Pro Bike Mechanic's 10 Most Hated Products 

Yeah I'm not a pro mechanic (I just work on my own bikes as a hobby) but my front derailleurs never caused any problems

Agreed. Front derailleur are a good thing. Shimano is definitely the best make sure the front clain line is in spec use thier chain rings and chain and it will always work. Also pre tension the cable and seat the ferrals in . Never have any problems using Shimano 1.2 mm stainless with their 4 mm housin either and Shimano cable grease is worth the high cost less is better anyway. Avoid the short plastic ferral the longer ones are just fine plus they are less likely siese to the adjuster barrel and get stuck in the frame. A dab of grease on the ferral also goes a long way. Do all this and adjustments will be minimal and last for at least 5 maybe 10 years. Generally don't use sealed ferrals except the one on the chain stay and any that are pointed to the sky where water can pour in. Never use a metal ferral with a shifter that has a plastic housing seat either as it may damage the seat . It often can be fixed but it is a bit of cobble job. Keep your shifters lubed and they will stay working too that stuff from the factory doesn't last forever something light and yearly ( more often for winter) is better here. I use a mineral based ATF ( non synthetic automatic transmission fluid it won't hurt plastic) and a small amount of Lucas Red n Tacky to thicken it a bit. Works good on derailleur pivots and brake pivots too.

I'm a complete amateur, but I was able to replace the cable and housing on my front derailleur without any difficulty. A trick I've heard of is to deliberately tighten the ferrules into the stops on an exposed cable run, by pulling the cable to the side, before even attempting to adjust the setting. What I did, however, was to run complete housing without an exposed section. I did that for improved weather resistance, since there are harsh winters here and I store the bike outdoors (under eaves). I'm also using a coated cable to eliminate friction. Works a treat.

Fully agree, but my god some of the Shimano front derailleurs are so fussy.

Yup same, and intentionally routing cables internally rather than hiding them with a cover or within a grove is just such a dickmove.

100% and if you do any weighted touring, I think you need a front derailleur.

EXACTLY - I also hate that bikes are becoming thing you can't work on yourself. Not everyone is a pro cyclist. We don't need all this crap.

SRAM batteries are 60 bucks and last for several years. Welcome to modernity, change isn't always bad.

@@prasad530 60 bucks is the price of a normal decent (nothing fancy) rear derailleur... "several years" isn't exactly impressive either, I prefer bike stuff to be around for several decades.

I need the gearing range on my 9-speed so I run 46/30 on the front. I could go 1x if I had space for like a 52t rear cassette sprocket

Indeed.. was totally on board until the end. Front mechs and cables; seriously - so everyone should be on 1x with electronic shifting...? A hearty "f*ck that" from my bar-end-shifted triple and I!

@@Mike-de7wv Well, it's a mechanic's perspective! He gets to work on other people's bikes and hates when they come back for that half turn of the barrel adjuster once the cables settle in. I like maintaining my bike and I just love that feeling when everything just works perfectly after I've dialed it in.

2x10 is more versatile even in just urban riding IMO. My daily ride has sections where 50km/h+ is easily achievable for decent stretches. Flatish sections where it's nice to push along at 35-40km/h. But then parts where you're stuck behind foot traffic on a 10% grade for 50m.

Yup, I do all that plus hills with a bike loaded pretty heavy with my crap

Was gonna say! It is tricky when you do want to take the wheel off though.

why don't they make a lefty rear wheel frame

Same here, it's way easier to remove the tire on a lefty.

@@alf3071 Think long and hard and the answer will come to you. Don't ask.

So, do you have a lefty but still uses tube tires???

Some of us have been begging for viable 1x since the 80s. It isn't marketing when the companies FINALLY started listening to us a decade ago.

@@NoBrakes23 But 1x isn't objectively superior. It is more expensive and loses gearing range. My main bike is 1x (Deore 10 speed) but I honestly wish it was a 2x because I go to gear up after that top gear more than you'd think.

