Yeah I enjoy watching you videos but disagree completely with the eldritch knight. The cantrips you use are booming blade and green flame blade then you get to make a bonus action attack. If you want a spell from a different school then you can take them at certain levels. Plus I have played one more than once and a fighter up close with heavy armor and a shield being able to cast shield is an unstoppable force on the battle field,
sum body battle master does do more damage earlier on but how do you say it becomes irrelevant at level 11 that is the stupidest thing you can say. At 11th level it gets more even better dealing regular damage plus 2d8 thunder damage then 3d8 if the target moves. So it sets up perfectly for polearm master. Same with green flame blade plus doing damage to a creature next to your target. Now the battle master is one of the best I completely agree but couldn’t disagree more with the Samurai the fact there fighting spirit only recharges on a long rest and at 10th level you may only have it once a combat one hit from booming blade will do more damage than your 10 temp hp but at least you will have elegant courtier to talk the Eldritch Knight from killing you and even with your one round of advantage in attacks trying to get past a full plate Eldritch Knight casting shield plus casting spells and you having disadvantage on saves when he does hit you.
Plus The Eldritch Knight isn't really meant to take damaging spells. Shield and Absorb Elements are gonna be huge boons for the Eldritch Knight. He was also wrong about the kinds of spells Eldritch Knights can take. They have a limited number they can take from schools that aren't Abjuration or Evocation. For example. They could Take Shadow Blade and Find Familiar. So you could have a 2d8 Shadow Blade which will stack with extra d8s from Shadow Blade. So lets say you're 7th level eldritch Knight. In one round you could do. Shaodowblade 2d8+ Booming Blade 1d8+ Shadowblade 2d8. +your strength modifier twice
@@miguelgonsalves6161 I know I'm late but the strenght is added because is making two weapons attacks. (One with booming blade and one as a bonus action)
@@Mavarok284 At level 3 you can choose one spell that isn't abjuration or evocation. At levels 8, 14, and 20 you can choose a spell from any school of magic. In my opinion Haste and Mirror Image are particularly good on a fighter.
@@robertochacon5338 That would also be effective, but you wouldn't get as many ability score improvements, and you wouldn't get action surge or eventually get 4 attacks.
Eldritch knights can just pick spells that don’t give saving throws. Eldritch Knights can use booming blade and then make an attack. Abjuration is probably the best school to get. Shield, Absorb Elements, Counterspell, Dispel Magic. Those are the spells all fighters want. Ignore the class features, and Eldritch Knight is just a fighter that can cast shield. This may not be exciting, but it is potent.
Not sure you understand how Eldrich Knight works. It's actually one of the strongest fighters if played correctly. It is NOT an evoker wizard, EK's don't cast fireball for damage. They're a fighter with spells. Having access to Abjuration spells lets them augment their survivability by a LOT, they're easily one of the most durable Fighter subclasses. Here is how I would objectively rank the classes in terms of overall power. 1: Battle Master (The best if played well) 2: Echo Knight (Damn good, but very tactical. New players might struggle to make it maximally effective) 3: Eldritch Knight (VERY strong, just don't use spells for offence, If you go STR > INT > CON you can get a decent spell save DC but spell casting progression is so far behind full casters you should only cast spells to buff / de-buff or offer utility. Leave damaging spells to the full caster classes. Having War Caster and a melee cantrip like GFB or Booming Blade is very strong for punishing enemy movement, and doesn't need any INT. 1st level spells should mainly be Shield, Absorb Elements. 2nd level Shadow Blade, and up-cast Magic Missle to break enemy concentration. 3rd level You want Haste, Counterspell. 4th Fire Shield, Ice Storm, and Banishment. Basically double down on what makes being a Fighter badass. DO NOT try to be a wizard, you will fail. It is important to note, that you basically get 1 spell known per tier of magic that is NOT Evocation or Abjuration. Choose wisely, and it will greatly affect your playstyle and power level.) 4: Samurai (One of the best archer classes in the game. NOTE: Samurai were traditionally archers first, and swordsmen only as a last resort) 4: Cavalier (My favorite, I would rank it higher IF comparing all level 20 characters, but most games never hit level 18, so the capstone isn't something you should count on) 6: Champion (Crits are nice... but this class is BORING AF. It's a 1 trick pony that is actually worse than a baseline Barbarian in every way. Srsly just play Barbarian) 7: Arcane Archer (Impotent, lazy class design) 8: Purple Dragon Knight (Functional, but weak overall, and a huge noob trap)
This is a far better list than the one in the video XD i could see the echo knight on top maybe or some other variations but this is completely correct otherwise.
