Seven LAME Prog and Jazz Fusion Albums- By Great Prog and Fusion bands... 

Wonderful episode Andy.

Wow! Had never heard Zero Tolerance for Silence before. Made it about 8 minutes in and then had to immediately put on Cage's 4'33. This makes Metal Machine Music sound like Giant Steps.

Excellent and entertaining again, Andy. The live stream is brilliant.

Andy - really enjoyed this session. Certainly brightened up a rainy afternoon today, well done!

The combination of ‘contractual obligation album’ and post-disco cocaine abuse really seemed to result in some bad albums late 70s into 80s.

Great video Andy! Who would think that we could learn so much about our favourite artist/band from a discussion about there worst works. I suppose in order to discuss what is bad about an album, we need to discuss what makes the artist/band strong in the first place. Lots of great information, thanks. I too purchased “Zero Tolerance for Silence” by Pat Metheny, and I felt exactly as you did. I have such admiration for PM and the PMG, that I felt that I must be missing something on this album. Like you, I decided that I was not missing anything, and there is nothing for me on this album. Unlike you I did not keep the album, but I went to a local CD buy and trade store, and traded the album for “Animato” by John Abercrombie, Jon Chistensen (percussion) and Vince Mendosa (composer, arranger, and brilliantly unique keyboard improviser). Still my favorite Abercrombie album. John Abercrombie is a favored jazz/rock guitarist among many fusion guitarist (including Pat Metheny). I wanted to comment on the Jan Hammer video but did not get around to it. So I will mention here an album by John Abercrombie, Jan Hammer and |Jack Dejonette. The album is called “Timeless”, it was released in 1975 on ECM. This album is post gen one of the Mahavishnu Orchestra (I believe). It is a very jazz AND rock album. Hammers work on the title track is absolutely beautiful. This album is a must listen to for any Jan Hammer fan. Thanks Andy Jack from Canada

Oh, this video was so much fun. Had me grinning and giggling like an idiot. Forgetting the name "Tony Banks" was an unexpected delight. Don't be hard on yourself, mate. What you do is absolutely top shelf!

Very entertaining video! I was riveted as the Gentle Giant cover slowly panned left to eventually cover your face. I hope that was intentional because it was genius!

I worked for a music distribution warehouse for a retail record chain in the states. Everytime that I saw a new release for an amazing artist on GRP, I always held back tears. They used to give us free promos for many new releases in all genres. I learned alot about many fantastic bands and artists getting those free promos ( that nobody else wanted) I avoid most releases on GRP for the sake of my mental health. The Epidemics have all of the charm of a clogged drain.

Brilliant, brilliant, brilliant! Nothing more needs to be said.

Wonderful theme for a video. I feel so lucky to miss out buying any of these albums. I find your playing very interesting and enjoyable. Perhaps it is possible to do a video including your drumming?

Just discovered your channel, you touch upon some interesting topics from a jazz/prog perspective. For me the problem with Genesis’ Calling All Stations’ was that the songs were too long and they missed Collins’ arrangement skills which worked on previous albums. You also pointed out that they began to lose their touch from We Can’t Dance. The change in producer also didn’t help as they had way too much control and this was evident in the timings on that project too. Anyway good video.

A very entertaining run down Andy :-) Can't really argue with any of those, although I've not heard that Gadd album. I have to agree about CAS by Genesis, and tbh I've never even regarded it as a Genesis album. It's really a Rutherford/Banks project with some hired hands.

The Epidemics! I feel your pain. Went through the same sorry journey myself.

I love these videos, particularly the parts where you proactively address anticipated criticism and when you take on various forms of snobbery. I'm bookmarking this one to remind myself not to feel too bad when I suffer a brain cramp. We can only hope I remember that I've bookmarked it. 😁

Another interesting video. Never been a huge fan of ELP or Gentle Giant, so can’t pass judgment on those two albums. Genesis lost the plot of what to do when Phil Collins left, the main inspiration for pop tunes skewed the band down a path of no return. After the Invisible Touch album I tuned out and stuck with PG and his aesthetic. I think you were right about certain bands could turn out a popular tune/riff for pop song length. I think it confused ELP and GG. Entertaining as usual from you.