I recently switched from a compact Shimano 105 2x bike to a Sram Axs Xplr groupset which is 1x13. I compared and I'm not actually losing that many gears (especially the ones I care about) due to how they set up the smallest cogs to be quite incremental before bigger tooth gaps in the large cogs. It's been fine on the road - yes I spin out if I am trying to pump out power over 35MPH, but that doesn't really matter to me since I am not racing and can just tuck those descents. The gearing on climbs is actually a bit better with the extended range (despite there being a bigger jump between those cogs). Plus I just really enjoy the simplicity of a single shifter being dedicated to up or down, without worrying about shifting a front mech on more technical trails. I agree that it doesn't make sense yet for most racers as those little tooth gaps do matter in a lot of cases for keeping an ideal cadence on rolling terrain. But we did see quite a bit of 1x usage at Paris Roubaix this year! I doubt Sram would force that on riders if they didn't find it sufficient for the course.

@@Cobalt985 It's just the geared rider mentality. I'm having fun with a chill geared single speed road bike in a moderately hilly city. You can do longer/harder peak efforts in the uphills when you at times also get rest when reaching high enough cadence that you'll rather coast.

... just buy a mountain bike(?)

It's just nice as a mechanic and shop not to have to deal with them and stock them and have the right ones that are compatible with whatever, and finding an alternative if we don't have yours, etc etc etc. There's enough on a bike that needs servicing so It's nice when there's one system deleted

@@jmanswat2457 Yeah but that's true for most road bike parts, isn't it? Same goes for rear derailleurs with 3 common groupset tiers from 2 manufacturers (sorry, Campy), different generations, cage length and even color options... I would argue that taking away 2x from a road bike in most regions would impact your riding on every tiny climb - a bit like saying: run your car on all-season tires so that the shop isn't bothered with changing them every season. As a rider/customer, my expectation is that drivetrain parts except from wearing components need to be ordered if I had a failure, anyway.

I just bought a new GRX 810 2x group, and the supplier shipped the 1by left shifter by mistake. I have a spare bar-end friction shifter and I'm seriously thinking of running the FD that way. How's that for a mullet build?

​@@joelv4495Why WOULDNT you want friction on the fd, especially when it's only two chainrings?

@@jmanswat2457 - except the FD is the part that's about the most fit and forget item on bike. Why should customers compromise their riding, just because lazy mechanics can't be bothered to do their job.

Yeah also converted from 1x to 2x. My mechanic was really confused. But I use my bike both for bikepacking (heavy) and I put it on the trainer for Zwift. 1x really wasn't cutting it at all. I don't worry about spinning out anymore and also have better gearing for uphill when heavy.

As mechanics you get to understand that there are two camps for bicycle performance and maintenance- recreational and racing. They each have different goals and come with their own requirements in terms of parts, setup, and cost. Racing is so much more expensive and finicky.

@@jmanswat2457 I definitely agree with you but I would add to both categories a subcategory of wanting to go with trends. A lot of things out there get slapped on to new bikes that get marketed in a way that makes people think they need the newest tech to keep up when in reality the differences are marginal at best. I see this for both racing and recreational.

​@@xAudiolith yh. I learned that last year. I always rode alloy (2013, middle of the road, Cube endurance bike) until i bought a carbon Cervelo, a bike that the pros used to win the tdf, like 15 yrs ago. But i barely improved on any of my times. I tt'd my way to work probably like 40 times, not even 1 km/h of difference in speed while being 1.5kg lighter. I did my favorite lap of about 75km a few times on both bikes and it wasn't smoother nor faster nor did i feel any difference at the end of the ride. I feel scammed. It's so disheartening. It's all in your legs and all those gains are all in your head.

I have to disagree with them on Muck-Off and Cannondale. Never had a buildup with Muck-Off, and I own a Cannondale. Great bike. Though I must say those lefty forks look ridiculous.

I'm a forgetful person. I like double because if I'm down it goes up n vice versa. No guesswork what the levers gonna do. I wish it just came with one button that switches between the 2.

the front mech is normally very reliable. gear problems are always with the rear derailleur anyway

dont go for 3x drivetrains, its just a marketing gimmek. any cyclist who knows what their talking about, mountain or road, will tell you the same

That implies, that top manufacturers making tripples really know nothing about bikes, right? LOL@@halfblood_drag0n

​@halfblood_drag0n Agreed... 3x literally has no point at all. There's no purpose for the middle gear. Just has 2x, and use the cassette more. Also, I do hate 2x as well. Not that it's useless, it's definitely great, and can be hard to get as much range out of the cassette with a 2x chainring, but then all the problems that come with it, it's just not worth it.

