Upgrade the CPU Upgrade the ram i bet future video be like "Install faster GPU" in the end, modders accidentally create *Xbox 360* by upgrading original Xbox.
I think the actual "pro" of this mod is that eventually we are gonna run out of chips to do the classic 128mb ram mod, and this is a good replacement for that eventuality.
I don't think that's really the point, nor a close coming problem. Compatible ram chips are most likely still in production, and are used in low power, or low capacity computational devices. That being said, adding more deditated wam for thuh swerver is always nice.
@@TheGamersRace Yeah, you'd be surprised how many embedded systems are using cores based on Pentium era cores (system-on-a-chip) for things like restaurant bump bars, and PBXs (once upon a time anways.
@@alext3811 Yeah a lot of people don’t understand that a lot of the little pieces that make up old school tech….make up new school tech too. Yesterdays bleeding edge laptop is tomorrows “bump bars” as you put it.
The CCPway business model: they take free and open source PCB design like this, and then some Chinese сомм unists noname garage shop produces a ton of devices for profit
Well I can see some scenarios where additional RAM could theoretically help + 720p patches + PC Ports or better pc ports + Texture improvement mods in games + Emulators + Sega chihiro games
There are some games patched at 1080i (Halo 2 HD, PSO) that can still run out of memory even with 128MB ram mod. (in the case of halo, he had to dial down the texture cache size to make it work) If they can fix the memory speed issue on the original kernel, it would help us run halo 2 at 1080i better (the guy who made the patch theorized the game was possibly starved for memory bandwidth). Besides that, there's also the port of ReactOS that can benefit. I would like to see where this is going.
128mb is enought for 720p patches, that need 900mhz at least to run... and few need 1.4ghz cpu to run. The ram is to... install a proper OPERATING SYSTEM on the Xbox making it a MODERN CONSOLE... a Dashboard that can actually act as a operating system... imagine XBox running Android by example, its possible as Android ran so well on 256mb ram phones on the past...
My gut instinct is that the stability issues are due to the interposer increasing the length of the PCB traces. I know from personal experience that one traces being just one or two mm longer can cause errors in signaling, even at the slower speeds that these old devices run at. Also this is even more obscure, but changing the width of the traces can cause weirdness with signal reflection. If the interposer uses thinner traces and doesn't perfectly length match them then that's my bet for the core problem.
I don't know if it was still a thing in the celeron era the Xbox was built on, but older PC's if you wanted to go above a certain threshold of ram, it'd actually run slower if you didn't have an equivalent increase in the CPU cache memory that stored the increased address range of the system ram. Given the whole point of celerons was same MHz with less caching for cheaper, if this was paired with the CPU upgrade mod, would that unlock the proper speed and reliability of the extra megabytes?
@@mikeyjnz You're misunderstanding that concept -- that was an issue primarily with motherboard-resident cache controlled by the system chipset, lasting from the 386 era on up to the Pentium MMX for Intel, and the K6-2/III for AMD. It wasn't necessarily the cache size in and of itself but rather the Tag RAM. Once we kicked over to CPU-resident L2 cache, like on the K6-2+ and III+, every Athlon, the Pentium Pro and onward, that issue either became much less prevalent (in the case of the K6 line) or disappeared entirely. In short, you can throw as much RAM at that thing as the chipset will address and there will be no slowdown.
In 2008 a forum user upgraded to 256mb using chips from a Compaq Presario, but because comparisons between 128 and 256 showed that there were no significant gains, this was left aside. Particularly, I wish there was this modification for the Xbox 360 and PS3, they clearly suffer from the memory they have, especially the PS3. As far as I remember, there was a developer version of the x360 with 1GB of RAM, but it is extremely difficult to find, and quite expensive.
I'm sure it could benefit emulators or applications. Im sure it would never benefit regular games that much. I will say though they have released tools since for patching games for using more ram. on top of that, with the 720p patches, the games run way better on 128mb. at the end of the day idc because id only ever use xbox for games and id use a PC CRT, not an LCD.
I like that the Xbox is becoming the Amiga of consoles. Neverending performance upgrades that don't have an immediate application, CPU upgrades / accelerators, memory expansions that weren't possible when the machine was new, it's fantastic.
Where this modification will really shine is in improving the performance of current emulators that run on the original xbox. More RAM = more space to load ROMs into for a smoother performance. But they would have to each be modified to take advantage of the extra RAM.
