of a standing army.
@@fortune00011 The silent ones don't get a pass. When you watch your fellow officers do it and do nothing then it's the same as the "getaway driver" in a bank heist. They know what happened and left with the culprits and didn't report anything. So... how about we not worry about giving any a pass until they show they are part of the few that do work to do better.
@@soliniv1411 Not only is that correct, not doing so is the reason for worrying about the police lying. If a person simply remains silent, there is no need to worry about what an officer is saying. Many people however give up the right to remain silent to try to exonerate themselves on the spot.
They are paid professional liars. We as taxpayers pay these tyrants to use excessive force against, lie to us, lie on sworn court documents, and generate revenue from us.
@@tvc1848due to terrible precedent, you do have to assert your right to remain silent before being silent. Which is ridiculous, but so is most of what comes out of SCOTUS
agreed. Maybe we need to create a public service website where we can post officers names and photos and tag them as a known liar with any available proof.
It's not really a lie, though. THEY don't think they did anything wrong because cops are actual sovereign citizens. They don't have to follow the same laws that we do.
And “he’s got a gun!” Or “stop resisting!” And how about we get these officers to stop lying on their reports? I’m sick of hearing from police how the suspect was hostile and aggressive the entire time and we check out the BWC and it’s just a cop screaming at a citizen a bunch of orders and they end up beating them. Enough of this lying and deceit from police. We need police who actually care to defend and protect the constitution, not violate it.
We need to move from policy to law. How the supreme court ever thought it was a good idea to allow public officials to use bad faith as a tool is beyond me.
I’d consider it false statements made in good faith. They’re just trying to perform their duties as law enforcement. It’s bad in cases of wrongful conviction, but I think it (lying) does more good than harm.
Since the system whole became a Corporatocracy, with franchises, under Lincoln (Lieber Code 1863, Martial Law), there has been no "Law". L)and; A)ir; W)ater.
You must remember that the ONLY reason the Supreme Court exists is to find a way to legitimize the State when everyone can see that the State's process is unjust.
Yes, I was a teenager, sitting on my car in the driveway of a friends house around 10 PM on a warm summer night. My friend Lori and her brother Brian were standing next to my car and we were talking. Several squad cars pulled up into the parking lot of the auction house kitty corner to their house and began using flashlights and spotlights to look around the building. Officers in one of the cars shined the light over to us talking in the driveway and then drove over and parked behind my car with their light blaring and flashing. Two officers got out an approached us, and demanded to see my driver's license. I asked what for? One of the officers said they got a tip from a neighbor claiming they saw a man fitting your description run from the auction house over to this car. I then demanded to know who the person was. The officer told me he couldn't do it, and still demanded for me to show him my driver's license. I again refused and demanded them the tell me who said I ran over to my car. The officer then asked me, why do you want to know who called it in? I grabbed my loft arm crutches, stood up and then said, because I can't run. I was using crutches because I couldn't walk let alone run. The officers looked at each other then got back in their car then drove back to the auction house. They didn't even apologize for lying to me. They didn't get a call of anyone reporting they saw me run over to my car. They just wanted me to confess to something I didn't do. What would have happened if I was not on crutches? Would they have arrested me for nothing? That is when I realized police will lie through their teeth for any reason. I've lost my trust in them because of that, I'm 60 now. A few days after the incident we found out a racoon had tried to get into a window in the back of the building and tripped their silent alarm. Officers tried to blame it on me. I was just an innocent bystander.
Try being raised by a cop dad like that. He lied. Coerced. Tear gas = perfume, a cattle prod = a joke. A rape = exploration (he watched). An illegitimate son = dead brother. I parked my *unlocked* bicycle at the door to use the toilet, he stole it and sold it. Just a pinecone dropped in a barrell of fun, the tip of the iceberg of life living with a bad dad with a badge.
Your story is another one to add to the body of evidence we are all finding unacceptable and turning us against the police. I wish that the police and their sycophants who defend everything they do would wake up and understand how they have discredited themselves because the average law-abiding citizen is realizing the system as it stands is beyond redemption. I have a dear cousin who uses crutches and is your (and my) age, so your story really hits home. I imagine that your crutches saved you from being face-planted onto the pavement, tased, handcuffed (tightly so you have long-term nerve damage to your wrists), sat in the back of a squad car until they were done B.S.-ing about how to stack charges against you and for another half-hour while they back-slapped one another for their bravery, given a rough ride to the station, strip-searched to make sure no 18th century Japanese inlaid five-drawer bureaus were hiding in any of your body cavities, and then thrown into a cell with all of the unpleasant and dangerous men they had in custody. The sad thing about my imaginary story is that is all too common a tale.
In my town, I had one officer pull me over in order to apologize for his bad thoughts, years later another pulled me over, saw I didn't match the description, and apologize profusely for pulling me over.
The problem with someone like a police officer lying as part of their job is that we are training them that it is alright to lie about things that can materially affect peoples lives. Once they start down that rabbit hole it leads to abuse. Once the trust is broken it is unbelievably hard to regain.
My experience with this is from school and principals. It’s pretty sad when the 4th grader can read a rule book and understand they didn’t break said rule but the people of “authority” say it doesn’t matter because I said so. My experiences like that have directly transitioned into my experiences in family court and with police. So government, not a fan
Crazy, I had a officer lie to me as a young boy at about 10 years old, about a situation me and some of my friends were a part of, after that I absolutely lost all respect for them, and I still as a 50 year old would not trust anything a officer has to say.
