As another data point, Walmarts are stocking the Champion Labs e-core style Fram Extra Guards as of Mar 2024. I checked PH7317 and PH4967 and both had e-cores, blue bypass valves and nitrile ADBV. The dates on the boxes ranged from Dec 2023 to Feb 2024.
Interesting as 7/7/24 when I went to Walmart I checked the PH7317 out and it had louvers with a silicone ADBV and looks to be metal end caps I would want to say just because I’ve never seen them use louvers in the PH series but I may be wrong!
The newer Fram is definitely better constructed than the old Fram. Looks like maybe a Super Tech inside an orange can. It's probably the first Fram I would consider in the past couple of decades.
The new ones are made by Champ labs, now owned by Fram. They’re identical to the white Supertech filters. I haven’t seen them in my Walmart yet but I’ll be looking
The newer Fram is a Champ/Luberfiner made filter identical to Supertech. Both Fram and Luberfiner are owned by the same parent company. This is most likely a temporary supply chain substitution.
I would love to be able to send the link to this channel to every manufacturer out there; and not just to someone on their public relations department. For SO LONG they have not had to worry about someone cutting open their products for comparative analysis. Way to hold them accountable! You rock, Whip!
It cracks me up all the people talking down on Fram. the Fram orange can is a world of difference than a Fram Ultra. Fram offers products for all price ranges. I respect that. The ultra dominates in performance over every filter at any price except for special bypass filters.
Looks like Champ Labs (Supertech,Acdelco )has the new contract for fram I like that!! I'm sure the reason for the nitro anti-drain bag valve is the same as the supertech not having one now either is probably being a supply issue with silicone!!
I think E cores are a cost saving move. The core style isn't impeding any flow since the only restriction is the media. Cores flow more than the inner diameter of the stud mount anyway.
8th February 2024, Fran still selling the “old model” so, there is no “new” and “old”, maybe for the high demand push to Fram to buy with other provider
They ripped off everyone for years with garbage filters. New one looks better but they're dishonest with the label about silicone. How can they be trusted? Love your content. ✌️
first one FRAM production second one is Champion labs production the E core is their signature, they are both fine but not a fan of nitrile rubber adbv's
If I were to choose, it would be the newer one for me. It has been improved with more inlet holes. Any improvement gets my vote. YaY to improvements and better quality filters! 👍
Been noticing the same thing you have shown us there. I actually had bought a few new fram heavy duty filter's and they are slapping a fram sticker and number on a luberfiner. And one instance i peeled the sticker off saw luberfiner. So hopefully next month I am going to stop down to the luberfiner champion labs facility in Albion IL and see if I can get a couple answers in a tour.
I would like to see another newer date coded extra guard to make sure the one purchased off Amazon wasn't just a knock-off given the major amount of changes. The sticker, what appears to be a nitride rubber ADBV, especially since they just switched to the silicone ADBV a year or so ago to increase the service life of the filter.
The one from Amazon seems to be a Champion Filter, but the paint on the can is crappy and the sticker is not right. Its either a counterfeit filter or FIRST BRANDS who is the parent company to both fram and champ labs is doing a terrible job of making the public think they are upgrading the extra guard filter. The could get sued for false advertising based on the box.
@@GT-mn3bx Only 'one' black adbv has proven to be other than nitrile, Toyota Thai Denso, silicone. And in the case of First Brands Fram orange can, the black adbv used has been burn tested by Whip and other forums and proven to be nitrile. Confident one on new "Fram", nitrile.
Newer one is better... Metal end caps Inner cage conducive to better flow Pressure relief valve design I prefer Nitrile ADBV meh overlook-able Seemed like a slightly improved design. But only time will tell tbh. Can't wait for some follow ups in the future 👍 Interesting 👍 I always use Fram ULTRA though
I have to say, i would definitely consider the new Fram. In a pinch. But hey, that's more credit than i used to give them. Glad they seem to be going in the right direction!
Looks like they took one step forward with the metal end caps and one step back by removing the silicone anti-drainback valve, resulting in no real improvement.
Interesting changes. However, the pricing is still a joke here in Canada. Can order in a WIX XP or Purolator one filter from the states for what they charge for a fram extra guard in stores here.I suppose that falls in line with the rest of our parts prices being outrageous here though.
I don't think there is a new and an old Fram, I think it comes down to where you are located and the supply chain, Fram bought Champlabs and they ship to your location from the closest factory. the newer Fram is similar to a Supertech, so it is just a Supertech painted orange.
