Orcs Deserve Better 

I like to lean on the idea of Orcs having been created as a race of soldiers for a Dark Overlord, and ask the question "what happens to the Orcs after the Overlord's defeat?" They were made for war, but now that they are no longer bound to their creator, they are scattered, trying to find their place in the world; some become nomadic raiders, others settle down in good locations and only occasionally go out to raid, Viking-style, and yet others offer their service as warriors to any nation or ruler who offers them land and protection.

The way I understand it, if Orcs represent law of the jungle, hobgoblins represent a military industrial complex

An interesting possible biological result of being able to photosynthesise could be that if they have a way to store the metabolites of respiration (CO2 etc) in their blood or other organ or tissues instead of exhaling it (similar to how the tissues of many diving animals store oxygen), they could use photosynthesis to convert it back into O2, meaning they could live and even thrive in places where the air is far too thin for even the most height-adapted humans (being the main reason an organised human civilisation hasn't tried to wipe them out, they just can't invade the orcs' home without suffering altitude sickness), and while closer to sea level it would be a boost to oxygen availability which, even if it's not enough in the moment to grant them a boost to their strength or speed, could extend their endurance, reduce the rate of lactic acid buildup, and shorten their recovery period meaning they could be ready to go again while a human is still out of breath, all depending of course on the rate of oxygen generation compared to how much we take in through our lungs.

Goblins could also be what became of the orcs that remained in the caves

A party if ircs using shared vision with falcons would be scary as hell

The Orcs in our recent setting are loosely based on the Chimera Ants from Hunter x Hunter, they have a slight chance to assimilate some of the genetic material of the creatures that they eat into their own body and eventually pass those traits on to their progeny. As such, they've developed a culture of being nomadic monster hunters, with an underlying practices based on eugenics. Essentially they min-max their lives to try to make their blood-line the most powerful it can be. It makes for interesting PC and NPC concepts at any rate.

In my books, I have it that orcs primarily live on a tundra. Their skin is green in the summer and grey in the winter for camouflage. They often hunt mammoths and mastodons, with large mastiffs as common companions. They largely worship the Goddess of Fire, for the warmth of flame needed for the harsh cold, though ancestor reverence is a key component too. Orcs typically seek personal glory through great deeds, which they believe their ancestors will use to determine their role in the Afterlife. Shining a brighter light, as it were. Their ties to fire are more than cultural; it is like the dwarves' association with earth. Orc eyes glow a burning orange, and they are resistant to flame. Some may be tempted toward the corrupt fires of Hell and demons. Orcs historically raided due to their environment and losses by monsters, and the pursuit of glory through battle. The books take place in an industrial revolution, so that has largely been left behind, with orcs having a recognized nation. One orc character is a weaponsmith and engineer. Though, old fears and their more monstrous appearance doesn't make them strongly welcome everywhere.

I personally enjoy orcs portrayed as brutish ignorant muscular jerks, it makes rollplaying them really fun. I would still play them in my world as raiders with limited capacity for creating complex stuff, with few exeptions, but still I really liked the highland living reasoning and the using birds of pray to hunt for game or scout the land. I can totally see that also.

Orcs are green because Jabba's pig faced guards in Return of the Jedi are green. Remember that the AD&D Monster Manual had black and white art of pig faced Orcs at the same time both Star Wars and D&D were really big.

I enjoy your more anthropological approach to TTRPG world building. These videos have given me a lot to think about throughout a day.

Nice to see you doing a response to ponty hat, the other day I saw a guy doing a response to your dwarf video

I think the reason orcs live in caves is because they were inspired by monsters who turned to stone in the daylight. Those monsters had to live underground and only come out at night.

I know this is a preference, but I actually dislike orcs being green. I think grey orcs just look cooler in my opinion. I know it's not everyone's taste, but I just don't like green lol.

I think going the tolkien route of orcs being corrupted humanoids can still be interesting, as dragon age did with darkspawn, half orcs being the grey wardens who partake orc blood to better fight them. This could also lead to variations of orcs of what was corrupted (as is the case with darkspawn). Their origins could be divine, demonic or a dark lord (A BBEG is returning and making the orcs go on a rampage). This could be periodic as is the case in dragon age and could spread like zombies with bites too depending how you want to portray it. That's not to say orcs as people (like in eberron) isn't a bad idea either but I think both have merit to what sort of story is told. A threat outside the walls or allies in the untamed wilds.

In a lots of D&D style setting underground doesn't necessarily mean cramped because there is often an underworld of caves and tunnel vast enough to sometime host whole cities. Also their pigmentation doesn't have to be related to light, it's the case for humans and melanine, but even on our earth their is species that owns their color to their alimentation or other factor. I believe for instance Warhammer explains the color as a byproduct of a symbiosis between Orks and a kind of algae or fungi. Then again I dropped of D&D quite some times ago (3rd ed) and as you said the orcs are better treated in other settings. WoW, Pathfinder, heck even Warhammer in its own way flesh them better.

Very cool to see you talk about Orcs as I am about to run a mini-campaign centered around one of the Orc subraces of my Homebrew World. I agree with your notion that keeping Orcs limited to one area/archetype/alignment is a little reductive, so for my world, I tried to create a presentation of Orcs that was not necessarily all bad, but also kind of justified their thirst to reclaim their ancestral lands while also giving them a bit of cultural/theme diversity. After a war with the allied "civilized" races as you called them, the Ancient Orcs (light green skin) were forced into a ceasefire, the terms of which mandated the great tribes of Orcs to disband and generally scatter to the furthest and most obscure locations in the land. Centuries and a bit of Divine intervention later, the survivors of that war had become four separate subraces by way of their secluded or isolated environments and the adaptations their deities provided them. Frost Orcs (shades of gray to stark white skin), Plains Orcs (yellow to orange and some red skin shades), Mountain Orcs (rich dark greens and brown skin shades), and Water Orcs (teal, blue, and seafoam green shades of skin). Your insights were quite thought provoking and it is neat to see someone with similar thoughts. I am quite happy to have stumbled onto your channel recently, and I am going through the back catalogue currently, cant get enough of the way you break down subjects and provide very sound reasoning to your perspective(s). Not to mention your voice and the cadence in which you speak is very calming and serves well to enthrall the audience. Keep it up my man, excited to see what else you come up with and I hope the channel grows as much as it deserves! Cheers!

