I'm Japanese. After World War II, the police were unarmed despite the deteriorating security situation in my country. For this reason, the US Government loaned surplus M1917 revolvers along with M1911 and other pistols. The M1917 was therefore at one time considered the typical handgun of Japanese police officers. the M1917 has since been replaced by domestic pistols, but they were still in use in the '90s! (Excuse me, I used a machine translation.)
My uncle was an officer in the Brazilian army and used one of those revolvers from the first Brazilian contract. Today, this gun is with me, along with the original box.
Awesome weapon I’ve got a returned one I bought it in the 80s it’s my house gun no muzzle blast little flash it more of a thumper in recoil my wife is a fan of it over a semiautomatic
as an MA man who loves guns. it is a damn shame Springfield armory is what it is today. playing ww2 games and not even realizing until present day that like half of those American guns came from my state. not to mention the only 30 minute drive away was pretty cool. considering how anti gun MA is in reality, compared to the likes of like New Hampshire.
@@JACOBTHASECOND same from a CT man many of the guns that "won the west" were built here. We had Colt, S&W , Winchester Ruger, Mossberg etc.. Almost all production has left now. My 10/22 was built in NH for example instead of CT
Never owned a revolver, but all of my reading tells me that if I can't get a Webley Mk VI then I want this in .455. I may have no clue what I'm talking about, but my list of desirable revolvers is very short. Also it disregards contemporary ammunition prices.
When Desert Shield was ramping up, we shipped all our M9s to the desert. All we had left for SP's were a handful of various 38 Special revolvers (M15s). But we also came across several M1917 revolvers that were in the base museum (not on display). No, we didn't issue them. But depot requested we ship them back. I would assume for museum use.
When the USS FORT MCHENRY decommissioned in 2021 the armory was emptied and sent off to Crane. Inside we found an M15 38 special as well, very poorly maintained. Who knows how long it had been there, probably since the 80s
My brother was issued a WW2 Victory Model 38 Special at his request because it was lighter and everyone who worked outside the theater of operations wanted a 1911. They ended up using their sidearms because the entire country of Iraq was the theater of operations.
Still do to this day. There is a secret compartment in the Grumman LLV’s that stores a decrepit female mail clerk armed with this gun waiting to spring out.
Yes, they were. You can still find the US Postal Service marked holsters for them occasionally. Ian doesn't mention the production differences on the early SW pistols that had a grooved hammer and also the three letter inspectors marks on the early pistols as well.
Wanting to equip all troops with handguns made sense for WWI. I'd certainly rather have a double action revolver than try to wrestle a three and a half foot bolt action rifle around in a trench.
"Wanting to equip all troops with handguns made sense for WWI." As much as people rightfully talk shit on WW1's generals for wasting their soldier's lives "fighting the last war", Pershing was right on the money on that one.
@@georgetazberik6834 If it wasn't tanks, machine guns or mustard gas, every troop switching to their secondary becasue it was faster than reloading would have changed the face of global warfare anyway. Pershing was cash money on this.
My grandfather got one of these off of a British paratrooper in Korea. It was made in 1917 for the British Army (in .455), but re-chambered to .45 ACP by England. I would assume it fought with Britain in WW2, and made its way to Korea before being traded to my grandfather (he had a 1911, but always loved revolvers). I still have it to this day, thanks for the cool video explaining some of the history - I would love to see a video on the British or Canadian contracts one day!
That’s a very cool story! This is less of a forgotten weapon and more of an unknown weapon for me, so it was interesting to learn about the, and then to hear from someone who has one with a real back story!
Please hold onto it my friend. They ARE lovely revolvers. Before UK laws changed, I had one for many years in .455, and single OR double action, it shot a DREAM, with lovely smooth pull but crisp break. Superb piece of craftsmanship
@@liammeech3702 The U.K. imported large quantities of .45 ACP during World War 2, as the British were using several weapons chambered for that caliber (Thompson, 1911, etc.). Converting a .455 revolver to 9mm would have been costly, time consuming, unnecessary. However, converting that same revolver to .45 ACP would not only be simpler and cheaper, but would also be able to take advantage of the surplus stores that the U.K. still had on hand. Sidenote: it's also important to remember that while some Hi-Powers were in British service during the Korean War, it wouldn't be adopted as the British standard service sidearm until 1954.
fun fact these were popular enough that the .45 auto rim cartridge was developed for them, and yes it is just a .45acp w/ a rim- exactly as it says on the tin.
