ahhh yes I really think between my hearing condition and working with this medium that I almost don't hear the hiss anymore lol thank you for watching and the kind words
i think without the high frequency noise, it may be much harder to tell the difference between the two. the tape has a bit of mid bass bias and high frequency roll off though
@@MadeOnTape it seemed like a lot of the his was actually accentuated by whatever was reamping the keys... the digital version has some nice pre amp noise that came out with some more with kind of a nice crackle in the tape... I think
Maybe it’s just the added harmonics, but tape always sounds meatier, warmer and more full. And I’m an ITB producer. What I love about recording lossless and then putting it through a tape machine, is that the tape machine becomes a flavour rather than a limitation that governs the entire recording/mixing process. Is there something to be said about recording to tape initially? Of course. It creates a completely different environment for the performer/producer and encourages bold choices during the session.
Great recordings, I especially liked the warmth it gave the keys, and the bite on certain notes. Ensembles like this sounds great on tape. Thanks for the video!
The difference is hardly noticeable in the individual tracks, but with all the instruments you can hear that the digital sounds a bit pushed down, it's hard to explain but it sound less "powerful" but it also sounded more controlled. Nice video man !
Thank you for this great vid Chris! It answered the exact question I had about running separate audio stems from Logic to Tape simultaneously. I’m gonna need to get an interface that has more than two line outputs. Something like your Apollo. Tape does sound better, and definitely adds spice to a digital recording.
you’ll figure this out when you start: but you have to pull down the levels coming out of your DAW when going into your portastudio for good gain staging
Individually I got just the room mic wrong. That said, I basically picked all the tracks that I like the sound of the most. However, for the full mix, I far preferred the digital version. I'm guessing because the added lower freq content in the cassette tracks were masking the detail in the mids. Both sounded great. Which basically means... ... recording medium doesn't matter. Record good songs, then listen to them.
First example, bias is pretty prominent and the snare seems more compressed on the tape. Second, tape bias is a pretty obvious giveaway. Third, same situation but man that "warmth" makes the synth sound miles better at the same time. Fourth, bias again. Full mix, bias again. It's interesting, though. Somehow the tape bias adds a cozy feel. It reminds me of a trick I heard from somebody on Pensado's podcast, where he would add a track of pure white noise compressed to a key input of the lead vox and set the level to just barely audible. There's a degree to which we have gotten used to artifacts from equipment used during recording, and it no longer sounds like "noise" but rather as something like another instrument.
yo thanks for listening! i noticed the biggest difference on the keyboard part, surprisingly… the direct feed of his sound was a bit harsh, but worked with his amp. Definitely needed some extra juice
@@MadeOnTape the keyboard was actually the only one I was able to accurately guess as cassette until the final mix, which I got right away (both of which sounded much cooler in cassette form!) I think a big part of why the keyboard was more obviously affected by routing it to cassette was that it was recorded DI, and therefore had a much cleaner and purer signal than the mics initially. So when you routed it to cassette, you could really hear that analog warmth dirtying things up!
I do think the tape plugins can offer the best of both worlds in the sense that you can easily tweak how much tape effect you want to simulate while avoiding the accumulative effect of having the white noise on every track as I find it get's to be a bit too much, but that is still subjective and dependent on context.
Hey! That's my 4 track! I miss that thing. Anyway, I was surprised how detailed things were on tape when soloed, with the exception of the room/horns mic. And I was also surprised that I preferred the digital mix over the cassette mix. The performance felt better on the digital mix and the bass was a little fuller. Do you work in high speed on the 464? And do you use the DBX noise reduction?
One thing to consider is how hard you are hitting the cassette. If you want less subtle results then hit it harder and you'll definitely hear more transient softness, more harmonic distortion, etc. What's incredible is how clear the overall the quality of cassettes can be.
LOL!! And here I am recording my old four track tapes to Cubase 12 Pro….. for archiving and maybe doing some track cleaning with new mixes…… love what you are doing in the video…..
@@MadeOnTape I agree...they play excellent. I'm a jazzfusion musician. So not very far from my passion. But you can tell the difference between recording A and B :) .... but I'm a nerd...I also do mix/mastering on a daily basis...and work on fixing old cassette and VHS decks all the time :)
I immediately guessed the drums and bass sound because on tape the toms and bass were a little compressed sounding. The keys were interesting because the cassette added a bit more high mids
You also have to take account for the type of tape. There is/was ferro: the cheapest and slightly muffled sound of which the frequency from 1 to 3kHz was more distinct, CrO2 or chromium with a broader recorded frequency spectrum, sounding fresher, and then there's Metal, that also had significantly more dynamic range, costs more but elas also took it's toll on the tapeheads.
bass definitly sounded better in digital imho, tho i thought otherwise. strange how cassete ADDS hiqh frequencies and crisp, well, at least on my audio "system" (circa 97 sa eh 570 technics home hifi tower))). i tried to record audio tapes and what ive got was more warm, less crisp sound on cassete. well, maybe im too stoned rn to understand/hear the difference!
