‘Lets talk about big knobs’ pure comedy genius. You played the next few minutes perfectly with a straight face. ‘The faceplate is a smorgasbord of uncluttered glory’. At that point I wondered why there is not a woodworking equivalent of Spinal Tap, you clearly should be a consultant on it. Thank you, lightened up my day. I also benefitted from identifying and learning more about the 1940s 52 (no half) vice that a colleague donated to me. Priceless.
Thanks Mark! Really appreciate the kind words. Thats a great donation from your colleague, I fine wee vice! I do like the 52 smaller footprint. Great stuff!
I know you don’t have millions of views on this vid but thank you for uploading. It’s people like you that share vital information for the rest of us to learn.
I never ever thought I'd find myself watching a serious comparative analysis of old vices in itself, but one delivered like a comedy sketch!... 😂👌 Brilliant!
Thank you for this vid. I have acquired a 40s version of this a week ago, shipped to the U.S. from England covered in rust that the previous owner tried to conceal under multiple layers of black gooey paint. Even the screw, what a mess! After a week of sanding, grinding, oiling, thinning and copious curses this beautiful tool is nearly ready to be clear-coated and lubed. Everything works, amazingly... but perhaps not amazing. It's a tank and will now outlive me. It's simply a joy to repeatedly touch that knob. Thanks again!
Fantastic!! Great model. I look for those rusted up units myself, as I know that underneath the rust lies a perfectly functioning vice, just a bit of pitting, but it all adds to the character. Good stuff, Cheers!
Thank you for such an informative presentation. Troughout the video I was intrigued and facinated on how quality lasts a lifetime. I have the 1940's vise and never owned any other woodworking vice accept for my Record 74 machenical vise. I use my vices every day, and so will the next generations.
That's great! Thanks for kind words. Glad you enjoyed the vid. The 74is a great unit. I've been trying to acquire one for quite some time however quality examples are rare in NZ. I was lucky enough to grab myself a 75 model and like you, I use it everyday. It's a wonderful partner for the 72 1/2, cheers!
I absolutely LOVE channels like this. Some absolute header from NZ (Aus?) has gone totally overboard with masses of lovingly thought-out detail about…vices, and - even better - ONE vice by ONE manufacturer. I thought I loved my 52 1/2, but clearly there is someone who has put so much more thought into it than I ever did. This is such a great video: serious, informative, deadpan, slightly bonkers… This is what is so great about RU-vid and the internet in general - it’s a place where like-minded loons can share everything you ever wanted to know about the Record 52 1/2 but were afraid to admit to even wanting to ask. Nice work mate, from the home of the mighty Record vice.
I see almost unanimous praise and admiration for this superbly scripted and shot video, which has the added bonus of a delightfully concealed bit of tongue in cheek humour along the way. You obviously have a tremendous knowledge of this model and I appreciate you sharing this for all to look and learn from. I have three 52 1/2 models which thanks to you I have now dated. Thank you for sharing. Respect. Franko U.K.
We have just built three new benches for our woodwork club. We have installed three old Record vices, two of them the 52 1/2s. I must look to see their ages. I know that they have webs. One of them had a damaged pawl and spring which I replaced.
Wow ! I have just refurbed my 52 1/2 which thanks to your excellent video I now know is a 1930's model, am I turning into a geek or what as I found all that info fascinating well done and thanks for your time . I am just about to install it into my newly constructed workbench so I will get so much more satisfaction with all that new info .
Really sets the bar high for vintage vice studies. And waxing lyrical about the aesthetics of knobs was certainly a highlight. Just purchased a 1940s vice. Now to build a workbench that matches.
Thank you for this. I'm currently getting a huge chunk of rust I pulled it out of skip back to being a working 1930's Record vice. It was seriously rusted solid - the quick release spring is... not. We've been soaking it in oil and, with a combination of brute force, penetrating oil, and a lump hammer, have it near working again. Your video was an inspiration. And so funny.
Thanks for kind words, glad the vid was of help. Sounds like you have your hands full, however the pay-off will be a good one. They are such tanks that I have no doubt that it will come up as new. very rewarding restoration indeed. Great work, have a good one!
👍 Same here. 52D. Got it in December for 30$ Canadian! Some rust but nothing that can't be taken care of easily. Going to try and preserve the paint and stickers as much as possible.
