Scuba Diver Panic from 15 meters - Scuba Diving Incident Analysis 

I have never had a bolter take a reg. I did the leg wrapping thing so my hands could work my bcd and try to get my octo in their mouth. My eyes were laser focused on the diver mouth for bubbles. I was lucky and all of mine ended blowing bubbles for me. Don't know what i would have done if I didn't see bubbles. Big thing though, you are most likely going to get your mask slammed off you while they are flailing, be ready for it, and just tough that out. Agree that seeing the warning signs are the most important thing.

@@kevinhacken9801 This is just the kind of contribution that makes the comment section a valuable place, Kevin. Your experince reinforces mine. Hope to see you around the channel. I'm sure you have a lot of valuable feedback to offer.

@@kevinhacken9801 I totally agree I got some bruises on my face the diver spit out reg wasn’t making bubbles on ascent from 50ft after we got to the surface the diver was angry saying I was trying to drown him after we got to shore and he collected his thoughts I reminded the diver about exhaling while going up he said that wouldn’t have made a difference. Needless to say we don’t dive together anymore.

@@ivoryjohnson4662 oh man, such a hard position to be in. So glad everything worked out on that rescue! That is the decision that haunts us all.

I have had to do that a time or two but with mask on. And again not at that depth.

Thank you for sharing your experience! I'm a greenhorn diver here in Monterey,CA. I try to watch as many videos as I can about emergency procedures because I'd like to be prepared as much as possible although the real-life situation will determine how I will react regardless of my preparedness. Thanks to the excellent training I received by my instructor guru -Mycol- within 30 days of my OW certification I could use one of the emergency procedures, to tow a diver on the surface because she had no energy left in her.

Wow, BBB, way to keep your head. Thanks for sharing your experience, enriching this comment thread.

Yes nicely done

Like what causes a panic attack like that? Did they previously have a fear of the water? If so why even dive if they did.

@@UnfiItered @Shiwoon WeirdFace could have been that. Something could have scared them earlier on the dive or could have gotten a hit of nitrogen narcosis as well. Maybe inhaled some water. Maybe a medication not compatible with diving. As a buddy, you just have to do your best to rescue the situation while not knowing the why.

Be proud of yourself, you saved his life, you're a brave person ❤

Great attitude, Don. Incident/accident vids and forums are an excellent way to stay sharp 👍

Don got certified in the 90s. The open water class was 6 weeks. 2 nights a week. Training today is weak. Get additional training from experienced instructor asap.

@@kylegrimm8808 I understand what your saying. I have gone several times since being certified and I enjoy it but would like to get more training. It would be nice to have a 2 week course like your talking about to really get a new divers skill set more tuned in. There is a lot to know and I think hands on and in the water is the best way to learn skills that become ingrained into your mindset.

Oh panicking in water is so common. I was a lifeguard at an amusement park and people just get disoriented so easily I kept having to pull people out of 4 feet of water because they wouldn't stand up and kept flailing it's hard, but with the right training you can get through those scenarios. I do think having your mask come off underwater might be one of the worse things though at least for me so when we tested that skill I really had to focus because I knew I'd panic if I didn't stay in the right mindset. I just think some people want to scuba then they go do it and they realize it's not for them it can be very claustrophobic.

Where did you get this training?

Yeah fuck that. Lmao

D-fresh, thanks for taking the time to view and your informed comment.

Yep. Agreed. I strongly suspect that she was yelling or at least trying to vocalize during her ascent. That would have saved her from a lung overexpansion injury.

@@OrenNoah If so, could have saved her life...

When I did my ow dives I was given a rental hood at the shop because we were going to be diving in relatively cold-ish water. My head is really small and they gave me a “small” hood. I don’t know if they’re supposed to measure anything but the hood they gave me was tight at the top and front of my head but really big near my chin area. Because of this, when it came time to do the dives, I chose not to wear it and just suffer through the cold. It felt really constricting around my upper face and really big around my chin area. It kept coming up over my mouth instead of staying on my chin.

Hi Remco! Thanks for stopping back. She's slow and steady. Not exponential like many channels, but chugging along in the right direction 👍.

Many thanks for taking the time to add your comments, Gabriel.

