The presiding bishop of the Episcopal Church, the Most Rev. Katharine Jefferts Schori, speaks on how the church will deal with the question of same-sex marriages. This was recorded Nov. 7 at St. Mark's Episcopal Church in Venice, Fla.
Thankfully the Episcopal Church has always had the courage to take on the most difficult social problems. Why is it that so many “Christians” obsess about the sexual preferences of others but express no outrage about children in cages at the border?
Because of the separation between church and state. Marriage affects Churches because people will come to churches to request a priest to perform the ceremony. Children in cages are an issue of state policy and we Christians can't interfere with state policy out of respect of secular ideals.
@@MarcusCato275 Read the Prophets: Amos, Micah, Isaiah. ... these spokespeople for God called tbe state to account when everyday people were being abused, neglected and exploited. So do the best of today's Christian, Jewish and Islamic congregations.
I love how she answered this...honestly, this has to be the most positive honest and 'biblefactual' answer I have seen someone give on this subject. She did not close the door on this issue, instead she left it open. She did not say one way or another how marriage 'should' be seen, instead she gave lots of different examples of what the bible has said about marriage. She did not answer in a hateful manner and I LOVED that! :-)
The bishop skirts the question here. First, as Christians we follow Christ - who clarified marriage as between a man and a woman (Mark 10.6-9), even overriding Moses on the permissibility of divorce (Mat 19.8). Feel sorry for the questioner, as the question was a good and sincere one, but the answer was sarcastic and down-putting.
So happy Episcopalians have compassion for same-gender-loving people, me who has same-gender attraction feels accepted by the Episcopalian church, and so I have started to attend one because of their compassion. ♥️
It is not about compassion. It is about law and what the scripture says. Churches that do not recognize homosexual marriage will still not reject that person for being homosexual.
Thank you so much for sharing this video. The amount of negative comments Katharine receives on RU-vid scares me. It's so important for young women to have her as an example. Thank you.
I thought her answer was very well reasoned, and that she gave an accurate, yet succinct, summary of how the understanding of marriage has evolved within the Jewish and Christian traditions.
She kinda reminds me of Elizabeth Holmes, not just because of the voice manipulation, but also the “general facts” and speaking about how “she doesn’t exactly know what the future will look like but we need to keep having conversations about it. Wouldn’t this have been the perfect time for that conversation? She really didn’t say much if you actually listen, the most valuable information Here was historical facts, how is that helping people to become saints man
She fails to point out words of Jesus Christ: "4 “Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator ‘made them male and female,’ 5 and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? 6 So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate.”" And of St. Paul "10 To the married I give this command (not I, but the Lord): A wife must not separate from her husband. " And one doesn't need scripture to understand Natural Law. One can look at the male and female anatormy and understand that they were design by the creator for each other. Carried to the extreme, if all relationships were same sex relationships, the Human Race would not reproduce and would die off. Please cite where in scripture, scripture states that it is the will of God that Steve marry John. or Susan marry Betty. The fruit of the 16th century reformation brought division. Divsion brought more division, and more division brough even more. And this is the result. Since Katherine Schori must admit she is fallible, her interpretation of scripture could very well be in error.
"Theologizing" is what the process is called when those who are experts in the Bible (ministers/professors) interpret what the Bible says to modern day Christians. We do it all the time and have done so ever since the Bible was written. If we didn't, we'd still be plucking our eyes out, holding slaves and never cutting our hair - all commands which the Bible clearly dictates without exception. Theologizing effectively requires an excellent knowledge of history, findings in anthropology and how religion existed thousands of years ago. It's a complicated process that still does not always give all the answers or the answers we want to hear. Therefore, it is understood that the Bible is an interpretive document and says different things to different people according to ones own background, world view, education and geographic location. Some even claim to take the Bible's every word literally - an impossible task in this modern day. There are also some groups who attempt to force their own interpretation of the Bible onto others suggesting that to do otherwise is act of disobedience and they use the Bible almost as a weapon in a desire to control and manipulate others.
The "Bible", fortunately, does not speak with a single voice. Re-read the book of Ruth through the lens of what Leviticus says and you'll see that you are following the same path that those who condemned her traveled. And guess what, they were ultimately condemned by God while she was exalted. If you take your Bible so literally, take the WHOLE thing literally, not just the parts that support your narrow-minded prejudices.
