Playing the game of broken hearts 💔 

Listen guys! You're never going to know if somebody is love bombing you or if they are really into you by their actions. The only thing that reveals itself when you meet someone new is time and consistency. Only time with a person will reveal one's true self to you. If you spend enough time with someone, they will eventually reveal their true character whether good or bad. That's why you take things slow. You don't move in together. And as a general rule you need two years with someone before you think of marriage. I realize there are exceptions to that but you have to protect your heart I do not yolk your life with someone else too quickly. Remember it's only time that reveals one's true self. Don't fall in love with someone based on their words. Fall in love with someone based on their time and consistency. That's the difference between meeting someone's representative and someone's true self. I hope I explained this well.

A real apology goes like this: "I am sorry for (reason to be sorry) because it made you feel (sad, betrayed, etc, ) and for that reason because I care about you I promise not to do it again."

i can't remember where i heard this but apparently one big aspect of love bombing is to show you the potential for the relationship early on, so if things turn to shit, you make excuses for them because you know how good they can make you feel, or you have such good memories from that love bombing phase that it makes you want to stay with them despite the fact that they have become toxic. also, we want to hear all of your opinions about avatar! are you guys watching the cartoon or new live action adaptation? i used to watch the cartoon growing up :)

It's not about men being dumb it's self-awareness and society that's the issue

Love bombing is often too soon in the relationship for the heightened level of intimacy being offered. It’s a sign of presenting a very low boundary so that you will reply with a similarly low boundary and allow the intensity of the relationship to go at that partners pace.

Love all Val's book recommendations! Always enjoy listening to your conversations together ❤️

28:45 ~ the thing is, if we were in their shoes, we would do exactly as they do because it’s not natural loving kind behaviour, therefore it has to be learned behaviour and of course they learned it from their care givers etc. That’s not to excuse their behaviour per se, and forgiveness is more about us than them but their behaviour is on them. So if it’s bothering us then it’s because their behaviour or existence is triggering something inside of us that is already there. So we can use how we feel about them to get a better understanding of ourselves and weed all those false beliefs etc out of our consciousness. I like to remember the saying that if you spot it, you’ve got it. Which is correct, but only 100% of the time, which is something Byron Katie says :) ~ if we are bothered in any way by what somebody else says or does, then it’s because they’re triggering something within us, which is why narcissists are such a gift 🎁 ~ they help us to unearth our own false beliefs etc. p.s. I left a narcissistic relationship after 7 years, 12 years ago and I am only just starting to feel healed and I’ve spent the last 12 years healing - it’s not an easy or short journey.

I didn't grow up with it but I'm a huge fan of the original ATLA. I've also watched the Netflix adaptation and know exactly what you're talking about xD ETA: It's also important to consider how the person you're seeing treats other people. If they're only nice to you, you're not "seeing their real self", you're being led into a trap!!!

Something that really resonates with me in what you're talking about is going back to attachment styles we learn in childhood. I'm an avoidant attachment personality (afraid to be vulnerable, detached) where my relationships are often with anxious attachment types (insecure, clingy). I think there is something very attractive in the way people get together and often it goes way back and is deeper than we realize. I think there are definitely bad actors in all types, not that one is all bad, but the signs sound so similar to what y'all were talking about. Anyway, I'm trying to move more towards a secure attachment style, but it's hard.

Gorgeous seeing you two 💕 A lot of what you have talked relates so much to me (never left a cult, but survived family sitch). Be so proud and happy with all the re-processing you doing. Shall try the rock candy in tea 🫖

Love bombing usual tends to start very early on in the relationship, making you feel like the most special person to them ever. It almost always starts right away. Sending love ❤

Avatar is the best! It's my favorite show to introduce to, and watch with, young children. What great lessons for everyone! It touches on all kinds of heavy heavy world subjects in a way that kids can learn- even issues of genocide... not an easy concept to make kid friendly - kids hear from other kids, the internet, the news - you can't completely shelter them, and avatar has such a beautiful way of setting good values without traumatizing a kid. It covers disabilities, mental health, loss and grief, different cultures, environmentalism, respect for animals, totalitarianism and democracy, family fends, abusive parents - just everything.

Love love love that comment at 36.00 about adding a person to the exisiting relationship with yourself. Do they compliment who you are enough to join your bubble. I’m totally going to use this in the future. I change too much for people and then when I’m single I have to rediscover who I really am. Yay Amanda for living it single for a while! It’s the BEST!

Such a smart AND importen discussen. I’m impressed of your conclusions. You both have insights that for many people takes a lifetime to reach.

When you are watching Amanda Rae and realize you are both drinking from the same cup! 🎉

Thanks!

I did not grow up with air bender but LOVED the series when i watched it in my 30s. Don’t have Netflix so haven’t seen the current version

This is such a good topic! I can't date right now either. Nor do I trust myself to date. The only person I'm looking for is myself 😄😊

2:01 my kids grew up on The Avatar, I watched with them. We are watching the live action together.

I husband and I kept saying how they messed up the time line. Things in the new one feels rushed. Watching the OG again after that mess lol.

