Lightsmith CD reduction not working with all spenders, for now Herald is much better. I like party buffing and absorbs from lightsmith, we will see but for now Herald is much fun to use and look at 😉
Lighsmith would be my preferred choice but its currently undertuned compared to Herald. Also interacts with infusions which doesnt really mesh well with Melee Hpal. But I just love the concept of giving shields and buffs while still beaing a healer and mitigating lots of damage.
I saw the rework I was on the beta test, I was telling the forums and the discord that this would happen based on the rework they said “nothing wrong with casting” and we should encourage the casting playstyle. Never felt so vindicated when i saw everyone hating on it.
I hate how holy paladin became a HOT healer. Its basically just a worse mistweaver right now. I want to go back to chunking healthbars with Word of Glory/maraads empowered light of the martyr and managing holy power instead of holy shock spam
Agreed, wods haven’t felt good and chunky since shadowlands, and those phat lotm spot heals felt great too, not a fan of glimmer healing tbh, liked it more as an offensive
There's no internal struggle at all. The spec for the longest time had 1 big CD and it was wings. Then DF turned us into circus clowns juggling CDs constantly and devalued Holy Power so much by both flooding us with it and nerfing spenders so bad that you only want to spend them when you have 2 stacks of Dawn. The spec is fundamentally broken. It's got a mandatory class capstone talent that goes against the builder-spender philosophy. It's got no real choices to make in the spec tree since you can get all the CDs without any cost. The way the spec is designed it is binary: it's either broken or unplayable. There's so many, many multipliers that stack on top of each other and that are definitely not fun to play around like Dusk & Dawn and Strength of Conviction. There's so many minuscule effects trickling healing all the time, which goes against what Holy Paladin has stood for for the longest time. There's no internal struggle at all. The spec needs to have its toxic talents removed, it's resource flooding looked at very hard and more, many more spec talents introduced to create clear separation between caster and melee builds. Oh and also fuck active mana management. And Daybreak isn't an active mana management tool at all. Give us more mana sustain talents so we can fine tune how much mana we need. Give us trinkets for mana sustain.
Blizz "lets make mana management a thing" = healers going oom --> taking unfun but mana efficient talents, mana potion. Why there is talent tree with this philosophy, or funny potion if you will need to use mana one. Good example is caster build on 10.2.7, why we play on it?
Thanks Mad for bringing this up in its own video. For me the state Hpal was concerning and has been for about 2 seasons now. Yesterday we received a substantial spender buff and Herald/Tyrs nerf. While this is a step in the right direction, spenders are still not in like with how much a holy Light heals for example. And cost too much. Holy shock does nothing other than givinng DR and Holy power, even with light of thr Martyr. This translate into weaker Divine tolls and Daybreak. Mana is still a concern when you really depene on just your base spells to heal. Button bloat is our biggest issue right now.
I want to go back to the melee pally days myself. Not really into hard casting paladin. This weird mix does not work for me. There are plenty of ranged healers already.
Eh, i dont feel like the devs themselves know where to go with holy paladin now, that's why it is some half ass melee restoration druid/worse version of mistweaver. Peak holy paladin was bfa sadge
I want them to get rid of glimmer and stuff like divine toll and daybreak, and buff HS insanely, as well as WoG and LoD. Glimmer and related stuff was fun for a while, but its evident that they just take away from the power of the HS, making it feel terrible.
@@MrGMottas I hate glimmer also, but I kind of like Devine toll... The reason is that, Holly pala does not have to many AOE heals... Yes, LoD is nice but it has a major limitation: you need to cast it into a cone, in front of you which makes it hard to use when people are spread apart. DT brings an additional AoE heal/dps and gives you 5HP which opens up an imediate LoD or using any othe HP spender...
@@alinmeleandra3175 i think the dmg patterns in legion were also better to heal and to react to. In today's healing we are so strong (healers) that we are relying on aoe small heals and stuff to "snipe" and keep all raid 100% too
Get rid of divine toll and replace it with shadowlands divine toll, and go back to making glimmer offensive based and not healing based, and bring back shadowlands wogs and hpally would feel a lot better
The direction they've headed with dynamic spells is exactly what I've wanted for years. Do something to one target and get a different result if you do it to a friendly unit etc etc. Or dynamically switching spells based on buffs etc, this is exactly what I wanted. I love the direction it's going.
I'd take H pal losing some buttons/ CD power if it meant we got stronger healing on our Holy shock and Holy power spenders. Caster variant of H pal feels awkward to play due to our spenders being weak and all our power in casting. i Think Blizz just needs to take one direction with H pal and just improve that version of it rather its a instant cast variant or caster but playing in between both just makes the class feel useless in certain places.