The US during World Wars is that one friend that carries so many guns in his truck that he has enough to lend out to his friends and still have left over guns.
Lend/lease we (the UK) didn't finish paying for WW2 supplies from the US until the early 2000's - that means some of my tax money went to US manufacturers for a war that ended long before I was even born. Not complaining just saying.
@@jb8086 According to Wiki - The last payment was made on 29 December 2006 for the sum of about $83m USD (£45.5m) to the United States, and about $23.6m USD (£12m) to Canada.
Long story, bear with me. I inherited one of these from my grandfather, who bought it at an estate sale years back. I always thought it was a true M1917- has all the military markings, US hand grips, etc. when I tried to run .45ACP with half-moon clips, I couldn’t close the cylinder. Tried different brands of clips, still no-go. Did some research on the serial number, and it is actually a 1955-era reproduction of a USGI M1917 chambered only for .45LC, not an authentic WW1 revolver. Still a really cool gun, even if she’s not of WW1 vintage.
There were two N frame Smith & Wessons used in Raiders of the Lost Ark. One was indeed a S&W M1917 with a 4 inch barrel, and was provided by Stembridge Gun Rentals, in California. As much of the film was shot in England and Egypt, the other one was supplied by the British prop company Bapty & Co., and was a Mark II Hand Ejector chambered in .455 Webley, also with a 4 inch barrel, and a different front sight.
Actually I've seen pics of a few that were shortened without front sights meant for very close range combat with concealed carry, which is paradoxical given the very large frame and cylinder size. One had the rear of the butt rounded off too.
The revolver that made it on the top spot of C&Rsenal's "The Best and the Worst Great War Revolvers" video. Love the classic S&W N-Frame. Also Ian, to add more info on its use: 1. The M1917 revolver was popular with US civilians and police during the interwar period. Not just surplus, many were newly-produced for the market. 2. The M1917 revolver was used by tunnel rats during the Vietnam War.
@@lavrentivs9891 silencers were few and far between. Revolvers were preferred over autos in the tunnels since it wasn’t uncommon that you would have to fire the weapon pressed against you or the walls around you. The slide of an auto would slam into you, your face, dirt, etc that would cause a malfunction and take it out of the fight
Eugene Sledge used one in combat as a Marine in World War II. Not issued, but sent to him in the mail from home. More M1917 revolvers were used in WWII than just the official issued- some guys brought their personal guns.
The S&W M1917 revolver makes an appearance in the movie Fury, Brad Pitt's "Wardaddy" carries and uses one with plexiglass "sweetheart" grips holding a picture of his girl back home.
Mine has the S&W logo on the right side, the Lanyard loop, and crossed flag stamps, but no US 1917 marks, bomb stamps, nor "property of the United States" under the barrel (the barrel has been shortened to 4"). The cylinder was originally .455 Eley, but has been reamed to 45LC. I also picked up a 45 ACP cylinder. I don't have half moon clips, but I do have full moon clips. It has black plastic grips rather than wood.
I surprised myself with how I fell in love with the big frame revolvers after I picked up a Colt M1917. They just shoot so comfortably. Been looking to add the S&W to complete the pair, but they seem to be harder to find and/or more highly cherished by their owners....
I've seen m1917 revolvers serving in Vietnam. Pilots used them, Tunnel Rats used them and even some MACV-SOG operators like "Mad Dog" Shriver used them.
I had one, sold it. I liked the trigger pull of the Colt 1917 more. An old Gun Digest Annual I have has an article on modifying the S&W 1917 to also use .45 Colt. I was going to do that, but then S&W came out with their M25-5 and just buying one of those was easier. 😊 S&W like Colt kept on making these right up till WW2 began. As stated here there was a bunch of them made for Brazil in 1937 with a Brazil crest on the side plate. Many of those came back into the US in the 80s and were sold relatively cheaply in Shotgun News. I once had one of those too. I believe I paid $109.95 (used Colt versions were about $420 in that era). Gosh I miss the prices in Shotgun News back in the 80s. :) The US Army MP Command (no longer exists) used to prefer the 1917s for use inside CONUS and used them till the mid 1960s when spare parts started to run out.