I think the use of the DX7 was basically an assault on music, sound and production ... it s always Fun watchin'

We can poke a finger and laugh, whilst recognising that it’s completely natural and that we’ve done it ourselves lol Great vid and whilst I’ve not heard some of the music you’ve discussed, the Genesis criticism was particularly salient, as I can remember having unresolved feelings about all their albums post Duke throughout the 80’s, until by the time ‘We Can’t Dance’ came along and I’d become immersed in American rock bands like Faith No More, Jane’s Addiction, 24-7 Spyz …. and British dance and Electronica like early Prodigy or The Orb etc … I’d become embarrassed by where Genesis had ended up. As the gift of time gives you even greater insight into your relationship with bands or artists you have loved, I have came to appreciate just how incredible Genesis were at their best,( still to this day probably my favourite band if there can be such a thing), but I’ve still never listened to their last two albums to this day. I’ll take your word for it ….. no problem lol

As far as I’m concerned ELP NEVER had a clue. They were sniffing their own farts the whole time and had no self-awareness when prog declined. Love Beach is awful…but their other albums are a chore on the whole.

I was stuck one Halloween with no idea for a costume. Then I hit upon it. I could be giant for a day. All I had to do was cut out the mask. Some people thought my costume was a little lame, but I assured them it was better than the album.

I loved the Jeremy Clarkson reference. The Greatest band....In The World! Mike Rutherford was actually in a episode of Top Gear. Mike ends up being one of the slowest celebrity drivers....Of All Time!

I have that Gadabout album too...talk about underwhelmed...

Good to get a heads up on those albums which truly plumb the Mariana Trench of abysmalness if that's a word. Still, when it's the work of well respected musicians it helps me live with my own musical indescetions and learn to appreciate the advantages of artisic obscurity.

The wheels came off Genesis for me when on hearing a tune on the radio, I would be thinking, 'is this a new Genesis or Phil Collins song'? Also I recall when 'another day in paradise' came out, Genesis being featured on the money section of a newspaper ( this was the 'wall street' era, don't forget) about how they were investing in office blocks. > sigh

The rumour at the time was that Pat was upset with his Geffen deal and made "Zero Tolerence" just to quickly fill the album obligation. He denies this. But I'm a big fan of that record. It's like Free Jazz as seen through the eyes of Thrash and Hardcore. Someday it will be reevaluated for the genius it is.

Because you made BANKS bigger than Tony, I assumed you'd got his surname wrong and said it with a 'W'. Genesis are my favourite band but I've never heard 'Calling All Stations' and your argument, on the basis of just two tracks, makes me glad I'll never have to hear it. As for the Metheny, I wonder if the album is an argument against the title, ie., silence is sometimes best. This video was as informative and life changing as your Top 10 Biscuits. Nice one Andy! Cheers, Ian.

Another great video. Gentle Giant were absolutely amazing. I think it's their background in soul that made them 'feel' so good. I also like t5he way the album cover slowly moved so that you were a giant for the day. You didn't mention Let Me Know You by one of my heroes, Stanley Clarke. It's awful

I remember watching a L. Shankar video and some blond was just sitting there, doing nothing. On subsequent vids she woukd ‘grace’ an L. Shankar performance. I haven’t the album you mention but I’m looking for it. I know you were being serious about this topic but it was quite funny and entertaining. Ugh! That cover of Love Beach…….what were they thinking?!?

"Calling All Stations" had some great songs, the title track was the coolest track since 'Mama', 'Congo' was perfect prog pop, 'Alien Afternoon', 'The Dividing Line', 'Uncertain Weather', 'There Must be Some Other Way', 'One Man's Fool', c'mon, this was a good Genesis album that yielded outtakes that belonged on there..........and much like you describe the Weather Report album, ELP were in the same boat with L.B., contractual obligation and yet still managed to deliver with 'Canario', 'Memoirs', and the obligatory but solid Greg Lake ballad 'For You'.....although, mind you, there is no excuse for the hideous cover that Emerson fought tooth and nail against.......they'd have done far better to showcase a hot female bum in the those "Love Beach" shorts being hawked with an album insert upon release..........ELPowell in '86 was a pared-down and brilliant return to form

Pretty good analysis. Glad you mentioned the 1994 album by Pat Metheny, Zero Tolerance For Silence. I love most of Pat’s albums but when I put the vinyl on I thought it had been distorted in the pressing, it is just a complete wall of distorted noise, an absolute stinker of an album from someone who should have known better.

