To play drums like Gene is hard enough as it is...but as an actor also trying to emulate his style and look on camera is admirable. Sal does an amazing job!
Well, I too was a budding jazzer in the late ‘50’s when the movie came out. A few things really ought to be clarified for this discussion. Krupa was a 100% “rudimental” player. His trademark sound was derived around 16th note triplets with 32nd groupings interspersed for contrast. His “drumnastics” often included several of the drum rudiments such as paradiddles, double paradiddles, and paradiddle-diddles, ratamacues, ruffs etc., all judiciously used to get around the drum set. His influences were Baby Dodds, Sonny Greer, contemporary Chic Webb etc. -even Cozy Cole with whom Krupa partnered in a Manhattan drum school in later years. His technique was simple but beautifully executed and he was a masterful and tasteful drummer within the Chicago and swing genre. Through the force of his unique personality and his ultimate finesse he truly did what is said of him, that he moved the drums and drummers permanently into the spotlight, opening up opportunities for people like Buddy Rich and Ray McKinley etc. Rich, who truly was a technical marvel far beyond Krupa, was known to say-with conviction and respect-that Krupa was his inspiration musically, and that he loved the Krupa sound. Krupa was also quite expansive with new ideas, though he never really advanced along with developments of jazz into bop etc. Instead he used his high musicality to forge a unique sound to carry him into the ‘50’s and beyond. Few musicians can claim such a thing. Virtually all of the greats shined brightly as progenitors or members of movements in jazz. Krupa made his own movement and occupied it with great success. As to Sal Mineo, he idolized Krupa and for the role as Krupa he worked for months learning to play all of Gene Krupa’s technique, under Krupa's tutelage. However, the entire soundtrack is in fact Gene Krupa and Mineo worked to duplicate exactly G.K.’s sticking and posturing for the visuals of each scene. Again, you are hearing Gene Krupa throughout. That was the “inside poop” about the film back in the day. And, actually, a drummer who comes up through solid rudimental training and also works with advanced method books and symphonic training can sit down with Krupa recordings and films and master exactly what Krupa plays measure for measure with the exact sticking, just as advanced drum and bugle corps players or symphonic percussionists can play terrifically difficult music in perfect unison. Sal Mineo had the benefit of being coached by Krupa through every scene for as long as it took to duplicate exactly (or nearly so) what his teacher showed him and prerecorded. Hmmmm-I hope this doesn’t offend; I certainly mean no offence.
Hmmm...symphonic, drum and bugle corps, rudimental training, ...sounds like me....throw in influences from Beatles, Count Basie, Billy Cobham. everything 50s, 60s 70s and 80s, plus Gene, Speey and Michael Giles...and you got me at 71 years old. All this talent and good chops and can't find any good people to jam with....having a low tolerance for mediocrity.....plus influences from Gene, Speedy Jones and Michael Giles....it's torture !
Your assessment is most eloquently stated! I wonder in the final finale scene when Shelley man tries to Gene to come out of his 3:00 hole if those licks are actually Shelly playing or those Gene Krupa as well
@@domenicv7962 : Shelley Manne The other drummer in the “ Big comeback scene….Gene’s friend In that big climactic scene when they’re both on stage when they’re playing in the Tommy Dorsey Orchestra, The other Drummer who wants to try to get Gene Krupa to snap back into playing That’s the late great iconic jazz drummer Shelly Manne! Shelley Manne plays Davey Tough in the movie GENE’S drummer friend!!!
Imagine people back then calling him a dope addict for smoking pot. I love his "fuck you" drumming response. Same thing happened when Ringo first appeared as a member of the Beatles - the audiences had loved Pete Best for his good looks, though he couldn't play worth a damn. Ringo won them over very quickly just as Krupa (Sal) did here. Brilliant performance by Sal Mineo.
Sal had been a drummer for a few years prior to taking on this role. And then he studied with Krupa learning how to mimic his stylefor just over 2 years before filming started. I've always loved this movie; I saw it in the theater when I was seven years old in 1959, and have been playing drums myself ever since. Gene was one of my first drumming inspirations.
Same here, only I was nine years old in 1959 when I also saw it on the Saturday matinee. That planted the seed. In the 60's, I was in a garage band and then progressed to jazz in the late 60's and haven't stopped playing yet. I own the movie DVD now and still watch it regularly along with all of the RU-vid videos I can find.
