I agree, crowdfunding sites shouldn't get their money until delivery. That would have some accountability for them, and they wouldn't be wanting to push campaigns that won't deliver for years, if at all. We'll never see that until it was some type of government regulation. I could see the EU doing it.
Would it still work of that was the case. If the whole idea is to fund the project to be created many companies put in the bare minimum just to get started. I'd say give them 50% to start but then they'd just walk away with that and never worry about the full amount. Also who gets the interest on the rest ov the funds? KS? Yea idk anyway to do it but I feel they'd need money to get the project moving forward
The Toyzzo campaign really highlights that far to many people just close their eyes and hit back. The glass half full side of me can only hope that every backer of Toyzzo has the funds and understanding of the risk they took.
I've seen it on far too many campaigns to count now. Just having an idea, no matter how unfeasible, is enough to get tons of money from people who put in 0 effort to do any research at all. Even now, there is still someone on the Toyzzo campaign only a few comments down hoping that Toyzzo proves all the people calling it a scam wrong and defending Toyzzo. I am watching another campaign that has reached the required amount and is about to fund. It's an NSFW campaign that claims it will deliver games using custom stories...but all the art is AI drawn and contains 0 NSFW imagery (likely because their artist can't figure out how to make the AI output it). They just admitted to using AI art today but initially they denied it over and over and threatened to sue for lying about them. Yet they'll fund anyway.
I'm an all in Judgement PVC backer. Fortunately I own a 3D printer so i've proxied every single released character (available in hallofeternalchampions). The game is a blast. By releasing balance patchs and new characters often they've alliviated my frustration. Can't recommend the game enough.
Can't recommend the game enough? What game, lol. Is that a joke? I'm an all in PVC backer, and they've only sent us a starter kit. That's it. 80% of what I ordered is in limbo, stuck with no promise of ever coming. Sorry, dude, not everyone has a 3D printer, let alone the time and money to proxy a game they *already bought* and hasn't' been delivered for several years.
Loving the video. I think one factor that gets ignored is us, the consumer. We now demand that all crowd funding projects contain so much stuff; neoprene mats, dice packs, expansions galore of content we will never get to...this is backed up the fact that if you had 2 KS pledge levels - Standard and "deluxe" - its always the deluxe that gets a good 80%-90% of the backer volume. This hobby is not cheap but we have been a factor in making it more expensive.
The Devil Pig Games portion was very valuable to me. I am currently backing their newest project, "Heroes of the Pacific." I hope this does not result in the failure to deliver on that project. Thank you very much for your detailed explanation. I appreciate you, brother.
I just want to say, thank you for backing Toyzzo, probably with one dollar, so you can give us updates. Except the first update, the other two are for backers only.
@@TheKingofAverage The sad thing is that they probably thought that in that way we could not see what they were doing and youtubers like you, could not talk about them anymore because you could not see their updates!
The last 2 updates were almost immediately reposted in the comments by a backer so that the people who aren't backers can follow along with what is happening.
At least the devil pig games situation shows their are still people behind the company that care. Ive seen it a lot lately were people loose money, and they just want to have the whole company burn without knowing their are good people in that company trying their best to help the backers out. For the most part is one or just a couple of people that are screwing around, were most people are just trying to make an honest living.
please look into Deep Water Games and their Rat Queens: To the slaughter I think them coming out in their update was because they were found out somewhere else
Ooof, I had no idea the Devil Pig CEO was involved with Matagot. So much for putting anything into their recent Cyclades KS. Zero confidence in them now.
I would demand that these developers produce, have landed, and are ready to ship. Before they even think of posting it on kick starters. I understand that I paying more because of the funding site taking a cut. I should expect to get mine in the first print run. The company has enough to do another print run plus make a profit. If your not seeing a traditional production to sales cycle. You should be very wary on those purchases. Its like going to a farmers market. All you see are pick up trucks, and empty tables. Your told by all the vendors that they are taking your money for next year's harvest.