Yes Danny, I too forget names.

I admit, having checked for snipers, that I like Love beach. It has significance for my weird mind, for the time. In the late 70s some members of king crimson were involved in making pop resulting in bucks fizz. Greg lake had been a key member of king crimson and on this album got involved in making pop I think that he was successful as I enjoy the songs. The second half of is a bit spoof, which is entertaining. My case is stated - you don't know where I live....

Zero Tolerance for Silence is a bit like that Record by that Guy from that Famous Band was covered by „Zeitkratzer“. „Metal Machine Music“? by Lou Reed?

If you own a few of these LAME Albums is there a fine due ? just asking for a friend.

I love the way the Gentle Giant album cover slowly creeps across the screen. LOL You mentioned the 80s production sound. How do you define that? I hated a lot of the music in the 80s. I didn't like Invisible Touch or We Can't Dance either.... I do like some of the Mike & the Mechanics. They had a couple of amazing lead singers. And, hey, I can't remember names anymore to save my life. On the Weather Report albums, now you're just showing of....

Sometimes when I want to be unhappy I put on Love Beach, Giant for a Day and Tormato.

OMG as an ECM absolute devotee, I can do nothing but agree about the Shankar album you mentionned, I mean what were they thinking ? It's beyond bad, it's truly horrendous.

Anthony Garone of Make Weird Music sees Zero Tolerance For Silence as an avant noise rock album. He also sees a connection between Zero Tolerance and the Dillinger Escape Plan. You might want to check out what he has to say about it I first picked up the album when I saw a sticker quoting a rave review by Thurston Moore. Being a big Sonic Youth fan, that was enough for me. I've come to really like it. And I have tons of respect for Pat Metheny's work on Song X and his willingness to challenge us (and himself) from time to time. The video is titled: WTF!? Noise Rock By Pat Metheny?!?

Speaking of fabulously naff album covers, Throbbing Gristle's '20 Jazz Funk Greats' is my personal favourite. It belongs to that late 70s period of fuzac that Andy describes. At that time jazz fusion was hated as much by punks and post punks as the more traditionally reviled prog!

You're giving me PTSD, reminding me of the Epidemics record. I was a college-radio DJ when that came out, was super excited and so sadly disappointed -- nay, *hurt* -- by it, in the listening. I also saw them live, opening for The Golden Palominos (with Jack Bruce, among others). Live they were just as bad as the record. And that was my first live experience of Percy Jones.... eventually, I got better.

Ahhh....ELP's Love Beach with the Bee Gee's album cover. A meme long before anyone knew what a "meme" was. I have a bit of a soft spot for Memoirs of an Officer and Canario. They were okay, but there's no denying ELP did much better with their earlier long, multipart compositions from earlier in their career and same with their classical interpretations. They're no wear near the quality of Trilogy, Karn Evil 9, Endless Engima, even Pirates in their own multi part comps or Knife Edge, Hoedown, Fanfare from the adaptations.

In terms of "This Is This", Monty Python perhaps showed how it's done: if it's a contractional obligation album just call it as such. : )

I remember being literally pissed off when I saw that "Giant for a Day" cover. I bought it anyway and brought it home and was horrified after putting it on the turntable.

For me the most amazing thing about “zero tolerance” is that it sounds like someone with zero technique on the guitar. How is that possible? I often wonder if decided to play left handed in order to divorce himself from his musical past…. Also it is amazing how sincere he is about how honest he was in its making. I adore song x

Don't worry too much about forgetting Tony Banks's name. I forgot my own address yesterday. I've only lived here five years.