@@fenriswolfretro6729 with more ram you can use HD TEXTURES on HalfLife2 at 720p ok the original Xbox... Or increase the VIEW DISTANCE on games like Morrowind, making the xbox looks like a 360 in graphics.
Gotta appreciate the continued efforts to refuse to let this console die. The chips should come pre-bent though imo. Just to ensure a safe and consistent install.
3 месяца назад
I legit misheard "Prehistoricman" to "PrehistoricNAND"
Could you imagine the possibilities with a 1.4ghz processor upgrade and 256mb of ram on an original xbox? Holy smokes! I bet if there was a proper bios for something like that, it would be able to do alot more.
Exactly because the stock cpu is 700mhz with 128mb cache and the tualatin 1.1 to 1.4 are 512k cache and faster speed. A faster ram like that could help emulators for shure :p
I don't get the whole excitement over making a console slightly faster. Still disgustingly low res, quality, fps everything. I guess fun but not really playable. I'm at 4k 144hz and I want more.
@@xpodx sure it isn't 4k, but higher resolution videos do play back better and emulators run better in most instances. Also, the potential of running other Operating Systems on it like React OS could be much faster/better performing
@@xpodx you most certainly can on many different devices...but I still consider the original Xbox an absolute beast at emulation. I can also run DIVX videos near 1080p off of a blu-ray rip and it looks pretty damn sharp on my 4k TV and very close to Blu-Ray quality with little to no artifacts or pixelation running at full speed on my 1.4ghz 128mb OG XBOX. My other modded stock OG XBOX stutters so bad that the same video it is unwatchable. The video resolution source you are ripping from to reconvert to the right compressed video file encoding type makes a huge difference.
Maybe if this mod came out 20 years ago it would have some real potential, at least for making a better homebrew/media center Xbox, but can't imagine any developers doing anything with this in 2024.
It did, right along with the 1.3Ghz PIII mod. The difference was you either scraped the Chips of a doner board, or you bought a batch of 'em to do it. Problem is after Twenty Years of NON PRODUCTION, supply finally went the way of the Dodo as they say. This update (To that Mod), address that last issue. As to what you'd use it for? That would likely. Be one of two things Sega Chihiro (i.e. Virtual Cop), or a full XBOX SDK environment. Again. Same today, as it was Twenty years ago.
You don't like the idea of using the Xbox as a classic Win98 & DOS PC?, I do, got to say, being able to just plug in an Xbox to my VGA monitor or CRT TV and firing up my favourite late 90s PC games sounds incredible, setting up a Win98 PC can be a little tedious, both from a hardware and software point of view, the OGXBOX literally has everything under the hood for complete 80s through to 2003 PC support, imagine not having to mess with drivers and settings, and turning retro PC gaming into a plug & play console experience, yes please on that for me, even Amiga OS could be run complete with MIDI and soundbanks audio compatibility.
Amazing? Yes. Practical? Not really. Dangerous to the health of your Xbox? Possibly. I mean, I can chop my hand off if I want to... but just because I can, doesn't mean it's a good idea. 😂
@@another3997it’s a step forward is how I look at it eventually we might find a way on some consoles to upgrade hardware and keep the functionality at better frame rates and or resolutions
@@BlueEyedVibeChecker @BlueEyedVibeChecker Since your body does not process food at over 100% efficiency, (literally impossible) you'd actually be using up more energy though blood loss and digestion processing cost. So, not a good idea but on the argument of freedom of choice, it still makes sense.
Their clear green xboxes were very cool, really the most appealing console at launch considering it was playing pc games that needed systems that cost three times as much as an xbox.
The thing to do here is to start with 2 working unmodded original Xboxes. Take the RAM chips out of one, and put them in the other, making that one a 128 MB mod; then put these chips in the other Xbox, making it a 256 MB mod. No waste.
@@England91 that's actual the method on a v1.6 motherboard, but on v1.0-1.5 motherboards there are 4 unpopulated sets of RAM solder pads, you just need to solder the 4 RAM chips from the donor board into those 4 slots to do the 128 MB RAM upgrade. After that it's just a matter of having firmware capable of utilizing the RAM.
Amazing video as always! Along with the ModXO modchip this is probably the best modded XBox on earth. The only thing missing would be the replacement of the processor for the 1GHz that Retro Renegade Repairs made. Great content Tito!