Orcs as a race of demonic creatures who kill humans predates Tolkien. Orcus is originally a Roman god of the underworld, and orcs were his creatures of shadow that would drag people down into their hell. Tolkien just made them corporeal beings. So fighting against them being evil has always been weird to me, orcs are monsters with no culture or society they only know destruction because they're crafted from chaos (they cannot create, only through destruction can they bring about change).

The thumbnail is perfection

I think, ironically, orcs and elves share a lot of the same issues due to being adapted from Tolkien's works without carrying the context that makes them work in those settings. Elves, for example, are haughty and aloof because Elrond was haughty and aloof. But Elrond was haughty and aloof because he's _been alive for thousands of years_ and has watched almost all of his friends die horribly. He doesn't go with the Fellowship, or strike out to aid Gondor/Rohan, because he's already done this song and dance 5 times and is fucking tired. The last time he lead a big army to help the realms of men was the whole Angmar situation, and that ended with Arnor collapsing anyways and a bunch more of his people dying to only succeed in temporarily driving the Witch King away. The fact that he's still helping _at all_ is honestly a testament to his character, because his life has been one long train of watching evil _nearly_ be defeated only to escape to menace the world later. But then when you apply the Elrond archetype to characters who _aren't_ filled with centuries of trauma, it just makes them come off as assholes which is where you get the annoying snobby elf stereotype. And Orcs have the same problem. Orcs in Tolkien's work are a purely evil race meant to symbolize the worst of humanity. They are brutal, unclean, and murderous, caring only for things of utilitarian value, and motivated primarily by hate. They are mass produced, less people and more automatons of violence, and even among their own kind their lives are viewed as extremely cheap. Whatever Tolkien says about allegory, orcs are extremely allegorical of industrialism and the military industrial complex. They despoil everything they get and then look with greed and envy to lands that haven't been ravaged yet, in the way industrialism chews up the land for all of its resources and then looks to new lands for more. In the books, they're described as chanting the name "Grom" (That giant battering ram they break down the doors of Minas Tirith with) with reverence. They only revere things based on their utility, and love weapons of war especially. And this is why they're brutish and uncreative, because there is no room for art or expression in a world derived purely on utility. And they collapse into infighting without a strong unifying will, because their evil is self consuming. With no force to make them work each other, they don't expand from the lands they've despoiled and recede more and more until they only remain in the most fortified of mountain caves. They don't function without a dark lord... So when you take these character traits from Tolkiens orcs and put them on orcs who _don't_ have a dark lord, instead of being a well crafted critique of fascism, industrialism, and war in general, they just become a weird group of people who genuinely shouldn't be able to survive given how self destructive they are.

In Tolkien "orc" was a generalized term for what would be goblins and hobgoblins. Orcs came into their own later on possibly in early D&D. The third origin story given for orcs was Peter Jackson's movie adaption, avoiding Saurman's horrific breeding program hinted at in Tolkien's work. The modern massive beefy orcs are more Warhammer and WoWC, classic AD&D orcs are just human-sized. Not a big fan of the whole "Noble Savage" reimagining of orcs. Keep the monsters monstrous unless you're running an adult only gaming group. Fantasy monsters are used to shield younger gamers from all the savagery and sticky moral issues of living in violent dark age raiding cultures. It's OK to kill them and take their stuff because they're monsters.

As much as i love warcraft and it's orcs, i have to deepen the deepdive and throw both under the bus here. That the modern orcs and the society they hail from live above ground sire is cool but they too were originally cave dwellers. As per Warcraft lore at the very birth of the race their home planet's surface was populated by giants larger than any orc made construction. elemental constructs made by titans to combat the even more dangerous effects of overabundant life magic. theorised to be the evolutionary ancestors to the orcs, ogres, gronn and so on. for supposed eons any orc caught above ground was either killed or enslaved untill naturally the orcs made their way to take their world. these giants aventually hunted and killed for sport. or rather, so the tail goes. Some orcish settlements having made their homes out of the bones of such giants. however though if these were the same giants or if the initial threats were even larger is to my knowledge made purposefully dubious.

Professor Dungeon Master also had a good video on orcs recently. Worth the watch. As always, Tom, insightful vid.

Other ideas for the orc/goblin thing I've come up with: * Orcs are goblins who were modified by some wannabe dark-lord to become foot-soldiers, but who eventually rebelled, and afterwards, returned to their original home, becoming guardians to the goblins, who, in turn, became the orcs' craftsmen. * Orcs and goblins are the same species but different genders.

I would fight 500 elves and I would fight 500 more, just to be the Orc that fought 1000 elves for Gruumsh! I like my 1st edition orcs and am not changing them!

To me, fantasy races (of all kinds) are reflections of human qualities, both positive and negative. Dwarves are about honor, pride, and craftsmanship. Elves are about wisdom, beauty, and harmony. Halflings are about community, friendship, and courage. Meanwhile, Orcs reflect our tendency toward violence, destruction, and conquest (which we absolutely do have in us; just crack open a history book). Stripping the evil out of orcs, in my opinion, strips away their entire purpose as a reflection of the dark aspects of humanity. They're more than just a convenient enemy: they're a warning, that we humans can be just as evil as them, and we should strive to be more like the dwarves, elves, and halflings.

I noticed a distinct difference between a lot of modern fantasy Orcs and Tolkien Orcs; A lot of Orcs are stereotyped as being Violent and Brutish because they are "Uncivilized" but in Tolkien's work Orcs were the colonizers, they are extremely industrial destroying the natural world to fuel the war machine for the sake of conquest and progress. If you want to make "Evil Races" like Orcs the villians in a campaign wouldn't it be better to lean into that Industrial side of things and make Orcs the Industrial and Militaristic super power are invading to colonize and take the land for all it's worth. You could even have sympathetic Orc characters who feel crushed by the system that uses them as another resource.

I remember an online novel I read called "Praise the Orc!" which described the orcs as tribal groups that like strength and honor above all else, but that others despise them due to their innate strength advantage, vilifying them for generations and generations with wrongful stereotypes.

