Planning madness in Smithfield 

52 flats rejected due to a beer garden... absolute madness

This happens all the time, all over the country. The Irish population don't want low rise cities, a small cohort of unelected people do, and they have an unreasonably high power to stop anything that could improve our cities.

Bonobo would have been the local easily walkable pub for everyone that lived in those apartments as well. They could have had 100-200 new regular customers living a few feet away providing business and they pushed it away

Even besides the issues of ABP having too much centralised power, the fact that they sided with the pub is wild to me. I can't understand how it can possibly happen that when the most urgent issue in the country is a housing shortage, there isn't a massive hurdle in place for siding with objections that prevent new, dense housing being built. If a body is supposed to try and weigh things for the greater good in society, it's just inconceivable that having some more light in a beer garden and respecting some tosser's opinion that Dublin should stay low-rise forever is considered to be of greater value than creating homes for 50-100 people in a perfect location.

Thanks for bringing a light to this case! Fantastic video. I frequent bonobo very often so i cant wait to bring this up at the bar. The site is north of the beer garden and would have 0 impact on the daylighting in the space. Plenty of lovely south light getting in. Pretty shameless of the owner to be objecting the development that would have 56 new customers delighted to be walking distance from the pub!

Very interesting video on the methods and effects of NIMBYism

As one of my teachers said, it costs nothing and only takes a weekend to start a war with your neighbors and severely delay or disrupt their construction plans. The system is stacked against those trying to make our cities better and in favor of grumpy assholes. Things really need to change!

Great video, would love to see more deep dives into planning cases like this 👌

Not in my back yard beer garden

It’s shocking how many people who live in the heart of cities think that they shouldn’t have to witness any other people living in the space around them.

Bonobo didn't buy the property to develop it themselves. Therefore they should have little say on what happens with it. These kinds of cases are ridiculous and their reason to appeal is even more so. Install some lights and plants in that beer garten, make it cozy! Otherwise, move your operations outside of the city to a place that is more appropriate for what you have got in mind. There are enough villages around the capital with wide open space and undisrupted shadows for a beer garten. The idea that Dublin "is a low-rise city, and should remain so, predominantly" is nothing more than a personal opinion and should carry absolutely no weight. Stuff like this truly makes my blood boil.

honestly, I couldn't give less of a fuck if bonobos beer garden doesn't get enough light. dublin needs more housing and trying to stop it from being built for such a small thing is a really shit thing to do.

I've worked on a lot of developments in Ireland where we literally added a floor knowing full well that our preferred building height would be the result after further information and objections. It's a stupid system, knowing that every time you work on a design, all of that work, investment and effort could be lost because councils refuse to set specific design standards for areas weather through lack of funding or sheer laziness.

The main argument for many people against new construction in Ireland seems to be the changing skyline due to high-rises. In my opinion homeless people dying on urine soaked streets is a much worse sight.

Shockingly even-handed and well thought out. Great job

The system is designed to limit new housing units coming on stream because it is so so so important to the government that house prices generally, do not begin to fall. If house prices begin to fall, some people would default on their mortgages, due to negative equity. This would put pressure on the banks which would be less likely to loan, leading to fewer people buying and further declines in house prices, leading to more defaults and so on. But limiting supply is just one of many tools the government is using to keep house prices on an upward tradjectory. A big problem, (from the government`s point of view) will inevitably arise, as mounting market forces will eventually overwhelm the government`s ability to rig house prices. Our national debt increased by nearly 200 billion since 2008, to close to a quarter of a trillion today. This was a six fold increase from where it was. Most of this was used directly or indirectly to re-inflate the house price bubble that the market was trying to correct. Should house prices fall, that inflation will come out of housing and go elsewhere, such as foreign assets, consumer prices, etc. We will still owe the 200 billion Enda Kenny borrowed, it`s just that we will have nothing to show for it. Not even high house prices. We could re-design our planning system in the regionalized way suggested in this video, but if that happened, the government would simply re-design it`s market rigging mechanisms to ensure it`s ultimate goal of ever increasing house prices continues. Reform will not happen by design. It will be done onto us by factors beyond our control and because the government is acting in it`s own interests and not ours, the sooner international market forces wash over and overwhelm our government`s ability to create inflation in the housing market, the better it will be for everyone.

Absolutely adore this channel, watched all your videos in one sitting. Would love to hear your take on the transmission system/electrity grid and challenges we have to meet our renewable energy targets. Obviously so many of the challenges we face are alligned with that of housing and the planning system being broken.

Great video & good forensic analysis of the problems we face to overcome our own housing crisis !!

Great video, we definitely need less restrictive planning laws,

Imagine if New York or Hong Kong were low rise. Would they be as inspirational and powerful? It takes guts to build big projects. Low rise is another way of saying’no balls’.