@@ffviifakeremake9997 imagine if we could tap into the motherboards chipset to add another IDE channel so that the DVD drive and Hard Disk can be ont heir own IDE controllers (and allow SSD upgrades to run at full speed while the DVD drive is being accessed) Also PCI would be interesting but I doubt that could be done like my idea for another IDE Controler
@@nekomasteryoutube3232 You never know man... Most of these mods were just a dream at some point and look how far the modding scene has gone. Maybe it's a matter of time? *crossing fingers*
Having two games run at the same time would be useful for a quick resume fucntion, while the suspended game can be partially unloaded to allow for the main game to take up more resources, having a quick resume function would allow you to swap between games quickly. Not very useful in practice, but a neat function all the same.
This is pretty cool, one thing is for worth thinking about, it could open up allot of possibility's for the home brew community with PC ports ETC. I will probably stick with my 128mb build for the foreseeable future, but I will be keeping a close eye on this project. I know JCRocky5 has been moving in this direction with his softmod, I think he has even considered 512mb support. It's crazy that even after this console has past the 2 decade mark, it still has such an active community.
Hoping this sparks some interest back into the modding scene to have someone patch software to add an option to tweak variable ram usage so the system itself can determine (equivalent of adjustable bar like more modern pc systems today) the ideal amount of ram as well as manual slider option for tweakers to get the ultimate setup.
a 3D printed template of some sort for bending the pins would be cool. Create mounting holes on the PCB that lock in to pins on the template. The template would have beveled edges to press the "legs" onto with a length of firm plastic.
Thank you for this video. I am going to dust off my Crystal Xbox and do this at some point. At around the 9:00 mark. If you prep the motherboard pads with a thin coat of solder before tacking the chip, the chip installation will go easier. I would have prepped the pads, added more flux, then tacked a few pins as you did. I would hot air this into place only because I have a board pre-heater. I get why you did it how you did. I'd have drag-soldered it too without a board heater , just with the pad prep steps I mentioned earlier. Great job all round. Subbed! For context, micro-soldering has been my job since 1989. PS. My Crystal Xbox is my Guinea pig machine. Anything that proves good on that makes it's way into my green machine..
This mod could really help emulators specially N64, if i remember correctly there is a memory problem when cartridge games are to big for 64mb so the emulator store some files in the HDD slowering the overal performance.
In fact the interposer pins should be shorter than the original 2001 ram chips. That allows to solder the pins without the need to bend them too much or the interposer could be designed with the pins on the pcb and that could help to solder on a 90° inclination
Using a modified xblast chip would allow you to test each memory module one at a time installing it. Refer to Modzville's xblast videos. Popping all 4 chips off and roux chambeau'ing the install of 8 and assuming you'd get them right on the first shot is ambitious. What should be done is remove each stock chip one at a time testing functionality of each in xblast. Replacing them in order, then proceeding to the empty slots. Another thing not covered was emulation and 3rd party software. This is known to have significant performance leaps with a 128mb console. Its also worth noting that module stacking has existed.
this opens the door up to kickass Morrowind modding. Between cpu upgrades, the ability to overclock the front bus (which got several of my OG's to over 800mhz), and the large amount of ram, homebrew just got a kick in the ass to pave the way to more fun weekends!!
At this point we might as well go all in with a custom mobo running a modded Xbox BIOS. There must be a surplus of older CPUs and GPUs out there with similar architectures like Core2Duo and certain Nvidia GPUs that we could plop onto said board with a skt775 DDR2 memory controller and a GB or 2 of RAM
That would probably do more for Ops 1fps YooTube at 8k woes. Least we forget the XBOX basically had a gForce 2GTS Chip inside it. Which was already old by the time they put it there.
