It was easy to forget how terrible roman is throughout s2 and like half of 3 but literally in the first episode of the show he rips up a million dollar check in front of that kid and his parents at the park. He's a bit of a demon
He's a POS who deserves every bad thing coming his way. Shiv needs to cut ties with these losers. Tom looks like he's on his way out so save yourself girl.
I don't think I've hated Roman any more than I did in this scene. That being said, I love how the show makes you hate a character in one episode and feel sorry for them in the next.
the reason he's being like that is because his brothers and sister always thought he was a dumbass his whole life - and it was very obviously shown to him and everyone which made him so insecure. so instead of curling up and accepting life he got his shit together by having jerry mentor him which got his career on track in his dad's eyes until the dickpic incident. Even Rhea said Roman would make a better CEO amongst all of the other siblings. so when he finally got into his dad's good side and doing well for himself he didnt waste anytime letting his siblings know who the man was.
the "hit me" scene made me cry cause THAT'S THE ONE LINE kendall could never cross. it reminded of that time logan hit roman and broke his tooth and kendall instantly jumped to his brother's defense while everyone else was to shocked to react. The fact that roman is the one who hit him by the end of this scene was even more heartbreaking.
I honestly think that Roman is the shittiest of all the siblings. But also, let's not forget, he was the only one who seemed to have a problem with his dad's decision to let Kendall take the fall. I think all the siblings, Rome included, do love each other (the boat scene in s1e09, for example). They just love Logan's admiration and approval more. Roman, who was till now thought of as the family fuck up, the good for nothing, is finally displaying some level of acumen for business, and thinks that his father, who singled him out for physical abuse, finally loves him. Yes, he is a grossly unpleasant person. But like all Roy siblings, it's a trauma response (just to be clear, I don't think trauma gives everybody a free pass to be shit to others). I read somewhere that Roman looks at everything through the lens of a hurt child -"If I just try hard enough, daddy might finally love me". And this goes for all Roy siblings, but Roman gets it the worst. Now he does have some semblance of approval from his father, so of course he is gonna ride high on it for a while. Ultimately, this is something Logan had deprived him from for so long, and he is finally getting it (ar least he thinks so). Roman is probably the softest of all the siblings, playing at being the toughest and the most badass, but it is all an act. He is just an immature person, who was never able to separate himself from the abuse from his father, and the bullying from his siblings (dog cage).
I think Kendall is really hurt by Roman, considering all the times Kendall stood up for him. Seeing Roman act like this on his birthday just hurts him. I really hope Kendall gets it back together
True. after all was said and done he always tried to get Roman Shiv and himself to run waystar. he always goes to roman because he sees roman like maybe even roman doesn't see himself.
@@Fleyk1707I get what you are saying but I do think Conner stepped in as much as was appropriate for him. These are not kids but grown adults and there is only so much he can do. I also think he has a passive personality which is fine, not everyone has that alpha male quality. I saw this as a dad telling his kids to knock it off before he steps in.
Connor looks pained to see them at each other's throats but he can't bring himself to intervene. I think it's just too much for him. And Kendall angrily shouting at him repeatedly to take off his jacket is just the cue for him and Willa to leave.
How is it funny? I don't care about Ken character, but this bit was horribly sad. It's like a person , who just learned about the death of their most beloved person, but instead of stright up crying or raging, they get obsessed with super insignificant details. Because when people are emotionally shocked, they do demonstrate this type of behaviour. People really get some sort of altered state of consciousness and start obsessing over weird details. So the writers did this bit here, to show how broken and inadequate Ken is at this point. Instead of reacting to Roman's behaviour he seems to be quiet and non-reactive, but he suddenly starts obsessing with how inappropriate is is to have a coat on at the party.
unbelievable perfomances from everyone here. ken's broken, huddled demeanor contrasting with roman's borderline demonic presence. shiv looking truly shaken, finally coming to the same realization ken did back in the first season. one of the best scenes in the series.
this scene. Wow. Roman encompassing all the worst of his dad with a heaping helping of his own worst traits. Shiv realizing shes totally adrift of anything going on within the company and now crossing moral lines she doesn't want to cross.
