Amazing how you put all of this detail together with such clarity and compassion. Truly tragic events and over 100 years later you have taken us all straight back there, trackside on that fateful day. Hats off, you did the victims proud once again.
Wow! The way you worded that has really plucked my heartstrings! Thank you! I really mean that, thank YOU! It’s times like this that really put it all into perspective and encourage me to carry on and get better and better. It’s people like your good self that make it all worthwhile. Thank you again! 👍🏻😇
DISCLAIMER: The images used in this video are for illustrative purposes only. They are not meant to accurately depict every single point being made or explained but are the best representation of them, given my limited resources. Please keep this in mind before commenting. Apologies for the couple of repetitions in the audio! For some reason, when I recorded the voiceover, I just couldn’t get in the zone and needed to go back SEVERAL times and edit out mistakes, it appears a couple have slipped through the net! My sincere apologies. Chalk it up to a glitch in the Matrix…or just your faithful narrator being a crap editor! 😂
I've always found this a very very hard watch .. I find myself not able to watch in one go and have to switched over and then go bk to it . Maybe its the same for ... its odd how the brain can behave at times . Rip to all those who died . 💔 x
Another "butterfly effect" of this was, the 1st Newfoundland Regiment being assigned to the 29th Division to replace the Leith Battalion, becoming the only North American regiment at Gallipoli. This also meant they went over the top on the first day of the Battle of the Somme. 801 men went over the top, and only 68 answered roll call the next day. This loss of "the brightest and best" of a generation, combined with other factors lead Newfoundland to join Canada in 1949.
I've let tours to the Somme and a visit to Newfoundland Park is a most moving experience. The Newfoundlanders had to advance from the British reserve trenches and over the front line trench to even get into action, then into No Man's Land and to the Danger Tree. I trained on the Vickers Machine Gun many years ago and if you look at the ground from the German lines you can see the superb fields of fire they had (the must really have thought God was on their side). The next day Col Haddo, the CO, had the survivors and those who hadn't gone over the top - clerks, cooks, etc on parade. That was trauma counselling 1916 style. The attack was actually launched because the Divisional Commander saw white flares coming up from the German lines, the success signal that the leading waves had captured their objectives. Unfortunately it was also the signal the German's used to get their defensive artillery fire to lengthen range.
Lifelong Railroad enthusiast, and former volunteer at a regional railroad museum in South Carolina. Excellent presentation, and when I used to lead our yearly re-certification on our museum railways train crews, I told everyone that Rulebooks are not written in ink...theyre written in the blood of those who died or who were maimed in accidents. I was told this, as a very young person, by a senior Engineer on Southern Railway system.
Yet another masterpiece, thanks. I was a Railway Signalman myself during the 1970s-80s, so I find it fascinating. Virtually all developments and improvements come about from lessons learned after disasters and mishaps on railways. I worked nine or ten boxes and crossings, and all of the old traditional lever type. Sadly, they have all been demolished, with no regard for heritage.
We have always been far too quick to delete our railway history. HS2 is a perfect example! If they hadn’t have closed the old Great Central line, HS2 wouldn’t have been needed at all!
@@DiD86 Yes, I don't understand why they closed it. It seems that the country were railways began, and once played such a large part of Transport has just left it all behind and we are now facing the consequences; of congestion etc. It has to be said that Tory Governments have always preferred Road over Rail. And Private over Public owned. One major improvement came, which reduced the death and injury toll in crashes. This was the change in carriage design, and materials used, from wood, and gas-lighting. This older design also folded up, causing horrible leg injuries. So later, they were built similar to aircraft designs, with metal tubular shapes;, which would protect passengers more. And the lighting came from electric, not gas. They couldn't prevent crashes, but as above, death and injuries were greatly reduced.
The ‘asking to be shot’ & carrying it out are both well attested in history. I grew up in house of WW2 vets; the uncle I shared a room with had deliberately killed a mate in response to his request (during the loss of the Hellas). The PTSD from this was worse than combat experiences from middle east, north Africa, New Guinea. He never stopped reliving that event.
