Publishing Worst Case Scenarios! 

That is some good advice, but I wonder how they decide what sells well or not. I mean some authors sell on name vs book quality. King wrote Thinner under a pen name and when he was outed it made 5x the sales afterward. Of course, King is an extream example.

Anne Rice had a trilogy published under the pen name A.N. Roquelaure. I'm sure you've heard of it. She was already well-known for her vampire books, but her Claiming of Sleeping Beauty trilogy was written to push every single sexual boundary possible, to the point that Fifty Shades and The Mister look tame. Except, unlike those books, Rice's were meant to basically blow up boundaries in a time of close guidelines being kept for sex in books. It was a huge enough risk that a pen name was used in case it backfired. Obviously it didn't, though she no longer gets credit for writing the books that destroyed the line.

@@RoseKindred I'm pretty sure they don't care WHY it sells, just how many units.

You are not wrong. The same is true with traditional publishers, Audible, Amazon, etc. This is why any prior failures or changes in genre should lead a writer to change his/ her pen name.

Hard same! I appreciate the highs even more, knowing and having experienced some of the lows. Plus, I have my agent to get mad at people on my behalf when shit goes wrong :)

How annoying... Why do they promise things they can't make them happen?

I have never heard of this happening to anyone here in NYC. Did this happen elsewhere?

@@scarlet8078 I was in a writing group in melbourne australia where it happened.

I say thank you to my publisher and agent as often as possible! When things go really well, it's worth being grateful :)

Yeah, I firmly believe that being prepared makes a huge difference! I try not to sweat the small stuff, and I appreciate all the good things that can happen. No single scenario is ever 100% perfect, and tempering your expectations helps a lot with long term satisfaction.

I honestly really enjoy talking about this stuff haha. I know for some people it's scary in a bad way, but for me, I use stories like this to fortify myself so I can better manage the knocks!

Julian Fantasia If you're in Canada and your story will stay there, there is no actual reason to care about B&N

Sharon Efee If I’m ever going to publish a book it will be with an American agent. Publishing in Canada is stupid if you want to actually sell books and you aren’t a Canada-specific contemporary or literary author. No one chooses to publish commercial fiction through a Canadian publisher. At least it isn’t anyone’s first choice.

Yes, reversion clauses are critical! It's why I go so hard about getting a GOOD agent--not just any agent. Contract negotiation skills are critical--I have a book contract with several clauses that shift things in my favor, thanks to my very sharp agent. A friend of mine also has a very sharp agent, and her publisher also declined to purchase her third book (essentially cancelling her plans for a trilogy) BUT she has every right to pub a third book on her own. Her agent did a great job!

Is this Victoria Schwab's "The Archived"? Would explain why that third book never came out.

That's totally mean...

I suggest that you just start writing. You may find that your series of 7 becomes 3. Regardless, the only way to sell multiples is to finish the first one. Baby steps ;)

I mean, the best revenge is success :)

Haha, yes! But I do expect it. And like, I'm cool if this scares some people off--I get it! But I know those who are strapped in and ready to try trad pub appreciate the honesty--it's easier to prepare yourself when you know what can go wrong! (I personally appreciate all the good stuff even more)

@@AlexaDonne it is an important discussion. Unfortunately this is not something that one would think to compile into a craft book. 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♀️

I actually screamed out loud: OH HELL NO at 9:53 lmaooo

@@valeriaq1810 Haha. It's super rare--I know of three people, total, to whom it has happened but it's still BRUTAL. The first time I heard of it was when Sarah Rees Brennan posted on her Tumblr about it and it blew my mind. (and I think she deleted that post shortly thereafter)

@@AlexaDonne thank you so much for sharing! And even more for taking the time to reply 💗💗

Yeah, if it was POD it's mostly likely that last series was self-published, rather than traditionally published.

@@AlexaDonne Well, that settles one wonder I have been pondering. Trying to be a writer and hearing all these videos and stories is rather scary to me.

@@RoseKindred Well, see I see it in a different way? I see an author who established a very successful base in traditional publishing, who was able to transition to self-publishing and still get carriage in a national bookstore chain's catalog (which most self-pub books don't get), while reaping all the profits from her hard work. To me, that's a hybrid author success story.

@@AlexaDonne Oh I agree, I just meant for a beginner like me all this work is scary. I am not averse to the work it is just more in-depth than I would expect, and I thank you for making the videos you do. They are very informative. I am glad as well to see the series still available even if it is not on shelves.