Since green skin is such a distinguishing and unique trait, I tend to prefer to keep it for the goblinoids, which in my mind are fey descendants (explaining the green colour and aversion to daylight). Instead orcs are more neanderthal-like, with stockier frames built for strength rather than the endurance and speed of humans. Due to their large body mass and shorter limbs, they’re less vulnerable to cold climates, but require more energy dense food such as animal products to survive.

In my world, I mostly combined D&D Lore with my own personal lore, which made them more like the Orc's from WOW: Basically, Orcs originally were much like how they are in D&D (only they're green and live ON mountains & plains rather than caves). the main thing is that one orc chieftain in particular discovered lost history involving Grummsh and Corelion and how the different races choose where to live. Eventually, after several tribes heard about this, they eventually decided to take the duty of the gods in their own hands and choose where they settle, eventually deciding to choose to live in valley's, hills, and mountaintops. they also eventually learned their biological relationship to Goblinoids (Goblins, Hobgoblins, Bugbears, etc.) and started living alongside them, along with other being who share their DNA, which eventually became known as the Goblino-Orcen Collective, which is a treaty which brings together several groups, including, but not limited to: Orcs Goblins Hobgoblins Ogres Etten's Troll's Oni Kappa Tengu (the last three being relatives to ogres, goblins, and hobgoblins respectively, caused by the mutations caused by a region known as Yokaima, which is heavily inspired by Japanese mythology) and Hill Giants Despite this, some other "Raider" groups are usually common enemies to the collective, such as gnolls, Tlincalli (Scorpion People), Sahagun, Bullywugs, etc. as well as their enemies, there are still some Orcs loyal to Grummsh and his hatred for elves. besides their enemies, they usually tend to be prideful warriors who always want to become stronger (only with those part of the collective, its less intense and can come with several meanings, such as skill in a craft, magic, or even interpersonal stuff). They do wield absolutely powerful warbows, rivalling elven bows in quality, along with their tendency to use either more militarized weapons such as Polearms or war swords, or more stylized and flamboyant weaponry, more often used in sparring (yes they have gladiator fights like they did in Rome, although they usually aren't as dangerous or unfair as Rome's gladiators).

Don't know why my comment is not here but the Green Skin of Orcs did not get invented by Gamesworkshop's Warhammer IP. Tim Kirk's "The JRR Tolkien Calendar" from 1975 in the month of September is where they get their Green Skin. Gamesworkshop does this thing where they steal ideas, concepts and names from Tolkien, Dune, Moorcock and DND and change one letter amd claim as their own. It's not a secret. The 8 pointed star of chaos has existed in our real world. But it was Moorcock that used it first to symbolize the Chaos Gods of his universe, not GW. Assume everything GW "creates" came from somewhere else, unless proven otherwise.

O! Great topic, I have an example about this very thing from my fantasy setting. For me, orcs are a sub-race of people who lived in a harsh and infertile climate. They developed natural strength and vitality, and also went through a series of internal wars, which hardened them and militarization became the key to their culture. For the most part, they united and were able to develop greatly, especially in terms of military technology, which at that time was ahead of humans and other races, which made them equal to all of them even if they united in one alliance. However, the weakness of the orcs lay in their little knowledge of magic, simply due to the fact that all the ancient dungeons from where the ancient art of magic was dug up were located in the center of the continent where humans and others lived. And the Orcs simply did not have the opportunity to study magic before they migrated to the regions of the human kingdoms. In fact, they are not hostile and do not want war, and will simply try to contact people. However, if aggression is shown towards them first, they will be forced to expect the worst and defend themselves.

I love the functional connection between your orcs and cacti and succulents xD (and I cannot but smile at the possibly involuntary parallel with GW's take on orcs as mushrooms)

It's become one of my favorite things, when Tom does videos like this, to see if I remember official bits in D&D that line up with the amount of thought he puts into the subject. In the case of Orcs and the mountains, a bit of old lore suggested that, after the other gods had made their personal races and given them domains for their own - Dwarves below the earth, elves in the forest, etc. - Gruumsh found that all that was left for his own species were the wastelands and the rough mountaintops. Furious, he swore a vendetta against the other gods, and passed it on to his created people, to wage it against the species of the other deities. Of course, none of that explores what the details of their culture might be quite so vividly. Tolkien's orcs were the concept of the worst of the barbarian horde; the savage, murderous, and innumerable strangers who sweep in to ruin and pillage. They are the vikings, and the mongols, and the huns. This is where the uncomfortable concepts attached to the Half-Orc are born, in a very real historical trauma that many societies have suffered. 'Orcs' burned the Library of Alexandria. 'Orcs' did worse things to the Irish people than even the British of comparable time frames, to hear the Irish tell it. 'Orcs' savaged China, with the latter helpless to even slow them down. Give Orcs better weapons than everyone else, and they are Europe through all of recent human history. And the word is in vogue again these days, for a reason we're all aware of. This raises all the problems people fixate on of course: an entire race of murderous raiders with no culture of their own, but full sentience nonetheless, is bio-essentialism at its worst. And the Christian themes that were baked in to D&D's early days also mean you have the dichotomy of 'natural magic' against the power of gods and their clergy. See Tom's video on Shamans and Druids for a good look at that. Tolkien's 'created to be monsters' explanation ducks the bio-essentialism problem: his orcs aren't truly 'people', they're monsters that imitate sentient behavior, but aren't capable of making choices or experiencing emotions the same way. A tragedy, but a deadly threat nonetheless. But as always following authors were less skilled than him, or just missed the point. D&D 5e approached it a fascinating way, removing the 'inherent evil' from the species but making their culture deeply religious. And all of their gods warlike and cruel. I've mentioned Karen Miller's Empress and its following books before, but if you want a good, viciously awful look at what THAT would be like, look there. D&D 3.5, or its novels, approached it from the perspective that Gruumsh actually is capable of caring for his creations. And they had R.A. Salvatore explore what it might look like if a god as violent and terrible as Gruumsh demanded of his people to establsh a *Society*. Not to raid and pillage and murder, but to carve out a place for themselves and LIVE with the others, for the betterment of the race as a whole. It is some of Salvatore's greatest work, to my thinking. And frankly I love all of it. I love having orcs as the terrible threat from the badlands and the mountainsides, I love the idea that they aren't inherently evil (the "is it right for a Paladin to murder baby orcs?" question was always easy to answer for me), but their *gods* either are or are so hostile that the distinction doesn't matter when they're sweeping down on you in a murdering horde. And I love the idea that even with this they can have a full and elaborate society as sentient creatures, instead of just monsters aping the concept. And I like the answer I landed on. The gods are not hundreds of different glorified Outsiders, they are what is True. And several of them crafted species of their own. Corellon is the god of Art in all its forms, a fey being that also holds dominion over love as Mania. Moradin is the god of Craftwork, again in all its kinds, of building things and skills passed down mapped out in math and learned instinct. And Gruumsh is the god of *Violence*. And the orcs are His. And while violence isn't inherently evil, it is inherently *destructive*. And so they are a species made to be the most ferocious, the best at conflict and physical contest. And His hold on the orcs, and His changing feelings over time, informed their role in the world.