Apparently one of the survivors who was discharged was a man called Charles 'Charlie' Torr. He lost a couple of fingers, and suffered permanent brain damage and altered speech and memory. He was unfit for work and afterwards moved to Canada with his sister who continued to take care of him for the rest of his life. When asked about the crash, all he would say was 'Tea, two biscuits' over and over again. According to a fellow survivor who was either physically unscathed or suffered much less debilitating injuries, they'd just been served tea and biscuits before the troop train impacted the parley train st the crash site. He died some time after 1973.
Excellent video. I think the local branch of the Westtern Front Association raised funds for a memorial at, or near, the site. When they reached Gallipoli the battalion were involved in an attack and had about 30% casualties so overall they lost about three-quarters of their strength in their first few months of service. RIP to a lot of brave men.
This popped up on my home page as a recommended and as it was something in Britain and not just a 10 minute clip I decided to watch it. Very glad I did. A brilliantly narrated and researched documentary. I found the narration very honest, respectful and down to earth. I just subscribed so this channel just got itself a 51 year old woman as a new viewer and I strongly suspect my husband will like this channel too 👍👍 Off topic I know, but I had to smile at the end when Kidderminster was mentioned. I live in Bristol now but originally came from Wolverhampton and whenever we went on a family outing, we always seemed to go through Kiddi, as we called it, so as adults both me and my sister always joked that no matter where we were going, North, East, South or West, we had to go through Kiddi since it was the centre of the universe... Dad, was like a homing pigeon but part of that homing beacon was in Kiddi bless his cotton socks.
During World War One, Britain's railways were under the overall control of the Government's Railway Executive Committee. ROD- was the Railway Operating Division of the Royal Engineers which was formed in 1915 and ran railways overseas where the British Army was fighting- beginning in Belgium. The photo shown was a collection of locomotives repatriated back to the UK after the war had ended and seen at Tattenham Corner. These were engines built to the design of the Great Central O2 locomotives and some found their way to Australia.
This is one of the best videos on youtube I've seen on the subject of the Quintinshill Rail disaster, as no one else has mentioned the Caledonian Railway's poor regulations over the block back signalling, nor Tinsley's epilepsy. The fact that the Caledonian both hired their own coroner *and* cut and paste their own rulebook to absolve themselves of any culpability is, quite frankly, shocking. You are right in that James Tinsley bares much of his own responsibility, despite his condition, but I think we shouldn't ignore how he and George Hutchinson were made into scapegoats so a private rail company could get off the hook.
@@MysticMindAnalysis 200,000 years ago we were chattering apes. Forgive your species and yourself. Improve your future by doing better than the past. We all come equipped to do so. Cheers.
I first read about this incident many years ago, in Tom Rolt’s book “Red For Danger” (3rd edition, 1976,2nd impression, 1978). The account is in the chapter on signalmen’s errors. (Edited for spelling error)
Yes, that book should be mandated reading for people undertaking front line rail duties. If only it could be updated as well with more recent incidents that have brought about serious changes.
ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-XL_4VHxdXng.html Link to The Signalman. Might not work in some countries, if you have a VPN, set it to Australia, it definitely works from there!
One thing I’ve noticed since beginning this channel is that some videos are just slow burners. I uploaded my first ever video in September, it took until February for the views to run away with themselves. I’m content to bide my time. 😁
As my father was one to happily say, "Nothing is infallible, thanks to mankind." Reminder Collars seem to have been given quite an appropriate name. If the soldiers shot there injured & burning comrades I don't think it was callous. Compassionate maybe.
I don't usually comment on this lunkheads comments but I'll add this watching again just as enjoyable. Also look for some guy who reads "The Signalman" by Dickens. Called DiD or somesuch.
