"Sir, You Can't Lock Your Checked Firearm That Way" 

Almost feel like we need a "Traveling with a firearm story" bingo card at this point to track which way(s) the airline/TSA messed up this time.

7-11 clerk: You want a bag for those chips? Me: They're already in a bag.

Years ago I was passing through Philly and TSA found a flashlight (gasp!) in my carry on. "What is this?" demanded the security professional. "That's a flashlight," I said. "What's it for?" she asked. I raised my voice slightly, so everyone around us could hear. "You don't know what a flashlight is for?" I asked. Some folks had already been listening, for this TSA lady was grouchy. Now, there were chortles and snickers, not only from other passengers, but from her own co-workers. She glared at me and put the flashlight back in my bag. "Go on now," she said. ETA: This was a completely normal looking flashlight. Black, cylindrical, nothing camouflaged, not a pocket fleshlight, etc.

"Can you pull out your gun in front of a crowd of nervous, tired, angry people?"

As a former TSA worker - at my airport we discussed how the case itself being hardsided is perfectly fine. Supervisors and workers alike were informed, and the only time I had a problem was with people using lockout cables for the gun itself, rather than the case - but the regs (internal that is) aren't that hard to understand. Some people just don't like to think/read

If I had a dollar for each time I've had to help explain their own policies to them. I might be able to buy a couple boxes of nice ammo.

> It’s in a hard case > yes but there’s a soft case in that hard case 😱

Holy shit I had the same "where's the hard sided case?" situation flying with a rifle and a couple handguns in my pelican case a few years back. I honestly thought I was being fucked with. I pulled out the airline policy and the TSA policy papers and started reading them back to the check in attendant, and at each mention of "locking, hard sided case," would pause recitation, look her dead in the eyes, and smack the peli case with the hand.

TSA should hire you to do training videos. Then we'll get to see when someone who's taken the training does or does not recognize you.

"Sir, I just need one moment to very briefly review my policies and procedures for this situation... Mhmm [reads policies].... Mhmm [checks case]... Sir, you have a wonderful flight." Coulda been that easy...

It reminds me of just a week or two after 11th September 2001, I had a friend and his wife who were travelling at the time and ahead of him at security was an off duty serviceman who was carrying a handgun, he notified the security and asked if someone wanted to check in the fire arm so it could be carried in the hold. He was told they couldn't check it into the hold or have a crewmember 'look after it'. They said it was perfectly fine to take on board, they did however insist on taking his nail clippers incase he tried to take over the plane....

I ran into this EXACT conversation when I was flying out of San Antonio to LAX. I had multiple pistols in small soft cases inside a very large Pelican. The lady refused to admit that they were, in fact, also in a hard sided case. It finally took a TSA person to show up and tell her she was wrong and I was right. This was about 7 years ago. And in SAN ANTONIO of all places.

You kinda think this kind of thing would be rare... but I know better. My sister once worked for the TSA. Something like 15 years ago or so... so post-9/11 but pre-2010. May even have been pre-2006 (liquids ban) but unsure. Anyway, her story is that she was told by her higher-ups to put together a "test package" to test the security checkpoints for carry-on luggage. So she goes and gets a certain small bag. Pretty much fills the thing with simulated explosive. The bag had a metal plate on the outside, not huge, but a few square inches. but decently thick. Behind this, inside the main compartment, she mounts a PCB and a 9v battery. She then runs something like 10" of wiring from the PCB along the top metal zipper to a simulated detonator positioned near another metal fitting on the outside. This thing just *_sails right through_* security, multiple times. No one ever opens it, no one ever even *_questions_* it. A carry-on bag with a mostly homogenous filler. Looked real good in the X-ray monitor. Instead of the higher-ups stepping back and thinking "Oh my, we have a training and security-mindedness issue," my sister got reprimanded for making the test package "Too difficult." You read that right. TSA management (at least at that time and in that place) reprimanded someone who, with little to no formal training beyond what TSA itself provided in detecting these things, constructed a simulated bomb that defeated the TSA's security measures in place at the time, and had the package been real, would have been cheerily let board whatever flight it was destined for, and we'd have had another Pan-Am 103. She quit the TSA not long after, and I haven't flown since.