Yeah, you're not alone my friend. Myself and probably The Whole Country. America has woken up. I'm gonna throw in an estimated guess and say; very few; and I do mean very few police officers can be trusted. In my book a good 90-95 % of all police officers cannot be trusted. I learned from Attorneys; NEVER talk to Police, They are NOT your friends.
Same thing happened to me. Skateboarding with a friend at a local school and a security guard called police. Security guard stated we broke a window. Cops lied to me and said my friend said I did it. Told my father what had happened and upon checking with friend he never said either of us broke the window. We complained but they wouldn't drop the charge
When I was 18 an officer lied on the witness stand, under oath. It affected me all of my life that a trusted law enforcement officer would lie. I am now 70 and it still raises my blood pressure when I think about it. I have become very jaded when it comes to the integrity of police officers.
A large percentage of Americans watched a police officer lie under oath during the OJ trial when Mark Furman denied ever using the N word then evidence was presented that he had. He was never charged with perjury, and was rewarded with a job for Fox News.
Oh, oh. I also remember a time when I went to a friend's 21st birthday party, and, after the party was over, I was obviously completely wasted, and was planning to just sleep in my car and then drive home after I sobered up in the morning, since I did not want to put my life or the lives of others at risk. Well, my car was parked across the street from my friend's house in a church parking lot. So, I go over to my car, get in the driver's seat, lock all the doors, lay my seat back, and try to go to sleep. About 5 minutes later, I heard a tapping on my window and see that there is a cop standing outside my door. I put my window down and talk to her, explaining how I was drunk and intended to sleep and sober up. After she verified that my keys were not in the ignition (they were not, they were in my pocket), she told me that I was not allowed to sleep in my car for some reason. I don't remember the reason she gave, but I do remember being absolutely floored that this cop would tell me that I was not allowed to do what I knew was the responsible thing to do. She said the car could stay where it was, but that I couldn't sleep in it, which is absolute bs. So, because of this cop, I literally had to sleep, face-down, on my friend's front lawn. But wait, the story gets EVEN BETTER. As if denying me a safe place to sleep weren't bad enough, when I woke up the next morning, groggy and rightfully pissed off about what had transpired the night before, as I make my way toward my car to go home, I notice that it is no longer in the parking lot where I left it. Thats right. While I was sleeping on my friend's front lawn the night before (which, I remind you, I only did because a cop refused to let me sleep in my car), someone had gone through my pockets and stolen my keys and, as I was soon to find out, my wallet. I 100% blame this cop for the hardships I was forced to endure in replacing all my stolen property, and I have hated the police ever since.
I am not a lawyer, but a similar thing did happen and was covered by a lawyer over on Audit the Audit. A young woman was arrested for drunk driving because she had started her car, but had no intention of driving it. It was pointed out that under many laws, just being in actual, physical possession of the vehicle while drunk means you can be charged with a DUI. Even if the car is not on, the key is in your pocket, whatever. If you have the ability to hop in your car and drive away because you have the keys, own the car, and are under the influence, the law is not on your side apparently. Even if you don't drive, it can be considered a DUI just because you had the keys, were in the driver seat, and were drunk. On a side note, I'm not convinced it is entirely the officers fault that you got robbed while passed out drunk on someone else's lawn.. I'm *sure* that you had options for a safe place to crash and just didn't. I'm not arguing that it was right to kick you out of your own car or that the laws even make sense, but I am arguing that you made the choice to sleep on a lawn after the fact. I don't see the problem with sleeping it off in a car if you're allowed to park there, tbh. If you're not DRIVING, you're not committing a DUI. I also just thought about the fact that passing out drunk on someone's lawn is probably also against the law, might as well have just kept in your car xD
Whenever a cop tells you something, try saying: _"How do I know you're telling the truth when it's legally allowed for you to lie to me, and actually a part of your training to do so?"_ 🤔
My parents were divorced when I was a child. I have distinct memories of a police officer trying to get information out of me when I was 4 years old, right after they separated. The officer lied to me about my father trying to get me to say whatever my mom's lawyer was trying to get me to say. It messed me up for life and I never fully trusted my father until much later in life when I realized what happened to me. I also don't trust a word that comes out of any police officers' mouth due to this.
@@witolddupa Some departments have policies against it but theirs no actual laws forbidding it and many departments don't even include lying to children in their policies.
They lie in court reports all the time...once they get caught lying in court should be placed on Brady list but let's face it even the mi.state police are not in compliance with the Brady list laws most department in the country are not in compliance with it either
I'd almost be sad to see this take effect. The last 2 times I was called to jury duty, I was dismissed after stating that I had no confidence in the government's ability to be truthful.
I got out of jury duty because post cataract surgery I can't see well enough to drive after dark. It was right in the middle of winter, and I stated that in order to drive safely home (30 minutes away) I would have to leave no later than 4 PM. I was excused.
Interesting, I WANT to get on a jury so I can ruin a lying cop’s arrest by refusing to convict. I’d certainly convict if it was clear cut, but “beyond a reasonable doubt” becomes very fuzzy when you know there is a high probability that the police lied or otherwise coerced the accused to try to obtain a conviction
Uniformed police or anyone who has identified himself/herself as a police officer should not be allowed to lie to the public. As it stands you cannot believe anything the police say. I believe that this issue is at the very heart of moral decay in our society. There was a time when we expected police officers to have good moral character rather than operate as a paramilitary gang of thugs barely distinguishable from their primary "customers."
