#darksouls #demon #chaos An admittedly rambly video about why the demons are almost all gone by the events of dark souls 3 and who or what might be behind this mysterious extinction
Im actually surprised some gaming studio hasnt made a souls-like where you're a caveman and have to fight dinosaurs or sabre tooth cats n whatnot, it would probably be better than lords of the fallen
@@TheHonoredMadman _"In the Age of Ancients the world was primal, shrouded by the untamed wilderness. A land of nature, dinosaurs, and bigass fuckin' bugs. In this far past, there is only unga bunga strength build..."_ Seriously, that's a pretty good idea though. Weird that I haven't seen something like it now that you mention it, yeah. Even if "better than lords of the fallen" isn't a particularly high bar to clear. Perhaps in that game, _you_ light the first flame. Because no one has invented fire before lol
Black Knights are just built differently , they can go forever . Look at that champ still swinging away in the catacombs , that dudes gotta be a couple thousand years old
@@wanred61 I would like to think that the armors were always empty, and what moved them was a fragment of Gwyn's soul(or Gwyn's soul itself). They were born with him after all. So I always thought that they were like puppets at his service instead of individual knights.
@@InuzumiLikely. The physical form of the black knights was destroyed in the war with Izalith. That’s why black knights don’t leave a corpse behind in DS1, or any game.
Even if the demons can exist without a chaos flame it might be necessary for them to reproduce, so with you having destroyed the bed of Chaos in one, and Ivory king and his men having purged the old chaos before 2 then the issue is just that there could be no new chaos demons. Also that demon looks to me to be made of compressed ash rather than rock.
honestly i think it would have been cool if you could go to the remains of his kingdom and found some civilized demons who similar to his wife overcame their nature and seek to be better with him as an example
i love that he refers to balrog early in the video but then calls him "that fire thing" when talking about the lord of the rings version of him LMAO. sick video though i really enjoyed
You say Gwyn sent his black knights to deal with them. I'm pretty sure that's wrong and it was his Silver knights Gwyn sent as there were no Black Knights then. Black Knights were the Silver Knights that followed Gwyn into the Kiln to reignite the First Flame, scorching and twisting their shiny silver armour into the black armour of the Black Knights.
Think the black knights were the silver knights that were sent to deal with demons, but their armor got twisted by the chaos flame, which is why it looks physically different like it kinda got ran through a hot topic filter. The knights that followed Gwyn to the kiln got incinerated inside their armor and their souls became sorta bound to the armor. If am not mistaken.
@@stinkybean5 That sounds right but then they still wouldn't be Black Knights when Gwyn first sent them, but Silver Knights. Black Knights being the veterans of the Demon war makes sense to me though
The knights that went to fight the demons were scorched by the chaosflame and their armor melted and warped. The black knights in the kiln are incidental, they probably got scorched while they were down their with him. Both theories are right
Black Knights are both silver knights that went with Gwyn to the kiln as well as silver knights who were sent to hunt demons. Hence why their armor has been blackened.
Yeah for some reason i neglected to mention that all black knights were once silver knights but as the others have said the demon crusades had a lasting effect on the armor, as for the ones that followed gwyn into the kiln, they may have already been charred in the demon war or were a separate group of silver knights that got charred nit by the chaos but the true firstflame. I like to think there were veterans of the chaos war whos armor was burnt but then they followed gwyn into the pit and had their bodies burnt as well, leaving only the spirits behind possessing the armor
It’s likely when izalith died the flame of chaos started to slowly die and anything that was created by it lost the flames that gave their bodies form to the point where there’s only embers left.🤔🐱
The corruption that the Ivory King felt in his soul was not that of the Chaos, it was the corruption of his Wife, although she was good unlike her sisters, she was still a child of the abyss
correction, she WAS evil, and then he went "ya i know what you are and why your here, im going to show you unconditional love anyway" and thats what made her good, dude just pulled out the anime power of love shit and i love it
History does not repeat; it rhymes. This is what I can firmly say when it comes to demonkind. That said, there's alot more to think about: The first thing we should examine closely is the logic behind the Chaos Flame, or rather, the logic behind Flame in general. What was the Witch thinking when she did it? And why are her ideas so prone to repeating in vacuum? When the First Flame came, it imposed something upon the world. That something is what we call " Disparity".In this process, it didn't quite create the world; it imposed different meanings upon an existence that was formerly unified. It categorised, split,defined and redefined everything it could touch; it forced everything into separate but coherent things. It induced consciousness into other beings not through merely giving them souls, but by forcing them apart,imbuing them with a strange vitality,foreign to their world of stillness. The Dark is indistinct; Light reveals all. Whether that is desired is another matter. By this notion, it can be inferred that the First Flame, by some token, possesses a will of it's own. This will is what imposes Disparity. Therefore,the key to understanding and therefore repeating the event that created the First Flame is to discover how to grant Fire it's own will; a will that can provide it with the same power the First Flame possesses by