I have had several people in the comments take me to task for calling people who do modular synthesis "stupid." LET ME BE CLEAR. In this video, I am not calling any person, or any type of synthesis "stupid." Where I used the word stupid is referring SPECIFICALLY to the user interface in modular synths, where the controls of the synthesizer itself are completely covered and made inaccessible by patch cables.
Scott - I have enjoyed several of your videos over this past year and I went ahead and subscribed to your channel as of this one. You have some marvelous information here and I appreciate your efforts to educate your viewers on the power of a flexible mod matrix and how it provides a routing path similar to what you can do with a modular synth. I also appreciate your choice of the Hydrasynth as a teaching tool because of the excellent layout of the signal path and how you can utilize the shortcut to link things in the mod matrix by holding your source and tapping the destination. I feel that we have a similar appreciation of synth architectures based on the instruments we own in common. In addition to the Hydrasynth, I also have a Summit, a System-8, and a MicroFreak. Having said that, I really have an issue with you using the word "stupid." No matter how you choose to qualify it, the word has no purpose in this conversation. You yourself say at 4:26, "I don't know that there is a better alternative." You have no valid argument for criticizing something with such harsh words if you cannot provide a better option. The critique itself is valid. But calling it "stupid" is not. The best teachers in my life NEVER used that word. In your clarification sentences, you identify valid critiques. I get that the cords obstructing the interface is horribly user unfriendly and terribly inefficient. Expressing that is valid and useful as a teacher. Using the word "stupid" makes you sound unintelligent. The explanation of your frustration with the interface and its inability to preserve and restore a sound once created is valid. That is insightful and enlightening. The word "stupid" is not. One other critique I will offer for you: You appear to understand how to use modular, at least in theory. However, the one physical patch you make on the Model D (your semi-modular instrument example), is a mistake. At 7:47 you claim that you are patching the LFO to the "filter input." If you look at the video, you will note that you patched the LFO (output) to the filter contour (output). You don't patch outputs to outputs in modular. You probably meant to plug the cable into the CUT CV (input) which would use the LFO to modulate the filter cutoff frequency. To be clear, I often find your videos insightful and entertaining. I appreciate colleagues who wish to share what they know. I wish I had more time to get back to posting my own videos. However, I would heartily encourage you to abandon using the word "stupid" and review your content for mistakes before posting. Keep up the good work and, as always, thank you for sharing. Peace.
there's a very vocal and toxic portion of the synthesizer community online luckily most people in this hobby are brilliant and kind people it's funny because you start your video basically praising modular, even though it's not for you didn't get the vibe that you called anyone stupid I think one of the issues with synthesizers is just how many different ways there are to use them some people are exclusively focussed on patch creation and sound generation some love sequencing some will only ever touch the filter knob and spend most time on the keybed
Bless you, Scott, but modular synths require a completely different point of view. It's all about being spontaneous. We don't care that that great sound we just found can't be saved - we relish finding it, using it and moving on to other great sounds. Improvisation is the forte of the modular synth. Every performance, every jam is unique and that's the point. If I want polyphony or patch memories, of course, I have other synths that can do that. The right tool for the right job. You're spot on with modular being a rabbit hole, but we don't collect different oscillators as much as clever modules that offer intriguing new ways of doing things and chime with our workflow. Yes, we suffer from GAS - but hey, you're sitting there surrounded by keyboard synths so it's not like we're the only ones...! 😉 What I would say against modular is that it's a money pit that will almost certainly never pay for itself. We do it purely for the love of it. Anyway, keep up the good work. I love your reviews and recommendations, and thank you for steering me towards the Argon8!
Well said. Making the patch and the journey there is much of the fun. Some performers pull their entire patch each time and the patching process is part of the performance. Modern sequencers, knowing how to transpose using another sequencer, polyrhythms, etc., are all part of creating interesting music. So is sampling to other hardware or software and making patches that can be saved.
Fact: Synths were created by moog let help people create something that sounded musical without knowing how to play music. It always been about making randomness.
Not even close. The difficulty of saving/recreating sounds/patches is the greatest failing of modular synthesis. The increased timbral possibilities are worth it in spite of this fundamental flaw.
I am sort of surprised by comments that some communities are in tension over modular versus self-contained synths. I just love synths, their sounds, and music made using them. I don't feel bound to any particular thing. I dig patchable (or semi-modular) synths, too. They are all good.
I would say it mostly stems from bad demos of modular, making a lot of people thinking that it just sounds too different from typical synthesis, and thus makes no sense. But modular is a way to combine components of different synths, or use modules with features that no other synths has, to build unique variations of sounds, that could benefit any sound designer interested in making their own unique variations of sounds. But demos and many modular musicians only make bleep bloop of various of FX noises. That has made many synth enthusiasts think modular is just a bad way of making synthesized sounds, and not useful in a musical context.
Eurorack is bankruptcy on the installment plan. I’ve been building my system over 12 years. I love it! The thing I think you’re missing is that, as someone who grew up during the age of the DX7 and the menu driven synthesizer operating system, euro and modular in general provides a physical and tactile experience. Let you manipulate the sound at the lowest possible level. It can take you into a lot of unexpected places, and, for me anyway, it becomes a sort of meditative process of alternate composition. the patch becomes the composition. At the same time, the physical limitations of having no polyphony, or only one of a specific module, makes you have to be economical in your signal path choice. This is where software like VCV don’t replace it. VCV is a cheat that lets you get around some of the best parts of modular in that you do have limitations, and if you don’t record what you’re doing, it is gone- there is no coming back later.
I agree with you that modern synths who have a modulation matrix have almost the same flexibility as modular systems in terms of sound design. So as long as you stay with a standard signal path, you can do pretty much anything in terms of modulations. Of course you can’t do unusual things like inserting a reverb between an oscillator output and a vca input or other non standard signal paths. However not all people who have a modular system end up with a wall full of modules buried under a mountain of patch cables. I’ve seen people do some great things with a relatively small setup with a handful of modules.
