Devon playing devils advocate against genetics. When you’re 6’5 with a 34 foot wing span and hands the size of a boat paddle you have to let someone else argue this, lol.
I think gifted persons often tend to downplay the role of genetics because admitting superior genetics would lower the "glory" of their achievements. Its more satisfying to think that the achievements came just from sheer willpower and dedication
Devon and I both love RVJ and respect his opinions. It's awesome when you can have intelligent and interesting friends to debate with, who don't neccesarily share your views but appreciate yours and are willing to engage.
Yes people don't understand this. Everything we do is linked to genetics. Every thought we have comes from our brains which is made from our genetic code. Can our thinking and bodies be influenced by external factors. Of course. But you can have siblings brought up in very similar environments, but one will have amazing work ethics, and others will be lazy. Genetics is a huge determining factor in life. People don't like to acknowledge it,because it takes away peoples control.
That doesn't necessarily mean that the 5'2" ectomorph shouldn't try at all. With the right drugs and hard work I think it's possible. He might die after the match though. lol
I think the correct way to think about it, is that while a sport is either in it's infancy or just a smaller sport (E.G. Arm wrestling) Hard work and motivation is going to be the largest determining factor for getting to the top 1%. For getting to the Top 1% of the 1% (AKA Pro, not just "really crazy good") of that smaller sport, I think that is where genetics plays a huge part (E.G. Your Devon Larratts, Michael Todds, Dave Chaffees.) When talking about sports that are so flooded that it's hard to even get into the base levels (E.G. Football, Basketball, Baseball, etc.) I think the roles are reversed. To get into the top 1% you have to have the genetics because if you don't, you're going into a overpopulated game already at a disadvantage. When you have the genetics to get into the 1%, that is when you break into the 1% of the 1% with your work ethic. (Example, like RVJ was saying. Every kid in america wants to be a pro basketball player, but they're not even going to look at you if you don't start with the best genetics because the market is so flooded already. After you're "selected" by the genetics, that is where your work ethic comes to become the best of the best.) TL:DR, Smaller sports = Work ethic gets you to the top, Genetics let you rise to the top of the top. Larger sports = Genetics get you to the top, work ethic gets you to the top of the top. I think this is a really interesting conversation all things considered and I'm sure there's some flaws in my thinking somewhere.
@ good point, pretty much all the major organized team sports have no weight classes. So by default if you're not in the top weight class or atleast whatever the biggest is that's the most efficient you're at a huge disadvantage aswell.
It’s like Kevin Durant has said. Hard work beats talent when talent doesn’t work hard. I will say even in sports like basketball you can get pretty far with just really hard work as long as you have atleast average genetics. But you won’t be as good as someone who has good genetics and works just as hard of course.
I know hes a lucky dude.."jodi im gonna go fly around the world every month and armwrestle, hang out with my bros, party etc...you stay home and watch the kids and keep house" 😁
@@bluevelvet772 he’s right on a basic level, but higher level phenomena that matter in sport, such as determination, drive, work ethic, are not genetically determined but instead caused by environment. IQ is certainly largely genetic. RVJ was totally correct on genetics being crucial for success in professional armwrestling. Crazy George is an outlier because he employs a technique that doesn’t leverage genetics as much as technique and bone lock. But even there, the point stands that a Crazy George with amazing genes would be even more dominant (think Michael Todd).
@@criticalcog6363 Work ethic and determination is genetic and can be bolstered in environmental situations in people who already have great work ethic regardless of life experience, put them in any situation they always have work ethic, look at Floyd Maywether he was a multi millionaire, had no reason to have work ethic and yet he still outworked everybody, that is genetic, at least it seems that way to me.
@@xXJeReMiAhXx99 i know!? He's like " it's just their frames and body type in general isn't huge" you mean genetics!!?? 🤣😂 strength is about more than lb for lb, its about leverages and size, mass moves mass, speed and momentum. That's why when strongman 1st started, Franco Columbu was drafted cuz he's hella strong but then he blew out both his kneecaps and ended his career, because it didn't matter that he was strong, he needed to be 6ft 9 like Brian shaw to protect himself with fat. 100%genetics.