In the late 1980s I lived in Dumfries and knew an elderly gentleman who at the time of this disaster was a child living on one of the farms nearby, his father being a farm servant. His abiding memory, he told me, was of the hordes of sightseers who flocked there to rubber neck, even to take souvenirs! In spite of the location’s relative isolation they arrived by every conveyance possible. The photo used here, both at the beginning and the end, shows two women on bicycles doing just this. Apparently so great were the numbers that they impeded actual rescuers, nurses and doctors etc from reaching the place.
I started on the footplate in 1980 and regularly worked through Quintinshill to Carlisle from Edinburgh. Even then when there were engineering works at Quintinshill, particularly involving a ballast cleaning machine, cap badges and buttons would turn up in the spoil wagons.
I really enjoyed this video. I wonder though if you are aware of how many black screens show up in this video? Also as was pointed out in another comment there was at least two places where you repeat.
Yes, sometimes there just isn’t a perfect pic to illustrate every point, although I could have just stayed within the previous one, I guess. Think of it more as a podcast with pictures to aid with visualisation, rather than a full-on doc. The repetitions were an editing error. I think I was a little too excited to get it posted that I didn’t proof watch it first! 🤦🏻♂️
It is nice to see this as the person doing the narration Has.got all the facts right Well done Someone should do statistics On how many people get killed And why on the roads
The basement under Carlisle station was used as a makeshift morgue due to the overwhelming number of bodies, the area is off limits to the general public now but I have spent many nights in Carlisle station and have been down there during the night, and although theres nothing down there now, it used to be old offices and storage rooms and it is incredibly eerie when down there alone. On windy nights it howls through the alcoves and old rooms. Its said that you can sometimes hear screams and moans of the men who succumbed in the crash. I've only had one strange experience at Carlisle. I seen a dark figure disappear through a wall one night after glancing up after movement caught the corner of my eye. After going outside onto the platforms to look around there was absolutely nothing there and no sound of footsteps etc. Was on edge the rest of the night.
@@DiD86 Carlisle station is big and has a hidden area underneath it away from the public gaze, other than the public subway theres nothing to see for any travellers using, it just leads from the platforms to the car park. It does however take you past the doors to the basement though. Theres lots of stations on the BR network with basements that are not used. Perth is another example, very similar design to Carlisle, same company that built them I think. Edinburgh Waverley has 2 basements, the normal basement which has has offices and storage rooms and the lower basement which is a labyrinth of old tunnels that are only accessible with breathing apparatus on. If you've ever stood on the main concourse at Edinburgh Waverley you're standing directly above an old shooting range that was used for rail staff way before my time.
Interesting stuff! I’d love to explore them! I love all that stuff! You never know what goodies are there to be found. Being a railway enthusiast as I am, makes it all the better!
Exceptionally well done. Makes the book on the subject come to life. Would love to see a video on the rail accident when a train on the overpass (flyover??) collapsed on the train below. Can't remember the year or city in England.
I think you maybe recalling the Lewisham rail crash of 4th Dec 1957; when an electric unit that had stopped at a signal was run into by a steam hauled express to Ramsgate. The result of the collision brought the flyover down onto the express with many lives lost!
I’m assuming the parliamentary train would have been within the Clearing Point of the Up Main home signal? If not, then blocking back surely would be unnecessary anyway. Though I’m not sure if Clearing Points were a thing in 1915! If not, then accepting the train surely wasn’t the issue. He could have accepted it and had it sat at the home signal until the Parli was moved back to the Down. Either way, I’m remarkably grateful that we now have track circuits. Would’ve saved all of this.