I don't think he meant wireless, just 1 chain ring at the front and 11 or 12sp at the back.

I totally agree about needing a front Mech. Dude in the video is a just trendy and jumping on the 1x bandwagon. I live in a mountainous area, I use both rings equally. Not to mention if you've rode enough you know that the big ring feels different than the small ring, even if the gear inches are the same. So to say it unnecessary is foolish.

@@frankdatank2570 Yep, I moved from the plains to the mountains. Need that front mech more than ever!

He’s in the industry so he doesn’t have to pay retail for anything. No wonder he loves wireless shifting 😂

I'm with you - 2x for the gravel! The differential in speed makes it almost a necessity.... 1mph climbs, 40mph descents... RANGE! and Quick jump shifting™ using the front mech!

I have a 3x and don't want to miss the range either. Tbh one tooth less on the back or one more on the front and I wouldn't make it up the hills when riding with luggage. I am even thinking on upgrading to a Casette with 36 instead of 32 teeth max

It’s just a lot of redundancy really, I’m going single up front next bike.

@@climatechangedoesntbargain9140 As long as the rear derailleur can handle it. I can only have a 30 t on my 3X. (with 28 - 39 - 48 in front)

I wouldn't want a single chain ring on my road bike. Have some steep hills where I live that always require me dropping to the smaller chainring.

Chainline

Regarding getting tyres on and off, that's because there are two versions of Gatorskins. The folding bead one is fine, goes on without much hassle, very straightforwards. The wire bead version is an absolute bastard of a tyre that is near impossible to get on and off and has led to multiple tyre levers of mine getting snapped whilst trying to get it on and off rims. Horrible to live with, should never have been created

@@thelonesculler I've used both folding and wire bead and the folding is definitely easier to live with

Eh they do give you a good deal of puncture protection but you are definitely giving up a good deal of grip, ride comfort, rolling resistance, and weight on Gatorskins---which is to say quite a lot. I used to use them before I knew better. Gp5000s or other top level tires will make your bike feel like new. If the roads are bad where you live I would suggest going tubeless.

Since more than 20 years I'm on Conti GP 4000. Once I've tried Gatorskin on my commuter when using it on often London's wet roads. It was horrible nightmare. Sometimes it was spinning without any grip when I've tried to suddenly accelerate.

very true, just lower some pressure as they can take it

Gatorskins, Supacaz bar tape and front mech for me.

I use muc off lubes and have had no problems cleaning extremely neglected winter chains and cassettes in an ultrasonic cleaner, so it may be down to what is used to degrease.

@@BrianMcDonald The chain lubes have a poor reputation with people who test these things

Ultegra, infinity elites and all sorted

I like front mechs, too. Especially if you are driving with luggage. In this case even smaller hills will be hard to cycle. Especially if you only do it a fey times in a year. I really liked to switch to the lowest gear possible then. Maybe 2x front mech would be sufficient when having a 12x casette. But still I'd like to be able to switch.

@@twillyspanksyourcakes Zero Friction Cycling recently posted a video comparing transmission losses between 1x and 2x, the data is pretty conclusive, I think I’ll stick with 2x and keep the watts.

And cables. His beef with cables just seemed to require you to buy stainless ones and just learn how an adjuster works. I'd take that any day over stupid expensive repairs on electrics

@@twillyspanksyourcakes I suppose you're right, the margins are higher and so is parts/servicing costs. Personally you'll never get me to abandon a system with as much flexibility as mechanical drivetrains have. You can technically run Campag 10 speed shifters with a Suntour Vx derailleur and Shimano 8s cassette. With a bit of maths and ingenuity almost anything is possible with a mechanical setup.

Wheelside bearing in the freehub on Hunt wheels only lasts about 3000kms, but that's the only downside of these (they are strong, fast, solid, reliable in all weathers and most of all exceptionally well priced). Suggestion: buy a replacement freehub from them, it's 40€, so that when you start hearing that horrible metallic grinding sound signalling the end of the life of your bearing, you just swap freehubs easily and replace bearings with other ones with no rush

@@guytatler9769 Agreed. I am not a "road cyclist", though I ride on the road quite often. Mechanical will ALWAYS be all I use. I do not want to contribute all that shit to e-waste in a few years.

I think most of the FD "problems" he stated are just "neglect" issues!

@@barriobarranco I find it funny how a quarter turn on a barrel adjuster is supposed to be a big technical problem somehow.