Wait another ten years. When you go the frige and don’t remember why. 😂

Ohh my God I am crackin up over here : watch the Giant for a Day album cover drift across the screen ( 21:35 ) in front of Andy's face as he trashes this one !

Just had a quick breeze through ‘The Epidemics’. It’s unadulterated cack. Astonishing (and a little reassuring) that great musicians can make such egregious shit. I’m gonna recommend it to all my pals!

Yeah, that Epidemics is a total headscratcher. I found a copy in a thrift store for ninety-nine cents and thought I had struck gold until I got home and played it. It sounded terrible right off the bat! I pull it out every few years to see if my feelings have changed (it has been known to happen on occasion!), but I can never make it through the whole thing! Original copies of Love Beach, BTW, came with a fold-out insert where you could order a pair of authentic Love Beach jogging shorts! I have the insert!!!

Land Of Cockayne by Soft Machine comes immediately to mind.

Tony Kaye and Peter Banks ..... I still listen to those early Yes albums and even bought the first Flash album and the sole Badger album (which I think is an exceptionally good live album and even lives on as the ring tone on my phone). If I were to sum up the best musicians on those albums I might well use the portmanteau term "Tony / Banks. 😂

I just listened to a few moments of Love Beach -- seemed fine. It's gotta be all about the cover

Great stuff, but I'm not sure if Calling All Stations deserves to be here. Maybe if they had employed David Longdon the sound might have been more what they needed at that time. Plus his great writing and instrumental skills....... Ray Wilson is a great singer but too "rock" for Genesis I think. keep up the good work!

One of the few prog bands to play convincing punk was The Tubes. I will not forget just how shocked I was when I heard the ferocity of of Telecide. Great as it was, I much prefer their earlier proggy material.

So, we should be aware of albums with Pun titles? In that case, I'll steer clear of 'Miles Ahead' and 'Milestones' by Miles Davis.

I remember buying _"Love Beach",_ putting it on my turntable, and for some songs I was just staring at the speakers and thinking "What is this? What is happening here?" ... and not in a good way. I pretty much stopped listening to ELP after that, except that very occasionally I'll play their debut album, or a few songs off of _"Works (Volume 1)"._ _"... Calling All Stations..."_ was also a big miss for me, but it didn't trigger a backlash against their other albums. I still like and play most of their earlier albums.

Im surprised Jethro Tull's Under Wraps didnt make the list?

Love Metheny but not Zero Tolerance. Listened to it only once. Wondered if the famously straight-laced Pat had succumbed to some LSD or something. "incidental music off a My Little Ponies movie" is wonderful. Thanks.

Thks for not picking any albums I love. Or did you and I can't remember?

The Missing Piece was the first Gentle Giant album I bought and I loved it and bought their back catalog and realized that The Missing Piece was not all that. Octopus might be my favorite. But Giant For A Day is awful. However Citizen is not bad. Andy's assessment is spot on (for me).

I feel Love Beach won't be getting any Love in this video :) "I'm gonna make love to you, on love beach Make all your dreams come true, on love beach Gonna make love to you, on love beach Gonna make your dreams come true, on love beach Gonna make love to you, on love beach..."

How about the 10 lamest biscuits as a vid?

I'm a big fan of many of the bands that you like, such as Gentle Giant, Brand X, Mahavishnu Orchestra, Jan Hammer, Jeff Beck, John McLaughlin, U.K., etc. Call me weird, but I'm not ashamed to admit that I love the album This Is This. It's actually my favorite album by Weather Report. I also don't have a problem with Giant For A Day. I think it's underrated and it's a very good album!

I bought Love Beach when it came out and it was my first ELP album. I must admit I enjoyed it so much I went out and bought all their other albums and liked them even more although I always have a problem with Greg Lake's' side of Works Vol1.The funny thing is, all these years later I still enjoy Love Beach. I like their versions of Canarios, I like Memoirs Of An Officer And A Gentleman especially the piano solo, I even like the opening track. You are right it's not Pop or Prog.I call it Prog Lite. No, the real stinker for me is their very last LP In The Hot Seat. That album is an absolute horror and should never have been recorded. I agree with you about Giant For A Day-GG were losing their way with that album. Having said that for what it is, it's still a listenable album. Genesis also should have bowed out when Collins left rather than produce that weak Calling All Stations Album. Not all groups produced their worst albums at the tail end of their career. I know I am going to upset some fans but much as I love Santana I absolutely cannot stand Caravanserai -it just bores me to tears. Also Pink Floyd really hit a bum note with Ummagumma with its aimless experimentation and yet I really like their earlier and later albums so there you go.