nature. The Chaos Flame was the first attempt to apply this logic; to grant a Flame it's own will, using the power of a soul. By doing this, the Witch Of Izalith could not only replace the original Flame,but come to understand the essence of existence in and of itself...... So, what went wrong? The reason the Chaos Flame appears so random in it's creations is simple; it is an attempt at imitating the First Flame. An attempt at achieving power over Disparity. Due to it's imperfect, parasitic nature, it failed at doing so; it could only jumble together random aspects within Disparity as it changed or created new lifeforms. The head of a bull,covered in the carapace of insects, situated over the body of a behemoth. A centipede with a shark's mouth,spitting poison,bigger than a house.Indeed,this is why they're called "Demons"; twisted mockeries of Disparity itself. "The Guardian exhibited traits of several animals other than lions, suggesting that it was no ordinary beast, but rather closer to the beings known as Demons." This is why beings other than Chaos Demons can adopt the moniker; all they need is to be unnatural according to the laws of Disparity, as dictated by the will of the First Flame. That is what they all share. I believe Eygil's Idol is termed so due to being made by him; I doubt his king would have so much affection for him so as to make him a monument this large. Moreover: "An ornamental helm commissioned by the Old Iron King. An awkwardly repurposed iron ornament, and as such, remains a stuffy, heavy thing. Wearing it gives one the sensation of being smothered in iron." Now, it could've been fashioned to honor Eygil himself, but once again, I doubt it. Bull decorations are far too ubiquitous throughout both the Iron Keep and Brume Tower; if Eygil had this many images in his likeness, he might as well be the King! The only other explanation would be that the bulls were symbolic of the King himself, and as such, represent him. Plenty of kings did it before; made them seem larger than life, or "ineffable" as they say. As such, I don't believe Eygil to be a demon, and even if he was, I believe his service to the Iron King was sincere; he is the only follower of the King explicitly termed as "loyal". That said, it is also likely he led his king to his doom, though not by his own will. I believe he created both of the Smelter Demons; his job description is that of a " magus'; not just a pyromancer,even though it was his principle obsession. Most sorcerers in Drangleic and Melfia seem to know both as a matter of course, with more ancient examples including the Leydia Pyromancers, Straid,and Eygil himself. But if so, what happened? Why did Eygil fail? What went wrong with his Demons, and his Majesty? "Pyromancy created by the magus Eygil, loyal follower of the Old Iron King. Creates several pillars of flame in front of the caster. Eygil sought to grant fire a will of its own. This pyromancy was conjured up to behave like a snake, writhing toward its prey, with a mind to strike." "Pyromancy created by the magus Eygil, loyal follower of the Old Iron King. Cast flame in a sweeping motion across a targeted area. The fire seems to dance, and makes its victims dance with it." The second one, Dance Of Fire, is suspicious, in a way; it casts dark flames, resembling those of Nadalia's pyromancies. But why? Remember when I asked why the Chaos Flame failed? "Be it sorcery or pyromancy, all techniques that infringe on humanity lead to the same place. That is to say, they all seek a will of their own." Here's the thing: All this time,we've been talking about how the Flame has a will, and how we need to grant the fire we make a will to succeed it. But the question is, how can that even be done? The Izalith Catalyst is surprisngly effective with Dark sorceries, don't you think? Do you see it now? "The Dark is the mother of all; all things were born in it" As I said before, the Flame didn't precisely "create" the universe; it divided what was already there. This division includes itself,and that which birthed it. The Flame is Light,rebelling against the Dark... But where was the Flame born? How did it gain it's own will? That is the question Eygil , and the Witch before him, attempted to answer. In doing so, they meddled with forces beyond their ken. You may be guessing where I'm going with this; Eygil is the Lost Sinner. I don't believe the Lost Sinner created the Old Chaos; as it's name implies, the Old Chaos is not a mere derivative of the Chaos Flame; it is the original Chaos Flame. The old one. As for how it is here in Drangleic, remember that things like the First Flame do not possess a specific location,but rather, collect at certain nodes of influence(bonfires). The same applies in some ways to Chaos; the portal system from which the Ivory King and his soldiers emerge is the node of influence,connecting back to Lost Izalith, like bonfires connected to one another. The Chaos Flame surrounds it, too volatile to stay put. I agree with the notion that the Ivory King helped massacre the demons of Chaos; in fact, I believe this portal system was essential for him to reach them. This is also why I firmly believe it to be the actual Chaos Flame, far from home. That leaves the question: What did the Lost Sinner do? Answer: attempt creating their own flame; granting fire it's own will. Or as Shalquior says it, 'relight the First Flame". Repeat the event of it's birth. And before people mention the Lost Sinner being feminine, the Japanese terms them as " they". Coincidentally, one other character is also termed as "they" in other Japanese descriptions... Eygil. The doors keeping the Lost Sinner inside are the same as the ones in Iron Keep. This, along with their sheer guilt and the ambiguity shared by the Japanese item descriptions, leads me to believe they and Eygil are the same. (I'm rather suspicious that both of the Iron King's most skilled subordinates seem to have some aspect of Dark to them. Eygil's Dance Of Fire; Alonne's Bewitched sword,which can cast Dark Greatsword. Was Nadalia watching over her king from afar? Did either of them even know?)