Could someone guide me to what era/years to research Persian culture to match the nomadic orc falconer culture/ lifestyle

I've been making my way through your videos, and I can tell this channel is going to really blow up. Great, thoughtful work

in Tolkien, while he used "orcs" and "goblins" interchangeably at times, his intent is "orcs" are bigger Goblins(so the sizing are Goblin

I find it incredibly annoying that so far everyone who "fixes" orcs (not make them fit the world but actually "fix" them) just does some variation of the exact same thing. Noble nature themed warrior culture. Ya'll will go on about the evil races being unrealistic, unimaginative, and boring, but you always do the same thing every time yourselves. You know what i find boring? A fantasy world where nothing actually needs to be fought against. And that is exactly what this hobby is creating.

I would also like to see a prosperous and advanced Orc civilization too in fantasy fiction

There are two interesting orc civilizations in Pathfinder namely the Belkezen orcs, who outside of a handful of major cities and keeps living seminomadic lives coming back to the largest major river during it annual flooding called the flood truce to hunt and capture game and is slowly dabbling with both trade and alliances with there human nations, and the Matanji, who are effectively a military oligarchy that incorporates and allies with its human and elvish neighbors against the city of Usaro and are renowned Demon hunters because of this.

I've never seen the problem with Orcs being simple. If you want more complex enemies, you use humans, or elves, or some other group who have some practical motivation for their actions. If you want violent brutes without nuance, you use orcs. There's no reason why in a magical setting orcs could not exist as intended. They would be just like humans with innate psychological injury. They are naturally psychopaths, naturally have hyperactive amygdala, etc. Their baseline state is to be the worst of damaged humanity. Some very few might through accident or effort rise above these base instincts, but they would far and away be the exception to the rule. An orc that could behave like an average human would take an equivalent amount of luck and effort as a human behaving like a pure sage. Now, could such a group evolve naturally? It might be unlikely, they stand a good chance of failing to climb the evolutionary ladder to the form of an Orc. But in a magical setting where some rogue wizard or god could take some other sapient creature and "break" them into a shape that fills their purposes, orcs make perfect sense, and would be ecologically stable _enough_ to last throughout the timeline of most fantasy settings.

If orcs are capable of photosynthesis, then their biology is so far removed from humans that it would almost certainly be impossible for them to interbreed. Humans would have a better chance of having kids with an egg-laying species like kobolds, lizardfolk or aarakocra than with a creature so different on the cellular level that it has chloroplasts. If half-orcs existed at all in such a setting, they would have to be created in labs by wizards, much like owlbears and similar oddities.

Honestly I love orcs as they are in most settings, I personally don't think they need to be fixed. I especially like how they're developed in the Elder Scrolls. They have a lot of depth there without abandoning the core identity of the orc. I think there is an appeal to being somewhat monstrous and unsophisticated in thinking and appearance. Humanizing them too much IMO just takes away what makes them interesting. I think it's a general issue in D&D nowadays that races are basically just becoming humans with an aesthetic coat of paint on top and a few small quirks here and there.

In my setting Orcs used to be savage tribes until recently one chieftain united them and started to adopt the organization and strategies of the surrounding civilizations. He declared himself King of the Orcs and started modernizing his kingdom. Due to Orcs' natural endurance and determination, they managed to turn their land into an organized agricultural and military power in just over 60 years. Turns out they are just just about as capable at complex and innovative thinking as humans are, its just they kept getting kicked into the undesirable parts of the continent where survival was too much of a struggle.

I like a lot of these ideas! I do the skin situation a little differently. Rather than making them all categorically one pigmentation (grey, green, etc.) I make my Orcs a wide variety of skin tones, usually pulling from the classics people know. So we have Grey Orcs like DND, Green Orcs like Warhammer, and Terracotta skinned Orcs like the Mag'har in WoW. Just keeps things varied, and it only makes sense that Orc skin would have multiple shades like humans and other fantasy creatures.

Love this video. I think we need to move away from Forgotten Realms/WOTC lore in general.

Orcs are first seen in beowulf, as one of the "tribes hated by god." This makes them functionally similar to Nordic trolls, Celtic Sidhe, etc. as a race. That said, I prefer them as a sort of combination of the barbarian tribes from Conan and Chinese steppe nomads.

In RuneScape a tribe of goblins went underground to avoid “The God Wars” and have evolved to have pale skin but instead of losing eye sight they have super large eyes because as a species they still have use of their eyes. On top of their physical evolution, they became highly intelligent, peaceful and incredibly advanced living isolated for thousands of years

There are actually two types of Orcs in Forgotten Realms. The grey orcs you mentioned originate from another world and traveled to Faerun via big portal, similar to the orcs in Warcraft. The orcs native to Toril are mountain orcs, and they are generally more hairy and boar-like

The way that I run orcs is borrowed from their depiction in Delicious in Dungeon, Dhakaani goblins from Eberron, and the Wildlings from Ice & Fire. Orcs were once the most prominent humanoid species which had their own more permanent kingdoms and civilizations before being forced into a diaspora by the elves (who invaded and dominated orcish land), forcing them into remote locations like caves, deserts, and mountains as well as sparking a nomadic culture. This culture coupled with the fact that their resources were nearly entirely depleted by the elves (and subsequently the dwarves and humans) forced them to adopt either raiding or druidic practices (druids being the majority) to sustain their tribes. Human civilizations only recently began accepting more orcs into some specific cities but the prejudice toward them is still fairly negative due to the formerly mentioned raiding practices of a small number of tribes. In my fantasy, orcs are a misunderstood people who, due to their situation, have had to adapt and make hard decisions. I also let orcs have a wide variety of pigmentation: green being more prominent in grasslands and forests, tan in deserts, grey in rocky areas and caves, and even blues in snowy regions. I really like these guys LOL.