It's more of a symptom than it is a cause, my man. You should look up Sir Robert Peel's Principles of Policing (yeah, say that five times fast). You'd be amazed at how many of them we've not only strayed from, but constitute what people _want_ from their police forces.
"Now that I have explicitly invoked my right to an attorney, *you will lose this case AND your qualified immunity if you continue to question me.* Think before you act, Officer."
@@timmylong-dl2im - it "should" be true...the law is written to accommodate this very defense...however, since qualified immunity is granted by the judge and not the law, it almost never gets to that point.
When I was a Peace Officer and a Sergeant I use to argue all the time that except for authorized undercover investigation we should never lie. What little that was gained from the lie never out weighted what we lost in our personal and professional integrity.
"undercover" shouldn't even be allowed. As it is, it's just a means to bully or coerce people into committing a crime where you can have the means of recording the evidence convenient, if it hasn't already been pre-manufactured. Is it fair that criminals don't have to play by the same rules? No. Who cares. Allowing cops to "not play by the same rules" has proven to be more of a danger to society than they criminals themselves. If a cop can't do the job in full daylight of transparency and accountability, the moral and ethical cost of doing the job isn't worth getting the job done.
It's cause it has lead to where we have more issues with police becoming sudo mob members than actually protecting the community. I grew up and was 17 when i got a speeding ticket for 1 mile an hour over the speed limit in a small tiny town with two highways that go through it. I had a $400 ticket for that which I ended up having to work a lot of extra time to pay off with a part time job I had at the time. My parents actually knew the judge cause it was a small town and I had to pay the citation but it started a look into the tickets that town was handing out. Turns out the police were pulling the money and the town council had setup the money to go through the local bingo hall. The biggest winners that were over a million dollars for some of them were the council members and police. Ever since then that is why I don't always trust the police.
I had an officer try to tell me immediately after being stopped that my friend, who was drinking, was actually driving and we had switched seats during the stop. This was the first thing out of his mouth. Trying to immediately escalate tensions and get a response he could consider suspicious. That didn't work, but goes to show that they usually prefer resistance to compliance, it gives the some excitement and a chance to use the cuffs and stick.
Here in the city I live in, the two Deputy Chief's of Police have both told me unequivocally for anything more serious then a traffic violation NEVER SPEAK TO THE POLICE. If its something that can get you jail time, call a lawyer. Dont even ask the police what time it is. Just clam up and wait for the attorney to arrive. CHEERS from Colorado 0:01
Considering how police love to escalate traffic stops into felony arrests (drugs, guns, etc), the deputy chiefs' advice should apply to ANY interaction with the cops.
I was 18 and my sister was 16 when she got pulled in for an interview about some thefts in the area. She knew nothing about it but somehow they thought she knew somebody who did. I went with her. It was all good until I caught The investigator in a flat out lie. At that point I stood up and we walked out. In hindsight she should have taken a lawyer instead of me even though she legitimately had no clue what they were talking about because they were headed for trying to charge her with something.
When I was NINE (66 now) an Athens Ohio policeman stopped me in front of my house. He accused me of breaking windows of an abandoned lumberyard across the street. Which was not true. He told me he had proof, so I should just confess. I realized that all that I had been told about “policemen are your friend” was a lie and I got enlightened at an early age. Also, I tell that story to every cop I encounter.
Fellow Athenian here. I lived on N. Congress! My claim to fame in Athens is took a dump on a police car from the 6th story of the parking garage when I was about 12 years old!
@Swearing0000 Of all the cops you've encountered and told that story over the years, has any one of them ever shown any kind of interest? That's the cop I'm looking for. The one that feels the civilian population are worth engaging in a constructive exchange of perspective. The mythical "good cop" is as mythical as a sasquatch. Some people swear they exist, yet tangible proof evades the public at large.
Yeah I suppose if they used it as an investigative technique ONLY but even once they realize you are not involved they still act like you are a criminal... No apologies, no "well we're just looking for someone who did such and such" I'm always polite with police until they give me a reason not to be... But you cannot let them run you over.
They'll always be able to say "you match the description of someone in an investigation" and "I thought I smelled marijuana coming from the car". Those are classic wild cards they'll probably always have in the harassment handbook.
There was a case in London, UK were some cops were sacked for the "I thought I smelled marijuana coming from the car". The couple they pulled over were both athletes who are subject to regular random drug testing. The disciplinary hearing found that the cops lied as there was no way either of the couple would have been smoking stuff.
Other classic police lies. "The dog alerted on your vehicle." "Come here, I just want to talk to you." "If you don't tell me the truth I can't help you."
Actually, there is at least one state where a judge has ruled that a car can't be searched simple for the smell of pot. In that state pot is legal. I believe that Steve covered that incident some time ago. We can only hope that that type of behavior will spread.
@@philiplubduck6107 I highly doubt this applies to undercover cops that would kind of defeat the entire purpose and we would lose a valuable tool for busting crime rings. I think there is precedent in the supreme court already that says that ability will never be assailed so you can calm down sir
It's astounding that in the U.S. we have policing that not only relies on lying to its citizenry it actively seeks to silence and prosecute those who want it stopped.
f'd from the Left and f'd from the Right.. Working poor, tax slaves, UNITE!!!! Down with Uncle Scam, american mafia passing for a government and their gang of goons!
That policy is pretty much useless when you factor in the part where lying is permitted if they have permission. They will always have "permission" if anyone tries to hold them accountable.
