Listening to you reminds me of sitting in university classes listening to a professor who was passionate about what they taught. You are such a trove of knowledge, thank you for doing these videos
I came across a wonderful rye bread recipe, the smell and taste is amazing. ( the best thing about it here where I live, is that no one bakes that particular sourdough rye bread, so I'm putting it out in the next farmers' market.)😉 ❤
Love your videos. This one has taught me so much! I am from New Zealand, living in Thailand. I lived for a short time in Holland where I loved the 100% rye bread. I would cut a slice into 4 an slice a banana, one round per square of rye bread. Delicious. Lately I've been baking a wholemeal/rye loaf and it's the best bread I've ever baked.
Greetings from Poland! Nice to hear our breadmaking history inspired you. Can I ask where exactly in Poland did you eat the bread? Unfortunately, it is hard to find REAL sourdough bread these days. That's why I started making my own. Love to watch your videos and improve my own skills in home sourdough bread. Take care and let the bread business roll!
My family lives in Międzybrodzię Bialskie which contains a small store that carried some nice authentic sourdough, at least up until the last time I was personally there…5 years ago. Real bread is hard to find the world over, but it starts with folks that simply want to make it happen.
I was born in Poland, came to the US as a 4 year old. Now that all my family is deceased I long for the food my parents made. Now I’m 62 years old and I just started making wheat/ rye bread with sourdough starter. Also making fermented sauerkraut. Funny how this happens as you age, I did not like polish food as a youngster only American food. Not the case anymore.🤣
Nice! That's what I'm baking for a last couple of years. Adding rye at about 15-20% of total flour. This brings the unique flavor while keeping gluten high to make it easier to work and let the loaf rise. On a side note - most of my last year improvements are because of your advices! Huge thanks!!!
Have watched a few videos from this channel and then out of the blue you talk about how you started up. Even watching you I can see the passion you have for the bread for the yeast for the customers. All of it. Seems like you might have gone through a trial by fire but you are so keen. There was no way you were going to fail!
I didn’t realize Rye was stickier and I’ve been trying to use Rye for my sourdough. I didn’t do exactly what you did and it luckily turned out. I added different wheat flours at hour 6-8 bc it wouldn’t fold. By hour 12 I refrigerated it. Baked it 7 hours later and it turned out real well. I probably did too many folds cause of the situation but tons of air pockets!
@33:38, glad you asked, Jon. I have a 5.5QT Professional Series KitchenAid like yours and I hate when the dough climbs up like that. My solution is to lower the bowl, from time to time, as it’s mixing. This way, the dough releases from the hook and you can keep doing this until your dough is fully developed.
I am from Poland living in UK for 18 years always missing taste of bread from my childhood in seventies and eighties. First lockdown and also your videos inspired me to start baking sourdough bread and currently will be starting third 25 kg bag of great Ukrainian wheat flour! Another bread in the fridge ready for baking tomorrow morning and always feeling the same excitement ☺️ It's amazing that you took inspiration from Poland! Best regards and thank you for your videos!
I stripped the gears on my Kitchen Aid Pro by doing 3 loves. But I now am doing by hand and really am enjoying it and getting closer to the lace that I like in the bread.
By the way, I love your videos. I am fascinated by the science of breadmaking. I will figure out how to make that perfect little torpedo rye roll that I had in the late 1960s. Leathery exterior like a bagel.
I was trying to catch your weights , was hoping to find you recipe here but no luck. Can you post your 3 loaf quantities? I've been making a sourdough rye for about a decade but use a rye starter. The starter is pretty tough, I can ignore it for weeks in the fridge, not optimal, but that's life. My SD Rye has to have caraway seeds. Started because my hometown bakery with a 75 year history sold out to a new baker who promptly ripped out the well used ovens that produced a wonderful bread and replaced them with who knows what- bread was never the same. He does OK but is more of a coffee shop with a bakery side than a true bakery. I feel I've gotten very close to that wonderful bread, and mine is much in demand among my family. I enjoy your channel and have learned a lot. Thanks.