That's the point, just take mele or caster and focus on it, we will stay or change main Class to play. If they start again changing from mele to caster from patch to pach i will be frustrated as hell.
I started playing my MW in beta with Conduit of the Celestials and it easily heals like 30% more than my Hpal. Its crazy the difference of how much they button heals compared to ours. WoG, Holy Shock, LoD, DT, DB, all are a joke right now.
Maybe bring exorcism back, would gives the player a way to choose between melee and ranged themselves. For m+ blizz could make a talent that would make exorcism's damage splash onto nearby enemies? Just a thought
Hard caster with HL will be only waste od time and mana if other healers will spam AoE and instant casts. I dont see hard cast direct heals in raid with other healers doing It faster, better and with lower mana cost. And mana that's is another problem, they changed infusion reduction cost on FoL from 70% to 30%. All have hipe on Hero talents but our problem from retail are still here. People will Play that talent that will be reactive and efficient, 2sec hard cast in raid is 3 instants from other healers. Mana management now is like punisment for fun talents and enjoy play.
You can thank all the fotm rerollers in season 2 dragonflight for that. Holy paladin from vanilla until dragonflight season 3 nerf patch never went oom. There was a few patches in between but the next patch after it was right back to never going out of mana.
Like, Pally seemed like their hps can get to 3-600k with cooldowns. Which is e ought to keep people alive no problem... but Resto shammy is able to do those numbers as their baseline and with cds shoots into like 1.5 mil hps :s hopefully just a number tuning issue.
Do we going back to old problem with paly healing only on wings? Circle is complete :DF start mele heal only on wings, lets make wings uptime more, to much overheal (cry baby from legion on caster build) redising to shokadin, its to op lets nerf it. Hey lets make mana important and hardcasting more powerfull (but pally its mele) no mater lets change it, abbomination is born casto-mele monster weak on all aspekts. New expansion: lets make burst healing on wings.
Give choice nodes that enable people to pick a playstyle. For me Holy Shock and SOTR is GOAT. Give me buttons that make Holy shock/SOTR better. Let me buff Holy shock, WoG and STOR by choosing talents that make that happen and have those choices remove hard casts for me. Alternatively give people who want to be more ranged a damage spell and remove holy shock but give them a hard cast button which maybe has a shortened cast time.
I am actually enjoying holy pala no matter what. The only thing i really want them to reduce is the mana cost on literally anything. The play style should benefit from stacking haste, but you literally can't, because you will run out of mana on longer fights, unless you play a caster build.
After play some time on Beta i see that blizz is on the same position like on retal. They dont know what to do with holy, they dont know what to do with healer spec on all classes. Mana managment, hard cast powerful spells, dps, suport for others, mechanics for healers. All is stacking and make danger to fall. They have hard moments and time is ticking, raid testing, duneons testing, class balans in 2 month. Rollercoater is coming for fist season for healers.
That's one of the issues right now with fistweaver imo. Since there are no talents to increase range of abilities if you can't do damage means you're stuck casting stuff and singlet target healing is fine but aoe is awful. Being melee on this game is sadly a disadvantage.
Thanks Mad. Amazing! I will play Holy Paladin no matter what. it's my favorite healer and I play it in the goods and the bads. Can you share that weakaura that has Holy Bulkward? you addons look amazing and clean for beta.
I like the idea of lightsmith but after testing all healers, I found paladin (both specs) had a hard time keeping health meters topped off. :( outside of cooldowns that is.
After more testing, lightsmith is become hard to quantify.. I just realized how much insane damage++ my sword was giving to the groups rogues overall damage... it was 10% of his overall dungeon dps... it was more than his actual melee lol. Bladeflurry seems to proc the sword's holy damage... his dos added to my own as well as the random armaments to others put my overall dps at 290kdps for the whole dungeon... which is way higher than I originally thought looking at my own damage numbers.
Yesterdays tuning changes were nice, decent buff to spenders and our damage. lets hope they keep going that direction and we might be back. lightsmith is painfully boring but maybe the defacto M+ hero tree with the fat shield, especially if it continues to scale with gear. holy bulwark, barrier of faith, and sac. suddenly 4 people arent taking much damage. herald def more fun tho
Bring back instant cast paladin and hardcast paladin. Hardcast - Bring back some kind of killing machine system for holy light. Every holy light crit gives you an instant holy light. Combined with baecon of virtue this is very rewarding. Make it so that holy light actually heals again! And maybe add some ability that makes a holy light cast speed up after you cast holy light. Make infusion of light important again and boom u got casting hpalla. ( Which i would love to have back ) Instant cast melee paladin is avenging crusader paladin. Make shield of righteous another ability that can be used with a 2hander and make it a dmg ability that heals. Outside of your wings you use word of glory to heal. Consecration could be a passive aoe heal like healing rain. Lots of healing from glimmer as well so you dont have to keep up baecon of virtue Tuning can be done after that to give them benefit in different situations but as equal as possible in numbers.
