I admit to be nuts of violin concertos, so I propose two lists, one with violinist from first half 20th century 1. Beethoven: Oistrakh/Cluytens really a big majestic but serein interpretation 2. Mendelssohn: Shkolnikova/Rozhdestvensky 3. Bruch 1st: Heifetz/Sargent, he owns it and Sargent accompaniment is really something 4. Dvorak: Milstein/Steinberg, I can use Milstein I 2 other places ‘Mendelssohn and Tchaikovsky, but if I have to find a place where he is head and shoulder above other is here) 5. Brahms: Eduard Grache/Kondrashin, I could cite Kogan/Monteux here but I want to mention a sleeper, the CD might be difficult to find though 6. Tchaikovsky: Szeryng/Haitink. Another sleeper, surprisingly good, straight forward reading 7. Sibelius: Wick/Ehrling, white hot reading Second list with recent violinists 1. Beethoven: Henning Kraggerud, Arctic Philharmonic Orchestra, Christian Kluxen, this is released last year and it seems going under the radar of everybody. 2. Mendelssohn: Liza Ferschtmann, gorgeously recorded 3. Bruch 1st: Vengerov/Masur. 4. Dvorak: Mutter/Honeck. Usually I don’t like Mutter sound that much but here she just nails it. 5. Brahms: Yang/Antoni Wit, the double concerto on the same disc is also first class 6. Tchaikovsky: Julia Fischer/Kreizberg 7. Sibelius: Batiashvili/Barenboim, this is her second recording. I prefer Barenboim accompaniment and gorgeous DG sound. But the first one is also very good. I think the Schumann should be in the list. I would recommend Kremer/Harnoncourt for the first list and Carolin Widmann (she also conducts the Chamber Orchestra of Europe) in the second list. For the Elgar I would chose Chung/Solti in the first list and Znaider/Davis in the second list. So the lists have 18 different solists/18 conductors, and parity of male/female on violinists are also respected. How about that !
These are great. Thanks for the recs. I'm definitely not as well versed in violin recordings as I am the piano, so this is a list I'll be getting to work on soon!
I wouldn't include the Schumann Violin Concerto. Clara suppressed it, and was probably right. It's from a period when he was struggling and very variable, whereas the Cello Concerto, though gruff, has real merit. The Elgar I have seen in a "Big 8" list with the 7 above. It has taken me a long time to get my head round it, but recently after a concentrated listening I feel I "got it" properly at last. I find a lot of Elgar's themes are more difficult to grasp. So I struggle with the symphonies, Falstaff, nearly all of Gerontius etc, but love the Cello Concerto, In the South (Dave's choice for a representative Elgar work) and the Introduction and Allegro, plus several of the salon and potboiler pieces.
My favorite Tchaikovsky for the longest time has been Vilde Frang with Eivind Gullberg Jensen and the Danish National SO. No one I know has ever heard of this recording, but I found it glorious with incredibly expressive yet honest, heartfelt and completely unpretentious violin playing and the warmest accompaniment perfectly shaped around the soloist. The same disc also has a very nice recording of the Nielsen concerto.
Not even going to lie Oistrakh's Beethoven Violin Concerto is the best and there's many many reasons for it, and it's usually regarded as its reference recording, as Oistrakh was a genius of Beethoven (listen to his recordings of his romances). For Tchaikovsky, it's simply put between Oistrakh, Perlman, and Heifetz (dependent on style). Sibelius, Hilary Hahn doesn't come close to the rendition of Heifetz's (personal taste so this is kinda voided as it's my opinion). Love that you mentioned Kyung Wha Chung's Bruch, Heifetz's is also really really good but hers is more unique. Mendelssohn, Heifetz's recording is regarded as one of the best.
Hilary Hahn The most horrible Bad Awful Sibelius violin concerto player! The Best Sibelius violin concerto players=Guila Bustabo ( The Queen Tiger Power) Viktor Tretjakov ( The King! The greatest Sibelius Ever) Jascha Heifetz ( The Sound!) Itzhak Perlman Leonid Kogan Miriam Fried Gidon Kremer Lisa Batiashvili! The Bad Sibelius violin concerto players=Sarah Chang ( no colors her violin sound Voice! Like Black white TV picture! Bad sound) James Ehnes ( The weakest Ever) Ann Sophie Mutter ( out of The rhythmic balance all The Time! Rough sound) Ida Haendel ( lazy Boring no talent) Yehudi Menuhin ( The most over-rated ever) Camilla Wick Igor Oistrakh Sergey Stadler
Many thanks as always Mr. Hurwitz! My modest list of the recent recordings without repetitions: Beethoven- Tetzlaff/Zinman; Mendelssohn- Ibragimova/Jurowski; Bruch- Jansen/Chailly ; Brahms- Shaham/ Abaddo; Dvorak- Vengerov/Masur (ditto to Mutter/Honeck) ; Tchaikovsky- Gluzman/ Litton (Glazunov could be added as it is coupling) ; Sibelius- Lin/Salonen.
I really love this list and have bought many of the recordings you used for it. As you did for the Violin could you do for the Cello and make an episode of the IDEAL Romantic Cello Concertos and also IDEAL 20th Century Cello Concertos?