Thank you, just thank you so much for doing research and presenting this. You're an asset to ireland.

I live in New Jersey and we have a some of the restrictive housing laws. It is difficult for developers to create new houses, which lowers housing availability and pushes up rent. What I don't see is that if these governments know prices are an issue, why don't they decrease restrictive laws?? Both NJ and Ireland are highly sought after locations, so why don't they scrap these laws and make these areas even more attractive??? >:(

completely bonkers. That building was completely reasonable. If anything they should be building higher. "Dublin is a low rise city, and should remain so". We already have some of the worst public transport links of any major city in Europe. Following that thought process means continued outward sprawl, served by no public transport. It's so frustrating that these objectively soft complaints (in the context of a crisis) are allowed to continue. People talking about protecting the Dublin skyline as if its one of the 7 wonders of the world! It's two chimneys, the spire, liberty hall and a lot of cranes! Build up a and do something redevelop derelict plots.

That organisation is really doing a good job of protecting that heritage building... the absolute state of it

now we know not to go to Bonobo

Great video guys keep it up!

After coming across 30 floor residential buildings on Taiwan, the low rise nature of Dublin is so myopic and brain dead

A friend of mine just pointed out when I shared this video with him: the proposed development is north of the beer garden - there would not have been excess shadow. Amazing that ABP thinks the better option is continued dereliction of a prime city centre corner site.

That is a very insightful take on the reality of being a property developer (i.e."improver"). The potential occupiers (or owners) of these apartments have no voice or representation at decision time. Many LA Planners are venial and short sighted with very few who are pioneering. As so often is the case in Irish life, many of the key decisions will be made by one sole official or judge.

Why would the owner of a pub object to 52 apartments being built next door 😂

Very well said and put together information! Great video.

You get it. Great production and video, subscribed.

great video, it deserves to be shown during any discussion on the issue

Brilliant explanation, thank you.

The rights of the protected building don't go seem to go as far as stopping it remaining unused and derelict

Brilliantly produced video. Pity we can’t have an intelligent government allowing high-rise development and multiple occupancy living like they do in proper countries or alternative models such as cohousing like they do in Denmark etc. Greed has destroyed Ireland.

Why on Earth would the political establishment consistently take measures that ensure sky-high rents? It's almost as if most of our T.D's are landlords.

Great video! Well done again!

Fantastic video. I hope this gets more coverage. I sadly left Ireland for the last time because of the lack of housing and opportunities. Irish youth deserve a lot better than what they have been given since 2008.

Infuriating story.

ABP is obviously quasi-judicial, but is the council’s planning department not also acting in a quasi-judicial manner when dealing with planning? And ABP can put conditions on approvals granted as part of an appeal, can they not?

This is why new built homes are so much more expensive. Not just the suppressed supply but dealing with the bureaucracy and the risk of failure. It ineviteably means the margins of developers need to increase to fund it all. That also means only big firms with deep pockets have a fighting chance to get anything done. Imagine this was you, your personal bet on the future of Dublin and the potential of the piece of land you bought for a fair price after studying the development possibilities. Wtf would you do now? Probably declare bankrupcy, lol. 😂

No one really believes Smithfield is the second coolest neighbourhood in the world. Not even the second coolest in Dublin. And to have objections to housing based on a beer garden is laughable.

Thanks!

Fantastic videos! I would be glad if you could explore the "cost-rental" approach to development financing. The approach in Vienna seems particularly applicable to a mid-size European city like Dublin. There is a flagship scheme for the approach in Emmet Road, Inchicore.

Well done, I was a builder for 42 years and stopped in March 2023, the system is infuriating and against self employed and small developers.

Dublin could be an amazing, vibrant city, especially after Brexit. Instead the greedy of landlords is transforming it into an unlivable place.

Crazy. Ireland is just crazy. I live in Belgium, a country with quite the opposite reputation for its haphazard and sometimes less than stellar planning, but yet we have way way WAY more affordable housing in a much more densely populated place. I consider the occasional ugly high rise a blessing, and would take that over unaffordable housing any day. Seems like a bit of a ridiculous trade off

This is another great contributor to the state of our housing: NIMBYism.

All the design work is shifting to before planning application, which then has to be revised multiple times as it's rejected and revised. Dublin is slow but at least somewhat communicative. Limerick planning by contrast is absolutely impossible.

Hey your argument is super interesting. Please consider changing from presenting a comparison of many countries using a line chart instead of a bar graph (it's super confusing-it visually communicates a continuous line where instead it's discrete data points!)