Disagree about the Eldritch Knight. EK is actually quite a fun subclass to play. It is stronger than the Arcane Archer for sure and imo rivals the Samurai. (Personally, I don't think the level 3 skills offered by the Samurai help a fighter. The fighter should not be the face of the group so Persuasion/Performance are meh. The Elegant Courtier ability is likewise not as helpful to a fighter except for the proficiency in Wisdom saves, which is very good. But whether the Samurai is better than the Ek depends on DM and campaign. If flanking rules are used as I always use them, then the Samurai's main power is not as good. If you can easily gain advantage from other sources (such as a Familiar that helps or flanking then why play a Samurai?). First, it is easy to not need a higher Int than 14 until you get up to level 13 if you select the right spells. Plus, you'd be the perfect recipient of a Headband of Intellect. It's very easy and frankly wise to pick mostly abjuration spells and throw in a few level 2 evocation spells with saving throws that always do some amount of damage. For example, Absorb Elements, Shield, Find Familiar at level 3. A few damage dealing level 2 evocations, and then counterspell at level 13 and Haste at level 14. I'll admit that at certain levels, you lose a bit in damage due to extra attack at level 5 and 11 but only the amount equal to your GWM bonus for those extra attacks (if you hit). At level 7, the class leaps ahead by giving a bonus action attack when you use the cantrip. In fact, I'd say that EK then becomes stronger than many fighter subclasses from levels 7-10. That is, if you pick a two handed weapon and Great Weapon Master. Once you're at level 11 melee cantrips decline (due to multiple possible uses of GWM by other fighters). But the cantrips do leave you with additional options in combat depending on terrain, how movement and arrangement of pcs and npcs turn out, etc.
As for Battlemaster v Cavalier... it depends on what you are going for. The Cavalier is the better tank for sure. But unlike Cavalier, Battlemaster is not reserved specifically for Tanking. It is a much better damage dealing subclass than the Cavalier. In fact for straight damage dealing, even the Champion would surpass the Cavalier. So, it depends on what you want your character to do. Sometimes linear rankings like this do not work as well for certain classes and subclasses.
I again believe you need to state this in your opinion. All ranking videos have them ranked differently than you and I tend to believe ones more that seem to know more about the game mechanics. Eldritch knight is way stronger than you give it credit for and the bonus attack after the cantrip is practically made for green flame blade or booming blade. Besides most fighters pick either strength or dex then do not to much in the other one so it does not spread your stats to thin at all. Fighters also get more ASI than any other class in the game which allows them to increase stats regularly. Also in my opinion battle master and cavalier should be ranked over the echo knight which I do like but the other two have to many abilities for extra damage or control.
sum body the Samurai does not out damage any other fighter it does not apply more damage it gives advantage for a round of attacks and so little temp hp it doesn’t really help. Luckily though again since you continue to comment after me you can use your persuasion skill to keep the Eldritch Knight from killing you.
sum body it says gains advantage it seems you need to learn to read so that You can learn the rules and learn to play. If you could do math you could see all the damage output from the cantrip then attack on average adds up to more than your Samurai’s rounds with advantage. If you are not looking for ways to help gain advantage in your combats anyways you are not playing tactically. Which seems the only reason you would truly like the Samurai’s 3rd level ability. See in my posts that’s why I say it should be in your opinion if you believe samurai is a better subclass than the Eldritch Knight that is your opinion I completely disagree but that is why the game is fun. I do also believe that you responded to my comments first.
I know it's not a true fix, but I would suggest giving the Eldritch Knight another look through. It can cast shield, absorb elements, find familiar (you do get spells from any class, just not many), shadow blade, fireball, etc. Also, I didn't hear about the sword coast adverturer's guide cantrips. Yeah, wish booming blade and green flame blade were printed in other books, but a free d8 of fire or thunder damage plus potentially more in good situations plus a bonus action attack means that Eldritch Knight fighters do more damage than most other fighters lv 7 to 10 because of the feature you didn't like at lv 7.