My favorite part of this scene (other than Shiv actually finding some humanity) is that Kendall's "You're not a real person" diss to Roman, even though it sounds unclever and kind of pathetic actually REALLY gets to him. You can see it on his face as Kendall says it, it's the exact same expression he made when Logan called him a moron is season 2 and those are the only two times he makes it. It's only for a split second, but you can see in that moment he knows its the truth. Out of all the siblings (even Connor) Roman's always been the most starved of affection from Logan. He always acts like he doesn't give a shit, and it's true that he's enjoying an inevitably temporary moment as Logan's favorite kid, but it's all completely meaningless. Roman's had his humanizing moments, but those were all within the context of him never thinking he had a real shot of being the successor. His behavior now that he's finally got a taste of Logan's love demonstrates once and for all who he truly is. He's not the court jester who sees through everyone else's bullshit, he's a pathetic narcissist just like all the rest, only he's the most insecure out of all of them. You want to see who someone is? Give them power. You want to see who a Roy sibling is? Make them Logan's apparent successor. Ken's an insecure, self-loathing workhorse , Shiv's a vindictive, hypocritical control freak, but Roman? Roman's an honest to god piece of shit with no values at all and I'm honestly glad they decided to send him down this road because he was so easy to hate at the beginning of the show and now after working his way up he makes a great villain. He's completely relinquished any sense of identity or individuality and allowed himself to become nothing more than a vessel for his father's will. Even Shiv at some level prioritized her own values over pleasing Logan, even if she still caved when he intimidated her (with the whole Mencken thing). You could argue that Roman refused to sign the letter against Kendall, but that was when Shiv was still very clearly the golden child, and he didn't have to worry about losing that spot. Now he's flat out sending men to stalk and spy on his own niece. No person would do that if they weren't a scumbag. He's proved outright that there is nothing he will not do, no bridge he won't burn or line he won't cross to please his father. He's become exactly what Logan wants out of a child: an empty, soulless minion who will let him live a second life through them. He's not a real person, and while he may have confidence now as the favorite, the moment he fucks up (and he WILL fuck up) and Logan starts giving him the cold shoulder he's going to have nothing and no one to fall back on. I truly cannot wait for that moment to happen. Pride cometh before the fall. This has been coming since he abused that kid in the first episode.
My thoughts exactly... I genuinely can't wait to see what the writers are going to do with his character. His whole existence is based entirely on Logan's approval. At least Connor has a gf (the fact that their relationship is purely transactional is another question), Shiv had a good career before and Kendall has his children but Roman has absolutely nothing going for him
@@bltr2507 Exactly. On the subject of Connor (who I'm glad got some actual depth injected into him this season) I'd say he's the least dysfunctional (which is not exactly impressive I know) because he's probably the only one out of all of them that ever got Logan's love unconditionally. His mother was Logan's first wife, so Logan himself was probably a less cynical and jaded person at that point. Also, his lack of involvement in the family business shows that Logan almost certainly never put the same pressure on him as the other kids, and based off the age differences he was probably an only child until he was literally an adult. Yes, he's a classic rich kid with no discipline or life skills, but at least he doesn't hate himself.
I’ve grown to appreciate how this show doesn’t try to drastically change the characters for no reason. What could be perceived as changes are usually just people being put under different circumstances. And by now all the Siblings have had the chances to show their different sides. It’s not a matter of who wins, but who can let their best side come out when needed.
Yeah, but part of me also thinks she only felt that way because Romain fucked over both of them with the Gojo meeting. So Kendall is her ally in his situation with a hint of companion for spying on the kids. She didn’t have much compassion for Tom
Damn nicely put i completely forgot about what he did to that child i forgot he had that in him the show introduced him as a piece of crap and humanised him to the point where we sympathized and forgot his true character excellent writing they dont miss a beat
I think this reveals a lot about romans true character. He thinks he’s a hot shot businessman for ideologically sucking off Mencken who imo will flip on the family once elected and is riding on a high where he thinks daddy’s love enables him to do whatever. Its set in stone when he calls his dad and says “im the only one you need “.
agreed. adding to that his deal with mattson is bound to blow up. Hes some sort of tech billionaire nihilist who would literally piss on them and proves what he thinks about them. He gives zero shits about anybody and the deal means next to nothing for him. He can troll them for fun and they need him more than he needs them. Hes like Elon Musk capable of trolling with little to no consequence except none of the high minded goals.
