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Scotland Economic Pluralism Climate Change Talk 

ProfSteveKeen
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My talk critiquing the climate change trivalising nonsense written by Neoclassical economists.
There are very good questions at the end where you can't hear the question, but can hear my answer. Listen through until you hear me say the talk is over, at almost exactly an hour.

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27 май 2023

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Комментарии : 31   
@jthadcast
@jthadcast 4 месяца назад
so on point. Keen never fails to speaks the horror out lound of the pathetic excuse for economics that props up consumer insanity while reducing climate change to a minor cost that we only need buy a solution. thank you Professor Keen for speaking truth with the necessary sarcasm to stomach the bitter pill.
@Alex_Plante
@Alex_Plante Год назад
The Nordhaus scam is that he does not actually consider the cost of climate change, although that is what he falsely claims. Instead he compares the costs of different areas with different climates. To explain: I'm a civil engineer, and I design drainage systems. Suppose I design a drainage pipe in a given city for current conditions, and conclude an 18-inch pipe is required, then I do a similar calculation for a city 100 miles away that receives more rain, and conclude they need a 21-inch pipe. the difference in cost between building an 18-inch and a 21-inch pipe is relatively small, because most of the cost in laying a pipe is the trench. Now suppose the climate of the first city changes such that now they need a 21-inch pipe. The cost of upgrading their drainage is to dig up the 18-inch pipe, replace it with a 21-inch pipe, refill the trench and repair the road. The cost of changing the pipe diameter is far far greater than the difference in cost of building a new 18-inch or 21-inch pipe. Of course, in the real world we would consider other solutions, such as building retention basins, or do nothing and allow more frequent flooding, and accept the consequent flood damages. But still, the cost of adapting to climate change is far greater than the difference in cost between two cities with different but stable climates.
@ProfSteveKeen
@ProfSteveKeen Год назад
Excellent analogy!
@GhostOnTheHalfShell
@GhostOnTheHalfShell Год назад
We can see this in the US West right now as after 20 years of desperate drought has been given a reprieve with an immense snow pack. Thousands of farms across the West have seen their productivity slashed because they had inadequate water to plant to capacity. Farmers and ranchers have also lost their livelihood entirely. Now comes the floods. Ex: Tulare lake has re-emerged drowning farms and ranches in the central valley in a mini Pakistan flood. Farmers and ranchers have lost their livelihoods now from the opposite of drought. That 3-4x plus snowpack looming in the Sierras will enjoy summer heat waves, the menace of soot from fire (whose risk is moderated from a super wet season) and monsoon like storms that create conditions that rhyme with the sequence that flooded 1/3 of Pakistan. Forest growth from a wet season will become the fuel next year. Whiplash brutalized wheat and rice yields in India by 15% and 5% respectively last year. India is the worlds largest exporter of rice. Brutal heatwaves again retuned this year. With ave temps rising, wheat is not a viable crop above 45C (iirc). For the North American continent, bread basket growing regions will shift to Canada. Canada’s regional soils are poor. Glaciers scraped them away. Russia is the one country that comes out with an advantage in all this, if it even survives. Now let’s talk about wet bulb and its impact on human labor and even survival. Business make get a wake up call as the insurance industry follows data. Auto and mortgage coverage is being suspended due to factors including climate change. In the US a mortgage is contingent on insurance.
@sjpandolph
@sjpandolph Год назад
Most economists have no concept of living biologic systems. This is a shameful situation.
@Gunni1972
@Gunni1972 6 месяцев назад
That's like Building a Robot, Sell it without software, and never factor in the labour time it takes to write the software, and train it to do the stuff, it SHOULD be capable of. Sure, Now it is suddenly cheap. And we are not even talking Licenses, energy consumption or software and security updates. (The time when it DOESN'T run). An example for technocrats.
@JeanNoelAvila
@JeanNoelAvila Год назад
Very interesting, as usual. A bit more pessimistic than your previous presentations, though. I don't buy the tradeable carbon credit stuff that is basically a carbon market. That is a fallacy: carbon must not be convertible to money and vice-versa. In my view, the carbon credits must be personal and non-transferable, just like a basic need. At most, only a small ratio could be tradeable.
@jonwatson4467
@jonwatson4467 Год назад
The issue with the carbon parallel currency is that the non-wealthy will simply exchange their ccs for dollars and at prices that make the system ineffectual... The state would have to set the price, and be the market maker, because otherwise the system would fail.
@jthadcast
@jthadcast 4 месяца назад
reducing abrupt climate change and the subsequent stress to civilization to a minor price increase is insane. we risk war over minor price changes in oil but habitat loss is somehow manageable.
@GhostOnTheHalfShell
@GhostOnTheHalfShell Год назад
Also, I don’t recall but are their own equations when iterated on non linear? IIRC if you have an iterative system with non linear terms, say like interest rates, behavior gets “chaotic” quick (sensitivity to initial conditions etc). I guess I am asking if various fundamental assertions about the nature of an economy has be rubbished so deeply they’ll lose all trust. It’d have to be in some element of the business community, or investor of large standing. The top wealth strata is they believe they are divine kings with divine qualities and divine rights. They are indoctrinated into this world view by all around them, but not everyone is under that spell.