I think the term "Demon" in Dark Souls just means a creation of a false God or a godless creation. The Demons in Izalith are Chaos Demons specifically, creations of the Flame of Chaos. Thats why there are many creatures which have nothing to do with Chaos but are still refered to as Demons.
Great video. I find the fact that the demons are a minor force in the world of Dark Souls so interesting. Like, they are this race that came out from a failure, influenced the world in a masive way and they are going extint without anyone capable of preventing it. Unless another crazy witch tries to make another flame I guess.
I wouldn´t call them minor force. Through pyromancy and by extent of Chaos, demons are part of one of the great four forces in the setting alongside humans, gods and dragons. Sentient mushrooms of Oolacile/Darkroot are minor force.
I like to think that the twin demons found the remnants of the demon prince's "flame" aka his soul after Lorian dealt with him and decided to share it between them to keep him alive that way, hence why they take turns in their berserk mode. They also might have been regular batwing demons and the soul caused them to power up but they could have been major batwing demons from the start.
I think demons are artificial lives made after the first flames but so the chaos flame just spat out life one whatever shape and the other gods picked out designs they like
Oh and only the first flame could “create life” so these demons are made of a finite resource (as the rebirthing of the first flame does. Thermodynamics and all that)
You’re easily my favorite channel to listen to. Your pacing is wonderful, not to fast, very easy to understand, etc. Keep it up! You’re doing fantastic
The creation of the chaos flame didnt immediately create the bed of chaos. Izalith had control over it for a time. She didnt become the Bed of Chaos until she fully succumbed to Chaos and embraced it.
What I love with DS, Bloodborne, ER, etc, is the artstyle. Fromsoft has never had the best graphics. Even ER comparing it to other games from that year its graphics are ok but nothing special but man the artsyle is always fantastic. Why artstyle is better than just nice graphics 👌
At the very least you could say the freezing of Eleum Loyce has stilfed the Old Chaos flame. The Old Ivory King and his Kingdom did screw those damnable creatures over.
@@Stephen-so9oi i don't like promoting other channels on other people's stuff. Idk if that's just me or what but yeah the one from yesterday about Quentyn
It’s funny to me that you mention the balrog from maple story but then later on refer to the “demon thing with a whip that gandelf fought” that my good sir is the true OG motha fuckin balrog lol
I'm always impressed with your content, my dude. I always love the Souls lore, but really respect you branching out to other topics and media you care about as well. Keep having great insights, and keep putting out great content that you are passionate about. Stay monotone and stay green homie!
While the flame of chaos dying didnt make the demons die outright, they are clearly weakened in its absence, and i suggest that they are mostly dying out because without the original flame of chaos no new demons can be born
I wonder if the Ghru eat the fungus growing out the giant demon corpses they seem to worship. If the fungus fed off of the dead demons, it could potentially contain the essence of the chaos within them and transfer it to the Ghru upon ingestion
Hmm, i don't know about the witch's children's spider legs being made of roots, but it definitely looks like spider legs are attached to the ends of some of the bed of chaos' roots, specifically the burning ones used for attacking you. It's certainly interesting that all of Izalith's family attained spider (legs in particular) related mutations 🤔 most of the demons seem to be arthropodic/insenctoid aside from those we tend to see _outside_ the izalith or blighttown regions (like capra demons, the asylum demon, those gargoyle guys, etc)
Always a good watch, the memories keep flooding back. Do you like Bloodborne and Sekiro? I don't mean to spread you too thin as you most likely have better or different topics to discuss, but I have a soft spot of the intense amount of effort that went into Sekiro. At first, it seemed like a solid action game with a hard but fair learning curve. But the devil is in the details with that game, I even noticed that the Lone Shadows are missing their left arm much like Sekiro himself. I could be wrong about this but I've only seen them fighting with their one arm swinging the sword and I've only seen them using that prostetic poison blade.
