Sinking of the Shinano by the USS Archerfish 1944 Animated 

EVIL WON WW2 😢

​​@@JOECURR1488uhhhhhhh ...care to elaborate of you just gonna leave us hanging? Cos like ...the Nazis were pretty evil, dont know if you know that or not

Has to go down as one of the oddest comments i have ever seen

@@TonySpike NOBODY SAYS... FREE ISRAEL. Intriguing...

corrosion

Good chance china already dredged her up for scrap like tons of other ship wrecks in the pacfic.

​@@Loli4lyfhence the phrase "amazingly intact"

bull shit. Large ships are often ripped to pieces due to the physics of sinking. Something they were not designed to due.

@@rfarevalobro is ignoring every well preserved wreck

You beat me to it. After Midway and Guadalcanal, Japan lost the cream of its navy pilots, and they could not replace them fast enough. Besides, America's industrial capacity could turn out dozens of combat ships, planes, tanks, etc for every one Japan could produce--And technically superior.The war-hawks were so full of their corrupted Bushido propaganda they could not comprehend that we would never, ever quit, no matter the cost. They thought they could cow us with their so-called martial spirit, but that ended up in their troops and pilots dying in the thousands running into a rain of steel.

I agree. At the time Shinano was sunk, the USN had 14 fleet carriers, 9 light carriers, and 67 escort carriers. Together they could operate well over 2000 aircraft. Shinano wouldn’t have made any difference against that, even if it had been completed as a fleet carrier, which it wasn’t.

@@MrNatWhilk - Correct. And in addition, the Shinano Carrier Air Group consisted of only about 50 aircraft. Even if the IJN had a dozen Shinano Class carriers, it would not have been enough. And they lacked the experienced aircrew to operate them.

Didn't they say that the Japanese "hoped" it would tip the balance? I totally agree that was complete nonsense, but that was not the creator's opinion. Even if Japan could have built 10 such carriers, it wouldn't have mattered. They didn't have the pilots to man the carriers and probably not enough planes either.

@@canuck_gamer3359 - And they would have lacked the fuel for these ships.

One every 3 weeks.I think,could be wrong

​@@anthonycaruso8443 wouldn't be surprised

Being what was happening to them it was just a last chance move to help bring atleast one carrier back after the loss of the it flagship carriers at midway

"Zero chance" pun intended?

Its called Japanese cope.

Indeed, he was ridiculed and disbelieved when he reported the sinking of HIJMS Shinano and its size, only to be subsequently proven to be totally correct, credited with its sinking and decorated.

@@harryricochet8134 By his book, the USN initially thought he might have sunk a cruiser, as they had radio intercepts saying that "Shinano" had sunk. Note that "Shinano" is the name of both a river AND a province in Japan - most IJN cruisers were named after rivers, and battleships after provinces. But Enwright made several drawings of Shinano during the chase. He'd then thrown them away, but a thoughtful Chief PO (who knew that, in the Navy, you NEVER threw stuff away) had carefully preserved those drawings. When those drawings were show to Enwright's superiors, certain details, such as the fine clipper bow, led them to realize that this had to be the 'missing' Yamato battleship they had always suspected of existing. Even then, in the original commendation for USS Archer Fish, they underestimated Shinano's tonnage by almost 50%. And so it goes. :)

Btw, on a subsequent cruise, USS Archer Fish's second most noteworthy "kill" was a submarine operated by the Imperial Japanese ARMY. I kid you not. The Imperial Japanese Army built and ran several submarines - kept in secret from their hated rivals in the Navy. They were used for commando and re-supply missions.

@@7thsealord888 Ha! Now that I did not know, which is interesting as that veil of secrecy from the IJA's greatest enemy seems to have persisted long after all others pertaining to their endeavours against external enemies have fallen. In its detriment, I've thought that interservice rivalry (hatred) to be akin to a third front for some years now.

@@harryricochet8134 Indeed. I have heard it said, and tend to agree, that with all the (lack of) cooperation between the IJA and IJN, they ,might as well have been fighting for different countries. And not necessarily on the same side, at that. :) That rivalry / emnity certainly was a major impediment to Imperial Japan. Another was their downright incompetent cryptographical (coding) practices. Whilst they could be pretty good at cracking Allied codes, they never seem to quite grasp the idea that the Allies actually had people who could read and write Japanese.

Indeed, that's the version of events I'd read. I've never before heard of there being reconnaissance images of the Shinano prior to its sinking. Perhaps these were only subsequently retrieved once post-war review of IJN records proved its existence and that Enright was telling the truth. Given the overall poor standard of accuracy of this clip I'm sticking with the previously known version of events here lol.