It's ridiculous. In the very same case, they can lie the entire time and suffer no punishment, while in that same case if you lie one time or if they can twist something you said into a lie you are doing prison time.
"knowingly" that is the loop hole. It should be a felony for a cop to lie. If he will lie to arrest you, he will lie to convict you. If he is sometimes a liar then how can anyone ever take his word for a crime? I saw him run the red light. I smelled alcohol they will absolutely lie about anything, therefor we can NOT take their word for anything.
The issue is that if you remove "knowingly" human error or people providing them false information now can cause innocents to suffer through no fault of their own. You basically choose to punish all bad and some innocents or most bad and little to no innocents.
After seeing many of these cases, I've come to the conclusion that all law enforcement lies. The question is are they liars because they're law enforcement, or are they law enforcement because they're liars?
police academies all teach how to lie under oath. in a court of law.. my dad was cop in the 1960's and everything he warned me about police..... is all coming true.. never ever trust police of any kind
Everyone is the hero of their own story. All great evils are in service of a "greater good". Cops seem to believe that anything they do is a net-good because they did it
The fact that this is Seattle actually has me a little hesitant. This is the same city that decriminalized crime essentially, along with Portland. So while yes, it sounds like a good law, Seattle doesn't have a great track record
A long time ago, I had a buddy who was arrested and charged with "theft by taking." He didn't know that the stuff he had been given by a friend of his had been stolen, and he was terrified about what was going to happen to him, and the police who were interrogating him basically tricked him by telling him to "write an apology letter to the victims whose property you were in possession of, and we won't charge you." So, he writes the letter, basically admitting to the crime in writing, and the police charge him, arrest him, and put him in jail. The things these cops do sometimes really disgusts me.
I once got woken up to a police officer knocking on my door. I answered it and he said he was responding to a complaint about someone using a laser pointer out my kitchen window. My immediate reaction was to laugh because it was absurd because I was asleep for hours at that point. He did not appreciate that I found the situation funny. I immediately changed my demeanor and explained why i had laughed. He then said, "Oh yeah, if you were asleep how come the complaint that came in gave a description of '20 something white male, 6ft tall, with shoulder length hair and a goatee?" I looked back at him and called BS, and that I don't even own a laser pointer. He said, "This is a very busy night, I don't want to have to come back here" So I could tell that he didn't believe me, but he left anyway because he didn't have any evidence or admission of guilt. I later found out that my roommate and her sister were the guilty party and had left just before the officer arrived. Turns out her father was friends with the officer, so she called him and apologized at her own behest. I later had another encounter with that officer and it went very differently and was a very pleasant encounter. That same officer became slightly RU-vid famous when his patrol car camera recorded and incident where a council woman had a breakdown during a traffic stop where she was pulled over for speeding. He handled that situation with poise, professionalism, courtesy and sympathy. That video should be an example of how to de-escalate a situation where a driver is irate, abusive and emotional. I believe he is a good and reasonable person and officer, but it always bothered me that he lied to my face to try and get me to admit to something I know I didn't do. How am I supposed to put my trust in any officer if I know they have no repercussions for lying to me in an effort to get me to incriminate myself, even when innocent?
If you are innocent why would you incriminate yourself? It seems that the officer was going to let his friend's daughter a pass but wanted to put the blame solely on you, which I find disturbing. But a policeman or detective trying to trick you into a confession is kind of their job.
They are actually trained to do that to get a confession, so he probably felt he was doing the right thing even then. I have to say, I hate them doing it for small crimes when decent people can get in trouble, but in serious cases, like violent crimes, it can help them get a good confession that can be verified with solid evidence.
Somehow when I hear the phrase 'a commitment to unbiased and constitutional policing' it is hard to forget the idea of qualified immunity and other tactics that can easily be used to get around such a requirement
Another problem: They don't have to tell you that you're under arrest for you to be under arrest. If it exists in their brain, it's enough. Or they can make it up later to best fit their timeline. For example, they can attack you without warning, and if you defend yourself in any way it's Resisting Arrest if you're lucky. To me, this is a bigger deal than Miranda Rights.
If the interaction lasts more than a sentence or two ("Hi, how's it going?" "Good, you?" "Good, have a nice day.") Inform the cops that you are in fear for you life from them. They have weapons, qualified immunity and a potential comply or die attitude.
Until intention to rest is declared, moral justification exists for a defendant to use virtually any amount of force against police officers in response to attempts to abduct them.
@@roflchopter11 and arguably still does if the arrest is made because someone with hair the same color as mine driving a grey Toyota corolla like mine robbed a bank 2 miles away with a 9mm handgun, and I told the cop I have a 9mm handgun in the glove box which is legal here, and the cop decides that is enough for probable cause. Not saying it would work out well practically on the side of the road or legally in court after the fact but morally? As far as I'm concerned if you didn't do it, you'll always have the moral right to resist. Same if you did do it but it, whatever it is, is something that shouldn't be against the law.
Even competent adults can be tricked into making false confessions. Worse, they can be tricked into actually BELIEVING that they did it. Lying to suspects is an incredibly effective tactic, if the measure of effectiveness is getting convictions. But if your measure of effectiveness is finding and convicting people who are actually guilty, then lying suddenly stops looking like an effective tactic and starts looking like either a lazy tactic or an act of desperation. It needs to be made illegal by federal law.