Gatorskins suck. Have you actually tried a good tyre?

Gatorskins suck.

@@discbrakefan Yes, but I've got tired of fixing punctures on the side of the road.

What bike are you ridding now I am finding that my lighter bikes are more fun to ride as I get older but have a mike apple bike that is steel that rides like a dream… so really enjoy ridding still at 76

​@@MikeSmith-qu5ew Actually I just bought a Giant Contend SL2. Nice and upright riding position and takes fat tyres. Converted it to 1x of course. Semi internal cabling only. A real common sense bike.

David that is a good choice for sure,I am always trying to upgrade but need to more up right at 76 and need some warm weather I am in Wisconsin and the winters are long.

@@MikeSmith-qu5ew Hello, I met Mike Apple at a WI bike race in Madison- quick fix on my frame. Thanks for jogging my memory!

@@davidadams8342 David I have one apple bike its a perfect frame steel and the paint is perfect its a touring bike with a fit that is fast. I have not seen a bike as nice. Do you ride a lot still its tough for me with the traffic but still get out for rides.

I can't see it taking off either. The only way to get around the limited gear range is having a gigantic dinner plate sized cassette and not only does that make the jumps more extreme but it also means you're constantly cross chaining.2x has cleaner lines and smaller jumps, hard to give up that practicality.

i have the e*thirteen 9-50t cassette in the rear, that gives amazing range. have a 30t on a mtb, 32 on xc bike and 38 on my gravel bike. up to 50km/h and down to snail speeds on 25°+ gradient climbs it leaves nothing to be desired for. and if im going 55 or 60km/h it is still acceptable.

@@Ropetable I hope you mean 25%, not 25°.

@@Ropetable I did look into riding with those since they are awesome but so expensive!! I go through a chain every 9 months or so as is and tend to get 2 or 3 chains out of my cassettes before they are worn out. The whole 11-speed package (an SLX 11-42 cassette with 3 KMC chains) costs me roughly €140 for 2 years and 3 months of riding.

@@woodywoodverchecker haha right, my mistake.

He sounded like a professional mechanic until the last bit. It's funny he says "don't fall just for the marketing".

But can you actually get better gearing with 2x? For speed probably, but for climbing, you can get a 46-30 up front and an 11-34 in the back (or maybe a 11-36 tops, but that is not officially supported for Tiagra). At the same time it's not very hard to have a 10-46 or even 10-50 for 1x, combine that with a 40t or 42t up front, and it's very similar, but with better climbing gears. I switched from a Tiagra set to Apex1, and so far haven't found anything to complain about.

@@kornenator i run tiagra using 48-32t combo with 11-36 without derailleur extender. No issues so far. I still got top speed and some climbing gear. Since it's hard to get GRX crank comes with 165mm length. Besides the jump on wide range 1x11 is too much for me. And oncd again the 10 speed components is far cheaper to replace and maintain.

I run a 46/30 up front with an 11-42 cassette. I just needed a longer chain, around 120 links to get it to work.