QUESTION: I recently tried this 25% rye bread. It was incredibly wet, even though I'm accustomed to a wet sourdough dough. I'm wondering if the scalding water quantity for the rye pushed the hydration over the top. I divided your 3-loaf amounts into 3, and then multiplied by 2 for 2 loaves instead. Other than that, I followed the amounts and ingredients (Bob's Red Mill Whole Grain Organic Rye and Organic Artisan Bread Flour). Very active levain, fed the night before at 1:2:2, overnight bench rest, 150% rise. Mixed rye scald by hand and bench rested overnight to room temp. Mixed all together with a 5-qt. KitchenAid for 13 minutes until it balled up. I understand that flour types will make a big difference, but even after 5 rounds of stretch/folds, I still couldn't get a windowpane with 78 degree F dough. The dough was still tearing. I feared overworking, so in the fridge at 39 degrees for 14 hours. Still very wet. Gluten weak, breaking. I shaped as best I could and put in bannetons to fridge for another 12 hours. Out of bannetons, scored, baked. Epic fail. They didn't rise much in the Dutch oven, came out dense and wet even though it temped at 203 degrees (couldn't go more without burning). It is inedible. Tastes very sour with the texture of a wet Magic Eraser. Here are the amounts I used for 2 loaves: (still questioning if too much water) Scald -- 366g water, 178g rye Dough -- 280ml water, 266g levain, 660g bread flour, 18g salt, 16g honey Here are the amounts I gleaned from your video: Scald -- 500g water, 250 rye flour Dough -- 420ml water, 400g levain/starter, 990g bread flour, 27g salt, 24g honey Sorry this comment is so long, but I figured giving this amount of detail would prevent an inevitable endless back-and-forth with questions about, "Did you do X?" I really appreciate all the instruction you provide! It helps to understand not just the processes, but also the trouble shooting, and in-depth theory and science. Makes for a far more intelligent experience making REAL bread. Seeing your results with this rye bread, I'm sure I made one or more mistakes. Maybe it was that the bread flour was enriched, or because it's not whole grain bread flour. I've been getting really good results with 85% this same flour, 15% whole wheat, 75% hydration, 20% inoculation (because of cool kitchen), 2% salt, and 78 degree temp controlled with a proofer. The biggest difference I can think of is the extra water used to scald the rye flour.
I had the same problem as you described, no window buliding, also using the same flour brand like you. I wonder if I should just reduce the water by 50ml if it turns out differently....I'll try it next time. The taste was great
@artsymargo ok today I prepared the dough and tomorrow I will bake it. ( I'm be beginner 😅 just that you know) I used the measurements for two loaves, changed following: - I used this time different flour (king Arthur's bread flour) -I reduced the water by 30ml -I prepared the rye scald the night before and left it out on the counter. - I added the scald, flour and water and honey and let it autolyse for about 2 1/2 hours. - I slap and fold the dough on the counter for about 10 min - I spread the dough out thin and square, added the salt on top and massaged it in with a little water on my hands.,than I fold it all together an another round of slap and fold ( 5 min or so). - let it rest in a covered plastic container for 45 min and did a coil folding. - I did 4 times a coil folding in between 45min. -preshaped the 2 loafs, let them rest 30 min. Than final shaping and put them in the baskets and in my fridge. The dough seems much stronger than the last time, I'm very excited how it turns out tomorrow 😄
Just want to clarify the math in this formula. By my calculations this is not a 25% rye bread, but only about 17.4% rye. Total amount of flour in this recipe is 1440g ( 250 g rye, 200 g bread flour = wheat in starter, and 990 g wheat in the bread). Thus 1440g is 100%. 250g of this being rye flour is only 17.4% of the total.
I shared this channel with my husband who is learning to bake sourdough bread and he wants to know where you found your shop apron, or what brand? Does anyone know? We have rye flour ready to try with our starter. Thank you for all of the detailed information.
I just "learned a lot" by mistakes as I just made a 50% rye, 20% wholewheat, 30% wheat bread in a manner you'd make a 100% wheat loaf :D :D Dough everywhere, can't stretch, wait, sticks to hell itself, but I managed to use your shaping technique and somehow managed to get it into the baskets :D Wish I'd seen this video first.
I've watched your video several times now as the concept of combining boiling water over rye flour is a bit foreign to my typical bread making techniques. I baked the first batch this morning after overnight refrigeration. The internal loaf temperature was around 205 F upon completing the bake. The loaf interior seemed gummy and under-baked. So I baked another of the loaves until the interior was around 215F which was an improvement. I'm using a typical electric range with a rectangular pizza stone on the rack and a steam pan below. I started at 475F for 15 minutes and completed at 435F for 40 minutes. My oven tends to bake very dark. Would you have any suggestions? I enjoyed the flavor and would like to repeat the recipe with a dryer crumb. Thank you
Hi Jon Home baker from Sydney Australia 🇦🇺 👋🏻 Do I need to have a 100% rye sourdough starter or can I just feed my white starter rye flour in prep to bake Sorry for the newbie ?