The new Extra Guard looks like an AC Delco filter. Nylon center, inlet holes and also Delco has a sticker on their cans. Made by the same factory for AC Delco maybe... Also the filter media is not the same, the new one looks like Wix media style.
I just looked at some Fram extra guard filters today, and most look like the old design. Maybe Fram hasn't switched all filters to the new design? Or maybe they are old stock??? As always, I enjoy your filter analysis!
Is it possible that the new version is actually a bootleg ? The sticker is something that Fram has never used. We all know that merchandise purchased on Amazon isn’t always what it appears .
The last and final time I used a Fram Filter was back in 1991 on my Camaro. Fit great but after several minutes it began leaking at the seam. From then on I used the original AC Delco oil filter or a WIX.
I think first brands is switching up the filters, but doing a sloppy job! They should have put a silicone ADBV in it and written new and improved on the box or something. Somebody dropped the ball!
@@davidcampbell1899 Well, First Brands has been substituting nitrile adbv on EG and TG, and box still said silicone. IOW, not new. Whip posted one such example on an orange can.
The newer "Fram" looks most like the current Champ Labs made Advance Auto "Drive" filter with a sticker and some "sure grip" on the dome. First Brands throwing them in the same box as older Fram...no beuno. Also nitrile adbv when supposed silicone....also no bueno. Fram going to metal endcaps after all these years of promoting fiber end caps.... heresy. lol However, add a silicone adbv to the new design, good to go I think. Who knows if this version the final one. Metal caps on an Orange Can (and TG), who'd a thunk it? Thanks to Paul for the EG filter and you Whip for the vid. 👍
According to Frams site a few months ago, the Drive is a step down from the Extra Guard. I was looking for Ultra specs for Duramaxes and they don't have them. Only Extra Guards.
My order of 2 PH7317 arrived today and they both have a date code of A41732 (June 21, 2024). The center tube is steel with louvres and I don't think it has steel end caps. I did not cut them open. The bypass valve is the usual button type.
I like the newer one a little better despite the nitrile rubber drainback valve. The inner construction looks better. The newer Fram looks like a Champ filter also a Supertech. Maybe that is why they have a sticker instead of printing the name on the can.
Ugh. Nitrile rubber ADBV ruins an otherwise decent filter. The new one reminds me of a budget Supertech but with metal end caps. Are we sure that maybe the one from Amazon isn't a fake? It would be interesting to get Fram involved and find out. Amazon has tons of problems with fake products and they won't know if someone doesn't call it out. I find it hard to believe that Fram would say it's a silicone ADBV on the box but not actually have one. That's like a lawsuit waiting to happen for them.
In this case, I believe to new EG filter purchase at Amazon is an authentic First Brand Champ Labs made Fram. First Brands already been doing same for Advance Auto "Fram" filters for quite awhile with the AAP Fram Drive oil filter. And First Brands Fram has been substituting nitrile adbvs for silicone on EG and TG, Whip has posted one such filter. If any lawsuits coming would be from consumers to First Brands for false advertising.
The newer one sure looks identical to my Champ XL PH2867XL which is the same fitment. Ecore, nirtle valve, 13 holes, blue bypass, same shape dome on the can.
With so many counterfeit automotive products showing up on Amazon (spark plugs among many others) I'm wondering if it has now hit the oil filter segment. Guess we will know if this is legit if the "newer" design shows up on the shelves of the brick-and-mortar stores.
I still wouldn't leave it in 10k or 1 year.Its cheap enough to change, I opted for the fram ultra synthetic.I was going to leave the extra in until next oil change but decided not to. Also, I only had to pay a few more dollars for the ultra, which was on sale. I'm more comfortable leaving the ultra in for a year if I decide to.
They finally changed those resin cardboard end caps. Years and years of people trashing the Extra Guard. Their filter media is exceptional, now they have end caps to match. I am happy to buy an Extra Guard again! Wonder if they are gonna change the OEM Honda and Subaru with metal end caps.
My guess is that First Brands is consolidating their budget filters into one, cost-effective line of filters. I’ve been a fan of SuperTech filters and with these changes, I feel that Fram can begin to overcome some of the negative feedback of their old design. They’ve got to fix their supply issues with the silicone adbv however. I’m curious how the Fram tough guard looks now.
Looks like Paul & me got something in common, both from Staten Island & enjoy seeing oil filters going under the knife by Whip City Wrencher 👍 another great oil filter autopsy
Champ / Supertech painted to look like a Fram to me. First time I have ever seen a Fram filter without a metal core. I wonder why they farmed their filters out to Champ. Can't beat em join em I guess! Thanks for the review!
