Here you go working for Hornaday and bad mouth old reliable proven cartridge to sell for Hornaday. I knew something was coming hearing said some nonsense. Don't need to see anymore I am out of here
Great video Pete, but the one thing that isn't talked about is that the modern cartridges are far more expensive than their older counter parts and harder to come by. I have 2 7mm Rem Mags and rounds are far easily found and much cheaper than its 7PRC counter part. Lets not talk about the Hornady debacle with the powder used, that they cant even meet their own advertise speeds on the box. Unless your a pro competition shooter, the older cartridges are just fine and more than adequate for the hunter shooting 500 m/y and in. Just my 2 cents. :-)
Exactly, these "ancient" cartridges get the job more than done, only reason those new ones really exist is because they need to make money. Not even to mention if you handload your 7mm Rem Mag you can easily outperform the 7PRC. They keep trying to reinvent the wheel.
@@duckgrape2455 He literally says this list doesn't apply to reloaders because of your exact reason. For people not wanting to get into reloading, the newer rounds are just better if you're shooting factory. Reloading isn't for everyone and some people still want to get the "best of the best". So yes, that market is aimed at those people. And that's the whole point of being a company, is to make a profit. If making new cartridges means more profit, of course they're going to do that! And they're not trying to reinvent the wheel, they're just called optimizing. Speaking of wheels, go look at the tires from 1980 vs 2024. They're still tires, but they're BETTER. You'd be an idiot to buy the 1980 designs for 2024, and guess what, they're more expensive because that's how a free market works. Kind of the same can be said for cartridges. Why buy older rounds when new rounds are better in every way? The only reason would be cost savings, in which case, sure don't buy the cartridges and stick with the cheaper one. Because you are right, they do still get the job done, just not AS good of a job.
@@samueldesousa3134 also 7mm PRC is just a simple copycat with a little Flitter here and there from the 2004 introduced but commercial not succesfull 7mm Blaser Magnum
@@lenzadlbergerguess your from Europe? I live in Switzerland and would love to get a 7mm wsm but there is nothing available here 🙄 guess the 7wsm would be also way more sexy than the hyped 7prc.
not only that, i can wander into a hardware store and buy 308 or 3006. ask them for 300 prc and they will think im giving them a part number for lawnmower spark plugs. for normal people and practical shooters, performance is not the only factor.
@@PetterBR Minor disagreement. A lot of 260s won't chamber (or the mags are too small) the 155 gr Lapua Mega/156 gr Norma Oryx/160 gr Woodleigh Weldcore. For 140 gr bullets, yeah, 260 Rem is hard to beat. I prefer my 6.5x55 Tikka to either 260 or 6.5CM, tho.
@@PetterBRprobably dont find much 260 factory ammo or factory chamber guns for that matter lol but its a great case, ideal if you build a custom gun and handload
@@PetterBR availability does matter in this opinion. 260 is great but doesnt have near the rifle options or ammo options. I can see the creed having a major advantage there. Like i said you have to build a custom gun and handload to really benefit from a 260…now the 7 rem mag or 300 win mag vs the PRC equivalents…that is a opinion based discussion since both are available in guns and ammo
Me watching the video: Hmm, yes, makes sense, plan for the future. My safe (full of Federal Value Pack .22lr and surplus, corrosive 7.62x39): No you won't.
I'll say it a 1000 times over..... No matter what new cartridge comes on the scene..... 30-06 is the benchmark to which everything is measured..... Sure the old '06 doesn't do everything the best, but it does "just enough" the best, and that's what the average shooter wants from a factory rifle with factory ammunition. I've never heard a dead buck's spirit say "Jeez pal, I'm telling you that new High BC bullet really did a number on me" or "That faster twist rate sure killed me dead in a hurry"..... Nope..... All he would say is "The last thing I heard was bang, and now I'm here" With modern components in modern rifles, the old '06 can compare just as good as it's counterparts. You'll still hit your target same spot as with some new Air Jordan endorsed PRC model. Oh..... shhhh.... Spoiler alert.... PRC = People's Republic of China = COMMIE!!..... 🤫🤫🤫🤣🤣🤣
🚨🚨 Trigger Alert! 🚨🚨 🤣 That aside, I don't need anything new...although the 'new' line Nosler cartridges are really nice, IMO...but yes, older cartridges still work fine. I'm not a Creedmoor fanboy...I....just ....can't...sorry. No.
any of the previous cartridges are perfect. I would recommend it over anything he recommends. largely due to availability and it still gets the job done. Also, some of it is damn cheaper@davidandre886
375 EnABLER. Seriously though, Hornady has designed excellent cartridges here and they have good market support. I just thought it was funny because the information presented could have been said in a 30 sec short.
my 30-06 pushes a 215 berger at 2660fps, matches 6.5 creedmoore drop and drift with a huge amount more energy... if ur a handloader, the 30-06 is still incredible.