Lets add a few women to the list: Beethoven: Faust/Abbado (Harmonia Mundi) Mendelssohn: Mullova/Gardiner Bruch: Janssen/Chailly (Decca) Dvorak: don't care fo:r it very much, so I substitute the Schumann: Kopatchinskaya/Holliger (Audite) Tchaikovsky: Kogan/Silvestri (Melodyia Brahms: Znaider/Gergiev (RCA (both non-women, I know) Sibelius: Mutter/Previn (DG)
Si es por agregar mujeres yo agregaria 1) en el Tchaikovsky, Erica Morini-Arthur Rodzinski/Royal Phil, me parece; 2) en el Sibelius Miriam Fried-Okko Kamu/Helsinski Philharmonic; 3) Dvorak Edith Peinemann-Paul Paray, que me parecen versiones superiores, and unsurpassables, in my opinion!
Ann Sophie Mutter her Sibelius violin concerto is so awful Bad! Mutter( out of The rhythmic balance all The Time! Rough raw sound Ever!) The Best Sibelius violin concerto players Are really=Guila Bustabo ( The Queen Tiger Power) Viktor Tretjakov,( The King! The greatest Sibelius Ever!) Jascha Heifetz ( The Sound!!!) Itzhak Perlman Leonid Kogan Miriam Fried Lisa Batiashvili Gidon Kremer!
I think that Laló - Symphonie Espagnole is also a great violin concerto that also is basically in every soloist's repertoire! I can recommend the Vengerov/Pappano recording.
Symphonie Espagnole was written for PABLO de SARASATE. Saint-Saens employed him for most of his violin pieces. Sarasate wrote his own great pieces like Zigeunerweisen and the Carman Fantasy!
One of my favorite recordings of the Sibelius is the early digital (1980) version by Dylana Jenson with Ormandy and the Philadelphians. The 1743 Guarnerius del Gesu instrument she used sounds luscious, and is matched by the opulent sound of the orchestra.
About the Oistrakh/Cleveland Orchestra/Szell Brahms Violin Concerto, EMI actually did reissue it in 2006 in its Great Recordings of the Century series. EMI did recognise that it got a gem in its hands.
I’d like to give a shout out to Goldmark. Not a concerto candidate for the pantheon but really, really beautiful when you’ve got Milstein / Blech putting it through its paces.
I'm reading through these IDEAL lists and struck by how many amazing performances there are of these works. You really can't go wrong with almost any of them. However, if I were to pick my IDEAL list it would be: 1) Beethoven - Yehudi Menuhin with Furtwangler from Lucerne in 1947 (available on Testament). This is a very special recording. Menuhin is at the peak dexterity and really has something to prove. Plus he and Furtwangler share such an obvious sympathy and partnership. Marvelous! 2) Mendelssohn: Issac Stern, Ormandy and Philadelphia. The lyricism of the playing just melts my heart. Such a beautiful recording. 3) Bruch #1 - Perlman, Haitink. You want warmth, you got it. 4) Dvorak - since picking Joseph Suk and Ancerl is kind of cheating, I'll go with Johanna Martzy and Ferenc Friscay. This performance seems almost forgotten, but what a magnificent one it is. Idiomatic, rhythmic and passionate. 5) Tchaikovsky: Oistrakh and Ormandy. Oistrahk is one performer who never took the Tchaikovsky for granted. He kept refining his performance throughout his life. The legato playing where the temptation is to go crazy is amazing. 6) Brahms - a newer recording - Augustin Hadelich with Miguel Harth-Bedoya. This is a bit of a controversial choice because it includes new cadenzas written by Thomas Ades. I find the Brahms can be a bit stiff, and this new version is a breath of fresh air. (I also love Kreisler's early recording but the sound is pretty terrible). 7) Sibelius - Ginette Neveu. She brought something very special to this work. Her tone was like fresh air down your spine. And so colorful.
It's fun to make lists like this. However little they are set in stone. My choice: -- Beethoven: Isabelle Faust / Claudio Abbado (Harmonia mundi france) -- Mendelssohn: Christian Tetzlaff / Paavo Järvi (Ondine). Historical bow to: Jascha Heifetz / Toscanini (1944, live. Naxos). Heifetz' violin tone is especially well captured here: sounds better mono than in the stereo repetition, in my view. In the third movement the violin strings glow with emotion -- Schumann (a special-case-concert, but very interesting): Gidon Kremer / Harnoncourt (Warner). Or, less unruly for the ear: Tetzlaff / Järvi. -- Bruch, Concert no.*3* (musically more interesting than the popular no.1): Antje Weithaas / Hermann Bäumer (cpo) -- Dvorak: Isabelle Faust / Jiri Belohlavek (Harmonia mundi france) -- Brahms: Vadim Repin / Riccardo Chailly (Deutsche Grammophon) -- Sibelius: Cho-Liang Lin / Salonen (Sony)
I’m glad you gave a shout out to Saint-Saenz’s 3rd. Maybe not up to snuff with some of your Big 7, but a fine work which deserves to be played more frequently.
Here Here! As a matter of fact S.S'.s No. 2 & 3 are every bit the Dvorak. What about any one of Paganini's concertos. Let's talk about somebody who trail blazed a different approach on playing the violin! Dave just picked out mainstream composers and their concertos and ran with it. The Violin composers like Rode, Paganini, Vieuxtemps, Wieniawski, Sarasate, Ysaye, for instance really showed you what you can do on a violin.
Very pleased to hear Mr. Hurwitz praise the Suk Fantasy---- my main violin teacher's teacher, Carl Flesch, championed the work all over Europe, and there is quite a tale, which I will have to relate at a later date, regarding Igor's teacher's own saga about trying to advocate for the work.