I binge watched all the Avatar season 1 episodes. I know what "the green episode" is about. Heartbreak sucks, but is necessary for help in finding what our real needs of our own and from others is. It isn't just in a love interest, it's also with others in your life. If those around you aren't in a good place emotionally, then it can effect how you're treated & be damage for you as well.

I think the answer to the questions you have about certain wisdoms or truisms is “it depends”. I don’t think there are a lot of absolutes. We all need validation, it’s a basic human need, not an insecurity, but if a person is putting all of their needs for validation on one relationship instead of having other good relationships and a good relationship with themselves, that could make them clingy, that’s not healthy. So it’s a matter of degree. It depends. Is it good to get out of our comfort zones? Sometimes. Does that mean we should do it all the time? No not really. That’s not healthy for our nervous systems. More uncomfortable-ness isn’t always better. And abusers can use that to manipulate you into accepting abuse “for your own good” because “it’s good for your growth to be uncomfortable.” Being uncomfortable is only healthy when it’s necessary and beneficial. It depends on the situation. “Grow where you’re planted” aka “learn to like to do the things you ought to do.” That might be beneficial sometimes, but it can also be used to get people to shut up and not complain. Sometimes it’s better for people to stand up and demand change. So. It depends. Can heartbreak be beneficial? Well, it’s healthy to get as much good as possible from difficult situations, but doesn’t that mean we should seek it out? Not really. But it’s also not healthy to avoid all human connection because you don’t want to get hurt. It’s moderation, context, and wisdom. Not black or white truisms that can fit into a soundbite.

I really liked listening to this. I’ve been out of a 25 year marriage with a guy who is a narcissist and I constantly felt like I was crazy. He would lie pretty much every time he opened his mouth, he would steal from me and the kids, ugh just a bunch of stuff. When I would confront him he made me feel like I was crazy and wrong even though I knew the truth. I don’t think I’ll ever trust myself to be in a relationship ever again. I don’t know if I’ll ever be able to heal from everything he has put me through. It’s sad there’s people that are completely okay with destroying others.

Sorry is like a broken plate. If you drop a plate and say sorry what does that change? Nothing the plate is still broken. Your actions and what you choose to do to do afterwards like picking up the pieces and glueing them back together. But the plate will always have those cracks that you can see. It will never truly be the same as before but it can also become something even more beautiful from the pieces like the art of using gold to glue it back together ^_^

Trauma! We reenact the same systems we grew up with, as Dr Ramani has explained. Recycle Repeat. Omg yes, atlas of the heart!

The thing abiut Narcissists is, everything is a transaction. Any kind of attention at all comes with strings, so when they go out of the way for you, you RUN.

I just finished watching air bender! Can’t wait to hear your thoughts 😊

I just finished Avatar the last airbender live action and then the cartoon series. I LOVED BOTH!!! My kids told me I had to watch it so we watched it together ( my kids are 34 and 30)

Best books I've found to listen to in order to avoid these types of people again: Boundaries After a Pathological Relationship by Adelyn Birch & The Covert Passive-Aggressive Narcissist by Debbie Mirza

I’ve NEVER been loved bombed. Feeling low key jelly

I wish every woman would say "I am not your mother!" and leave those guys. That's the only way they'll *possibly* take responsibility for themselves one day

I loved Avatar so much we rewatched all of them with my kids last year. I haven't had a chance to watch the new one though so I appreciate you not spoiling it. I can't decide if I want to watch it though as so many old things are being ruined with "updates". I don't mind minor changes but if something is vastly different it should be marketed as a different story.

Clingyness can also be from deep childhood truama where abandonment was a big issue

The Avatar talk is needed I would love to hear your guises opinions on it. It really is the best show and I think it’s interesting that you both relate to it with your experiences in the order.

You two are truly wise

I love avatar the last, Airbender, if you did a series on avatar, the last Airbender and I would be so happy

I agree, saying sorry without any change or attempt at is is manipulation. I didn't grow up in a high control group and I was always taught if you do something wrong and apologize that means you are going to try your best to improve and not do it again. Men who try and twist what an apology should be are doing it because they are manipulative and don't care enough to improve for someone they allegedly love.

Brené Brown says: The broken-hearted are the bravest among us, they dare to love. ❤

This is a really good episode. Great job!

I love the connection with the cult father and love bombing. Your vulnerability is so inspiring to me. Thank you ❤

Yo. Avatar is one of my favorites!!! I used to even cosplay Appa lol

What you said about narcissists targeting people who have traits that they want, it reminded me so much of Sister Wives with how Kody has repeatedly said that he and Janelle are alike. They have literally nothing in common. He wishes he was like her and pursued her to claim that he somehow had those traits.

Yay the intro is back!! 💜💜

I think love bombing can also come in cycles. All of these that narcissists due come in cycles to keep you coming back to stay in the relationship. These repeating cycles can also be from families too.

No shock here because we always have so much in common but I grew up on and LOVE Avatar the Last Airbender! ⬇️

Amanda!!! I love your theme song 😍

It's so true! There are so many systems and structures that in the surface could be amazing, but then humans be humaning😂😂😂

You cared about others more than you cared about your self

It would be interesting to know how much to disclose & when. I have a hard time showing if my feelings are really hurt with someone in the first year or so, for example. I also do that thing where I try so hard to make sure the guy is happy, and they only act like more of a spoiled child as a result. Honestly they seem happier when I’m more natural about my reactions, but that is hard to do when my trust has been broken before.