@@Adventures4Lou very true, but the 30-06 is very very capable as a long range cartridge. If a 6.5 creedmoor can do it, the 30-06 with the right load is actually better, I think telling people not to buy a 30-06 is silly.
@@440capnhook mine weighs about 10.5lbs, recoil is very manageable, if imagine with a muzzle brake it would be very comparable to a 6.5 creed or maybe even a 243.
I've got 212eldx that I plan to work a load for, and theoretically it matches external ballistics of the creedmoor with 143eldx. But yeah, outside of competition, I have zero interest in new cartridges. 6gt is my competition gun
The 30-06 cartridge was designed for Black Powder and not modern propellants that burn way faster. And why most modern cartridges are designed with a sharper shoulder angle to increase efficiency.
The 30-06 was not designed for black powder. Smokeless powder had already been around for ~20 years when the 30-03 first came on the scene. MR-21 was the original powder used in testing and production, a smokeless, not black, powder. In ~1930, they switched to another smokeless, IMR-1185 Even the 30-40 Krag was developed for smokeless powder, and it predates the 30-06 by about a decade. Other cartridges predating 30-06 that used smokeless - 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser and 7x57 Mauser.
Friend and I took 13 Springbuck and 3 Kudu last weekend using a 30-06 and a 6.5 Swede Couple freezers full of meat and 250+ years of legacy - whats not to love
its not a flex to say you use something less efficient and neither of those cartridges are anywhere near that old. you can shoot a .45-70 out to 600 with iron sights, why are you such a bad hunter you need bottleneck cases. you probably used jacketed bullets too. shouldn't even be in the field. see how stupid that sounds. its like saying you drove across the country in a rusty ford taurus and bragging its not a newer car. ok.
@@joshuarosenwald6490 where am I in Africa now? where do I live in Africa? or, have I been to Africa, but currently am not there? what are you asking me.
@@hotramen5952 lol I wasn't asking you anything! I was asking original commenter...im not even sure what you said?...read what u said you should clean that word salad up...maybe don't put so much dressing on lol!
@@brett5990lord have mercy on you. I once made the mistake of asking a Facebook group if I should get a Savage Axis in .308 or 6.5 Creed. I swear it felt like a twitter feed with everyone just tearin each other apart. Out of the few hundred comments 15 were even remotley helpful. Everything else was people just hating each other for saying one is better than the other
Give some love to the 7-08, better ballistics than the 308, not a barrel burner, and significantly more hitting power than the creedmoor. IMO the Creedmoor is more of a target shooting round meant for long range efficiency (paper puncher) but could still be used on lighter game.
You guys are doing it wrong. Buy em all. I've got the 308, 6.5 cm and the 6.5 PRC. I honestly don't know if I could just pick one because they are all great in their own right. The PRC is kinda difficult to find ammo for and very expensive compared to the others but a great performer. The creedmoor just smashes deer and is very pleasant to shoot. The 308 doesn't try to destroy itself, ammo price/availability is great and it's overall performance is sufficient for most people.
I’ll take your word for it but some of those “old school” loads are much more plentiful and cheaper to source. For example 308 and 5.56 are very common in the US and is manufactured in large amounts for the military.
I’m all for people being free to speak their opinions. I’m not one of these ultra sensitive folks who gets triggered by someone disagreeing. Personally I love the old cartridges, but it is interesting to hear things like this.
While I don't shoot long range anymore, and being 49. I still hunt deer and the occasional elk with model 70 in 30-06 that my grandfather gave me when I was 14. I guess that I'm to old to change.
Most of development is very incremental in improvement in the past 100 ish years, if you already have the old cartridges there’s not much reason to get the new ones. This one is definitely generational where new shooters will be going for new rounds as they are _technically_ better. The most surprising not seen here was 280 ackley as the 60 something year old round is still very equivalent to the 7mm prc. There really isn’t much reason to get a prc over an ackley even today. And there’s 7mm saum and rum which don’t really have newer counterparts but those i guess were still created after 2000.
i turned the volume down so my model 94 32 W.S., and Model 100 308 couldn’t hear. The 22-250 overheard and screamed from the other room,” Prove it!”. Good video, but that Hornady shadow is pretty huge in this one.
I am sorry, this video is a Hornady promotion video. The 6.5x55 se in a European action from 1960 and up will do everything and more than 6.5 CR. Thank you for not trashing the .338 wm. Case and cartridge design decades ahead of its time.
True about the swede, but good luck finding guns and ammo, at least in the US. I’ll take the 6.5 creedmoor any day and all day long and twice on Sunday. Other than just being different, (which is a fine reason), there’s no reason here to buy a Swede.
