You say off the bat that it’s a totally subjective list, yet due to your experience, technical familiarity, and thoughtful approach you’ve produced easily the most reasonable and satisfying list I’ve seen. The fact that I would personally have (slightly) different placements is irrelevant when I agree with everything you say about these bosses. Ironically the contour of the rankings somewhat suffers from how strong these bosses are overall, essentially spanning from good to great
One of the more disappointing aspects of gaius is that he doesn’t even have his own ost. How disrespectful for a remembrance boss with such a great moveset.
I really like how Messmer, Bayle and Midra are almost universally top 3 in the DLC. They're just that good. Fromsoft definitely brought up their A game in the DLC. Messmer is probably the best boss they've made next to Isshin, Orphan and Gael
I like how all souls games has that one boss that most of the community agrees that its the best fight in their game, elden ring didnt have one, but now it has too. And messmer deserves it more than anyone.
@@D0verking69 godfrey is definitely is a top tier boss, but i dont think everyone said that he was the best. for me, mohg was the best and some said maliketh, malenia or even radagon was their favorite. Still, Elden ring as a general has amazing boss quality (most rememberance bosses are S tier) but it was lacking a top tier, one of the best in the series boss and messmer came in clutch.
1. Bayleee S+ 2. Messmer S+ 3. Midra S 4. Rellana S (lacks presentation, moveset is S+) 5. Dancing Lion A+ 6. Putrescent Knight A 7. Scadutree Avatar A 8. Gaius A 9. Radahn A- (fix X slash and A+ or maybe S) 10. Romina A- 11. Metyr B
One compromise for the cross slash that i feel would work is make it so you can roll both of the slashes at the same time with just one roll while delaying the final part of the combo a little bit, which could allow for another opening depending on the weapon
Imo the reason why so many people loved Rellana is because she mixes very well the appeal for ER combat. A challenging fight with varied and interesting attacks, and rewards skill and experimentation having a lot of combat expression on change. Is one of those fights that rewards knowledge and the more you know her fight the more you like her. My ranking would be: 1) Bayle 2) Messmer 3) Rellana 4) Midra 5) Dancing Lion 6) Romina 7) P.K 8) PvZ Sunflower 9) Gaius 10) Mr. Flashy 11) Metyr
yeah those first 5 are by far the best fights in the dlc for me too. I personally would ne maybe out Dancing Lion as first tho because he is the most different fight and such a spectacle. Metyr is by far the worst for me aswell lol
I consider the Leda Gank Squad to be the penultimate boss. They have their own boss theme, but not their own health bar, so I understand anyone who doesn't consider them to be a boss. Scadutree Avatar is a boss I like way too much, and was one of the most memorable in the DLC. I just really like the weird way it fights and the music that gets surprisingly sad. Easily an A+ or S tier boss.
@@edun4513 too much health, too much damage, all while the gank you unless you have the towershield summons or furled fingers. didnt necessarily find it hard, just didn’t find it fun at all
My DLC list: 1. Messmer- S+ 2. Bayle- S+ 3. Rellana- S 4. Midra- S 5. PK- S 6. Romina- A+ 7. Dancing Loin- A + 8. Sunflower- A 9. Gaius- B 10. Metyr- B 11. Radahn😢- B Remeberance list: 1. Messmer S+ 2. Maleketh S+ 3. Bayle S+ 4. Godfrey S+ 5. Morgott S+ 6. Mohg S+ 7. Midra S 8. Rellana S 9. Maleina S 10. PK S 11. Romina A+ 12. Dancing Lion A+ 13. Godrick A+ 14. Rykard A+ 15. Radabeast A+ 16. Sunflower A 17. Starscouge A 18. Renalla A 19. Placidusax B 20. Gaius B 21. Ancestor Spirit B 22. Astel B 23. Metyr B 24. Consort B 25. Fortesaxx D 26. Fire Giant D
The dlc refined er's boss design and made memorable, fun fights without some of the weird unintuitive aspects that plagued the base game. There aren't many instances of things I was really opposed to, sure metyr's Lazer is ass and radahn feels half-baked, but he's cool, and a lot of these fights introduced moves and combos that felt so engaging and satisfying to learn. Like p Knight's little duo moment where his horse charges at you, and gaius' multi-hit sword and boar head slam combo, and messmer's entire fight, also rellana's twin moon attack is the coolest thing I've ever jumped over, second only to bayle's nuke. There are plenty of nit-picks, but I would say this boss line-up is similar in quality to ds3 and maybe even sekiro for me. My ranking's looking something like this: Messmer Bayle Rellana Midra Romina P knight Gaius Sunflower Lion Metyr Radahn
Very reasonable tier list. I agree with your Radahn discussion. Also I fully agree with the dawning cognitive clarity thing, I think FromSoft done it best with Lion Dancer, IDK why but it was the best instance of feeling overwhelmed but then you find out that its moves become clearer & clearer with each attempt & you begin to think that it makes perfect sense, I think you explained it perfectly. My ranking (please don’t kill me lolol): 1. Messmer. 2. Consort Radahn. 3. Lion Dancer. 4. Bayle. 5. Midra. 6. Rellana. 7. Saint of the Bud. 8. Putrescent Knight. 9. Commander Gaius. 10. Scadutree Avatar. 11. Metyr.