The other drummer in the movie was Shelly Manne who played with a dazzling array of musicians, including Bill Evans, Charlie Parker, and Dizzy Gillespie, and ran his own hip nightclub in the 1960s. Although Manne, who was born in New York on June 11, 1920, started out playing the alto saxophone, he was destined to be a percussionist.
Sal Mineo is amazing in this movie!!! He is literally banging the drums to every beat perfectly in every take or angle!!! And he's only 20 years old!! The following year he's amazing in Exodus, I can't figure out, how this guy wasn't given the parts or the credit that he truly deserved..
I'll say this for Sal Mineo--he worked extraordinarily hard to appear convincing at the drums and he went well beyond that (of all drummers, even Buddy Rich, nobody looked so born to play the traps like Krupa, so Mineo had a lot of work in front of him!)
Sal was an exceptional exceptional actor, I have the privilege of seeing him in a play, called marathon, 33 comma in Austin, Texas in 1975. It’s great gifts were overlooked for so long by the film industry I believe in a sort of retribution for the fact that he was gay. But having the opportunity to speak with him for just 10 minutes, I saw someone who was a deeply caring person who has so much potential yet to meet, his death in 1976 was devastating to so many.
Great Frigging movie. Sal Mineo was superb both as an actor and drummer. He nailed Krupa’s style and sound. Krupa had a swing to his drumming, as well as march patterns, and he was the master at rim shots. He is by far my favorite drummer from yesteryear.
Sal did a great job on this, having been coached by Gene beforehand. Hard to believe getting busted for one joint could have such a disastrous effect on your reputation, but it happened.
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WOW! What gem have I just come across. I knew there was a film about Krupa and have been wanting to see it, but Holy Crap! Sal Mineo plays him! AND CAN DRUM LIKE THAT!
Sorry, that wasn't Sal Mineo on the recording. Gene Krupa actually did the film's soundtrack and Sal Mineo dubbed along to the pre-recorded track. Actually, back then they didn't call it "dubbing or syncing" - instead, it was called "sidelining." The movie was heavily panned by critics and drummers (even today) for it's inaccuracies. I'm very surprised to hear positive responses from anyone.
I knew that it wasn't Mineo I was hearing, but still... just watching him. I am beyond impressed that an actor could pick up the skills to imitate Krupa's playing close enough to looking real. I was also kinda freaking out at the Sal Mineo + drumming combo. Two of my favorite things.
Ronda Gupton-Pruett From I've read/heard from several Krupa and Mineo interviews is that Krupa and Mineo rehearsed, worked and practiced for months together at Krupa's house until he was satisfied with Mineos performance. If you watch the "Sal Mineo drum contest 1958" on youtube I think he cites a reference to the amount of time he put into it.
qq kk Great! I love when adjunct information, especially media like this, cranks down hard to form new synapses. Sort of like looking at the old information from above. Maybe it's a wasted synapse, but it feels good growing.
"In 1934 [Krupa] joined Benny Goodman's band, where his featured drum work made him a national celebrity. His tom-tom interludes on their hit 'Sing, Sing, Sing' were the first extended drum solos to be recorded commercially." ~ Wikipedia
Krupa replaced my grandfather, Frank Frisselle, when he left Rudy Valley's band in the late '30s. He once said that Frank Frisselle was the best drummer in America.
Lynda Williams Buddy Rich said the same thing about Frankie Frisselle on The Tonight Show how about the little guy has he picked it up yet ?I bet he will. Aloha
I was a fan the first time I heard Drum Bogie. I was 13 and had just started playing the drums. About five years later I went to see him perform at the Metropole Cafe in NYC. During his break we had a conversation which set me on a quest that lasted for many wonderful years.
I remember watching this when I was a kid. All the voices all the sudden made me jump. I used to smoke the weed. I haven’t in a long time. The musics my buzz now.
1957 - I was a young wannabe drummer & would go to the loop every Sunday for matinee concert @ The Modern Jazz Room on Randolph & State St and right across the street was the Chicago Theatre with the movie. Hear how great those tom toms sound? That's because they are natural drum skins - not synthetic-plastic which started replacing natural skins in '58. There was another great movie that came out around then 'The Man with the Golden Arm' staring Frank Sinatra as a strung out junkie jazz drummer. Shelly Manne was the technical drum advisor on that film (I don't know if they needed to hire a real junkie as an advisor). Saw the Gene Krupa Quartet @ a Sunday matinee @ the Blue Note on Clark in '57 or early '58 and got their autographs. Admission at both clubs was only $1.50 for for 2 hours music + 2 glasses of coka cola. But gas was $.25 gal & cigs $.25 a pack so I guess every thing is relative (especially when a relative steals all your thngs).