Thanks for a great breakdown of Record vice history mixed in with some nostalgia. Have come across a 1940's unit not working and contemplated if it was worth the time but after watching this I will take it apart to see if I can give it a new lease on life.
Yeah sorry for the re-upload, I had major resolution issues on the first attempt. Stuck on 360p for whatever reason. I have 2 x 60's versions on my 'mother of all benches'. They are very grunty units indeed.
elams1894 - really love the integrity and eye for detail you bring to all the videos. If you have time - a circuit design discussion for the WISC amp or how you balance aesthetic vs functional choices would be most welcome!
@@danielpirone8028 - Thanks Daniel, that is a very good suggestion indeed. Luckily, now that I have finished my bench, I have time to at last finish my latest amp design which is almost complete. A video, such as the kind you suggest, would be a good fit. Cheers!
Thank You - very useful information and comparison - never realized there was so much variation. Saw a Record 52.1/2"B a few weeks ago - no vertical on the back casting using the bench face as the vertical. Had the cast linkage joining the rod ends and curvaceous knob so was an earlier model.
Thats very interesting. Never heard of the 'B' designation. I'll have to have a research. Seems to be so many little quirks to this vice, might have to sort out another video ha ha. Thanks!!
I found a 1960s version yesterday, well chuffed 😅 great video by that way, thanks for taking the time to make it. I will have to make do with my stumpy knob 😂
I THOROUGHLY enjoyed that. thank you for posting! Paul Sellers also appreciates the record qr vices, too. Just for the record (ha!) I bought a 1960s version for $70 a few weeks back, and I love it! Take that, Ebay sellers!
I recently acquired a set of a 52 P and a 52 1/2 P in the Sixties design, and I’m very happy with what I’ve got. I don’t mind the stubby knobs, and they go well with the tiny knob I’ve always had - in a small East German engineer’s vice from the same era. I specifically didn’t want a quick release, as I’ve had less than satisfying experiences with that in the past. I do like the old ones with the bulbous knobs, but two of those - and no quick release - that’s almost impossible to find these days.
Great vices! Quite rare Indeed, to have two 'P' models. I've only ever seen two P wood vices listed on our local online trade site here in NZ. Heaps of P engineering vices but almost zero wood vices. Thanks for message and all the best!!
@@elams1894 thanks 🙏. I had a smaller Woden and that had a kind of cam lock quick release no lever, a very clever design I thought. Did record ever do this as well?
@@mark4lev I don't believe that Record ever made a cam type device, but you never know I guess. I have a big Woden engineering vice, equivalent to the Record Number 23. It's an impressive beast, and hardly used. I also have a Record 25, but for whatever reason, I like to use the Woden.
What a great video. Thanks for taking the time and effort to make it as it answered a few questions that I'd had for a while. I've have a sixties 52 1/2 front vice on my workbench and a sixties 53 as a tail vice. Both fully restored, they perform perfectly. Also recently restored a 40s version (it's ready for paint) and will say that that round knob, while admittedly looks great, is a lot more effort to restore. I've painted mine with roundel blue from Paragon paints which they sell as the correct colour for Record vices, BUT I have noticed, in restoring a few of them, that the original paint colour varies between quite a pale blue and a much darker blue. Not sure whether the variation is due to the age of the vice or just to do with batches of paint.
I've got a 52 1/2 A that I'm stripping down and repainting with spray. I've got some Janolite Cobalt Blue, I was worried that it might be too dark, but actually, watching this it might be quite close. Even if it is partly due to the age of the vices, I don't mind keeping that character. I'll try and do a video.
Nice! I just picked up a 1940’s version (attached to a workbench) for $50 - I know I was getting an incredible deal, but now I have some extra info about what an awesome piece of equipment I found. Thanks for the video!
Thanks Drew! Thats indeed a bargain for my absolute favourite vice! 50$ WHAT!!! with bench!!! Awesome find. It does happen from time to time. I scored 2 x 60's models for 50 each once, couldnt believe it, ex Tauranga School units. I checked out your hunting vid! Mighty Kaimai's! The gateway to the beast Coro. Nice work. All the best!!