@@thiagoborges892 True, though. I have a couple of 90s megasynths (Yamaha EX5, Technics WSA1) that are cursed by menu hell. Never used them to their full potential, because life's too short to navigate a Yamaha manual! Modular = see it, do it.
There's a ton of menu diving and button combos in modular too... You're only talking about the simpler modules like Buchla clones and other analog stuff.
I 100% agree with you Scott. I had a very large Modular system with all the "must have" modules. It was very frustrating and a very expensive endeavor. I sold it all off and replaced it with two ASM Hydrasynth Deluxes, a Novation Summit and a Modal Argon 8X. These are much more musical IMHO.
As a long time modular advocate … it’s not for everyone. HOWEVER it also does not need to be a rats nest of wires, nor does it need to be vastly expensive or just a blips and bloops etc etc. this is often the view of those who either have never worked for long periods with modular or only in a passing hobby form. Most people I know who work in modular a lot select and arrange our modules in an ergonomic and rather clean routing set up that avoids too many cables in the way or knobs too close together or obscured … blaming poor cable management on modular itself is just incorrect.
Another advantage of using the Hydrasynth over a modular is that it is polyphonic. Try doing that with your modular setup! Not to mention the poly aftertouch….
I do poly quite often with several of my different modular synths, but only 4 voice max. Here's a brief example of a 4 voice modular patch with poly after touch, nothing particularly unique though and probably any decent keyboard synth with poly after touch could do the same . . .in fact the Osmose keyboard I was using just as a controller could have done it all by itself without all of the modules! 😅: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-TSqf1RFcvlw.html
I am currently recording and using my BARP 2600 to create bass. I am about to change things to get a nice lead. I am frightened to change the settings I have. My son looked at me, took out his phone, and took a picture of the settings and patch cabling. I am subscribed!
I think it is a special kind of art, working with modular synths. I'm interested in them, but would not want to have one myself, exactly because of the reasons you mentioned. But I'm getting more and more interested in the Hydrasynth...
Isn't it beautiful how we all experience the same technology in different ways? I can totally see your point of view, yet, I see it different on a few levels. No wrong or right, but just different perspectives. I love sounds, I love music, I love technology and like modular (or semi modular). It scratches an itch that the music of Bach doesn't for example and vice versa. There is something beautifully temporary and hypnotic about modular patches, knowing its probable gone forever once you start to play around. There is also a depth in every instrument that only can be viewed once you get that deep into it. Some modular experts have a depth of understanding as reference that's related to non-modular synth yet it's own sink hole. Think fractals, every junction leads to something unique yet similar. You know what I would like? A follow up with a modular guru to exchange perspectives you thoughtfully bring across. Great video en thanks for sharing your thoughts on a great topic! Respect & peace my fellow synth lover!
I have loads of synths from playing throughout the last 35 years. Modular is what got me excited about synthesis again. It’s so fun, so creative, and although it may not seem practical or easy, it makes the most incredible music. Still love synths but Modular’s just bring the fun and creativity back into music - for me
Personally I love to play with it, and I love sampling it, but the cost outweighs the benefits -- at least for me. If I had a lot of cash I'd _definitely_ have some huge case full of top-shelf modules!
While I'm sure there are endless amounts of great music being made with large modular setups, Imo, at least 80% of the "modular jams" I see posted online end up ironically, sounding pretty samey. Most of the most common and widely used modules tend to lead people towards things that often sound like generative bleeps and bloops. While I'm sure those bleeps are a blast to create for the artist, they do next to nothing for me, personally. I think another thing that leads to a very particular type of sound, is true polyphony is very rare in modular setups. This leads to the most common compositions being written around a bunch of different monophonic synth voices. Which is neither good or bad, just different, and in a way that I personally find less enjoyable to listen to
All true, and I agree with your points. But that isn't stopping me Ha! The hook for me is the ability to build your own unique instrument. The patching process and subsequent discovery process is a total adventure and is so good for my self help regiment. Despite the spaghetti. Thanks for all the vids!
Some of us absolutely love the engineering and creative exploration components of modular. For others, that gets in the way of making music. There's no point in dissing one method or the other just because it doesn't suit you.
I respectfully disagree. There is definitely a point in discussion because it might save someone from buying something they don't want or need. For a musician who wants to write and record songs and is strapped for cash, modular might be an awful choice, but for someone who really wants to have fun and experiment with sound, then keyboard synths might be very disappointing.
@@bveracka Anybody who buys stuff they don't want is an idiot, so that's on them. As for buying stuff they don't need, well, nobody 'needs' a hardware synthesizer. Why can't we live and let live.
@@bveracka Doesn't seem that you disagreed with me, you simply expounded on the "eurorack is not for everyone" angle, and I agree with that completely.
