Thanks. The boxes are from a guy on eBay. Good seller. Good communicator. I put a screen shot of his eBay name in video. Thanks again for your comment:)
I use a similar method, but the dowel that I use is tapered, resulting is a cartridge bottom that is about 1/4" in diameter, and tapers up to the bullet diameter. This makes the cartridge easier to insert in the chamber, and when compressed, the cartridge splits open, directly exposing the powder to the caps flash. I dip the bullet end in molten beeswax as a lube and as extra hold, and then wrap bundles of six in tinfoil. This makes small, surprisingly sturdy packets that can be stacked in a belt pouch or pocket.
Not bad. I have fired a lot of the "rear twist" type cartridges like that, and usually they work great, but I have had that mass of twisted paper end up clogging the flash hole in the nipple so bad that that chamber was out of operation for a long time. There is an alternative to both the end cap and the end twist closure styles, which I will be detailing on my channel in the coming days.
So, I have dipped round ball cartridges like this in the past. I would not recommend it. Even if you use 100% beeswax, this can and will melt in the summer, and make the entire cartridge wet. These cartridges will still ignite and fire, but leave much more paper and powder residue in the cylinder. Using the powder loads I do, I have plenty of space to put a wad (felt, cardboard, etc. soaked in lube) over top of the bullet after loading.
Thanks for watching and commenting. I am new to paper cartridge making but I’m not really a big believer that lube over the ball is actually necessary. Historically I don’t think it was a common thing. Maybe to help waterproof. ( i could be wrong) I lightly lube barrel after cleaning with very hot water. And often lube/bore butter over ball just on the first chamber that will be fired. The stuff I dip the ball in does take a little while to turn to liquid sitting directly on the stove burner. I don’t think the remaining chambers have melted from the already fired chambers but not positive on that. I’ll check it next time I shoot. The bore butter lube stuff on top of every chamber does melt away and make a mess before all chambers are fired. There should be close to zero chance of lube getting past the ball in the loaded chamber. I have sat in the hot sun high humidity dripping sweat waiting for groundhogs w/o lube melting. But I did not have my pouch w/my extra rounds on me in the hot sun. Saturday is supposed to be sunny and 87. That’s my hottest day in the forecast right now. So I’ll sit a cartridge out in direct sun all day. I’ll also put one on some foil to make it hotter maybe. Or maybe I’ll just put couple little bits of lube out in the sun. I’ll let you know what happens. Maybe make short video. :)
Hey it’s me again. Only going to be 84 today. I’m not going to bother with experiment. I don’t know how to replicate the outdoors w/o being outdoors. :) I will try it on a 90 some degree day some day. Maybe I can shoot this weekend and see if other chambers melt from firing. I’ll keep you posted. :)
@@andrewfett142 Would you try some Ballistol on the lead balls for lubricant? I don’t remember reading where if someone online or on the bottle that they said you can use it to also lube the lead balls and it’s not as messy
@@andrewfett142 Lube was not historically used: you shot your six shots, and then you switched to your other gun or, if cavalry, to the saber. If you managed to reload, you shot another cylinder probably, and that was that. After 2-3 cylinders, functioning will start to get compromised by caked residue and accuracy will suffer. After 4-5 cylinders, you will have to radically clean the gun. Today we shoot for fun, and having to stop your shooting session every 5 cylinders to clean the revolver is no fun at all :P Grease is used to keep fouling soft and help shoot longer. I use grease pills (50% beeswax 50% vegetable margarine, dont' ask me if volume or weight, it's approximative and doesn't matter anyway) BEHIND the bullet. Grease becomes dissolved by gases and deposited on barrel and about everywhere: last time I shot 96 shots (16 cylinders) and everything was still smooth as with the first shot, accuracy still as good as first cylinder. In hot weather add beeswax. in cold weather add margarine. Have a look here, I believe you'll find this page very interesting. www.geojohn.org/BlackPowder/bps3.html
@@JM-zz3vs just now seeing your comment. I’m pretty happy w/the way I’m making the cartridges now and using the hot dip lube from guns of the west. I put bore butter type of stuff on top of ball in first chamber that will be fired. I really only shoot a couple few cylinders worth at a time and that’s just once in awhile. Thanks for watch’n & comment’n:)
Interesting. Does the primer cap burn through the paper to ignite the powder, or does the paper come apart while loading sufficiently to expose the powder to the flash?
Howdy. I use cigarette papers. The only part of the paper that somewhat tears apart is right at where the paper and ball are touching. The rest is undamaged. So it ignites paper & powder. Sometimes there is a small bit of paper left in the cylinder. Can pick it out or if not much I have just loaded another cartridge. Have to be sure unburned paper is NOT smoldering! Safer to pick it out. :) Thanks for watching my video.
Nice technique - I haven't made these with round ball yet, will follow your example. Tell me, is there also a complete shortage of BP primers in the US like there is in Europe atm? Guys are selling them online here for 2 euros a piece.. all stores sold out. Luckily I had a small stock myself. Will soon need to start converting centerfire primers to cap & ball at this rate.