I think the American Desk Jockeys maintained their highest stupidity levels for soooo long that it was easy for them to continue their long string of hitless at-bats. American Brass and HQ idiocy was - fortunately - only outdone by Japanese and German counterparts. The bigger idiots lost.

i looked for comments like this after realising the vid was mostly bs

back then when they had to dogfight their enemies instead of detecting each other with radar hundreds of kilometers away and fire a missile

It's always been puzzling why content creators are so lazy with the accuracy of their content. This is WWII history, some of the most preserved memories in recorded time.

Also for its size it wouldn't have carried very many operational aircraft. They ended up making it more into a carrier to carry replacement aircraft. But by that time there weren't any other carriers for it to support.

The U.S. built just over 150 aircraft carriers of which 122 were smaller escort carriers. Shinano wasn’t going to be much help against that volume of production.

I agree. I laughed when I heard the part about tipping the war. We had the bomb, so nothing would have changed the outcome.

I wonder if fighting Japan 🇯🇵 so hard was worth it … all those dead Americans …

​@@treystephens6166they known they was going down, they just wanted to bleed the enemy until then.

Thank you very much!

@@TheWarline Thank you!

I remember reading a history that said Archerfish reported sinking an unknown carrier, because she couldn’t ID it based on their onboard guides. Luckily the Captain saved a sketch he made of the ship when trying to ID it, and when he returned to port, the signature ‘clipper bow’ of the Yamato-class battleships in the sketch enabled the Navy to ID her.

That had me scratching my head as well.

Operations room goated

Except it literally did turn towards the submarine. It was not an accident or executing a zigzag maneuver to attempt to dodge torpedoes. So the video is correct. Abe had the location of the submarine due to it being spotted earlier and still on the surface. He couldn't outrun the submarine due to the mechanical issues and was over confident in the Shinano's ability to withstand a torpedo attack from a US submarine.

@@taoofjester4113 In what world does that make sense. “Oh I can’t outrun it, so I’m going to rush it”? The CV had no anti-submarine weapons. Moving away would provide time to evade torpedos, and rushing only serves to increase chances of getting sunk.

@@taoofjester4113 source? US Naval Institute says Abe was executing evasive maneuvers, and never mentions him intentionally rushing the sub. Show me a source saying he intentionally rushed the sub.

Exactly. His speech was, “I ask that congress declare….”

Kinda makes ya wonder about seeing that manifest and double-blinking on the accompanists, eh? "Hello, life insurer? I wanna increase mine."

Another fun point - Japan always demanded or commanded that all ships were being attacked by huge wolfpacks and battle fleets when in fact American coordination at-sea were hampered or ruined by 'demands for radio silence'. Every ships returning from completed missions were torpedoed and left to add hundreds to sea-deaths in the name of 'radio silence' to protect - uh - nothing. -signed, USS Indianapolis.

After 40 years of reading, and talking to Pac War vets (including HQ brass political-types), I still don't believe I have a good understanding of how deep and horrible the Army v. Navy rivalry was. I imagine in the 1500s, the Army's cab service (Navy, responsible for taking armies around islands) sometimes did leave armies on the shore, pinned down and to be slaughtered. Other times, the ships couldn't move sufficient supplies or to correct locations (apparently, the accuracy of GPS in 1500-1800 Japan wasn't particulary accurate). But then the navies pulling into ports to extract or deliver armies would get trapped by their opponent's ships. I am sure there were plenty of tit-for-tat slaughters with fingerpointing to create the 1930's rivalries. I think Japan's puny natural resources that have growing demands from Army v. Navy hunger was another factor. The Army made Euro visits to France, German and England from the 1870s on, and both sides favored one country that the other side despised. That Army, by the way, had to use the Japanese Navy 'taxi service' to get them to and fro. I'll bet THAT went over well, too. "The General's seasick!" "Gee, our Admiral isn't! Your general must be puny and weak." wheeee...

Thank you so much!

Thank you

And the IJN's death toll of experts were a total result of their propoganda. No Japanese expert in anything wanted to be left on-shore, say, in January, 1942 when manning Pacific battle fleets. That's why Japan's air-maintenance experts lost so many in those opening months - their most senior experts followed propoganda and used their superiority to demand 'first seats' on ships going into battle.

Glad to hear it!

Thank you! Will do!

You still around here huh 😂🤣

@@f430ferrari5 What's your problem with him?

@@lessronishere7540 you may want to evaluate why he doesn’t even bother to respond after 4 days. 😂🤣 Go read my other reply to you and you should figure it out. Notice what this commenter discusses. He writes a long analysis about a time period in 1944 which is totally irrelevant. Stick to 1942. It’s the only time period that mattered. Midway is indeed the most popular discussion of the Pacific War of WW2. Yes? He goes on to mislead yet again about Yamato or Musashi being useless battleships but that in reality is due to the stupidity of IJN leadership. There was nothing wrong with those battleships in 1942 had they been used properly. Heck even the US used battleship and or heavy cruisers to bombard the shores in the Atlantic War for DDay. So why do so many commenters unethically shy away from better utilization of the IJN battleships. I’ve had many debates with BKJeong and absolutely destroyed him and he knows it but yet he still unethically makes misleading comments. Let’s see how different you are. You agree with him Battleships were useless? Careful what you say. Don’t make a fool of yourself. Better do your research.