and it will last longer and be cheaper to buy a new chain for

I worked on and off for 13 years in the bicycle business. I was the top manager in a shop chain that was in the top 100 of shops in the country according to BDS. I trained a lot of people to become mechanics. The president of the largest bicycle club in the United States was going around telling everybody that I was the best in the state. I had no personal relationship and I'd only see him come into my shop once. My point is I've seen a lot of silly opinions in the bicycle business in a lot of silly products. It seems like the products are more silly than ever. That's what burned me out on the business. I kept seeing new products launched that were garbage. Only to have enthusiasts with too much money and too few brains come rushing into the bike shop with a magazine in their hand saying, "Do you have this yet? do you have this yet?" Speedplay pedals are not one of those products. I am one of the original purchasers of speed play pedals and I love them. Especially since I suffered knee damage courtesy of a drunk driver in 1990. Speed play pedals are much more comfortable than SPD and egg beater pedals because they have completely free range of pivot where the others have spring loaded pivot. It's a huge difference if you have knee problems. And like you stated, installation is the easiest you can have. As far as the weight of the cleats, they're not particularly heavy so I don't understand that comment In the video. Additionally, speed play have by far the most corner clearance of any pedal made. When I was an avid cyclist doing 300 miles a week I practice taking corners while pedaling all the way through the corners. I could do a much deeper lean with Speedplay pedals once I got them. And as far as he's comments about triple cranks and double cranks and also about cables, I think he's dead wrong. I think those are ridiculous opinions. He's not going to enjoy using a single chainring with a limited rear gear range in the White mountains of New Hampshire. He's not going to want them in Fitchburg, Massachusetts. He's not going to want them and Aspen, Colorado. If he's having a problem with cables rusting up it means he's not building the bicycles improperly. On every bicycle that I assembled - and I have assembled thousands of bicycles - I always trimmed the housing and then put the lightest coating of white lithium grease on the cables and would take the cables out and pump the housing full of Teflon lubricant. I know from my own bicycles that the cables just won't rust if you do that. And they'll smoothly shift. From a business point of view, he should want his customers to come back to have their cables readjusted during the break-in. That's an opportunity for the shop to show its new customers the accessories that they should now realize would make their experience more enjoyable. Instead of them buying the bare minimum of accessories such as a water bottle and cage for perhaps $20 or $30 or $40, they'll eventually set themselves up with about $500-to-$1,000 worth of accessories that fit their needs and actually make their cycling experience much more pleasurable. That all really starts with the tune-up after a break-in of a new bicycle. And it's the skipping shifting because of stretch cables that will drive those new enthusiasts back to the shop to get the adjustment. If they don't see a problem and don't feel a problem they won't bring the bike back in for those adjustments. You know what I mean.

I 100% agree with you regarding Speedplays. Best pedals, longest lasting cleats, no hassle adjustment to ANY personal requirements, double side benefits - easy engadgement and double life.

Smaller cassette on the back = less weight also, than a massive SRAM 48-10 (or whatever they do 😅)

Is it a specific lube that does it or is it a certain type of terrain that it's so bad with? I was highly recommended muc off by the two mechanics at the shop when I was going to get something else and have personally never had a problem with it being bad to clean

In my experience, it’s Muc-Off Wet Lube, the blue one, which is particularly awful. Even correctly applied, the first ride in wet conditions on roads and it retains all the grime and grit splashed up from the surface and dries into a black gunk, almost like a glue or sealant, coating chain and gears. You won’t have the same problem with Muc-Off Dry Lube, the yellow one, because it washes off in even the lightest of rain, leaving your chain to rust. I agree with the video: +1 for Fenwicks All Conditions.

This is awkward…i switched from wd40 lube for bike to muc off dry or wet lube and tho i did a good choice lol i felt the lube was way better than the messy wd40

Exactly! New Leftys use a quick release system to remove the brake caliper with a single flip of a lever. Can't get easier than that.

Totally agree love my lefty Oliver excellent

3 x is superb especially if using a friction shifter

I converted a 3x9, V-brake hybrid to drop bars with long-pull drop bar brake levers and indexed bar-end shifters. That might seem weird to some people, but it works really well, and a set of 3x9 brifters would have cost about twice the price of all four separate levers.

@Vaughanb Brean That's awesome. Mine is a 2001 Sirrus Comp. Barely handles 33mm tires, that's enough.

Please don’t tell him that 😂😂

Yes please.

I have 3 sets of hunts. They have been nothing but bomb-proof. I'd always recommend them.

@@erickaracsonyi4415 since this I’ve crashed and damaged the rim (still running with a tube but won’t seal tubeless). They have offered a discounted replacement or repair under their crash warranty scheme. Can’t fault them!

Any rear mech today can change at least 3 gears at time. Some 4 or even more.

​@@edudutra at load?

@Climate Change doesn't bargain same load front mech can handle.

If you find the terrain "suddenly" changing on you, then you're doing it wrong.

Unless you’re shifting that rear with AXS.

I had the nipple holes tearing after 1 year on my alu HUNTS

Same here, purely love my Hunts, also the envy of my mates as they just continues to roll compared to other bigger and expensive brands

@@nathierfakier6380 there is little magical about them, they need the same maintenance as any other brand. Mine broke after a year.

Destroyed the hub on my Hunt rear wheel twice. They sent replacements without question but it shouldn’t happen.

I’m looking at picking up hunt wheels for gravel and my FIL uses them.

You either love them or hate them. No in-between :D

+1 for speedplays. Been using them for 15 years. Never had a problem and the new cleats with the rubber cover are certainly expensive but they last forever.