The types of responses you get to traveling with firearms could make a whole YT channel on its own. Always fun to watch and always a good lesson/tips & tricks for those who want to travel with firearms

I travel with my pistol(s) quite often. Although not required, I store the pistol inside a pistol case with the slide, barrel, and spring removed from the gun and stored in the same case. I store mags in the same case. I have never had TSA cut or open my lock, which is a standard lock (not a TSA lock). I was recently asked to show the employee my firearm at check in. I tried to explain I have never been asked that before and didn’t want to pull a gun out in a crowded airport; she told me that is her airlines policy and she “does this all of the time” and she knows how to check in a firearm. She was very snippy and rude, but I smiled and said okay. She saw the disassembled gun in the case and asked me where the firearm was. I explained I always disassemble my firearms before checking them onto an airplane. I wonder if me field stripping my pistols makes it easier for TSA to see they are unloaded in the X-ray machine.

I had this same discussion with an AA rep when travelling with the same Pelican case and my AR pistol. The pistol was just sitting on top of my clothes/items in the case with my pillow on top of it all. AA: "But it needs to be in a hard case" Me: *slaps Pelican case* "This is a hard case." AA: "No, the gun needs to be in a hard case." Me: "Again, *slaps case* this is the case." Finally I told them to go get a manager because I'm following the AA policy. They got a manager, manager took a quick look and said "he's good to go, that is a hard case." This was Tampa International.

Props to the counter worker changing her mind. It can be so easy to dig our heals in when we are wrong to give the impression of authority. And so difficult to do an about face and admit we are wrong gracefully.

I had essentially the same experience while flying Delta to Las Vegas in 2021. Glock properly unloaded inside of a non-locked Glock pistol case, placed inside of a properly locked Pelican case. The ticket agent tried telling me the Glock case must be locked. Politely informed them that it was in a locked, hard-sided case. They didn't agree, called Delta supervisor and TSA officer. Both of them agreed with me.

I reached out to you over my epxerience with the zip ties of freedom years ago. Funny enough, I had the same interaction using Ridgid rolling toolbox at the time with padlocks on the sides. I just turned the gun case into the entire travel case which seemed to break the minds of the ATL Delta reps.

I had a situation once checking in at Charlotte NC. I go with my bags to the counter and tell them I'm checking a firearm. The lady at check in says "I need to see the gun". I said really? don't I take it over to the TSA area? No, we need to see it here. I'm looking around, feeling like this is a set up or something. I unlock my hard sided case and show her the gun. She and her co-worker jump back a few feet when they see my hand gun. I'm thinking, you asked to see it. They obviously have no clue about guns. She says OK, we've seen it, you can close the case. I finish checking in and take my bag to the TSA area and got the all clear. It was so bizarre. I really think they just didn't have a clue what they were supposed to be doing. It felt really uncomfortable opening that case in an airport check in area.

Every airport that I've flown through has their own take on TSA regulations. And, every airline at every different airport also has their own spin. Years ago, while flying out of Phoenix Arizona, after checking my suitcase in with the firearm the clerk handed me back the suitcase and told me to walk it over to the TSA counter about 80 feet away. The TSA people were completely flummoxed by this.

We have a confirmed case of someone that can't seem to grasp that a soft case inside a hard case means that it's in a hard case. This would have probably been a fun discussion to record all the way to its conclusion if you had the time.

I routinely travel with a firearm. And ran into this same issue twice last year with Delta. Once elevating to a manger in Atlanta.

Well at least she read the rules and understood it, and put two and two together. Unlike some people.

you know as silly as this is, at least the employee tried to conform to written policy from their employer, so i will give them props for at least going by whats written, instead of making shit up even if she didn't completely understand it

So essentially this was a Schrödinger firearm that was neither inside or outside the hard case

Is the firearm part of everything? Yes… Is everything in the hard case? Yes…

The interesting thing is, what she read is the opposite case, a handgun inside a hard case inside soft luggage. Instead of a handgun in a soft bag inside of hard luggage.

Had a very similar experience about 6 months ago. Since I was going on a short trip, I figured I’d just use the case as my only checked bag by loading my clothes and toiletries in there as well. This really created quite the interrogative for the southwest reps. I’ve made it a point to fly with a firearm anytime I can legally do so.

Story time with Deev is always fun

Delta and American are the worst for flying with anything other than the "usual" stuff. I travel a lot with tools and these two airlines always have to make something routine very difficult! Southwest is the only airline that has given us virtually no troubles! Thanks Dev, I always learn something from you and I enjoy the learning! 🤓

I love that you are always sharing these gems. It gives me more knowledge and ammo to use against the airlines as I fly with firearms.