Many D&D races (particularly Forgotten Realms) in general suffer from their gods being too openly present, but at the very least it does make the amount of monoculturalism feel believable (even if it isn't enjoyable)

I have orcs in my world but there are three types on their homeworld. - Green Orcs: Who live in forests. - Blue Orcs: Who dwelled in tundras and boreal forests gaining blue skin and a lot of white hair similar to fur and humans made the legends of Yetis from them. - Red Orcs: Also called Ash Orcs evolved in volcanic areas and can gain nutrition from igneous rocks.

What about people who aren't fed up with classic orcs? I love those old stories. Why would I not want to play in that world?

Lovely video! I personally don't mind alignments being stapled on an entire race and that race having a god associated with them for these things do open up interesting dynamics. But such things must be justifiable: some instinctual need or desire Assuming an entirely different race would have the same needs, tendencies and all is superficial imo, but I do like the direction you're taking it. It's important to note: just because it makes sense doesn't mean it'll happen or is culturally transferrable. Religion and culture are such crucial parts of civilization and how history takes its course, so it's difficult to talk about how orc civilization without that context

I was yelling "Stop! Cut! Perfect!" around ten minutes. I have nothing against a wide-ranging loose discussion of ideas about orcs like the last 8 minutes. But my Tolkien orcs BBQed your falcons. Sorry about that. It's just the way my orcs are. ; )

For Orc (and Ork) deities I really enjoy Gork and Mork. Honestly Warhammer Orcs are just the best

I find it weird how they're always depicted as tribal and low tech when Tolkiens orcs are associated with industry and make "make no beautiful things but they maje many clever ones"

I've been working on an orc-like race for my worldbuilding and it's surprising how similar it is to what you're describing. Although i feel like they would absolutely maintain herds of animals. Bigger bodies means a higher food requirement, a reliable source of food is necessary on top what can be foraged and hunted.

>Pointy hat >Interesting video Choose one

I think your idea works best for those that want to be more like tolkien's orcs. I fully believe tolkien's orcs was inspired by how england saw genghis khan's mongol empire. From doing "barbaric actions" for fear tactics to the fact they seem unstoppable but then they suddenly retreat and just disappear only to learn that their leader died causing that retreat and they never could regain that power. So it makes sense to have them respectfully take inspiration from mongolia which also includes the horseback archery as well as plains and mountain life. To me this should be the default rather than mixing it with racist views of africa. Me personally i rather have orcs either be the main sea faring race with a heavy polynesian inspiration because samoan orcs seems great to me and my samoan friends. Can also have them take the role of fantasy humans were they are the western europe inspired castle builders that are constantly waring with the other kingdoms next to them. Plus looking at how the typical fantasy races are with the elves being very agile and able to climb trees, dwarves being great miners with their strength and small size, then why aren't orcs the builders? They can easily carry heavier stone that would require multiple humans and possibly the use of tools when you can just have a orc doing it. It's why for some settings i have the humans being the nomadic plains wakers and for other settings i have humans take the elf spots as the forest dwellers with the elves being the plains walkers with using their bigger ears to be able to hear more from the vast openness of the plains. To me have fun with a idea and get as much out of it as you can. If you're going have them being mongolian inspired take advantage of that with orcs being feared horseback archers and using birds as help.

My favorite orc homebrew culture so far has been basically "horse nomads but in the sky" crossed with the classic orcish warriors and raiders. So they were nomadic raiders hunters and mercenaries who rode giant bats. Orcish bat bows and air lancers served a lot of cities as warbands for a price and frequently facilitated trade

I could see an underappreciated potential for synergy and trade between centaurs and orcs if they both prefer relatively continental environments, but have different diets and habitat preferences. They're just different enough to have overlapping territories without competing, and their abilities mean comparative advantages in food production will help encourage trade.

Definitely stealing these ideas for my setting

The best part, in the Forgotten Realms the grey orcs are a newer subspecies to the more common mountain orcs. In fact, the grey orcs were far more calmer when compared to the mountain orcs. These variants had a dull green skin pigment, but often had a varied appearance overall. The greyification of modern orcs is a recent trend. Also don't be fooled by the mountain orc name, they were just the most common species. They kind of existed everywhere they could.

In my own campaign I based orcish culture heavily on ancient Mongolian society, with a smattering of other cultures to make then not just an expy. Animal husbandry is incredibly important to my orcs; mundane beasts like horses, dogs, oxen and chickens serve as mounts, companionship, food and labor, not because the orcs CANT do heavy labor but because if you CAN outsource it, why wouldn’t you? But they also tame more exotic creatures, like any of a variety of monsters, primarily as mounts, hunting companions and warbeasts. A horse (or warg, or rhino, or dire lion, or whatever have you) can move significantly faster and let the rider save stamina for fighting, if needed. My orcs also have their own smithing tradition; they craft outstanding weapons and armor in their own distinctive styles, with totems of protector spirits, deities and ancestors unique to either the craftsman or commissioner, and they keep secret the methods of smithing a metal called orichalcum, which (properly worked) can warp time subtly. They’re also not so prolific as raiders. While they do raid in times of hardship (when wild forage is hard to come by and the herds are thin and weak) they’re intelligent enough to know that overdoing it is an easy way to trigger a crusade. Rather, they trade gathered and crafted goods to settlements in areas they travel through; orcish goods are known for being hard wearing and durable to an extreme, and they’re a reliable source of wild plant and animal products from far afield. A common saying is; “If you want a painting or a poem to make you weep, find an elf; for a house or a statue to stand a century, ask a dwarf; for a dagger or a shirt to last a lifetime, seek an orc.” However, they also take up tribute from both caravans and settlements. This is grudgingly accepted because orcs in an area will typically kill or chase off more dangerous threats; both to keep the area safe for themselves and the herds they depend on, and to seek glory in hunting dangerous monsters. Thus, the presence of orcs means a region is going to be much safer, but a bit more expensive.

