Shooting the Guncotton Cartridge for the M1854 Lorenz 

This feels like the gun most gun enthusiasts would realistically be able to cobble together if they were sent back in time.

That tiny puff of smoke confused my brain pretty good, gotta say.

I didn't know there were actually smokeless percussion loads in the time. Thanks for showing! Also I love how the sticks sometimes can be seen going downrange.

Since I've had "only shoot black powder in muzzleloaders" drilled into my mind, this got me nervous

the "Smoke lessness!" was known? but WOW! NOW I have Watched the difference! the whole thing looked and sounded different than I would have thought.

Awesomeness! Love to see a video on making the gun cotton and assembling the cartridge.

This is awesome! You did this a lot sooner then I excepted since I was at your shop. Glad to see you where confident enough to switch to the Lorenz instead of the Enfield for your test. That really does look a lot of fun.

Congratulations on such achievement in the fields of both Hoplology and Experimental Archaeology! God bless you and yours!

*What a GREAT 2-part Series! I learned a lot! Thank you, Man!* 🤠👍

This guy should have every powder manufacture knocking on his door now

Awesome experimental history.

that was awesome dude, thank you for taking the time to make this video.

Für den Kaiser; die Geschichte verlangt es!

watched a few of your posts and do love the way you flick your hand each time, funny the things you see, keep up the good work

Love everything about this channel. Been binge watching!

I'm damned impressed! Excellent.

I learned something today. Thank you.

I have made gallery rounds for 8mm Lebel and .303 using flash paper and lead balls. This was the standard practice for French training who issued reloading kits to units to make these rounds from fired cases. Flash Paper is essentially gun cotton. I would be wary in using anything but a cigarette paper sized sheet. NC, unless it is properly made can be full of pooh traps! Cordite was used in BP type guns, but it has significantly different properties to modern nitro powder.

The wooden base would have made a very effective base for a needle fire cartridge and could have held a waxed felt base to seal a Dreyse type rifle breech

Thanks for a very entertaining video.

There are not enough like buttons for this video!

Love to see the muzzle velocity you’re getting out of that

Wunderschön!

You are a maniac! So cool!

So cool! Learned about a new cartridge

Wow. I’ve never seen it in action. Thanks. 👍 Gun cotton is a bit too easy to ignite in storage. Too bad. It sure looks like it worked great. First step towards practical smokeless propellant.

Gott erhalte Franz den Kaiser ! Best Wishes from Austria ! I love your content !

Pretty cool, those Lorenze’s are a sharp looking rifle

Wow! That was really something, very interesting.

Good Stuff Man!

I had no idea this type of cartridge existed, really interesting. Obviously much less fouling than black powder, but when you'd finished was there much? Loading a bit light to be fired in such an old rifle was a good idea, the cartridges look great too.

Dreyse: "I fear no man... but that thing..." Guncotton Lorenz: Dreyse: "It scares me..."

I remember hearing of gun cotton in the mysterious island by jules vern thanks for putting a image to it 👍

Fantastic!!!

Is there a danger that the guncotton cartridge will prematurely combust due to a hot barrel if you fired off a lot of rounds over time?

Brilliant thanks for sharing 👍

I'm familiar with gun cotton but I never knew it was used like this in a firearm. Thanks for sharing.

Awesome thanks 👍👍

Interesting futuristic technology ... LOL... Great video...

I'd really like to see some chronograph data to compare the gun cotton vs the black powder, even if it is a light charge

I've never seenthis type of cartridge b4 thx

Gott erhalte Franz den Kaiser

Using guncotton in the Lorenz is a real transformation!

Oh yes . I didn’t know gun cotton was used for rifles but after making some and just igniting it I guessed it could be used for a propellant . My idea was to put it in a brass 45/70 cartridge much like cordite was used in the .303 . I didn’t have any loading data so “my” idea is still on the drawing board . I don’t think I will experiment for obvious reasons . Thank you for posting and now I know it can be done 👍

Joules Verne wrote about that cotton, if I remembered right. In his novel from the Earth to the moon cannon club used that kind of explosive to send a man to the moon

I want to try this with my black powder Colt revolvers, Great video.