Excellent comparison, i didn't find this sort of information anywhere else. :) Love the dry humor by the way. I was just lucky with an ebay auction and got a Record vice what i now know to be from the 1940 era. There must have been some variation in production though, my vice still has the 1930es cast iron bar keep bracket! Also there are some rubber discs installed on each end of the handle bar to protect the beautiful knob (hurrrhurr). I'll take it apart next week to clean, derust and repaint it. Great video mate, thank you. 8)
Thanks ko la! Thats a great buy. Never sen a 52 1/2 with the rubber discs on the handle, thats very cool. The number of times I've pinched my the webbing between thumb and fore finger. Thats very interesting about the bar keep bracket. Indeed they would have used what ever is left over from previous versions. That would be a unit that they probably made very early on in the 40's, perhaps just after the war. A definite keeper as I'ver never come across one like that. Love the transition vices. All the best with the cleaning and thanks for the comment, very interesting!
Perhaps the rubber rings are to protect your ears from the thunking of the knobbly handle bits against the big knob. Imagine putting up with that all day in a busy workshop.
Living in the US, there's little chance of owning a nice Record vise. Your comments of the vices (no mistake in the spelling) of the earlier models was hilarious! I'm grateful to have a heavy vintage Craftsman front vise and that's what drew me in to your video. Brilliant!
Really interesting! Thank you for the comparison. I have the version from the 60’s........i may keep my eye out for the one from the 40’s now. One can never have too many vices 😜
Brilliant video. I have a 1960's version and just aquired a 1930's version. I only have room for one and have to decide which one to keep. This video did not make my task any easier, in fact it made me want to get a 1940's version and keep the set.
I have a 52.5 that doesn’t have the nubbin but does have the MADE IN ENGLAND across the top so making it difficult to date, somewhere between the 20s and 30s versions. The quick release lever, spring and bar are missing although I do remember them being present when it was in my father’s shop in the fifties. He was born in 1924 so must have acquired it second hand.
I wonder if there's a video of how this old vice I have works? Oh, yes. A Rolls-Royce level video, for what turns out to be a Rolls-Royce level vice. Thanks.
This is absolutely brilliant. So well made a d extremely helpful. Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge. I agree the 40s version is absolutely beautiful, but the 60s version does have some more practical features. Of only they made a mixture of the two in the 70s! Still though this video has made me appreciate the sheer beauty of these things and I'll be getting one very soon.
Having just bought a 40's version for £25 (the shipping was a tenner) I was on tenterhooks. Doesn't really matter, they are all good, but I've bought so many dud items over the years it's nice to have a tiny win. Also to see that Record did do some good things on the 60's version. Some less objective commentators have just lazily gone with "newer = bad" Mind you, there is the matter of Irwin and the current knock-offs. Now. Where to build that wharf?
Great video; loved the photography, level of detail, and style of delivery. Very nice to have a break from being shout-explained at by American youtubers. Watching this was the final kick up the ass I needed to finally furnish my workbench with a proper vice. So, thanks for that. I managed to cop what I think is a 1940's 52 1/2, but it was without a screw and nut cover, and the rail stay has been poorly replaced. I found a replacement for the cover but, after receiving it, I've discovered the front plate has no allowance for it, and no place to screw into. If you have a moment, could you share how your 1940's vice has its screw and nut cover fixed?
Thanks STIMULI! Appreciate the kind words. The screw and nut cover were included in the units with the designation 'A'. Any 52 1/2 vice with the screw and nut cover would hence be labelled '52 1/2 A. Having a look at normal 52 1/2, you could retro fit a screw and nut cover however you would have to tap a wee screw hole into both the face plate and the rail stay. Indeed the 'A' designation models have a cavity for the fitting, however I think you can get away with it without the cavity if you were to tap into the iron. Cheers.
@@elams1894 That's great to know, thanks for the help. A lot of this information has been lost to dead links in old forum posts. I settled on the same solution. It'll be mostly hidden, but it doesn't seem like much can go wrong with the process anyway :)
Hi buddy, great video. I have a question, so I recently bought the 1930’s vise in your video but it’s missing the ‘rail stay’ and I can’t imagine why! Do you know if it’s possible to buy the piece? Thanks
I don't know what version I just bought. It looks like the 60s one but with a slot cut out at the front which looks like some flat bar would sit in it for some reason.