Same the second guy was way worse but as friends they might have been ok maybe. But I’m glad I did get married and we had a daughter and two dogs. It feels really dark now coparenting and figuring it out

Amanda- Didn't you say that Paul was going to leave, but his parents offered him the keys to the cult so he'd stay? That indicates to me that he doesn't believe, but when over $ 1 billion is presented to you 🤷‍♀️

love you both youre so strong! but honestly i disagree that everyone is a lil insecure & that’s where the want for relationships manifest. def true for LOTS of ppl but not everyone! i haven’t seriously dated anyone in 3 yrs bc i’m not actively seeking out a partner, i don’t rlly crave just being in a relationship per se. the only thing i yearn for is love, i just want to meet someone we can be in love together. i want to have a family in the future, so ofc a life partner would be ideal, but i rarely have crushes. so yea that’s how my weirdo romantic attraction works lol

This might be only in my case but I realised I was attracted to the wrong people when I was insecure because they gave the illusion of "having it all together". They knew what they wanted, they had answers, they were charming and innovative. When I truly noticed this about myself my type changed. I was then attracted to kind determined people who didn't have all the answers but they were actively working to grow. My husband didn't love-bomb me when we first met. We dated and got to know each other. I had money and he didn't but he never ever let me buy him stuff unless he had enough to reciprocate. He was always kind and had excellent listening skills. We would walk for hours and just talk about anything. We would laugh and have funny inside jokes. 11 years later he's not the same person. He's better and I'm better. I didn't feel fireworks at the start. I feel it every day now. I swoon and get to experience over-the-top love-dovey cheesy moments. Yes there needs to be chemistry at the start but love-bombing too early feels fake to me now. It was so hard for me to break the mold of what I thought romance should be at the start. I wanted whirlwind swept off my feet and I would get manipulation and control. I now get constant support, comfort, safety, passion and love.

happy spring, blessed ostara and happy easter🐣

I need to watch the live action show... im worried cause i love the animated so much. I noticed when I got love bombed and really feel it and not just really nice and I never had those good love. That was after a week I was told I LOVE you and we had mostly texted and had only hung out once at work. It was crazy.

Children of narcissistic parents usually repeat dating narcissistic people and having narcissistic friends bosses relationships cycle over and over.

Y'all know we grew up on Avatar :D

Clingy is unhealthy, we all should continue our hobbies, outings with friends, not call or text all the time. A healthy relationship doesnt need constant reassurance. Regarding LOVE BOMBING___usually love bombers turn out to be bat sh#t crazy 30% of the time.

Did either of you have any kind of relationship or interaction with your grandpa, Ortel? If so, what was that like?

YAS i grew up on that show!!!!!

Last Airbender is one of the best shows ever! Stil haven't brought myself to watch any of the live action stuff even tho I've heard good stuff about the new one. Did you watch it right after you got out? Or were you allowed to watch that while in the order?

YES. Saying sorry without changing is 1000000% manipulation! I think for relationships it’s the same rule you have for religious groups, Amanda-trust your gut and if you’re having to do mental gymnastics to figure out what’s going on/invent explanations to make things seem ok even though something feels “off”, get out of there. “Sorry doesn’t mean I won’t do it again” omggg i wish you'd puked on him immediately.

5 year olds are definitely absorbing a lot of messages about gender roles. Even just watching Disney movies, or when they're taken to the mall, etc., they're constantly observing and absorbing.

I think everybody kann resonate with what you are talking, who had a unhealthy childhood. You automatically seach for patterns that you are used to, which are unhealthy. You both see things are so clear now, you did a lot of work already. And you match so well as talking partners.

On future faking, my follow up is do you see that with me or is this your general plan?

I love you guys' conversations!! Just a quick thing because you probably aren't aware yet: the word Val used that starts with a "g" and means "ripped off" started out as an insult against Romani folks, so I try not to use it. I totally wasn't aware for a long time, and I think we all know you meant no harm!! But it's a hurtful word for some.

Chemistry is such a liar!! Whether it's physical attraction or intellectual or some chemistry felt for whatever reason, it's like a lure. I bite and wiggle and so difficult to get loose from when I discover I'm about to be the catch of the day, nothing more.

❤❤❤❤

Clingy = Jealousy 😢

That is true I don’t think they know what gaslighting is etc but then again I think sometimes they do know. Liabilities lol it’s creepy when the women are the same but I don’t know how it happens I’m still traumatized I don’t talk to my sisters or mom like I used to before my ex came around. Some stuff is so weird

Hell be safe But have fun 😏

Love Avatar!

My goodness Val looks like Koleen (did I spell her name right?)

AVATAR !!!!!

I Love Avatar!

Have you ever been told you look like the movie star Lana Turner? I think there is a resemblance :)

Is Val still married?

Hi what's up Amanda 😘

In my opinion avatar the original animated is better the the live action movie