Let's just say she was having a "Monday". 😂

I’m so stoked to hear you guys are doing a flipper class!!!!

Now it's in a hard case 😂 Literal LOL. I am entertained. I've only checked firearms a handful of times but (knock wood) I've had no issues so far. Only once they tried the "it's been 15 mins you're probably fine" thing. I was like nope Deviant said I can't leave haha. I didn't really say that but they did eventually get confirmation from TSA that I was good to go.

This is the kind of thing you get when a bureaucracy prioritizes compliance over cooperation. You train people to only care about accomplishing the letter of the rules without ever considering what the intent of them is... and then they wonder why their people ignore the organizations actual goals?

I was flying with two bolt action rifles, and packed the rifles in locked hardcases as checked baggage, and carried the bolts as carry on. (If someone steels the rifles, they have to get the rifles reset to headspace on new bolts, and decreases the chance of theft). the TSA folks had serious heartache with the bolts being in checked luggage.

I had a similar reaction from TSA in Arkansas and they called their supervisor which luckily knew it was fine.

Delta and the zip ties of freedom. Sounds like a band name

I'm a diverse person with a lot of jobs, and I've done that SO many times, and I love when the person has that look on their face... "Oooohhhh, I'm so stupid! It was there the whole time...."

Rarely fly with firearms anymore, but I used to print out both the TSA and individual airline rules. Back in the bad old days, the correction I used to have to make was getting them to put the "steal this bag" tag on the inside where it belongs.

I knew where this was going as soon as I saw the soft bag in the hard bag.... Next time try having a locked hard case inside of a soft bag and see what they say....

Deviant - Keep these vids coming! People simply don't know what they don't know. TSA and related folks are NOT experts and travelers are always in a hurry when at airports, so these can become tense situations fast.

TSA is what happened when you institutionalized failure to reason.

Used your last video as a bit of a guide, put my HK in a hard pelican within a hard pelican, with chamber flag, separated emptying magazine counter face up, hornady box clearly visible, and 2 locks on internal hard case and 2 locks on external hardcase. Southwest had me fill out the declaration card and tape it to the outside of the firearms case then said the were going to put it on the normal conveyor, made me nervous as at DIA they take you to another room for TSA to inspect and xray the case. Thankfully the difference from your experience was they said wait at the counter for 5 minutes, TSA will need the key, if its longer than 5 minutes let them know. And surprisingly TSA a couple minutes later called the Southwest agent and she got my key and a whopping 2 minutes later they were like “bags cleared, your good to go.” Using locks that hold the key unless relocked really does make TSA relock things btw, made a keyed alike set of 6 American locks that retain the key unless relocked. All 4 were still present upon arrival in Denver.

This is the same NPC behaviour I had with my vitage film camera and several lenses. I had a printout from TSA, where it tells them to NOT put it through Xray to prevent dampage and visually inspect it instead; and if needed to test it for residue.. Trying to explain how Xray machines can/will destroy the light sensative film.. since they go THROUGH everything.. How do you think they capture(d) photos in hospitals on your bones inside of your body. 2 minutes of arguing with the girl who refused to try anything other then her damn Xray machine or look up their own rules, and almost send 4 rolls of undeveloped film with photos I had taken through. I asked for literally ANYONE else who is willing to test swab the damn camera and let me repack everything in my bag. and the guy was like.. yeah that's fine, I'll check for stuff and you're good. Back in Europe, I showed my obviously old camera and filmcanisters and they looked at it for a second and said "you're good".

Coming from a country where it is illegal to own a firearm under most circumstances I always watch these tips and stories about traveling with a firearm!

Yay! Another traveling story! Always so interesting to see the way you handle these kinds of interactions.

"Are you not entertained?" XD can someone drop that on airlines employees on camera, please?

What REALLY brasses me off is there was a time, shortly after 9/11, where the US looked into every other country known for GOOD airport security, Germany, Japan, freaking Israel.... They hired consultants, GOOD ones, to recommend policy and training, paid who knows how many hundreds of millions of dollars to do so, and SOMEHOW, still managed to come up with the TSA as it exists today... The first commercial flight I got on after 9/11, I'd been in Retail Loss Prevention Management, and other areas of security including large venue, for about 7 full years, looked around and thought, "This is a F'n joke" (and that was BEFORE I was delayed over 72 hours due to multiple "secondary screening" which found, surprise, surprise, nothing)... Keep in mind, that was the "professional opinion" of a 26 year old acting LP manager at Parisian with some experience in large venue... FAR from being a "wizened elder" in the security industry. And what's worse... Here I am 20 years later, and HOPEFULLY a little wiser, and it STILL hasn't gotten much better since then... to the point that I'm VERY thankful that I don't have to fly commercial very often. We COULD have had a good program, but somewhere along the line things just got FUBAR'ed.