@@brianbrill Yep, that's partially because when I read it on my phone, I thought you'd typed "no point in _discussing"_ incorrectly, when you'd actually typed "[…]dissing". 😆 Still, I'd say the point stands on solid ground. People get into modular for generally two different reasons - either as songwriters or as synth enthusiasts who want to have fun channelling electricity into all sorts of beautiful and weird sounds. If you're really into songwriting, composing, performing, and recording - and especially if you're on a bit of a budget - then modular is best saved for later. If you're the synth enthusiast type, then it has the potential to be a lot of fun. One caveat I'll add about modular is semi-modular, and how that can be an excellent bridge for newcomers to modular. The MakeNoise 0-Coast is a wonderful product. Anyways, you probably know this and don't need another essay from me! 👍🙂
100% with you but if I want to dive in the modular sound design rabbit hole I use VCV - you never run out of free modules - you can save your patch - and even the patch cables have always the right length and can be transparent
The problem with cables and cramped user interfaces isn't one of modular synthesis in itself, but of how many (but not all) modules are woefully designed. The Eurorack standard certainly isn't very helpful in this regard since it specifies a size that is very small. That said, when Eurorack basically was just Doepfer it wasn't too bad since Doepfer's modules are better designed compared to a lot of the things people make these days in terms of spacing between connection points and controls. My first foray into modular synthesis was with a single-unit Kilpatrick Phenol, and when you get used to how it is spaced, Eurorack feels too cramped to the point that when I wanted to integrate a Eurorackable synth (The Dreadbox Dysphonia) into my system, I DIY'ed a patch panel to get the cables away from the controls. There are other standards, of course, like 4U and 5U rather than the Eurorack 3U that allows more space, meaning wires don't get in the way of controls. Also, if you've not played much with modular yourself, you might be surprised how much less the cables get in the way than what it might look like in pictures. Those other standars also have fewer modules available, meaning it's less of a rabbit hole for people who constantly second-guess their choices. The shortcomings when it comes to saving patches is also one of the strengths of modular. Modular is ideally suited for those who do _not_ want to save patches and who want to start from scratch every time, or who want to explore the evolution of timbral and rhytmic variaton that they can create along the way as they patch, for which patch saving would be rather counter-productive, so it depends entirely on what the aim of your music making is. So while I love modular synthesis, or rather open-architecture synthesis (meaning any cable can be plugged into anything and nothing happens until cables are plugged in), I do agree that there is a scourge of modular these days. It's simply too much of everything everywhere, and that is also why there has been a trend the last few years for trying to design minimal systems. If you have a small system that covers the very basics, it is still amazing how many different sounds you can make with it, and the variety of sound you can get with just two oscillators, two filters, two modulators, and two VCA's is still more than any one person can exhaustively explore in a lifetime.
I started a synth meetup group several years ago - and eventually the group went to war with each other over this very thing. Some of the group wanted to talk about and demo nothing but modular setups. The others were musicians who actually used synths to play in musical situations and wanted to learn more about traditional synths and synthesis as it relates to music. The group actually disbanded eventually because of the nasty discourse. By that time I had moved out of state and just watched it all implode from afar. But it was sad. There seems to be an animosity between the two types of synth users that just will not disappear, no matter how similar they really are or their similar origins. I believe it really stems from a more basic dichotomy between people who can actually play music, and people that can't or choose not to play music using synthesizers. In fact some modular synthesists get very upset if someone even mentions making something musical with their gear. It's a very strange attitude IMO. Can't the two co-exist? Apparently not, as I witnessed.
The modular synth group I belong to actually has members that perform live and some members actually use some non-modular gear. Good heavens! We just need to squash the gatekeepers that say you can only do this or only do that. You want to make music then fine. You want to make bleeps and bloops then that's fine as well. These groups can co-exist if you stop the people that have the mentality that they can't.
You nailed it right on the head. I didn't want to come out and say exactly that in the video, for fear of alienating some of the viewers, but in my experience, the knob-twisting modular guys are obsessed with miniscule changes to patches to make exotic sounds and buying the latest whizzgadget to install into their rack, where the physical traditional synth guys are more interested in actually playing and producing music. The two factors can co-exist - but like I mentioned, it's usually happening when accomplished electronic musicians (Martin Gore, Vince Clarke, Rick Smith) delve into modular, and use their modular gear in creative ways to make actual music.
I tried to play along at several “Modular on the Spot” events. But they wouldn’t let me because my MakeNoise 0-coast was considered semi-modular with normaled circuits. Fortunately I got out of that space and found more inclusive groups to play with.
@@ScottsSynthStuff what do you mean by "actual music?" And how do you define music? I go by Edgard Varese's definition that music is "organized sound." I try not to exclude others in what they may believe is music. Have you listened to any minimalist composers like Steve Reich, John Adams, or Terry Riley? Would you consider what they produce music? It's very similar to what a lot of modular synthesists are doing with the minimal changes over time aspect.
I was at a synth event where they showcased all these modular synths. They had a stage and some of the guys performed on stage with their gear. They sounded cool but it was stressful to watch. Like guys on stage trying to put out a grease fire with panicked expressions on their faces.
I 100% agree with the comments in this video. As someone who spent his youth creating audio projects on breadboards with none surface mount components and reels of cables, I welcomed the digital age of synthesisers with open arms.
Another problem is: most modular is analog and depending on drift the sound you design may not be the same an hour from now or when you turn it back on the next day. I understand modular attraction, but I am musician and composer who sound designs for each song; modular is a little slow and I can't go back to a design two weeks ago to fit the song. So, even after 35 years of sound designing, I have no intensions of going modular, especially when playing chords from a keyboard is needed.
I'm one who subscribed after watching a couple of your videos. Every time you show us something about the Hydra, I am more and more convinced I need to get one. It will be the only hardware synth I own, everything else is software for me. But, I see it as both a wonderful, extremely capable synth as well as probably one of the best MIDI keyboard controllers out there. I want to save my ducats for the Delux; both for the dual synth engines as well as the larger keybed.
The Hydrasynth is so good. I was also saving up for the Deluxe, but after watching a lot of videos on the Explorer and the increase of my performing gigs I decided I didn't want to lug around the Deluxe and just picked up the Explorer on Black Friday. I've already used it at a couple of modular gigs and in a bunch of videos with my modular synth. So good for $500 I can't believe they didn't cut any corners on the engine and you just lose a few extra controls like the ribbon and some more knobs and cv in. I'll eventually pick up a Deluxe for my studio, but I'm thinking I might go for the Polybrute first as my Hydrasynth craving has been satiated for the moment.
