8 MWh is way too low for most small houses in nordic countries. Trippel that 24MWh / year and most normal villa with two electric cars is covered. I have a small villa and a heatpump, live alone and only one EV. that I don't use much. I use about 8MWh / year.
My Grand father did the same thing with an old wind charger back in the 40's through the 70's until he sold the ranch. He stored the HO in a tractor tire tube tied to the bottom of a water tank. The weight of the water provided the pressure to push out the gas to the cook stove. I think he even had a shop cutting torch or maybe a brazing torch powered by OXY and HO.
@@apollo8352 I was 8 years old when my father explained how it worked in 1972. My grandfather and father set it up. I have only seen one other system like it. It was in central S.D. and I was hauling hot water from a geothermal spring back to a drilling rig in the oil field. The spring heated all the outbuildings then the ranch house, But I digress, the rancher that had the spring also had a similar Hydrogen fuel set up and he built the burners for his cook stove and I believe he also built the tips for his cutting torch. It had to do with orifice size to burn properly. In both set ups the gas generator housing was a glass battery case.
@@lorencolt Hi there.....we seem to forget town gas was originally hydrogen, before they changed it to the more polluting natural gas hydro carbon.....if memory serves me, all they did to convert from hydrogen to natural gas was change the gas jets. But I especially like your grandfathers gas manometer storage..... I played around with hydrogen and fuel cells trying to store electricity as hydrogen then changing it back to electricity when I needed it...but storage was always an issue since it leaks out of most things, but a tractor tire tube under water is genius! Of course with these hydrogen cars they have realised you need a facility like NASA to liquefy hydrogen so it takes up about 17000 times less space....so storing hydrogen as a gas enough to travel a car long distances requires really high pressure storage, I think they are looking at in excess of 30 Bars, which is a hell of a lot if energy taken up by storage. Thanks for your reply
@@apollo8352 If big gov did not make it illegal to buy (But not use?) due to it being used in weapons, Lithium-6 Deuteride works perfectly to bond hydrogen so it can be stored at much lower pressure. Research is being done to use a carbon matrix for lower pressure storage.
Great idea. Never work in Australia because government will never let decentralised elect/h2 production as this will erode the profits of the foreign owned energy companies.
@@divergentthg7925 The government is sleeping with big business & the US. I do not understand the average voter, they seems unaware of the power and corruption in the government. They are more interested in sports and social media....I know it is not only AU, but we are better at getting Donald Ducked.
The future looks fascinating! Everything is advancing super fast on all areas of technology atm. The biggest revolution in clean energy is happening right under our eyes!
Unless their electrodes are Platinum it's a gimmick. I've been working with hydrogen for over 15 years I have built things similar to this 10 years ago. The problem is that the electrodes do not last unless you're a government agency you have some kind of government sponsorship doubt you're going to be able to keep replacing electrodes. I have a brand new prototype I'm about to finish building but it cost me almost $4,000 to build it. The reason is because the electrodes cost me 3970 dollars. My containment units are already rapidly produced. I figured that out years ago. There's also a certain point where during a long run you have to worry about tridium buildup as well as deuterium causing your water to become less conductive. It's only happens after the unit's been running for a few months but can be problematic. Deuterium does not do any damage to the containment unit as long as water will not hurt that containment unit, heavy water will not allow electricity to flow properly though. Tritium is a free radical that is produced during electrolysis process. Depending on if you're storing fuel or continuously using it on demand tritium can become a problem. I found this out the hard way when some of my containment units started to Glow after 3 months of continuous use. Who knows how long I had been breathing tritium before I knew I needed to vent through a bubbler and outside of the shop to empty the units.
Clever idea. The winter might gum up your moister from the air portion as water has been known to freeze during the winter. Also, hydrogen, because it is a very small molecule,, has been known to be adsorb into iron. Thereby making iron vessels a sort of sieve. My guess that the team that put this nifty idea together would benefit from the advice of a Chemist.