It's also uncomfortably close to actual entrapment. The FBI pretty much can't catch any terrorists without creating the plot, finding the folks to engage in it and then arresting them.
I didn't beleive it when I first heard it, but it's true. People have done studies and shown that the majority of people can be tricked into falsely confessing (probably less for major crimes, but still) and something like 25-30 can be gaslit into thinking they actually did it. That adults. Most people don't think that can happen to them, but the minds is an odd thing.
A lot of times totally innocent people will confess to something they didn't do because of the fear that the cops will frame them in order to get a conviction. If they go to trial with their fabricated evidence (which the judge and jury will most probably believe) it will go much harder on them. IOW, they take what they think is the easy way out, because the fear of police corruption is highly justified due to the fact that there is so much of it.
@@admthrawnuru I have a childhood memory. I was fighting with my younger brother and ran into the bathroom to shut the door and lock it against him. He was chasing me and managed to get one finger into the hinge side of the door. I can still hear the bone cracking as I shut the door on his finger. My mom took him to the ER and he had a cast or splint for weeks afterward while it healed. It's a false memory; neither my mother nor my brother remember it. My best guess is that it was a vivid nightmare that somehow made it into my long-term memory as a real event. And I felt guilty about it for something like 50 years before I talked about it with my mom and brother and found out that it never happened. That's something that I somehow did to myself - imagine how bad it would have been if a cop had told me I did that. I might have been unable to believe my family when they told me it didn't happen.
@@admthrawnuruIt's not just a "you did it" immediately leading to "oh, I did it!" Getting a false confession comes after MANY hours of interrogation grilling, repeatedly telling the person over and over that they're guilty and the police will be able to prove it. It's incredibly abusive of their power over a subject in custody and borders on psychological torture.
In a roundabout way, not a lie in many jurisdictions. Providing ID itself may not be required, but the police can potentially detain someone for an extended period of time until one's identity can be established. This is a tough call for an individual. Comply or push back. Personally, I'd provide ID (done it a few times over the years), keep the interaction as unmemorable as possible, and move on with life. Some battles aren't worth fighting. Others strongly disagree. More power to them and applaud their efforts.
@@ronbennett7885 Well said! I agree completely! Knowing what's at stake, people still do it. Like you, I feel that's your choice. I cannot, under any circumstances, be put in handcuffs. Therefore I do not poke that bear.
But that is an issue, by letting them do something to you that they have no right to just gives them the I can do and say whatever I want and people better obey or else. That's like them arresting you for breaking a law and then they do the exact after they cuff you but no consequences are suffered. But I get y'alls point. If I did something fine, but I refuse to be trampled upon.
And there's a few other things that go along with that. Cops aren't allowed to lie in court either, but some do and it's uncommon for them to suffer repercussions. There is a database for currently serving officers that are not allowed to testify in court because they are "unreliable" but still permitted to hold a position of trust.
The problem that I have with police lying is that they have the authority to give commands and to use force if those commands aren't followed. Allowing someone to use commanding language when they don't have legal authority creates problems, and it places the onus on the public to know which commands are legal and which commands are not. I can understand situations like undercover work and what not requiring them to fit the role, but when they're uniformed giving commands and instructions they should be required to be honest.
The key is, when you hold out and are arrested and then found innocent later, their organization should be liable for remediation all your damages and costs, no matter what that entails. There has to be a cost that hurts them as much as the false accusation has hurt you. Otherwise they can't be pushed toward honesty and accountability.
Usually the actual rules aren't the problem, it's the fact that police break them so often with zero repercussions aside from a paid vacation. Do your civic duty and always refuse to speak to police if you can, the best case scenario is nothing happens and they leave you alone, at worst they harass/accuse you. Maybe we should have actual requirements for them and not just hire anyone who fails their ASVAB.
Precisely. Usually its not about lack of rules, heck, the constitution is right there! That's exactly why there are so many videos on this channel and other lawyer channels about police doing unconstitutional things, and then courts have to figure it out. Other than the most obviously criminal actions, the police is not held personally accountable, they can just do anything if you look suspicious in their eyes, and you have to suffer unlawful investigation or arrest and battle in courts to get reimbursed with taxpayers money.
im just a dumb sperg but it seems so clown world that a cop wouldn't be able to follow rules and the truth. That should be a sign. It's literally the problem.
Anyone who fails their ASVAB! 😂😂😂 Seriously though, a lot of them get off on wearing the military gear. This bleeds over into them acting like they're in some kind of action movie. They are very dangerous.
The best thing you can say to the police is "No thanks" I do not consent to illegal searches of my person or property. The police are the biggest organized crime syndicate I have ever seen.
They should be stopped from lying, because most of them don’t just simply lie, they coerce you into admitting something you didn’t do or entrap you into doing something you normally wouldn’t do.
Just like any other privilege given to authority, lying was intended as a means to a constructive end. In short order, I learned to accept that every time a cop makes an utterance, it is best to treat it as a bald faced lie. The line between catching criminals and getting a law abiding citizen to incriminate themselves gets crossed on a regular basis. Up until fairly recently, I was back the blue, now I feel disdain for the uniform. For the record, my change in perspective bothers me WAY more than it bothers any LEO.
"Up until fairly recently, I was back the blue, now I feel disdain for the uniform. For the record, my change in perspective bothers me WAY more than it bothers any LEO." BRAVO! You've articulated what I haven't really been able to put words to myself. It troubles me that I have lost any trust or faith in institutions that I once had so much respect for.