I am also evaluating to buy a Deluxe... But living in a city in Italy it is difficult to have space at home. Scott's room full of keyboards is a dream. I have something to show too but most part is in their boxes, something under the bed... 😢
I play keyboards live in cover bands because I get fun. Other guys get fun twisting knobs and connecting cables. Everything is possible. Everyone can choose. When I want to lose one night catching a crazy sound, I open Voltage Modular of Cherry Audio with simulations of ARP 2500 and Moog System 55. I couldn't do in the reality and it is fun enough. Then I get back to some 70 or 80 rock song with an Hammond simulation. It's music, it makes me feel alive, sadly is not my job. Music can be everywhere, I like to sample strange sounds in my city and then play with granular on Pigments. Maybe on rainy weekends some Bach on hi-fi. Music, that's all
Pigments is incredible. The entire Arturia V collection is awesome especially since you can tweak all of the parameters like on the real synths. I love playing with VCV Rack and MiRack as well. Saving patches and copying and pasting modules. So much fun.
Nice to hear another viewpoint then your own. Personally I don’t have any issues with the cables or the interface of my system. And the no recall is pushing me to get things done, press record 😉
Hey Scott have to say I agree with you 100%. These are exactly the reasons I’ve never went (and probably never will) down the modular rabbit hole. The only benefit O can see is creating a really unique sound and then sampling it and importing it into say the. Wavestate
Hi Scott, there is a solution for you. It's called VCV RACK. A free Eurorack software emulation. Most of major hardware modules are emulated. Of course all can be memorized. You're right : the Hydrasynth is absolutely versatile. But I have reached some limitations though. For example OSCs outputs can't be used as modulation sources as it's possible with Moog Grandmother for example. The Hydrasynth Deluxe is probably the most capable and versatile synth I've ever played. It is so pleasant workflow... But as all instruments it has its own limitations...
Hi Scott. I mix all the various synth approaches (modular, integrated physical and virtual synths) and agree with your two points…though I would have said limited rather than “stupid”…however I would like to add a third limitation: polyphony. The default modular approach ALSO assume monophonic voices and the complexity/cost/effort in comparison to non-modular is night and day. Thanks for sharing! :)
As a modularist, I agree that modular is impractical, limited, and costly. Patching is tricky, and not portable. There are tons of modules out there, but only a few do something truly unique. A lot of modules are just groups of simpler modules integrated under one panel, which kind of goes against the modular ethic. Still, if you crave esoteric sounds, and are comfortable non-repeatability, modular is for you. Just get a free software like VCV Rack. You can still make those "whale farts in a sea of ketchup" noises that you crave, plus save your patches!
I've had a video about this in the makings and I have to say, I align a lot with what you say here Scott. For me the ultimate reason (spoiler alert) is the kind of work I do. When you have super time-sensitive projects there is no way you could afford the time to deal with modular synthesizers. I prefer one synth that allows me to work effectively *every time* rather than have my clients/artists waiting ;) They ARE fun though!
You got it. I think some people see the hours of patching part of the creative process. To me, I want the sound I want, so I can get to using it, which is for me what the creative process is. I'm pretty quick (usually) with coming up with a sound that I want on the synths I have.
I am with you on that one. I think one way to backup your modular sounds is by sampling them and then using them in your Montage but yeah it's not as easy as hitting 'store'. I got my patch cord fix years ago virtually in Reason.
VCV Rack and other similar virtual modular synths let you save patches and they're awesome in their own regards. I played with VCV Rack for over a year before I purchased any hardware modules.
@@TF242 You brought up getting your patch cord fix virtually and I just wanted to share how I got mine virtually as well. :) I think VCV Rack is a great way for people to try out modular without dumping a bunch of money into it, and they might get their fix just from that.
Exactly. It's basically a handicap in every possible way and a distraction, a big focus is autopilot "generative" and random. I'd take a $5K Doepfer A-100 over a Minimoog Reissue or OB-8X though.
Say, with a setup like yours you could even add 'modular-like' flexibility to any MIDI device with the RK002 cable, you can program it to just do a simple channel/key remap - or make it convert a simple nanokontrol to a M182 sequencer, generate euclid patterns (+/- 250,- module) or grids (200,- module), make a polychainer, do CC to sysex converting, etc etc. but it's the world of MIDI which arguably does not look as cool as a wall of patchcables and blinkinlights :-)
First off, for anyone getting in to modular synthesis, I would recommend getting an auto-sampler, to automatically create multi-samples of a patch. There is sample robot, and Akai have it built in to their MPC line and the Force. There are other options as well. And most people have cameras in their phones, so it isn't that hard really to take pictures and write notes, to roughly re-create the patch. But I would still multi-sample a good patch. But the next step is to think about what your goals and use cases might be. One issue in the modular scene, is that there is way too much focus on "esoteric" sounds. I believe there is several of reasons for this. One is that people are trying to get the most out of a limited set of modules, so they don't make full patches for sounds. Another is that to demo a module, the maker/demo-person, don't want to influence the sound by other modules, meaning that if it isn't a self contained synth voice, they can't demo it like it is a typical sound. And this has influenced both buyers and makers to focus a lot on weird type of sounds. What is mostly missing is the perspective of modular and semi-modular as a way to build a custom synth voice that is set up similar to a typical subtractive synth voice, but with the ability to combine different soundings ocs with different sounding filters. And if you have a hybrid approach, and make use of CV output of synths/controllers, or software, or make use of midi to CV converters for pitch and gate, you can also make use of oscillators from other sources than your modular, meaning, that you can save a bit of money on not having to get a lot of digital oscs, and you may have some analog oscs as well. And when you think of modular in this way, you also realize that it can process all sorts of sounds through the filters of the modular set-up and vastly expand use-cases for it. Except for through zero analog Oscillators, and a couple of analog oscs with wave-morphing built in, there is little reason really to get a lot of modular modules, and it makes more sense to buy semi-modular or analog synths and run the oscs through modular filters modules, which is the area, that deviates most from components found in other synths. If you get a couple of semi-modulr, you will also cover most LFO and envelope needs, or you can do that from a computer with the right DC interfaces, or the upcoming reliq hardware, or a fem modules that have several of digital