Im allin for Judgement PVC and I'm torn. I dont enjoy assembling models (if they go together like GW models) but my main issue with resin is the cost and hiw fragile they are (I'm clumsy, lol). I do think they likely went overboard but also, just a core bix is a risk too with a skirmish game that NEEDS variety imo; we enjoy the game but have barely touched it due to limited heroes selection. I kind of wish they'd found a middle ground (Unicool or SiOCast) or...worked with someone besides Creature Caster who had more experience in PVV production.
I agree, skirmish games live and die on variety. They go together pretty good, but resin is always harder than GW HIPS plastic since you're stuck using super glue.
The thought that Kickstarter actually says they have a team to verify campaigns is gross and at the very least misleading. Kickstarter needs to get sued for negligence in the duties they purportedly perform to protect backers.
On the flip side of this, and because I think it's behavior that needs to be championed, Orange Nebula found issues with copies of Unsettled being delivered and sent out an update today letting backers know they already were going to getting fixes printed up and would send them out to everyone automatically. No pulling teeth, no backlash forcing them to, no crazy hoops to get them. A lot of companies don't go to the level featured here but many that are considered reputable also do not like addressing issues with their KS deliveries either even when it's fully their fault.
Literally everyone wins if they do that. You buy only what you'll actually play, they get to keep the game in it's best shape possible, their IP now is in our minds and part of our lives for far longer than a giant 1 and done and there's less risk on both sides!
I can give you a much simpler explanation of why Toyzzo waited until they had the money in hand to think their backers. They knew that there was a suspicion they were scamming. They probably even knew this because kickstarter adked them questions to confirm that they were the real thing, and they somehow managed to convince Kickstarter that they were not a scam. They knew that there was a chance that they would never get the money, because Kickstarter would suddenly decide they were not legitimate. This is a lot of money and they wanted it badly, so they probably overestimated the risk of never getting it. when they finally got the money, that’s when these scum bags were ready to say: Thank you . -Toby
KS companies only receiving their money when they deliver, doesn’t that defeat the whole purpose of crowdfunding? Which helps these companies secure capital to develop and deliver the games? So how can they deliver games if they don’t get the money upfront?
Not KS companies, KS themselves. They take a percentage of the funds raised right away so even games that never deliver KS wins on since they still got paid already. It's only backers that are left high and dry and it leaves little real incentive for KS to stop a campaign (and therefore not get their cut of the funds)
I still have high hopes that gamefound will open their own manufacturing hub (preferably in the U.S.). That way they could quote how much projects will actually cost. They could require these projects to have enough development that it's reasonable to know how much it will cost to produce. They could take over the project if something happens. They could even hold onto the money it will take to manufacture the games, that way something like 6 siege can't happen. (They used the manufacturing money on deployment.. then needed more money just to make the game.) Gamefound would specialize in shipping and since all they do is board games they would excel at dealing with imports/export laws, VAT, etc. This is the dream ;)
I was able to pick up Judgment at Adepticon. It's a very fun game. Unfortunately, all the other heroes are resin, and I'm just not interested in resin minis for $30 each.
16:37 As far as I know Matagot is not a dubious publishing company. At least they weren't in the past. I haven't kept up with their doings lately. 🤔 Does this mean that Matagot suddenly comes under suspicion or is there a distinction between Matagot and their CEO here? If there is then the rest of the Matagot management can't be too happy with him right now.
@@TheKingofAverage Yeah matagot has been around for awhile not one of the big boys but not a little guy at all. They do a lot of the French versions of games for other publishers I think and have a decent sized retail catalog. Definitely not good for there business as I doubt other companies will want to work with them if this blows up much. I had no idea the CEO of matagot was involved in the devil pig mess
😂 knew creature caster was gunna have problems with judgement. I know a fair bit about them and what they are really like behind the scenes. Knew someone who used to be involved with CC and they got screwed over by CC. Owed money and CC tried to say an product was theirs when it wasnt. Its the reason i instantly noped out of judgement completly when i saw they were 'taking over'
They have been going downhill for a long time. Don't think they delivered Windward to all backers and no support for anyone who got problems with components.
Small consolation - IIRC they didn't charge for shipping. I can deal with a company not being able to produce a game but paying shipping For a game they never produced really grinds my gears.