I watched this movie on New Year’s Eve 1964, I was 14. I was working for $.75 an hour and saved up enough to buy a four piece Ludwig set and played every minute I had. Krupa was my inspiration! (Idol)
Sal must have been studying drums for many years. One doesn't do that kind of drum solo with only a few weeks practice. Incredible impersonation of Krupa and his style of drumming.
Its hard to argue with that first commentor, an educated soul he be. I myself immediately thought of Elvin Jones in the 60's psychedelic western farce Zachariah.
I hear that Gene Krupa was not too thrilled with the end result of the film, and I think a few of the reasons were the schmaltzy dramatic effects that were inserted. As Steve Allen once said, this was the first time that the Original Person was better looking than the Actor Portraying him. I do give Sal Mineo a lot of credit though good job. Kudos to Shelly Manne behind him on drums portraying the ill fated Drummer Dave Tough 1907-1948 who died after hitting his head on a Newark sidewalk after another usual night of drinking.
Haven't seen this movie before but looks like Sal does a great job playing Krupa..... I mean, Gene was a much better drummer, but Sal has his theatrics down perfectly and can at least hold his own on the kit.
Well, folks . . . this clip opens with the tune "Hawaiian War Chant", then moves into that driving "American" jazz standard, "Cherokee", which some of you probably know was written by an Englishman---the gifted Ray Noble. Can't we get the entire flick posted? Gary in Arizona
I agree with you.. I must say that Miles Teller did an excellent job in Whiplash and I think a big well done to Tom Everett Scott for his well performed part on drums in That Thing You Do..do any of you know how exceptional a drummer Tom Hanks is? I applaud anyone that gets behind any instrument and gives it all they got. Most times we stuck at it but the exceptions rise to the top to inspire us to keep trying. A bad day at band practice is better than most all the other days combined.. some of us live for one damn good moment, whole song or one great night on the drums.. to those that rise to spotlight you have my standing O
The movie was 1957 I think and did not come near to doing justrice to the story of GK. There was no real artistic effort to recreate the era (20's,30's and 40's)) and much of the story was pure fiction on a B scale. That being said the drumming scenes were great and Sal Mineo was fantastic as GK on the drums. Could not find any "out of sync" movements in any of the drumming scenes.
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Shelley Mann on who's drums? As far as I know, Davie Tough was the saviour in the background, Gene provided the drums and Sal, who was an accomplished skin banger did the rest, am I wrong?
You are correct except Tough was dead before filming. I suspect there may have been some contractual issue about naming the actual drummer up there. I'm kinda glad they did.
The 2nd drummer was Shelley Manne, look him up on Drummerworld, he is a very well established drummer. I'm glad everyone here is interested in drummer history - keep up the good work.
I think whiplash would disagree..... However I do enjoy this movie. As inaccurate as much of the movie is, they got most of what's in the movie wrong about the guy but he was a really good drummer so that part is true. Seek out the truth about this film and you'll find they got pretty much two things right, there was a guy named Gene Krupa and yes he was a good drummer. Most of everything else in the movie was wrong. Much like top gun only got two things correct, there is a place called top gun, and they train pilots there.
Crap film, but Sal really pours it on. Is there another picture in which an actor went to such lengths to learn a musical instrument and then had to emulate the unique style of the performer?
unwindzen He's "drum-in" after playing Rudimental Bass Drum in the US Marines, being Drum Section Leader and playing Tympani in our High School Orchestra my ears are pretty much tuned to the real thing this is an amazing performance by a true genius personally I can't enough of the accuracy in his beats, it shows the commitment Actors put into their craft.
He is playing lol but he's not exact. You cannot fake a cymbal crash - but he's just playing well enough to be "on tempo" so it looks right. I've played drums 50 years and grew up playing to Gene and Buddy. Sal did a nice job for what he was called for. Gene was a showman.
I heard Krupa when I was a kid and he made me want to be a drummer, and I was. Had a lot of local success and got rich thru music. Thanks to him and my band teacher and lots of practice.