LFOs and envelopes built in. semi modulars, will typically also cover most AMP module needs. When it comes to filters, there are Moog ladder style filters, with Q compensation to bring back the low end. There are SEM style filters with resonance boost, and/or, different slope options, with the ability to modulate the filter variation, 36 and 48dB slope analog filters... You can also find some nice sounding saturation modules, that could be used as sound processors for any type of sound, with CV control over parameters like amount, and in some modules over frequency, making it an interesting alternative to other analog saturation hardware, because of the controls that can even be automated from within your daw, with the right equipment. Modular also makes sense for building those hybrid kick-sub-bass sounds, that you find in a lot of music, inspired by the 808 sound, but in modular, you can build your own variations of that sound. But yes, if you look a modular demos, or performances by modular musicians, you might be led to think that modular is not about typical sound design, but only about creating "esoteric" sounds. But like any music hardware interest, it isn't cheap to build a nice set-up. And don't even think about polyphonic set-ups, they simply don't make sense, use samples of you sound for that. You might be able to have several of different sounds at the same time in a modular rig. But you will soon find yourself missing an additional module of a specific filter or OSC, to not be limited with those other sounds by just the modules "left over", and then again, I would suggest turning to sampling you sounds, instead of trying to free yourself up in terms of the sounds you can play simultaneously. In regards to the "stupidity". There really is no way to build high resolution controls of multiple analog parameters using digital controllers, without it becoming extremely expensive, so there simply isn't any way to make modular systems with complete recall, and no patch cables. And building analog audio patching is even more expensive, so you can't route the analog audio to different modules either. So if you want to be able to mix and match analog components, there is no less "stupid" solution, that isn't stupidly expensive. And virtual modular synths with high quality emulations, are really CPU intensive, so we have not yet reached a point where we can do the same things in the computers. But I guess in theory, a realistic option, that would be plausible is if someone designed modular modules or a hardware synths, with multiple CPUs, that took care of different parts of emulation, it would be possible to build something that is cheaper than an analog modular system, that could allow for patch storage but offer the same kind of flexibility. But that would be a niche alternative, that unlike modular and semi-modular analog, would have a high price of entry.
Semi modular is a good way to scratch that itch, as an Industrial musician/sound designer myself I'm always looking for sounds that are bizarre or uncommon in "normal" (east coast) synthesis and I have been tempted to go modular for years, but I find semi modular systems to give that versatility that I'm looking for while creating sounds. Great Video and yes you are right, it's stupid to have a wall of cables in front of the controls that you need to manipulate.
See I have a relatively small modular setup and I’m fine with that. I don’t have a lot of desire to expand it because the modules I own are so flexible. For me, it’s all about play and experimenting. When I have a patch I like I record it as a stem for later use. Part of the joy in my opinion is making sounds that just live in the moment for a brief lifetime and that’s it :). It’s very personal, but I love it! Also, my Oxi One is my primary midi controller for it - I’m not huge into the generative stuff.
I have avoided modular synths for the exact same reasons as you listed. I really like my work to be organized, streamlined, and repeatable. When I look at a eurorack full of patch cables going all over the place it literally induces stress. So I think there is a certain "mindset" that is comfortable with the discovery and experimentation process that fans of modular synths enjoy. Having said that, having a good mod matrix on any synth (synonymous to patch cables) is critical. I don't own a Hydrasynth yet (still don't love the sound), but I do own an Access Virus TI2, which has a great mod matrix. As you well know since you are sitting in front of one, but the Summit has a great mod matrix as well. Then there are Kurzweil keyboards that use VAST (Variable Architecture Synthesis Technology) that very well may be the closest thing to a modular synth in a single workstation. It is very flexible, but also very complicated and a lot to wrap your brain around. But people who are good with Kurzweil VAST programming can do some amazing things. So, IMHO, there are just too many modern alternatives to a modular system to bother with the cost/confusion of the manual patch cables. And if you really feel the burning need to wire your own patches, then just buy one of the many software VST versions that are out there today (eg Cherry Audio Voltage) and then you can save your work...
Ok! You sold me on not getting into modular. Had nothing to do with my wife noticing the bank account draining. Nope. As for never recalling a patch, I'm 68 so I remember very well when synths didn't have memory and it never ever bothered me. I'd use my synths live and have to adjust them in between songs or on the fly. So the sound wasn't exactly the same twice? Yawn. Whatever. It was close enough and nobody ever came up to me and said ,"Hey! You sounded different last night. WTF is wrong with you?" Never happened. And i barely noticed any difference either. Memory is convenient but not the be all and end all. Now don't get me wrong. I do appreciate it and depend on it daily. My Korg Kronos and King Korg get used a lot in my studio and being able to recall a sound is amazing. But there is something to be said for having to make a sound and then hoping you can get something like it the next day. Maybe I"m just nuts. Oh well. i like your show and I'm subscribing.
I'd been wanting to pick up a Hydrasynth for the longest time and finally picked up the Explorer last Black Friday and I'm really enjoying it probably because of the similarities to modular. I even used it in a modular gig a couple weeks after I picked it up. It feels like a perfect companion to my modular synth. I agree with your assessments about modular synthesis, but using the word "stupid" might have been a bit harsh. Playing modular synths requires embracing its strengths while minimizing its weaknesses. Can't save a patch? Oh well, live in the moment and embrace the ephemeralness of the sound. I usually record my stuff for posterity and possibly sampling later, but I like that I'm able to be done with a patch and clear it out forever. Interesting note: I went to see Suzanne Ciani perform and after the concert she invited everyone up to come and chat and unpatch her Buchla system. I asked her if she unpatches after every concert and she said yes. Then I asked her if she has notes to where everything goes, and she said she's been doing it for so long that she knows where everything goes from memory. Her concert was amazing.
Where I used the word stupid is referring SPECIFICALLY to the user interface in modular synths, where the controls of the synthesizer itself are completely covered and made inaccessible by patch cables. And...re-patching for every show by memory?!? Wow...just wow!