From liters to grams from milliliters to cups just stick with one thing just go with grams that makes it simple too many conversions just stick with one thing
Can’t seem to get good rye bread anymore. It’s all wheat bread with a little bit of rye in it. I miss good dense flavorful rye bread. I’ve been on a Reuben sandwich kick but everybody in town uses lame fake rye bread, Wonder Bread with a little bit of rye. Is it just that Americans really don’t like rye flavor? Americans don’t like dense bread? I don’t get it. I miss the rye we used to get in the years I lived in Germany. I miss the rye we used to get here when I was younger. This mostly wheat bread fake stuff is just ever disappointing.
To me that’s not really rye it’s mostly wheat it’s not reacting like rye at all. I bake 100% rye and it’s a completely different animal. You really don’t knead it much at all because there’s not as much gluten. Sticky isn’t the word you have to use rye flour to form it. It doesn’t rise much and it’s very dense. I cover mine immediately after baking by wrapping a kitchen towel all the way around it and let it sit 24-48 hrs before cutting. If you don’t cover it right away the crust is too hard. The problem I had is rye is gummy by nature so it can turn out gummy. The Germans realize that. I mill my own rye berries and I even use it for sourdough pancakes. The kids don’t know the difference. It’s not as strong as most people think, that strong flavor associated with rye is actually the caraway seeds. I enjoyed your video.
yes, quite interesting, I remember queuing for bread for 8 hours just before Christmas of 1981 with tanks on the streets, nothing in the shops. My husband frantic that I was arrested or worse, looking for me in the dark streets of a city north East of Poland. There was a small bakery 1km away from our apartment block that baked 100% rye bread. I managed to get 4 loaves, supplied the whole family. It was the best Christmas present they received that year. Peace to all my heart goes to those south east of Poland.
Mixing the rye with scalding water allows you to double hydration and softens the berry so it doesn't cut into the gluten when incorporating into whole wheat dough later. But weight till it cools below 130 before incorporating with sourdough starter. Impressive, and thanks for all the tips!
I will try this, I thought scalding the flour only helped with flavour, not gluten development. I make a 50% white wheat flour/50% whole wheat rye flour, I'll try scalding that rye before mixing the dough.
Thanks for taking the time to walk us through the journey. You are the antithesis to the current Shorts trend, which lead people to expect instant gratification for everything
Estonia we too have blackbread, 100% Rye, amazing stuff, they say all estonian families have some sort of rye traditional recipe, and i ask my family they dont have and neighbors too no have, so i said to myself i need to revive that tradition.
When you begin to explore various versions of "Rye" breads, I would highly recommend that you try the dark sour rye's that you find in Germany and in the Scandinavian regions. It is a robust flavour that is intense and delicious and more dense that any wheat based bread. Love your videos.
I just LOVE your passion for bread!!! I am actually going to be shopping at your bakery soon. I'm traveling and specifically am putting YOUR SHOP in my itinerary!! I can hardly wait to taste your incredible creations!
i'm from germany and we use a lot of rye here in our bread since back in time we couldn't really grow wheat, i'm doing an apprenticeship as a baker right now so it's really nice to learn what people are doing outside of germany!
In many German bakeries it's not even possible to get bread without any rye in it. Ever since I bake my own bread I am checking the ingridients of breads in German bakeries and grocery stores more carefully. And it's most common to have either a rye-dominant bread or at least a lower ratio of rye in it. One of our local bakeries is even using a little rye in their classic French baguettes which I was trying to discuss with them recently. :D In another bakery I asked for a wheat based bread with no rye and the only option was a pure Toast/Weißbrot. Also interesting to note is the rye/wheat border in the South of Switzerland where the German influenced area is bordering with the Italian culture.
@@sulgi82 yeah totally, we only sell bread which has some rye in it except the Weißbrot, starting with the sourdough, it’ll always contain rye just because we make our sourdough with rye. And the french baguette thing has mostly to do with the flour they got in France cause Germany doesn’t have the same white flour, so you mix it with other flour to get close to the original, that was what I was told. In our bakery, we use part type 550 and part type 1050 wheat flour to get close to the french one.