@@Ichijoe2112 The NV2A is basically a GeForce 3.5, closer to a GF4 which is a powerful GPU relative to its generation, it is more than enough for games of that era, especially considering that GPU was designed with 1024x768p to 1280x960p in mind, and the OGXB only needs to render @ 240p-480p, add to that almost zero OS overheads, fixed hardware optimizations and the bare-metal API, you could say it squeezes at least 50% more performance vs its desktop equivalent. It's just starved of RAM, unfortunately.
i would love to see someone like Modern Vintage Gamer chime in on things dealing with this ram, as he wrote the N64 emulator and some others on the Xbox, and the ram could be put to better use as shared VRAM with a rewritten BIOS and Kernel ie not just replacing a dashboard, but rewriting the implementation of binary executables like heavier emulators and DosBox or other ways to run things on it, like say a VM environment to let one boot OLDER operating systems like Windows 98 so one could run older PC games with the addition of a Keyboard and Mouse. Linux would be easy, as one could simply port a low-footprint distro like a 32 bit Puppy Linux version but built with modern 32 bit packages from Debian, for example. You could make it into a server for things like Insignia, with the extra ram being there to host other players on private games. Im suspecting with how the performance with the 8k video that cut to 1/4 ie 1080p one could possibly get the hardware to run that level of video using the extra memory as Vram. As well, Texture upgrade packs and upscaled ports could also be a thing, BUT pair this upgrade with a better CPU like the upgrades that can be done now to double that CPU speed and you could really have something there!!!
The PCB design is really nice! Would be really cool if you could add higher storage ram modules. Like a 512mb chip to the PCB. End up with 4gb of RAM haha
@@DavitTheCore you can overclock every original Xbox to 900mhz fsb 133 to 166 the max of the XBOX Nforce2 chip, and HalfLife2 runs flawless even in 720p with 128mb ram... But with 256mb you can USE HD TEXTURES on HalfLife2 like the PC... the only that the XBOX port lacks, it uses SD textures because of the low ram.
@@SargentoDuke I guess that could very well work! I'm not sure the end result would be as good as a Pentium 3 modded Xbox (just like shown by modern vintage gamer).
Wouldn't this be a good alternative to do the 128 MB RAM upgrades for Xboxes that are 1.6 motherboards? Since they only have four slots because this would work better versus trying to double stack RAM?
Been thinking about this a bit lol. Using flat flex like that is not ideal. I'd suggest castellated terminations for the next interposer revision. The connections would be more secure and the extra real estate can be used to address some of the issues regarding the RAM timings!
@@jdownj That very well could be a problem. I know it's possible because I've seen fine pitch castellations, but they were on ITAR regulated assemblies.
@@Sun-ut9gr that brings up an interesting point. I have no idea if PCB technology is regulated in any way… BUT the board manufacturers that can work down to that small are probably busy doing stuff that is more profitable for them than a hobbyist project like this…
Nothing useful. Each home-brew app, each game must be modified to utilize additional RAM. As there are no devs working on software patches and the mod itself is not trivial, it will never gain meaningful user-base. One day you may see some random game patched, or some app with 256mb support released, but that's it.
almost 20 minute video and you're not gonna show any games running with the ram upgrade? not gonna show 720p video playing on it at full speed? what a waste of time.
720p needs a CPU upgrade to run... or overclock the stock CPU to 900mhz, or change the CPU to 1ghz or more with a 370 interpoder, that is WAY MORE COMPLICATED THAN THIS RAM UPGRADE, having a new ram modules that are DDR2 adapted for the original xbox is awesome, as its a "new part" not like the CPU that are "limited old hardware". Anyway, all XBOX can run at 900mhz even 1ghz from stock, overclocking by software. There are no patches for use that ram, but for example games like MORROWIND you can use 256mb de ram to increase the VIEW DISTANCE.
So we have a mod now for both a faster processer and more Ram for less faster loading and less crashes. Just something as a console gamer that throws me off since I am very old school.
Which is exactly what he said in the video... but he also said, there's nothing that can take advantage of the extra RAM at this time. I guess listening and comprehension aren't your strong points. 😆
God, the OG Xbox community has never stopped progressing at all. Never died, never slumped. I wish I could say the same for other beloved consoles, but truthfully most console scenes go dead for awhile, like the PS3 community currently. And some consoles have yet to have a vibrant homebrew and modding community, like fact the Neo Geo Pocket Color has no modding or homebrew development aside from IPS and flash cart mods. Makes me wonder what exactly keeps the OG Xbox community still thriving.
Xecuter made a bios that supports extra ram. I used the extra ram to play certain MAME roms that required the extra ram. I have a working bios for 128MB ram if you want it.
always love to see your vids on new life being brought to the xbox... ive been a fiend for the xbox since 2002 and still play on my childhood 1.0 model regularly! ive even opened it up a few times to fix the dvd drive and replace that pesky clock cap...... keep up the good work!!!