Suzanne Ciani has found the music in the wires. I like ambient so i picked up a used Lyra 8 which in my hands has been more meditative than musical. Hanon is a bit tough on it.
I have a hydrasynth and also a ton of modular. I love them both. I feel more creative when I use modular, and the songs I create are totally different than the ones I create when I start with a synth or guitar. More tools around to make music the better!
I totally agree with your analysis. The way modules are installed in the case, powered, and have audio jacks is totally stupid. It makes sense only from a cost perspective, but the amount of time it takes to deal with all that stuff more than makes up for the cost savings gained by doing the cheapest things possible to produce them. Someone should make a standard like a cartridge system, where you can just plug the modules into a bus and go. No screws necessary. There needs to be a central control brain in a case that all the modules connect to. The brain would query the modules as to what their capabilities are, what inputs and outputs they have: their names, voltage ranges and if they're discrete (divided into notes) or continuous. Then you could use the brain to connect things together and it would remember all the module connections and control settings and everything. So you could save patches on the modular. That would be way more practical and there's really no excuse for not having this in the high-tech computer age that we're living in right now. It probably wouldn't be nearly as fun, though. You're making music, so why not relax and enjoy it for awhile? What's the rush?
Thanks for the cool video. I agree a 100% with you as I use my synths for playing music live (It‘s already getting messy with what I have, never mind bringing a modular setup on stage!). I see modular more as science and experimenting rather than making actual music which can be interesting too, but it‘s too much of a rabbit hole for me too. Thanks for pointing out the Hydrasynth, I must have a closer look at it!
you can make any kind of music with modular. not just experiments. its open ended and complete. build a synth, build a drum machine, build an experiment. literally anything, one can not pigeon hole modular.
I wouldn't shake a stick at any body else's process preferences. I think the diversity of approaches is a strength. But I'm of the persuasion where modular has never appealed to me either.
VCV Rack solves all the bad issues of modular synths by virtualizing it within software. Layouts are saved, cables only visualize routing so they don't get in the way, and controls can be remote controlled so all user-relevant inputs can be kept together in another panel. Combine that with the included MIDI I/O features and all that would even work with the Hydrasynth synthesizer being promoted in this video. The free version of VCV Rack really doesn't lack much if you want to get started, the paid version adds DAW and software support and helps cover costs related to future development. And if having a free soft synth that's great for exploring a generative approach to creating electronic music doesn't get you going, you could just route a computer on the I/O of mix somewhere and use it as a rather extensive effects stack. I've seen videos of people using it that way and outside of some possible latency issues (soft synths/FX can't entirely get around it), it plays well with other stuff.
The interface on a modular synth is entirely up to the owner. If you want it to satisfy criteria, improving it is your job. Modular is primarily a synthesizer design hobby.
Another great video Scott. Thank you. Your mention of how the cables interfere with seeing the controls on a modular setup reminded me of a (rare) complaint I have about my Summit (which I otherwise love). You have a Summit too, so I wonder if you have noticed this issue and how you deal with it: The screen of the Summit is on the far left side of the front panel, with the value knob on the right side of the screen. Because of its location, it is natural to use the left hand to turn the value knob. However, in doing this, the left hand obscures the screen! It is very awkward to try to position the left hand in such a way that the screen remains visible -- awkward to the point where it's nearly impossible to move the hand out of the way enough to read the screen while moving the value knob. Moving the value knob with the right hand eliminates the problem of obscuring the screen, but is awkward and unnatural to reach across the whole synth with the right hand to access the value knob on the left side of the panel. I think an easy solution would have been to simply reverse the positions of the value knob and the selection buttons (which are on the left side of the screen). This would eliminate the problem, but it's not the way the Summit is built. I find this issue to be the biggest obstacle in working smoothly with the Summit, which is otherwise a fantastic synth. Do you notice this issue? How do you deal with it? Thank you for any insights you have about this.
Oh I absolutely have this problem, and in fact I think I even mentioned it in my Summit review video. It's a really annoying design issue. Also annoying is that I am constantly bumping and inadvertently changing the tempo knob right next to the main value knob when I try to make changes using the value knob.
I have to shout out one of my favorite modular synthesists here on youtube, and that is a773! They are able to actually craft really cool songs with the setup they use, most recently more of a fusion/jazz take. Really inspiring stuff, as they include many of the "ephemeral modular sounds" alongside basic harmonic/melodic/rhythmic structure in a really creative way. Go check em' out!
I generally agree and use a Kronos for most of my needs, but I did recently venture into the semi-modular territory with an ARP 2600M. I brought it out for its first gig this weekend on Friday. I have a few standard slider settings and patch connections I like to have ready, and then everything else I manipulate live while soloing. So the combination of the notes and the sound manipulation are all part of the improv. It makes for a fun thing to use a few times throughout the gig, but it wouldn’t be practical for more than that. That said, I do love how it looks a little like a tiny modular wall-just enough of that “mad scientist” flavor without being ridiculous to bring with me. Plus it has its own suitcase that Korg includes!
dude I love this video, and totally agree that modular is absurd, but that is part of its charm, I still love it and find it endlessly inspiring. The irony of critiquing the rabbit hole of modular while sitting in front of at least 12 Keyboard synths is very funny to me. Having that many synths requires an entire room, rather than a large Eurorack case. What does your patch bay, midi routing, and cable management for all that look like? the "stupid interface" of 60's style patch cables, is like saying vinyl records are dumb because CD's or streaming is more modern and efficient...This is two sides of the same coin IMHO. But appreciate the effort in the video, and found it entertaining, peace and love!