Really interesting episode about a somewhat overlooked US firearm. I had an interesting encounter with this very firearm as a 10 year old boy. At the end of the war, S&W and Colt were still producing the revolvers. The US military didn’t need as many revolvers since the 1911 automatic was being produced, also. There were other government agencies that ended up with the 1917 revolvers and one of the largest was the US Post Office. The idea was to arm the Post Office to prevent any robberies of mail or stamps. The vast majority of these revolvers ended up stored inside a vault, most, never to see the light of day. My dad had been appointed postmaster in my hometown in late 1961 (the postmaster job was a political appointment, at that time). I loved to go with him and visit his office. I was sitting at his desk a few weeks after he had started the job. I was opening and checking out each drawer on his antique desk. When I opened the lower right drawer, there was a large box marked, “US Post Office”. I took the top part of the box off and there, in the original shipping box, was a Smith and Wesson Model 1917! I was impressed! Dad had come back in and I ask him what this revolver was for. He said that it had been issued to the office but that it wasn’t on any inventory listing. I said, “Let’s take it home!” Of course, he said “No” and that he was shipping it back to the head Postal Inspector in St. Louis. I never saw that revolver again. I always wondered if someone else thought, “Let’s take it home”.
John Pershing was a veteran of service on the frontier, the Spanish-American War, and the Mexican Punitive Expedition. Some combination of those experiences probably drove his desire that every Soldier have a back-up weapon to their bolt action rifles. Alvin York pulled out an M1911 when he was rushed by multiple Germans and he didn't have time to reload.
My grandfather had one of these in ww2 and my dad has it now . I’ve told him there are very few things I want after him and mom pass but this is one of them.
"I lost out" on Dad's generational family 1897 from 1897 used every day for 50 plus years feeding our Ks family farms, I learned shotgunning.When pop's passed as I had kids, and a gun safe, told dad it was the only thing "I really" wanted for the family future to an older brother who could care less, no safe, and his kid slam fired it through a wall at 12 or 13? in the 80's! Ya just never know? Dads' chioces? no matter how well you thought you know your pops? My first gun per dad's permission was a kit 1858 in 1976 age 11, I paid for and built 100% she still shoots, and shines like a Diamond!
I had a Colt and a S&W models of 1917 revolvers. I still have a S&W model 25 in .45acp. Half-moon clips, because they grasp the cartridges from the outside of the cylinder will catch on the boss cast into the left side of the frame to retain the cylinder as the ejector rod is pushed to the rear. Star clips that grasp 6 cartridges from the inside never foul this boss and eject with no drama.
I've never realized this when thinking about considerations of half vs full moons. But it does make sense. I have never owned or operated a moonclip revolver myself, but they are on my "Aquire List". And I believe a S&W 1917 is the only one I want that utilizes moon clips. Possibly a 1917 Colt or S&W Model 25 if the price is right.
@@tylerwilliams6022 I have an M1917 I bought for $79 in 1973 and a stainless 625 'Model of 1989' with the short cylinder and the full lug 5" barrel I bought in 1992. The 625 is, well, heavy but because of that recoil is almost nothing. It's an absolute treat to shoot!
@@rangerlongshot I will be 40 this year, and I kick myself for not getting certain milsurps when I should have. I could have atleast picked up a Mosin or SKS, or Makarov when they were still somewhat decently priced. I'm beyond jealous of the deals you must have seen in your lifetime. I'm not really into plastic or striker fired guns. Moreso WWII and Vietnam era milsurps and am also getting into western themed arms. Once I hit early adulthood I found that I am more of a 1911 guy than anything. Which is odd because as a kid I thought they were rather pedestrian and had no interest in them. But then again at age 16 I foolishly thought I had the world figured out. I've also come to love and appreciate Hi Powers too!