Thank you for the info. Excellent video humorous & enlightening . I find it ironic that a different nationality can appreciate a common place item of British engineering with such passion, whilst most Brits take them for granted (myself included) I prefer to buy British, when it comes to woodworking tools , particularly pre 1960. Thanks again Excellent video
Thanks, really appreciate the kind words. My grandfather is British and Father Scottish so its been instilled in me to strive for quality. In this age of cheap garbage, anything that is British, German, made is gold when it comes to tools. I have two full sets of pre 50's Britool socket sets, 1/2 inch and even a wartime 3/4 inch King Dick set. My favs! I rate them above SK Wayne, still great but alas two of my SK Wayne ratchets have slipped. But the Britool soldiers on with huge workload. Certainly the older the better. Have a good one, cheers!
Unsure if I missed it, but do these records utilize the Toe in feature? Or do they close up flat to one another? I have an old Colombian vise that I got oldstock unused and well,, it’s got toe in pretty excessively. It comes together flush pretty well however,, it’s definitely leaving indentations on my wood. I wonder if i should put wood jaws on it. And also if i should consider compensating for the toe in feature by compensating for it by making the wooden jaws the appropriate thickness to eliminate the toe in feature? What’s the word on toe in vs non toe in? Anyone know? Thanks!!
I inherited an old workbench from the father-in-law, it has the 30’s version attached. Still as the information on the maintenance plate! Can’t wait to restore it! Can someone tell me what they’re worth?
Awesome! Great model. Here in New Zealand, a used fully functional 52 1/2 can go for anything between $90 and $220. A 53 model will fetch higher. In US dollar terms that would be about $60 - $170 I should imagine. Considering the price for a new 'not made in England' unit, that is quite a bargain. Cheers!
Thanks for that fascinating video. And I'm amazed to find that my everyday vice was made in the 1930s, 80+ years old and as good as new. a pertinent lesson to teach Musk et al how really to save the planet.
Thanks for the kind words and glad you liked the video, indeed, these vices are made like tanks and your vice will certainly last another 80 years i'm sure!
I really enjoyed this video! I've always had a big place in my heart for functional art and the aesthetics of old form. I noticed the threads on all these vices have a bevel on the back side and are cut strait (perpendicular to the shaft) on the front side, unlike standard machine bolt threads. Is there a name for this type of thread shape?
Very informative! I have a ‘60s 52 1/2E that I like a lot. One question: what do you think of the Woden vises? I found an 89 No. 2 for cheap and was wondering how that would compare to my Record.
The 52 1/2 is a tad larger than the 52, but essentially the exact same model. The 52E is a beast, I have one waiting for my son when he's responsible enough to use it. Cheers!
Very useful video. On topic - is there anywhere you know of to buy replacement parts for the old Records? I have a 1940s 52 1/2 but it’s tragically missing it’s half nut and quick release. Cheers for the video.
Thanks! That's a bummer that you are missing parts. I'm not sure where you could spares other than looking out for an old rusty one that's going cheap. That's what I have done. The rust is easily removed revealing a near as new unit. Best of luck and cheers!
Have a 60s version in vg++ condition. Trying to price it here in Canada. Not seeing them though. Anyone sees this and can tell me what it could be worth id appreciate it
Awesome! There were quite a few Letter designations to go with the versions. 'P' represents the absence of a quick release mechanism. 'A' represents a thread cover. The letter 'E' that appears on the 60's version represents a thread cover and the letter 'D' on the 60's version represents a 'Dog', as you are already aware. I believe there also was an 'ED' designation in the 60's version that represented both a Dog and a thread cover. There were many designations that occurred in all 4 versions. Cheers.
After watching this the other day, i literally just bought a 20s version, which is missing the made in England stamp also, off of trademe. Im about to try and buy the 30s version also...🤦🏽♂️
Hi Eli. You just bought the very vices in this video, congrats! They are wonderful units and you know the exact condition so that's great. I'll reply to your email about pickup, all good. Thanks for comment, very cool coincidence, cheers.
@@elams1894 hey mate, tbh i was going to message the other day when i watched this video just out of curiosity as they looked similar and obviously you're a kiwi.