Charles Camille Saint-Saens: How do you define, "Not in everyone's repertorie"? It's evident you only chose popular-type-composers. That's a good method! Over the last 6 months, and I, being a serious classical music collector and critic, have went through Saint-Saens' entire instrumental catalogue. He is, without a doubt, in the Top-Ten List of Composers of All-Time! And his Violin Concertos are as good or better than anyone else, to be plain and simple about it. Yes, No. 3, I agree is the best and personally should be on the list or a list...too much Joachim and not enough Sarasate...here...
Just one plea - to try to include Leonid Kogan in any list of great violin performances. A powerhouse of passion, commitment, nobility and musicality. His Tchaikovsky with Nebolsin, 1950, is the deepest rendition I've yet heard of that popular warhorse.
That was a lovely talk, Dave. Probably the reason why you feel that the Sibelius is so particularly well balanced between violin and orchestra is that of the seven you chose Sibelius was maybe the best violinist, to the point that he was the closest to be a virtuoso of the instrument. There is a sad note in one of his Diaries, around the time he wrote the Fourth Symphony. He simply writes: "I dreamt I was a violin virtuoso". A bit heartbreaking.
I agreed with you about Mullova Sibelius. Because I have just learned about CAmilla Wicks passing away, I just listen to her Sibelius concerto, and I was thrilled. And a few weeks ago , I listen to Ida Handel (who passed away a few month ago) and again I was fascinated by her Sibelius too.
Since you commented on Bruch's compositional forte, Dave, I think that his double concerto for viola and clarinet should be given special credit (although, obviously, it is out of the scope of this particular talk). It is a beautiful work!
A wonderful list David! For more modern recommendations I would have Julia Fischer, Russian National and Yakov Kreizberg for the Tchaikovsky! Another one for the Brahms for me would be Rachel Barton Pine with Carlos Kalmer and Chicago Symphony. RBP is such an underrated artist!
Thank you for cracking the violin concerto ceiling, and especially in this repertoire there is no shortage of remarkable contemporary musicianship...simply amazing that a list such as yours can be so wonderful without including names such as James Ehnes, Julia Fischer and Hilary Hahn... And, just to add my two cents to this discussion, a big thumbs up for Zino Francescatti/Bruno Walter Beethoven performance...
My knowledge of violinists is limited, but for the Tchaikovsky, I really enjoyed Julia Fischer's performance with the French Radio Philharmonic, conducted by Vasily Petrenko. For the Sibelius, I've listened to a number of renditions, but I keep coming back to Oistrakh with Ormandy and the Philadelphia Orchestra. I'm adding Mullova and Ozawa to my playlist though. Thanks for the recommendations!
Dave, these "ideal lists" are so much fun! My list would be Beethoven: Milstein/Steinberg. Great playing, great conducting, great orchestral contribution. Mendelssohn: Oistrakh/Ormandy (monaural; the most lyrically beautiful of any I have heard) Bruch: Grumiaux (don't remember the conductor. This piece is made to order for this elegant violinist) Dvorak: Tasmin Little/Mackerras. Little has a smallish tone (no pun on her name intended), but her phrasing is lovely and Mackerras leads superbly. Brahms: Szeryng/Monteux. Warmer and more involving than his later version with Haitink. Sibelius: Stern/Ormandy. Ormandy, as usual, is both a great accompanist and a great Sibelian, and Stern gives one of his finest outings on record.
Thank you for the review. I take your point entirely about the "superiority" of piano concerti. I always think an orchestra is happy to accompany a world class pianist, whereas I've attended many violin concertos where you wonder if half the first violins are thinking "I could do better than that". That said, I love all the ones you selected and will check out those of your recommendations I don't own.
Beethoven: Grumiaux/Galliera. Mendelssohn: Hard to say. Since I can't choose Heifetz per the rules. I guess I'll say Rabin. Bruch: This is a tough one. I love this concerto and have excellent recordings by Stern (both) and Grumiaux. I'll pick the later stereo recording with Stern/Ormandy. Dvorak: Suk/Ancert. Brahms: Oistrakh/Szell. Sibelius: Kavakos/Vanska. Tchaikovsky: Heifetz/Reiner
Now that's a real challenge to narrow to specific performances for each masterpieces, but I'll give it a go. Beethoven: Kopatchinskaja/Herreweghe, Schneiderhan/Jochum, Grumiaux/Davis (sorry I really can't make up my mind here!) Mendelssohn: Jansen/Chailly Bruch: Chung/Kempe Dvorak: Stern/Ormandy Tchaikovsky: Huberman/Steinberg (esp. the remaster in the "Historical Tchaikovsky" box of EMI from the mid-90s) Brahms: Repin/Chailly Sibelius: Mutter/Previn +1 Schumann: Capucon/Harding (although I admit this piece isn't at the exalted level of the others)
Dear Dave: I was just wondering when you were going to talk about violin concertos, and I enjoyed your commentary immensely. Yes, I agree completely with you on "the seven", though I would personally add Saint-Saëns No. 3 into the list. The Dvorak is also one of my favorites because it is very lively and, like you said, very well balanced. Two concertos that I thought worth mentioning are (1) Goldmark, it took me about 25 years and it grew on me, and (2) Bruch No. 2, which I even prefer it to No. 1. However, the Schumann albeit very lyrical, comes across to me as a tad too wimpy as a composition. Coincidentally, the Mullova / Ozawa Tchaikovsky and Sibelius (Philips) was one of my very first recordings I owned. It's over 30 years now and this one still remains one of my favorite recordings. Milstein also has an excellent EMI recording of Beethoven and Brahms, though I didn't really like his own cadenzas too much; I like the Kreisler rendition for both. Finally, a few words on Perlman: I went to see him play the Tchaikovsky some 20 years ago in Toronto. He was a superb violinist, no doubt, but it was pretty clear he was on autopilot the whole time. I was a bit disappointed because of that.
