Schiit Modi 3+ - Is this the best $99 DAC out there? 

If you just got into audio gear let me recommend you just turn back now before it’s too late. Also, use audio forums sparingly. Lots of good help and advise but equal parts nonsense and toxic bs. Just find something you enjoy and be happy.

Don’t use your better gear on RU-vid. I watch 90% of YT on a tablet. Perfectly fine. Save the good gear for listening to music.

I can't hear anything because my wife has me turn it all down. That's why I bought a cottage in the woods for her and I stay home and listen to music.

Lol. This is the best comment I’ve ever seen.

@@maxjasmine DAMN 😱😱😱😂😂😂

What headphones is he using?

Thank you very much! I'm glad that they are helpful.

Yeah… after all it’s an amp!

#1 audio equipment in India. True story.

@@foxkenji lol real story.

I also did suffer from feedback noise when plugged into My motherboard for power

Even better, use one of the hefty USB batteries, it's completely pure DC, zero noise.

@@louskimming4371 Can you elaborate more? I'm not sure what that is.

ikr i thought about it before but didnt want to blow my DAC lol

Do you know which apple power supply? Is it the 12watt? Please help.

Let us know when it arrives what your impressions are!

It has been a while since I've bought a pair of active speakers, but years ago I got a pair of Emotivas. Seems there are some quite decent options under $500 available now from reports I've read. Since the basic Schiit headphone amps double as pre-amps, they can act as a volume control for the speakers.

Thank you too!

I have an air filter in the room, but primarily by having a duster within reach, along with wet wipes for my desk pad and a battery-powered vacuum cleaner. It's almost a daily effort.

The hi-fi hobby is one where sunk costs are a core part of the experience. The average layperson (much less non-musicians) cannot appreciate a $6000-8000 system (disregarding MSRP and looking at "true performative value") unless you've spent considerable time with a system that's $1200/1500/2000-ish. So this applies to portable audio as well, but in a much more compressed scale. Sure, to the uninitiated, planar headphones sound good, perhaps even "better", even, when compared to your sub $100 earphones. It's not until you spend a solid 6+ hours with a well matched $500 setup that you can start to begin to hear the details that planar headphones offer over cheap in-ears. On the other hand, hi-fi is (or rather, has been) a hobby where the cost window to properly dip one's toes in is fairly small. Spend too little, and you wonder why you spent it in the first place (you don't hear a difference, or worse, it sounds worse). Spend too much, and you feel like you blew your money on overpriced snake oil. The trick is to build a system that the uninitiated music enthusiast can appreciate the differences over audio solutions aimed at the lowest common denominator consumer for the lowest price possible. Thanks in part to the advent/boom of the chi-fi industry in the past decade, this price point has gotten lower and lower. For beginner portable audiophiles, getting a KZ ZS10 for $50 on Amazon will definitely, immediately show a positive-leaning change in the sound signature. Then switch to Tidal or use a local-music playing app and play files at or better than 320kbps MP3. Then spend an extra $100 on a dongle dac by Fiio or Hidizs. At this point, you're $150 in, and you have a setup that goes beyond delivering audio data decently and actually makes an attempt at making music sound better than the basic $20 Apple wired earbuds. This is an excellent point for the beginner audiophile to get off and reflect on the experience. The KZs are great for introducing them to the idea that a $30 difference can net such an improvement in sound signature. And as an aside, the $20 Apple earphones do an adequate job of delivering music in a musical manner, especially for the price. But for $30, for a beginner audiophile to be introduced to concepts such as soundstage, low-distortion bass not ruining the rest of the acoustic signature (probably have to fiddle with EQ), and to grasp at the idea that it's possible to find minute audio details with greater clarity/resolution is a steal. The $100 dongle dac is also great for introducing them to the idea of diminishing returns in audio. Sure, it sounds better, but the benefit from the sunk cost of $100 is not proportionate to the $30 spent going from Apple to KZ. Are the KZs a good audiophile earphone in the grand scheme of things? Absolutely not. However, for the merely curious, $30 is almost an unbeatable price. You can't say you wasted your money, and we're way behind thinking that you got sold overpriced snake oil. This is also a great point for said music enthusiast to get off. Maybe, to them, they don't need to spend any more money to enjoy their music. And this is a perfect spot for them to get off and enjoy the $30-150 they spent. However, they may find themselves now capable of being more discerning to the audio quality they listen to. And this is where the meat and bones of my comment and reply to you begin. The Magni-Modi stack is great for middle-of-beginner-phase audiophiles to dip their toes into desktop audio. Just my two cents, but if you're an early adolescent, you can spend plenty of time in portable, IEM land and not feel the need to upgrade. However, if you're a young adult, you might find yourself wanting more immediately, and want to get out of IEM land. At which point, desktop audio is great. Magni-Modi + Sony 7506 or Shure SRH440 would be my reccomendation for only $300. In my opinion, while many find themselves going down the IEM rabbit hole because of the skintight intimacy in presentation while still presenting great clarity and low distortion, a desktop setup+headphones offer a much more mature presentation. It's more nuanced, more balanced, etc. I believe that most young adults can take the Magni-Modi stack and run a long way with it. For fresh beginner audiophiles, this would last them a long, long time. Once again, the audiophile that finds themselves here can take a rest here and reflect on their experience. Do they need to spend more than $300 to enjoy their music? I personally believe that the combination listed above is particularly special, because it goes beyond dipping one's toes in the water. It's a jump into an ankle level pool at the local clubhouse. The water is very comfortable, and you can have a lot of fun splashing around in the water. For a few, this is enough money invested for the amount of enjoyment/fun. For another few, they know they can spend more to get even better sound and even greater enjoyment. But for most, they're currently splashing in the water having a grand old time. However, for the more discerning, Magnius-Modius is a solid choice for beginning-of-intermediate phase audiophiles who specifically want to try a desktop setup with discrete dac and amp components. Pair with Sennheiser HD6XX or Beyerdynamic DT990 ($200) plus appropriate 3rd party XLR cable (~$50-100) for a grand total of $700. This is knee level water. Beginner audiophiles cannot fully appreciate this system until they've had significant outside experience with a loudspeaker system of approximately the same value. To make it thigh, or even crotch level water, consider the HD600 or DT1990 ($400/$550, so total approx. $1k). For a significant amount of people, this can be endgame. Now, to answer your questions: Is Modius+Magnius a better option for long term (than Magni-Modi)? Does the law of diminishing returns apply? The answer is that they both depend on your own audiophile journey. If you've had signifcant experience listening to midrange loudspeaker hifi ($1000-3000), then I'd say the Magni-Modi would be perfectly fine. If you're already at the intermediate level of desktop audio, it would be fine as well. But if you're already deep into the intermediate-level desktop hifi, I would suggest perhaps using Bifrost 2 as the DAC, to really nail in the Schiit sound. The Modius isn't a bad dac by any means, and it's priced very competitively, but its function-to-price bracket ratio leaves it in a bit of a no-mans-land. The Modi offers a much better value for the money for beginners, and the Bifrost offers a much more distinct sound for intermediates. Therefore, for intermediates, the saving grace of the Modius is that it pairs well in a stack with the Magnius. But at the intermediate level, I'd also suggest the Topping D90+A90 stack ($1400) or the integrated DX7 Pro ($552 refurbished on Apos). But I'm going to assume you're either a fresh audiophile or currently in that first stage where you've begun to experience concepts such as soundstage, imaging, sound quality, distortion, resolution, speed, and the like. In which case, there are several things to consider. The first is the time you're willing to put in, then closely followed by the money you're willing to spend. If hifi is something you think you're going to be into for the next 5 years and you can afford it, then I think Magnius+Modius is a solid investment. The sunk cost will probably be the different headphones or IEMs you'll try and pair with it. The benefit is that over time, you'll likely hear past what the Magni+Modi would have offered in the first place. However, you won't know what you missed out on. On the other hand, spending $300 for the Magni-Modi stack isn't just cheaper, in the long run you'll be more appreciative of future upgrades (as a beginning audiophile). And obviously, if you're jumping in the ankle-height pool and it turns out you don't like it, the lower cost means that it's much easier to move forward from this experience emotionally.