Good grief, Cesar, that’s an amazing experience. Thanks so much for sharing this. Must have been terrifying.

Wow. This is literally what scares me from trying scuba diving. I can't imagine the level of panic id have if I started vomiting under water. Your a badass

@@JBAutomotive794 Hi JB...THanks for taking the time to comment. My expereince of the matter is that accidents are actually quite rare in scuba. Serious accidents even more rare. In fact, I'm told that one of the reasons the younger generation ahs not take to scuba is the lack of relative risk thrill, lack of "extreme" relative to other current options (paragliding, kiteboarding, MTB, etc. Pick a good shop, a good instructor, get good training, you'll be right., Scuba is a very nice coiuples activity (as long as both are motivated) and often an equalizer as diving is not a competition, adn really nice to appreciate cool stuff together with a firend or loved one. BTW, here is a vid I did on the real risk of poor instruction (divers soon quit due to lack of comfort resulting from the poor training) ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-98TevdsoKc4.html

@JB Automotive and Marine Honestly if you think about it a bit it's not a massive issue - you're vomiting, so what, just keep breathing and wait for it to finish. You can throw up through scuba regs (although I admit the one time it happened to me, due to sea sickness- which usually clears once you're underwater, I didn't want to fill my shiny reg with vomit so removed it and put it back in afterwards, whilst the fish ate up my predigested lunch:-)). Most things can be sorted out by stopping, breathing and working out the problem and fixing it. In my organisation we use a mantra - STOP (do nothing) - ASSESS (think what is the problem) - ACT (now act to fix it).

@@JBAutomotive794 it's actually not a big deal. I'm not sure if it's the pressure, the air, or what but I vomited in the pool in my training dive and again in one of my open water dives. Just puke into your reg...it's fine. Since then I don't eat the morning of a dive. The first dive of the day still makes me feel queasy when I come up...but then it goes away when I go back down. I'm a new diver only been a few times.

LM, thanks for this comment. I connected with it. It's really hard to imagine a panic that would make you want to spit a reg, so hard to believe for most of us, But I've spoken with more than a few divers that have had that feeling. They know it makes no intellectual sense, but the urge is so primal it's overwhelming. I'm interested in learning more about how to work with and train that energy. Glad to hear your mum had it under control. Thanks again for giving me some catalytic thoughts to ponder.

@Discovery Divers Tokyo It makes a lot of sense, during panic the areas of the brain responsible for reasoned thought and executive function basically shut down. The amygdala and limbic system light up and those are instinctual ‘lizard brain’ parts of the brain. We’re land animals and normally something on your face, or in your mouth, is an obstruction. So it makes evolutionary sense to instinctively rip everything off, reg included. I don’t know if there is a good way to harness that energy because it is so primal. The only thing to do really is focus on the breathe and try to avoid a full blown panic. (Just found your channel and love it btw!)

@@aprila8762 perfect explanation, exactly right. I have a CPAP for sleep apnea and when I first started using it would sometimes feel like I couldn't breathe and immediately wanted the mask off my face. Now I can't sleep without the thing but it did take getting used to. Doesn't make sense until you think of it from that evolutionary perspective.

Thanks for the comment and sub, GD4. Hope you keep the experience stories coming in future comment threads.

I think that’s a funny joke

Great post, Paxmax...

^^^

EXACTLY!!!!! He may gain more followers to his channel, especially if this video is the first time they’ve been here!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey, CrossX! DSD, I have to say, I am such a non-fan of those cuz of all the possible risk and potential for disaster, though I'm sure accidents are rare? I have literally only done 2 in my instructional career cuz I hate them so much. On the video, You bring up a good point, that her removing the made might have knocked the reg out. Had not thought of that. Appreciate the comment and thoughts!

This was a tough one. I guess you must be right about her exhaling somewhere on the way up. What a panic that dive must have been fo the others...waiting to learn whether she did serious damage to herself or not...

Thank you very much, Paul. Glad to have you on board 👍

Wow, that is a tough spot!

Panic strength is no joke.

Hi Ron! Yes, I agree. Looking at these vids has made more curious about the phenomena of panic in general.