By coincidence, I was listening to the Sibelius earlier today - specifically, my favourite recording, by Hilary Hahn. What a humdinger of a disc that is, coupled with a fine account of the Schoenberg concerto. I don't have Mullova's Sibelius, but I'll certainly seek it out :)
Hilary Hahn so awful horrible Sibelius violin concerto player! The Best Sibelius violin concerto players Are really=Guila Bustabo ( The Queen Tiger Power) Viktor Tretjakov ( The King! The greatest Sibelius Ever) Jascha Heifetz ( The Sound!! ) Itzhak Perlman Leonid Kogan Miriam Fried Lisa Batiashvili Gidon Kremer!
Yay! I am very fortunate (or was way back in the ancient times of eight months ago when people enjoyed live music with minimal risk of death) to live in Columbus, Ohio where Gluzman enjoys "Principal Guest Artist" status with our ProMusica Chamber Orchestra. I enjoyed the nod he received here.
Enjoyed this! The Perlman /Giulini Beethoven was one of my first classical discoveries and I've never heard better, a personal favourite. The Heifetz /Munch Mendelssohn I also love much prefer swift tempi in this piece, especially in the first movement. And the Mullova Sibelius is a marvellous recording - I saw hear play this, conducted by Okko Kamu, in London on her debut in the West after escaping her minders. I love Isaac Stern's Bruch Concerto, along with... Lalo!! 😆 In the Sibelius I love Chung's recording too. Curiously, I 'm not overly mad on the Tchaikovsky either but saw Vadim Repin at the proms, he was great. Mullova is also good in that, Chung too. I have the Milstein will give it another spin. Julia Fischer plays the Dvorak beautifully. Cheers!
Hi Dave, I have to admit that for the most part you are right. These 7 are the greatest of the many out there. Eventhough, the thing with violin music and violin concertos in particular is that the violin as an instrument is a charmer, it is a magician for its own merit. That's the reason I think, that so many were written...and I mean that even minor ones like 'the trash ones' as you described it lol 😆 owes their existence to the fact that The Violin can make them sound wonderful, no matter if the music is great or for the sake of writing something for this charmer! I speak from the view point of the violinist because I'm one. And I have studied and played most majors and minors too. And I would like to add just one masterpiece in the list, for as I see, there are so many wonderful suggestions that I cannot disagree and it would be pedantic to write an other one. So, my suggestion is Max Bruch VC no.3! Wonderful, such heartfelt warmth, his material is of the highest quality. He was born to write wonderful violin music. Ofcourse that is not the case with the his Symphonies etc. Indeed boring!
I agree with you that Bruch's other violin concertos are fine works, perhaps because the virtuoso element prevents the composer's self-consciously "good taste" from turning dull.
My choices: Beethoven - Suk & Boult (also with Konwitschny) Mendelssohn - Kogan & Maazel Bruch - Chung & Previn (also Tenstedt) Dvorák - Zimmermann & Bêlohlávek Brahms - Belkin & Iván Fischer Tchaikovsky - Lozakovich & Spivakov Sibelius - Kavakos & Vänskä (I refer to the revised version, as he did both on that BIS)
For the Beethoven there is one with Kogan and your beloved Paris Conservatoire Orchestra with Silvestri. It's the first one I've heard and so quite special to me
Interesting that you don't include the Elgar which I've seen included in a Big 8 with the others you mention. But as you say it's a different genre, yet not really "20th century". Is it unique? I've heard it described as "intimate". Nice to hear the shout out for Saint-Saens No.3 which some dismiss as trivially pretty, but is both lovely and nicely constructed. What's wrong with good tunes? Hadn't realised that Strauss had acknowledged the link of the Alpine Symphony theme to Bruch's - "steal with pride"!
Oistrakh also did the Brahms with Kondrashin and the State Orchestra Of Ussr as well as Rozhdestvensky and the Moscow Radio and Television Symphony Orchestra and with Konwitschny and the Staatskapelle Dresden. I agree completely with you that Szell and Klemperer are the ones to beat!
Beethoven - Hahn/Zinman Baltimore Brahms - Shaham/Abbado Berlin Mendelssohn - Kyung Wha Chung/Dutoit Montreal Bruch - Cho-Liang Lin/Slatkin Chicago (and for the Bruch Scottish Fantasy) Dvorak - Perlman/Barenboim LSO Tchaikovsky - Milstein/Steinberg Pittsburgh Sibelius - Heifetz/Hendl Chicago
Hi Dave, great video again. Everyone loves a violin concerto and 111 comments up to now! Personally, i would like a talk on not the standard repertoire but some other ones that have dropped through the net. Maybe name 5 unsung ones that need greater attention?
Hi, another wonderful overview! Would you please do a listing of recommended recordings of Romantic Piano Concertos, i.e., Chopin, Mendelssohn, Brahms, Schumann, Tcahikovsky, Liszt, and Grieg? Thank you!