I haven’t had to buy any for quite awhile. But yes I think there is a shortage. I got lucky with ‘51 navy from a garage sale. It came with a box of stuff. Including caps. :) I do need to look into getting more soon tho.
Did you fine the occasional misfire from the bottoms made that way? I did, so went to separate bottoms, otherwise I found it wise to prick the cartridges with a pick before capping.... Cartridges sure are more convenient on the range....
I just recently started making paper cartridges. I like’um. Pretty convenient. Most of the time I do lube on top just for the first round that will be fired.
I used to use cig rolling papers. Worked fine. For my Remington cap n ball. And a CwA mountain rifle,In 50 round ball. And ,,44. For the cap n ball revolver. They are fun to shoot. And a Single shot cap n ball in 45.
@@andrewfett142 sewing pattern paper is treated with something I don't think nitrate but something; they flash VERY quickly and are a thousanth or two thicker then rolling papers. I used to smoke home rolls and know cigarette paper well; various kinds. ZigZag corn papers were the best imho (Quit smoking in 1999) but since I found these pattern papers I have used them
@@pilgrimm23 I home rolled for awhile too. :) I liked kinda thick paper for tobacco. Switched to vaping few years ago. Not sure if better but seems better. Cheaper. I’ll have to look into the sewing pattern paper for cartridges.
Howdy Patrick. I don’t think I showed that part in my vid. The chamber that you push the cartridge into has a small hole at the other end. There is a cone/nipple that threads into that hole. Then you put a small cap on/over the end of the cone/nipple. When the hammer strikes the cap it shoots a small but powerful spark through the cone hole and that ignites the paper and powder in that chamber. Small explosion forces the tight fitting lead ball out of chamber thru barrel and BANG!!! Hope that’s an understandable explanation. Thanks for watching. :)
@@andrewfett142 Ahhh... igniting caps. Now i "understand" the complete procedure ! Last question: Are these caps also DIY or are they bought ready ? Sry... but you sparked my curiosity with your vid. Have to binge some more ASAP.... Lack of time so far :/
@patrickmihajlovic4112 the caps were bought. Hard to find these days. Some people do make their own tho. I have never. “Guns of the West” and “the duelist” have very good black powder pistol videos. And “Blackie Thomas”. Much more knowledgeable than me and much more experience. It is a very fun hobby. I appreciate you watching & commenting. And I’ll try to answer any questions. 😃👍🏼
Andrew, do you know what the paper is made out of and does it leave any charred debris in the chambers after being fired ? I have only used cigarette papers intially which will fire, but leave too much charred paper in the chamber. Cigarette rolling papers are good for practice and learning how to make coned cartridges. Once I found flash paper and flash glue, I only used that since it burns 100% clean with zero residue. I have always made one piece cartidges; never 2 piece. Colt eventually patented one piece cartridges made from nitrated lambs' intestine appendix. I cannot imagine trying to replicate them now. You did a very good job with this video. Keep your powder dry and your pistol cleaned and ready to be loaded.
Howdy. Papers are just normal thin cigarette papers. Cut the pack in half. I watched couple vids that nitrated paper sometimes still left some pieces in chamber so I haven’t bothered to try them. Usually pick out the left over but I have loaded another round right in with it. Thanks for watching and commenting! :)
@@dudearlo Nitrating paper doesn’t seem worth the trouble to me. Kinda already hard to make time to slap the cartridges together the way I do. The duco stuff is pretty simple to try. And maybe help it to burn better. If I can put it on the top rim of paper w/o dripping down to the powder; I might use it for the ball too. No more glue stick. Thanks for commenting!:)
Well my cartridges sit for awhile and I think any lubed wadding might go into the paper. When I dip them into the hot melt lube I try not to get it on paper that much for same reason. I haven’t been making paper cartridges for very long tho. Thanks for watching & commenting!
Howdy Marco. Lube; I think is lambs tallow & bees wax. I bought it from RU-vidr-Guns of the west. Cartridge too short-I’m not sure what you mean. The cartridges are about 1 & 1/4 inch long. I’m using about 27ish grains of black powder and the ball is .454. I guess I don’t know that the ball is fully compressing the powder in the chamber with no empty air gap. I’ll have to do some measuring and figure it out. Hope that maybe answered your question.
From watching other videos - tea bag paper burns better than cigarette paper. And .448 balls are better for preventing chain-fires. Just curious - is the winding mandrel 3D printed, and if so, is it on Thingiverse? The cartridge box insert could also be 3D printed.
Howdy. I’ve never tried tea bag paper. There are a lot of different cigarette papers. They need to be the very thin ones and as little glue on paper as possible. Unless you actually measure your chambers to really know; I don’t recommend using a smaller ball. You need a decent ring of lead shaved off as you ram the ball. That’s the main thing for sealing the chamber to hopefully prevent chain fire. Every pistol can be a little different. I think it was .451 that I’ve used before but .454 is giving me a better seal. Mandrel is 3d printed but not by me. :) “Guns of the West” RU-vidr makes and sells the kits. Yes cartridge box insert is also 3d. You could also make from wood. Boxes I got from eBay. I put the sellers name in video. Thanks for watching & commenting! :)
@@andrewfett142 Sorry - I meant .458. I think he said he was getting them from Hornady. Can't remember the channel's name, it's the companion channel to Forgotten Weapons and the video was about chain fires and how to eliminate them. The tea bag paper recommendation came from a different channel.