God may have planned it, but perhaps his followers misinterpreted it. Remember: the Bible is NOT the direct word of God; it's the way his followers heard it. This is evident in several contradictions between books.
She was probably happy to see that same sex marriage was made legal in every US state, and so am I. It's high time, and then some, that we witness some challenges to the conservative fundamentalist understanding of what marriage should look like. Not to mention that the state should have NO power to regulate the sex lives of their citizens.
It doesn’t matter if it’s “conservative” or “fundamentalist”. It’s what does the Bible say and we must honor that regardless of what government does. The Bible in the NT clearly teaches what marriage is supposed to be: one man and one woman in covenant commitment for a lifetime.
The PB clearly described the different forms that marriage took in the Bible and the evolving understanding of what marriage means to both those marrying and the culture within which it occurs. She ignores the obvious though in that in all these culturally appropriate forms that marriage has manifested itself, the party or parties involved were always of the opposite gender.
Thoughtful and articulate response. It's interesting to contrast her views with those of Catholic Bishop Robert Barron on the definition, meaning, and purpose of marriage.
"Different understands about what Scripture says about marriage", Genesis 2:19-24, Matthew 19:5-7 are retry clear to me. Women you've no business calling yourself bishop when you distort Scripture.
rowan orre no it doesn’t, that is very clearly in the Ceremonial law of the Old Testament, which was fulfilled by Jesus, as is written in Galations 5:18.
it's obvious you have no idea what the Bible says rather you've picked certain scriptures to look down your long religious nose in judgement of others - an act with the Bible says is also forbidden. Jesus actually called such people "hypocrites."
Who is ignorant? Ginny did not say anything about "choice". In fact, the bible says that God "hands people over" to sin - because they suppress the truth in unrighteousness (Rom 1). There is a cure for this condition (which affects us all), but you first have to acknowledge you have a condition that needs healing. Thus, it is a grave mistake to say that homosexuality is not a sin.
I guess we disagree. I believe the Bible IS the direct & unerrant word of God. I believe what you call a contradiction is where we are interpreting it incorrectly. God doesn't get things wrong-we do.
my problem with the debate is that the church acts like they invented marriage and that it determines the definition of marriage. there have been many religions long before christianity with different forms of companionship than one man/one woman.
If we view marriage on the basis of making babies, what about my wife and I? When we met, she was already past menopause, so by that thinking, there is no reason for us to marry unless, as the bishop relates from the BCP marriage is for the relationship just like when my daughter eventually marries another woman
Jesus said "In the beginning it was not so ... for he made them male and female ... therefore what GOD HAS JOINED LET NO MAN PUT ASUNDER." Two men cannot be joined together and two women cannot be joined together. Those who try are striving at an impossibility. Two men together is idolatry since man was made for the glory of God. The woman was made for the man. Therefore, two women together defraud each other, man, and God. The most important thing in life is to honor the Lord, fear God, obey his commands, and thank him for what he has given us.
Schori's treatment of marriage in that historical perspective is totally misleading and reductive, and as usual devoid of theology. Orthodox Christianity has only ever concieved of marriage as between one man and one woman. Shcori seems to be saying the church should take it's lead from whatever is the current trend or civil arragement; this is of course the antithesis of the mission of the church, a real church is supposed to lead people, not follow what is popular.
The Episcopal Church now has same-sex marriage. And thank God for this! The presiding bishop answered the question very well here. You have to think that this video was made back in 2008. We have thankfully come a long way since then.
You make a good point. Not only could different writers get something wrong, but also people could interpret it wrong (just look at David Koresh...) I guess, in the end, we won't really know this stuff in our world. Of course, even that could be open to debate for many. In the end though, Episcopalians, as well as all other divisions, recognize themselves as the true faith. But what do they think of others? This is not directed at anyone, I just thought it was interesting. Thanks for being civil
The bible teaches cleat that marriage is a covenant between one man and one woman. Jesus does love all sinners, but he does not tolerate sin. Galati on 5:19 "when you follow your sinful nature, the results are very clear. Sexual immorality, idolatry, sorcery, hostility, quarreling, jealousy, outbursts of anger, self ambition, dissension division, envy, drunkedness, wild parties, and other sins like these. Let me tell you again as I have before, that anyone living this sort of life will not inherit the Kingdom of God." 1st Corinthians 6:9-11 state about homosexuality as wrong. I pray for you all who are lost and being deceived please come to know Jesus and his true teaching as the Word of God has never changed. God bless you all my brothers and sisters in Christ.