I think you’d really like the comic book ‘The Hunger and the Dusk’ by G. Willow Wilson and Christian Wildgoose. The Orcs in the series are heavily inspired by the Mongols, with a semi-nomadic culture built around their herds of oxen. Their ongoing war with the humans is driven by their need for grazing land clashing with the sedentary humans’ need for land to plant crops. One Orc even says to a human at one point “where your crops grow, our herds starve’.

In my world Orcs are heavily inspired by the Monster Hunter franchise. Orcs and Goblins are green and striped, brindled or spotted to blend in with the jungle areas that cover most of the islands. The islands where they are native to also hold gargantuan monsters of all kinds that attack pretty much any permanent settlement, so they keep their camps on the move and largely forgo metal unless totally necessary because they can't just set up a village and a forge and all that. They are naturally very strong and train to be far stronger, they have a deep culture of hunting, and wrestling in outfits inspired by the monsters they hunt. They use their incredible strength and resilience to kill the monsters that come their way and harvest everything they can from it. Meat to feed the tribe, scales and fur for cloth and clothes, bones and sinew for structure or for armour and weapons. They journey between forges hidden deep in the volcanic mountains to use the heat for forging metal on rare occasions, typically the hunt-leader gets their own metal weapon when they take the position, and any other metal is used for ceremonial knives used in the Ritual of Carving at the end of each hunt. Goblins fill a similar niche to Palicoes in this setting, I thought the idea of these little green guys who are incredibly durable and just wanna do their best to help out the big strong orcs is fun, they typically take on the role of caretakers and artisans whenever the tribe sets up camp for the week, cooking, crafting or patching up clothes and helping set up tents etc. When Humans and Elves and other folks come to the islands where Orcs live, they find out how much of a bad idea it is to try colonise the place and set up castles and try to arrange political marriages with the daughters of hunt-leaders. The Orcs fight colossal lizards and megafauna for a living, crushing humans is child's play. Not that they need to fight them when said megafauna rolls up and destroys the entire colony after only a month of magically erecting the castle.

A thing about the war bow : Pretty much every ranged weapon becomes more deadly with greater strenght ... Atlatals or javelins would also carry immense amounts of momentum to the target , And since we have both modern day evidence from african hunters using javelin and spears to hunt elephants , As well as archelogical and experimental evidence of atlatals being able to pierce deep into large preys , I suggest to make javelins and atlatals the weapon of choice for megafaunal hunters

I would like to see more Fiction with ''Orc Philosophers'' tbh

It’s funny that you mention Vikings in a video about orcs because Scandinavians at that time were also more than just Vikings; their women had more rights, they had a social hierarchy (Thralls, Karls, and Jarls specifically), there’s a whole mythos with a pantheon of gods, they traded as far as the Byzantine Empire (and some served the Byzantine Emperor as mercenary guards), they had an abundance of amber that they used in their jewelry, and they were quite fond of hygiene and appearance. Heck, they even traveled to North America before the pilgrims. This is kind of a long-winded way of saying Scandinavian culture might be cool to take inspiration from for orcs as long as we give their society more details like that rather than “capture, pillage, and burn everything”

in my setting orcs are simply a more barbaric race of elves, they look like elves but they have developed a green skin due to high amounts of copper mineral in their water and they're much taller than most elves and practice scarification rituals to brand their skin with their clan markings

I prefer to use Hobgoblins over Orcs

I imagine orcs as nomadic with the ability to not only survive but thrive anywhere. And the only animals they work with being large dire wolves hunting and working together.

Orcs in my setting were initially mountain and hill people -- largely ribal, and crepuscular/nocturnal since the have sunlight sensitivity and good night vision. As of the "present" in the world -- very few orcs in the north part of the worls still live in mountains and hills; most have been pushed into swamps, by the exxpansions of dwarves, elves, and humans. Which is an environment they can ... kind of get by in, but not thrive in generally. A lot of their raiding is because the environment they've been pushed to is difficult for them to survive in, and they routinely need to raid for materials and resources that are lacking in the areas they've been forced into. They also have a historical, ancestral claim to the hills and mountains, and occasionally they put together an army to try to reclaim some of the lost territory (with mixed results); others have integrated into the societies that forced them out, or find ways to survive as small scattered communities in their former homelands. The orcs in the west -- where they were able to keep their mountains -- are less prone to aggressive raiding and war activities; though still engage in it to some extent because often they just can't get enough food in the mountains for their current population and so have to come raid the neighboring societies to make up the difference. (They also... just don't have the lack of creativity, some of the northern orcs have cities and all of them have had some creative adaptions to make their new home more hospitable and such.)

One of my DnD version of the orks are they are humans that are changed to orcs during dark rituals. Orcs are savage and like horde of locusts.

I treat orcs as another subrace of goblinoids. They are the counter point to humans as the young expansive race, and they come into conflict by going after the same resources. Goblinoids are very mutable, and orcs are the strong stocky form. They make up a lot of the infantry in goblin armies