@@andrewfett142 Ah... Just realized the source of my confusion. The revolver is called a ".44" but it's actually a .45 and uses nominally .45 caliber balls. The video I was referring to was on the InRange TV channel, and was titled "Chainfire! Is it dangerous?" (Every time I post a link RU-vid deletes my post, for some reason.) .454 balls should work fine (it's the size mentioned on the Wikipedia page for the 1861 Army Colt), I suppose .458 would be added insurance, and the person on the video was loading with discrete powder and ball rather than making cartridges. He was able to reliably cause chainfires by loading .452 balls.
@@iskandartaib you could measure your chambers with calipers. I think they can vary some. I actually need to measure the depth of my chamber so I can know that I’m compressing the powder with the ball. Not sure about that. One of the previous comments made me wonder.
😁no I don’t think that will work very good and it’s gotta be some kind of sin😁 I recommend very thin cigarette rolling papers. And use as little glue as possible. Glue doesn’t burn very well. I never have but some people nitrate their paper to burn better.
Residual unburned paper is a constant for me and I’ve tried many types of paper. I’ve tried nitrating with potassium nitrate only or a mixture of potassium nitrate and sulfuric acid neither worked like I’ve seen flash paper work. I’ve not tried nitric acid and potassium nitrate solution for nitrating paper. I guess that’s next.
I’m not getting notified for some of these comments for some reason. I really think the less glue used as possible makes a big difference. I don’t have much paper burning problems. Sometimes there’s a little paper left. I make sure it’s not smoldering and load another or pic it out real quick. But I’m only shooting a few cylinders at a time at most.
Lamb tallow & beeswax. I got it from Guns of the West. Heat melt it on the stove. I don’t like to pack messy lube over the chambers so I just dip the balls in lube. I do usually bore butter the first chamber that will be fired.
That was interesting. =) When i first heard: "paper cartridges"... i thought it was all paper... not that it included a steel ball !!!. so it must still have decent power. I think the last sealing on top of the steelball, The stuff you dip it in... that it can just be normal candle wax?... as its main purpose is to just hold it together a bit. And i guess you have been using this for some time with that gun, as i can see black marks behind the cylinder... Does it burn your hand with that backlash??. This whole thing reminds me of old school muskets, and those are cool.
Hey DSS. :) It’s an 1851 navy colt replica. Cowboy/Civil war pistol. Back then they were 36 cal. This one is 44 cal. Yes powerful enuff to kill stuff. I rub the ball on a glue stick. So that holds it together. The dip stuff; I think is lamb tallow & beeswax. It helps lube the barrel when fired. Blackpowder residue builds up kinda quickly. Supposed to help w/that. Your hand is pretty safe as long as it is not in front of the cylinder. I’m not an expert or anything. :) I had a 1851 along time ago. Sold it. This one my father in law found at a sale and gave to me for birthday. Had it for couple years now. I did all the filing that RU-vid tells you to do to all its parts. Works very well now. Very fun. Just recently started making the paper cartridges. Makes shooting alot more convenient. I guess the vid was kinda made more for people that already know blackpowder stuff. Just to show my twist the paper method instead of a separate piece of paper for the bottom. And to show the cartridge kit and the boxes that I keep them in. I’ll have to re read your comment to see if I answered everything. :)
Not a great way, to be fair. There is excess paper near the nipples, which will accumulate on consecutive reloads. They also look awful, and all that lube on top will leave a terrible mess when loading - a mix of paper, lead shavings and excess lube sticking to the top of the drum.
I almost don’t want to bother replying to your comment. To be fair I think you’re wrong. Seems like a pretty great, fast, easy and non messy way to load to me. You should always have a lead ring. Any tiny bit of paper ring doesn’t even matter. The couple flakes of almost solid lube also does nothing but melt to the metal or blow away. As far as I’ve seen the paper residue is no more than any other paper cartridge. If you don’t want any paper residue then don’t use paper.
@@andrewfett142 If you dont want to bother replying then simply dont. What kind of a defensive statement is that? Do you feel offended by constructive criticism?
Sounded more towards just being negative than constructive criticism to me. There is a difference. And your comment is pretty much incorrect. The “looks awful” is an opinion. The paper hasn’t caused any problems. And there really is no mess. I try to respond to everybody at least once.
@@andrewfett142 Oh, so I can't have an opinion now either? Good to know. Also, I can quite literally see the exact mess I described in the second half of the video.
I think I just responded to your comment with the same feeling I got from your comment. Text messages don’t show facial expressions so hard to know some times. 🤷♂️ It just sounded unnecessarily negative/rude to me. I’m really not wanting to argue with you. I’m a very friendly guy. Mostly. I think we can both be nicer and keep talking to each other if you want to. Howdy. I’m Andrew Fett(not real name) How ya doing? How’s the weather?🙂