Coincidentally, I was listening late last night to my CD of Menuhin playing the Bruch (with the Philharmonia conducted by Walter Susskind) which is coupled with the Mendelssohn concerto (also with the Philharmonia - this time conducted by Efrem Kurtz). This video has informed me usefully of other versions - but I would prefer to see lesser known works for the instrument get the sort of oxygen of publicity via the performances they deserve and become as well known in their own right.
I haven't heard the dvorak concerto. Am going to look for the performance you recommended. Have you heard the Tchaikovsky with currentzis? I really liked his disk of the piece. Sibelius may be my favorite of the lot, because I'm crazy about Sibelius and his music. Slowly he's becoming my favorite composer, alongside mahler. Hann is my choice here. I really like her playing.
Beethoven: Christian Tetzlaff DSO Berlin (ONLINE) Mendelssohn: James Ehnes/Phil (ONYX) Bruch: Sarah Chang/Masur/Dresner (EMI) Dvorak: Josef Suk, Václav Neumann, Czech Philharmonic (SUP) Brahms: Szeryng /RCO/Haitink Tchaikovsky: Ray Chen/SwedenRSO/Harding Sibelius: Batiashvili/ Staatskapelle Berlin/Barenboim(DG)
My ideal list: Beethoven: Tetzlaff/Zinman (Arte Nova) Mendelssohn: Midori/Jansons (Sony) Bruch: Mutter/Karajan (DG) Dvorak: Suk/Ancerl (Supraphon) - despite less than great sound (for that, I'd go for Mutter or Tetzlaff but both are already on my list) Tchaikovsky: Oistrakh/Ormandy (Sony) Brahms: Shaham/Abbado (DG) Sibelius:Hahn/Salonen (DG)
I am late to this but wow, thanks. As I'm still learning the finer intricacies of listening to the music, my list might feature a "reject" or two, but nonetheless, here goes: Beethoven - Wolfgang Schneiderhan & Euges Joschen (always likes this, but recently surpassed by Gil Shaham & Eric Jacobsen). Mendelssohn - Herbert Von Karajan & Anne-Sophie Mutter (I knew no better. Then came Tetzlaff & Paavo Järvi) Bruch - Chung and Tennstedt Dvorak - Menuhin & Enescu (it was what my Grandma liked. Again, I did not know anything else existed) Sibelius - Hilary Hahn & Esa-Pekka Salonen Tchaikovsky - Heifetz and Reiner (now also Lisa Batiashvili and Barenboim) Brahms - Ferras & Herbert von Karajan (this was the total extent of my exposure to Brahms. Now there is Gluzman with James Gaffigan) What can I say. I'm a metalhead.
Hilary Hahn so awful horrible Sibelius violin concerto player! The Best Sibelius violin concerto players Are really=Guila Bustabo ( The Queen Tiger Power) Viktor Tretjakov ( The King! The greatest Sibelius Ever) Jascha Heifetz ( The Sound!!) Itzhak Perlman Leonid Kogan Miriam Fried Lisa Batiashvili Gidon Kremer!
OK, maybe it's because I'm a violinist (who wishes he could do it all over and play the piano), but the violin repertoire is nowhere near that small. The problem isn't that there isn't enough, the problem is that most of it is relatively unplayed because the golden age of the violin was the Baroque, right after Stradivari and Guarneri made their instruments. The violin was clearly not invented to be a solo instrument against a gigantic orchestra, it was invented to solo against a very small ensemble, with easy clarity for fast runs, and improvisatory elements like ornaments and cadenzas. Most of the best violin work was done by 1750: not just Bach and Vivaldi but Corelli, Telemann, Tartini, Locatelli. We all roll our eyes when it comes onto classical radio, .but often that's because a lot of it is just played badly because it was meant to be a blank slate, improvised upon and only able to live in performance. Like any composer who writes a lot, some of those Vivaldi concertos (to take the most obvious example) are better than others, but whereas the piano was basically created for 1840, the violin was invented for the the kind of music written around 1715, and a lot of it is still misunderstood and we're still waiting for most of violinists on record who can really do it justice.
@@etucker82 Well he didn't "neglect" it, He left it to one side with what I suspect you considered an inadequate explanation. To be fair I wasn't entirely happy about that either - especially since Bruch got included. But hey the choices were otherwise sound.