@@DiscoveryDiversTokyo I have chronic panic attacks (daily). There is no ryme or reason to them. Sometimes later I cant figure out what the trigger was. Watching the video I could feel her sense of terror and it actually sent me into a panic attack. Thanks for the video. I am not a diver because I know it would not be safe for me with the panic disorder, but for some reason I love watching diving video's of all types.

@@jeaniejbutler4911 thanks so much for adding your valuable real life experience and perspective 👍

Thanks, BBQ...what a nightmare, huh. Must have been terrible for all involved. Thanks on the input and your observations.

you can't see bubbles from the back though. Also, no chance of getting a reg in their mouth, not that they will take it though.

Good thing they were only at 15 meters, not 50

Thanks for sharing this one, Wolfsong. Glad you make itout, learned form it and allowing others to benefit.

Thanks for sharing, NS. Well done!

Hi, Weston, maybe we have a similar approach. I like to stress the hell out of my divers in the pool on until I'm confident that they can take he worst I can throw at them, then I feel ready to take them to OW. Then I back off in the OW and let them do the dives...

@@DiscoveryDiversTokyo Best thing you can do. During playtime, knock off a mask, unclip a fin, hook a regulator out of their mouth, be creative in the controlled environment and let them deal with the unannounced problem. Even the most skittish may bolt the first time or two but those are the ones you want to identify. Once you find them them you can work with them and they quickly learn to stop, assess, and act and gain confidence in their training and abilities.

You have to learn how to clear your goggles. Absolutely important. If you can't clear it completely for whatever reason, then you need to stay calm and not panic. On my very first open water dive in the ocean in Australia, I had a mask failure at about 20 meters (66 feet) and had a mask filled halfway with water. I didn't let it ruin my dive and stayed calm. I got another mask and finished the 2nd dive later in the day.

I think she was feeling claustrophobic and like she couldn’t breath at that moment. Her instinct was to take a huge breath of fresh air. Step #1 remove mask while ascending. Step #2 Get head above surface, Step #3 breath.

I think your assumption must be correct, that her mask was filling with water. Can't imagine why else someone underwater would rip off the one thing they need to survive and breathe. Besides being "narc'd" but that wasn't an issue in this case. The way she was distracted when everyone else was doing the thumbs up to go to the surface makes me think it was water filling her vision line that was the distraction. Then, she panicked.

@@comfixit But wouldn't it make more sense if you are panicking underwater, to keep breathing until you get to the surface, and then rip your mask off and take a breath of fresh air? I've had quite a few panic attacks in my life, I know logic is not #1 in your mind during those moments of pure fear and discomfort, but she still knows she's pretty deep underwater. If she just wanted a breath of fresh air, she could go to the surface with her mask on, then rip it off only then, unless something was wrong with her mask. So I think the likelihood of her mask filling with water and she's unable or too panicked to correct it is potentially what made her panic and rip off her mask and flee for the surface

Isnt it also hard to breath with these things? Maybe the breathing resistance felt so high for her that she felt she'd suffocate if she kept breathing like that. Also if you are in panic you increase your breathing rate a lot and I doubt that these things allow that to happen. Theres probably not much air coming your way if you are mildly hyperventilating so her mild panic just got worse and worse.

Ive never understood why a flooding mask invokes panic. Its just water. Purge your mask. simple. its the first skill taught for a reason. People who panic in those situations have zero business diving period. Its just not for you.

Hi DT, thanks for view and comment. Punch in the stomach...reminds me of my Scottish rescue instructor. Another story. Hope to read your comments on future threads.

omg fr fr

Thanks for sharing that story, Jon 👍

Sometimes simply putting a hand on someone helps. It let's them know you are there and they are not alone. It signals that you know there is a problem and you are there to help. It gives them reference that they are probably not sinking, shooting up or out of control in the water column and they can devote focus to solving the problem.

Great Q - from folks I've known who have panicked, it's like any other panic...inexplicable in some ways, if you cannot relate to the feelling of the person in focus. One diver I knew who had a panic, he is she said they suddenlky developed an inexplicable desire to get to the surface as soon as possible. To be fair, that diver sometimes had comfort issues. The diver totally understood it was a potentially deadly instinct, but there was no control of the feeling, as with most fears.