It's not this company has been crushed by people who know physics and math on linkedin. One panel does 125 liters at atmospheric pressure on a sunny day. Which translates to 0.33kWh a day. That is NOTHING for a solar panel. And then you still have to bring it under pressure which also loses energy to store it. Then bring it into a fuel cell which you lose another 50% of energy to get electricity back. While conventional Lithium batteries have an IN-OUT efficiency of 90%.
*sigh* Hello unnecessary skeptic. I didn't hear anyone say the tank was made of IRON. I didn't hear anyone say that the tank didn't have an internal coating. I didn't hear anyone say that there were buckyballs involved. Did you Mr. Skeptic? No? I didn't think so. STOP TRYING TO STOP ADVANCES, either because you paid to, or because you are just a total defeatest. The reason doesn't matter - and frankly, no one should bother to listen.
No matter what color hydrogen is made, the gas piping of the house heated by natural gas will need changed to safely use hydrogen. Hydrogen gas embrittles most metals and plastics and also leaks very readily... in some cases, it can leak through the walls of the tubing or storage container, not just any fitting joints.
You are absolutely correct. A home hydrogen tank will leak (eventually) and it is extremely explosive. Storing hydrogen at home will be about as safe as storing nitroglycerin. These Green Energy dreamers are so out of touch with reality it isn't funny. They're going to get somebody killed.
They didn't say hydrogen will come through the gas main. They said a gas made from hydrogen has the same properties and could safely mix with mains gas and be used for green steel production.
It sounds far too good. The manufacturer and The Futurist conveniently ignore the problems associated with hydrogen. Storage is extremely tricky, it leaks very easily. Also, have you considered the problem of hydrogen embrittlement?
Exactly. For what it would cost to install these very complex panels, install high-pressure, leak proof pipes, fittings and pressure vessels, you could install standard panels, battery storage and buy a nice EV with vehicle to load capability.
Yeah they need to stop lying. You can't replace fissile fuels. What are you going to use to power a Bucket Wheel Excavator? What are you going to use to replace IV tubes with? Can someone show me an alternative solution to a jet engine that does not use petrochemicals? We have nothing that can replace petroleum products.
In most case it only needs to be stored for a short time. People have done this in the past and now we have better materials. Hydrogen is a small atom that can pass through some materials. That is a fact, but it doesn't need to discourage all progress. It has incredible energy density and it is the most common atom in the universe. I used to play with it when I was a kid, I think it has potential.
@@rowgler1 Energy density of hydrogen is low compared to other fuels, just google it. Also, it can be liquified only at very low temperatures and high pressure.
You lost me a bit earlier than this, but the comment "It extracts water from the humidity in the air" reveals the project is highly likely, not feasible. There are several issues here that I can raise off the top of my head: 1) you'd need a little power plant for each panel (huge waste and not practicable). 2) current process for water electrolysis is about 70-80%% efficient - so, to produce 1 kg of hydrogen (143 MJ/kg or about 40 kWh/kg) requires 50-55 kWh of electricity. Then lose another 30% of energy converting back to electricity. If each panel is say 400w, which will produce about 2kw a day, we get 1kw loss due to conversion, meaning in 1 month gives 20kw of power. This does not consider storage and compression energy loss). 3) you cannot extract enough water from the air at a good rate for this to even work (wasting more power for fans needing to move air about - specifically, air has a density of about 1.2 g/L, and water has a density of about 1 kg/L. if you had perfect capture (not possible), you need to shift 830 L of air. Actually, I take it back, the conversion rates for a panel are so poor, this may work, but you'd be better off relying on rain. In any case, this is more wasted power. 4) you need more than just water and solar power to extract hydrogen. 5) If in liquid form, hydrogen needs to be stored at -252.8 to remain a liquid, with over 5,000psi. As a gas, it has a low energy density and requires compression to 4 times that of natural gas. This all costs energy, so you will lose power to convert water to hydrogen and to just by keeping the gas. 6) there will be a high maintenance cost with so many separate power plants and complicated storage/conversion methods. Simply put, the cost for all of this is very prohibitive with little return on investment. You'd be far better off storing the electrons in a battery as this process is uncomplicated, loses little by way of storage losses, is cheaper, does not require storage of hydrogen on-sight.... look, nice idea (*cough*), but makes very little sense at a local level due to the massive cost, loss of electricity during conversions, complicated storage, already having better technology to do the same job.