Who is the keyboard player in Genesis, is it: Robin Banks, River Banks, Piggy Banks or Memory Banks?

Went to the "Giant For a Day" show in Rochester, NY. They were passing out those stupid cardboard heads. The concert was going well until they started with the music from the new album. It did not go over well with the crowd. Lot of those cardboard heads were thrown towards the stage. Gary Green the guitar player was giving thumbs up the crowd and the drummer was flipping us off. The show was ended with some great Giant classics, and all was well. BUT we knew we had seen the end of an era.

After listening to the album, did you have zero tolerance for silence?

Just looked up the dictionary definition of Lame which says 'unconvincing or unsatisfactory' that could easily apply to the 7 you mentioned, though you could also have called some of them lousy albums as in very bad. As you may recall I am a big ELP fan and would agree with what you say in the comments that Love Beach will never be a favourite of any ELPfan, and nomits not a favourite of mine though I do prefer it just over Works 2 and In the Hot Seat which I find to be their least good one. Basically for me ELP stopped being Greta after LAdies and Gentlemen, Works 1 had its moments but also sowed the seeds for Works 2 and Love Beach. I dont disagree with what you say about them not being able to write pop music in the same way that Genesis and Yes were able to, however from what i've read I think they were forced into doing it by Ahmet Ertegun who wanted hits, and that during the making of it they basically disintegrated amongst themselves leaving it in an unfinished underproduced state. The really awful song, with some of the worst lyrics ever - Taste ofyour love - could well have been a piss take however not sure if anyone got the joke. I admit that I do listen to it now and again, but thats more to do with being a fan than not - Ken Golden also made a valid point in saying that some of the dissatisfaction with it comes from the lack of the sound of Emerson's Organ, that was an essential element of ELP music. If you want a real stinker from the wider ELP family have you heard Carl Palmers PM 1:PM? As a fan I had to get it but its the epitome of lame. Didnt know the Shankar or the Gadd though as you say I am intrigued, so thanks to Deezer and You Tube have given them a listen. The Epidemics reminded me of another really lame prog album - Rick Wakeman's Rock N Roll Prophet, its the synth bas sound that does that. If there were no singing on the Epidemics it may just pass as a mid 80's curio, but as soon as the vocals (?) come in it sucks. Steve Gadd - is an ok listen, wouldnt ever say I'd go to it on any regularity though - I wonder if you find this to be lame becasue of the expectation behind it, and as you say there are a few Stanley Clarkes that could be included. I did once listen to the Metheny - once being enough - found it again on You Tube, listened for half a minute, first impressions were right, its just noise really, or at least it is to me - would prefer to listen to Brotzman's Machine Gun. Genesis karked it with We Cant Dance but then gave a hint that they may go back to something a bit more prog when they did a snippet from Suppers Ready when Wilson joined, but thats all they ever did, a snippet. Ray Wilson is a fine singer but I think the album fails due to Banks not creating anything memorable and Rutherford being too Mike & the Mechanics - thats a band that I just do not have any time for, total corporate wallpaper paste as far as i'm concerned. It came out in 97 just at a poit when Neo Prog badns were starting to get a bit of traction - if they'd done a proper Prog album hen they could have been the trailblasers for IQ, Arena, Jadis et al and while Yes had come back with one ofthe bigger piles of doo doo they'd ever recorded at least they still did prog on it and the much better follow up. Talking of Yes, Heaven and Earth could have been acontender, though theres something about that album that to me has a certain charm, its not their best but its just about good enough - one of the many mediocre middling ones you mentioned. Gentle Giant - dont think there's many who would disagree as to the it being worthy of inclusion here, I m not gong to. Weather report - again ok but is that what we want from a Weather Report album?