@@WeirdNumber1 I always glue the rubber bottoms on or they tend to fall off when pushing off from a dead stop. I have found numerous ones out on the road so I know I am not the only one with the problem............

I don't think I've had any major problems aside from the initial effort to get things right at the start. When you have new cables and everything is installed properly it feels like a dream, so the only real downside is that it just doesn't feel as nice when the cables stretch and if you are sensitive to feel you'll be constantly tweaking them or potentially servicing more which isn't always fun.

@@BrianMcDonald last time I adjusted my front mech cable was 2020. 10,000km a year. Sorted.

@@AnvilAirsoftTV are your cables external or partially/fully through the frame?

Same! Been using the muc-off e-bike lube and never had any issues

With you, Kate! No idea what people do to get it like that. 🤯

@@bernardlinde Perhaps they apply way too much, don't get rid of the access, and then don't use their bikes very often? It's something that could happen with certain dry lubes since these tend to be wax based.

Use quality cables, and not a lot of adjusting is needed, unless you have a cheap group set.

Exactly. I very rarely need to adjust my shifting with a click or two of the adjusting barrel - oh my what a workout !!! 😂😂 I love my 3x7

Dropping the front ring is about the same as dropping three rings in the back. I don't know what ancient groupset you are using that doesn't allow you to do that.

@@NoBrakes23 Read my post.

​@@NoBrakes23 Sure you can do it. Do it under load, and keep doing it, and I'll crack a beer, pull an arm chair, and keep watching you do that the whole day 😂.

I think a lot comes down to bike handling abilities and watching the road............

Oh, yeah, tire clearance is important. But I forget how tight the clearances are on road-racing bikes. My idea of “minimum sensible clearance” for a road bike is 38mm tires _plus fenders_ .

Do the math you’ll see a 1x has as much range as a wide range double.

@@njs461 appreciate I've probably phrased that poorly. What I meant was the increments between the two ranges of high and low are limited by a single chain ring and 12 speed cassette. A 12 speed with the same high and low rear cassette as a 2x12 speed will not offer the same range of gear choices; half in fact if we "do the math" 😉

@@DanVee94 just wait until that 1x20 drivetrain comes out!

100% agree with you, especialy about Speedplays - everything he says about them is exactly opposite to my experience.

I agree I changed to 1x and have never looked back on my now 1x10 105 road bike I have never had the issue of being in the wrong gear and I never EVER use the granny ring 😊

I got the Campagnolo Ekar 1x13 (40 and 42-9) and since I'm not a pro rider going way above 60 km/h I have not yet spun out. I tried :D

Agree. Not sure why Speedplay was even part of a video on mechanic issues. I can (maybe) see the topic in a bike fit video but why for a mechanic?

​@@razeemali2322 My own experience is that you have to keep pumping greasein them prevent bearing to axle play and then the grease will leak out during a ride all over your white dmt knit kicks. The cleats wear out really fast while being expensive and when worn out have a lot of lateral play in them which then can destroy you kneecaps over a longer period of use.

I had them for years and loved them.

I have the older Speedplay Zero pedals on seven bikes and have no issues other than the price of replacement cleats. At least in the Zeros unlike the even older X/2 models the cleat springs are the same on both pedals so I older need to buy cleats half as often.

Speedplays are easy to operate and feel nice. I'm not giving them up! The downside is that emergency release is by stripping the thread off the cleat bolts... (When I crashed the cleats pulled halfway of the shoes, so that the pedal body could rotate and slip between the locking lugs.)

Where is the laughing reaction on RU-vid?! 3x?! Mate let’s just bring back down tube shifters at the same time

I don't expect 2x to go away for road any time soon, but I suspect gravel is going to shift to primarily 1x for simplicity and dropper post compatibility, though I also expect droppers to find their way onto high end road bikes too for racing with the supertuck now illegal in UCI sanctioned racing. MTB world will NEVER go back to 2x or 3x, for MTB 1x is light years better

I’ve broken a couple sets, but it’s an mtb, so they get some abuse

Sounds ideal, and I'd even say that should be the "standard" gearing offered for road bikes too!!

Supacaz is OK for me, but I don't like the way the Super Kush lineup wears out, the outermost layer flakes off overtime. Burgh and Ciclovation (not all models) are some of the brands I like to wrap, but it's not cheap.