The sheer sticklery of this made my day, thank you

I love that workaround. Quite the flip of a problem. Nicely done.

You know how those Dr. Bronner’s soap containers have tons of writing all over them? I feel like you should do something like that to your firearms case. You could have a section for TSA regarding cutting locks and your contact information, or policies of the most common airlines, you fly, or whatever. Given the amount of silliness you get to experience with airline firearm travel, there seems to be a handful of repeating events. Might as well spell them out on your case and see what happens.

I am entertained. Especially because I wonder when/if people think my stories are crazy. I feel validated and I thank you.

Love that the case has just one TSA latch. It says without words, "this is lock is pointless, but here, happy now?"

it instantly became much safer once you removed the soft bag. thank you.

At least she admitted she was wrong. Thats more than you'd get from most airport employees

The only issue I have had when flying with guns was on a multi-month trip. I flew home half-way through, but left the gun at the destination. I was required to check-in at the counter due to "flying with a firearm" even though I was not flying with a firearm.

Love the content. Out of curiosity what are the cases you have your work stuff in within the pelican case?

Those velcro moral patches are rad. Great for organization. Love it!

Years ago I had a TSA agent open my pelican that had a Canon 100mm-400mm lens, 2 5D MKII camera bodies, some batteries, and a Canon 17mm-35mm lens in it. She opened both sides of the 400mm and asked "Is this a camera?" I said no, it's a lens and it attaches to those camera bodies "Sir I am going to have to call my supervisor, I can't verify this is what you say it is sir as I cannot readily see through to the other side". I put it on a body and had her look through the viewfinder. These are the last line of defense huh?

I like the TSA/ airline content as well. Keep it coming

I am so proud of Flipper. I remember reading their Habr articles years ago.

Always love the updates on flying with firearms!

I had a similar experience when storing a tiny laptop in the magazine pocket of the seat in front of me for take off. Apparently it lying in a loose plastic bag on the floor underneath was preferable because then it was in a bag, which was the rule. Anyway, how often do you unpack your firearms while traveling?

Hahaha! Common Sense...so rare that it's become a super power. Thank you for sharing!

ROFLMAO!!! ""You can't make this stuff up!" seems to be a very common refrain that afflicts all of us who are in the security world. My team and I say this at least once a day.

I had a very similar thing happen with a Southwest rep (who actually came down the counter from another desk to intervene without anyone asking her) when she saw my soft shotgun case inside a locked hard case. I couldn't convince her and she came into the conversation already combative and argumentative, so I just asked the original rep at the kiosk to get a supervisor and that resolved the issue in about 30 seconds

This is why I prefer road trips. Flying in a tin can thirty thousand feet above the ground doesn't scare me, but I can't stand the invasion of privacy that comes with going through an airport. If you want to search my bags, you had better have a warrant. If you want to scan me or grope me, you had better be my doctor or my spouse.

I actually really enjoy the traveling with firearms content. More people need to be pushing against the bullshit... just generally really, in any way they can.

I had the exact same experience just a few months ago, except for me the rep was not satisfied until I pulled one of the padlocks off the pelican and put it around the handles of the small pistol case the gun was in. 🙄

ohhhhh man, I would desperately love to go to that class. Sounds AWESOME.

I am so glad that Alaska seems to handle firearms relatively well. Not sure if it's just their route network invites more of them or what.

What about a hard case? We have that. Yes, but what about second hard case? (If Hobbits ran the TSA)

The TSA should pay you a salary for being an airport security “secret shopper” that finds gaps in their training, and helps educate their employees. I mean, you’re already doing it, the least they could do is write you a check for your troubles.

Just for fun, get a large, soft duffle bag to contain your Pelican case :-)

I wish I could afford a flipper zero. I have a couple of clients who might be able to find me one while out of the country. I'm crossing my fingers. Thank you for doing what you do, brother. 🤙🏽

Good on them for rereading the rules and understanding that they were wrong. Still doesn't excuse that despite having standardized rules, many airlines interpret them very differently.