Having a good semi modular synth or controller lets you use the modular modules like a fancy breadboard is used for electronic prototyping without soldering
I love them all, my modular, semi modular and non modular synths. As keyboard player I do like to play my modular, actually most of the time using the hydrasynth. I believe that it is the tactile and physical experience of patching that inspires me to create sounds on the modular synths, whereas I use my traditional synths as preset instruments most of the time even if they have extensive sound modeling capabilities. I have spent much more money on non modular gear than on my modules. So you are not forced by an evil curse to buy a wall of modules to only create 8 note sequences once you get started with modular. On the issue that patch cables obscure the controls and sometimes you accidentially turn a dial (especially the tuning knob), this is indeed true and annoying.
As you point out, modern digital or hybrid synths like the Hydrasynth, Summit, Poly/Matrixbrute, Rev2, Moog One etc. are essentially modular but without the patch cables. The Mod Matrix is just another way to visualize the connections between the various modules that make up the synth voice inside those synths. On the software side, synths like Pigments and Phaseplant are even closer to true modular synths in their flexibility and the ability to route anything to anything else. Then there's Voltage Modular, VCV Rack etc. which even give you the virtual patch cables to play around with.
I’m using the tiny 1010Music Tangerine to auto-sample my monophonic and modular synths, adding velocity, filter, chorus & reverb to turn them into interesting expressive polysynths at a fraction of the cost!
B-b-but you can plug modular synth set ups into mushrooms!...not a fan of the modular scene but I guess some people enjoy the complexity. I prefer the tactile pleasure obtained from the use of keys and expressive capablility
It wasn't long into my synth owning career that I started to want to use the filter on this synth with the oscillator on that synth, or this effect with that, wish this one had a second envelope and so on... Of course, there are some flagship model synths that have enough mod options to satisfy any need, but they are way out of my price range. I have been buying little here and there, but no major prchases. I own about ten synths, all entry-level as far as price and functionality. The money I've spent could have bought me a pretty nice eurorack system. I can't say for sure it would have been a better option but I am tempted to sell it all and switch to eurorack for a more compact setup that does exactly what I want and need it to do. Adding modules to expand the system instead of buying another synth with a lot of redundant functions. I'm no professional musician, just someone who's interested in sounds and rythms. This is just something I do for my own enjoyment.
I'm sure I'm not the only person that will recommend VCV Rack as an alternative to a physical modular system. Not only is it affordable compared to a real Eurorack, but since the cables are only on a computer screen you don't have to deal with them getting in the way of the controls. You can even hide them if you want. Of course you can still get out of control with acquiring way too many modules and spending money frivolously, but honestly the free version with a few paid modules is more than enough to go wild. Oh, and most importantly, you can save presets 😁, although I actually like the ephemeral nature of modular and hardly ever save patches. Creating the sound is half the fun!
I get you use a lot of hardware. That being said... software has its perks to the desktop/home studio user. Thankfully VCVRack basic version is FREE. The VST version is only about $100 or so. Cardinal Modular is a FREE VST.
Agreed on the cost, depending on size of system. That said I believe the attraction of modular is you can build your own synth from scratch. You aren't limited by what the manufacturer has already predefined and built (ie with polysynths). One can also save patches by taking photos of the interface, but it does take time to rebuild the patch from scratch.
And there is the whole world of software modular synths. They don’t take up space, they are a tiny fraction of the cost, with some free. You can save your sounds. Often they are polyphonic.
I enjoy my modular synth, but I keep it limited to what I can fit in a cre8audio nifty keys. I ended up assembling a 4 VCO bass/lead paraphonic synth and still have some space left for a couple more modules. Learning to patch gave me a better understanding of how a synth works and sound design, which has helped me with all my other synths. The nifty keys enclosure has keys, several built in modules, and is easy to transport.
I‘m pretty sure that Anthony Marinelli, the synth programmer for Michael Jackson‘s Thriller album, will not agree with you on your reasons for not using modular synths. He thinks like a synthesizer and this guy can indeed recreate synth sounds on his ARP2600 exactly like it was in 1983. And you can watch him doing this within a few minutes. It’s a question of training and devotion I think.
I did mention people like him in the video - I mentioned Vince Clarke and Martin Gore, I would include Anthony Marinelli in that, as well as Rick Smith and many more - highly talented, accomplished musicians who use modular synths in a musical way, and do so like it is second nature - because it is! :)
I'm not into modular because the cable mess triggers my OCD. I hate the look of it, I can't get my head around it and I hate that I can never recreate a sound because it doesn't have presets - for the same reasons I didn't buy a Pulsar 23. I wouldn't call modular users or the system "stupid" though, it just appeals to people that are unlike me.
Once again, nailed it. One more thing to note, not only is building a modular setup an endless pit, so is creating patches on them. Where does the cross-patching end for crying out loud?!? When is your patch “done” when you’ve got 80 more empty 1/4” and 1/8” sockets staring you in the face, begging for input?
Your points on modular are so true. I like it, but it is exactly what you said lol. I have protected myself by going semimodular with some modular and I record everything just in case. And, yea, pics of the patch to recreate. I really like the modular segments for inspiration, and for interesting samples.
You know I just came to discover a module called percussa ssp. It's the closest thing in terms for a module itself, to having preset memory and polyphony accessible and available. Well, 8 voices, but for a module that's almost unheard of. It can have virtual cables, but also has a regular bay, and I think it's a va and wavetable unit with some fm and granular capability. So, a ti2 esque thing maybe? The price though is a bit high, around 2k I think. Not sure if it has a sequencer. I know tiptop audio is working on ART modules that step away from 1 v/oct and use special polytip cables, so i think the ssp design, and this, might be the way modular goes forward. Would be nice if the price could come down, I'm not sure what causes those components to be more expensive, maybe rarity? And I actually never heard of the ps3300 from korg, until recently the limited korg reissue of the semimodular ps3300 from the 70s, it has presets (16 i think). It reminded me of a massive ms20 with some more patch points. Probably very pricey though so if i wanted those sounds i could get the vst from cherry audio. If i ever pick up a hydra it will likely be the explorer which is ideal for my limited space. I wonder how close you can get to the seemingly unique and quirky modulations you sometimes hear from arp2600 or buchlas . I've been able to do a few on my wave 2, but since I don't have a 2600 and never really played a modular in person much, I'm a bit in unfamiliar territory. But having had a chance to experiment on an actual 2600 was interesting, so I think I'll be ok to try it in a vst format in the meantime. I find many polysynths however also suffer from limited modulation slots, for various reasons the manufacturer wanted to focus on other aspects of the designs. I lately have been interested in learning about the virus ti2 just from curiosity standpoint, because it looks like it can do a lot as well.
modular synths are for people who want a wall with $50,000 worth of equipment to play 5 notes on a recording that no one will ever hear and no one would know what it was anyway.