Shinano had the speed to outrun the Archerfish. A propeller shaft bearing started over heating. She had to slow down until the bearing would run cool enough not to damage the bearing or the shaft. It was then that the Archerfish could keep track of her.

Hopefully not from this content...it's full of wild inaccuracies as is pointed out many times in this comment section.

Thank you very much!

Thanks!

Agree about the flag, Union Jack

Agree.

@@TheWarline Still a fantastic video

It’s coordinates were (33°07′N 137°04′E), 65 miles (105 km) from the nearest land, in approximately 4,000 meters (13,000 ft) of water. Depending on her angle, speed and direction of decent, currents, coupled with how much she might have broken up - this would leave a very large area to search.

She was retired in 1968, then sunk by us off San Diego

Give it time. They will probably release it as either a Tier 11 or premium T10

Wow, thanks!

I dont see it. As many others have pointed out in this comment section, there are a handful of severe mistakes in this video that should have not made the final cut. Said mistakes would not even quailfy as bad research, as nothing of the sort is written in any sources, they are straight up misinformation/clickbait/fabrication. They are made up. This is a severe quality issue. Unless future videos improve on quality and become more historically accurate, this channel will not reach a status similar to the Operations Room. The graphics are awesome, some of the best I have ever seen here on RU-vid, but as long as facts are wrong/exaggerated/twisted, this channel is not great.

it would have been a slaughter and our politicians wanted this war. They knew japan was going to attack pearl. This was the 2nd installment of the federal reserve becoming rich of tax payers and exercising ways to expand in taking over other economies. Woodrow Wilson should burn in hell for what he did to the US.

It was due to how the U.S. economy was during the market crash. Torpedoes were expensive at the time, and live-fire testing would destroy said torpedoes, so no live-fire tests were conducted on the Mark XIV due to costs.

@@darkdill I see your point, back then a torpedo cost as much as a Hellcat fighter so they weren’t cheap since each one was hand made and parts couldn’t just be easily interchangeable. That said, if the torpedoes were malfunctioning then it would be a complete waste and any reasonable minded Commander would demand the issue be looked into immediately because risking the lives of the sub crews, not to mention possibly losing the sub as it’s torpedoes bounce off the enemy ships they then have to deal with depth charge attacks and many of our subs didn’t make it out as a result. So my inclination on the issue is that they knew this was an issue but didn’t push it to be addressed with an urgency. Remember, we knew our oil embargo would provoke the Japanese and we knew they were planning to hit Pearl Harbor which is why both of our aircraft carriers were out doing “training” while the rest of the fleet was in harbor. We could have crippled the Japanese by sinking their troop ships and everything else since they rely solely on ships to move the bulk of their logistics. But instead, we wanted the threat to grow so it would justify the construction of numerous aircraft and tank factories. Since it would pull our economy out of the dumpster and make certain people very wealthy. Just my opinion though.

@@echohunter4199 There's zero empirical evidence whatsoever to sustain your utterly ridiculous claim that there was specific foreknowledge of Japanese intent to attack Pearl Harbor much less that any such knowledge was so detailed as to result in the aircraft carries being deliberately deployed whilst the remainder of the fleet was permitted to be destroyed. If indeed that were the case FDR would be viewed as a traitor as would anyone involved in such a scheme for which zero evidence has ever been found. Such a claim is patent revisionist conspirobabble garbage retrospectively manufactured by ignorant individuals in an attempt to make themselves appear informed albeit only to the most ignorant of listeners. Your 'opinions' are not only not founded upon a shred of actual empirically sourced evidence rather than in total contradiction of this and therefore merely testament to your own abject ignorance of the subject at issue. The Kriegsmarine had a similar issue with the effectiveness of their torpedoes primarily due to the very same reason of cost with both this and the similar issue with the reliability of US torpedoes being widely known, studied and never found by any empirical analysis to be due to some conspirobabble policy you have posited without a shred of evidence. If you have even a modicum of respect for those who gave their lives in WW2 you should in the very least respect the fundamental tenets of historic custodianship rather than disseminate such utter rubbish and blatant lies and in so doing take a giant crap on the true circumstances of their sacrifice merely in order to prop up your own fragile ego and conceal your abject intellectual laziness. SMH.

The japanese thought this. Not him.

Yokosuka is a US Navy base now. I was briefly stationed there.