Well you don't need a long action rifle to shoot 6.5 Swede. I have rifles chambered in both and my Swede is nice but with factory ammo it really doesn't compare. Any way, I have built medium/long action rifles, they are 284 Winchester and 338 RUM. 6.5 Swede wasn't even a consideration. 284 is just more of everything, more bullet, more ballistic coefficient, probably more FPS, Lapua brass, lots of 1,000 yard benchrest championships, etc. 338 RUM was just an exercise in how much bullet I could fit in a CIP length long action and a beginner ELR rifle that didn't need an extra large action for 338 Lapua or bigger. With a short action I like 6.5 Creedmoor. If I was going for 6mm it would be 6 GT. The 6 GT is an evolution of 6 BR just stretched out to feed better from standard AICS short action magazines. If I had the money for a top of the line ELR rig, I would probably choose it by which bullet I want to shoot, then figure out who makes the best chamber for that bullet, who makes the best barrel rifling for that bullet, then choose a chambering that has good lathe turned brass available that will put it in the velocity it needs. I might even get a super heavy test barrel to play around with barrel length and tuners to find nodes so I could have a better guess at what will work for my "competition" barrel.
Nope. The performance advantages Pieter talks about are marginal and insignificant unless one is competing on the paper-punching circuit. For competition, yes, it pays to be cutting edge, because millimeters and even fractions thereof can make the difference between money and a wasted trip. For hunters and infantrymen, all those minor efficiencies won't make a darn bit of difference in bagging the animal or surviving combat. What hunter has ever thought, "I could do this shot with a 6.5mm Creedmoor, but a 6.5mm Swedish? Too risky." Ridiculous.
And thats only if you buy off the shelf . I get close to 6.5 prc speeds when hand loading my 6.5x55 . The factory rounds are way under powered because of the amount of ww2 and older rifles that are still around . But with a modern 6.5 sweed you can load up much better rounds .
@@davidheath2427 which bullets and which/how much powder? Just curious. I'm not leaning on mine too hard - abut 2400 fps with 160 gr Woodleigh PPSN on top of H4350. The way I look at it is I'd have to get over 2600 fps with that load to really move the needle on both ballistic arc and energy, and for me, the juice just ain't worth the squeeze. I have a tack-driving deer/hog slayer good for about 250 yards as it is. If I need to reach farther than that, I'll go out with my 280 AI anyway. Also, the only rifle for which higher pressure loads is really an issue is the Norwegian Krag-Jorgensens. The Swedish small ring M96 is about as strong as any modern rifle.
@smokedbrisket3033 I'm using 153 grain Berger hunters and ar2206. Not sure what the American or hodges equivalent is of that powder . They are going at about 2740 . No sign of cartridge stresses. But all firearms are different. I'm using a modern rifle not an old military. Tika .
@@davidheath2427 - AR2206 is the same powder as Hodgdon Varget. Seems like kind of a fast powder for a 6.5 Swede. Anyway, I also have a T3X - a lefty. AFAIK, that's the only LH 6.5x55 made. Maybe JP Sauer makes one in LH, but they'd be the only other one. I'm surprised you aren't using Woodleighs, too. Didn't realize you're in Oz. I correspond with the owner every few months, super nice guy. They're not quite back to full production after their fire in...2021 or 2022? Can't remember now.
None of the modern stuff is any good when a lot of the shooters using them cant maintain 1 moa at the distance those cartridges become more effective than the conventional counterparts
Piet, " the 30-06 sucks" | " the 308 sucks" Henry, "bru you talking about me?" Piet, "the 6.5x55 is a fossilised dinosaur that nobody should use." Henry, "Friendship ended."
it should be, and I literally came to comments to tell him he screwed up not mentioning 270 Win as it's the most effected by what he's talking about. 1-10 twist barrels in .270 is a tragedy. Optimal bullet design would be around the 156gr weight and nobody makes a barrel that would stabilize that in 270 Win. 6.8 Western is going to fail because of lack of available ammo and very few mid range cost rifles, but it should explode off the shelves based on the ballistics.
@@h4l414 hey don’t forget the 7mm rem mag. All these modern shooters hate it because it’s a belted magnum 🤣 when I come across these youngsters who tell me I it is old & belted I just tell them “ well son daddy has to wear a belt to whip that ass”🤣🤣🤣🤣
Surprise not to see 280 Ackley Improved. Nosler brought it to Saami in 07” and it got approved. Great 7mm option less recoil then the 30-06, same performance as 7rem mag and a wider variety of bullets then the 270win. But I guess from a factory stand point ammo choice may not be available for some but at lest where I’m at there’s 10 different factory loads available to me. But if you a reloader then it’s even better.
@@timothythompson6549 agree 280 rem is so overlooked and it sucks Remington failed to market it properly. There’s still tons of factory loads I’ve seen on the shelves and online lately. I still have a ton of 280 brass and un-open boxes of 280 rem that I have setting over the years.
The Creedmoor line is the biggest fraud thrust on the American shooter in my lifetime. All of the line, is not better than what they are trying to replace. I could make this claim a thousand pages, but it would suffice to say the 6.5x284 is superior in every way. The 243 win is also superior and the 22-250 still remains the "Varminter" of choice. You can change the twist on the older cartridges if needed for the heavier bullets which are now the fad.