Beethoven - Perlman/Giulini Mendelssohn - Midori/Jansons Bruch 1 - Kyung Wha Chung/Kempe Dvorak - Tasmin Little/Handley Tchaikovsky - Oistrakh/Ormandy for Auer version with cuts, Kremer/Maazel for original text version without cuts Brahms - Kremer/Bernstein or Rachel Barton Pine/Kalmar Sibelius - Lin/Salonen or Kuusisto/Segerstam I would add Bruch Scottish Fantasy & 2nd Concerto - Perlman with Lopez-Cobos or Mehta (he did the same coupling twice and both are great) I agree Saint Saens 3rd is the best of those not included in your top 7 - Julian Rachlin/Mehta The other famous ones (Wieniawski/Vieuxtemps/Lalo/Paganini) are not musically thrilling to me
Excellent discussion! It’s interesting that there are many more great 20th Century violin concertos than Romantic ones. Off the top of my head I can think of Nielsen, Bartok, Berg, Stravinsky, Prokofiev, Shostakovich, Walton, Gubaidulina, and Ligeti and more that I have forgotten. And Prokofiev, Shostakovich, and Gubaidulina each wrote 2 masterpieces in the genre! For the Romantic ones: Beethoven with Grumiaux/Galliera for his patrician interpretation, but I also love Tetzlaff/Zinman with the “piano version” cadenzas. Mendelssohn, a more recent one with Hadelich/Harth-Bedoya that doesn’t treat the work with kid gloves. For Bruch I only have a BBC Music cover disc with Tasman Little and the BBCNOW/Atherton which is excellent and the work is not among my favorites. Dvorak has to be with the Czech Phil. My reference is the one you mentioned: Suk/Ancerl, but an updated version that I love as well and has great sound is by the orchestra’s concertmaster, Josef Spacek with Belohlavek that also includes the Suk Fantasy and Janacek “Violin Concerto.” It’s one of my favorite recordings period! So glad you included this great concerto in your talk. For Tchaikovsky I’ll go with Heifetz/Reiner because he plays it faster than others and observes the cuts of so many repetitious runs! For Brahms there are several, but I’ll choose Oistrakh/Klemperer (though I should also mention a sleeper on Naxos with Ilya Kaler and the Bournemouth SO/Inkinen). Both take the finale more slowly as a heavy Hungarian dance which I really like. For Sibelius it’s a choice between Lin/Salonen and Hahn/Salonen. Both violinists are terrific and I’ve never heard anyone better in the orchestra part than Salonen. Lin is paired with an equally fine account of the Nielsen, so I’ll choose him over Hahn who has the Schoenberg concerto as a coupling which I rarely listen to.
@@hwelf11 Yes, of course! How could I have forgotten those great concertos! I have both Zehetmair/Rattle and Skride/Petrenko recordings and love them both. While on the Polish theme I should also add Lutoslawski’s Chain 2 and the two Penderecki concertos. There are others I have forgotten, such as Barber’s concerto and David just did a talk on his music!!
@@johnwright7749 I have Zehetmair/Rattle and Juillet/Dutoit, and Oistrakh/Sanderling in # 1 , as well as an LP of both the Symanowski's with Antoni Wit and the Polish National Symphony, and a violinist named Hanna Lachert - I can vouch for the others, but can't remember if I ever found time to listen to this one. ( David is reminding me of too many recordings I need to revisit or discover, as the case may be). For the Barber , I have Olivero/Slatkin, which I find satisfying.
@@hwelf11 I also have Olivero and Takezawa also with Slatkin, and of course Stern/Bernstein-still my favorite-but they all are fine. Speaking of Bernstein, I forgot to include the Hindemith Violin Concerto with Stern, as well as a more recent one with Franz Peter Zimmermann and the Frankfurt RSO/Paavo Järvi on BIS. I’m sure they’re others, too, that I have forgotten!
Great video!! I am curious if you are familiar with Sibelius’ short works for violin and orchestra. I adore the two serenades, especially the first in D major, and think they are even better than his violin concerto. I have not been able to get excited about the other short works though. Do you have any recommendations for performances that could change my mind around the other works? Thank you, as always, for your insight.
The serenades are lovely, but go with your gut. No performances are going to change your mind about the rest (btw, I don't think they are better than the Violin Concerto).
Yes, the violin seems to be a tricky instrument to write solo concertos for, even if the composer plays the instrument himself. I definitely do prefer the piano version of Beethoven’s op 61 and even the piano arrangement of Brahms violin concerto, with Dejan Lazic. I’d love to hear the others on this list for piano. And Bach’s sonatas and partitas that were mentioned as reference; well, according to contemporary sources he and his circle played them on the clavichord or harpsichord, filling out harmony and bass lines where necessary. Tells you something... American keyboard player Robert Hill recorded the ones that were transcribed (possibly by Bach himself) and added a few transcriptions of his own. Best recording there is of those works, especially the fugues. Sorry, a bit off topic perhaps but interesting in a violin ”masterpiece” context, perhaps.
I think the Bruch Scottish Fantasy could be an eighth entry on your list. It's full of good tunes and is a much better piece than the other violin musical travelogue (the Lalo Symphonie Espagnol) which I know you hate. The Heifetz recording with Malcolm Sargent makes a terrific case for this piece. Regarding the Brahms Concerto, I don't know the Oistrakh recording with Szell (though I do know his excellent recording with Konwitschny and the Dresden Staatskapelle ), but I have high regard for Isaac Stern's recording with Ormandy. Stern was in excellent form and the Philadelphia Orchestra plays with rich, warm tone. The big oboe solo in the slow movement, by the way, is played fabulously by John deLancie.
All this is good, but I dearly miss the one and only Christian Ferras with Karajan. They did Beethoven, Tchaikovsky, Brahms and Sibelius. People should know, that CF had a noble, passionate, rich, expressive and lyrical tone with very precise intonation, technically impecable and throughout satisfying on the spots where some major violinists would play in the style of "no-one-could-do-this-anyway". I would love to hear a reason why did you ommit the immortal Ferras's recordings? Thanks and keep videoing.