I posted this on Pointy Hat's video as well, but a while back I was also frustrated with Orc lore and tried to fix it a little, even made a blurb from the Orc's perspective. Here it is if anyone wants to use it: Little is as often told or as poorly understood as Orcish history. The Elves hold they were born from the blood of the god Gruumsh when he lost his eye in battle. The Dwarves tell that when the One-Eyed God marched on their ancient kingdoms he realized he would need an army, and so fed his blood to wild boars giving them humanoid form. Many Humans maintain He Who Watches led the Orcs from the depths of the Abyss to wage war upon the Material Plane. What is truly fascinating is how far removed these tales are from what the Orcs themselves tell. Recent scholarship focusing on using Half-Orcs as mediators and contributors in interviewing various tribes about their religious traditions has allowed us to piece together a consistent cultural narrative, which follows. In their own tongue the Orcs are called _Margumhai_, or “the Exiled People'' for where they are is not where they are from, and where they are from they can never return. Where they are from differs from telling to telling depending on the location and the neighbors of the orcs, sometimes it is an idyllic cave, sometimes a sylvan forest, other times verdant fields or green valleys. It is always called _Bhoguzg_ ``good land” and it is said that in those times the orcs knew no war and ate no meat, but farmed and foraged in harmony with the land. Then came the _Ashurzish_ “first enemy” and they were driven out and hunted like animals, their homes burned, their land stolen, never to be returned, who the first enemy is varies from telling to telling as well, but it is usually one of the longer lived races like Elves or Dwarves, though some vivid and savage tales of the first enemy depict them as being Humans. It is said for three days and three nights the survivors fled from the first enemy, until they could run no more and collapsed exhausted. The land they came to was not as good as from where they they had fled, but it was still good. So they set themselves down there, keeping careful watch for others, but living in peace, and for a time they prospered. Then they found the _Grakish_ ``second enemy”. The second enemy is almost always the Drow or the Humans, though occasionally it can be more exotic races like the Dragonborn or even a group of fiends. The Orcs tried to introduce themselves to the _Grakish_, but to no avail, the _Grakish_ raided them constantly, enslaving all they caught, and killing many. The Orcs tried to resist, but to no avail, they were too weak and knew little of war, and so they fled. For thirty days and thirty nights they fled, resting little and eating less, until the _Grakish_ were far behind them, and none could recall the way back to _Bhoguzg_. This land was much harsher, and they struggled to feed themselves from the meager bounty of the land. They persevered despite this, and there was peace for a time. Then they found the city of the _Gakhish_ “third enemy”, usually Dwarves, Elves, or Humans. Wary after so much conflict they hid their tribes and sent scouts to see what kind of folk were in this city. They saw many wonders there, and hiding their faces spoke to the _Gakhish_, and found them reasonable, and friendly. So the tribes came out of hiding, seeking to join hands with their neighbors, so that their wandering might end at last. But it was not to be, for the Orcs were hateful to the sight of the _Gakhish_. The city-folk reviled them as bestial, ugly, even demonic. The _Gakhish_ drove the orcs away, mobs searching the countryside for them. Outnumbered 100 to 1, they once again fled. For 300 days and 300 nights they traveled, until they came to the edge of the world. There it was truly barren, and there was little to eat, and many predators seeking to eat them. The elders despaired, for now they were truly lost, too weak to go anywhere else, but not strong enough to live there. There, at the edge of the world they found their god, Gruumsh. He was tired, he was battered, wounded, defeated, and driven out just like they were. Yet he was strong, proud, and unafraid. They had been driven there because of their weakness, but he had come there to regain his strength. Then _Durub_, first High Chief of the Orcs whose name now simply means “ruler”, knelt before the resting war god in supplication. “Oh Mighty One, we have traveled far in weakness, driven from place to place by the cruel will of others. We offer you our service for ever and ever, if you will only lead us in strength.” Gruumsh looked down with his one remaining eye, and his mouth twisted into a fierce grin as he replied “Know that *I AM Gruumsh*. As long as I have walked I have not known peace, and as long as you walk with me your fate shall be the same. But I can promise strength to you beyond what you have ever known.” So the deal was struck, and Gruumsh gave each man and woman of age a spear and took them on a hunt. The _Ashurzaz_ “first kill” is its own legend, but when the tribe drank the blood of the kill and ate its flesh they grew strong, and resolved to never be driven away again. They would reclaim their homeland, and if they had forgotten where it was that simply meant they would have to keep conquering until they found it. Then they would build strong walls and sturdy gates, and their children would grow fat on fruit and grain. But the men and women would be ever vigilant, never again would they suffer exile, never again would they be helpless. Now they were war made flesh, and flesh made strong. Such is the history of the Orcs, according to the tales they tell themselves. --John Reuel, Professor of the College of Lore

There is a quote attributed to Tolkien, that goed as: "we where all orcs in the great war". How truly is that quote from Tolkien aside, I think Tolkien himself never was quite satisfied to the origin of his orcs, and how they could be "better orcs" as you put it. In Tolkien's writings, orcs are adversarial and antagonists, but even there, here and there are bits that show that they do have a culture, a life beyond their dark lords wars. I personally like in modern fantasy, where the magical creatures of the past have become races of peoples, to be people. And people can do terrible things, but they often justify it to themselves.

Its an old game but kingdom under fire, orcs still generally look like standard orcs but are actually the best farmers of all the races. It makes sense, beyond just being good soldiers, their naturally burly size and muscles make them excellent on farms and most manual labor, though they arent the best craftsmen.

I feel obligated to bring Fateforge Orcs here : two very different cultures, born of a mightily important event (the ascend to godhood of an half-orc and how some orcs saw him as going overboard and totally not respecting orcish culture and tradition in his conquests as a mortal while others followed suit and paid a heavy price) but each being complex, with good and bad parts and frankly an overall awesome take on orcish violence being actually extremely borned and controlled through faith, traditions and sets of rules (no slaves for instance!). ANd they did so for all goblinoids and it rocks.

In the campaign that I'm not DMing for, I play as a Thri-Kreen whose favourite food is Orc.

I always worldbuild my orcs as obsessed with written knowledge, as their awareness of their own short lives means they know they have less time to learn, teach, and discover new knowledge. In some of my worlds, many alphabets are descended from the original orcish writing systems which were among the oldest writing systems, as well as orcs frequently inventing the printing press in various forms (woodblocks, individual letters, stencils). The result is that orcish libraries are expansive, well organized, filled with books that teach the basics of skills and professions fairly quickly, and orcish educational theory is some of the most advanced (become fully fluent in a foreign language in half to two-thirds of a year? Thank orcish teaching techniques).

in one of my home brew campaigns, my orcs were created as that cannon fodder by the fallen giants, who were at war with their children the dwarves , however these orcs were freed by there brothers the dwarves and had a slavic type of culture , where the dwarves had a very norse like culture, i had a hobgoblin otterman style empire, this also lead to orc-dwarf parented children etc .