I don’t profess to be a signalling expert, although a massive train buff, so I won’t say I know the answer to that one. Realistically, it’s the troop train that scuppers the plans. Because they were mandatory priority, Tinsley knew he had to let it go on through. However, if he had held it until the DOWN late-running expresses had passed and then called the Parli on to rejoin the DOWN main, nothing would have been amiss. Yes, he may have gotten a bit of a bollocking for holding a troop train but realistically, he had no other choice and I’m sure his gaffers would have seen the predicament. Totally agree on the track circuit point. But then again, correct use of reminder appliances could have been just as effective, had both men used them. Arrogance, forgetfulness & slackness killed those people that day. It’s a damned disgrace on both Meakin & Tinsley. Thanks for watching. I really appreciate it, and for taking the time to comment. 👍🏻😇
I was a railway signalman for 30 yrs working box's from lever frame and semaphore signals with absolute block to the modern track circuit with colour light signals within the modern IECCs ...... ending my career as signalling manager training signallers within the iecc set up. The book "Red for Danger" was always an essential read for those who took signalling or train driving seriously. But as for Neil Oliver the guy is a clever idiot no different from David Icke.
I’m no fan of Neil Oliver at all. Hated him since the Coast programme he used to do. He always sounded REALLY patronising, like he was talking to a child. And yes, Red For Danger, essential reading for any railway worker or enthusiast!
Red for Danger was my introduction to this catastrophic event. Not sure about Neil Oliver, and although many can't tolerate David Icke, he has been right on so many issues, long before they occurred....
It has always been the case that no matter how potentially dangerous a job - or situation - is, familiarity breeds contempt of the dangers and people start to get lazy or careless and cut safety corners.
I was in charge of builders carrying out station refurbishments. Working at Barnstable station my PICOP had taken Possession of the track to carry out works to the platform wall. Men we’re on the tracks working on the wall when a train came through our station and on our track where I had workmen working. All hell broke loose with rail-track investigators suggesting it was our fault and wanted to sack everyone, that was until all our documents were checked and verified to be correct. My PICOP had done his job 100% correctly, the signal man had not, he had let the train through that could have killed a dozen men, fortunately nobody was injured, we all were commended for carrying out our possession correctly but as I remember the signalman lost his job. It is a very dangerous environment to be working, very strict training had be passed. But I could write a best selling book about my years working in south England area at major stations etc. Turn your hair grey.
A northbound express was making limited stops from London to Glasgow, and being double headed by two engines. Number 140 of the Dunalstair 4 Class, and number 48 of the 43 class. And both were 4-4-0s.
A northbound freight train was standing on the northbound loop to make way for a local passenger train, making all stops from Carlisle to Beattock, and led by Cardean Class 4-6-0 No. 907.
we should also not forget that at the time, health care and system did not know as much as they do today, and i must say that i am a bit surprised by people thought that you are safe anywhere, the most accident happent´s at home
"Knowledge like this is what comes from being a train geek. I do not apologise." 🏅🤣💜 On the impossibility that I wasn't already thoroughly impressed with this video, you won a fan with that phrase 😁
that happend to a mate of mine while we worked for great western trains he was found out to have colour blindness and was switched to train cleaning job in Swansea
@@garethmatthews7939 my dad was a driver for many years and he got finished on medical grounds due to a clot in the back of his eye that was distorting his vision. Anything like that, and you have to be straight off the footplate. Thankfully, the railway looked after him and made sure he left with a very handsome golden handshake, which was good of them.
@@NoWayMrBobby it was a creative decision to save on editing time. I don’t do it anymore as I realised it wasn’t a great look. I’m glad you enjoyed it, nonetheless.
Perhaps a few decided to take the opportunity to get out. There's a decent amount of time between an eager naïve young lad enlisting and his actual deployment. Many lads joined because their mates did, reminiscent of that old "If your friends jumped off a cliff, would you?" Doubtless, a few probably had a few reservations about the whole getting blown up by turks aspect of their war, some may have learned of the horrors while training, these lads may have opted to slip away in the chaos. That would explain some of the missing however, a few sensible lads avoiding a rich-mans clusterfuck can't account for all the missing.
A southbound troop train was carrying the 7th battalion of the Royal Scots, and was being led by 139 Class 4-4-0 number 121, and was also coming right behind the coal train.