@he1ar1
@he1ar1 Год назад
The market might be able to build a roof over my head so that I don't get wet when I am sleeping. But the roof wont stop the basement from flooding and causing the house to collapse. Building more roofs is not the solution.
@GhostOnTheHalfShell
@GhostOnTheHalfShell Год назад
I have to ask if anyone competent has taken on Friedman’s assertion about wild assumptions. It’s non rational (I’d call it psychotic). At this rate, after 50 years of free market fundamentalism, there is ample data to see how of it has played out. His assertion also very at odds with button down business. The crazier the bet the better the chances…
@ProfSteveKeen
@ProfSteveKeen Год назад
Yes. There's an excellent paper by the philosopher Alan Musgrave in. (1981). "‘Unreal Assumptions’ in Economic Theory: The F‐Twist Untwisted." Kyklos (Basel) 34(3): 377-387. It's reproduced in Milton Friedman: Critical assessments. Volume 3, edited by J. C. Wood and R. N. Woods Routledge 1990
@ProfSteveKeen
@ProfSteveKeen Год назад
"Economic theory is often criticized for the lack of ‘realism’ of its assumptions. Milton Friedman rebutted such criticism with the famous dictum ‘the more significant the theory, the more unrealistic the assumptions’. Friedman's position, often called the ‘F‐twist’, stems from his failure to distinguish three different types of assumption. Negligibility assumptions state that some factor has a negligible effect upon the phenomenon under investigation. Domain assumptions specify the domain of applicability of the theory. Heuristic assumptions are a means of simplifying the logical development of the theory. It is argued that Friedman's dictum is false of all three types of assumption. Finally, it is conjectured that what began as a negligibility assumption may be changed under the impact of criticism first into a domain assumption, then into a mere heuristic assumption and that these important changes will go unnoticed if the different types of assumption are not clearly distinguished from one another."
@GhostOnTheHalfShell
@GhostOnTheHalfShell Год назад
@@ProfSteveKeen I would enjoy a mathematician giving it a treatment, if they could hold their nose. Imagine a Gödel like theorem proving not only is the strategy circumstantially, but completely and utterly wrong. That or not even false. I think this latter condition holds.
@GhostOnTheHalfShell
@GhostOnTheHalfShell Год назад
@@ProfSteveKeen oh dear, that makes him out to be a con.. yet he had Charles Koch buttering his and McGill Buchanan’s toast. They delivered the kind of theory that served his political agenda and personal delusion. The history of it is depressing enough.
@GhostOnTheHalfShell
@GhostOnTheHalfShell Год назад
@@ProfSteveKeen If still had the math chip installed I wonder if one other way would be to show his own (ones he directly conjured to support his ideas) statements contradict standard economic identities.. well sheet how about making a really really unrealistic assumption that all the identities are false. But I think then the theory needed to justify it would have to be a super super powerful. So strong in fact non could abide its smell. MF was a pure troll. I dunno if mmt can even be used. In a negative growth environment, which is already evident in India’s (Asia’s) agricultural sector, also in central and S America and will become more so in N America. Onshoring is a survival strategy as the conditions for global trade pass, but even then the conditions of the 70s have passed away as well. There is no Kansas to return to. Rural folks in Bangladesh are adopting a semi aquatic life style and have added raised gardens in response to their conditions. I doubt modernity has that flexibility but that’s what’s needed. We wait for our Divine Kings to bring us EV and other tech magic to keep everything the same.
@GhostOnTheHalfShell
@GhostOnTheHalfShell Год назад
And both without reliable water are doa…
@christopherdobbie
@christopherdobbie Год назад
Is it why German GDP hasn't tanked due to being able to get the energy needed but only at a higher cost thus proping up GDP? If this is so, when can we expect the reduced productive output show up in GDP?
@he1ar1
@he1ar1 Год назад
According to Real GDP figures once seasonally adjusted, the Germany economy is in recession. Government spending has been reduced by about 5% while the ECB have increased interest rates and credit supply from the banking sector is shrinking. The economy has to be in recession. Exports cant save it this time since much of the world is also facing inflation and reductions in real income.
@kthomsen12
@kthomsen12 5 месяцев назад
You mentioned reducing production or consumption. I just watched another video of yours where one thing you didn’t like about Bitcoin is that being a hard money it may reduce consumption. Considering the views you just expressed on the climate maybe that is a good thing. Bitcoin also treats the Rich and the Poor alike. Giving them access to the same money at no extra cost to the poor. Inflation hurts the poorest the most. That is one of the worst things about governments printing extra money!
@ProfSteveKeen
@ProfSteveKeen 5 месяцев назад
It costs way too much in terms of energy, and it doesn't enable centralised action, which will be the only way we'll have a hope of preventing civilisation collapse from global warming.
@GreenIllness
@GreenIllness Год назад
Soon you'll be a critic of orthodox climate change too if you do as good of a job as you've done with economics. Nordhaus should been a red flag for the mainstream climate change argument like: "wait a minute..!"
@GreenIllness
@GreenIllness Год назад
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