My list, although as always I must agree with some of yours: - Beethoven: Jean-Jacques Kantorow, Netherlands Chamber Orchestra, Antoni Ros-Marbá - Mendelssohn: Wolfgang Schneiderhan, Berliner Philharmoniker, Ferenc Fricsay - Bruch: really? who cares? - Dvorak: Isaac Stern, Philadelphia Orchestra, Eugene Ormandy (though I prefer Milstein-Minneapolis-Dorati, but you told us not to repeat your soloists) - Tchaikovsky: Alfredo Campoli, London Symphony Orchestra, Ataúlfo Argenta - Brahms: Zino Francescatti, New York Philharmonic, Leonard Bernstein - Sibelius: Ida Haendel, Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra, Paavo Berglund
I suppose it really depends on one's definition of 'romantic'. I would say - maybe going out on a limb - that the Elgar is certainly a romantic concerto, as are Prokofievs, and even the Berg at a push. But if we are being strict about it, sticking to the 19th Century, either of Zehetmair's recordings of the Beethoven do it for me, and Kyung Wha Chung's Bruch would definitely be on my list (Max really was a one hit wonder). I agree that the Tetzlaff is a great recording of the Dvorak (and the Suk is a really interesting work).
Just curious, David, did you ever play with the (Manhattan) Downtown Symphony? I ask, because I once schlepped through the Schumann P.C. with that band. It would have been in the timeframe of 1987-8-9. It was fun to do. But it would be really surreal if you were on the timps.
Hi David, I have a very different view on the recordings of some of these concertos (I don't know as many recordings as you, by far). For me Mendelssohn and Bruch are problematic because they are often played as "beginner-recordings" before the players have become really great. So most recordings of these concerts are not completely convincing for me, especially on Mendelssohn. It is mostly played either like Tschaikowsky ("old fashioned") or like haydn ("modern") and not many players get the specific quality of this piece. That's of course only my personal view.
This may be a dumb question, but........are Barber's and Korngold's violin concertos not listed because they were written much later? Because, for me, those two seem to have an equally romantic grandeur like the other seven. Anyway, just curious. Great video, as always.
Yes, that is the reason. That's also why Elgar's isn't listed. I regard it as a 20th century work (as opposed to the Sibelius). I know it's arbitrary, but I had to draw the line somewhere. It was a 30 minute talk already...
I have played violin for nearly 50 years and listened to many many great artists playing the 7 violin concertos here. Although I have not made up my mind on 5 concertos, my choice for the Mendelssohn is the Campoli, LPO, Boult (a magical reading of a concerto Campoli was supposed to have performed 900 times) and the Tchaikovsky done by Kogan, the Paris Conservatoire Orchestra, Silvestri (a smoking smoker of this fabulous concerto). Have you ever sampled these gems David?
Alex Madorsky the Schumann has an infinitely better second movement than the Tchaikovsky concerto. You can see in the Schumann where Brahms got the idea to feature a second “soloist” for the second movement.
@@gabevalle2659 I confess I come from a bit of a Phillistine perspective here: I almost never listen to violin concertos, often find them tedious, and many of them blend together in my head. The Schumann falls squarely into this category for me. I just don’t find much memorable to the piece. That doesn’t mean I think it’s dreck, just not much there to hold my attention. I never got into the Tchaikovsky before I saw Gil Shaham do it live.
Alex Madorsky The Schumann is absolutely an acquired taste, and if you’re new to the genre it’s definitely not a great introduction to it. But, Schumann is not afraid to explore the lower range of the instrument instead of having the violin sit high all the time, it’s full of drama and excitement, has a gorgeous second movement, and has a very fun and rhythmically refreshing polonaise for the last movement (who does a polonaise rondo as a finale!?). Yes, it can be a little repetitive, but that’s all Schumann at the end, give him a break he was on the edge of a mental breakdown, and was still in absolute control 95% of the time. I would definitely recommend giving it another try. The Tchaikovsky is really easy to listen to and a great introduction, but nearly every great concerto beats it. It’s got great melodies, but they just are thrown at you time and time again, it’s Mozart but without the harmonic innovation and development to back it up.
Dave, I urge you to watch on youtube, "The Art of Violin", by Bruno Mansaingeon. Please note, Itzhak Perlman's fundamentally correct comparison between the piano and violin......There are other great solo works for the violin besides Bach's for instance the caprices and solo works of the following: Pierre Rode, De Beriot, Paganini, Vieuxtemps, Wieniawski, and Ysaye to name a few.
@@DavesClassicalGuide You need to watch the video starting @ the 1:25.25 mark; you'll realize the difference between the piano and violin. The violin is more difficult to master than the piano. I've purchased more than a few of your suggestions, and you know your recordings, and I am grateful. God Bless......
@@camillesaint-saens3166 I know that. I said that in my violin talks--it's a much more difficult instrument. It requires two independent skill sets, one for each hand.
It's not on the list because it is not anything like as popular or widely known as the others (I love it, personally), and because seven works is enough for a half hour video. I am always a bit amazed at this constant demand for more--always more--when most people really haven't listened carefully and thoughtfully to what we have. I plan to talk about many of these works in due course, but seriously, what's the rush? Why does everything have to be crammed into one video? Relax everyone! We'll get there.
I have a stupid question and it deals with "How do I determine if a work is romantic or 20th century?" It comes in when I classify music according to genre on iTunes - I want to be consistent and it is problematic. I always had the Sibelius as "20th Century". Also problematic (for me) is Debussy - Romantic or 20th Century? What is the rule you use?
I have the Szeryng/Monteaux. IMHO this great - and hard to get recording - has never been bettered. I believe it is only available on the Monteaux RCA stereo set.
Brian M. Smith I do as well, or the LP at least. Szeryng for me, not including Joachim of course, is unbeatable as a Brahms and Bach interpreter. The recording has been uploaded to RU-vid, but I’m not sure of it’s status on CD. But yes, the best Brahms VC recording out there in my opinion as well, a truly superb combination of violinist, conductor, and orchestra. It’s a shame Szeryng gets written off so quickly these days, his Brahms sonatas with Rubinstein on piano are also out of this world!