A great video. Experimental archeology.

If you’re casting your own bullets, place your bullet back in the mold and use a drill press through the sprue plate. The dowel will be as straight as possible then. I had to polish and old mold to get some surface rust out and I used a bullet as a polish carrier. Worked pretty slick.

This is gonna bring a tear to my eye, finally someone who appreciates the empire, AND HE IS ALSO FROM PA

I was so disappointed when you said it was just a dummy but the first live shots are great! I wonder if they were actually drop down in practice or if it was just something the brass were told...

Finally found it. I'd been wondering for a while why there wasn't this sort of cartridge that you just drop in as just one unit rather than tearing it apart to pour the powder and ramming the projectile.

If you don't want to make gun cotton, a sample can be bought from one of those magic supply stores as flash cotton, flash paper. Magicians use it during shows. $6 for 25gm. It's shipped wet so not hazmat fees.

I had no idea smokeless rounds were used so early, though it makes sense since gun cotton was invented in the 1840s. Surprised it took until 1886 for it to become mainstream.

keep it alive my friend that i have never met

How do you make these gun cotton cartridges? U should do a whole process of making them like how Von lenk mae them

Man, that's pretty ballsey, but you are a big boy and are responsible. I know you probably can't/won't say, but is that homemade nitrocellulose?

id like to see more of this... i want to know if it can be used in revolvers, can it replace black powder if need be? I HAVE SO MANY QUESTIONS NOW!

Fascinating. What if…you bound the charge with thin nitrated paper or thread?

Good video

Absolutely splendid Bret! Hope you can refine this cartridge and show how perhaps accuracy can be, if at all, synched up a bit? And when you make a batch of these cartridges, do you need to employ extra safety precautions in storing them, or is it a case of making a small batch, and shooting them fairly quickly?

I want to do this now for my Remington 1863 contract rifle

As a native Pennsylvanian lost in the dry mountains of New Mexico, my eyes almost wept at the greeness of your mountain.

Cordite, or raw guncotton burns very hot according to British sources I've read, and that looks like an origional gun. You might look into this, because that is old steel and probably very valuable because I've never even seen one of those rifles before except in old phorographs.

True historical data

I hear the Kaizerhymn too😮

Now you've got me wanting to make something like that for my 1858 Remington repro -- except the nipple is right where the stick would have to go, and I don't think the stick would/could be tight enough to hold #6 against the recoil of #1 through #5.

Wow never seen this before

If a barrel explosion of the antique gun is possible due to potential user error (eg ramming the gun cotton), then I wonder if it is more advisable to wear greater eye protection while firing.

Wow, every day is a school day. I’ve heard of gun cotton but never seen that type of load.

wow.. fantastic..

That's so fucking cool dude!!!!

Die Bratwurst ist so vergänglich wie eine Welle im Meer oder zwei Kirschen Blüten im Wind, das lächeln deiner liebsten im Sonnenschein darum nie den Senf vergessen zur Bratwurst!

I have a wesley Richards monkey tail rifle … one of the Portuguese contract rifles… how about a video on making cartridges for those??

I really want a video on how exactly you made the gun cotton and how the cartridges are made? Obviously this wouldn’t be RU-vid legal (what is???). However I think it’s definitely something I’d love to try. I have a modern optima V2 pistol rated for 150 grains of black powder. I think it we’ve fun to try some gun cotton (very small carefully measured amounts). How about getting a proper performance cartridge??? I’m confident you could sell those things (for modern reproductions). I think smokeless muzzleloaders are underrated. The issue normally with smokeless in a muzzleloader is getting a consistent seating depth. The cartridge removes this issue entirely and it seems it would be safe enough for modern reproductions (maybe even some antiques)??? Anyways you have a hugely underrated channel yourself!!! Seriously keep it up!!!

Very cool... However, how do you shoot at targets below you? Won't the cartridge just fall out?