As noted in other comments, you are WAY WAY off in the eldritch knight. Booming/Green Flame are perfect cantrips, especially for level 7. Its SUPER easy to take useful spells like absorb elements, shield and find familiar that don't depend on your Int mod. I also can't believe you out champion fighter over samurai, and cavalier over battle master.
My personal list: A (personally see a big difference between these and lower tier classes) 1) Echo Knight 2) Rune Knight 3) Battle master 4) Psi warrior 5) Eldritch Knight B 6) Samurai 7) Cavalier C 8) Champion D 9) Arcane Archer 10) Banneret
Top 3 archetypes for Fighter no contest are Samurai, Battlemaster and Eldrich knight in no particular order and Champion is close 4th. It feels like you are missing so much from what a fighter can do. Eldrich knight having Shield Spell and Elemental Absorb with the cantrip access is sufficiently good to make it amazing.
I love samurai cause it's simple (not as much as champion but still simple) but powerful but also VERY good for archers. almost feels like it's just champion+
I like your videos, but imho you are wrong about the Eldritch Knight... Green Flame Blade/ Booming Blade cantrip and Shield is awesome... Find Familiar etc also very nice
You only get one bonus action attack meaning using a great sword you could deal 8d6+20 (average of 52) damage with a standard attack, or you could use booming blade and deal 3d8+2d6+5 (average of 32) damage and use you bonus action on top of your standard action.
Well no. If you have 3 or 4 attacks as an action. And a high ability score this does not get outpaced by 1 booming blade and an attack. Add something like dueling fighting style or great weapon master and you are losing a ton of damage. However if you multiclass into bladesinger for their extra attack feature you have the best dps in your party.
So, the way the war magic works is if you use a cantrip you can attack ONCE as a bonus action meaning you could use a cantrip and attack a single, or attack 4 times and use your bonus action for something else. As a DM I retcon this ability so that when you take the attack action and land a hit you can use a bonus action to cast a cantrip which isn't as powerful as you thing I did the math, and the damage output ends up being similar to other fighter archtypes.
I think youre over emphasize the need for a high int for an eldtrich knight, there are tons of spell options that are available to the EK that do not require even a good int score and you can take non evocation and abjuration spells at certain levels. You can easily have an EK with, heavy armor, a sheild, the sheild spell and mirror image making you near impossible to hit, all of which dont require a high int. Your damage output may not be as high as some of the others but you defense is through the roof. Not to meantion how much stronger your opportunity attacks will be if you take a cantrip like booming blade/green flame blade and the war caster feat. And if you really need a high int it's not impossible to get it since the fighter has so many more ability score improvements available to it. The EK is really only weak compaired to other fighters if your spell selection are bad otherwise it can keep pass and even surpass alot of the other fighter archetypes without much difficulty.
Hey man, just letting you know that you need to make some visible stuff like a table or a chart for the end - would really help someone look at your overall opinion at the end, and those who do that defo get more views Thanks for the vid man
You’re missing the mark with Eldritch Knight. First of all, the Fighter gets so many ASI improvements, increasing INT is less of a problem. Level 3: Getting Shield + Absorb Elements + Find Familiar is HUGE Get Warcsster Feat: Hit enemy with Booming Blade when they provoke opportunity attacks. Do weapon damage plus booming blade damage Level 7: War Magic. Instead of just hitting someone with two attacks, hit them with two attacks PLUS Booming Blade. Level 10 Eldritch Strike: Step 1: Hit bad guy Step 2: Cast Hold Person or other “save or suck” spell (Bad guy has disadvantage) Step 3: action surge and hit bad guy again. Step 4: keep hitting bad guy on your turns --Now bad guy has disadvantage on every tuen trying to break free of the spell. Level 13: #TheNuclearOption: Fireball 🔥 + Action Surge + Fireball 🔥 = 56 average points of damage to every creature within a 40 foot radius. Level 15: Arcane Charge. A beautiful feature to get the most out of action surge, but yeah I want a little more at Level 15. Level 18 improved war magic. Do the Eldritch Strike trick without needing to action surge. But yeah, again, I want more at Level 18. All in all, played right it’s a very good class. WAAAAAYYYY better than the Champion.