I wasn't scuba diving, but as a little kid I had a few near drowning incidents. I think it was little things that triggered panic. Once I was underwater at the deep end of a hotel swimming pool and a little water went up my nose, probably only a few drops, but I instantly felt like I inhaled lungfuls. There was an overwhelming urge to surface and breathe that blotted out all thinking. I probably was making upward progress but the panic distorts time perception and made it seem like I wasn't moving. I think at that point I succumbed to pointless flailing about and may have actually started going back down. I don't remember when, but at some point my mother came to help. She is a strong swimmer, kind of Viking built able to beat most men arm wrestling, but had no training in handling a panicked swimmer. I was maybe 6 but in my panic I nearly drowned her. I think the panic let up somewhat because I was passing out and at that point she was able to get me out. I'll never forget how weird it was to have been that afraid, certain I was dying, and then moments later be on the surface and see no one else had even noticed. The adults were sipping cocktails. Kids running around yelling and laughing. Similar things happened over the years but without anyone around to help. I'm not sure if it was because I was older or because I knew I had to save myself, but I maintained at least a shred of self control despite terror. Off the top of my head, I think it was always something small that set it off--and unexpected dunking, water being much colder than expected, thinking I could touch bottom when I couldn't, an unknown something (alligator?) bumping into me, an glimpse of something huge that didn't last long enough to identify (an eye the size of a dinner plate) while falling from water skiing. Ironically what helped the most was being volunteered into lifeguard service in a situation that required me to swim hours every day for several summers. The initial feelings of panic still hit me hard sometimes, but I seem to have gotten pretty good at damping it down. I'm still very torn about scuba. My curiosity is worse than a cat's and even as an adult it gets me into dangerous situations sometimes. It really pulls me toward exploring the sea and maybe eventually caves. But, I'm also worried that maybe I'd fail to suppress that panic feeling and get someone killed. It is probably a good thing that dive shops won't sell to uncertified customers because my curiosity would get the better of me and I'd compromise by diving alone and probably get myself killed. I'd feel really embarrassed and guilty before dying of stupidity, although maybe full blown panic would help ease it.

It’s the fear of knowing that ur 15feet under water with no oxygen, and that u might die, that’s how panic happens

​@@alexrecendez7624well it happen no matter how deep it is, i had to hope i was swiming upwards at 6 to 7 meters deep and not knowing it was so scary, i would never dive unless i had money to hire a crew to watch me over all the time

Hi Lars. Def interesting perspective. In a case like this, if someone spit a reg with even 1/2 full lungs from 15m, that seems a certain fatality if they make it to the surface without exhaling. For me, I guess it depends on the depth and the likelihood that they will exhale. I would have more confidence that someone with a reg in his or her mouth would exhale on the way up. Thanks for this post, food for thought.

@@DiscoveryDiversTokyo yes definitely the right choice to get a reg to her, but others suggested trying to keep her from surfacing. I know of an instructor who forcably kept a student from surfacing. She nearly died as i recall. Her reg was full of sand from the beach entry and she sucked it in. So IF you knew this girl's lungs were half full and IF you knew she wasn't going to exhale and IF she was going to embolize and die from it and IF you knew she was going to accept a reg before you drowned her, then i say to all those, by all means keep her from surfacing.

@@LarsDennert Sounds like you have some info I have not seen. Sand in the reg? Is there more reading on this event I'd definitely want to check it out if you have a link. Thanks, Lars.

@@DiscoveryDiversTokyo I suspect that @Lars Dennert is referring to an incident from a few years back in Monterey, CA. If not, then there at least two such incidents.

@@OrenNoah yes my link to the article refused to post. californiadiver.com/tragedy-at-the-breakwater/