Wholeheartedly agree. And 6.5x55 does all that 6.5 CM does, does it better, is easier to handload and much easier on the barrel. .243 Win. is probably one of the best 6mm ever. 6.5 CM is one of the best... marketing operations ever.
The fact that he didn’t address the 270 and 6.8 western ( the 6.5 and 7mm prc biggest competition and is the only non-Hornady cartridge) tells me all I need to know
Because no one is using a .277 caliber cartridge in any modern context. No one's shooting matches, no one's designing modern high BC bullets for it, and no one cares about the revamped 270WSM that Browning released a few years back. And I'm not even saying it's bad, I'm just saying I haven't seen ANYBODY except Hornady haters even mention the 6.8 western at all. The military has a hard-on for the 6.8 bullet diameter, but I think that's literally just because they looked at history and saw that when someone necked down the .30-06 to .270 they got better performance. Now they're hoping they can repeat history by necking down the cartridge that was literally supposed to be a 1:1 replacement for .30-06 but slightly smaller. For the record, one of my favorite cartridges ever is overshadowed on both sides by its competition. The 7mm-08 is looked at as a "women & children" cartridge by most .308 shooters, and it's seen as the old fudd round by many 6.5 shooters I've met, but it has a hidden ability that sadly can only be appreciated by a handloader. It can literally give the best of both worlds from its competition if properly handloaded. It can fire the same bullet weights as .308 which will have a higher BC than ANY 6.5 bullet, at still quite respectable velocities. I can shoot a 162-168gr bullet between 2600-2650 depending on powder choice that's available, and with those weight class of bullets I get 95-98% of the muzzle energy of a .308 and quickly overtake .308 after only 200yds and hold more energy at every range than 6.5 Creedmoor, while also maintaining drop and drift ever so slightly better than the Creedmoor (it's splitting hairs, but it's literally giving every benefit except for slightly lower frontal surface area of the .308 and also beating the .308 in the exact same ways a 6.5 does, with additional benefits. The .308 can launch heavier projectiles, but only at the cost of significantly lower velocity (to the point that not even the higher BC can salvage them at longer range) and with comparable BC bullets the Creedmoor is ever so slightly faster, but the 7mm is slightly higher BC which allows it tocatch up very quickly. I think if given the proper ammunition treatment the 7mm-08 is the best short action .308 family cartridge that exists, the problem is the VAST majority of loaded ammo is too light because people want as high velocity as possible. Coming from antiquated reasoning telling them that speed flattens trajectory (which it does, to a point, but we have technology now that allows us to correct for slightly more drop much more accurately while achieving much better performance through efficiency rather than raw brute force.
Do not put the 30-06 down , you can do more with that round then one thinks . As a handloader you can have it shoot like a 22lr to full with a 220 gr. Also do not put the 22-250. 308 have more uses then any other besides for what I stated the ammo is not going to be hard to find and get.
Let's just say for fun that I get to hunting camp and realize I forgot my ammo and the only store for 30 miles is a little general store. Which do you think they're more likely to have .300 prc or .30/06 springfield?
@Verdigris. I've fired 7mm08 and 6.5 cm back to back, and yes, the cm has a bit less recoil in the real world. Not the kind of difference that I'd run and trade in my 7mm08 though.
Fun Fact CIP Old German 7mm have a 1:8.6 Twist Rate since they where introduced over 100 Years ago so a 7x57 and 7x64 can Stabilice up to 170-180gn 😉 same goes for the old 6.5x55SE 6.5x57 ... also 1:8.6 140gn are no Problem 8mm Mauser is no Problem to get 220gn to fly and you can also seat the Bullets way out till you get to the Lands so some old Calibers where way ahead of Time when it comes to Twistrate and how much the Bullets sticks into the Case, the slow Twistrate thing Was mainly a American issue.
@@danielrouw2593 as a Reloader with a modern Rifle 6.5x55SE beats 6.5 Creedmoor without Problems (SAAMI Specs for SE are a damn Joke CIP is ok 3900 bar but a modern Rifle with quality Brass even 4000-4100 Bar is no Problem at all) i shoot my 140gn with Reload Swiss RS60 at 856m/s out of a 22" Barrel 130gn at 902m/s Brass is fine no Pressure Signs Accuracy is great and yes i am a Hunter
@@lenzadlberger the usual yak reason given for the 6.5 swede being loaded lower is because of the older crag and Norwegian rifles chambered in 6.5 swede might not take the higher pressures, however modern 6.5 swede rifles have no such issues with pressure
@@giggergigger1 i know the Norwegian Krag one Lug Bolts are the Main Problem For the Swede with Factory Ammo, i have a Mauser M12 Expert from 2019 For this Rifle more "modern" Pressures are no Problem at all, Funny is that 6.5x55SE is the 4th cheapest Brass that Lapua Produce after 223 7.62x39 and 308 😂 and you allways find once fired Lapua Norma or RWS Brass online cheap as dirt in Germany
I agree and disagree. Newer bullets have come a long way in terms of terminal ballistics. However, very few cartridges have taken as much or more large game in North America than 30-06 (most of those being classics as well). The "classics" are the classics for a reason Pete.