Have that Pat Metheny. Almost thirty years later and I still can’t get a handle on it.

Not sure whether I should be relieved that Greenslade weren’t on the list, or concerned that you haven’t mentioned them! They’re not the greatest, boundary pushing Prog band of all time, but they produced some pretty good music (in my opinion!), great keyboard playing, great drumming, and Tony Reeves on bass. 😊

Question: Have you ever heard David Sancious?

I actually enjoy that Metheny record, but I have to be in the mood. Don't feel bad, I make the same mistake all the time with The Banks.

Never heard Giant For A Day, but I've always loved Civilian! Missing Piece had Memories Of Old Days, one song worth the price of admission to a disappointing album.

Once, I was walking up a street on in the West Village, NYC, and I passed a tall, thin man with short black hair who was sitting on the sidewalk, crying and shouting, "Please give me some money. I need money." I would normally help out a street person in need when I could, but I thought, "Any money I give to this guy is going straight into his arm." So, I kept walking. But something about his face unnerved me, and I thought of him for the rest of the day. I couldn't think of anything else. Then it struck me. I knew that face. I knew who he was. It was Jaco. He was sitting right around the corner of the basketball courts he pretty much lived in toward the end of his life. I would've known who he was immediately if he didn't cut his hair short. I was devastated, and I still feel terrible guilt for not doing anything to help him. Some people say to me when I tell them this story, "Doesn't matter. There was nothing you could've done to help him. He was too far gone," but it still bothers me to this day. RIP Jaco. Sorry I just walked by you.

I’m writing this, because it’s a good way to see what my name is, that I just forgot. Welcome to the club, Andy. It will only get worse.

Zero Tolerance for Silence is practically unlistenable. It is a statement perhaps in SOME way. But one not to be repeated.

that happens to be so funny because then I was trying to remember the keyboardist for YES which is ALSO named Tony but I coulnt remember his last name and then it came to me ...........Tony Kaye

I wonder, if things had been slightly different, whether Calling All Stations would have existed. I'm specifically thinking about the choice between the shortlisted pair Ray Wilson and the much missed David Longdon to replace Phil. I'm not decrying Wilson, who has proved himself an excellent musician, but If they had chosen Longdon, they'd have got themselves a reincarnation of Peter Gabriel, up to and including the creative input. Maybe that's the very reason Banks and Rutherford didn't choose him -- feeling it would have been a retrogression. I suppose I'm relieved they didn't in the end, or else we might not have had those wonderful years of Big Big Train' fronted by Longdon (whose only similarity with early Genesis apart from the voice is the [steam age rather than Victorian] English folk themes).

I bought No Pussyfooting by Robert Fripp and Brian Eno and listened to it all the way through back in 1973. It never graced my turntable again. Perhaps the Pat Metheny album belongs with No Pussyfooting in a special category of "Top Ten Albums You Only Listen To Once"? 😳

Going “…all Jeremy Clarkson…” is a real kick in the knackers…! 😂 But, all joking aside, I think that Calling All Stations is another one of those that takes time to grow on you. It’s got some great moments on there. In fact, many more great moments than bad ones! It takes a little bit of investment in time and listening to reveal itself. One Man’s Fool is probably the best piece on the album. If you want to point out a real bad album, really bad that is, then look no further than the absolutely godawful dirge called The Final Cut by Pink Floyd (Roger Waters). It’s a real shocker…

“Pop hits are so cheap and easy to make. Let me show you how its done:”

I've got another one... just tried to listen to "Land Of Cockayne' from (well the cover says:) Soft Machine. Oy.

I've just listened to a few minutes of the Pat Metheny album. It reminded me of Metal Machine Music by Lou Reed. Reed made that appalling record to fulfil a contract, apparently. Did Pat Metheny have a similar excuse for creating such a pile of shit? If not, I can't imagine why he recorded it and after recording it and, presumably, listening back to it, decided to release it. It's not a masterpiece. It's musical masturbation.

Did you know Francis Dunnery was auditioned for Genesis before this album.