So what do you think of the rune knight? I think it sounds like an amazing fighter which might be on par with 2nd and 3rd place and I would think that it's very suitable for more grapple oriented combat.
Rune Knight is by far the strongest fighter archetype, it's not even a competition. It gives you so much damage, control abilities, and durability it's not even funny.
Him calling the eldritch knight weapon I'd like to see him say that when my eldritch knight walks into a fight with 28 AC after using a haste and shield spell.
The best kinds of eldritch knight don't use offensive spells they use defensive spells to become one of the tankiest classes in the game the only thing they're missing is resistance.
The bannert would have been good if they got more uses of second wind , action surge and indomitable to support them from Other fighters. and to just pump up some of those features. specially the Rallying cry and the Bulwark. because let me tell you inspiring surge with a rogue or a paladin or even a monk with a lucky stunning strike is bonkers .... sadly only for that. . The eldrich knight ... let me tell you about the eldrich knight one of the most Verstile fighters. a caster with access to full plate and the wizard spell list "they can pick outside envo and abjer later", a caster with profincy with consaves and 2 more ASIs ,a fighter with greenflame blade or booming blade cantrips or blade ward "Getting resistance to weapon damage and get to attack is such a solid tank". A fighter that Can haste , A fighter than can fly, A fighter that can cast Shield and absorb elements and mirror image, a fighter that can cast Fireshield and deal damage every time they get hit + a resistance. a fighter that can cast Shadow blade at 3rd level dealing 3d8 on each attack with an action surge at level 20 that would be 8 * 3d8+5 (+2 if they also took dueling style) psychic damage for an average of 164 assuming they all hit with the possibilities of a crit. and finally a fighter that can cast fire ball even thoguh it would be a low ac IT IS STILL A FIRE BALL the biggist AoE a fighter can do. So Yeah .... I have played with someone who played dex based eldritch fighter + 3 dip into blade singer and let me tell you .... THE AMOUNT OF CARNAGE that man did. let me start with that one time he reclaimed his stolen sword from a GOD using his bounded weapon feature. there many spells that doesnt require a save that enhances the fighter so much. So yeah ... THEY ARE FAR BETTER THAN THE MEASLY ARCANE ARCHER.... . The Arcane Archer is just above the bannert they get only two yses and they can use thier features w ithout a bow ... so not sling not a crossbow not a gun not a dart .. just a bow..... I gave them more uses more options and let them use thier arcane shots as arcane strikes with any weapons and then it would be another arcane fighter and a neet option. . The rest of the fighters I do agree with. I played an Echo knight as a spy in a game an booooy was he effective.
Echo Knight isn't only usable in that adventure module? I would treat that as UA content. So it's the cavalier the top dog. As a defender I think Forge Cleric and Ancestral Guardian Barbarian are the stronger defenders.
I think Champion is good only as a 3 level dip. If I was tasked to build single class Champion build, I'd go for Elf+Elven Accuracy+Dex dual wielding+Fey Touched (Hex or Hunter's Mark). Still not as powerfull as Battlemaster/Echo/Rune /Eldritch Knight.
Improved Critical is not a good feature. If you are using a greatsword it adds 0.35 damage to every attack. If a seventeenth level rapier wielding rogue takes a 3 level champion fighter dip, it adds 1.8 damage to per round. (If you can get consistent advantage, and you add elven accuracy, that number is significantly higher.) This is less damage than just adding 2 more levels of rogue for a another sneak attack die. For a fighter critting doesn’t add very much damage. Also hoping to crit is extremely unreliable. When fighting a priority target an arcane archer can decide to use an Arcane Shot, a Samauri can use fighting spirit, a champion can roll the dice and hope to crit so they can do a tiny bit of extra damage. It is more useful to decide when you do your extra damage than to have it be completely random.