Some music in the background of the ranking would be nice. Otherwise, I think all of your takes do a good job of acknowledging the merits and demerits of each fight
So i would rank them as follows 1. Messmer (S+) 2 Bayle (S+) 3. Relanna (S) 4. Midra (S) 5. Putrescent Knight (A+) 6. Romina (A+) 7. Lion (A) 8. Radahn (A) 9. Gaius (A-) 10. Scadutree Avatar (A-) 11. Metyr (A-) What is funny is that for me all rememberence bosses are atleast A tier or above. I also did not vibe bith the scadutree avatar. Hopefully I improve at it the more I play Edit: forgot about metyr lol
25 remembrances + Bayle Malenia (S) best moveset for back-and-forth aggression Messmer (S) Mohg (S) Maliketh (S) Beast Clerygman is alright, 2nd phase is excellent Godfrey (S) Smooth, plenty of mid-combo openings Morgott (S) Majestic Bayle (S) best dragon fight Midra (S) Fearsome and beautiful Radabeast (A) Radagon alone is an S, Elden Beast isn't anything special moveset-wise though it's presentation is top-notch Rellana (A) Moveset i'd say is on par with Radagon's, though beyond gameplay she is a pretty unremarkable character Rykard (A) Fun gimmick, Fun character Dancing Lion (A) aesthetically amazing and a trippy moveset. Lightning phase is kind of cancer Miquledahn (B) instant S if they fix its problems Starscourge Radahn (B) Pat his crotch to win Romina (B) Good moveset, lame character Scadutree Avatar (B) simple fun Putrescent knight (B) simple fun. Wish it had some sleep attacks though Anscestor Spirit (B) very unique aesthetics Godrick (B) Simple fun Renalla (B) cuts it close to C Astel (C) too many attacks that force you to disengage Placidusax (C) pat his tail to win Metyr (C) cancerous double-sunday attack. In general not a very fun moveset Gaius (D) Frustrating moveset. The fact it gets I-frames when charging is so weird Fire Giant (D) Clipping toenails Foritssax (D) Clipping toenails + static touch
romina is unexpectedly cool at high ng+. She was at the very bottom on my first playthrough, but now I fell in love for how insanely magestic and unpredictable her moveset is. She feels like maliketh in some way, when she has that damage, she can quick combo to death with insta stan and good dmg. I think fromsoft slaughtered her damage for no reason, she is definitely one of the best ever made movesetwise. to be frank, I find midra so easy in any ng+ he just can't do nothing to me at any build, but I died a lot to incredible combos of romina, and that was hella fun (dex, low poise especially shoking, with those hitstans)
I fought Rellana for over 8 hours on my NG run and now RL1, got 2 no damage wins against her and I just have to say I have some insane PTSD and stockholm syndrome.. oh my god, I want to go back but I also dread just seeing one clip of her.. high S, amazing but I need mental help lmao
It's insane how Romina has dialogue for her P2 transition and Rellana for her Twin Moon attack... in the game files. Why Fromsoft, why? They added a FUCKING CHAIR IN RELLANA'S ARENA IN 1.13 BUT THEY DIDN'T RESTORE THE DIALOGUE
Funny you say I can't stay by Gaiuss' ass cause he punishes it but that's how I beat him the first time, I just guard countered the kick over and over again until he died.
@@jermergerg or the deflecting hard tear to save on stamina and equip load. I really wish the game shipped with that mechanic and it wasn’t locked behind some physic thing that anyone can miss
I think people hated on Gaius due to his charge before FS patched his starting placement to always be the further away spot. Dying immediately after getting pinned to the fog gate isn’t fun for anyone. Also, dodging that charge felt like an utter gamble.
Chad opinion putting Gaius at B tier. Rominas phase transition is unforgivable. No way to know exactly where 60% hp is. Also Rellana is the best boss in all of souls (ive spent 15 hours with her 😅)
Everybody’s talking about the ranking, but what abt the gameplay shown here? I’ve tried to do no-hit runs, but it simply is too hard for me. To see this channel do it without breaking a sweat is wild.
Ranking them is hard for me because all my top 5 I consider S-tier and easily interchangeable. But gun to my head right now I would probably rank them: 1) Messmer 2) Rellana 3) Midra 4) Lion 5) Bayle 6) Romina 7) Putrescent Knight 8) Scadutree Avatar 9) Metyr 10) Gaius
While still being a dumb move, to me the double slash does not make the radahn fight much worse as even at no Scadufrags the attack can be partially tanked around twice. This can make the fight more interesting as you'll likely have to time to heal to both recover and stay safe from the attack.