This dialogue is fucking Shakespearean. Every single line is almost lyrical and dripping with meaning and says so much about every character without saying it out loud, it’s absolutely fucking amazing, I wish I could write like this
Man, roman was so SO OUT OF LINE for doing all that! To ken's kids? like seriously? The fact that his desperate need and desire for logan's affection is driving him THIS FAR? INSANE! What hurts me even more is that he did this AFTER ken was the only sibling that stood up and demanded logan to stay away when he hit rome in the previous season. like that reaction from ken was so spontaneous, showing that he truly cares about roman underneath all the facade and drama, something even shiv didn't do despite being in the same room! And roman went and did THAT to him?! I think that realization hurt ken even more. The fact that he cared enough to protect roman from logan, despite striving for his dad's approval himself, because he had a sense of loyalty to his siblings but roman literally proved that he is nothing but a vessel for logan's will and that he will do ANYTHING and hurt ANYONE for their dad, who probably will never truly approve any of them till the end. The "bootleg logan" comment did come true in the worst way possible. Roman's "hit me" only made it worse because it was a direct parallel to what logan told him after completely shattering his hopes. So, what's the difference? In that scene in season 1, you could see ken's fist balled showing his pent up frustration and anger, and that maybe if he wasn't so scared of logan, maybe...MAYBE he would hit him because he sure as hell WANTED TO but here, there is no anger left in him. Ken is totally broken and his own brother has made the deepest cut, with no feeling of guilt or remorse for what he's done! That's why ken walks away, even when roman trips him he doesn't respond because what's the point? Logan has already got to ALL of them.
To be fair to Shiv, she was utterly shocked and quickly came to make sure Roman was okay. And the guilt she felt about being the reason Logan hit him was apparent on her face
Roman is truly fuckin disturbed. All he talks about is sex and he can’t even get it up. Would love to see some background on his character. I mean, wtf happened to this guy?
indeed. Great writing and performances all around. Perfect execution. Powerful, compelling and memorable. I'd put this scene up there with Shiv and Tom at the beach in Croatia.
He’s always been cruel to Kendall. They have always been hateful towards him. Yet it so bad when he betrays them back sometimes because all they do is stab him in the back
I'm glad Naomi was around for Kendall because he might have tried harming himself. If not for the fact that she was an addict like Ken she would be a good choice of partner for Kendall.
This was the worst thing Roman ever did in my opinion. The callousness is unreal, pushing a broken man to the ground in front of his 40th birthday crowd when he's clearly on the verge of an emotional breakdown possibly leading to suicide, which he does later at least half attempt.
Looking now it’s as if Logan brings out the worst in his children when he gives them just enough attention,it’s like they absorb his malice and become more hostile and as his favor moves they snap out of it, when shiv wrote the letter she was working well with Logan and Roman chose not to sign, now with Roman in favor Shiv begins to snap out of the Logan charm and starts to see things are maybe going a little to far with Kendall, I am guessing Kendall is going to cash out and make his own web based media with Shiv
My take on the scene: When Roman challenges Ken to hit him, its not a quark or coincidence. It’s almost a full circle moment, representing his transformation into “bootleg Logan.” Just like in S1 E1, where Logan challenges him to do *the same exact thing*, Ken still folded, and even though Roman has ascended, Ken hasn’t fundamentally changed. Its even sadder when remembering how Ken defended Roman at Argestes after Logan pummeled him.
Does anyone remember the last time Roman tried to acquire a billion dollar company? He tried to buy Pierce over the phone like an Uber eats order and got called a moron. I think were gonna see something similar to this happen again next episode.
This is still one of the hardest to watch scenes in the whole show and one of the most brilliant at the same time. A whole season’s worth, if not 3 whole season’s worth of hatred and distrust bubbling to the surface in what looks like three children calling each other names and getting physical. Brilliant.
It's beyond me why Roman would buy words of someone who has no issue literally pissing on the app Waystar created. It shows he has zero respect for Roman, his family and their company. Any 'deal'they tentatively made (and he makes it clear that it's not set in stone) is gonna blow up in Roman's face, much like the launch in S01...
Exactly, Logan's gonna kick his ass by the end of the season. Logan's position will be worse than ever before too, his wife is estranged, none of his children are ready and two powerful deals have been sunk.
Everyone criticizes and says how bad Kendall is but Kendall almost always included his sibling in the business deals and just want their love but they always treated him like shit. They betrayed him more than a thousand times but when he betrays them it’s horrendous act. Kendall is better than the rest of them. He is a good person who is deeply flawed and he’s actually become a better person now that his family is no longer in his life according to the creators.
This episode initially feels like its going to be a dud, but then you see its sensational writing and acting to show Kendall so out of touch with reality, the tension builds and you then start to sense your own doubt about the episode is your own tension because of Kendall's meltdown and then boom Roman comes along in this scene and nails everyone. never doubt the writing of this show because at some point in an episode there will be a tipping point and you will just go WOW
Honestly, for how terrible Roman is in this scene, I can’t help but feel bad for him. His entire life and sense of self-worth revolved around getting his father’s approval, a man who was emotionally and physically abusive towards him the most out of all the siblings. Now that he seemingly got Logan’s approval, he doesn’t care about destroying the relationship with Shiv and Kendall. He’s so cruel and terrible because theres literally nothing else in life matters to him other than being Logan’s son. And considering where he ends up by the end of the series, it’s really depressing.