The depth of technical and creative innovation across all sports is underestimated. Devon mentioned the 3rd/4th row of the army being genetically gifted clones. In tennis, these people are the 6 ft 5, lanky dudes with powerful groundstrokes, huge serves and quick footwork for their size. But if you look at the pinnacle, that 1st row, the variation is massive. Federer vs Nadal (and Djokovic) is a perfect example of how a select few athletes can compete for the top whilst looking and playing totally differently. In football (soccer), if you were to construct the ultimate attacker based on genetics, you would end up with someone like Christiano Ronaldo: lightning pace, huge jumps and air ability, vision, power, clinical. And yet, the one who blows everyone away (especially the top players) by pure magic is a 5 ft 7 Argentine who needed hormone replacement therapy as a teenager and is riddled with injury: Lionel Messi. Think about all these legends in sports who aren't visually what you'd expect: Mike Tyson (5 ft 10 heavyweight) to Tyson Fury (fat gypsy who moves like a featherweight), the lanky rock-climber vs the small explosive climber, jon jones vs daniel cormier. RVJ's point is fair, but Devon is right. At that top level, the true innovators, it's a crap shoot when thinking about what you're getting
the more complicated the sport the more there is room for the argument. the more simple the sport the more difficult it is to break the genetic obstacles. Armwrestling is not as diverse as fighting, more diverse than sprinting.
Are you serious? Messi is genetically gifted with speed, reaction, coordination in combination that no one on the planet can get close to He was definitely not riddled with injuries, check his mins stats. He started getting traumas only recently. His genetics were messed up so he had to undergo hormonal therapy. Now imagine had there been no cure for his condition he'd genetics would have crossed him out of the competition even in Barca academy simply by physical conditions.
Thumbnail is great, looks like you are both showing each other your armwrestling chi energy orbs haha...*Vegeta what does the scouter say?* *Its over 9000!*
Loving the "Cards Against Humanity." Should do a video with you all playing that while high AF. Would be HILARIOUS! Also, the two of you were trolling RVJ soooo hard 🤣🤣🤣
Exactly. And it's all about if all things are equal. If two people are equally as strong, and work equally as hard, and have a superior mind and strategy, who is going to win, a genetically gifted guy or the schmuck that gives it hell. The genetically gifted guy every time. When all things are equal.
Ronin how about a genetically gifted guy puts in 50% hardwork against a guy with piss poor genetics who gives it his 100%. Who wins? I would say the first guy.
@@Davemate ok, but that wasn't the point either. The point is all things being equal genetics are more likely to be superior in atlethic endeavors. Get off Devon nuts.
7:48 vi love it! “Crazy George isn't even a normal dwarf, he's a 'little' dwarf, with a little hand, that shouldn't be able to beat anybody”... lol, great quote Devon, I’m turning that into a T-shirt
In my experience in combat sports, which in no way am I putting myself even close to your guys league, something that plays a huge role is the ability to summon and harness aggression. I see this in all your matches Devon, and in any combat competition no one wants to have a master of aggression across from them! Unbelievable what some can achieve with or without good genetics if they’re capable high levels of aggression. Thx for the cool convo upload
1st, big respect to everyone who takes or creates his chances and works hard, as long as it's done ethically! Devon and family/friends, i love your content, keep rocking :) 12:55 I agree to Rvj and say, not everyone can reach everything! What forms the character of a person? 3 things: genetics, parental influence and every day influences (interactions and experiences in life). Genetics: Two women tries to become a model and do exactly the same things, use the same amount of energy and effort to reach the goal. What happens if one appears "ugly" to most people and the other one "beautiful"? Will they make the same experiences in life because they do the same stuff? Will they achieve the same goals? This example shows the genetic aspect only, and genetics don't define our look only, they define our skills at all, even the skill to better your skills. Some can do something well but suck at something else, no matter how hard they try. Others can learn very good but don't have the imagination of what to learn. Why can't everyone be as fast as Usain Bolt? Because they are too lazy? Parental influence: Why are so many race car drivers sons of former race car drivers? Genetics alone? i don't think so. The answer is possibilities. They have someone who opens a chance, a door for them! Did Justin Bieber started his career as a kid or did his mother? The son of a company boss will see his father doing stuff a company boss does. The chance the son becomes good in things like dominance, strategic thinking and acting, ... are higher than without this influence. Of course as long as his genetic skills allows this. He can get experienced support from his father too, if he decides to go a similar way. Other life experiences: If nice things happens to you, you will be happy. If bad things happens to you, you will not be happy. If you do nice things to people but they do bad things to you, you will be angry, confused, scared, depressed or become crazy. This things affects and forms you, specially when you are a child. An excessive amount of certain experiences can result in extreme behaving, feeling and acting! Take a look at a dog which got abused his whole life long untill you took care of him. He will not trust you, maybe he forgets the bad times after a while with you, maybe he never forgets. Humans don't forget easily! People are different (But always are worth the same)! There are things they can affect or change deliberate, but there are things they can't, even they want too. What this things are varies for every human being! Metaphoric example: Two guys drive side by side on a empty straight road, one in a strong sports car, the other one in a little, weak compact. Both can't change their car and never have been in a different one. The compact driver tells the sports car guy that he would like to drive 200mph fast. The sports car guy tells him to shift into the highest gear and press the gas pedal fully to the ground, its easy. The compact driver follows exactly the advice, but can't even come close to 200mph. The sports car driver looks at him deprecatingly and says "you don't try hard enough, it's your fault, i am tired of people like you" and drives away. Respect each other because we never know the story behind a person! There can't be winners without losers!