The only one I got wrong was the Sax room mic one, but it was iffy due to being a room mic recording with loads of sound in the recording, no obvious lows, mids or highs that are tells for digital vs a cassette, let alone quiet bits to hear hiss! The rest all caught them, I know my audio engineering well! Ears still work great too! lol
Drums-I couldn`t hear the difference, but, it was kind of nasty unprocessed sound anyway, that I can`t call Hi Fi Bass-YES I KNEW IT. how? Cassete adds hiss noise. The same with keys. First I heard some noise and thought it was cassete, but on the second example there was even more noise. with saxophone and drums in background you don`t hear that much of a hiss, but still, I´ve got it right as well. First of all-TAPE ADDS NOISE. Hmmmm....I do love tape machines, but I would probably stick with reel to reel....as for cassettes...I love them because of nostalgic aspect, but making music with tapes????...well, only if I want to learn to overcome tape limitations, learning some sound engineering skills. But I wouldn`t use the tapes so old, chances that they are damaged are pretty big. And if I would ever make something critical for a client with huge budget, where nothing should go wrong-screw the tape. Digital only. By the way-final mix had hiss as well, for me this is not acceptable. I would at least use some noise reduction, new or NOS tape type 2 at least...As for the mix...Ok, this is small bar recording, nothing fancy, no huge production...To explore tape limitations I would probably try to get some better sounding source. There was a band in USSR, who had no acces to huge studio. So using this kind of analog porto studio they recorded an album at their apartmant, that became huge success and sold over 2 million copies, even metallica covered the title song during Moscow performance. Nobody gave a f---ck about tape limitations, everybody was just enjoying the music. Not my favorite kind of music, but I have a great respect how they pulled it with limited equipement. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-K69_m4gtZDk.html
Only a handful of comments here use words that actually mean something. The rest are "Oh, it's warmer/airier/thicker/smoother". What exactly does "warm" sound like? More mids? Then say "more mids".
I have to be honest that without headphones at a normal listening level you can barely tell a difference , with a slight hiss from the cassette recording. If you add in dolby for the. cassette I think it would take a professional ear to discern any difference .
I could hear it and cassette added color, etc.. But Im not sure if a plugin couldnt add the same color saturation and warmth. Now if we were working with biased hot real to reel.. Maybe a HUGE difference. But, it does have its advantages. Rather its the cassette that is the main factor or just the analog pres and tone stack aged components inside, transformer? I have no idea. Just passing it through analog for color, no tape involved, could that be it, no clue. These days. I would honestly just use a tape plugin, Ozone probably. But there are others even free, out there. That I think to 99.99% of listeners, consumers, would not hear any difference at all between the real tape and plug in. I honestly just think IMO its the analog pass through that is making the most colorful difference, the tape may add some mojo, but, I dont think so, I think its the analog circuitry its passing through. Adding color. I think you could accomplish with a plug in perfectly acceptable. In fact you may have. And just fooled us all.
Never been able to pick out cassette so easily, maybe its the studio monitors I'm listening on but Cassette sounds so awful, It is just degrading the sound and taking out all the specialness. Its that spatial sound and distinction between instruments that proves that evolution always wins! We have moved on for a reason.
hi there is deck reel to reel that use 1/8 tape not the RCA unit the motors are dc and basf made the spools 3 3/4 ips is the max you can get out of 3 3/4 ips on 1/8 pancake my mate used to go in to see the live bands the co vid stop this and with copy right you see alot you have a fee at the door just to see a band there are pub's there's no fee that all
in individual channels can't tell but on full mix, cassette has a bit of a hiss that wasn't unpleasant but noticeable. idk what happened but in your video about the wavesfactory cassette pluggin vs real cassette I was able to tell the difference ^^U
Well well, even a cassette tape sounds better than straight digital, subject to the handling of the sound person of course. As far as tape noise, you can eliminate it with a plugin if you want such as the waves x noise I think it´s called, which works really well if you are good at being an engineer.
From my loudspeakers in my stereo system, I can’t hear any difference. It must be the type 2 and it being on the Tascam. When I record to my Tascam with a synth or two and using type 2, almost no difference. But if I try to record music off the internet to an RTM type 1, the difference I’d fairly noticeable between tape and source…although the test was with a live concert as opposed to a digital album. More testing required.