Sign me on, it is a great idea and seems perfectly viable to me. Such a project would be ideal for all remot habitations from the Himilayas upto the Alps
These hydrogen panels has been developped by the university of Leuven and a spin off is doing further resaech. This started 3-4 years ago. At this moment you can forget an installation at your home as the gas must be kept under high pressure tanks. Hydrogen at home is not yet profitable. Hydrogen is mainly used for ships, trucks trains and other heavvy transport. No not for a car.
@@TheNewMediaoftheDawn Its the only state that does this as they have a distribution network for hydrogen. Some firms ( as Colruyt ...) in belgiun has also hydrogen cars but its more for publicity.......we have a long way to go as now hydrogen for cars is way too expensif. That wil hopefully change in time.
Im in the ship industry. We install lately a lot of batteries. But had "almost" one hydrogen project. But Hydrogen is NOT used for ships yet. And trucks are now failing fast as batteries get better. Hydrogen is a failure.
As I have a heat pump which is working well and solar panels/ev I am looking at battery storage to maybe complete my setup. Conventionally using green hydrogen for heating versus a heat pump requires 6 times more wind/solar. Not sure how stored hydrogen could be used with a heat pump and I am more than happy with my EV but I can see this might work for an industrial unit where they have space to install .
@D M Since Jun 22 I have achieved an average COP of 3.55. even at current UK cap cost of heat Gas = 10.3/0.9= 11.44p/kWh Electric = 35/3.55= 9.86p/kWh. However we have cheap off peak so our average cost of electric is about 26p/ kWh so cost of heat about 7.3p/kWh. Saving on our heat requirement 11184* (11.44-7.3) = £458 . Inc no standing charge over £500 cheaper. For DHW we have solar and night tariff etc.
Hydrogen eats through piping.I have generated my own independently for about 7 years. Same problem with syngas. All you have to do is hook up the dc output and pass it through water. This automatically splits it. Most set ups you see on youtube DON'T split the hydrogen from the oxygen,like you should. The major problems are storage and safety. If you wanted heat....simply make a sand battery. Heat it using the electricity.Release its heat when required. The larger the battery the more heat you can store. Basically this battery is merely a length of resistance wire which is embedded in sand. The wire heats the sand during the day.If your battery is stored below the house and has hollow pipes running through it,simply by pumping air through it the heat transfers to the air in the house. The maintenance of this device is minimal,and a d''''ned sight safer then hydrogen and could be built by any 12year old. (As proven by my kids) Now,if you will excuse me my eldest wants to show me how he can make a small pyrotechnic explosion using flour,a candle,a tin and a bike pump whilst I prep some sandbags 😸
We don't need hydrogen tanks, a company in the US is using a "music" disk or cassette for storage the hydrogen and they were saying they've achieved 220 miles of range per cassette for electric cars, which would need only a battery of 5-6 kwh storage.
I'm only interested because of the decentralized nature of the tech. I think carbon based fuels are still superior in most every other respect. But being able to make your own hydrogen off grid is defiantly a big win.
The problem is you dont have a household export of hydrogen. You'd need all the piping to support export, and getting to where it needs. Which would still be a massive costly infrastructure change.
a couple of times you mention using photocatalytic hydrogen production (direct light->splits water using catalyst) but all the images show a photoelectric cell in the front implying that the standard electrochemical process powered by photoelectrics is being used ... which is it?
Why are people still trying to store hydrogen at high pressure, dangerously explosive gas or liquid? In the 1970s a safe hydrogen storage system was developed in California. It was the the size of a car gasoline tank and consisted of 3 tanks of storage medium. The hydrogen binds with the lattice of the storage medium. It doesn't leak out, it doesn't explode, it doesn't require high pressure, it doesn't require cryogenic temperature. It can store enough energy to power a car.
@Ricky Supriyadi not really. You see, I read about this stuff back in the 1970s. I do recall that one of the materials is graphitic carbon nitride. It stores the hydrogen in the lattice structure of the material.
