I love how the $1200 H.R. Pfretzschner bow was a favorite! Goes to show not all bows (or violins either) are valued accurately. I love the "blind" test which gets rid of preconceived notions.
I’m getting my good one repaired right now, my wife was very surprised sound difference. The practice one is balanced well, but it simply can’t pull the same out.
I still have fond memories of the concert Ray played with the Dover Quartet in Laguna Beach. So happy for Joel that he found a great bow at a great price!
My parents very generously bought me my second bow for my 21st birthday from Guiviere’s in London. I used this method too and it was nerve racking not knowing how much each bow was worth. ( I expect my parents set a limit 😁). It was great fun though and I still use that bow to this day.
It's amazing how two professional violinists can have strong opposing views on their preferences of sound. Remarkable exposition and it goes to show even the best have differences amongst the best of sounds.
Just for those who aren't "in the know" - Many great bows as made by the makers from the 18th or 19th century are made octagonally and *stay* that way (makers like Dodd, Peccatte, Tourte). But then for some reason they have been "cut down" to a round shape which takes away weight but gives the bow a different feel. If the wood has aged well on such a bow then the bow will keep its stiff feel and wont warp. All good bows start off octagonal, then are shaped to have 16 sides, then 32 sides/facets, then eventually finely rounded. There are a lot of great Tourte bows, Dodd, Peccatte, Pajeot, Simon, Persoit's which were once octagonal but then later "rounded out". Less wood means less weight on the strings and so they "speak" more clearly instantly. They don't always age well after this process though! I'm very thankful to have a Fonclause which is octagonal and untouched - it speaks the best out of all the bows I own (everything from Tubbs, to Bazin, to modern). A modern bow I have really out-does a lot of old French and German bows though [one being a Carl H. Knopf bow). This is why you might see many modern round bows being very thick in diameter - the maker *has* to give the bow a little more wood in order to make it "play". So you will generally see today's Chinese and Brazilian bows with a larger diameter especially in the middle of the stick. Octagonal doesn't always mean: "rule it out".
@@belmon38 I'm glad you got yourself a Sartory! Some violinists (who aren't too well known) say "bah, it's a French antique and it's nice but it's not good enough in comparison to the $50k - 80k French bows [that they've magically set money aside for]). Maxim Vengerov (an idol of mine) uses a Sartory often! Myself, I think I've seen perhaps 9 or 10 or 11 Sartory's and come to think of it - only ONE was octagonal! It was a beautiful example with very little shellac on the stick but still had a bright shine to the light-coloured pernambuco. The frog was in great condition and the silver mountings didn't have many scratches or 'pitting' marks that looked bad. I played it on my violin and the match just wasn't good. I then heard my client play on their violin and it sounded great. (The client played their Sartory on my violin and it still didn't sound good. They also played MY best bow on their own violin and the sound lacked a little something). Thanks for your comment :)
So much octagonal bow hate! I love octagonal bows, they feel so much more comfortable to me than round ones. But then I generally like a lightweight bow.
I liked the sound too. But sometimes the way it sounds up close will wreck the experience. Sound as viewer vs player are two different things. Haptic feedback is also important, I’ve rejected instruments that sound great to the listener because they are not pleasurable to play.
Well I need a Ray Chen in my pocket when I upgrade my violin bow.... not for a long while yet though.... Loved the vid.... and listening to you guys playing. Price isn't always everything....
Omg, this video really helped me choose a bow! Seriously, I've been checking bows for a long time and there is a shop selling a copy of Peccatte's. It will be a shot in the dark, but I think I'm gonna go for it just because you mentioned here. Thanks, Ray!
10:03 - bow no. 12 was a BIG YES from me, but then again it was being played by on a completely different violin to a Strad and by a person with a very different technique.
@@alandeutsch9987 I thought he said "You can like it, I could be wrong". I wonder what he actually said! Edit: Damn, now I think you picked up on the words best! "...and be wrong" sounds like a very fun bit of banter between these lads :)
hello ray! i'm new to violin - zero musical background and all - and do not play an instrument but you have opened up the world of violin to me! i enjoy listening to your playing, and honestly the snipplets in this video where you tested out each bow on your violin sounded wonderful to me! if you ever decide to just record and upload your random practice sessions i would definitely listen (currently listening to a recording of your saintsaens rondo performance :-))
The fun part is, my very first experience with a good bow was a Pfretzschner as well. I remember going to a bow maker and asking for bows in the price range of up to 1500DM (old currency in Germany, with inflation that would be like a 1000€ now). We did it the same way as presented here, no price tags and not looking at the stamps. He threw in that one Pfretzschner from the "golden period" of Hermann Richard. I was told it was about 15000DM (about 10k now) at the end, but I think thats at least double of what even a very good Pfretzschner is worth today. However, that bow was so amazing, but back than there was absolutely no way to afford it for me. So the end of the story is, that I fell so much in love with that bow, that I did not buy any bow at all up until 7 years later, because everytime it felt less. I now play a Grünke, which I am pretty happy with.
I ought to have listened on better speakers. The ones you guys tossed aside did seem to sound more Honkey...less pretty or refined. On my phone speakers anyhow. Thanks...I might be able to get a car title loan and not sell my house for a cool bow ;)
I just bought a new bow actually! The dealer gave them to me in batches of 3, and I'd pick my favourite and put it aside, then onto the next batch of 3. Keep working in 3's until you have your favourite. Turned out I also liked keeping my money. 😂
I've been thinking of upgrading my bow. Given that it's a $4500 HR Pfrezchner and how this turned out maybe I should just be happy with what I have. haha..
Hey Ray, I'm a big fan of Joel and the Dover Quartet and their collabs with the Brooklyn Duo. Now that you've acknowledged you can play the viola, I would like to see you review/react to Dover Quartet''s recording of Dvorak's American String Quartet, first movement.... or even better, hear you perform the viola solos from the piece!!
Haha octagonal bows are always my first picks. I think how it feels to the person, based on what they first learned to play with, really affects their playing sound.
I love the blind tests, reminds you not to have preconceived notions and try stuff out to see what you like/what works for you. Also the idea of doing it with another musician who can give you feedback is very good!
I haven't looked at tonic for a few minutes, but there was no mandolin practice there. You have mandolins on your mantle. Please include it if you have not already. 😊
Put blindfolds on the and give them some really cheap bows from the internet, don't tell them what they are then see what happens. We can't all afford those bows they were using...
Ray! Why is it so important to play on a $5.000.000 violin to choose what bow is right for you? Can an expensive bow make a cheap violin sound expensive?
For us, subscribers, to hold melodies tight, Two souls embarked on a musical flight. Joel Link, a master of the violin's grace, And Ray Chen with a heart's yearning embrace. A dozen bows they gathered, each a gem, To test their resonance from root to stem. Instruments of wood and horsehair entwined, Secrets of sound within their form defined. No price tags whispered, no bias to bind, The mystery of bows they aimed to unwind. Choosing three each, with eyes to the skies, Awaiting the moment when the truth would arise. Strings and wood form a symphony's core, Bridging the realms of what came before. Joel's choice was diverse, one to nine to twelve, A delightful journey where stories would delve. Revelations unfolded, prices unveiled, From thousands to thousands, tales of bows sailed. Yet within the notes, in harmonies true, Lies the essence of music that forever renews. A bonus bow, an unexpected treasure, Unveiling a sound, a memory to measure. Strings vibrating, like whispers of time, Echoes of melodies, in rhythm they chime. So in a video where bows dance and play, Two kindred spirits embarked on this day. With violins poised, and strings at their hand, They wove a capriccio, a story so grand.