Very interesting. My Gt Uncle Willy Stewart was killed in this disaster, whilst my Gt Uncle Jock McConnell survived. Willy was killed trying to rescue his comrades, his body was never identified. Jock later survived being shot at the Battle Of Cambrai. Brave souls ❤
the jerico trains were wagons coming down from south wales full of welsh coal and the ups were the reurning empties has the rn only used welsh coal has it gave off pure white smoke. The fires were caused by gas lighting on the coaches
Corporal USMC here. I wonder if the survivors ever thought "they had it lucky that day". Referring to the troops who died, shot or dismissed from service after amputation. The amputated in my opinion where the lucky ones. Didn't see friends brown apart or shot. No shell shock from constant bombardment. Lucky maybe...
Yeah, I’d put a pinned comment about when I realised. I am able to do some after thought editing via YT studio, so I might try trimming those mistakes.
The carriages in the troop train were not older stock as you describe. The photos of the burning carriage show an almost new vehicle with six-wheel bogies, at the time pretty much state of the art for a main line carriage for express passenger services. Similar vehicles built by the Caledonian Railway, converted to electric lighting, were still in service up to the mid 1950s. The horrifying inferno after the crash was caused by the ignition of gas escaping from ruptured gas tanks in a vehicle with a wooden body. Quintinshill happened in an era when potentially stronger and safer electric light and all-steel bodied vehicles were in their infancy. The technology to build much stronger and safer all-steel carriages with electric light did exist because many early electric commuter trains from the same era had steel bodies with electric light, but it was not universally adopted for main line railway carriages in the UK until the 1950s, by British Railways. I don't know why this was. Cost considerations, maybe? An accurate and well-informed account of the accident, however, particularly regarding the actions of the signalmen.
The photo you refer to shows one of the sleeping cars in the Glasgow express. The accident report includes a full list of the vehicles in the troop train, which were mostly Great Central gaslit 6-wheelers.
@@KOE530E OK, my source was not comprehensive on which vehicles were in which train. It would be interesting to know what GC six-wheelers were doing on that train, but it was wartime and the train marshallers would have used whatever was available. I don't suppose GC sheds would worried too much about some of their old six-wheelers being off their patch.
A really good description of the disaster, but have to disagree with you about the impossibility of sending the Blocking Back signal after the arrival of the Up coal empties. The regulations as quoted in the accident report specifically stated that if, “after the passing of one train……it is necessary to obstruct the line inside the home signal by allowing vehicles or a train to be crossed from one line to another….the Blocking Back signal must…….be given to the signal box in rear”. The signalman at Kirkpatrick had no need to know why the blocking back signal had been sent, just that the line was still not clear after Train out of Section had been given for the coal train, and that he could therefore not offer another train until the obstruction had been removed. The fact that the local train was actually occupying the Up Main line before the coal train arrived is irrelevant - the line was not clear and the Blocking Back signal should have been sent to inform Kirkpatrick of that fact.
as a footnote, 'Parliamentary trains ' were required byAct of parliament. As a condition of granting private railway companies a monolopy by way of their respective Acts of Parliament which let them build the railroad in the first place. It obliged them to provide transport to all at the rate of a penny per mile, on a certain number of trains per day. An obligation in Law which they did their best to honour only in the breach of the intended purpose
The Germans (and Turks?) probably had a good, long, loud laugh when they heard about this accident. Those soldiers killed might've died at Gallipoli anyway, but their deaths might've proved to be a little more useful. (Well actually, maybe not, given the eventual withdraw and defeat there.)
I can't remember which accident it was: (Long time ago!) Site: a dense points system. The weakness: one set of points was unguarded for 1.9 seconds in a singular set of circumstances. The signalman reach over end pulled the wrong lever. (A miniature lever.) The resulting 1.6 second action, fitted within the 1.9 second and a crash resulted.
This sounds like the accident at Hull Paragon station on 14th February 1927. If I remember rightly the signaller reset a signal sooner than he should have done then pulled the wrong lever.