@@meloniedropik3539 I have tried to engage with active duty LEO's many time about this, but none (so far) have been willing to engage. As with any other secret society, if you are not a member you are not worthy of any forthright, sincere discussion.
Insight, my father was a cop for 33 yrs up to Chief Criminal Deputy in a county of 75,000.. You cannot BELIEVE what goes on routinely.. All cops are criminals, because, they will never, ever, ever, ever, rat on another officer no matter WHAT they see happening or know happened.. To do so would require them to get another job because NOBODY would ever work with them again.. The drug corruption is rampant.. Came home once when I was still living at home to find a cop in my dining room, one in the driveway, and one half a block away.. My mother got death threats from people tell her they were going to cut her up and feed her to the gators.. The threats were from my Dads fellow cops on the take, because he was retiring and got fed up and called the FBI.. I know ALL I need to know about cops.. The Sheriff didn’t run again and a different man has been Sheriff for awhile, but, NEVER trust them, EVER
@@peteparadis1619It is so sad how far the world has fallen because we have decided that honor and integrity are laughable constructs practiced by fools who deserve all of the abuse they get. "Do unto others, then split!" started out as an antiestablishment bumper sticker, but I fear it has become the ethos by which society now functions. God help us.
@@kenhawkins1033Secret society, they are indeed. I wonder if those Romans who recognized that they were destroying their own culture have had their thoughts preserved, and, if so, what might we be able to learn from them? The collapse of the greatest civilization that men have ever created is such anguish to witness and yet be powerless to do much of anything to prevent is a crying shame.
The one I hate is when police are trying to bully citizens into giving up their rights by telling them that if they do not comply, they are going to jail. Unless you ar a lawyer and know your EXACT rights, any agreement to surrender one's rights is done under duress. Police should also be required to inform people of their rights when first they approach them, such as telling them that they have the right not to answer, or to go about their business.
Perhaps we need to be a bit more willing to stand for our rights and address their violation at a later date - even though there will probably be a dropped charge or three to have expunged by then.
I remember In high school watching a documentary where they were able to convince a person to admit to a murder they didn't commit. They simply got people together, threw a party, got people to drink more than they should of, then picked a person to target. The person the next morning actually believed he killed somebody by every one making up a story. Cops showed up, arrested him, then the murdered person told the guy he didn't kill him. The murdered person told him he was involved in an experiment. Very very scary. Morale to the story, be careful who you hang out with and don't admit to ANYTHING ANYTIME ANYWHERE! Needless to say, they guy who admitted to a murder he didn't commit was extremely relieved and actually cried.
"IF there's cocaine in the door, it's probably YOURS, officer." I have often maintained that, when police are permitted to lie in their investigations, how can one believe ANYTHING that they say? It really does nothing to promote honest law enforcement.
FINALLY! I've been screaming this for thebbetter part of a decade now. Hopefully this catches on, and more places implement similar "rules". Although I think it should be made a law, with harsh penalties if proven that they're lying. And make it for every single govt official, not just police.
I am sure there are plenty of rules, regulations and laws that would prevent this, lying in court and falsifying evidence or testimony are already illegal have been a long time. What is lacked is an enforcement of the rules and unless this is done doesn't matter how many laws you make they are useless. Much like immigration they keep saying we need new laws to stop immigration, there are literal books of codes, regulations and law on immigration they just don't obey them or enforce them.
The personal problem I have is when the cops lie to me after pulling me over by saying the reason they pulled me over was because of a faulty blinker, brake light, etc when in fact my lights work fine. They then proceed to check if I smell like alcohol, smell weed, or can see anything they can then charge me with. Upon telling them to show me the light in question, they then merely say it must be a lose/faulty socket or connection, the light is working now, and so I need to get it checked out so it doesnt cause an unnecessary traffic stop
Based solely on news stories and videos I’ve seen I’d say the most common lie told by police is that someone not breaking any law would be arrested for breaking an imaginary law.
@@patriot9455 How else could it possibly work? People clearly recognize that humans take advantage of one another, and so we need some form of government. Then they seem surprised to discover that the authorities are also human.
When not lying is termed as a new innovative technique, you can be sure these liars have been acting as lawless criminals their entire lives. In no way does a morally sound individual ever reference telling the truth as an innovative technique.
My only experience with a cop asking if he could search my vehicle was back when for reason I would get stopped, frisked, and questioned practically monthly. He asked. I said, "sure, as long as you put everything back where you found it." He backed off and let me go.
They have them in many places. They're rarely much better, because the civilian review board gets chummy with the police. Either that, or they criticize the police for having their ties crooked and it's exactly the OPPOSITE problem.
I have always felt if the police can lie, how could anyone trust them with anything they say, even why they stopped you for a traffic citation? They don't have to tell you everything but lying, and everyone knowing it's allowed, seems like entrapment and it also changes confidence in a profession that screams it should be ethical.
so glad you mention the trauma it causes for children. no one ever mentions that. i wasa one of those kids. always knew to do what the police say without question. always have. but now as an adult being powerless n having to sit there in court n watch them lie on me like its nothing. just another day as they dismantle my whole life in minutes. it's very wicked! And they lie about small things like its nothing so they will definitely lie about most serious things. Avoidance is ALWAYS the best option! And if you come into contact with one you must limit your time around them at all cost!