I firmly believe that the 1900's were magical. After the year 2000, the magic didn't disappear immediately, but began waning or changing. Maybe we we're all inserted into the Matrix around 1999 (joke, or is it?) I'm glad some younger people seem to recognize that it's worth exploring the 80's, 90's, etc. It's interesting that video games and musical instruments/gear are two of the best ways to experience the past in an interactive way. I dig what you're doing, keep it up!
thank you so much! Digging into these techniques has also helped me immensely in the modern recording scenarios, and i’m grateful we live in a time with both. Especially because access to great sounding recording equipment is as inexpensive as it’s ever been 🙏🏻🙌🏻
One thing I love about tape is that it adds a very natural compression that you can't recreate with an actual compressor. It seems to just soften the transients in a way you can't achieve any other way. Also sssssssssssssssss!!!
Very nice! These results surprised me, even as a Portastudio guy. I feel like the real sonic beauty of double speed cassette is mostly lost to RU-vid's audio compression, so your demo here is especially impressive, in that it's still scoring all these points on a very digital playing ground. If it were ever safe enough to try, it would also be interesting to compare one recorded live directly onto tape to a digital one captured simultaneously from the sends of the 424... I guess I'm mostly curious about the sonic affect of the dbx during the tracking stage. Whatever. Awesome video!!
it would be very cool to figure out how to do that down the road! Also, I never use the DBX on the portastudio, so that's an even more surprising aspect of this example. I was able to really push the levels going in but not too much ... cheers!
Oh, wow! I actually don't use dbx, either, I just assumed you did because of how little hiss you achieved... on a UDS instead of an XLii, no less! Really nice work. ...Not that you asked, but I can suggest one way to multitrack onto the tape and digital simultaneously, in case you're interested at all for down the road. ...OH! I was going to describe my usual method, but I just realized you have a 464! I thought it was a 424. I've mainly used a 414. So, you have some awesome extra features. I'm pretty sure your rear panel has outputs for each channel ("Tape Out" 1-4), which would make it very simple. Just, while recording onto tape, run a cable for each track 1-4 from the Tape Out section, into a digital multitrack recorder or interface. It should just require 2 sets of RCA cables with TS adapters on one end. Just keep in mind that each signal will already be affected by your EQ settings. ...Sorry if you already knew this, or don't care. There are other ways to do it, too, which I'd be more than happy to share- if that's not obvious enough given that you never even asked for any of this. Sorry! I get carried away🤦♂️ Anyway- awesome video, again, and best regards!
yeah these comparisons, on youtube, I can never tell, but when I record to tape, its night and day difference, whether or not that difference is good or bad but your point about youtubes audio compression is valid.
FWIW I got drums, keys and room confidently right, couldn't make up my mind on bass before the answer was revealed, and couldn't make up my mind on the mix.
I could hear a difference. Individually the analog tracks sounded much better, but combined they seemed to be smearing each other. Perhaps the portastudio would be a good audio capturing device, then mix it digital, and I bet that would sound fantastic.
absolutely! we've done that in the studio recently on a modern production and slowed down the drums to get them fatter, but in the DAW the world is your oyster! There will be a longer piece of content in the future, but I released this Short: ru-vid.comaXsFFoV87E0
So it turns out the cassette sounds warmer and and just better in general especially the full mix. The only one I wasn’t a fan of was the keys on tape the hiss really was noticeable.
Hey dude, that was really cooooool, I love cassettes, but I have to admit that this time - the cassette wins for me again! :) :) The final mix is very smooth and "cassetteclear" sounding to me. Solo parts are somehow - how to say - more wider opened, spatial like... compared to digital. A bit of an unexpected finding, I was afraid it would be the other way around. Piece :)
it's definitely subtle on this one! I know in person i definitely like what the cassette did to ease off any harshness and when they get loud it's got more fun distortion
I could tell right away butt the one I got wrong was the room sound one ,was hard to know butt I can tell right away from daw to cassette case the computer is to hifi sounded
I LOVE tape..I get on the turntables set my VCR to record,and start spinning my VINYL records. NOTHING replaces harmonics, a noise floor, and the warmth of analog machines as they warm up..No matter how much digital I use, I master to tape..I can slam tapes and get that natural compression..