Hate how they added good spells in the same talent points, like aoe heals or tank bubbles. Make light Smith just a passive thing, not a casting buff and moves to DPS or bubble
I truly dont understand the confusion over hpal being melee v. Range- I find moving between the two to be really engaging. Finding the the position to hard cast and not lose out on mastery while also dipping into melee to build hpower faster. If blizz where to lock hpal into range or melee it would feel much clunkier and lose a huge fantasy aspect of being a priestly warrior. I guess if your someone who is exclusively interested in min/maxxing your output picking one of the two would make it easier, but I dont want easier I want FUN.
It is so so disappointing that holy shock does not heal at this point. We have two months for changes,but at this point I m ready to respec to prot paladin😢
True, for now its look like shadowlands start. Good that we have 2 other spec, but holy perspective is on bad position if you compare to other healers. Dont be owerhipe to Hero talents, other healers have them to.
Blizzard just needs to make two separate healing specs for paladins. For whatever reason they're afraid to do it. I'm a fan of hard casting, but I come from the days of TBC holy paladin and my favorite time was Wotlk, so I was "grown" in that time.
For some reason, Blizzard decided to nerf their base kit. I know its beta and things can change but It is not a good sign when they are nerfing Holy Shock cooldown
I really wanted Lightsmith to change consecration into a toned down Ashen Hallow and have a lot of cool interactions. AC Herald has felt the best to me.
Honestly, would love if they just created two separate specs for holy paladin. Crusader (or anything of the like) - focused on healing through damage. Also 2handed paladin making a comeback would be sick. Faith-Bringer (idk lol) - casted ranged healing (with some instant cast of course, like WOG). As many have said in these comments and on forums, there's too many buttons. But it's not necessarily the buttons that's causing all the problems. It's the amount of passive healing paladin brings to the table, which means are spenders can't hit as hard or else we become too Op like season 2. I would rather paladin not be a HOT class, such as druid. The instant cast and melee gameplay prior to rework felt both more fun and more engaging (it had it's cons of course). Just my fantasy take on paladin, but I see paladin as a plate wearing crusader of light, jumping into the frontlines of a battlefield, whose very attacks rain down sparks of light from the heavens and onto friends and foes alike.
Ehhh dreams to be like dudu, 4 spec Class. It will be like prist, one spec will be trash but other good :) Mage is a good example one spec is OP one is mehh ok, one total trash, all on rotation in patches. Always one is "fun"
Hpal will get a rework in season 2.5 8n TWW, will be totally OP again and will ge4 nerfed to the ground again... -.- How is it not seen, that HPal is zero fun to 9lay right now? Get rid of the hard casts and rix the melee healer. Right now holy priest feels faster and has more instant casts as range than we do on HPal
I am moving over from Druid healing for tww. I have tried all of the other healers to see which I like better. I passed up with shaman and holy because it’s boring and slow. I actually like the speed of current holy. But I agree, there are too many buttons and what seems like less effect.
Come to pally organisation, you will have soo much "fun" right now. You will use keyboard like piano and on end you be behind other healers. But sometimes you will shine! (when other healer fuck up hard and die)
While I loved your coverage in this video, the whole spec is bumming me out atm. If I wanted to play an aug I'd play an aug so smith doesn't interest me much. I am not a huge fan of holy paladin right now in beta and it has been my main since BC. Mostly for this iteration, I don't really enjoy resto druid gameplay or HOT effects. Because I've always sucked at it, my mind sees damage and it wants to heal damage in an instant kind of interaction. It doesn't feel great to me, it feels like they stuck it in between a melee and caster and it doesn't really know what it is anymore. There is a lot of this buffs that, to buff this, and could buff this, so track this, this, this.... man just let me heal!!!
I should probably also say I have watched your videos on resto druid and man I wish I could play it as well as you make it look easy. Only thing I can do on a druid is feral.
All fine with wanting to hardcast holy spells, but people who prefer that: plz just play hpriest then. Never understood that take, I wont go and play an rsham and then complain that I cant heal through meleeattacks.