Agree 100%. I use synths to make music, not to create sounds. No disrespect to those that do but I'm untidy enough as it is without a room full of spaghetti that sounds like a surprised trout on a motorcycle. I like a small, analog-digital hybrid setup that I can fit in my panniers and cycle to the gig.
I think if you’re a keyboard player you probably want to practice that and write music at the keyboard. If you sequence and program your music you probably would love the creativity of patching cables, twiddling knobs, and coming up with sounds and recording them. Don’t forget you can do polyphonic music by putting different notes on different tracks recorded separately so it’s not necessarily mono work unless you intend to do all this live.
Been there. I had a large eurorack system I had a 5U system and a 4U frack system... could spend hours making complex patches and really it didn't sound any different from what I could have accomplished with a desktop synth. I recall after a very heady weekend of making sounds with the monster modular and there were wires everywhere... I started (48 hours later) to start pulling out some cables and of course you'd expect some intense change when you remove the cable but no. I could pull out about 40% of the cables that were no longer helping the patch as subsequent patch cables removed the signal from that branch. That and the desire to buy more had me sell it all. No mo modular for me.
Between my arturia matrix brute and Waldorf blofeld I feel like I have plenty of modulation routing that I’ll never even tap the full potential of. Plus I am a keyboardist and feel like interacting with an instrument in a live environment is core to my experience. That being said I still daydream about building a small modular rig for FX processing or percussion sound design but I don’t want to loose myself chasing that dragon lol.
I'm a keyboardist too, and I use a MIDI keyboard to play the modular. I have a module to control 8 simultaneous MIDI channels (pitch, velocity and modulation), another module to convert MIDIClock to keep the modular in sync with the rest of the synths (or the DAW), a ribbon controller with pitch and pressure control, a couple of x-y pads ... So plenty of ways to perform.
It's one of the things that kept me from doing this video for a long time. And to be clear, I am not calling anyone stupid, I am saying the user interface methodology of hundreds of patch cables obscuring the controls of the modular synth is stupid.
I don't think he's calling the community stupid just the interface of modular synths. I think stupid is a strong word, but I understand his criticisms. I got into eurorack modular a couple years ago and I'm really enjoying it. I grew tired of doing everything "in the box" and wanted a way to interact with hardware without a screen. I grew up composing and arranging traditional music, and back then "real musicians" didn't play electronic instruments. Here we are again with another argument that "real musicians" don't play modular synths. (Which I don't think this is the argument he's making.) Modular synthesis isn't for everyone just like playing the banjo or the accordion isn't for everyone. There's so much music out there that isn't for everyone, but thankfully there is so much music out there you can find some thing you like and enjoy.
One thing modular doesn't mention is polyphony, simply playing a chord becomes a gigantic problem, so when I think of modular, I am thinking monophonic. I have considered semi-modular for monophonic design using synths that have a patchbay on the right, keeping the cables neat. But last year I added the Kurtzweil VAST/FM synth to my studio, now I have modular and all the benefits of saving patches. I can design the module and then connect to other created modules and up to 32 modules per patch. And the synth is polyphonic and multi-timbral so chords and layering of modules becomes easy and savable.
Yes, I have a mono/monaural analog synth I use to play in my sound design to a sampler and build up a stereo poly instrument that can be played with a keyboard. But this is a work-around for those with modular systems, and it is no longer analog, and it has to go through ADCs and DAC's an extra time, 2 conversions for analog tape and 3 conversions for digital recording. @@vincentprimault4380
@@vincentprimault4380 Yes you can. I have a sampler I use just for that, taking a monaural mono synth layering patches in the left/center/right of the sampler and building gigantic stereo synth with 4 notes of poly.
If today’s electronic musicians took all the time they waste on sound design and used it on applying music theory, there might actually be something worth listening to.
You seem like a nice guy, and I’ve watched a number of your vids, but I have to say I think this presentation is missing more frequent use of the words “for me”. I think that’s what you’re trying to say(?) Modular is not compelling for you? Cool. You don’t even have to convince anybody as to why, in my book. You’re just not into it. You do you. I wrote a bunch more, but decided to just let it go at that. Well, actually, one more thing: you realize there will be people (not me!) pointing and laughing at tens of thousands of dollars of hardware - keyboard synthesizers, mixers, patch bays, and MIDI routers filling a room - because they do it all on a $1500 computer? Do you really care why? Yeah, I don’t either.
You're entirely correct, the impetus behind this video is to present reasons why *I* don't do modular. I think I did mention that those reasons are my reasons, and people who do love modular may do so for their own, very valid reasons.
haha, hey Scott, fun video! While I'm totally ONE with the Borg matrix of modular synths 😅I feel there is no right or wrong way to be a musician/sound designer/sonic explorer/gear collector/etc. and what ever works to accomplish desired goals is the important thing. I'll agree that modular synths can be a massive black rabbit hole that endlessly sucks all of your time, money, and even personal relationships out of your life but . . . it's the life I've chosen. 🤓And seriously Scott, it's not like you haven't gone down the rabbit hole of needlessly spending tens of thousands on more keyboards than you really need?! 😁 Best of luck always, keep up the good work on your channel! 😎👍