I disagree about the 30-06. In a Remington 700 action with a SAAMI chamber, there is plenty of room to seat the bullet out longer. I've already done this. You are limited to 220 grain modern bullets, but that is plenty for hunting ranges inside 1000 yards. It is also the only long action SAAMI 30 cal cartridge with a .475 base. This allows getting one or two more cartridges in the magazine. Given all this, the 30-06 is still a contender with reloading in a magnum length action. Plus it will have better barrel life than a 300 PRC or larger cartridges. Now, if all you wanted to do is shoot ELR, then the 300 PRC definitely gets the nod for the 30 caliber, but make sure to have a muzzle brake or a suppressor as it will have a lot more recoil than the 30-06. There really isn't a 30 caliber cartridges with a .475 base that mimics the 30-06 to be able to replace it. It's more powerful than the 308, but less than the 300 Winchester or 300 PRC. Kind of a sweet spot.
300 WSM smashes 30-06.......... while being a short action cartridge Also a cartridge known for its accuracy, holding multiple records in shooting competition ( including the smallest 10 shot group at 1k)
@theprfesssor True, but it uses a .545 bolt face and not a .475 bolt face. There isn't any 30 caliber SAAMI cartridges with a .475 bolt face that can equal the 30-06. Also the 300 WSM is limted on over all length with it being in a short action.
@@rodgerthackeray7978 There is 1 cartridge that can rival 30-06 and has a 475 base, that would be 30 Thompson Center it is a SAAMI cartridge......granted though it is effectively a dead cartridge...... nearly as dead as the company that made it ( rip Thompson Center )
I have 35 year old Remington model 700 30.06 that I have used for 35 years, I have upgraded it to Magpul 700 long action with detachable magazine, last year and I replaced trigger with Trigger X field trigger, this year I removed standard barrel, and replaced with 26” heavy fluted barrel with M18 muzzle break barrel has 11.25 twist rate, I really like now that I can now shoot a shot every 2 minutes without barrel ever going above 73 F. I currently use Hornady 165 gr BTSP interlock and H4350 powder with large rifle primer. I now get much better grouping with. Heavy barrel. With Magpul stock I can easily handle recoil,
Tikka make a 6.5x55. This round was probably the most ahead of its time ever. It used heavy bullets 140gr / 160gr. In a modern rifle like the Tikka, its pretty much the same thing as the 6.5cm.
Pretty much the same except that, in a modern rifle like your Tika or my CZ, the significantly larger case capacity of the 6.5x55 allows it to be hand loaded to performance levels that the creedmore can't hope to match without dangerously over pressure loadings. The creedmore is on my list to pick up someday but my two 6.5x55s make that purchase very much not a pressing one.
@@jrunestad4508The only benefit of the Creedmore is that it is a short action cartridge, but the Tikka is only made in a long action so there is no benefit. If you are buying a Tikka the Swede is the better choice.
Dude,its NOT the cartridge that has the slow twist,Its THEE GUN!!!!! How does that make the older cartridge bad????!!!!!!!!! Your NOT a paid influencer,are you?????
@@IMPACTSHOOTING I don’t think that makes it any better lol. Encouraging new shooters to buy calibers that are both more expensive and harder to find isn’t any better
@@IMPACTSHOOTINGit's just a boring commercial for newer calibers likely to be obsolete in a few years. The 30-06 is time proven and according to Boone and Crockett records, has more entries than any other cartridge on the North American continent. I'll still recommend anyone a 30-06 buying a new rifle.
6.5 PRC: General Barrel Life: 1,500 to 2,000 rounds 7mm PRC: General Barrel Life: 1,500 to 2,000 rounds .300 PRC General Barrel Life: 1,000 to 1,500 rounds ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
The expected barrel life of the 7 PRC is near identical to the 7 Rem Mag (PRC has slightly lower poeder capacity, but slightly higher max pressure), the .300 PRC is only alightly lower expected barrel life over the .300 Win Mag. Ultimately, bore diameter, powder charge, powder burn temperature and the peak pressure are what determines barrel life. For many of these cartridges, their old school counterparts should have very similar expected barrel life.
@@BLKSMShooting if you take the 7 Rem Mag and 7 PRC, run both with the same bullet and powder, at the same velocity, the barrel life will be near identical. That's not an opinion, just how the science works. If you really want me to, I'll run all the cartridges through GRT and the barrel life estimator I have. Also, to rem mag or win mag having 5k barrel life... maybe if you shoot it extremely slowly and barely ever put proper heat into it. If you shoot a PRC the same way - then it will also have an extremely long barrel life.