I think it is part of the answer for the future as long the other parts of the solution come together, battery storage,gas storage tanks,the cost has to come down as it will in the future.
Wow. Glad to see KWH correction in comments. Currently have 7.5 kW of solar panels with cycles of un-used PV power after battery bank is full. ... Wondering IF hydrogen generation could use my solar power via 120 vac output instead of your solar panels??? ... to produce hydrogen in an inner tube at bottom of a water tank. ??? Have you reviewed pros and cons of such options. I would love to have such an options for home heating (in addition to my mini split heat pumps), and maybe kitchen stove.
The silliest thing in the process is at 3.02. When pure Oxygen is being produced do not waste it leaving to the air. . One can use it for filling Oxygen cylinders. This Oxygen can in purified form be used in Hospital, Industry related to Burning, bunker oxygen supply, indoor plant cultivation, as a car fuel to burn limited amount of it as alternative to petroleum products etc. 😊😊😊
This product has similarities to SunHydrogen’s product but may be using very different chemical reactions. Green hydrogen needs to compete with grey, brown and blue hydrogen. Finally whatever form of hydrogen your using has to compete with the various other means of storing energy including using gravity as a long term means of energy storage as you can do with pumping water up to a high reservoir or lifting heavy weights up and down.
If you follow their numbers, it produces enough hydrogen in a day to drive an HFCV about 2km. A solar panel the same size would produce enough to go about 12km in a typical EV, and you don't have to figure out storage, compression, etc. I'm afraid that going from electricity to hydrogen and back again will always be an unnecessary and energy-wasting side trip. If you could do it without that being the case, you've invented perpetual motion.
Several years ago, Cambridge University made multicoloured organic solar cells producing electricity at about 12% efficiency and I’m wondering if the intermediate was sugar. If so then the storage problem could be solved
Too costly enthusiast will own but not everyone. Because fuel cell system will cost a lot and now a days we can't predict the weather everywhere on the planet. And it's still dangerous to have hydrogen as storage for homes.
With hydrogen, we can still use our conventional ICE (internal combustion engine) vehicles with some modifications, enabling them to run on pure hydrogen. This would make our ICE vehicles clean energy vehicles, even cleaner than EVs.
Great idea. Now you will only have to pay around $50k to get the rest of the car converted to run on hydrogen. Plus the $300k to get the equipment to compress and store the hydrogen. Then you will need about 120 of those panels to create enough hydrogen to be useful for driving. Good luck with that.
@@Aircam73 I'm not talking about ALL of it. I'm talking about people who wish to use their ICE vehicles instead of buying a new and dedicated one. That would be cleaner.
@@Schjoenz What I am saying is most people that say things like you keep saying know almost nothing about hydrogen. You can't just convert the engine and start running it on hydrogen. It would take around $50k just to convert your car to run on hydrogen. You would have to rip out the entire fuel system, gut the trunk, cut holes in the body and run high pressure tubing throughout. To put enough hydrogen tanks into a car to make it get close to 200 miles of range with a very inefficient ICE you will take up the entire trunk area, all of the under seat areas with very expensive high pressure tanks. The people who have done it said the cost alone for all the equipment is close to $50k and if you got someone else to do it you are looking at close to $100k. All so you can buy fuel that isn't available, costs 4 times as much and now your car gets half the range it once did. Sounds like a great idea.
the cheapest version of the picea system costs about 60000 Euros. Their are quite a few systems already running in Germany since 2018. Instead of installing a swimming pool in your garden, you install such a system 😊. The good thing of the system is: it is very reliable technology and good german engineering. Picea builds about 100 systems per year. Scaling up will bring the prices down. The core technology is modular and not bigger than a refrigerator, with two parts: the hydrolysis unit and the hydrogen fuel cell unit, which turns h2 back to electricity and heat. Greetings from Franconia
Hydrogen is a stand alone fuel that doesn't need to be converted into something else. When using hydrogen to power vehicles never throw away the oxygen as that's the secret to powering all types of vehicles as when water is broken down the resulting gases comes with all the oxygen it needs for complete combustion, thus any oxygen sucked into the combustion chamber will be extra.