I deadass expected the man behind the death of the demons to just pop out with the DS1 protagonist-- also it's pretty likely, given how many of the entities born of the chaos flame are parasitic, that demons as a whole are a species of either parasitic, symbiotic, or otherwise a physical corruption of formerly not-demon things. While the Old Ivory King's knights and the Ghrus aren't explicit demons, what happened to them may have been something very similar to what happened to the original demons; the corruptive force of the Chaos Flame took hold of their bodies in their moment of weakness while exposed to the burning seedbed, whether that weakness be despair, or obliviousness.
Most demons were created from the controlled chaos flame. The spider sisters probably chose to only halfway mutate, as they kind of act/acted like emissaries with the outside world
Bruh I saw the thumbnail and thought it was about DOOM then read the title as such and thought “well no shit we got an angry af dude with no sense of mercy killing every daemon he sees!!” Then I was it was dark souls and went “yeah because a dude with a bucket on his head with no sense of mercy is killing every daemon he sees!!”
Pretty sure that though there was def conflict between Chaos Demons and Gywn, they had more or less come to an agreement or a pact by the time the player arrives and escapes the Asylum. Demons def do not seem to reproduce so they were fated to die out slowly. I think I’m the interest of self preservation these Demons made a deal to end whatever skirmish they had with the Gods. That’s why we sooo many of them in the beginning area’s. They serve both as protectors AND skill checks for the gods to weed out the weak in order to find and mold an undead into a suitable candidate to Link the flame once more.
I mean the Chaos flame was made , perhaps at the behest of Gywn, to prolong the age of fire. So the goal was the same right? It also seems clear that both the remaining sisters loved their forms (likely as much as her mother who embraced the chaos for her “people”). Everything that they did seemed to be out of love and self preservation. I mean even the Sees less Discharge bro is calm, despite the horrific pain he is in constantly. He only loses his shit when you steal from the grave of his beloved and presumed dead sister.
Absolutely not, the demons don’t want neither the dark lord, nor a new lord of cinder, because both would end up facing the Bed of Chaos, the only source of demon reproduction, by the time of DS3, the black knights are finishing off the remaining demons, there was no truce. This is also lost in the japanese translation, but, Izalith failed into creating a new flame due to her greedy ambitions, demons are parasites that infect their hosts and slowly change them in time, the “happiness” is purely artificial.
I don't think Titanite Demons were crafted by Blacksmith God. Item description says they arose from slabs after he passed. It sounds more like his abscence allowes them to achieve a form of life.
Gwyn didn’t send Black Knights. He sent Silver knights, who, upon battle with the demons, were charred black and are very likely just animated suits of armor. That’s why they don’t leave a corpse. I know, this conflicts with the lore the black knights were a result of being charred by the flame when Gwyn linked the fire. But since they all wield demon-slaying weaponry in the kiln and elsewhere, I believe the black knights were charred during the war with Izalith.
Because I never opened the gate to get to the covetous demon, mauldron doesn't open the gate for me. So i never had him do a Patches at me. The way you describe him and covetous demon's relationship reminds me of Patches with the Amygdala.
Demons, I think, just refer to unnaturally created life. Any construct that had achieved true life was a demon. Chaos demons are such unnatural life that was spawned by the Chaos flame. So anything born of the unchecked power of the Chaos flame is a chaos demon. As for the drider sisters I believe the human parts are a delibrate fabrication on their part. That is to say with thier skill they could reform their flesh to a degree to allow them to take on a partial human form. The spider part was their true body though. Not a deception so much as a manifestation of their wish to return to their original form. And yes, as we know for a fact the Chaos flame was slowly withering into ash as the ages wore on we can assume no new demons would be created as none of them seem capable of propagation. Each and every one a dead end for their lineage.
the stray demon on the bridge is not a chaos demon but i demon formed from rock and the item it drops. common misconception. and you can actually break apart the stone demon's legs.