The barrel twist and freebore are both specified by salami (spell check😂). A throating reamer and a prefit with a faster twist, bang you are in business, Most barrel companies make profits to your liking. The installation is usually done by the owner if they have the tools, or a local gunsmith if they don’t.
It's been said by others: modern high-tech cartridges may be preferred for certain very specialized applications. But the old standards are still popular for very good reasons: they work well enough to be excellent for appropriate uses. They've stood the test of time. Sometimes a long time. And importantly, they are affordable and widely available; as are the rifles designed to shoot them. I doubt that most would see a need to move to the latest high-tech design. They just aren't THAT much better. How many of us will ever have the need to make a two-mile shot?
Why I choose 300 win mag over 300 PRC. Ammo availability, Large amount of different factory ammo of each use case, Price of ammunition, 300 win mag performs everything ill ever need. Sometimes the latest and greatest isn't exactly what's needed.
@@IMPACTSHOOTING Yes and no. For me starting my PRS in Sweden the 6.5x55 is 1,1euro and 6.5cm 4euro. Here in Sweden the best route for begningers (what ive heard) is start with a 6.5x55 and when that barrel is dead buy a 6xc and start realoding. If we look at our feild shooting comp here 6.5x55 is the most used round. In summery would not say the 6.5cm is worth 4euro when you can shoot 6.5x55 for 1,1euro. and when starting to reload we can get 6xc for 0,7euro.
I agree in nearly every aspect of this video... but we have to talk about availability. It is quite impossible for me to aquire most of these new calibers as factory ammo. I'm not reloading myself, so i'm stuck with stuff from the shelf. Gun stores are not always the fastest updating their inventory up to new standards, so i have to depend mostly on "old" and common calibers.
So even as a hand loader why would I want to set aside loads/rifles I have spent hours upon hours developing that have killed game for years reliably to start all over with new reloading components that are hard to find and start that process all over again because somebody came out with a new whiz-bang cartridge. Im sure that many of these new cartridges do some things better than my old ones but dead is dead and I’m not starting over when I have something that works just fine.
7PRC is just a 7mm rem mag without the belt. It doesn’t offer anything more other than more expensive components. For a reloader, 7mm PRC might be better if they don’t like belts. But its velocity isn’t meeting what was advertised. 7mm rem mag without a belt sounds like an amazing idea personally but I’ll treat it as a belt less 7RM and expect nothing more
I have an old Browning 30-06 that might not be a match rifle, but since I rarely have to shoot farther than 200 yards, stuffed with my handloads it has never failed to put game in the freezer. Sure there are "new modern" cartridges that exceed the '06's performance, but for an older person that already has an old rifle in a older caliber, it's enough for me. I also shoot a 223 AI, a 22-250 AI, a 22-284, 6-284, and a few other wildcats. But I find myself reaching tor the old trusty '06 for most of my hunting.
So don’t forget price. 300 PRC costs twice as much to shoot as 30-06. The extra practice you get because you can afford to shoot it will outweigh any performance advantage. The rifle is not going to be the limiting factor for 99% of new shooters anyway.
@IMPACTSHOOTING the sweed comes with a 8 or 8.5 twist rate and loads up nicely to just under 6.5 PRC speeds . Maybe not quite the neck angle as the prc . But leaves the needs more for dead .
Surely prices and availability for ammunition should be a consideration, especially for new shooters coming into the sport. Performance aside, the price and availability for the PRC and Creedmore ranges will take a long time to rival the other cartridges mentioned, and that is assuming they will indeed be the standard of the future, which is a big 'if'.
You can allways shop Sako TRG 22. For example, standard 308 win rifle has magazine for ammo 71.12 mm, Sako has 74.5mm magazine. Chamber also holds more pressure than standard saami. In this moment my 308 win at 178 bullets have 10.2 mils drop at 1050m, my 6.5 creed with 140 bullets at this same distance have 10.5 mils drop. Sou there is 308 and 308 :)
To be fair, most people have no justification for anything other than having a 22lr, 223, 308/6.5 creed, and 7 rem/(300 win) mag. 99% of hunters and shooters can’t out shoot the cartridge at the given range it’s possible to ethically hunt game. Ruger 10/22, ar15, and a tikka bolt action 308/6.5 creed and 7 or 300 mag covers all grounds
7mm08 is my favourite, but I think when he says 7mm in general is the goldilocks of calibres you can take that as a win. It’s just that 7prc is the newest. I think if you have any 7mm your on the board.
@razz_nz4143 I mean the PRC is a replacement for 7Mag, 280 AI, maybe arguablybthe .270 ince there's barely a difference in bore diameter. 7mm08 is meant to get the job done with less powder, and if anyone is going to try and replace it would likely be AR-15 length, maybe something similar to a WSSM.