On the start of DF all healers have spots(mele, range, hoters, buffers, AoE, morę spot healing) then reworks started but not in spots where was healers and pll chosen to start. They changing all concepts so ppl was forced to change classes. If that is not a plan of blizz to jump ppl on classes every half patch i dont understand that philosophy of hard changes on middle of expansion.
I feel that Blizzard can't really make up their mind where the spec is moving, either make it fully melee healer (maybe ranged in raids like monk?) Or make it more like the old days. Also Blizzard gatta make some internal button bloat allert. X amount of buttons to press should have some sorta cap. Also all instant cast would cause some pvp issues I reckon due to not being interuptrable. What playstyle would you guys prefer if you gatta choose? Melee or full ranged and hardcasts?
That is why ppl are so frustrated, they change philosophy from patch to patch. When you whant mele heal you take that healer if range take other, on paly you take mele healer, then is pach and your playstile is in trash and you are forsed to caster build. And the beat is that from start paly tree was created with minds od mele (mastery, instants, spenders) and then making mess there and we are here, mele healer standing close to tank hardcasting FoL and HL. How they thing they go with it, to DPS we need mele range, healing is casts? On this moment Holy is not hybrid build, its abbomination of 2 philosophy (Professor Putricide love it)
I find Infusion of Light to be terrible, and I can't understand why Blizzard insists on it. While it feels powerful when casting Holy Light, it completely disrupts the flow you had at that moment. Imagine you're having the time of your life, dancing on cocaine with a hot chick in a loud and busy club, and every 60 seconds or so, everything stops and you find yourself in a quiet, empty library for a few seconds. That's the moment you're actually casting... It feels really awful... It simply kills my boner........................ I try as much as possible not to cast anything, but sometimes you're simply forced to cast or people simply die... Terrible design. I personally believe that Infusion of Light, mastery, beacons, and glimmers are the bane of Holy Paladin, and the reason for the balancing issues we are currently facing (like how many multipliers do you need until it is to much, Mr. Blizzard???????????)
Paladin: "Priest turned warrior" which wears plate armor and melee weapons... You need to be special to think that someone with a big sword should spend time casting healing abilities... The special flowers that like hard-casting should switch to priest since its the next best thing (from holy use point of view)... If melee Pala with instant casts is not viable, I am not going to play pala.... and since I don't have time to play anything else nor do I want to change class, most likely I will not return to the game...
It is also warriors turned priests. Literally you are not actually looking at this you are looking at what benefit your opinion not what is actually the case
@@havtor007 Well, 1) I am too old to change game style for my pala every other patch.... After 10 years of this and it becomes annoying as hell... 2) Lore wise, melee is the only game play that makes sense for this class... 3) Pala is not known for it good mobility... If the game considers pala as a melee class then you need to play very carefully if you need to be in melee but also hard-cast... If you don't want to stay in melee range, than in some fight you might trigger boss abilities on the "range group". Which you either force you to move (and lose a shit tone HPS) or have everyone else move which is worst... 4) Holly power was/is a cool power type. I do not want it to be remover or be changed between holly, Ret and Prot... If Holly power is present it should be important (like runes for DKs, or combo-points for rogues)... If holly power stays in the game and you need things like crusader strike to build up HP, than not staying in melee would just make things harder..
@@havtor007The lore says that you’re wrong. Paladins are warrior-priests, so, they either were priests who learned martial fighting, or warriors who received the Light and augment their martial prowess with it. The whole concept is a warrior that uses the light…hence why they are distinct from Priests.
@@SireVV And correct you can be a priest or a warrior before you become a paladin. (Hint you are agreeing with me) Then we have that this lore ONLY apply to humans and dwarfs. Every single other race has different lore apply.
@@alinmeleandra3175 on 1 welcome to paladin it always changes. It has however been ranged for a longer time in wows history then it has been melee. 2 Here you are just wrong. Lore wise paladin is many different things. And also remember you have ret and prot as part of the kit also. 3 Lore wise paladin is Literally mounted all the time so mobility is lore wise massive. Paladin became considered as melee in legion before that point it was considered a range this is just a semantic thing that can change instantly. 4 Holy power has not really been strong for expansions. BFA when the "melee" playstyle started in the middle of the expansion was just Glimmer so it was just Holy shock spam. The so called melee playstyle literally has nothing to do with holy power abilities in the first place. You can have WoG be strong and still be ranged.
i honestly have been loving holy paladin on beta. if it goes live similar to current beta iteration ill probably make it main healer or main healer alt. TWW holy paladin feels great compared to other healers. TWW druid feels awful losing two of its best spells. Monk we will see as they balance it... I honestly dont feel like other healers feel better at all..