L G Don't cry (a hug)

Sharon Efee *hugs*

Absolutely! If you don't sell something, it still belongs to you. But most of us in the trad pub ecosystem are trying to sell something that way, so we just shelve the book. Not always forever--I would consider self-pubbing one of my older projects, possibly.

@@AlexaDonne you have such a big author platform - I'm sure your book would do great if you self published!

@@DanicaChristin Self-publishing is definitely part of my long game plan! There are some key genres I really want to write in that don't do very well in trad pub, or are simply more lucrative in self-pub. But it's chicken and egg! I've partly built my platform on the back of my trad pub experience, so I'm not sure if it would have worked out the same the other way around, at least not for the book I did debut with :)

Bethany Laurell also with self publishing you've basically got to do everything. Traditional publishing allows for professionals to take over the business role for you.

@@RashmikaLikesBooks Well, that's the conventional wisdom, but is it really that accurate? From what I've seen, the vast majority of traditionally published authors still have to pay for most if not all of their own marketing, as well as paying their own way to cons and festivals and such. They don't have to pay for a cover to be made, but the flip side, as mentioned in this video, is the very real possibility of hating the cover and having virtually no say in it. Same goes for the title. I'm not trying to hate on trad pub, but it just seems like every time I turn around, there's another tweet thread or RU-vid video about the myriad of ways that the publishing industry can screw over authors, and I'm continually frustrated/mystified over how they get away with it when the entire industry wouldn't even *exist* without authors and the work they produce.

Bethany Laurell what you say is completely true. Traditional publishing is far from perfect. Self publishing gets a lot of unwarranted hate, when it's actually a good option for a lot of people and might be better than trad publishing. Self publishing is a lot of work, but ultimately ends up being very rewarding for a lot of people.

@@RashmikaLikesBooks For sure! I forgot to say that traditional publishing obviously has extensive in-house editing that the author doesn't have to pay for, so that is a point in its favor. Ultimately both paths have their advantages and disadvantages. It's good for authors to have options!

@@bethanylaurell8081 My publisher paid for all my marketing as well as all my travel to events. And I only got into those events because my publisher got me in--most of the biggest/best book festivals and fan conventions ONLY accept trad pubbed authors. Plus, distribution is a real thing--I'm in nearly a thousand libraries, which you can compare to a notable self-pub title I had librarian friends look up and is only in 27, total. I also had 3-10 copies in every single Barnes and Noble in the country--IN the store, not just online. The thing is, if you focus on worst case scenarios, you miss all the middling to best case scenarios, where you still end up WAY ahead of where you'd be otherwise. 99% of trad pubbed authors get the extensive distribution that is standard for traditional publishing, and even the bare minimum of marketing is enough to move copies of the book. It's good to know about the 1% worst case scenario but the odds of it being you are slim. To focus on outliers is a little bit myopic?

Bookstores have store buyers (usually by category/department) who decide what they'll stock on their shelves--they can't possibly stock all books, as there just isn't room. Plus, titles are constantly weeded from the shelves--I'm a year out from pub, so my book has likely been weeded from most shelves. It's pretty routine for indie stores, for example, to decline to stock titles at the outset--only a fraction of YA titles are stocked by indie stores (I've gone to indies who didn't stock me). It's more rare for a big store like B&N, but it does happen--it usually means that the buyer just doesn't feel it is worth their bandwidth and shelf space to stock a title they don't believe will sell. Sarah Rees Brennan's second book series was passed on by B&N at first--she blogged about it on her Tumblr. They'd done a big order for her first series and it just didn't sell. Another person I know of who it happened to writes middle grade--the store just didn't want to carry it. Another person I know was pubbed by HarperTeen, who notoriously publishes like 200 YA books a year, and B&N just can't take all their books--in any given week, 4+ of the new titles might be HarperTeen books and they have to also stock titles by other houses. This is why it's almost impossible for self-published works to get into stores--they have such limited space they turn down even some trad books (so a self-pub title has to be very commercially successful and represent a guarantee). This is also because of returns. There is also a WHOLE subsection of the distribution business that has to do with remaindering/returning books--the major publishers enable bookstores to return books for a refund--so that represents a lower risk for the store in buying books to stock, because if they don't sell they can return them. Many smaller publishers WON'T refund the bookstores if they return inventory, which is why many book stores will not carry small press (or self-pub) books. There are also incentives major publishers offer stores for carrying more of their titles, but that's even further down the rabbit hole. There is a very complex and intricate set of systems in the publishing and distribution world, which is why trad pub is so good at it--they know all the ins & outs and rules. I know I should make a video, but it's such an intense topic and I've not felt up to it yet lol.