Ok Pete you have never ruffled my feathers before until now . Did Hornady pay for this video. I will keep my .22-250 or a Ackley version any day over a 22 creedmoor. I will keep my 6 xc or 6 BRA over the 6 creedmoor any day. The 7 and 30 I can buy into. I’m happy with my .30-338 custom not going to get a 30 PRC .I love what you do for this community,Tahnks Big Time
Hi Bruce, I think a lot of people missed the premise of this video sadly. Its for new shooters, Im not saying sell your rifles and buy these instead. And no, no affiliation to Hornady
@@IMPACTSHOOTING, Exactly how I received the video as a newcomer. I still and will always have my inherited classics in .243, .270 and .308 but I am sold on getting a modern cartridge in the safe. Thanks.
Not to rip on your list, but you have to consider availability. In the land of powder and lead, alot of these modern cartridges are few and far between.
The 30-06 is a great 30 caliber cartridge for 165/180 gr bullets without going magnum or over bore. I cut my teeth shooting military 30-06 1903 SPFD and 8mm Mauser 98 military rifles with steel but plates. I might have been 11 or 12, and yes they did recoil some but not bad enough to turn me off. I have shot competition and hunted with 6.5C & 270WIN. Also hunted with 7-08, 280REM, 270WIN and 30-06. Now days I hunt deer in the western US and use a 270. With a well built custom 270WIN. I get outstanding accuracy and velocity using factory Hornady 140 SST Superformance ammo. I will never take a shot past 500m and the 140SST in this ammo has a mv of better than 3100fps, enough umph to anchor deer. When hand loading my 30-06 in a MOD70 Classic Winchester I was able to get 180 grain bullets to a mv range of 28**fps without getting to max charge. To upgrade to the modern well thought out 6.5/7mm/300 PRC means a lot more powder burned and harder components to find and pricier factory ammo just to get speeds that are nice but not necessary. My dream cartridge would be a 7mm Mauser cartridge giver the "Creedoor" design elements. Elements like chamber designed specifically for 160gr bullets, sharper shoulder and less taper in the side wall, kinda a 280REM efficiently redesigned. BTW enjoy your videos and agree about the 22 & 6mm Creed's.
@@TheGunNerd some truth there, but very few hunters can "outshoot" the gun they are shooting, i have not had one single whitetail or blackbear complain that the 30-06 i took them with wasnt efficient enough. been using the same 30-06 for hunting since i got it new in 1988. ammo is EVERYWHERE and cheap for the most part. have been shooting "big" 200+G bullets out of it no problems and it just plain works, why would i ever replace it ? so i can brag that the bullet is a 100fps faster...so i can spend more money on ammo if i can find it....nope..ah must be so that i can have the latest greatest flashy new gun... guns are not cell phones, shouldnt have to replace then every 2 years. my 30-06 is now 36 years old and shoots like day 1, gets about 20 shots a year, should last a easy 50 more years and be killing things just as dead then as it does now. so why would i ever change or recommend anybody not use a .243, 7MM rem mag, 30-06 or .308 or .270? they all work great for hunting.
@brian770 most more modern rounds are hitting harder at farther distances, and if you can shoot good at way over there, why use an underpowered round? 6 creedmoor provides all the good things about 243 except availability (but it's catching up, just slowly) and that can be remedied with buying ammo online. Same with 7 prc. If you're shooting things far enough away to need a magnum, you're going to benefit from 7 prc. I will say tho old cartridges aren't bad, but why use an old round when a more modern one has inherent benefits? 30-06 is great no doubt. For deer and bear inside of 300 yards it's wasted performance. While I can't see myself replacing my ar10 in 308 any time soon (30 cal rocks up close), 6.5 creed has less recoil, availability is catching up to the point it makes almost just as much sense to go with it for availability, and it hits significantly harder at extended ranges. 270 has performance similar to 6.5 prc, which has the same benefits over the older counterpart. Don't switch if you already have an older cartridge, but if you're in the market for a new rifle, why go with 300 win mag when you could go 300 prc?
In 2024, I bought a Garand in .30-06. As far as horses, when an EMP hits, horses will still get us from A to B. Very few cars will, only the really old ones.
5:22. 22-250 is my all-time favorite cartridge, but even with a built rifle with a quick (1-7, 1-6.5) twist, getting quality brass for it is incredibly difficult. Brands like Lapua/Peterson don't produce 22-250 brass anymore, so now you're back to fire-forming your own brass if you want something beyond average brass.
One little comment on the very beginning of the video: There is another way of making a bullet heavier: Use material with a higher specific weight. Doesn't change much for the discussion, just saying... In regards to the calibers: I am somewhat missing the disussion on the ones between 30.06 and 50BMG... You did mention the .375CT and the .408CT which I appreciate (I am shooting a .408CT myself), but I am missing things like the 300 Norma, the .338LM and the .375 Swiss-P in the discussion. I believe that a .338LM is a good alternative for even some .30 bullets, providing more range with not too much negative side effect.