Lol...Tony Stark level! Hi Tammy. Thanks again for sending that one my way. So much can be (painlessly) learned from these kinds of vids 👍

that's such a great comment !! I also lose track of time and get distracted fairly easily (adhd) so thank you for pointing that out as a real concern to have !! I'm also paranoid as crazy so I usually do prepare like a maniac for everything but this would have slipped away from my list of awareness ! so I will definitely keep in mind that I get distracted so I should check in constantly and consistently with the dive master regardless of anything flashy or pretty that may catch my eye . This woman also seemed at first to be very preoccupied with what was on the bottom and just didn't get the signal and imagine if it's your first dive and the next thing you know you're left alone you gasp for air and swallow some water, I mean I can absolutely relate to her panicking because you can't even communicate your issue. I mean people having a panic attack on the surface can't usually find the energy to communicate or even just say "I'm having a panic attack!" to those around and then people usually do the worst thing which is surround you and bombard you with questions and concerns, in this scenario to have a panick attack and have someone grapple you makes the panic even worse even though in this case they're literally trying to save your life.. I think people should learn more free diving first perhaps ! I find that working with holding your breath helps soooo much to get to know your own body's reactions to panic and how unhelpful that is. And that if you force yourself to calm down you can far better orient yourself and find solutions. It's usually the fear of dying that's the issue which sounds obvious but the actual fear stems from the instinctive belief that you need oxygen this very second when in fact you can easily go without a breath for quite a bit longer and I feel like free diving teaching your body to override this subconscious belief that you will instantly die and give you those extra seconds which could literally make all the difference in the world in that scenario

I wouldn’t suggest practicing to hold your breath in diving , in any context.

Please always make sure to follow directions during training never play game with your life . The woman wasn’t playing attention and clearly didn’t have any idea what she was doing just a very sad situation.

So funny...someone else told me that...

@@DiscoveryDiversTokyo the resemblance is amazing.

I was thinking he looks like Jon Stewart

HI CM...it's a fair point you raise. Each agency has ratio limits, prolly dictated at least partially by insurance requirements, for each kind of dive, the conditions, and if any training assistants are present. I agree, as you might be suggesting that, even though an instructor may be technically be within ratio standards, some instructors may not be up to task depending on their level of expertise and experience.

@@DiscoveryDiversTokyo yeah I was suggesting that. Just because you can based off guidelines doesn’t mean you straddle it.

I'm guessing that this is a training dive and that the experience and repetition just isn't there yet. Basic open water recreational dive training with many training bodies only takes a few days and you really don't have time to get fully familiar with procedures enough that they are automatic.

@@lmlmd2714 So it's a relatively good bet that the individual involved wasn't fully trained and or missing much experience. That puts the whole situation in a much different light. Still hard to watch them panic at depth.. :-) thanks for the comeback!

Hi Ivory! Thanks for adding your experience. Yup, lots of folks have a hard time with hoods, especially in their first year or two of diving. Glad you made it through that one!

I don't like a full hood unless it is less than 50F. I wear a surf cap on most cool dives. It is much more comfortable. Just sat it took over 500 dives to discover these. www.amazon.com/Henderson-Thermoprene-Sport-Cap-2-5mm/dp/B073RRWWP7/ref=mp_s_a_1_13?dchild=1&keywords=wetsuit+cap&qid=1624510369&sr=8-13

@@ns4854 thank you so much for the suggestion that is exactly what I need

It is, isn't' it. BTW...love your RU-vid name, 132...

Can’t disagree with that!

what happened

@@justinmckibben4534 it was a excursion dive, I didn't have my cert yet, but I had done one before deeper and was fine, this time tho I kept getting salt water in my regulator the whole dive and at the last meter or so I took in a big swallow of water and tried to flush my regulator with no success so I did the classic panic bolt to the surface

So nice of you to say, CLuve. Hope you stick around as long as the vids are interesting and useful to you. Best of luck with your diving adventure once it begins 👍

W&W, this thread is filled with some incredible comments. I would never have imagined someone could get all the way down to 60ft with the air off. Was it a long hose rig? And we almost lost you?! I’ve always wondered what ling expansion would feel like before any damage was done.

@@DiscoveryDiversTokyo Nope, just a very small women with a 3500 psi tank, certified the week before... She said that after 4 inhalations it started to get hard to inhale, but she told herself she was imagining it because the gear was all brand new. By the time she spit her reg, she had reached total panic and would/could not accept my second stage. After 3-4 attempt to donate were rejected, I just forced the reg against her lips with one hand, held the back of her head with the other, pressed the purge and started kicking like hell for the surface. I had no idea if she was going to be bloody foaming mess when we hit the surface.. but she was OK. All I could see was bubbles. As we shoved her up on the platform, I reached up and turned her tank valve on - just in case she had complications.. didn't want others to know she entered the water with the tank off. Not exactly sure how that happened, but I didn't turn her tank off. I was terribly upset by the incident, probably more so than some diving fatalities I had been involved with. I was done for the day after one 90 second dive.