@@hideyoshinagachika3360 Thanks for the insights. At home I have only tried my baguettes with 550 type flour so far. I just received a T65 flour test package from a French mill, waiting to be used for baguettes. Curious to see if I will notice any big difference in taste.
Scalding the rye is important because of the ergot fungus that will grow on the rye kernels during a wet year. So you kill the ergot by scalding, rather than propagating it in your dough, and you gelatinize the rye as well while reducing the impact of the bran as well. When you see a scald, you are probably looking at a recipe with old ancestry, although today folks like the gelatinizing effects. Much European wheat is rye in part from seed saving over centuries as they had no way of getting rid of the rye to separate it from the wheat. So much bread in France from local wheat has a significant percentage of rye. Most folks actually will prefer 5% to 10% rye in a wheat bread but could not tell you why.
I didn’t find any indication that the boiling water decompose the ergotamine, the noxioux substances of the ergot. So boiling the rye flour doesn’t make it less dangerous as food. The only thing that helps is to purchase the grain or flour from modern mills that have detection system for the ergot.
@@geezerdude4873 As far as I know the ergot fungi grows on the rye plant, and even if it don’t spread during the bread preparation it remains extremely nocive. As far as I understand, the ergot fungi is not like the yeast, who develops in the bread preparation process, but it is a parasite of the rye plant. After all during the baking the dough is over 194 °F (90 °C) hot, so according to your assumptions the ergot after baking should no longer be dangerous, which is not the case.
@@Adrian-ww2jj Ergot is a mold which you can favor the growth of with water and warmth. You do not want to grow more of it. This can be a life or death issue that traditional people understood. So you sterilize and then add yeast.
i can tell i’m OCD. All i could think about when he was ready to bake was “ WHERE IS THE THIRD LOAF!? Anyway this guy is THE BEST for learning all things sourdough. And I’ve watched more bakers than i can remember. This guy is the top.
Great video as always! As a German I love bread with Rye Flour and as someone who bakes sourdough at home I kicked this off this morning - can't wait for the outcome, thanks for sharing the recipe!
after listening to your story about ruining that dough confusing salt with sugar, I just thought that maybe if you used redmond salt the pink color would have stopped that confusion .
Yes, Jon, thank you so much for sharing your love of bread baking, techniques and encouragement with all of us. Every video I have watched from your channel have been educational and enjoyable.
I watched masterb bob the baker videos on youtube, and he make all sorts of breads. He uses oil, to help with dough sticking to mixer and hook. BTW bread looks great. Thanks for the video.
I was watching this vid when you mentioned alternatives to not having access to rice flour. White or brown rice flour is incredibly easy to make. I didn't want to pay for rice flour to dust my banneton when I can make it for almost nothing, just the cost of the rice. Rinse the rice to remove any talc etc. Cook as usual, I use my instant pot. Rinse again with cold tap water to remove starch until water runs clear. Drain well. Freeze 24 hrs, this is an important step, it separates the grains. Dehydrate until completely dry, I use my dehydrator but you can find how to dehydrate in your oven on the internet. Then just fine grind in a food processor or coffee bean grinder that has been thoroughly cleaned - unless you want your bread to smell like coffee, cleaned herb grinder etc. Voila ! All the rice flour you want. It can be stored in any dry container.
I swapped out my 5qt mixer for the 8qt professional because the dough for 2 good size loaves of bread was just too much so it took forever to get good gluten development without having to constantly stop, scrap & restart. The 5qt simply became a hinderance rather than asset. Our granddaughter now enjoys the 5qt.
I made this recipe over the weekend and turned out great. For my scald I used both rye and English malted crystal rye. My Famag spiral mixer was just the thing for these dough. I've made a number of whole ryes especially in winter, but we really liked the mix of Type 85 + the rye scald. I know in Germany they often do a Rye and Spelt bread with various seeds.
@@a.w.3480 It resembles the yudane method in the incorporation of very hot water to flour but the hydration ratio is far greater than what yudane calls for since Jon uses 200% hydration.
@@ambrosewetherbee8301 It is the other way round. The tangzhong/yudane methods resemble European water roux/scalding techniques which have been in use since at least the medieval ages. Tangzhong and yudane only go back a.few decades.
@@ambrosewetherbee8301 I responded to the wording "It resembles the yudane method". When using this kind of phrasing, it is often interpreted to mean that the subject is a derivative and the object the original. Copy resembles original, not original resembles copy. I am therefore taking issue with this specific phrasing, but never mind.
