Heeeey... Marshall here... It is important to note here... Regardless of how I voted on that final day... I couldn't win the game. I didn't realize it at the time but if I voted to save Reznora then the Innkeeper would turn me good the next night before being killed. I Goon'd around and found out. Town was rightfully invested in the outcome, which is a credit to Kat and the players themselves, so I don't fault anyone for being loud or having that gut reaction of disappointment when it doesn't go their way. Shit happens and I dropped my hand... I think that's better than a bad game with players that aren't invested in the outcome. I appreciated Ben's apology so much though and I hope everyone remembers it in their moments of frustration as a good example of how to behave.
This is 100% correct. You were a kingmaker without a kingdom. An unenviable position, but one that I think really shows off how ridiculously deep this game's mechanics can be. - Ben
That apology at the end was so thoughtful and such a good thing to do. I didn't even realise he called out on Marshal throwing the game until he was apologising for it.
Yeah I think Evil forgot that Marshall probably didn't have a clear picture of what was happening and so had didn't know which was the right way to vote. You have to help your goon out a bit more
Agreed. I was in a really similar situation once. I outed some information that screwed my team, and a little while later a player publicly in town square said "for those that don't know what's going on, ialsoagree outed xyz." The real bummer is, it didn't really matter what I said because they already had the information without me, so I really didn't reveal anything they didn't already know. But no apology later so feels bad man.
I feel bad for Marshall, I've done similar things a couple of times -- put down my hand and accidentally swung an "easy" but important vote. The final day is stressful and everyone talks at once, and it's easy to get mixed up, which is sometimes all it takes to swing a tight game. Everyone in this video played quite well.
"you're executed with patters's scissoring, it was a little death and you didn't die" in french an orgasm is a "little death" so all it wasn' an execution it was just a happy ending
Marshall and Ben there in the end had a communication problem It's not throwing the game, that needs purpose Marshall couldn't know I personally think that Evil can Tie is clear, but online everything is on the same volume and stuff can easily drown out
Marshall was very much in the unenviable position that no matter what happened that last day he could not win. He either loses as an Evil Goon like happened here or he gets innkept, flips Good and then dies to the demon kill.
Very interesting ending here. From our perspective, Marshall looked very stupid at first, but in hindsight, Ben only said that four votes will tie it. This could be interpreted from Marshall's point of view as both "please tie this", or "make sure it doesn't tie" (and even though it was obvious for us what Ben meant, it's understandable that in the heat of the moment this is difficult to parse). Ben should have quite simply said "Marshall, if you're evil you have to vote for this".
In hindsight, Aggie maybe could have guessed that town would double-tap Ben and saved her protection for the last day, but given the information available at the time, protecting Reznora that day was a reasonable choice too.
In the situation that Ben was the professor in a minstrel night, why would the professor be used up, if the professor is drunk and therefore has no ability?
Really i dont think there was an optimal strategy by Marshall at the end, nor by Ben. Just tough decisions, and ultimately a loss that cant be laid at anyone's feet. A great game any way you cut it, and good on Ben for the apology
We already have Katwoman (townsfolk): You solve the game, but most players distrust your alignment [you may randomly be the story teller for some games].
I mean, Ben literally said to Marshall to vote for Reznora. Ben was so sure Reznora was DA'd, so I'd have been apologizing to Marshall for that. Aggie was very clear she had DA'd Marshall when she kept saying she sailor picked him last night. There is no world where Marshall did anything wrong here, so it's sad that he felt guilty about it enough to take the blame for the loss when it wasn't his fault at all. Everyone is gaslighting Marshall into the whole "hey, don't feel bad for costing us the game, it wasn't your fault that you lost us the game" which is worse in my opinion that accusing someone of throwing in what was clearly Ben making a joke. I don't think anyone is consciously trying to gaslight Marshall, but it is what happened, and Marshall should have been the one to make that joke to Ben and then have to apologize for it. I'm not saying Ben threw the game; I'm just saying Marshall should have been the one to make the joke to Ben (that Ben threw) and then feel the need to apologize and comfort Ben for having lost evil the game (the way Ben and everyone in comments did to Marshall). And for people who think Aggie DA'ing Marshall was a bad call, she very expertly was signalling to her team that she had done so, but they weren't paying attention. Locking the Goon in could have meant they won that round, because it did give them the votes to push at least a tie through, and meant more people got to win as evil. It was certainly the more fun play. I don't think anyone should have been upset over the loss. It was a fun game, so everyone won. I just hate that Marshall walked away feeling like it was all on him, "but we forgive you" sentiments spearheaded by Ben who literally told Marshall to vote for Rez.
Really good game here, just a bit of a shame the end happened how it did! I've played a couple of online games and can totally understand the panic. It's a tough one, especially where you aren't 100% sure and then you have half the game shouting at you. I'm sure it wasn't deliberate, but essentially lying about game mechanics in order to sway a vote just doesn't sit right with me.
I'm not sure anyone lied about mechanics in this game, but too many people were trying to speak at once. Technically if the vote had been tied, Marshall could have been turned Good before the demon killed, meaning he would have lost when evil won. But if he dropped the vote as he did, he lost with evil. He essentially had the option to decide which team won, but he lost either way. However all of that was being said in the few seconds of the final vote with no time to comprehend who was saying what.
I think I'd go insane in one of these games because even when everyone is trying to be good about, over-talking and cross chatter still happen. Gives me stress to listen to it, I can't imagine trying to play.
Hi! Ben asked me a few videos ago where I lived to help me find a BotC group, but I'm not sure he got the reply because I haven't heard anything since so I'm going to repost it here. To avoid precise revelations (because internet), I live in North Lincs and my closest city is Scunthorpe.
If good can't win then the Storyteller can (and usually should) end the game early. However, never underestimate an evil team's ability to do something weird and unpredictable like attacking a dead player or something. - Ben
Omg, that slightly-uncentered background is unbelievably distracting! I'm 3 minutes in though, maybe I'll get used to it. . . come on me, breathe. . . yes . . . I can do this.
Well played, everyone! I've never been Goon but can imagine each day is just trust-fall after trust-fall unless you have a reasonable suspicion you will never be turned. This was so fun to watch and I hope Marshall had fun too