Alexa Donne I didn’t even know there was so much to after you get the agent, then the editor, then the publisher. Holy crap.... that must be the most insanely intense wait time. Then if they don’t even tell you! What a huge let down if you were excited for it.

@@KatharineFrancis It is a lot! It's why I've always been so intense about seeking out information and preparing as much as possible. Honestly, I was so prepared for so many worst case scenarios (and/or went through them before I sold), that when everything went pretty darn well for me, I was pleasantly surprised and really happy about it. It's why generally I can't complain much about my publishing journey. I got decent money (nothing crazy, but not peanuts), my publisher treated me SUPER well, and even though I'm not a huge seller, my book was widely distributed, especially in libraries! And some of this stuff... it's better to know it so you can make more informed decisions about your publishing career once you're on this side. Like... some publishers are more notorious for things falling through the cracks than others, and you can always... not submit your book there lol. (the question always is: do you just want to be published, or do you want to publish well?)

Alexa Donne I for sure want to be published well. Haha I still haven’t decided which to go with. They each have their perks and cons but your channels pretty much the only one that gives it to the viewer straight. You should totally do a video on this topic some time. Or like a series of publishing mishaps to prepare for.

I have a whole video on that!

novellyKJ I wonder f techbically there's a problem to start with one company and then move to other (fot the same series if you are rejected)

@@sharonefee1426 I don't know if that's possible. The publisher owns the right to publish the books when they buy it, so I think unless there's some sort of clause in the contract that says you get your publishing rights back if the publisher decides to not publish future books...that can't really happen. Maybe a publisher would be nice and let you out so you can publish elsewhere, but that's rare. I've seen authors wait decades to have their rights restored to them so they could republish a book series that had been out of print for almost that long. It's kind of ridiculous. And because I see it happen to other authors, it just weighs on my mind, I guess.

all things I'd fear

Can you just be forced to go with the trends? Sounds weird...

@@sharonefee1426 it's more that, it's exponentially harder to get published if you reject certain trends... And forget rejecting several common beliefs about "the right way to write". It's less that, you're forced to write trends no matter what, and more, if you don't conform to what publishers believe "sells"... no matter how dumb that can be at times... you'll nine times out of ten not find yourself a book deal. This is by extent why literature has become so focused on YA novels overall. It's easy to get certain things published and difficult to get others published. Conformity, albeit implicit conformity, is something that people often force down your throat for no better reason than they won't interact with you if you don't conform; such is humanity.

Honestly I'd never get published. My slow burn starts with no clear inciting incidents for example, these are things most readers adore and praise, which have a genuine purpose in the pacing, yet are just so antithetical to what people believe makes good writing that it would never get past the acquisitions meeting.

Hi

@@bennettfrazier1742 are you having a good day so far?

@@octosepninetyoneninetysix1601 yeah, it's been a great day, what about you?

@@bennettfrazier1742 same here on my end

@@octosepninetyoneninetysix1601 that's good, enjoying the video?

Well, but Pearl Harbor is a movie, not a book. Hollywood is very different, where movies are collaborative efforts with studios--who put in the money to make everything happen--have power. Books are different. The publisher can't publish a book without the author--that's not how rights work. They need the author to do all the hard work. (In Hollywood, you can be replaced on your own project, easily) So really a publisher can't make you do anything. If it truly comes to blows, you cancel your contract and give the money back. But most of the time, if an author doesn't want to make a change, they don't have to. The publisher backs off. I've flat out said no to my editor... many times. So my books--all the good and especially the bad--fall on my own shoulders.

@@AlexaDonne Thank you Alexa, you are more angelic than you know - and a hard working angel at that. As I am sure you are aware, writers fear the loss of control after going through so much effort and hoping for the best during the 'process' of being traditionally published. You give me strength.

@@cadengrace5466 I understand the fear! But I'm here to at least show that it's not always so bad :) I've only had the experience of my publishing team making my books better. I really appreciate the feedback I get on my drafts :)