@@ce2167-n1t I have this performance on an old LP and its first RCA CD reissue, and both have subpar sound. The orchestra sounds covered and "boxy" at times, and loud passages have some distortion. Are these problems fixed in the current download? PS. Anyone looking for the recording should search for "Monteux," which is the correct spelling of his name.
@@ce2167-n1t If you like Szeryng, there is a big box set of his recordings available in the UK on Presto. Or, I should say, it was available a few months ago. Wonderful concerto and chamber music recordings. Also his chamber music discs with Rubinstein on RCA are great.
Not offhand. I'm going from memory here, but the similarity is so obvious. It was one of those tidbits I picked up working on my Strauss book. If memory serves, there was a rehearsal of the work and Strauss told the players something like, "take it from the Bruch," or words to that effect. Hopefully I didn't dream it up, because it's a great story.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Norman Del Mar points this out, and even includes a musical example on p. 112, Vol. 2 of "Richard Strauss - A Critical Commentary of His Life and Works" (which I think is THE indispensable work in English on Strauss).
Like Lydia (see comments), the Beethoven bored me shitless until I heard Zehetmair/Bruggen who do the first movement in 2 in the bar, as it should be, instead of the deadly 4! So did the Brahms until I heard the old Milstein/Steinberg on the radio. My other choices would be: Mendelssohn - the stereo Campoli/Boult or Janine Jensen who is awesome! Tchaikovsky - Campoli/Argenta or Ray Chen; Sibelius - Niveu/Susskind; Dvorak - Tognetti/Australian Chamber Orch/Halstead; Bruch - not sure !
I dont like this rule of one different artist for each piece - not here nor in the other selections - is good. I think you will not make another video about each concerto - so I would like to know the best in each one in your opinion. I know this your channel - but as your public I would like leave my opinion. What do your followers think?
First, one approach (the ideal list) does not preclude another, except where I find it unhelpful--in this case for the reasons I explained. You are free to disagree with those reasons, but I hope that you will try to understand them and find more here whose approach you agree with than not. That really is the best I can do.
All your choices are great. But I still have a particular crush on Hillary Hahn. It is just a chromosome affinity. Lol And Gitlis is still giving me the goose bumps.
Thanks Dave and so many interesting thoughts on the contrasting reception of piano and violin concertos. But surely the Berg concerto is the ne plus ultra of the romantic violin concerto and so if you can only have seven it’s a real horror to leave it out (for once I’d disagree and say that if you’re going to include Dvorak and not that there’s something not quite right. And I like the Dvorak concerto!)
I love the Milstein/Abbado Tchaikovsky as much as anyone, and I definitely imprinted on it, but....these days almost everyone has reinstated the Leopold Auer cuts in the finale, which were obligatory for so many years. Does that mean Milstein should be a 1st choice with a caveat that it’s cut? I wouldn’t have said so 15 years ago, but now I would. Only problem is, who to recommend?
Reading through the comments 1 day after this video posted, two things strike me. First, this video really brought out the comments! Second, what diversity/lack of consensus! Clearly an embarrassment of riches with this repertoire.
Beethoven: Schneiderhan/Jochum. runners up: Kreisler/Barbirolli, Jansen/Jarvi, Menuhin/Furtwangler Mendelssohn: Francescatti/Szell (needs Heifetz's tempos but Heifetz plays it with so much hardness it sounds like Prokofiev) runner up: Milstein/Walter or Abbado Bruch: Who cares.... listen to the chamber music.... Dvorak: Franck/Mackerras, runners up: Milstein/Steinberg, Suk/Ancerl for Czech Philharmonic. Tchaikovsky: Heifetz/Susskind (it's trash, Heifetz plays it like trash and it's great) runners up: Gitlis/Hollreiser, Brahms: Huberman/Rodzinski, for more modern: Zehtmaier/Northern Sinfonia or Barton Pine/Kalmar or Morini/Rodzinski or you guessed it... (Frank Stallone) Milstein/Steinberg Sibelius: Gitlis/Horenstein, runners up: Heifetz/Mitropoulos, Spivakovsky/dunno..., Oistrakh/Fougstedt (whoever that is...) And Elgar: Kennedy/Rattle or Paul Daniel live at the Proms. Runner up: Menuhin/Elgar of course. Honestly, the wrong names in the violin world are promoted (as is true everywhere....). The big names are usually fine: reliable and professional, but they're not where the real interest is. when you spend a lot of time listening to many of the big names: Heifetz, Perlman, Oistrakh, Kogan, Stern, Hahn, Fischer, it's very easy to believe that there's little difference between the greats (Milstein gets a pass because he's the most 'excellent' of all.) But when you listen to some of the slightly taken for granted names: Gitlis, Huberman, Francescatti, Szigeti, Enescu, J. Sitkovetsky, Spivakovsky, Morini, Kreisler (taken for granted today....), Thibaud, Jansen, Zehtmair, Kremer, even Menuhin at his (rare) best, it's impossible not to see that these are artists of individuality, and impossible to mistaken one for the other, in terms of interpretation as well as sound. You just have to be prepared for artists who don't devote themselves to the sound, and who makes lots of mistakes in the name of excess, because it's an instrument made for bravado and overheated passion.