@@munmunyee Wow! Amazing comment. I'm saving this for future reference. Thank you for taking the time to write this. So helpful!

@@munmunyee great comment man, thank you

​@@munmunyee Wow! (a VERY BIG WOW!) I was going through a few old emails and (idiot me) I didn't realize I had missed on the friendliest, most exhaustive, empathic, smart, and generous comment I've EVER seen to any question of mine, during my lifetime. In the end I got an Asgard - Modius stack, with a pair Meze 99 Classics. I moved that to my larger set and got a Vali 2 with a Modi; and finally I just couldn't resist getting a Bifrost 2/64 when it came out. The devil told me I had to get my hands on a R2R dac to compare with a chip dac I honestly can't hear a difference between the DACs they all sound the same to me. The problem is most likely ME and my listening capabilities. However, I'm sure that if I switched to more resolving headphones I'd probable hear the difference. Now, when it comes to listening on my speakers; I can hear the difference with the Bifrost 2/64 (streaming via WiiM pro and managed via Roon). I hear the air, the openness and I feel it's "organic". I see it as a journey. Nothing is making me think I'll be spending more money on DACs in the near future. You deserve a longer response, but for now, all I can say is THANK YOU!

Yup.

Thanks for correcting me. My mistake.

The Nyquist Theorem is just that. It's actually impossible to implement perfectly. You'd need infinite computing power. The harshness usually comes from electrical noise, usually from power supplies, passing through the circuits. Likewise, you'll often see people say "Digital is just 1's and 0's" but that is completely misleading.

@@Currawong oh hey thanks for responding! So would you say that the difference in DAC quality is more due to electrical isolation than anything else?

that's what i wanted to ask. I use usb as well. manual sais you dont need additional power but if i connect it anyways will it be better?

@@dmitrys410 no, it just adds another audio-source.