In my setting, orcs to act as antagonists because they are the colonizers. I think it flips the script in an interesting way, as colonial stereotyping of indigenous people tends to be used in descriptors of orks. This cultural touchstone suggests drawing from colonial powers as the real world inspiration for orkish culture

My orcs are one of the first races created, and thus resemble their patron god the most closely. This being Gruumsh, who's more of a god of conflict and violence. As such, they view the world through a lens of winning fights. Mining is winning fights against the ground, woodsmanship is winning fights against trees etc. They are also renowned surgeons, skilled in nonmagical healing (which is still important since magical healing has limits), since they view it as 'battle against death itself'. However, this leads to two persistant problems. The first is that they're not great at writing stuff down or solving problems permanently, because that ends the cycles of conflict and violence that they see as personal growth and holy tribute to Gruumsh. The second is that this extends to greetings and socialisation - Orcs will happily raid each other's villages, viewing it as a social gathering. Unfortunately, this applies to other races. It took a very long time to finally bridge the gap and bring about relative peace, and there's still many tribes that prefer the old ways of doing things.

Given the sheer variety of their depictions across the fantasy works I've read, orcs have become my favorite race to explore in fantasy. I'm casually writing two stories featuring orc protagonists and decided to make very different takes on common tropes for them in my stories. For the first, they are heavily influenced by Tolkien and come in a few varieties, while for the second I wanted to swing away from the typically depictions and actually made them the closest fantasy race to human.

In my setting, orcs are the way they are because of an ancient war in a time where magic wasn't so powerful where many races fought against a common empire and the orcs were the greatest fighters, one of the only races that wasn't invaded, so before the end of the war, this empire made a special attack against orcs that left their civilization weak, and after the war, the other races were afraid of their power so they conspired against the orcs to reduce their numbers. Later some took them as s14v3s and continued to commit atrocities as such against the orcs, in such a way that today there are radical orc groups that raid and pillage more for revenge than for living, but most others do try to make up their relationships with the world and in the future, they'll become some of the most stable races in the world.

The reason my orcs raid is because they've been forced to live in the bad lands and can't grow or hunt enough for for themselves

Orcs in my setting are incapable of using arcane magic (they can't access my equivalent to the weave) and have a twisted connection to healing magic (they mutate when wounds are healed, often in a negative way). They're broken up into 2 factions, an isolationist military state that developed various sciences to compensate for their lack of magic, and a smaller theocracy following a chaotic neutral/evil life God ,who are more warlike

The way i like to depict orcs is they are just another species of sapient life that evolved during some kind if dark age. Most of my worlds have a Primeval Age (Lizardfolk), Golden Age (as refered to by Elves, Dwarves & the like), Dark Age (fall of Elves & rise of Man), with the current age being an industrial race between Humans & Orcs, orcs hate humans & vice versa due to competing for resources. Humans (with the help of Elves & Dwarves) won the war & orcs are now trying to settle in a world they arnt welcome too. While they are *in world* sterotyped as monsters they arr in fact just as cultured & varied as everyone else.

I like to think orcs team up with goblins because they look similar to orcish children. Like they know they’re not children but is similar to how humans feel about things that reminds them of children

If we have nomadic (or semi-nomadic) high altitude Orcs, falconry makes sense, as do herds of semi-domesticated horses and/or llamas (kept as food animals instead of work animals) on high plateaus or steppes.

My only big issue with Pointy Hat's video was how he basically jammed Grey Orc and Mountain Orcs together when speaking of Faerun orcs. The greyskin are far more civilized, has their own cities and are generally the kind you can talk to. Mountain Orcs, greenskins, however are like the goblins in Goblin Slayer.... also are the pig like orcs. Also the fact that the greenskins are the original orcs in Faerun while Grey Orcs are interlopers from another dimension.

In my main campaign orcs aren't dumb brutes & raiders, some live in cities and towns other in clans or tribes; they are diverse in their intelligence just like the other races, as there are smart, average & dumb humans the same goes for orcs. Aside from their size, strength, tusks & intimidating presence the color of their skin is tied to their environment: lives in forest & plains or valleys then green, lives in caves or cold regions then grey, lives in deserts or tropical places then dark green &/or brown. As a cultural specialty i made it so their smokehouses are legendary & they also trade with dwarves a lot as they have a bunch of creative mind & craftsmen.

Rather than the mountains where their large size would make breathing more difficult and falls more dangerous(square cube law and all). Instead I always liked orcs as swamp dwellers where the water support and the wide range of food could help support their large size. Additionally their green skin could be a symbiotic algae or fungus that protects them from other parasites and/or helps with photosynthesis.

In my setting orcs have a reputation for coming in from far away lands and invading because many orcs left their ancestral homeland after the neighboring nation of wood elves decided their mad king was totally right and their bat god needed human (and orc) sacrifices to stave off famine. i like to tie in cultural stereotypes to history in world rather than having them come from nowhere or, worse, having them be literally true

Yes!!!! In the world I’m building now, the gods gave each race their own continent or subcontinent, and thus they are all culturally very distinct; but I’ve been at a loss as to what to do with the Orcs. This is perfect inspiration! Thank you!

Interesting video, but I disagree with some of your opinions yet respect your right to discuss opinions. I don't mind the stereotyping that much & yet am open to breaking the stereotype in some ways. Anyhow, my issues with Orcs is simply they have too short of a lifespan potential in the lore! I unfortunately don't have a group to play with:( But, I have created 12 different Lvl 1 Characters in case I found a group. They are all either Elves/Elf Adjacent or Gnomes or Dwarves since they have the best Lifespan Potential and best lore!

I LOVE this (And most of your videos!) So when do we get YOUR fantasy world? I'm curious how you would put your ideas of Orcs, Elves, Necromancy, Druid magic, etc together.

Orcs have layers! More seriously though, as a fledgling world builder, this video as given me several ideas for world building my "Orcs" (I put the word in quotations, because in my world they call themselves "Zagrok"). I particularly felt inspired by the concept of Orcs worshipping the Sun, among other things. However, I beg to differ a bit about the Orcs not needing to domesticate cattle-like animals. Because while they might not be very useful as pack animals to the Orcs, domesticating them for their meat or dairy could be very advantageous for a specie which would likely need a lot of calories in their diet (at least compared to Humans).

Great video, even though I dislike pointy hat as of late. Would you perhaps make a video on giants as well some day? Giants are even more odd :)