Great podcast with a great in site into Ireland's planning laws ,a law rife with corruption money and back hand dealer ,with the now well known brown envelope brigades

Your channel is very good

The original plans looked so good, ngl.

i live in and one an apartment adjacent to where they would build. I had no problem with the plans. but upon hearing of the size of the complex I sonically laughed to my other half saying good luck dealing with the nimby's

Reminds me of "Listed buildings" in the UK, tons of proposals all turned down for bizarre or antiquated reasons and in the meantime, the building is empty, dangerous and collapsing.

You should look into Meeting House Square. We paid north of 100k for big fancy umbrellas that broke and now because nobody can agree who takes responsibility for the break we are letting a square that cost millions go to waste. Just something I found out recently. So stupid.

Dublin IS a low-rise city but cannot stay that way. It won't change without an elected board with long-term goals in mind, not corruption and profit. What individuals can do so that will be changed, is what myself (and many others) are unsure about.

Great video. New sub

There's also the rural problems with APB. It's not a bad idea to counter one off houses, where you're only able to get local planning permission in an area you're from - preventing people from buying and building status houses in the middle of nowhere. But in the case of Kian Egan, of westlife, bought a house that was a new build, demolished all but a few internal walls and doubled the footprint, bypassing planning restrictions on the right of natural views. That house was part of a chain, where one house was granted an extra sized footprint so his sick relative could live his last days where he grew up. It was for sale the year after completion. Same area where Marc McSharry managed to get approval for a house that was built on the footprint of an existing 19th century home with a drive exiting onto a double blind spot. Down where my brother lives, he knocked a bungalow that belonged to the late father in law but wasn't granted permission to build a house of the same footprint as it wasn't in keeping with the character of the existing 2.5 4 bedroom houses in the area. The problems described here are definitely one from the centralised and Dublin nature of the planning department (seems a little less flaky in cork and galway), but hopefully a regional department structure could help correct the rural and the urban wonkiness in the planning approval

Nice content 👌

Have you researched the government's new Planning and Development Bill? Will it improve things?

In Canada, things are super similar..

Excellent decisions who only inconvenience developers' profits.

Great channel! What are you thoughts on incentivising the refurbishment of existing but disrepaired urban properties? It breaks my heart to walk down any town or city in Ireland, and see window boarded up or dark and empty along main street, over shop fronts, etc. It's like out towns are spreading outwards but rotting from the core. I'm glad we're moved away from urban sprawl and green field development, but surely there's a case for using whats already there. If the exterior of an existing structure isn't changing, the scope of planning permission and potential for rejection greatly reduces. In addition, refurbishing empty buildings would provide more plentiful small accomodation for individuals and young people, increase competition between existing landlords which should drive up overall quality of accomodation, and also increase the footfall for local businesses. But for some reason, it doesn't happen. Is the cost still higher than new builds? What am I missing?

If the developers engaged with locals and kept within planning guidelines there would be less issues

I dont agree that we should have a split planning body , i do think their should be a local appeal , and an board plannala should be for proceedural appeals and national interest projects , The courts should be exclused from planning issues except in extreme cases , A regional planning board would likely be just another layer of bureaucracy, changing how the bord work may be a wise idea though,

All residentally building is supoosed to provide 10 percent social housing when they build apartments its a disgrace that they do not ansd instead pay a meager fine which would never cover the loss.

DCC hate the fact that people actually live in the city. They're so insufferably stubborn and regressive. Travelling abroad and seeing how other cities are governed is a real eye-opener when you compare them to Dublin.

Thay pub made a decision to object to 52 new customers aswell as all the customers that would have came if high rise presedence was set

I am confused as to the housing problems in Ireland, because I hear there are tons of empty houses, and houses half built and abandoned after the big crash, but now there is a devastating shortage of affordable houses to rent or buy. Partly is it people owning two homes that they are holding on to as investments, or holiday homes, or Airbnb rather than renting them out? Why doesn’t the government finish building those half built houses? How can the objection of a bar result in 52 apartments not being built? How can that be one person’s decision? Surely that is super open to bribery? Also, Why don’t they have the young men refugees finish building those unfinished houses, and then be allowed to live in them, instead of packing them into hotels in tiny towns where they are not welcomed and leaving them with nothing to do. I think most refugees would prefer to be working instead of idling for the years it can take to get their case heard.

I agree with all comments in this video

The real issue is investment funds buying up all properties and politicians all been landlords. The property shortages means higher rents and higher profits for them. Fact

8 stories is not high rise.the council should be building developments twice that size

Down my way with is in Dublin 2 there going up to 18 floors right up to the port wall 14 floor buildings 10 floors and everything in between so what is it are we a low rise city or high rise there is not a lot of difference between Pearce Street/ Ringsend and Smithfield same apartment blocks but down here we have had 15 stories apartments since 2000 with Charlotte key dock I don’t think on bhord planola knows it head from it’s back side

Can't find his source/figures, but David McWilliams on a Blindboy podcast episode pointed out that "Copenhagen has footprint of Dublin between the canals, Copenhagen has population of 600,000 in that footprint, Dublin 100,000. Not a high-rise dystopia, intensively used city of six story buildings." Six stories is mid rise at best.