A friend of mines Dad, was a Mule Skinner for Merrils Marauders in The CBI had the one he carried for the entire war. He gave it to his son who had it cleaned up and we shot it many times. The DA/SA trigger was one of the smoothest I have ever used.
I think Pershing's idea of giving every infantryman a sidearm makes some sense in the context of the war on the Western front. It had been long-established by the warring powers that the long rifle - even a relatively short long rifle like the 1903 - loses most of its effectiveness in the cramped conditions of an enemy trench. If every Doughboy had a 1911 at their hip, or at least a 1917 Revolver, the American infantryman would be well-equipped for trench combat without having to resort to shovels and knives.
Problem is - what do you do without those half-moon clips... :) You have to make sure to keep them after reloading or trust the army to always supply them. I guess you can also use a flathead screwdriver to get the cases out... Kind of what I used to carry a flathead screwdriver for back in the 90s, for a machine gun...
I have one of the latter Brazilian contract ones. Improved rear sight, but otherwise identical (other than markings of course). The Braz. contract guns had a square notch rear sight instead of semi-circle, and the initial order used commercial diamond grips rather than smooth military style ones.
The Brazilian contract guns were broken into two series -- about half delivered before World War II, with the earlier hammer safety mechanism, and about half delivered after World War II with the later hammer safety mechanism. I have one of the early series... Damned fun gun to shoot, but I gave up on clips and bought a couple hundred Auto Rim cases from Star Line.
My grandfather carried his in 2 world wars and one revolution. We, the family, still have it in our collection. It's been around. I bought one at a gun show 30 years ago. Nice!
hi, Ian ... ‼️ good video on an awesome revolver ... it is perfect, it is the perfect platform than all moder revolver ... ‼️ it is immortal ... bye bye 👋😉
I love the 1917 revolvers. I prefer the smith over the colt. I think it's the best revolver issued in WW1 which is hilarious because it was our backup pick.
I have one of the .455 British contract ones. Best .455 ever made. It is great to shoot, especially for a 'log chop' shoot. Perfect combination of that 265gn stopping power and a well made handgun. The firing pin is central which makes the LP primer friendly to the firearm. I also shoot a MkVI Webley 1918 model which is a bit roughly made (most of the skilled makers having volunteered for the front), however the pin gets damage by the shoulders of the LP primer. The original .455 was made for the larger diameter soft copper primer used in British firearms like .303 and .455. A note for reloading .455 projectiles with the hollow base - always wad the powder to keep it close to the primer. Wool wads work but I use card cut from the side of a cereal box. Not using a wad gives generally lower and inconsistent velocity, plus lures the ignorant into using more powder than you should. A .455 cast projectile weighing 275gn and travelling 955fps may seem cool but the cost of microwelding the cylinder retaining ring back on and finding replacement grips for the spalled ones from the recoil is not worth the excitement.
At the risk of asking a stupid question, the 1911 had been around for 6 years or so at this point - what was stopping ramping up production of the 1911 instead of ordering these?
As reloading became more common in the 60's and 70's, there was some experimenting with these done to create a 'poor man's big-bore magnum' of sorts using standard cases, as the guns were relatively cheap and common back then which the 41 and 44 magnums weren't. It wasn't a good idea since the rounds might get used in something else with catastrophic results.
Saw some of these at a gun show in the early 90s with my dad, he told me he carried the Colt 1917 whenbhe was in the 2nd Armored division, but when he served as an MP drring the Army of Occupation he had the S&W version. He said he was just as accurate (or lack there of) with both of them.
My former boss was a warrant officer med-evac chopper pilot during the Vietnam war. He was issued a S&W 1917 new in the box. That revolver apparently "fell" out off the chopper and ended up at his home in Florida after he was discharged. A S&W Victory Model was issued to him as a replacement for the S&W 1917. When he requested a bit more firepower, they gave him two M3 Grease Guns.
This is one of those revolvers that I love looking at and fondling but never have enjoyed shooting. I think seeing War Daddy carry one in Fury made me finally jump on the band wagon. Such neat revolvers.