Champion abilities are crappy for a subclass and should have been worked into the base class for Fighter, as they would help round out the class. Many people have said they want battlemaster worked into the base class for the next iteration of the game, but that would mean the class would have two separate resources to manage (e.g. spells or psi dice and superiority dice), and Champion’s buffs are less powerful than battlemasters and wouldn’t risk overpowering the class (i.e. a fighter with battlemaster abilities AND EK spells would be too strong). Fighters lack the burst damage of other classes (Rogue and Paladin), so upping the crit range is a decent but not game-breaking buff. However, compared the the battlemaster, it’s simply not enough. Assuming 20 attacks which all hit, and dealing 1d8+5 damage, a battlemaster will crit once and deal 203.5 damage, assuming they only spend their superiority dice on their one hit to crit (which gets doubled, so they would deal 4d8+5). A champion under the same stats and conditions will only deal 199 damage critting twice. In reality however the battlemaster will come out far above the Champion, as the battlemaster can turn misses into hits with Precision Attack or give themselves advantage with Tripping Attack or Feinting Attack. Champion needs many, many more attack rolls to break out ahead of Battlemaster in terms of damage output. Most DMs won’t put that many fights in or have them last long enough to reach the turnover point.
Be me as a wood elf samurai fighter using a the elven accuracy feat to get triple advantage laughing as the DM wonders how I roll so many critical hits.
BTW elven accuracy makes it so your critical hit chance is roughly 14% per attack, and if you got hexblade warlock you can crank that chance up the roughly 30% per attack meaning the odds of you landing a critical hit are huge.
The brute fighter wants to know your location for being one of the most mechanically solid subclasses in the game because more damage and better saving throws are literally all this subclass needs to do but it also gives you an extra fighting style plus the champions survivor ability at 18th level. The subclass is so simple you cannot mock it.
I feel that arcane archer is the worst simply because it makes the fighter way less versitile and not very helpful when you lose your bow or run out of arrows. I think that cavilier is the best when played as a defender, champion as a striker, and battle master is overall just overpowered.
You underestimate the power of spells. You get a lot of versatility here, of course damage spells would be a bit meh, but abjuration ones that protect you can be really good even on higher levels and not many require much of the spellcasting modifier. Moreover you can still choose a spell per spell level that is not in those two schools. Not to mention Constitution save proficiency, Paladin has to take a feat for that.
In my opinion, it is an overrated subclass! I think a lot of people see spells and automatically want to place it high, but I don't think the spells add quite as much power as I'd like, taking into account action economy and all that. But again, this is just my personal ranking. You're welcome to disagree! That's the great thing about D&D - there are many differing opinions on how to play the game, and I'm just one of the many. Thanks for the comment!
I don't this this guy has looked at the spell lists for Eldridge Knight. Eldridge Knight is one of the best fighter classes period. Yeah, it will suck if take evocation spells. There are plenty of useful abjuration spells that will leave the Eldridge Knight standing while all other fighters have fallen down.
May i suggest updating the playlist for the Archetype Ranking videos? It makes it easier to find them in one place rather than scrolling through the channel
Added all the archetype videos into the playlist! That’s a good idea. I’ll go through and organize the channel over the course of this week. Thanks for the comment 😁
Eldritch Knight second to last?!? Sorry my dude, but I STRONGLY disagree! It's sooo strong! Let me give you some examples... Almost Advantage every turn with Find Familiar, crazy high durability with AC at the right moment with Shield and Absorb Elements! Pair the seventh level ability with the "Blade" cantrips from SCAG and, 'til level 10, it's basically free extra damage! And the amazing thing is, none of these spells need high INT to work! If you want a war mage you can use the Wizard subclass, or an Hexblade! Eldritch Knight is still basically a fighter with some cool tricks at the right moment! XD
Objectively the Champion fighter is just bad. Improved Critical amounts to a whopping 0.3 average extra damage per attack with a great sword. Superior Critical at level 15 bumps that up to an extra 0.6 average damage per attack .Level FIFTEEN.. No other Champion abilities add anymore damage, battlefield control, or any spells. It’s very playable because the base Fighter is very playable. The Champion subclass is garbage.