Hi Spanky, The Fram Drive has a nylon core also but felt endcaps. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-scM5LnSR1Uk.html&ab_channel=WhipCityWrencher
Ever since your Purolator tech video those are my budget filters of choice. Already have one installed on my wife's car. The new Fram eg looks solid though.
That right thar is a Champ filter dressed to look like a Fram. MUCH better filter. They technically have the same parent company, but I don't think I've ever seen them collaborate like this.
Just received PH7317 filter from Amazon and the box is from a "newer" version as shown in the video, however the filter is the "older" with silicon anti-drain back valve.
@@WhipCityWrencher 10 holes - Exactly the same filter as your old one. Inside is the metal, not plastic and Fram logo is printed on the can, not a sticker.
@@Charkatak I never compared the two side by side but here's a video of the Honda filter I opened almost 2 years ago. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ezrOmYzNi5Q.html&ab_channel=WhipCityWrencher
Probably as durable as any plastics on modern cars. Just as I take manifolds, oil pans, etc. The heat, cold cycles eventually causes the plastics to warp or crack and leak. 🤨🧐😏🤷♂️
@@WhipCityWrencher You would think they would test this in say 500 degree oil which would exceed anything even high performance street cars would see. I like steel.
@@GT-mn3bx I've opened a few used filters and never saw any problems with the plastic, but the glue, on the other hand, I have seen problems. I just opened up a used one today with bits of glue all over it. Still working on the video but it should be out on Feb 7th.
All Fram had to do was to add metal end caps...that's it and it would sell fine as a medium level oil filter. In essence; they re-branded what looks like a Walmart Supertech oil filter.
I'm a little late to comment but I'll add my 2 cents. I think the change is temporary and due to supply chain issues. FRAM was making the OEM Subaru filters until the shutdown. Then Subaru started providing a generic blue filter with no markings. Probably not a FRAM. Now Subaru is selling black Tokyo Roki filters. I'm going to order two PH7317 filters from Amazon tonight (07/29/2024) and I'll check the date codes and construction and report back.
ok... the 2 PH7317 arrived and they both have a date code of A41732 (June 21, 2024). The center tube is steel with louvres and I don't think it has steel end caps. I did not cut them open. The bypass valve is the usual button type.
The older Fram Ultra oil filter is better than the newer ones. You have to look for the year on the box only. If it says the year 2020, you have a good one. After that year, the quality diminished. .
Did Champion Labs buy out Fram? The new one looks like a Champion E-core filter. If Champion does not now own Fram they should sue them for patent infringement.
No. First Brands owns both Fram and Champ Labs. They have been calling Champ made filters "Fram" in the Advance Auto Fram 'Drive' filter for some time now.
@@GT-mn3bx Champ Labs, Luberfiner, same company. Luberfiner falls under Champ Labs umbrella. Which now under First Brands. So, 'if' Luberfiner was found not under sticker wouldn't be all that surprising.
@@WhipCityWrencher It’s gone from being a 3/4 inch hole to 20mm! I am assuming that is a permanent change, still waiting for Fram to respond. Meanwhile, ordered a $21 OEM filter from Troybilt.
Hello great typical oil filter review. Would be nice to get some real performance data to really see what the differences are. 1. At what PSI does the bypass kick in (If I am running 80 PSI on the gage is the filter in bypass). 2. Also what flow rate + PSI kicks off the bypass valve (I would think if it will filter smaller particles then it will flow less volume and create more PSI restriction therefore engaging the bypass at a lower oil pressure ). 3. Are high pressure high volume oil pumps running the filters in bypass and we are not realizing it ?. 4. Do the filters actually filter at the advertised particle size (how do we know). 5. How does the oil viscosity effect the bypass (Do thicker oils and smaller micron rated filters restrict flow and cause bypass more often). 6. If the filter reaches bypass all the filtered particles go straight into the engine right?. Don't get me wrong, your review was a great mechanical review of the construction. The bypass issue would be very difficult to test and measure, just something often wandered (worried) about. Thanks
All great questions. I can offer a tighter Wix Regular/Napa Gold at 23 micron vs XP/Platinum at 35 microns has 3 lbs cold and 2 lbs hot more oil pressure with same oil. (During summer temps). Also, going to 10W40 over 5W30 is about the same. Again during summer. I would think in winter the cold pressure would be a few lbs more than summer cold.