@@Speedospearo Oh, man, well done! I read about a fatality once with a tech diver (doubles and stages) who jumped off a boat with the air off and actually died before he was able to turn any air on, and he was apparently so heavy at the start of that dive with all the full air tanks. Amazing the stuff that can happen. Anyway, kudos on the heads up.

Hmmmmm.... sounds to me like you have far less experience than most I've seen bc they all say complete opposite

@@dazzlingextremes389Do you know how to dive? I've only been teaching Padi for 15 years. Started in 2004 and my last course was a few weeks ago at night in almost frozen water. I'm an active cave diver with over 3000 dives in total. I have had a few panicked divers in my time. Often on their holidays and not been in the water for some time. They are not always beginners! Most act wild with no logic which is why you are taught not to put your mask on you forehead as it's a sign of a panicked diver. l did have one that spat out their reg at 5m and stared blankly into the blue. I almost missed it. I was able to put the reg back though that time. Basically the longer l teach the more l realise how little l know.

Hi, Julia. Thanks for the comment/question. For sure, deep breathing and calm are important to scuba. Underwater is a pretty unfortunate place to have a panic attack, and I knowing many individuals with this challenge, I have a great deal fo empathy. For this reason, I definitely feel anyone with a panic condition should confer with their medical pacer partner to discuss the idea of scuba training. Best of luck, Julia.

It’s easier said than done but you have to just stop relax and breathe slowly (if you are panicked type train more in the pool, the more the better you would rather spend time there doing the work than experience a panic attack 30 metres deep and do meditation) I never ever trained in a pool, my wife was a certified dive master and got my ass in the ocean. I can swim but I don’t like water too much. My first ever dive I was loving it!! I got to 30 metres deep, not an ounce of panic or fear, I started to go frequently and go deeper I was just always calm and enjoying the scenery (remarkable it kept my mind off any craziness) Then I stopped diving for a while, and ever since I got a bad case of covid I began to be more “stressful” of a person. So we did a dive trip in Vanuatu and I was like an excited. Anyway we get to the edge of the boat and my tank starts making a whistling sound, I was like “oh no” anyway I jumped in the ocean very far from land and the guide guy wanted us to descend I said “no the tank is worrying me” he had a look and said “should be fine” even with his consent I had this bad vision in my mind “what if the oxygen cuts out 30 metres deep? Long way from the surface!” Then I was scared but tried to suck it up and we went down. Anyway all was well we were 25 metres deep and this rage of panic just struck me! You name it everything was getting me scared! I was worried about oxygen, I was worried about sharks, I was worried about death. I just regathered my thoughts and pulled through for another 10 mins but my jaw was feeling “weak” and unable to clench and water was coming into my mouth! I just said to myself “relax, relax, relax” I grabbed the guide roughly but calmly and signalled to go up. He put his thumbs up and instantly as we got to like 15 metres this huge “relief” came upon me and my jaw felt strong again (the mind is a powerful force let me tell you!) then we went snorkelling the next day and I literally told my wife “I don’t think I can dive that deep again” the only way to succeed in the waters is to get heaps of practice in a pool, a lot! And always calm down remain calm the mind freaks us out.

@BudgetGainsByJJ Wow, what a great reply. And thanks for sharing your story 👏. What happens to me is when I start deciding, and when everything is very quiet, that's when it hits me. When the instructor told me to breathe slowly and held my hands, that's how I got relaxed and got my PADI advice licence. I need to face it one way or another. I can't run away forever. 🫡

@@user-ez1fm7jx5m yes when everything is quiet! We have the same fear and it’s simple: our minds overthink and our bodies start stressing out. I absolutely agree with you just face the fear and keep facing it until diving because purely a leisurely activity, like it was once for me. I have an opportunity to become a Navy Clearance Diver, I’ve always wanted to do it to face my fear but the thought of being 90 metres under water is just terrifying. Would you say you’ve somewhat overcome this anxiety underwater a bit?