Sooo many things are not considered with the tape and deck in this video. The tape sounded better primarely because it gave a little treble boost which the recording needed. And that's because the tape was underbiased...but that Tascam doesn't allow you to calibrate that. So the effect will vary with every tape. Then there's azimuth, w/f, hiss and more which is also not regarded here. But fun video just for fun. You can't make any statement about tape from this video 🙃
Sorry to burst your bubble but it really doesn’t lol. Analog Tape is fuzzier & noisier, it takes up more space, it loses quality each time you play it, copy it, and will only last about 30 years before degrading to s*it. Digital sounds cleaner, it takes up less space, it can be played or copied an infinite amount of times with NO quality loss, and it will last 1000+ years. You should always have tape digitized so that quality is preserved.. and when it comes to a million songs on vinyl vs a million songs on a hard drive there’s just no contest.
@@mycreations4527 "Digital sounds cleaner," I like clean and I also like it dirty. Synths and drum machines went digital years ago, but then went analogue so we have the best of both worlds. I use tape to record for special effects ad then master digitally to CD, wav, mp3 etc. Sorry to burst your bubble but variety is the spice of life. Next you'll be telling me that there is only ONE civilization and that genocidal colonizers actually benefitted their victims. That's the type of argument you present. smh
Love the vid. Surprised that cassette was brighter, but I think that the cassette recording was also a wee tad louder? Important to keep an eye on when you're doing a/b's ;) Loved the cassette noise too.
i definitely tried to match levels! oddly i noticed more peaks in the keyboard part on the cassette, so wider dynamics? thanks for listening! appreciate it 🙏🏻🙌🏻🤘🏻
I got them all right but funnily enough I really liked the digital recording of the room mic. That being said, I would go for what I like, not what is "better"
i hear the difference. And tape was louder EVERY time it played. You should to check sound level before experiment. You just overheated everything on tape.
I’m actually making a new batch of promo cassettes with some of my interviews. Making them in real time limits how many I can make, but some folks really want them. It’s weird-some folks go to Pokémon tournaments in cars so old they have a cassette player, some don’t have a CD player in their entire home.
Ha ha. when the tape hiss becomes a distraction digital is better. It would have been different if you recorded to reel to reel.. cassettes suck and always have sucked.
a thousand percent! we artists are a strange bunch, and one person's workflow is another person's bane. It's all about the end result and whatever inspires you to get there ✌️
Tape is an awesome format, although I always recommend digitizing it. Simply put, Analog doesn’t last forever, Digital Does! You can copy a WAV file an infinite amount of times without quality loss.. If you copy tape, quality is lost each time with added Tape hiss & more muffled sound. Don’t get me wrong this can add a nice nostalgic sound to it.. But Let’s be honest, wouldn’t it be better if there was none of that?
I could hear a significant difference from the hiss on the Bass and Keys tracks. Couldn't really detect it on the busier drum and room tracks. I could definitely see digging my portastudio out of the garage to get a little old school mojo on a couple tracks. I suspect that mine will have more pitch artifacts because it's been completely unmaintained, sitting in a detached garage through summers and winters, for 15 years. Excited to find out!
The tape sounded “better” but it was identifiable by the hiss, especially on the piano. Personally I would use a combination of them, tape for drums and bass but leave the piano and ambiance as digital. I understand you’d need to resync and there would be phase problems which is why we have saturators and tape emulators. I don’t think the difference after using them would make it worth putting up with the hiss.
How can you get a cassette sound so clean. I bought a little cassette recorder off Amazon and if I run something through it the noise is un-real. Is this the recorders fault or the tape cassette
@@MadeOnTape It’s a cheap modern made one, only one I could find that is still being currently sold, name is Hamilton Buhl. I guess I should go after a good vintage brand like you got there
Is there a difference: 4 track all analog VS 4 track (DAW) to cassette deck? I mean in terms of sound. Or perhaps other things that makes it interesting to buy a 4 track cassette?
recording sound has many factors, so there's definitely a difference recording directly to 4 track vs. a DAW first. However, for me the main reason I have gravitated to analog 4 track recording is the limitations it forces me into. I'm jazzed about committing to sounds and performances, which can be easily manipulated in a DAW for endless possibilities. Ultimately, i'm happy to be born at a time where we have access to both. Hope this is helpful!
@@MadeOnTape yess thanks. Im planning to buy a simple 4 track by Fostex. X15. It has its charms. The big tascams are a bit to risky for me in terms of price and quality. Not so much afraid about the belts but more about the circuits. Anyway, cool channel and thanks for the info!
I was undefeated on this one, but not bragging 'cause it was the hiss that gave it away every time 😄 tbh I'm not sure which one sounded "better"; I just knew when the cassette was in so I may or may not have preferred it based on that alone
Tape sounds more tattooed but digital sounds great too….i will tell you the only reason music is dying is because song writing is terrible. Nobody is saying any counter culture and if they are….theyre not idols or iconic in any way.