Yay, I finally own a gun in one of your excellent videos. Mine is in excellent condition considering it’s over 100 years old. My gun has a story. My uncle and cousins ran a dry cleaners. They specialized in smoke damage remediation with insurance companies. The 1917 S&W I was given came in to their facility in a coat pocket after a house fire. The house was in a notorious area known for old time mafia and gangsters. For a year they tried to return the gun and the owner refused to accept it or have any knowledge of it. It sat in a safe for over 40 years. When they closed the business they gave it to me. The revolver shoots nice and has one of the smoothest double actions of any of my handguns. I only wish that gun could talk. But knowing it’s history it probably wouldn’t talk even if it could.
I did enjoy the video Ian! One thing I'd like to see more in your videos is how the trigger feels like. Is it heavy? Light? Sloppy? Etc. Most of us will never get to touch these old guns, so I'm always curious to hear how they feel.
Was at Springfield Armory a few weeks back doing a WW2 Display they have a few M1917 Revolvers on display most likely a few rare 1's up in the attic lol
You can shoot the S&W without half moon clips and push the empties out with a stick or whatever if it were necessary, but not the Colt. The Colt doesn't have the step in the cylinder like the S&W for the case mouth to headspace on. Excellent engineering on the S&W! Without the half moon clips the Colt is useless.
small nitpick: the Triple Lock was originally offered in .44 Special only, not .45 Colt far as I know Smith didn't offer any revolvers in .45 Colt until the mid-1970s (25-3 limited production, then 25-5 serial)
Isn't this the revolver that Indy shot the Arab swordsman with? I have NEVER, before or since, heard such a cheer erupt in a movie theater. It was LOUD.
Did they ever sell commercial versions of this? Because I have on that matches this exactly but has none of the US markings and does have the S&W logo on the lock-work cover.
I think all in all, the Enfield 1917, the S&W / Colt 1917 and the Colt 1911 were the best small arms of World War one. Not perfect, just the best. Thanks Ian. Great job as always 👏.
Because the ACP is less-aggressive than a Long Colt, the weight of the gun tames recoil even more. This was a grail piece, for me, and worthy of the quest. Five-digit serial number, too, which only makes it more special, to me.
I own one, and it is my favorite camp/adventuring/apocalypse revolver lol The only thing I don't actually like about the gun is the feel of the grip. I wrapped mine with athletic tape, both to protect the stocks and to pad agaisnt the harsh recoil. Though I would not recommend this - at all - I've shot modern defensive loads through it, without any issues, and it makes it a good outdoors companion. It'll also shoot all the cheap, crappy 45 ACP that doesn't feed well in other guns. It really is a fantastic handgun, even today, and if I could only have one it would probably be that one.
I almost got one of these for my first handgun, would've been a steal at $400. I paid for it online and opted for in-store pickup st my lgs, and they called me to tell me it was at their Branchburg location and they'd ship it over here. Well lo and behold it had already sold and nobody removed it from the website.
my grand dad has my great grandad's M1917 revolver that's nickle plated, engraved, and has a 1st calvary division emblem on the ivory grips. it's awesome
Almost bought a South American model.. whish i had (90's) In an odd way the now archaic term FLANGED that was used to describe what is often called Rimmed was more correctly descriptive.
Cool Smith and Wesson I’m a smith and Wesson man myself especially when it comes to revolvers just because 1 they are more reliable and 2 I prefer pushing forward then pulling backwards it’s a easier motion to do especially under stress like a timer
Very nice. One of my favorite revolvers. I believe S&W introduced their large frame 'hand ejector' with the extra lock in the brand new .44 special cartridge in 1907 or 1908 (just a lengthened .44 Russian). I heard the Smiths were more accurate than 1911's in the National Pistol Matches of the 1920's. The gap started to close when Colt introduced the pre-war National Match in the early 30's (that would make for a lovely FW episode). By the way, the Colt 1917, based in the New Service, was larger than the Smith. Thanks! Another awesome video!
These revolvers were very popular with tanker crews since if they had to fire a pistol in the confines of a tank, a revolver was preferred because it wouldn't send spent casings bouncing around the interior. Italian tankers preferred the older Bodeo revolvers in WWII for the same reason.