@@DiD86 cool my gradad was there he had to go to London for a car part for a customer it was the cheapest plece to get it, besides he likes driving on the M1.
Another perhaps even more tragic disaster for soldiers of the Great War, but at sea rather than on land, was the wrecking of the Admiralty Yacht Iolaire in 1919. Perhaps you have already thought of covering this?
Baffling that experienced railwaymen in the box didn't question Tinsley's acceptance of the troop train. As for the Blocking Back Tinsley SHOULD have sent, why would it have confused Kirkpatrick ? The BB is sent to tell the box in rear that the UP clearing point at Quintinshill is obstructed or occupied so do not send an Is Line Clear . Tinsley should have sent TOS for the coal wagon but kept the UP block at TOL then sent the BB bell code. That he didn't is undoubted gross negligence, as for the laughable sentences, I wondered if these two incompetent dolts slept at night ?
The rules stated the blocking back signal must be sent before the move is commenced. I don’t think it would have made the slightest difference to be honest but realistically, it still feel to Tinsley as he still was the one who accepted the offered troop train regardless of any other issue. In all, I think the blocking back signal is somewhat inconsequential in the grand scheme. He did not have to accept the train and kept the line locked at TOL as you described but he did.
One point not always mentioned, is that the compartment doors of troop trains were routinely locked in transit, to prevent any unscheduled disembarkation at station stops, on-train lavatories being mostly unavailable . This above all, accounts for the horrendous death toll, and the inability of those trapped to escape, although of course, many of the doors could well have been jammed by the impact as well. I'd be interested to know whether this practice was discontinued after Quintinshill.
The two selfish careless git signalmen that caused this horrific crash should’ve got ten years in my book. Not only did they receive paltry sentences, but they were even reemployed by the railway on being released from prison! What a slap-in-the-face that must’ve been to the families of the dead. Not a lot different to the 21st century really!
Great piece of storytelling but you should keep images on-screen rather than going to black. I found the flash of an image then going to black whilst the commentary continued very annoying.
I woke up 07:20am Clapham Junction. I heard a bang. Then 30mns later. Dee naaa deee naaa etc that was the sound of fire brigade in those days. I lived less then half a mile away. The accident happened in a railway cutting. But the BANG was loud. . 92 paying customers died and 200 people were seriously injured. It took ! British rail. ( yes it was BR then ) years and years to admit they were at fault . And the Victims were paid a pittance
Just editing mistakes on my part. Sometimes I need to re-read certain sentences if I got my words muddled and unfortunately, I somehow missed a couple of those re-reads. Apologies. 😇
Can anyone explain to me, why southbound is UP and northbound is DOWN?? I mean, I'm sure there's a perfectly good reason for it, I just cant figure it out.
Ironically, had these men been British military officers and made a similar mistake in action, they would have been promoted to field marshals, awarded the Order of Bath, and had epic poems written about their heroism. (cf. Lieutenant General George Bingham, 3rd Earl of Lucan)
Not able to get up for work usually means excessive drinking the night before so I have observed rather than some neurological problem, it also explains the lack of concentration on the job in hand equally well.
It's weird that there was conspiracy shrouding this incident. Because when you were speaking about the soilders shooting the ones burning, none of that made sense. Even in the depths of a warzone you'd try to minimize loss so it just rang fishy that would be done that followed by their forced silence makes me really wonder what the real story was.
The officers would have been carrying their pistols. and there was a platoon of armed soldiers travelling in the last carriage to guard the ammunition which was in the rear van- both these vehicles survived undamaged. Troops and civilian staff from the nearby Gretna Explosives Works also arrived very quickly at the scene with tools and a fire engine.
Bollocks, when was the last major rail crash in the UK that resulted in hundreds of deaths due to 'shit' signalling? Railway signalling is safer now that it ever has been, and it will continue to improve as technology advances.