+Joshua Knutson God changed His mind get over it. He's allowed to, he's God. This has nothing to do with you. You just keep worrying about that log in your own eye.
@@magicdog9523 Hypocrisy is for those who claim to be Christians and then clearly ignore the bible's and Christ's teaching. Like this old unfeminine battleaxe.
@@magicdog9523 It's clear that you despise God's word which clearly affirms heterosexual monogamous marriages and denies homosexual acts of any kind. Your inability to discern this is unsurprising I suppose, for you see in the bible things that aren't there, just as you assume I am Catholic, which I am not.
@@philagon I supposed it was a safe bet you were, considering your initial comment suggested bishops meant something to you. Was I mistaken in assuming you to be from a religious tradition that organizes itself in such a way? Orthodox, maybe?
Check out the Movie 'Prayers for Bobby". It does not deal with marriage exactly but rather the churches(at large) reaction to homosexuality. I once was 100% against gay marriage but now I believe i have been convicted of that and believe it is indeed right and fair...and not sinful.
This socalled bishop does a slick job of some verbal gymnastics and manipulating scripture references, and so elegantly twists the straightforward and historic understanding of God's Word on the subject in an effort to accommodate the world's way of thinking today. Notice how she intentionally ignores the fact that the marriage examples she's trying to use from scripture are all predicated solely on male- female relationships, as it has been since the beginning. Notice also she likes to throw up a bunch of smoke in her explanation to obscure the issue. Don't be deceived by her teaching. The Apostle Paul would call it a doctrine of demons. ("Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the Faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons through the insincerity of liars whose consciences are seared..."). 1Timothy 4:1-2
"we are now wrestling w/ questions now in ways the Bible never really concieved of." Hmmmm...so God didn't plan for this discussion? Yea-right. If you don't believe the Bible is the Word of God, then why bother following any of it?
it is a word of God as given to men at a certain point in history. it is by no means the ONLY word of God, otherwise that would make the Bible an Idol and God's voice today irrelevant. We worship a God who speaks through the Holy Spirit. We don't worship and only follow the Bible. Our God is not the Bible.
The traditional Christian view is that marriage is 1 man and 1 woman. There's just no way to mince that up and pretend it is any different. Primarily what marriage in Christianity has always been about is actually sexual chastity- marriage is the only acceptable way to express sexuality, and sexuality is primarily a reproductive end. Thus, there is really no place for gay marriage in Christianity.
“Well, there’s different understandings of what scripture says about marriage.” Umm, no there isn’t It’s abundantly clear! This waste of oxygen single handedly destroyed the Episcopal church with her radical liberal ideologies and a “my way or the highway” approach to any person or congregation who disagreed with her. A despicable human being who disgusts me with her claiming to be a religious person. The things she did while in office proved otherwise.
rowan orre read the Bible, it is very clear: Romans 1:26-27 “For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompense of their error which was meet.”, 1 Corinthians 6:9 (read 10 also to get full context) 9“Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men” 10”nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.”. Also read Leviticus 18:22 “You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.”, and Leviticus 20:13 “If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them.”, while these verses two verses are in the Old Testament and it is argued whether they are still upon us as moral law, there is *NO WAY* you can argue that the New Testament verses I listed do not clearly state that Homosexuality is a sin.
For as much as we teach about treating others with dignity, a lot of those same people sure as hell don't treat themselves that way (covered in tattoos, body piercings, you name it, as well as sleeping with anyone and everyone).
@@erikbunty2016 And Jesus dined freely with these people. It is not our place to sit in judgment of them. Sometimes the first step to self-worth is for others to recognize the worth that is inherent in you - Christians are held to a high standard and meant to be a light to all the world, not to find excuses to only accept perfection.