Glad they included that Social Media part. Reminds me of the one story you covered where police made a Facebook post saying "If we pull you over on the highway, it is perfectly legal for you to drive a little further to get somewhere safe." A woman saw that post, tried following its advice, and got PIT Maneuvered. Hopefully this law prevents something like that from happening.
Oh man I remember that one. To make matters worse: 1) it was a pregnant woman 2) when the officer turned on his flashing lights, the woman slowed down and turned her hazards on so as to say "I'm complying and I am not fleeing" 3) he PITed her WITHIN 30 SECONDS of turning on his flashing lights
I love your insight Steve I really appreciate it I find it valuable Having been exposed to many discriminatory traffic stops I appreciate the knowledge of giving me and that has served me well.
A Pennsylvania State Trooper sent me a citation for disorderly conduct in fighting with first responders. It was malicious prosecution and he was a liar. He got embarrassed at a magistrate hearing in minutes. Surprisingly the other day society got to see what kind of a person he is. He was arrested for physical assault on his wife. Chances are he’s going to lose his job something that wouldn’t of happened to him based on him lying about the citation he sent me. It’s usually found if someone is a search engine such as but not limited to Google. All you have to do is ask the question of a search engine, Pennsylvania state trooper arrested for spousal abuse in Derry Pennsylvania. You can read all about it.
The entire state of Pennsylvania is corrupt to the core. Just recently I read documented evidence that the Supreme Court there tried to claim that they never received an appeal letter from a certain someone that UghTuub is censoring after they signed a certified mail receipt. All to cover up a state-wide real estate racket among other crimes that happened to the certain someone along the way.
That State cop was married with kids, and the lady he lied about was his lover from an affair. That itself should be enough to discharge the trooper. Conduct unbecoming. If you regularly lie to your own family how can you be expected to always be honest and forthright at work?
When the cops lied to me, it was not part of any investigative technique. It was because I called them to enforce the law, and they did not feel like doing that. I called them about trespassers. They told me that was a civil matter, not a criminal one. Later I found out trespassing is also a criminal offense.
@@ASMRWM ........"crimes that make the city money" ABSOLUTELY! The term to serve and protect as it relates to police has NEVER been correct. The police are NOT there to serve the citizens.
It’s obvious your comprehension is off a notch. A civil matter is not criminal, trespassing is. They were telling you it’s not trespassing it’s civil, which would not make it criminal because it was not trespassing
The 'Knowingly Lying' part will be used as an escape clause to cover up knowingly lying just like the qualified immunity escape clause. Lying to get a confession should fall under the same grounds as 'Entrapment', a trick to get a false arrests but tricking people to commit a crime. P.S. Love the exit joke & I am going to be using it. 🤣
Except it's even worse. Under the qualified immunity standard, you have show that the officers violated a clearly established precedent, which at least is a somewhat attainable (if extremely high) standard. Under this "not allowed to lie" standard, at the very least you're supposed to show that the officer knew he was lying, and probably also show that he did so intentionally. Good luck getting that evidence.
I was walking home from a friend's house when I was 15 and the police rode by me and stopped me saying that someone saw me breaking into cars. It was a flat out lie and I knew he was lying. I have never been in trouble in my short life and I have never done anything like that. I have never trusted police since and I am 67 now and I have still never been in trouble a day of my life
They should also have to read the exact statutes they're ticketing or arresting you for, and be able to articulate the grounds of their suspicion if they're detaining you, and in a very timely manner...not after they have a 20 minute pow wow with their buddies with their bodycams muted while they try to come up with charges to justify their actions.
I did not realize that police could legally lie until I had jury duty. I thought this was just done on TV or in movies like some other things they do in these shows that are illegal and would likely result in being fired or suspended in real life. In the case I was on the police detective lied to get a confession and it was very carefully explained to us that this is a legitimate interrogation procedure that police detectives are taught to do. I was shocked and ever since then lost confidence in our legal system.
Had that happen to me not ten minutes into my morning walk ,at six in the morning. I was 63 and handicapped. He shined his flood light on me and kept his hand on his firearm.
@@ericgautreaux1752 I was accosted in a restaurant while having my breakfast. His Majesty wanted to know what I was doing in "[his] town". I replied that I was eating breakfast, and that any answers to further questions would be doing in the presence of counsel. My purpose of being in "his" town was business with the local school district. A lesson I took away from this incident was to never eat at a restaurant with cop cars in the parking lot if you are driving an obvious rental, or in a very small town. Strangers are suspect, especially if they look like I do. (The man in the avatar is me.)
@Steve Lehto- You are as much of a journalist as anyone I've seen. You have educated people on important facts such as forfeiture policies etc. You are more of a journalist than all of the mainstream media. You don't lie.
This should have been a policy in place nationwide from the founding of the country. There is honestly no telling how many thousands of people have been falsely convicted or even died due to police lying.
When I was a senior in HS, they had a post-prom lock-in at the town civic center. Upon entering a bunch of moms gave everyone a hug. I thought that was very strange, but later realized it was a ruse to get in close for them check for the odor of alcoholic beverages. That deception really ticked me off since 1) my dad forced me to go (he volunteered to help organize it without asking if I was going to the prom - I didn't - or wanted to go to the proposed lock-in - I didn't) so I didn't want to be there to begin with, 2) it was an invasion of my personal space disguised as a greeting from a semi-parental figure for a deceptive purpose, and 3) I never drank alcohol even through college so I was offended by them assuming that I might just because of my age. I can imagine that a police officer making unfounded accusations regarding drugs or alcohol to me as a teen would have elicited a similar reaction. If they don't already have evidence of a crime having been committed they should not use deception to go fishing for confessions of a previously unknown one. On the other hand, I don't trust anything coming from the Seattle city government. It will inevitably make conditions there worse than they already are.