Sorry but the only things is bad here is your brain, 15% of critical is ONE CRIT FOR SIX ATTACK, and if you have advance is doubled, ONE CRIT EVERY 3 attack. You want a build? Take this : Half orc, with orchis fury and magic iniziate. Flame tongue Greatsword. You have a 4d6 weapon, with orchish fury you can add a dice, 5d6, add Hex, another 1d6. Your crit is now 12d6 +1d6 (half orc features) whiteout expend ANY resources. this class for me is even better because teamwork . If another player give you advance, you become a litterally Meatgrinder. I love what this class can do. Is not generic, is simple transform your fighter in the BEST FIGHTER. More leve and ability you gain, more powerful you become, and basically your power continue to growth and reach the peack af 20 lvl. The capstone is of this subclass is insane, and trasform your fighter in basically an undying superheroes. You don’t need anymore healing or even short rest. Out of combat you can regain 150-200 hit point in less than 5 minutes, you can litterally retreat by an hardcore battle and be ready for finish the enemy ISTANTLY. Finally you are fucking fast, remarkable atlete made your initiative best, and if your are a dex champion, your ARE the Best!
@@nonnolento lol My brain, huh? Or rather your inability to do math. Every player already gets a crit when they roll a 20. So, improved Critical adds an additional crit opportunity if you roll a 19 (1/20 chance, or .05 probability). A greatsword does 2d6 damage, for an average of 7. If you Crit, that’s an extra 7 damage THAT IS ONLY APPLIED 5% OF THE TIME. *.05 x 7 = 0.35 average extra damage per hit* That’s not an opinion, that’s a fact. It’s math. At Level 15 now both 18s and 19s will Crit. That amounts to 0.7 extra damage per hit with a greatsword. AT LEVEL 15! Again, MATH. Now, yes there are certain things that can improve this extra damage some. A half orc lets you add one extra damage dice. That increases Improved Critical to an extra 0.525 damage per hit (10.5 x .05 = 0.525). You can also (somewhat) increase crit damage with certain magic weapons like flame tongue. And it all sounds great until you do the math. AT LEVEL ONE, the fighter can pick dueling fighting style and get +2 damage per hit. MAYBE if you pick half orc AND get a really powerful weapon that adds a lot of dice damage AND wait until level 15 you can equal that damage. *You have to pick just the right race, and have just the right weapon just to TRY to compete with a level one ability... at LEVEL 15* Don’t just make disparaging marks about my brain and then fail to show the math. SHOW ME that I’m wrong, or admit that you are.
@@Sean-fo8kg really?You fail in a math basis. Natural crit is 1 crit every 20 roll, exactly the 5% of chance. 19-20 range is 10%, exactly one crit every ten roll, and 18-20 range is 15%, or one crit every six/seven attack. All doubled with advance. Basically you are both bad in matematics and common sense, and you aren’t able to understand even the exponential increase of damage of the crit, if you find a way for have more damage dice. but probably you don’t even know than the Critical Hit multiplies ALL DICE of attack, not only the basic dice of the weapons. Return to school instead to delivery your ignorance in public
@@nonnolento lol Yes, everyone gets a 5% chance to crit. Improved Critical increases it to 10% That is a FIVE PERCENT ***INCREASE*** above what every class gets. So the *ADDITIONAL* damage is x 0.05. It is x 0.1 at level 15. Funny, your posts are still void of any equations. I wonder why.
@@nonnolento incidentally I just did the math (as opposed to you just repeating what you heard.) 20 required with advantage = 9.75% chance to crit. 19/20 with advantage = 19% chance to crit (an increase of 9.25% With a greatsword, that’s an average 0.6475 extra damage per attack. Woopee. Again.... you must attack with advantage EVERY TIME (as a fighter) AND have a magic that adds a lot of dice damage, AND pick a half-orc, AND then *maybe* at Level 15 you’ll (somewhat) out-damage the dueling fighting style. UNDER PERFECT CONDITIONS. If I’m wrong SHOW ME THE EQUATIONS.
At what point playing a fighter do you feel better then if you where a Rogue , Barb or Pally? I feel Fighter seems dull and only effects 1/3 pillars of play . I never take in RP because all classes can RP that’s just player based but boy does the fighter seem lack luster not until 2nd half do they get something the other multi attackers don’t get with 1 more atk. I also don’t take into consideration magic items because DM matters there and also if u hand pick magic items anyone can feel strong