Its look like Blizzard is pushing one philosophy (mana management, hard long time cast, weak healing) to all healers. Hope it will again end with lack of healers because od unfun play so they AGIN change philosophy. I thing they have push healers to wall and now dont know what to do to make it fun role. There was first sign where ppl have fun to do mythic plus with no healers (prot paly before mana nerfs) now dudu changing spec with going on and out of dungeon. And they pushing it farward. I like times when healers have way to regenerate mana active with loose healing to burst/Burn/heal on right moment, now you have bucket of mana and we stoping our toolkit to survive with mana to end of fight (do nothing interesting to not OOM on 2min). Ppl looking mana trinkets ewerywhere, mana efficient talents and blizz nerfing them one by one with no seeing what they whant and like.
The nerf to rebuke range is beyond stupid. Why remove a talent that has nearly 100% pickrate for M+? Nerf DK & DH interrupt range too if you want melee to be melee.
I hate the changes to holy Paladin I loved this class in BFA and shadow lands. It was actually my main healer during those. I abandoned it during dragonflight though I did try it after the rework and hated it
If you look on forums to read what ppl whant i will end like this. Dont forget about hard cast mana management "philosophy" of Blizzard. Its a recipe for interesting start of expansion, its not first time when healers was ragequiting because of unfun play stile.
holy paladin is just too bloated with abilities. everytime they try to rework stuff within the talent trees it somehow ends up feeling more annoying to play. if they can combine some of the talents/abilities the spec would probably feel much better. but currently, when i play holy paladin it feels like a chore and i realize that i would rather play any of the other healers
Casting a long cast in melee when you have to dodge 600+ things on the ground yeah GL with that. All healers are range and you want holy pala to be range too... cmon Blizz it's not 2008 with HC dungeons you are in 2024 with m+ dungeons. If you want to cast go play holy priest wtf are you doing with holy palas blizz. We have 1 hand weapon and shield we have to fight not like priest with wand and book. If i want to play with wand and book i will play holy priest. Do not ruin holy pala to please those range lovers paladins. Paladin is fighter class not staying in backyard and casting spells.
2sec casts on mythic mechanics, runing from fire , bombs detonating and other healers pumping healing, it will end with 70% overhealing. Times when you have 4-5sec easy standing in place have pass long time ago, game is much faster and intensive. If they buff HL 500% will not change how end content is created, wrak auras and other addons push Blizzard to more complex mehaniks
@@ryszard7669I have mained holy priest in Season 3 I had to cast a lot. If you can’t precast you might as well reroll to dps. Maybe bm or ret is more suitable. Doesn’t mean paladin isn’t underperforming but the holy light buffs are good since paladin has some problems with faster spothealing without using a cd. But good for a internet hero to say mimimi before they had played the buff.
Blizz shouldn't be tagging hpal as a melee healer and trying to cater to hard casting hpal imo. It hasnt been a melee healer in a long time imo. Pointless callling it that. Hpal doesnt have an identity atm i feel and it sure as shit isnt a melee healer anymore.
They make mele healer nice, fun and active (pl cry to caster) they make shokadin (pl cry to hard caster) blizz make this "thing" what is now (people blame mele concept and cry to hard caster). TWW start and holy is hard caster with all the nerfs on HS, spenders, holy power etc. (Hard caster cry to talents). Finale holy is HL spamer with one beacon (OMG Extasy, now we are in home) Hey why we are overhealing? , cant survive AoE on mythic plus? why our healing is so slow when there is dot tiking for 80% HP every 1,5sec? Boss is runing, ewerythin explode, how to cast in this?Hey there is 4 spots for healers but they pref prist/monk/dudu/evoker ewen. shammy, WTH blizz!!!
The holy rework was good we have no button bloat if we ignore the stupid dps buttons. They just need to power up our hard casts, and lessen the holy shock spam.
Do away with healers dpsing to heal or altogether. Spamming dps attacks just so you can use a healing spell is ignorant and lazy by blizzard. I know they made holy Paladin for the lazy macro users, but it obviously isn't working for 70-80% of the player base.
I’d like blizz to ask the community to vote for melee or range And I hope 99% rather like melee Also I prefer when we have no hots only raw healing spells
@@alinmeleandra3175 because that's how it always have been? You know casting while turning the pages of a holy book. I always liked that aesthetic. I lost interest in holy paladin when had to spam crusader strike and fish for holy power