These interposers are quite cool and definitely have applications outside of xbox upgrades. Many retro devices using that the SGram or SDram package type could possibly take advantage of them. Retro graphics cards for example.
I've seen similar mod for Switch. Soldering new NAND and RAM chips, which actually affects game performance and useful in other OS's and emulators it can run. Insanely difficult as chips are way smaller, but super impressive.
Morrowind would run worlds better with more RAM. Once you start taking items and moving them around the world, the game would eventually freeze after only five minutes of play. It runs perfectly on the Series X, with no slowdown or freezing issues.
Excellent video and exciting topic. I heard about a CPU mod a while ago. It consists in replacing the original 733 Mhz CPU with a 1.4 GHz. According to what I could see, this CPU upgrade would require the 128MB RAM upgrade (or use a Debug Kit or Dev Kit XBOX since both have 128MB installed by default) as the new CPU performs much better with that amount of RAM rather than just 64. I wonder if this CPU upgrade could be considered as a complementary project to this 256MB RAM upgrade.
I remember people doing this a few years back by stacking the original ram modules on top of each other, so even this is a far easier install comparatively. Would love to see where this project ends up once a bios is built to really utilize it as well as some game mods to hopefully make use of it
Damn, I watched this video and saw your sub count is at 255K, woulda been truly insane if it was magically at 256K for this video, like poetic almost haha, oh well!!...
Thief Deadly Shadows had the levels cut in half with loading zones because the OG Xbox RAM was so low. On the PC version there is a mod to remove the loading zones completely, hypothetically if you mod the BIOS to see the RAM the PC mod could be ported to the XBox version.
With this upgrade, there is a good point to it other than the basic "because we can" motive. It means we technically have a Developers XBOX as those Xbox's had a RAM Expansion to Develop Xbox Games on. Which also means, any games dumped by an Xbox Dev Kit can be played on consoles with that extra RAM Expansion; particularly, games like the fabled "Starcraft: Ghost" or the different builds of "Fable" or anything Rare Ware was working on before moving onto the Xbox 360. There are those looking to figure out how to make their own games for this generation of consoles, as there are living communities messing around with the Dreamcast, N64 and PS1 to make their own games on. While I haven't heard a whole lot of news involving the PS1 Scene, The N64 has exploded with Banjo Kazooie Mods, Mario 64, Legend of Zelda online and someone trying to make their own platformer though I won't believe it until I start seeing screenshots, and SUPER MARIO MAKER 64 3D with a Working online level thing. Dreamcast slowly, but surely, get's a slog of updates now and then on different shooters published for it and there is a passionate online Community that has taken the LIVE marketing gimmic Xbox was known for and call themselves "Dreamcast Live" where the host Dreamcast Game Servers for various titles while just re-directing games like Unreal tournament and Quake to other Server lists that were populated and still work since the day they were created back in 1999-2002. I also know Insignia is keeping the OG Xbox Running it's online games and people have been waiting for and are now playing HALO online and the AAA industry is castrating itself that everyone in the indie scene is getting their games out there to be noticed and pick up on the market and with this mod, providing someone has setup an environment to code and develop a game, could start making XBOX title's for the OG console; which might be easier to approach than NES, SNES, Genesis, N64 etc. Mostly because we know the graphical drivers the Xbox uses, Direct X, and the machine is basically in a rough sense, a Windows Computer operating on different rules. I'm willing to wager somewhere left over on the internet is some dumped documentation we can work from and if not, there are folks who know how to work with it; will start making games for it at some point.
this isn't the first 256 mod u could place 16 chips on top of each other, but i am glad to see this as its a more fordable and less hassle way to do upgrades these days.
It’s cool to have more RAM but it only benefits homebrew apps at the moment. But at least you can be future-proof for something like a potential modded BIOS that can improve official game performance. For now, I am waiting for the ultimate end-game mod to play my “legally purchased” game backups
At this point in time, one can literally turn their old OG Xbox into a *kinda* Gaming PC thanks to how many softmods and hardware mods there are by now. The library is so extensive and thanks to the preservation of Xbox Live done by the community, someone could spend a good while gaming only on this Xbox.
The original xbox is amazing, as much as i want to see solid emulators the love here is astonishing. Heres to the ps2,dreamcast and xbox the last bastion of modded consoles