I face palmed, I laughed, I wept for American education system. Then I thought 'hard case', just how hard has it got to be? and could I build a working padlock out of toffee? Though to be fair I have had similar reading & comprehension challenges about the interpretation of rules with government agencies here in the UK. It's just so rare to catch one on camera.

Good job, Dev. Hope the "fun TSA times" don't interfere with your enjoying your trips.

I think you should make russian nesting dolls with the cases. 'Sir, it needs to be in a hard case', 'It's in five hard cases', 'I'm sorry, but the rules say "a" hard case, not more than one'

That's utterly amazing and horrifying 😂

Awwww man I would love to see the flipper zero class. Do they have an online streaming?

Which model pelican case is that? I can never tell just by looking.

i see her point tho. the policy says hard sided gun case plus an unlocked soft case which can be interpreted as hard case inside unlocked soft bag OR hard case with soft bag inside. i can see why, for their safety, they don't want bags that look like shaving kits or similar common bags and prefer the kind of small case that's obviously a gun case. what they really don't want are lose guns inside luggage like you tried to compromise with. it can be argued that while that big black box can be used as a hard sided locking case for guns, that's not what it is now, it's your suitcase. {personally, i think this is a very uncharitable interpretation, but not entirely unreasonable for scared, litigious corporate entities who can't avoid firearms but wish they could.} the reason they want smaller, dedicated gun cases is if they have to search the bag for any of the numerous other reasons bags are searched by airlines, they don't want lose guns flopping around. the shaving kit thing is something they can't avoid, but again they wish they could. people don't want to be surprised by finding a gun, specially people who are already a little afraid of guns. that's why i say they probably don't like nondescript bags like that. i was a little surprised she read that stuff online and that was what de-escalated it tho.

2:39 I'm suffering brain damage

Yes, this was highly entertaining 😂😂😂

Maybe put the sales presentation after the video?

TSA and guns never gets old.

Personally never had an issue, I just do the most routine thing: empty the mags and leave one in, ammo in boxes, two holes two locks on a small hard case with the pistol in. As long as I am confident and routine about handling the guns at the bag check when asked, never seen anyone get antsy. The biggest trouble I've had with airport tyranny is around my trauma shears; most of the time it's fine, but sometimes CBSA or TSA will pull them out and measure the anvil rather than the blade, and I have to explain that the length limitation is on the blade, and that they are specifically built to their own specifications. Delta has been the most confused in my experience, United and American are completely routine about it and their people couldn't possibly care less about your handgun as long as they don't get yelled at.

Seems like the lack of consistency and run around is to serve as friction to traveling with fire arms in the first place.

had an issue with Hawaiian airlines out of San Diego, twice. Once was flying with multiple handguns in a locked hard sided case, in another locked hard sided case…and they wanted me to put a TSA lock on the gun case. The other issue was with ammunition in “factory containers”.

Omg, just when i thought it couldn't get dumber.. I do love this series though, lol

😂🤦‍♂️that got a good chuckle that KS for that this morning

The only time I've flown with a gun was from Newark, NJ. Weirdly, given the local laws, I had no issues.

Oh that's freaking hilarious. I had a comparable moment -- post RSAC checking into SFO with .38 snubby, sent downstairs for the screening. Showed revolver, yes, unloaded, and they wiped down the case, and then put the swab in their Ion Mobility Spectrometer - Ding! They: "Sir, this tested positive for explosives" me:"You mean like gunpowder on my pistol" They (sheepishly): "Oh, you can go now". (Yes, modern firearms use smokeless powder, but it was a "not the droids you're looking for" moment, and worked)

Gotta love good ol' security theater.

Thanks for a Great Video, and All Your Hard Work ! I am afraid to travel with my 9mm shield, period. At home, I have complete Peace of Mind, with my s&w within easy reach 100% of the time in my gun glo holster from amazon. I am wheelchair bound so no time to run for the gun. I keep a gun glo holster stuck to my nightstand, stuck under my desk and stuck on the inside panel of my wheel chair, for instant deployment, the holster has heavy duty velco and adhesive, even in my car door. I do not intend to be a victim of the current spike in violent crime, EVER. As I said, traveling without my firearm makes me feel Way Too Vulnerable.

Security performance theater includes performances by clowns.

About 10 years ago, I was flying out of Houston (I think it was with United). The ticket counter agent INSISTED I show her that both my handguns were empty right there. I got security involved, and they said it was up to the airline. So, I ended up showing in front of everyone that my guns were empty and cleared.