We are using Hhø fuel cells to drive out vehicles for last 10 years. Your research in the combination of both solar & hydrogen may help us to over come the energy shortage.
I am not a good science student,, is there any climatic impact by drawing hydrogen from air/moisture , will it make the city dry ? or hot? or does it affect any other element.
It's was first done in the 80's - 100sqft flex film ( ala; mylar ) pannel focused on a coffee can of *two metals oxides with a catalytic gas... It was able to heat / cool and cook as well as genarate electricity. Or it could be used as a desaltalation by freezing 1,000 gallons of salt water.... * I/2lb of titanium and magnesium oxide
I'm all for renewable energy sources. Many will be developed. The only problem I have with all this is that it is so expensive that low income people will be left out of the renewable energy revolution. In the past that's the way it was. Environmental injustices has always been forced upon low-income people. The least upon us have always had to pay the price with their health & wallet. I hope there is research being done so that everybody can partake of clean energy sources regardless of income levels..
If you lose containment of hydrogen - It goes straight up to outer space... Lost... Methane gas is weighed down by a carbon atom, so the 4 hydrogen atoms are not lost to space. Methane gas is easy to make. The fuel is decaying plants. It's the perfect fuel. And it forms a closed cycle for re-use.
Im always a little fesrful of millions of people extracting humidity from air. It seems like that is going to make some difference to local climate. I know my country does use artificial rain from time to time, but only sparingly because it does affect the weather (lower rainfall) nearby and delay rain nearby. zapping humidity out everywhere but by bit could have similar effect. Given that it return to water when converted back, it also need with humidity comes that time.
"Im always a little fesrful of millions of people extracting humidity from air." Obviously only the people at the edge of town are going to get anything at all.
There are literally millions of cubic kilometres of liquid water in the sky plus vapour. The visible stuff is called clouds. The invisible stuff is called vapour. The surface of the earth is 2/3 covered in water
There is no such thing as cheap H2. The phical laws of thermodynamics enthalpy and entropy means that the energy cost of producing H2 will always be high and the storage and transport costs are even more ridiculously high. However H2 is essential for making ammonia for fertilizers for food production.
Not convinced. Electrolysis manufacturing is generally a 70% efficient solution. If I understood this correctly, they referred to waste heat being used from this process, making it more efficient. I live in Georgia. I don't need heat in the summer. I'm trying to get rid of heat in the summer!!. Then storage. Low pressure tanks would be enormous. High pressure tanks cost you another 30% to run the compressors. Then the whole process appears extremely complex, and prone to a need for lots of maintenance. Hydrogen, being the smallest of atoms, is the hardest to contain. Picture building a storage container out of bowling balls to contain bbs. When the bbs(hydrogen) invade the spaces between the bowling balls(steel tank) they cause weak places in the vessel called Hydrogen embrittlement, which can lead to failure. 6-9000 psi tanks are not something you want to fail. The process of turning hydrogen into synfuel creates a whole other layer of complexity, inefficiency, and adds more failure points in the chain. Not sure of the solution for populations in the northern latitudes. This seems like an extremely complex, inefficient, and failure prone one. Geothermal from areas suited for that with gigavolt DC transmission lines to distribute would seem more logical and viable. Of course it doesn't allow you to live your off grid dream.
so basically instead of using standard battery for storage, it use hydrogen as fuel for fuel cell which replace battery completely. the idea is good, but how efficient are these in real situation? 🤔
I can see great possibilities for this because Our infant structures can’t currently consistently maintain our electrical needs if we look at building houses in the future and how we update what houses we have so that they are more energy efficient this could possibly be a great part of our energy dependence this could be great for everyone but what are the side effects of hydrogen how dangerous is it there’s a lot of things that we just don’t know
Not sure about the hole need to go green to save the planet thing but having a small off grid system I will say the storage of solar energy is my biggest issue. Current batteries have come along way but it’s still to expensive and difficult to manage the energy production. A small economical hydrogen battery would go along way in helping me get the most benefit out of my system
We make energy storage from used batteries from electric vehicles with an efficiency of over 90%. The cost of building such a warehouse is over 70% cheaper than buying a new one.