People, in general, were not aware that, during some ten years, half a dozen experiments on a large scale had been tried in the French army, each of which had no sooner been thought worthy of adoption, before another was introduced; and that, even at the present day, the Minié is but little used, owing to a previous pattern having been largely circulated. It is also most probable that the Prussians would never have adopted their needle-gun had they thought that so perfect a weapon as the present rifle would so soon have made its appearance. The Rifle-musket: A Practical Treatise on the Enfield-Pritchett Rifle ... By Henry Jervis-White-Jervis

It would be interesting to see how a gun cotton load would work in a modern Inline muzzeloader with the same setup. A majority of modern Inlines are rated to take up to 150gr of black powder (pyrodex pellets) substitute. They utilize a shotgun primer and sabot. The trick would be not to compress the load. It would be a challenge to ram it home because a sabot is a tight fit. Said load can't be compressed.

Brett, would the Pedersoli Lorenz repro work with your bullet-on-a-stick? I ask, coz they appear t be very solid guns, and perhaps with the breach plug pulled and drilled for the stick, you could up your power and truly test this awesomeness. Your thoughts please. Great video, cheers, Gus

It's crazy how the sound and recall is so low 😯

Awesome. I have to believe that even with “perfectly straight” Austrian ammo double loading is going to be a thing with a company or battalion firing all at once and no ramrods?

Oh, so you did a gun cotton, no tear cartridge. Very good. Again windage is poor but elevation and range is pretty good. That's what matters in opposed infantry fire.

Ze Kaiser woud be smilink...

Is this stuff non corrosive? And safe for originals and maybe a 75 caliber Brown Bess smoothbore repro? Have an original 1860 Type 2 Lorenz myself.

So it's a loose fit and that is how the catridge slide to the breech easily?

Very neat Brett. What does the smoke smell like?

Were there any problems with shooting the gun cotton cartridges in a barrels made for black powder when they were testing the original cartridges? Any blown up barrels?

This video is a month old now. Hopefully new enough that you can get back to me. With a bullet/cartridge so loose that it literally falls to the breech, am I correct in assuming that the charge expanded the bullet tight in the barrel? I'll look for these cartridges on your website as well and I can Google stuff. Just amazing to me that it can expand enough to be a viable accurate shot. Thank you in advance for your time reading my question and also creating all of your fascinating content.

How did you determine the thread diameter and density of weave to use? Where’s your guncotton sourced from?

02:22 Sir thank you for sharing this piece of information with us! It makes so much more sense now! While ppl usualy drone about how fast and wunderbar was Dreyse needlegun it completely makes sense why the Austrian militär did not update its Infanterie Gewehr Lorenz as it was going to get the update in amunition and speed of reload all the while they could keep the same gun and thus same drill for already trained troops of regular army and also Landwehr! This is blast of information, IF they could pull this one of the famous Battle of Königgratz would unfold very differently for sure (by the way it is best preserved historical battlefield on this planet, go visit, reserve several days so you cannot miss anything preserved from that Duel of the Fates that decided future development of Europe to this very day). Awesome work Shame they did not pull it off and solve the pickle with guncotton. Gott erhalte! +][+

I hope Ian sees this.

I'm seriously confused.... Why wasn't this main streamed? This seems ingenious!

Interestingly, if you were on the battlefield, would you choose this super slow-firing gun or use a bow and arrow?

i like the music 😂

I wonder if modern chemistry can find a more stable active ingredient for guncotton. It would be really nice to have a somewhat clean burning propellant with similar pressures to black powder. But then again, aside from hunters and enthusiasts there's not much incentive/demand for a product like that.

This would have been devastating if put into a breach loader

If you drill a hole the diameter of that stick through a piece of wood of a thickness equal to length of it, then countersink a hole the diameter of the bullet, you might be able to get seat those pegs straight.

Were the shots flying higher than usual for a Lorenze? at 70% charge is the velocity noticeably increased?

Did they have issues with this cartridge in damp conditions?

Hello from Sweden 🇸🇪

The Cartridge should have a small Disk attached to the Top of the bullet.