I absolutely hate it when Walmart asks to see receipts. I vehemently refuse every time. Most of the time, I don’t even look at them and ignore them if they ask. I’ve never been chased down.
I just had this happen to me the other day, two cops came up to me and said I was violating an ordinance that didn't exist, the problem is these cops have no relationship to the truth, if you had a relationship with the truth you would know the truth and you wouldn't lie!
When I was 8 years old I saw a cop shop- lift. You're right. It plays with your head to realize the people who are to enforce the law will often break it when it suits them and they think they can get away with it.
Having been down that road, I refer to this tactic as lazy policing; it's most commonly used by officers against people they perceive as uneducated, without means, and possessing dull normal or less IQ's.
It’s amazing how novel and idea this is. When you give authority, there should be a higher bear burden of responsibility. We shouldn’t lower the threshold of expectations. We should hold people in authority to at least the same standard if not a higher standard of the people they support service and represent.
They can but it could possibly frame them as incompetent or a video will probably show up that they "knew" and now they have a perjury charge which is supposed to be an automatic dismissal. So better than nothing. Needs to be a state level rule instead of a city rule though.
In my experience police are the least trustworthy people around. The lying isn’t limited to investigating something either. It’s constant, it’s a way of life. It’s part of the power trip
Hang onto that thought. Police these days CANNOT be trusted nor expected to be upfront with you. Yes, it's just sad that we have come to this, but we have. Police, for the most part, would lie to their own mother if it would get them a confession to whatever heinous criminal act you've been ACCUSED of, NOT PROVEN GUILTY OF DOING, but ACCUSED of under their watchful and thorough investigation 😢😢😢
I had a police officer demand I open my trunk and even put his hand on his gun. Clearly threatening to shoot me if I told him no. I just smiled and said, "you will have to draw and aim, then demand I open it against my rights." I don't like bullies.
i have a problem with the " knowingly lying " part. they usually get around that by being idiots . like qualified immunity were it has to be clearly established. " oh i didn't know i wasn't allowed to steal from people's home's". or acting in good faith were they didn't do it out of malice they just didn't know any better. it encourages bad behavior because they know they have many options to get away with it. but i'll give them credit for even trying to do something about it.
I question whether the current class of cops is bright enough to remember which lies they told to whom. Not a lot of Rhodes scholars on the Force, are there?
@@writerinfact1768 they even tried to change the policy on body camera's to allow them to look at all the footage before righting their statements. fortunately law makers saw through their BS reasons.
The real question is why does every cop enter a situation with us presuming we are a criminal or guilty and we are supposed to enter a situation with them treating them with all the respect in the world and assuming they're there to help.
I have a friend that has been involved in law enforcement for over 30 years, he is now a US MARSHALL. He told me in conversation once that cops are allowed to lie to you inder the pretense of causing you to make confessions or admissions to crimes in their investigation. They can tell you false information, threaten you with being arrested or charged in order to force you into cooperation with their investigations, basically if they can imply that lying to you is necessary to gain information relating to a crime, even if you are not the person who commited the crime, it is justified on their part, and free from being held accountable under perjury or entrapment or coercion. He said when they say " if you tell me now i can help you " or whenever they appear to be engaging you in "friendly conversation" things like that, they are hoping you will say something that they can use against you, no matter how innocent or generalized it may seem to you. How you word things you say can be manipulated and implied by them to insinuate your guilt or involvement in a crime. He told me, NEVER, EVER GIVE CONSENT TO ANYTHING, IF THEY SHOW UP AT YOUR DOOR,AND SAY THEY HAVE A WARRANT SO YOU NEED TO OPEN THE DOOR AND LET THEM IN, THEY ARE LYING, IF THEY HAVE A WARRANT, THEY DONT KNOCK ON THE DOOR, THEY BUST THE DOOR DOWN AND COME IN. THEM KNOCKING ON THE DOOR IS ALWAYS PROOF THEY DONT HAVE A WARRANT. SO HE SAYS, DO NOT EVER OPEN THE DOOR ONCE YOU KNOW ITS THE COPS. YOU ARE NOT LEGALLY OBLIGATED TO LET THEM IN, NO MATTER WHAT THEY SAY, NO MATTER WHAT THEY THREATEN TO DO IF YOU DONT OPEN THE DOOR, DONT OPEN THE DOOR! THEY CANNOT DO ANYTHING, WITHOUT A WARRANT, AND IF THEY DO BUST IN YOUR HOUSE AFTER YOU HAVE REFUSED TO OPEN THE DOOR, THEY ARE PUTTING THEMSELVES IN A SITUATION WHERE THEY MUST NOW BE ABLE TO PROVE BEYOND A SHADOW OF A DOUBT THEY HAD EXIGENT CIRCUMSTANCES OF SOMEONE BEING IN EMINENT DANGER. THAT IS VERY HARD FOR THEM TO PROVE IN COURT, BECAUSE THE PERSON THEY CLAIM THEY NEEDED TO SAVE HAS TO TESTIFY OF THE DANGER THEY WERE IN FEAR OF. He told me dont get violent or verbally abusive with cops but dont believe anything cops are telling you as gospel truth, everything they say during any interaction with you is being said with an agenda behind it.