After watching this post I now own all four plus a 53 and a 52 ! That's enough ! my wife doesn't understand why I need more than one vice,it's a man thing!!!
HI, Great video and information. I need the quick release bar and trigger for an otherwise great condition 1920's version any one got a vice beyond restoration I could salvage them from or any idea where I might get one. Thanks
Great video, impressive. I have the 20's version and wondering how to get the 'click' out of it, it kind of jumps at a couple of points and does not grab the threaded rod.
That's no good. Could be the thread is worn in a few spots. It's a backward thread, like the ones on toothpaste tubes, and if it's a bit worn the thread nut won't hold under pressure. Cheers and all the best!!
Excellent and fascinating video. I've watched a couple of times now and feel quite expert thanks to you. Purchased a 60s E and a 40s also. Also a cheaper P model from.the 60s. How did you get such a nice patina on the faces and knobs/ handles? I've got all rust off but a poly abrasive pad was a bit heavy. Tried Autosol as well - its okish Would be interested in any products or techniques you used?
Thanks for kind words. I used a wire brush on the drill press for the light work. For the heavily rusted stuff like the knobs, screws and bars, I soaked them in citric acid solution for a few days. Then I neutralise the acid in washing soda then apply canuba wax with an old tooth brush. I dislike taking all the paint off and repainting as I think the old paint adds a great deal to the vintage look. Thanks for comment, great to hear of your vice acquisition, cheers!
@@elams1894 many thanks, I did similar with the wire brush and soaked in commercial (but expensive) Hammerite rust remover. I like the idea of neutralising the acid. I just rinsed with water but it left the metal salty, although WD40 got rid of that. I will try canuba wax, dont know it. I found 2500 grit wet and dry on the knob removed the tiny scratches I made with the abrasive disc on the knob. Totally agree with keeping the remnants of the original paint! One mistake I made was trying Gunk. That removed everything including paint. I stupidly added white spirit to dilute it and it went horribly wrong. Left a pinkish residue as a result of chemicals mixing. Anyway, just on the far end small parallel plate. I'd send a pic if I could
@@cracknelldavid nice work. I too try to stay away from paint strippers and alike, just too brutal. I find the wire brush doesn't go too far into existing paint, however it still removes old glue and surface rust. Britax works pretty good but I couldn't handle the toluene. I find canuba lasts a bit longer and its base solvent, linolene, or citrus oil or simar, is much more mild. Good stuff!
@@elams1894 I know Paul Sellers recommends furniture wax on the parallel rails, he also says he uses a "plastic" abrasive attachment but I haven't found one. Thanks for clarifying on the brush/ paint. Your vices have a lovely patina. Perfect. I think I might have to assemble a collection. Need to build more benches!
Indeed, one can never have too many benches. I'm building one right now, 3m long and but like a tank. My Number 25 Record engineering vice to sit in the middle. Its 42kgs so my bench needs to be big ha ha. I like Paul Sellers, great channel!
Thats a great inheritance, great model. I have a 1930's mounted on my bench, its a beast and always gets comments from whoever comes into the shop. Cheers!!
Hello, very entertaining and informative video! And does anyone know what thread type and size screw is meant to be used in original thread in the face plate?
Thank you! Indeed good question, probably a Whitworth thread size. I have been lucky with mine as they all have had the screws still in them. I have been meaning to get both a Whitworth and Imperial thread guage and find out. Cheers
just bought a 1940's record vice. because of the curves at the back i am struggling to picture bolting this underneath a work bench. will i have to cut out a slot of it?
Nice one on the purchase. Yes you'll need to cut the two slots in your bench to accept the bolting plate of the vice. It may seem like an inconvenience however the benefits far outweigh the hassle. I've been using both the 40's (with back plate fins) and 60's (without) and the 40's is far superior in terms of holding strength. The 60's is slipping with same significant weight and pressure whereas my 40's is holding the work with ease. Cheers
@@elams1894 amazing, thanks for the speedy reply! i found a video shortly after commenting on this with a guy fitting the same one onto the same bench i was planning on buying so between the both of you, have sorted me right out. thanks!