I see 3 possibilities: 1. Made in different Fram factories using different tooling. 2. Fram doesn't make one or both filters, but buys them from whatever factory is offering a better deal. 3. One is counterfeit.
Either that is a champ labs filter for the newer one, or someone got a scam product from the Amazon. Both are highly likely, but a sticker on Fram sounds like a fake to me. I got a set of Motorcraft plugs from Amazon for my F150 and the ones I got first time were wrong plug in box, second ones looked right until you looked at the electrode strap and the writing on base was in Mandarin… since no one had them in town besides the stealership, I went there and got correct part.
Hi Aaron, This RU-vidr made a what to look for in fake Motorcraft parts, here's the link. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-OpDJNDb6b9A.html&ab_channel=FordTechMakuloco
@@WhipCityWrencher I’ve seen that video. He has many good facts and great information. The way parts are faked, some look amazing, some even will function adequately in the spot. But I quit getting auto parts or off road parts off Amazon because I’ve had way too many be fakes or defects that someone returned and reboxed. Amazon is a terrible company who is definitely not on the good side of employee relations, or how they let companies advertise “real” parts, or send out reboxed stuff as new, And they will some times fight over stuff too. Tools have a tendency to be the same way, fakes or defects from the big rock candy mountain. I love your channel. Keep it up.
G'day Whip. Great video as per usual.Shout out to Paul for his generosity. I would not use either of these filters and if I was desperate I would use the new fram for no more than 3000 miles tops. Happy New Year to you and all your viewers from Aust.
Hello Whip, excellent video and comparison 👏 I still wouldn't run the new Fram filter on my bicycle. The orange can of death is a hard pass. I'm shocked that they finally have metal end caps on the EG. For me I will continue using Napa platinum, Fleetguard and Baldwin oil filters.
If the specs are still the same, the Gold and Wix Regular filters better. That's how they get filters to last longer. They filter worse. Save for the Purolator Boss. Last I checked.
@G T I like the rigidity of the platinum and the synthetic media with the screen backing to help keep the filter from collapsing. But I have used the napa silver and gold aswell they are all great filters. Far superior to fram.
Glad to see Fram finally started using metal end caps on this model! Kind of strange that they ditched the silicone ADV for the nitrile rubber but overall its a decent looking filter now. Thanks again!
I'll never buy another Fram filter again. A Fram Ultra Synthetic cartridge filter started breaking down in my engine and circulated throughout. I lost most of my oil pressure and that led to failed lifters
The only aftermarket filter worth considering is Mann. They are produced in different countries but they are all good. Otherwise just go to a dealer and get an OEM filter. I don't understand people who buy Fram filters after decades of history of torn cartridges. What makes them buy Fram filters if good filters are available at roughly the same price or cheaper?
i like the fram ultra synthetic filters but everyone just cuts filter in pieces and looks at them i wish someone would make a flow test machine and some particulate test on oil after being run through different filters with dirt in oil that would actually tell which has best flow or clogs first
This guy did and maybe still does but I think it's pretty expensive. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ChkwzU-nH3c.html&ab_channel=AndrewSchneider
Another case of not always believing what is on the box (or Fram web site). It looks like production of the lowest end Fram moved to Champ Labs but the box either wasn't redesigned or they had leftover stock to run through so "Silicone anti-drainback valve" isn't accurate. It is definitely a step up moving to the metal endcaps from the fiber endcaps though. Now an oil filter customer at Walmart has possibly three very similar options to choose from - Fram Extra Guard, Supertech and ACDelco.
Wonder if these are similar to the new blank blue Subaru filters ,the older blue FRAM Subaru filters are dissapearing & the newer blue dealer installed Subaru filters are completely blank & only the box has the part#& information, they also appear to now have the E Core too ,would be cool if Whip City could get his hands on both & cut them open
I got a Fram FE10295 filter element for my Tundra. It was made in the US, has a metal mesh inside, silicone (orange) gaskets, metal crimp on the filtration media. Looks like the same as the Toyota TRD filter, which are unavailable. Quality looks to be better than most of the other filters for the Tundra V-8. Maybe Fram is getting their act together.
Yep, that's a relatively New Fram Endurance oil filter that came a few months ago.ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-eIy_5SbvJWo.html&ab_channel=WhipCityWrencher
@@faxmen09 I remember that vid. I was just at Walmart. Some EG have silicone and some black nitrile. I guess it depends on the age. A while back their site showed EG having silicone.