To me ELP at best were poppy ,wtf that album sounded like , I don’t want to know . Really enjoy your insight into these things .

If the GG album cover was a NOMEANSNO cover it would be brilliant! Do you know this amazing Canadian band, Andy? Horrible album covers, composed deliberately to deter the listener, BUT incredible compositions and musicianship. I've always argued they could possibly be the greatest band of all time! Possibly a ridiculous assertion, but when you hear them you'll see my point! Fading Lights is a wonderful piece of prog as what should have been Genesis' swansong imo! PS. I'm 54 and me Mum has never got my name right the first time!!!

'My little pony'. Classic comment. Made me laugh.

I so thought your #1 choice was going to be “Million Dollar Legs” by Tony Williams Lifetime.

You are not the only one to stumble when recalling the keyboardist for Genesis. I've done it countless times, and I don't know why. All the other members I can rattle off without pause. Come to Tony Banks, though, and I hesitate, or draw a complete blank. And I really do like his playing and song craftsmanship!

Ouch ... Calling All Stations gets put down way too much and is actually one of my "go to" Genesis albums .... and I have got them all and am ok with all eras ... CAS gets played a lot .... especially the equivalent of Side 1 if it were an LP .... I would buy a deluxe version of this (with b sides, associated recordings and a live show from the European shows that were done) without hesitation ... if you have not heard the album give it a go ... approach with an open mind ... I think the album is due a reappraisal now 20+ years have lapsed ... this line up could have evolved given time .... for me, at least, Calling All Stations just works .... beats We Can't Dance, And Then There Were Three, Side 1 of Wind & Wuthering ... as I say, from my perspective .... Got to agree though with your view of Pat Metheny's Zero Tolerance For Silence album ... total "mince" .... CMcG, Aberdeen, Scotland

Hysterically accurate. I don’t know The Epidemics, and I will stay away.

It seems that this point of view is a bit influeced by the equation: if an album is a commercial success it mustn't be bad (for example that horrible Yes "Owner of a Lonely Heart" album isn't included) . On the contrary there are albums that didn't deserved to be on the black list... For example ELP's Love Beach features one of their best compositions (the 20 minutes long "Memoirs"); Genesis' "Calling All Stations" is also a very good album , stronger and more inventive than many previous Genesis records of the Eighties era

I always mix up Peter Banks (early Yes) and Anthony Phillips (early Genesis) as both were the first basically unknown guitarists of their bands

If you take Peter Banks and Tony Kaye from early Yes, you have Genesis' keyboard player. A great alternate list would be a top 10 "progressive" new wave bands of the 80s that displaced prog. The Cure, XTC, Depeche Mode, Talking Heads, etc. Oh, another "lame" fusion example would be most of Chick Corea's solo keyboard parts on Romantic Warrior (chicken squawk synth sounds, etc.).

I agree that Genesis lost it when Steve Hackett left.

I used to own both the Metheny and the Epidemics albums and was excited to hear them both but was astounded at how little esthetic merit there was in either. Such misfires. As a kid I remember trying to make a piece of “modern, abstract assemblage” painting with no foreknowledge of the historical development that lead to the various tenets of modernism. I had no idea what I was trying for or what my actual aim was. Of course the end product ended up in the trash bin. That’s my generous assessment of their perhaps naive approach to something that they simply didn’t come to naturally. Definitively head-scratchers. I can give L Shankar a pass because of the cultural differences; going from essentially the Indian classical tradition to New Wave pop is indeed a stretch. Metheny on the other hand sounds like he’s trying to divorce himself entirely from the sonic palette of his earlier work which was devoid of distortion and bombast. It’d be great if they were interesting failures rather than misguided posturing?

Lots of good points here including that "Duke" was the pinnacle of Genesis. Don't agree at all with Genesis's Calling all Stations being on this list. Though without Phil, "Not About Us" is perhaps Genesis's best ballad of all time.

The final cut by Pink Floyd

Peter Banks was the Genesis keyboardist. Got it. Tony Banks does have too much influence sometimes, I agree. I think it was major factor in Steve Hackett leaving Genesis.

SONG X!!!! 🎃