Hey, Devon! What's a good routine to hit all the requisite arm wrestling area with only one set of powerblock U-175s? Is there such a dumbbell only routine that would suffice?
Intelligent Training Methods + Discipline + Elite Role Model(s) = Great starting point for anybody looking to rise to the top in any sport...with or without ideal genetics.
Genetics covers a massive range of factors. Hard work can help you achieve incredible things but when it comes down to it you cannot say that a genetic advantage in sports specificity isn't a huge help.
Da MudderBurd that’s just his opinion, if you see devon vs todd hutchings , he clearly couldn’t handle devon’s height , he just couldn’t get over the king’s move , which is a huge disadvantage , having long arms in my opinion gives you more options and opportunities
hassam Kkkk who Cares? Dude still has 4 hammers lol he’s the greatest middle weight. His hand is not that great where they say in armwrestling it’s all about hand. But man he does have s9me power
Compare Danny Tesch start point vs my start point. Yet now we are equal. He had a far greater genetic start point. Yet where we are now is essentially the same.
Yeah Ryan you do not look to have great genetic at start but you worked your ass off and look now what you have done. Hats off your the avarage joe exemple for us
(As an aside, love your content) But, I don't think that's good evidence for or against. You may have different genetic advantages that have cancelled out Danny's. They're not all so obvious as to be seen. For example, ability to recover, to endure pain, an obsessive mind - have both a genetic component... and can be increased with practice. If by genetic advantages, you mean only things that cannot be increased from baseline, I don't think genetic advantages that let you train harder or think better are lesser in value than, say, a big hand.
I personally don't arm wrestle but love to watch the sport. It's awesome and adrenaline pumping. Those longer Devon matches are among the best at keeping me on the edge of my seat. To me, arm wrestling is like martial arts. If you stay disciplined and true to you're training, you can be great. There are many styles and techniques which are all effective but yet has their counter. You will take losses "lessons learned" along the way. Those who train not only their strengths but also their weaknesses becomes Devon and is fan favorite of all. Lol
RVJ should read about the history of the oldetime strongman known as Maxick. He was a small sickly child who was told by his doctor not to exert himself due to his frail condition, and he ultimately became one of the first men to lock out double his bodyweight overhead. Also look at some of the photos of him performing his muscle control exercises. He could vacuum his abs on one side while outwardly flexing his abs on the other side at the same time.
Hey devon, or Jody.. what's devons elbow to wrist length? Sorry if it's been answered in another video, if you could post it here of on jolex I watch both!! It would help satisfy my hunger for knowledge.. lol
You have to remember Devon said he was playing devils advocate! It really got the discussion going. Devon uses a similar kind of tactic when he’s pulling.
I think anyone who's finished a marathon, 70+km road march in FBO or some form of extended intense physical activity would be able to relate to what Devon is saying. RVJ makes the argument that... effort being equal.. genetics is the deciding factor. Effort is never equal. The will is severely understated whenever the discussion of genetics comes up.
@@fistoftulkas7335 I'm not sure when you say your will is genetic even if quotation marks are involved. There are genetically predisposed mental illnesses but mental conditioning is a separate thing. Just because the preceding lineage are made up of individuals representing testicular tenacity does not mean the offspring would display similar characteristics if he were to say.. be fostered by deadbeat junkies. Fortitude or willpower can be nurtured. "The Only Easy Day Was Yesterday" Navy Seals motto. "Viam inveniemus" Canadian Special Forces (We will find a way) You'll find a common theme with elite military training institutions.
Just saying that your willpower is genetic too, there are people that are stronger mentally, some aren't, just like some have better physical's attributes than others. The mental's fortitude is just as important as the physical's, and both are part of your genetic's makeup.