There us an awful lot more of vacant properties left to rot and the majority paying zero vacancy tax/fines

Not a word about Ireland's shadow government

Great video but to somewhat play devils advocate here, take keavens port on camden st, the pub had planning approved and the beer garden approved before apartments were finished (similar to here) , but now the pub can’t open its beer garden because of complaints from the apartments and their attempts to remediate the situation with a noise barrier wall have also been objected to, severely reducing the pubs operating capacity, appeal and most likely property value. Unless bonobo were given some sort of iron clad guarantee that the residents of the new block could not object to the beer garden being full of loud drunk people till 1am , then I can see how any residential development would be in their interest to object to.

Who decides Dublin is to be a low-rise city?

outrageous

Suimiúil! 👍

They probably weren't intended for the local populace anyway.

Hi Folks, I love the content! How would i get in contact to discuss the video editor role I have seen advertised?

But... like... the apartments wouldn't have been blocking out sunlight and loads of the people living there would've been in Bonobo very regularly????

Great example of the absurdity of the Irish planning process. Every action has a consequence, and while the right of the individual stakeholder should be heard, it should not be permitted to trump the common good. This is only one decision by the planning authority(ABP), but it illustrates how the building planning system actually works, and every development for new high density buildings must run through this gauntlet. Result, Bonobo, the lone onjector, had their say, but society has to pay. How is this absurdity not a national emergency? Ppl are out blaming landlords, immigrants and developers etc., but their justified anger is directed at the wrong parties. The real culprit is the government who set up this subjective, opaque, time consuming obstacle course that is ABP. Look at peer countries and compare. Holland has a population density of 521 ppl km2. Ireland is a mere 73 ppl km2. Similar level of wealth and income. The Netherlands is 7x more densely populsted. Are homes there more expensive? Yes. But only 30% more (average price for a used 3 bed home on a national basis, both countries). Solution: Create designated zones, in DUB and other cities where high rise developments can be built. Also, create new towns, with high density residential structures, with parks, walking to shops etc. Tax derelict building owners, forcing them to build productive structures. There's tons of land, use it. Stop blaming excess demand, which is simply evidence of the country's economic success. Instead, boost supply.

The pub feared their beer garden being closed and possibly their whole business once the apartments were built from objections, noise etc.,from the new residents. ABP does not have a great recent history. A leopard doesn’t change its spots.

Crazy.

Look at the council flats across the road simpler times😢

the current goverment is going to find out the hard way in there old age the consequences of whats happening now as many young people are just giving up or leaving

I dont agree that one person shouldn't make a decision. Then, that one person is responsible. If its a lot of different people then its very hard to find who's responsible. One person sounds far better than an anonomous department of many.

Benobe owners want to purchase the land themselves and then they will increase the amount of apartments and include licenced premises at street lever.

Bonobo prefer less business when pubs are under pressure so it makes sense they dont want too many people in walking distance

People who own houses vote to keep supply of houses low

Smithfield? Cool? 😂😂 Yes, very cool to have people live in moldy brick flats

So a race to the bottom of grey tower blocks made of pyrite, where are the green spaces for the people who will live in these shoeboxes. Is every new build to be this ?

I once again remind you all that there are 180,000 vacant dwellings in Ireland - this problem of objections to new buildings is totally blown out of proportion and building new buildings to house people is wasteful both in terms of money and damage done to the environment. And as we've seen TIME AND TIME AGAIN new buildings = new properties for vulture funds or foreign banks eg. 232 new apartments built by the government on the old Stillorgan Leisureplex site immediately bought up by AXA-Kennedy Wilson and ABP mandated that they be rented out for 15 years to "solve" the housing crisis. AXA charge 3000 euro for some two beds and 1750 is their average rent in contested RTB cases. Do you think the best option is to let the "future owners" decide then? The future owners are going to be big foreign banks who couldn't care less how our cities look, and once again, objections to city councils are not the issue. It's hoarding of housing that's the issue.

The pub owner paid off the inspector, and since then purchased the vacant land and is developing it with a different developer.

That bar-owner must have beeen down in his cellar all night stocktaking when he refuses what would probably be an increase in affluent locally based footfall likely to refresh the community over time in multiple ways. Knee-jerk nimbyism hits the top shelf.

Build more buildings as high as siptu building and corks tax office so that we can house more people