But for 60% waste heat in Winter months in southern regions will not be useful since solar is available during winter time. So need heat recovery plans for other regions. Good for use in western city regions and homes.
For home use hydrogen is a long way off making sense because of the extra energy needed to compress it to a practical volume, with sodium batteries scaling up now I'd say it will be available at half the current cost of Lfp within a decade, at that point it will be hard to beat in terms of cost, efficiency, longevity and the simplicity of no moving parts. Even Lfp is probably going to drop in price a lot in the meantime and already makes sense for those savvy enough to build their own system creating about a 3 to 5 year payback, then enjoy another decade of zero power bills.
The Solhyd Project's Hydrogen Solar Panel represents an exciting development in the field of renewable energy, as it offers a decentralized, off-grid solution for green hydrogen production. By addressing some of the challenges associated with large-scale battery systems and conventional solar panels, this innovation could help accelerate the transition to cleaner energy sources. However, it's important to continue evaluating the efficiency, cost, and scalability of this technology to better understand its potential impact on the energy landscape, including its competitiveness with other hydrogen production methods and energy storage alternatives
Given the difficulties and challenges involved with storing hydrogen, feeding back to a fuel cell likely makes more sense and would be safer as the system could be designed to do this. Piping hydrogen into the home for direct use as a fuel sounds like a bad idea and dangerous. Natural gas was chosen for this for very good reasons of safety and even that requires special design. Overall, residential hydrogen is a bit concerning. Hydrogen is a very small molecule, thats why it was used to make the old airships float, remember what happened to the Hindenburg outside of New York.
@@jliengkul Of course we have an answer, there is so many hiden patents which can use. Consumer system is our enemy, technology development is purposely blocked.
In winter& rainy day they would not produce nothing like ordinary ones too but it will costs alot and longevity are not so good but that everyone avoid to tell
Few governments would be willing to give up the cash cow that is refueling your car. They will probably put in a regulation saying that residential neighborhoods cannot store so much or such and such explosive stuff within so far of another neighbor. Cutting out most neigberhoods from having something like this.
I doubt your neighbor would want to live next to someone who had a hydrogen storage tank, ask your insurance company if you can afford it. If you think the East Palestine train derailment was bad, imagine hydrogen in those tanks
If we add these solar hydrogen panels as roofs to our freeway system to collect rain water as well, we can build some vertical farms around both the water and energy sources on top of the decentralized implementation of home top solar hydrogen.
What's the catch? If we are all using this and taking condensation out of the atmosphere, does that not mean that we are reducing our H2O count? (amount of water on the planet)
Well if you combust the Hydrogen with Oxygen then you create Water so it goes back where it came from. Food for thought: When 1 liter of Gasoline is combusted it creates about 1 liter of Water aside from the CO2 and NOx, did the air humidity go up with the extensive use of fossil fuels over past century?
What I am confused about is... does it use a solar panel to generate electricity that then produced hydrogen? Because if so, why not just use already existing electricity to produce hydrogen in one place? Why need for the retrofit?
hace 5 años fabrique un generador de hidrogeno y oxigeno solar puse dos laminas de acero inoxidable vivía orilla de lago semis salado inserte laminas en agua salada del lago paneles solares generaban la corriente para el generador de hidrogeno gas proveniente lo almacenaba en una camara de camión cuando se llenaba desconectaba usaba gas de hidrogeno como combustible ya sea como para soldar o cocinar fue una idea de garage
Make the first Solar Super Tanker and the World will at least look... The major issue with Hydrogen is the long term safe handling! Clean, yes! Dangerous as hell very easy due to handling, YES!!!
4-8 KWH a year for 20 panels that look expensive? The cost of the Hpanels surpass the Spanels and battery duo by A LOT. In Quebec we can need up to 256 KWH a day in a well insulated 4 members household. It is cool, but it is like comparing a toddler running and a rocket.