Hello Jon, Just made your Rye bread today 6/18/22 LOVE this loaf, great texture, Great Crumb, not a thick crust, Its a Keeper, as your question about the Dough ridding up the hook I have a 7 qt and it does not do that, what most of my breads do is just stay on the bottom of the bowl. Hope some day to get to AZ to check out your bakery, Been a Fan of you page and look forward to seeing more of your video's
cool, you use the Garage as Test kitchen, for future projects in your business !! Well done !! ps: It is a good Idea to exchange your staff in other bakeries ,so they learn skills and see they are not alone in the job !!! They become more value in productivity !!
Hi Jon, do you think it will have the same result if I replace the rye flour with buckwheat flour? Please let me know your thoughts on this crazy idea of mine. Thank you in advance.
I love this video so much. I’ve been working on a sourdough rye . I think the scald is going to be a game changer. Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge.
Although I really like your videos it would be nice if you showed some recipes for the home baker because it’s tough to convert from the Comercail setting but I have learned a lot from your videos thanks for sharing
OK I have a question about the starter. I use my starter 2 days a week, preferable would be Monday & Tuesday. After that I only keep about 200 grams in each jar. I use about 1,200 grams per 4 loaves of bread. Average is about 300(ish) per loaf. So, You are saying that I should feed then my starter and leave it out for 4,5,6 hours and Then put it in the fridge? I usually just cover it and put it in the fridge and then go back later and feed it and again put it back in the fridge. And feed it every 2 days small amounts until Sunday night rolls around about 7 ish and feed it and leave it out to ferment for Monday’s baking. I am using a 30 quart mixer.
The PROOF TEAM is a International Treasure. Entertaining Education that motivates. You may have considered apprenticeships as a "win-win" for both you and "the Passionate WANNABE BAKER." Thanks for caring, sharing & being in our lives.
John’s recipe seems to be this: Rye 250g T85 990g Water 500g (scald) + 920g Starter 394g Salt 27g Honey 24g Starter seems high - 32% Hydration seems low - 78% bearing in mind the scald. Have I made a mistake?
호의는 감사드립니다만 전 악마신 소멸 하는 천손족마고관음보살김혜령입니다 이번에 이지나여왕과 최명희가 저의 천상계엄마 백옥피부 프랑스거인인간 왕족 엄마 살아있는채로 암매장 해서 죽여서 이집트우주 소멸 하고 최명희우주도 소멸 하고 거대 지구 만들었습니다 안녕히가세요 부인과 행복하시고 건강하세요 많이 복잡해서 이해하시기 어렵습니다 천손족타르타르족우주 문제도 있습니다
I am surprised to see how long you mixed the dough in the KitchenAid mixer. I have been watching and learning a lot from RU-vid videos as I begin my sourdough journey and most people caution against over mixing.
Hey buddy I just want to thank you for all your help you videos are excellent after watching you for 2 days my loaves are coming out spectacular thank you again and wish you much luck in your business let me know when you going to start selling flower
..."might be my new favourite bread"... Love that conclusion, Jon.! Mixed bread, rye and wheat, or wheat and rye is Germany's overall favourite too. Now you know why! ;-)
If, I only could follow a recipe! I don't understand myself, even when I strictly decide to follow a recipe, something happens, and I change something in the recipe. I say that, because I really enjoyed your video. As I am rather a hint home baker and not a recipe baker, I liked both the content and the lay-out of this video. A real professional baker goes through the whole process and gives much more information, than what is required. I try my best next time to make this bread, thank you.
I can tell you know what you're talking about and all that but you got to stick with one thing you can't go from leaders to grams to ounces to cups and all over the place just try grams just stay with grams Make it simple
What are your thoughts on a starter with 50% white and 50% spelt? I've heard it said that whole wheat flower will give it a bit more of the sour taste. Not sure if that is true.
Thanks, John, for making this great tutorial. I'm going to make a third of this recipe since I don't have a mixer. I don't have access to any T85 WW flour either, so I plan to autolyze 80% white bread flour with 20% WW flour before combining the rest of the ingredients along with the Tangzhong.
Greetings from Denmark. 100% ryebread is daily tradition here. Smørrebrød (literally buttered bread) is our ryebread, a bit of butter, cold cuts of meat or fried fish and then with lots of toppings. I love it.