Re: recommending the purchase of a rifle chambered for a "vintage" cartridge, it depends on what you intend to do with it. If you want to target shoot and are within a relatively short drive of your loading bench, it's a different situation compared to a rifle that you might take with you on a multi-day hunting trek. It's a question of ammo availability; nearly any place that sells ammunition will inevitably have a box or two of many of the older cartridges... .308 Win, 30-06, 7mm Rem Mag, etc..., but isn't as likely to have the latest and greatest gee-whiz ballistic flavor of the month. Ideally, you'd never forget your ammo at home, or never drop it in a puddle/river, or never lose it... but stuff happens; and as we see with electric cars, when things don't go according to plan and you are outside of your own "area", there's something to be said for common availability of that which you need in order to keep going.
Biggest risk in traveling to a hunt is the airline losing the ammo. Definitely with you - I'm headed to Limpopo in a couple weeks, bringing my 9.3x62 and my 6.5x55. If the carrier loses my ammo, every gun store in Jo'burg will have ammo for both of those rifles.
The 22, 6mm, 6.5mm were all standard size cartridges. Then you stepped up to magnum for 7mm and above. Furthermore, the moral of the video was "If Hornady designed it, shoot it."
If you need an intermediate recommendation, a 6.8 Western fits short action length with magnum bolt face (like 6.5 PRC). You get energies of heavy 30-06 with better ballistics. If it wasn't clear from the recommendations in the video, the classic long action case doesn't really fit the cartridge design trend because of its long aspect ratio. If you really need a standard bolt face long action cartridge, the closest one to the modern design sensibilities would be a 280 AI or 284 win, but i'm not sure if there are factory rifle offerings with the right twist (or even factory rifles whatsoever)
I enjoyed seeing what new stuff is available out there and try to keep an open mind, but cost and availability is always my first concern. As far as these “old” rounds go, they’ve been around forever for a reason.
I have a .308win and a 6.5CM and I only realy use it to hunt under 300 meters. Both do 2760fps but the one is 130gr and the other 150gr. Within that range I prefer to use the 308 on bigger animals, because the tragectory of both are basically the same, but at that distance the .308 just has more energy on target. If i hunted over 400-450 meters the lighter 6.5 CM has more energy on target, but ja, I don’t shoot that far. Well, there was that one blesbok at 450meters, and the 130gr 6.5 performed like a dream.
For hitting steel at 1000 and beyond, I would agree with much of what you say. I’ve spent my share of time sitting at public ranges and feel comfortable in reminding you that well over 90% of normal shooters have no business shooting past 300. 99% have no business shooting past 500. I also didn’t hear much about added recoil for the heavier bullets. For new shooters looking to hunt deer the .243/257 Roberts/6mm creed are fine, I would also recommend looking at the classic 270/7mm08 if they are comfortable with the recoil. The 7mm and .300 PRC’s are designed for big, heavy bullets which makes for heavy recoil with loud booms and more likely to scare off new shooters. With normal hunting bullets like the 140/150 gr 7mm or 165/180 gr in the .30’s there’s no real advantage to having a PRC over any of the classics. The 300Win or even a good 308/30-06 with a 165 gr bullet is every bit as effective as a 30PRC/30 Nosler at the ranges most hunters encounter. Same thing goes for the range. I’ve shot public ranges from Georgia to California and the vast majority of public ranges don’t go beyond 200 yards. So let’s start our new shooters with something like the 270. Recoil mild enough for most shooters, effective on deer sized game at any ethical range for the average hunter, tons of bullet choices at much better prices and availability. I’ve even heard rumors of people taking elk with a 270 if you can believe that. 😉 1 last thing on my long winded rant… a good friend of mine in his 50’s, been hunting since we were kids, read all the articles, bought into the 300PRC hype and bought one, even though he didn’t like the recoil of his ‘06 with 165 gr bullets. After the first half box of 212 gr eld-x bullets he decided to finish sighting it in another day. When he pulls the trigger you can watch him flinch and close his eyes a split second before shooting. With the help of a lead sled we got him shooting halfway decent at 200. I don’t think anyone could argue the fact that he would be better off shooting a 7mm08 or 300 Savage with little to no recoil, no flinch or closing the eyes.
That's simply because Hornady produces winners. With the exception of the 6.8 Western, I can't remember the last time someone other than them produced a relevant and innovative/efficient cartridge improving on what's been out for the past 20+ years without serious drawbacks
@@K-bob_45 Yet modernized and standardized meaning that you don't have to buy a custom barrel, non-standard chamber cut, and handload to get the benefits. Also they're built with better powders, bullets, and case geometry in mind.
Piet! Your dad was right... dad is always right! 30-06 is the best of all riffles. Klaar gepraat. If you have a problem with the recoil then take of your high heels when shooting, stand firm man.🤪
My only comment is that the cost for the new "modern" high BC cartridges are more expensive than similar performing old school cartridges from a store.