110% sexual references while watching a vice video, I wonder which country this gentleman is from? Could the solid rimu workbench give it away? Seems sacrilege to use it for that, to me, though. Very interesting and detailed video - thanks. There is a version you don't mention with the area for the RD number, but without the number itself, too. They also didn't have the sticker proclaiming the benefits of the little cover on the earliest ones with it. My 52.5 is like your 30s one, with the flattened nub and RD number, not the rounded nub of the 40s one. My 53 is the 60s style. You should also have noted that the 60s version was the longest lived, available for about 40 years before the unmentionable occurred :-) I would subscribe, but RU-vid completely stopped sending subscription notifications by email, so it's nearly useless. Might anyway, just as a bookmark. Cheers :-)
@@elams1894 Good to hear, and fair enough. I still treat recycled rare timber like gold, but that's just me. Re the extra info, there's a great write up here: smallworkshop.co.uk/2018/04/17/record-vice/
Cool, thanks. Yes I too treasure the recycled stuff. The recycled Rimu I used for the work bench was all warped and full of nails. I really could do little else with it. The good stuff I use for guitars and amp cabinets. Cheers
@@elams1894 Fair enough! From the video it looked like 4" thick heart rimu for a table :-D I didn't spot any nails, but the camera can be a tricky thing to the eye :-)
Yo Pro, thanks for message, sheesh a year already wow. It's been insanely busy but Im actually just about to upload the first of a new amp build video series, this first vid concentrates on filaments. Finished the whole thing and whaddayouknow, my computer crashes so it's been a mission getting it sorted. Should be out in less than a week however. Thanks again, hope you are all good, cheers
Hi Elams1894 - I have managed to obtain a quick release bar from a later vice (40's-60) than mine but as you point out in your fantastic video its wider than the early 1920 version. Could you possibly tell me how wide (and thick) it should be and I will get mine machined to the correct width. Many thanks for the great info.
Hi Steve, unfortunately I have sold the 20's unit. However I think from memory the thickness of the 20's bar was 13/16 of an inch. But I'm not 100% certain. If anyone else out there can chime in with the exact measurement, that would be great. Failing that, I'll ask the person who bought the unit to put some callipers over it. Thanks for kind words Steve.
I just got one of these but mine does not have the quick release function (gutted) and I can't find any history on it, could you possibly enlighten me at all to anything you may know about it? Many thanks.
That's a bit of a curve ball. Perhaps they made a few over the years. However, is there a hole in the face plate that would normally accept the quick release lever? If so it would suggest someone has perhaps ripped the mechanism out. Other than that, I'm not sure.
@@drsamuelbeckett2998 that's very interesting, I have never seen a unit with no hole for a QR. I'll have to research that one. Certainly there were some odd ball units around. Cheers
The Record 52 1/2 P appears not to have a quick-release mechanism, or at least not in the images I've seen of it. According to smallworkshop.co.uk/2018/04/17/record-vice/ there are different letter codes appended to the product name to identify different models.
@@stimuli9443 Very interesting with the 'P' designation. I have never seen one in the 52 1/2 but I guess that makes sense as the 'P' designation comes up alot in the engineering vice lineup, the 36'P' comes to mind. Cheers!!
Record sold to Irwin in 2003 I believe. As a consequence, manufacturing began to outsource to China. However, some models were still made in England but it is unknown how quality changed. For this reason, In my opinion, a Record vice from the 1900's is preferred. Cheers
@@elams1894 The G clamps turned to crap when they outsourced to china, noticably worse steel that rusts much more easily than the British made stuff, I would imagine the chinese vices same problems
@10 mins in - your drooling over curvaceous knobs a little too frequently, to not think of this as a bit of porn, . . what do you do for your real job ? yes got a '60s one from a high school today - looking for the do's and don'ts with these brilliantly easy to use vices.
Ha ha, yeah I like a nicely shaped knob I must admit. I am a Post Entry Quarantine Biosecurity Inspector by day. In other words, I look for new pests and diseases that have made it into New Zealand., which has been way too many this year. The 60's model is an absolute beast, I have two on my bench, fantastic units. I too got mine from a high school, bought both for 50$ a piece in very good condition, stoked.
Why was the High school selling them? We need more good carpentry apprentices! I taught woodwork for a term as a relief teacher, and threw one lad out of the class, he was a liability! Turns out he was taken on as a chippy, and now is a master craftsman with a top end builder!@@elams1894