Roman is the complete worst but the tragic thing is we know that theirs a semblance of good in him that continually gets squashed out by the constant abuse from logan. Of course once he got genuine power it was gonna go to his head. I hope he continues his s3 finale track and actually becomes better
Oddly enough, this makes me feel vindicated. From episode 1 onwards, I could not stand Roman at all and he turns out to be the worst among his siblings.
One of the more underrated aspects of kendal's relationship with his siblings and his dad to an extent is that deep down he saw them as nothing more than small obstacles or pawns to use against the battle he thought he had with his dad. Its more explained in the final episode but I dont think theres a singular moment in the entire show where he genuinely saw them as equals or even just people him saying roman isnt a real person was his real thoughts of him coming out
I always hated how they easily just start to put their own siblings down like I know they are brought up like this and no one in this show is portrayed a saint and definitely ego wins over love and family
He’s my 2nd favourite but i immediately saw that’s not Roman that was fucking Romulus the crueler version of his dad that could make even his dad shed a tear he doesn’t need to protect or be protected by Kendall because he’s built himself bigger than how he built up his dad in his head
i thought shiv was the worst after her open letter but roman is straight up evil. like seriously he's so void of emotion. he's probably very traumatized that he thinks of everything like a joke like a sociopath
Roman seems to think all he needs is himself and his dad's lov...appreciation. Maybe my favorite scene in a long time. I mean I love seeing them roast and outsmart each other but I think they're finally starting to understand each other. We're seeing redeemable qualities..well with the exception of Roman who is just always terrible. They're all in competition with each other, any good deed is partly decided on "how will this benefit me", but they're becoming closer. I'd still like to see Conor be more of a mediator though. And I'm still thinking that daddy will piss him off and he'll work with Shiv and Kendall to help him hurt their dad and Roman's candidate...who knows. But this is how you create character development, 3 seasons in the making. Kendall can be hard to like but there's a good guy in there somewhere. And who didn't like Tom and Greg hanging out?
@@gamerjamson I think we're watching very different shows dude. Roman is just plain evil, Shiv may be bad but she's not the worst. Logan is right there.
@@ariyatabassumabdullah1143 I honestly think Shiv is in the skylar situation. People think she is the worst because she is a woman and we’re not used to seeing women act like shitty people in movies and tv. This makes people uncomfortable and thus hate shiv the most.
Roman’s wicked, but I love seeing Ken and Shiv get just overwhelmed by him. Ken and shiv were too self-absorbed to realize Logan’s #1 is now Roman. Roman definitely overplayed his hand at the end though, I expected another Ken downfall, but it’s probably gonna be roman.
never hated any character in this show more than i hated roman here, his nagging shiv about her position in the company her husband going to jail and mocking ken every word he said i wanted him diwd
Rewatching this i just realized about what Matsson said about success being analysis + execution + capital, that only Kendall has the vision and analysis because of his experience running the company but none of the children have the execution part cause they never deliver even when it counts, and considering the stock drop from season 1 to season 3, all of them are bound to lose the capital backing them also. I love it.
Logan is the personification of the Seven deadly sins and each of his children demonstrate a mixture of one or more of these qualities, adding up to the Seven.
Such a great scene. All of them are broken/off their game/about to explode and it boils over right here, especially for Roman. *Does anyone know the music playing?
this scene honestly pinched my heart while watching because the siblings' relationship is messed up, they still fall back onto the same place they were before. kendall's outburst i think is from realizing how lonely he really is after not finding his children's present. he knew that shiv and roman had an ulterior motive on why they came but with everything weighing on him and adding onto his emotional crisis, this happened. i know some may disagree, but i truly believe that the they have genuine affection for each other even when they pull shit like roman did. that's the thing with them though right? they cross so many lines yet they still bounce back from it. this one, though the dynamic is pretty much like before, it has changed in a way that they are more distanced than they were before. that's why we see kendall being around so many people all the time, to fill the void, to float above the pain. but he cannot function without his family can he? its this annoying and maybe even toxic familiarity that comes with growing up in a dysfunctional household. i have lots of thoughts but yeah this show is brilliant.
This episode has some great lines. “Does this feel like an asshole’s birthday party? Because it feels a little bit like an asshole’s birthday party.” 😂
Bordering? Earlier he has been kind of an evil-lite trickster who can't be taken seriously but here he truly feels like someone who enjoys watching others suffer without any remorse. This and million dollar homerun-Roman.