Don’t let all the external factors clog your mind. Follow the passion, put in the work ethic, set your mind on winning and you’ll reap the rewards. Genetics or no genetics, that’s not in our control. We can only manipulate that which we can control.
End of day desire to better oneself and be the best you can be everyday and dedication to growth.....and education on every aspect of your mission to be the best is what sets apart the herd
Arm wrestling is a skill based sport with strength being of equal importance give or take a percentage leaning here or there. Crazy George has a wildcard and that is in his skill based technique. He is also gifted in his resilience and will and also definetly is a strong guy all around. He looks like those type of guys who can bend steel with his fingers or do a thousand pushups. Strong attachments. His style has molded his weapon (arm) for battle to the highest degree. Rob is talking more about a pure strength and geometrical anomaly who if had the same enviromental stimulous as the greats would be a great himself. Just remember, out of billions of men, No man has ever been 10 foot tall or had shoulders 5 feet wide, not even double the average. There are outliers but there is always a limit.
Hard work guarantees that you’ll be the best version of YOU that you can possibly be. That’s it. And it’s all anyone should aspire to really. Whether your a physical freak or not.
RVJ is right, genetics are a massive factor, hard work also matters but it will only get you so far and no matter how hard you work you will not always be able to reach the heights that people with better genetics can.
But you can train endurance. The top runners in the world aren't just from "Kenya" and doing nothing like Rob said. They have run their whole life! It's their way of transportation, we drive 5 miles to the store, they run 5 miles. Training tendons will also gain you endurance. And look at Devon he's a slow starter so the ability to fire all muscle fibers isn't a huge factor, IF you know how to counter it.
Muscular endurance in particular. It's not the same endurance that runners have. It's about how much power you can put forth in the right directions, but endurance in that case is how much power can you resist in the right directions. Endurance isn't a factor in itself. Like Todd Hutchings said, to have endurance against someone you have to be strong enough to stop them first of all.
@@vids595 At that point you're fucked, but most people aren't completely fucked like that. The argument about genetics is usually referring to your average dude vs. genetically gifted. It's not referring to a dude who's genetically fucked. If you're genetically fucked, you probably wouldn't even be aspiring to be the best at a sport.
@@vids595 That's why I said "genetic". These abilities people have could be from proper development from mother having an abundance of nutrients. "Genetic" diseases are not genetic, they occur because the mother lacked building material(nutritional deficiencies). Not everything is genetic.
Genetics and determination are both important, but genetics can reach a level of importance that can outclass determination: take a professional woman armwrestler, she would never beat john brzenk no matter how determined she is, and he's basically retired now so his motivation is much lower than hers. I guess John also has experience on his side so maybe the example isn't the greatest, but you get the point. Determination can be a key factor when the genetics are similar but there's only so much it can do. The main difference and advantage of determination is that it can change, while genetics can't. But the fact that it can change also mean that it can drop, so it can be a disadvantage too.
Had to stop it at 621 to comment on RVJ's "love of the sport is a drug too" Your absofuckinlutely right. I dont Armwrestle for the hell of it....I chase the feeling of power and strength it gives me. Its pure enjoyment of the struggle and the fight to win mentality. Fuck the money. Fuck the fame. I want that pump from the pull....my might against your might
You are all very smart for what your passion is, I would think that armwrestling is a game of minds more than strength. You have proved this in your mach with Dave. But as well as being superior on the table you all seem to be like wise wizards in a way lol
I have sort of a weird strength thing I have smallish hand but super strong hands I’ve snapped handles off 3 different sets vice grips tightening it down on rounded bolts. I’ve turned wrenches since I’ve been 7 years old. I wanna see Devon or rvj try it
Genetics is good. But it cannot teach you to fight if you don't have the heart. Mental toughness comes from within and how you channel your motivation. And physical strength comes from work ethics. Neither can out do the other
I have been pulling for 6 years and I have a great work ethic, great coach, and I travel to train and am a student of the game. I guarantee if RV J was a brand new never guy having pulled at ornament showed up and practice would smash me right handed without a doubt.
I'm not really sure what there is to argue here. Success in all sports is a combination of ONE static factor (your genetics relative to everyone else) and variable factors like work ethic, diet, training regime, PEDs, and luck. In a smaller sports like AW you can get guys who have average genetics but still make it to the top through sheer persistence and work ethic. In bigger ($$$) sports where there is more competition, you need genetics to even get your foot in the door. Then the other factors start to set you apart.
lol my man RVJ just talked about Khaled. Man has crazy hand strength but might be lacking else where. Of course this was shot way before we knew about Khaled, lol.