I absolutely loved Midra despite his comparative simplicity, probably because like you said he resembles a DS3 boss. But Bayle was just too damn epic especially in phase 2.
Lightning fire -> pyroclastic lightening I think is the term. I agree with your rankings and like the idea of keeping consort in ranking purgatory for now. If they improve the 1,2,x slash he'd compete for top three in my book. Kind of a shame, because there is some really good story telling and lore between Radhan and Miquella - I've been working on a lore theory about the latter. He reminds me the most of a GRRM antagonist and his character arc from compassionate child to "a monster" is really interesting when you piece together his arc.
@@jermergerg Yeah, that's my own theory. A child with good intentions operating within Marika's warped paradigm, who slowly fell further away from the compassion which earned him his moniker. Also, "The vow" - if you are wondering what it is, I suggest you visit the church of vows....
My biggest issue with radahn isnt the triple slash but the long combos and magic moves. I hate that i have to dodge/wait for eternity for a small window to attack. I dont feel rewarded for learning his moves. I want to be able to fight, not watching the boss flying and do things while i have to sit still the whole time. I want boss fights like morgott or rellana or messmer where i can dance or do cool stuffs with them. Radahn doesnt have any branching combo and postioning doesnt work with him. His fight feels so boring to me, you keep dodging and hiting him at the end of his combo.
My top 5 would be: Bayle (S tier) Messmer (S tier) Dancing Lion (was an A tier fight on my first playthrough but I now put him at S tier) Midra (A tier) Consort Radahn (A tier and could easily be S if not for his unfairly cheap double slash and second phase AOE attack)
Mine personally is: 10. Commander Gaius 9. Metyr, Mother of Fingers 8. Rellana, Twin Moon Knight 7. Scadutree Avatar 6. Midra, Lord of Frenzy Flame 5. Putrescent Knight 4. Romina, Saint of the Bud 3. Divine Beast Lion Dancer 2. Bayle the Dread 1. Messmer the Impaler
Really surprised that you don't make note of the levels of jank in Romina's fight, given you did no-hit runs. She has some very weird behavior, including her entire body becoming a hitbox with virtually no tells. Plus, parts of her body will clip through the arena walls, and certain of her weapon swipes will straight up miss at point blank range. Cool design, bad implementation. Easily the worst experience I had in my RL1 run, aside from Radahn.
@@jermergerg She gets a pass from most players because she's quite easy on a normal run with her low damage output, but she's got a lot of problems that need to be patched.
@@entroponetics I'm seriously hoping they do a big boss patch in the next month or so and just wipe out a lot of the big glaring issues. I love Bayle, but his fire balls shouldn't be able to teleport through the arena walls, and this seems like a very easy fix. So, hopefully all of this will get taken care of soon!
@@jermergerg I do wonder what any kind of fix to Radahn in particular will look like. The cross-slash is the #1 issue, but how would they address it? Change the animation of the individual slashes? Is there precedent for something like that? And what about the right-to-left slash combo opener? That one feels like it comes out a little too quick to react to most of the time. Personally, my biggest issue with that fight comes from the particle clutter in phase 2, and the way the golden shower effect will flinch you if it hits, and mess up your dodge timings for subsequent combo hits. How would you fix something like that?
@@entroponetics Lots to potentially clean up in that fight, but I personally would be satisfied if they fixed the triple slash--that is by far my biggest issue with the fight. If they made the first two swipes dodgeable with one roll, that'd be perfect.
Because you're supposed to parry Radahn's triple slash; you face the oppression of the full move if you neglect the move's counter. I'm beside myself with a combination of amusement & frustration with so many people's complaints concerning Radahn because it reveals how so few engaged in the fundamental & storied mechanic that is parrying.
You aren't 'supposed' to do anything it's a open world game about exploration and build diversity. Obviously funneling players into a particular choice runs counter to the games primary strengths which is asinine have design.
@@BBQcheese buddy, moves have counters, boss have dances that's been the nature of these games since the beginning, you ignore mechanics and under-equip your kit at your own peril, then bleat when peril finds you.
@@jermergerg Nothing comes to mind outside of Maliketh's phase 2 attacks, which is a cheeky technicality so I take your point, but you would be shocked at the new rhythms parrying opens up in these fights: Radahn's triple slash becomes a tide-turner, he pretty much stance-breaks himself trying to hit you with it, and that's to say nothing of Rellana. Love your stuff really, but it's telling that the two fights you expressed hardship with have steps in their dances that call for parrying.
@@Coypop I have well over 100 hitless kills on Maliketh including all sorts of crazy restrictions like RL1+0, no buffs, AuX, Great runes, Talismans ECT which is over 15 minutes long or things like Mid roll with a +0 colossal hitless. I've never parried him in ANY of these. Every single thing he does is CONSISTENTLY avoidable on a medium roll. He has a tool that is meant to parry him and yet they still balanced his kit to be fair without it. This is probably the best piece of evidence that your argument is flawed.