Paused video to ask question, then saw your ipad suggestion, still need a pointer

You'll blow things up if you plug a 120V adaptor into a 240V socket. The PSU is just a generic USB power supply. Grab an old iPhone charger or similar and use that.

@@Currawong excellent, thank you

A new model is highly unlikely. The multibit version was due to stop production AFAIK.

Depends on your tastes and system. I tend to recommend Chord, Schiit and Audio-gd in order of preference towards accurate soundstage versus most options and degree of euphonic tuning.

You need a streaming DAC for that, which has a USB port for that purpose.

They are now, but at the time Schiit was gathering a BOM for the Modi 3+, they were considerably more expensive. For the Hel, they now have USB-C, because the price dropped. This is all written up in the Schiit Happened chapters on Head-Fi. :)

@@Currawong that's a fair point; makes sense. do you think they'll have an update at some point? to be honest (and if you know these folks well), this is what gives me pause on pulling the trigger. i know it's a small detail, as an Apple audio/video user/maker, I'm avoiding any new purchases that aren't USBC.

The gamer gear was designed and released more recently. Regardless, there's absolutely no benefit to using USB-C on a DAC. If anything, it'd be more headaches for Schiit and their customers, as USB-A to B cables are consistent in what they do, but there are a variety of types of USB-C cables, some of which would be no good.

yes. just grab a cable micro usb to lighting (or micro usb to 3.5mm with the apple dongle adapter) and in regards to pairing it with the magni 3+ it is a perfect pair. the infamous "schiit stack" as people call it. really good bang for buck.

No. You need an ADC (Analog to Digital Converter). A DAC only goes the other way.

I don't recall the reason for using micro connectors (though I'd guess it makes it easier to connect to a phone) but the reason USB-C didn't make it on to the 3+ was that, at the time it being designed, USB-C connectors were too expensive. Now that the price has come down, they are putting them on newer products. I believe that the ESS-based version of the Modi 3+ will use USB-C.

It has to be powered regardless. Whether you use your computer's USB port for power or an external power supply doesn't matter.

@@Currawong thank you!

Should be good. I use a Raspberry Pi to stream to DACs as well.

Yes.

The last 3 Macs I've owned all worked fine with it. Sounds like a you problem.

You'll need a Mani phono pre-amp as well if you're using the Magni with a turntable.

Check what it says on the included charger, as it should be 100-240V compatible.

No need to upgrade. If you are going to upgrade, save up for a whole greater system.

THX

With a Magni amp or similar.

If you do distortion tests with actual headphones, rather than resistors as the load, it's easy to see the difference between the performance of different amps. As for blind tests, it depends how you set them up as to how successful they will be. With these amps, it'd be easy to succeed using high quality, complex music with heavy bass at high volumes through a pair of demanding headphones. In my case, I don't need to do a blind test to tell me what I already know -- that music quality and how loud you listen affect what experience you'll get from cheaper or more expensive amps. That's just a simple way of explaining what otherwise would require knowledge of maths and electronics to understand. Cheers. :)

Could be! You just need a 75 Ohm cable to use with it, assuming it has an S/PDIF output.

You've probably tried it by now, but I just hooked up a Modi3+ to my ancient AMC CD8b, (like the simple design and rugged Sony transport, sound though was just OK). I was pleasantly surprised at what an improvement it made. Much bigger soundstage and stronger bass and highs and just much more fun to listen to. As Currawong points out, it's not the most refined sound but it's pretty darn good. Eventually I'll upgrade and relegate the Modi to streaming playlists when we have guests over but for now I'm really enjoying it. (Little) money well spent.

The current model has USB-C.

Might be showing you the recordings how they are mate. The truth can sound pretty boring sometimes! More accurate is certainly not always better, but that's how it is treated.

It could also be that the motherboard on your PC is boosting the bass and treble. Which will be more fun sounding.

How did that happen? Something would have had to catastrophically fail to destroy that much gear.

​@@Currawong so I had the CTH and it started to have this high pitch, so I swapped back to the schitt magni amp thinking the CTH was faulty. I got the Denon for christmas and was swapping between that and the Philips, which both had right ear issues. So then we plugged in two more headphones to test, Meze 99 and another, both had the high pitch. That's when I realized it was the DAC. I swapped both to JDS Labs and haven't had an issue for months now. I sent in email to Schitt Audio explaining what I did, the equipment I swapped and wanted to know what could've gone wrong. I'm no expert just wondering about the setup. No answer, so the 2nd inquiry (a bit miffed) was sent and that's when they offered a full refund if I sent both back. I'm sad that $200 Schitt equipment did not work out for me. I know time to time someone gets a crappy equipment, but a timely response would have been nice, instead of a "I'm very sorry to hear what happened. I'm sorry we never received the first email. I'm not sure what happened with that. I'm very sorry for the delay." Will see, they're offering to look at the equipment and possibly "fix" the headphones.

@@evalee4718 Any update on your story?

Welcome!

Try it and see if you hear any difference. I haven't seen noise measurements of the 5W charger to know for sure.

Welcome!